Idea: Mod: Marry a LM the SOG way

[Jors]

I have been thinking to mod a Leatherman Supertool 300.

I am thinking of completely dismantling it and to discard (Keep it in storage for ever) the handles.
I want to make a new handle so that it has the same general profile than the Surge so that the 2 knife blades, saw and file can be used from outside, without having to open the handles first.
Maybe I would like to change the saw & file to a blade changer, and also have a big scissors outside, but a big one like the SOG type.
The inside of the handle I want to keep just as fat as the ST300 (+/- 14 mm) so that I can fit all the tools plus some more. Here I think to add a LM bit holder, SOG V-Cutter and also a blade changer as I can then add more loose options.
I may even change one of the outside four compartments to holders for a long screw driver bit, a tweezers and a big needle awl (like a stitching awl).
The biggest change to the handle will be to make it of the compound leverage type like the SOGs so that I would have the more power for the stronger pliers head of the ST300.

The locking mechanisms will have to be the same than the Supertool 300 so that I can use the other tools of the ST 300 without having to adapt them

The total size will be a few mm linger but noticeable / much fatter, but then I will have a REAL SOG / Leatherman, hybrid.

Maybe the SOGman SUPERTOOL Powerhouse.

I will first design the whole project in Blender 3D so that I can render it properly before I will start. After I have posted the critics can tell me where I can improve. I will then release a full set of plans and materials if I find the project viable.

[ari6126]

Sounds cool and huge. Fun stuff. Have you seen the PT-540 though? It might be an easier staring point (no replaceable cutters though).

[J-sews]

This sounds like a project of epic proportions! I can't wait to see the first renderings.

[CENTURION]

I've been thinking of doing something very similar, so I'll share what I've found.

Handles: Keep in mind that making handles like the ones on the Wave or Surge is extremely hard for the average person. I have access to some pretty extensive and high-grade machinery and tools (I have friends in an engineering and manufacturing company), and I have ruled out a double-folded handle due to complexity. You would need to have a metal break that can fit inside ~1/8", and do 90º angles in there. Instead I've been looking at something more like the Charge series, with a single folded handle, and separate scales on the outside.
Another problem with the handles is that the outside opening blades (if pivoted around the pliers-end bolts) will not work very well with the compound leverage there, because the gears will be getting in the way of the blade's cutting area. The solution that presents itself readily is to move the blade pivots to the bottom of the tool! You then of course have to either make a liner lock out of the inner handle, or try to find some way to work it into the existing lock down there, but I haven't been able to think up a good way of doing that though.

Pliers: As J-sews helped me with a while ago, there is a bit of modification required to the ST300 pliers. They don't open as wide as Powerlock pliers do, so the "shoulders" of the pliers must be ground down to allow them to open farther, because they need to open that far to fold the tool.
You will also most likely need to add some cutouts in the plier arms to allow the backs of the rivets that hold the gears to the bars that hold the handles together to clear (there may be other ways around this though when making custom handles)

With custom handles you could of course change the sizing so that the ST300 pliers could open and close with no problem, but if you want to retain the full power of the compound leverage, you will need to keep the ratios and distances roughly the same as SOG had them.

Everything else is pretty straightforward (that is besides actually building the thing). As you said, the LM locks will have to be used to hold both LM and SOG tools, and the SOG tools will have to have some simple modifications to match the LM profiles.

[Jors]

there is a bit of modification required to the ST300 pliers. They don't open as wide as Powerlock pliers do, so the "shoulders" of the pliers must be ground down to allow them to open farther, because they need to open that far to fold the tool.

I did not think so far as I do not own a SOG, but I don't think this will be too difficult. [ I am waiting for my Powerlock SOG to arrive within the next week or so. ]
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You will also most likely need to add some cutouts in the plier arms to allow the backs of the rivets that hold the gears to the bars that hold the handles together to clear (there may be other ways around this though when making custom handles

I think I will be able to bypass this by designing the handle to properly function without grooves.
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I wholeheartedly agree with you that the handles will be very complex. I am thinking (just thinking and wondering) of the possibility of make each handle out of 2 or 3 different parts.

I was thinking of making a small but powerfull press with two or 3 sizes to make the bends. This is in my abilities to make as I have my own lathe and access to a milling machine.
If I see that the model is too complex, then I will rather set for a blend between the Supertool 300 and the Powerlock: the handles will then the same pattern as the Powerlock, but just slightly bigger to accept the ST 300 pliers head, but a bit thicker, so that I can fit more tools. One hand opening is not importand as I am not using the knife 500 times a day but only once or twice. To be able to do a job is more importand, as well as a strong tool.
To make a saw blade change holder is not impossible, but I want a bit exchange holder like the Leathermans have. That is my real challenge.

[Threeme2189]

This sounds like an awesome project.
Good luck!

[CENTURION]

______________________________________________
I wholeheartedly agree with you that the handles will be very complex. I am thinking (just thinking and wondering) of the possibility of make each handle out of 2 or 3 different parts.

I was thinking of making a small but powerfull press with two or 3 sizes to make the bends. This is in my abilities to make as I have my own lathe and access to a milling machine.
If I see that the model is too complex, then I will rather set for a blend between the Supertool 300 and the Powerlock: the handles will then the same pattern as the Powerlock, but just slightly bigger to accept the ST 300 pliers head, but a bit thicker, so that I can fit more tools. One hand opening is not importand as I am not using the knife 500 times a day but only once or twice. To be able to do a job is more importand, as well as a strong tool.
To make a saw blade change holder is not impossible, but I want a bit exchange holder like the Leathermans have. That is my real challenge.

The press is a great idea, and if you have the abilities, go for it!

I've been thinking about maybe milling out the handles as a single peice, I have access to a CNC mill, but I'm wondering whether a milled-from-stock handle will be as strong as a traditional stamped steel sheet handle. 
Though it would definitely make creating liner locks for outside tools harder, as I would probably have to attach a separate piece of steel sheet to make them.

As far as LM bit drivers go, I've thought long and hard about it, but I think the most efficient thing to do is to just take one off of a Wave/Charge/Surge. LM has them metal-injection-molded, and I think some parts of it are just too intricate for even something like a CNC mill to produce.
Plus then you can have lots of other spare tool parts around, and the OHO blades from the tool around.

[Jors]

I came across another challenge.
If I make the handles 20 - 25 mm wide where thw original was 14 mm wide will the longer "axle" (pivot screws) not be weeker? The shorter the stronger and the longer the easier to bend.

[CENTURION]

Yes, I believe that would be the case. But I think as long as they're made of good steel, then it shouldn't be an issue. If you really wanted you could try using thicker axles, and widen the holes in all the components, but that sounds like a crazy amount of work.

[Jors]

Pliers: As J-sews helped me with a while ago, there is a bit of modification required to the ST300 pliers. They don't open as wide as Powerlock pliers do, so the "shoulders" of the pliers must be ground down to allow them to open farther, because they need to open that far to fold the tool.
You will also most likely need to add some cutouts in the plier arms to allow the backs of the rivets that hold the gears to the bars that hold the handles together to clear (there may be other ways around this though when making custom handles)
(Image removed from quote.)

I ran across another problem. Centurion was right. The pliers jaws will not open enough. Period. Even although I might mill down or grind down on the shoulders as indicated on the picture in red or blue the pliers jaws will still block against the replaceable cutter jaws. the jaws go inside a little groove underneath the man from Leatherman (Lefthand side jaw on the image).

My current way of thought will have to be redone as I can not use the ST 300 pliers head. I may have to think on something else.
I can change a SOG Powerlock by making a new handle set (thicker) to take more tools, but then the weak spot will still be the soft jaws.

Any ideas?

[CENTURION]

Hmmm, that sucks. You could maybe try milling out the powerlock pliers to accept ST300 cutter inserts

[CENTURION]

Any chance we could get some pics of the problem area on the ST300 pliers? The reference would be helpful for my own modding plans.

[Jors]

Centurion,


The position of the cutters when the pliers are closed (B)
A is where the pivot is. It is round, but the outer area is oval.


B is still the cutters at the open position, but here you can see that it moved in the groove C in the oval.
When you open it to force the handles open the stopping point is not the shoulders as you have seen in earlier posts, but it is actually the cutters that do the stopping.



The groove.



The red line shows where the cutter will have to be cut to be able to open wider. This will nullify the hard wire cutting part.

[CENTURION]

Ah, I see

Well thank you much for taking the photos, I can always use more reference material for planning my crazy mods

[Jors]

I am a bit disappointed in the fact that I can not go ahead as I wish / originally planned.

I am still using the Surge as my EDC as it is currently the best in my opinion with the ST 300 as runner-up.

However I am of the opinion that the ST 300 will be able to apply relative high torque as is so there is no real need for a compound leverage system now.

If I can succeed to make a new frame for the ST 300 that is wider, I will still proceed with this mod, in the new direction.
Currently the frame is made of 1.2 mm thick sheet plate. If I can duplicate the frame in 1.6 mm material but with the exceptions that the outside of the frame will be 25 mm wide - 5.5 mm wider than current, but without the frame rounded off to comfort your hand, then I will get 7.7 mm more space on the inside for each handle. By using thinner washers, I will get at least 9 mm more space, and the handle will bu much stronger.

If I can fit a 1/4 inch driver and a pair of scissors on the one side and on the other side a SOG wire stripper and a blade changer like Leatherman features (I may even be able to fit two in) or I may be able to downsize the outer width down to 24 or 23 mm. I can only grind the edges in contact with your hand round or spot weld a thin edge to make it easy on the hand.

This new tool will then have the whole ST 300 kit plus a scissors + 1/4 inch drive (SOG type, but beefed up) and a blade changer with a steel hacksaw blade and the SOG wire strippers. If I manage to get a second blade changer in I can either add another type of blade or even a set of tools that can be changes by need or I may even be able to fit a SOG type of V-cutter. The Bosch hacksaw blades are thinner than the Leatherman blades and therefore I can make the blade changer thinner than the default Leatherman one. I may even be able to succeed into make a socket tool where I do not have to remove the socket from the 1/4 inch drive.

This new version of the Super Tool will have almost all you can need and I would prefer this new abilities above the Surge's one hand opening. Although this tool will be more heavy I will have a whole toolbox in one tool and it will not be so much thicker - only 5.5 mm if I do not add an edge.

To make the handles I will have to fold the Stainless sheet in a channel and have to cut and bend the part where the pliers head have to be fitted. Here I will have to weld and shape by grinding to get the correct shape. I assume it is what the manufacturers also do, because if I should try to flatten an existing handle it will tore open as it can not so easily stretch or compress by mere pressure alone. I am still meditating on this and some time I might actually start this project.