MT.O Prybar

[Mr. Whippy]

Follow up:

The bit drivers and wrenches work perfectly.  Very good fit. 

And again, the bottle opener is flawless.

[Grant Lamontagne]

These look great!  I'm drooling already! 

Def

[redbaron]

"I had a look at adding a spoke wrench but there wasn't enough room for it anyhere sensible so i'll have a go at a bike tool soon."

maybe put one on top/below the 1/4" hex driver? there are already grooves for an O-ring, shouldn't be too hard to re-design them to be spoke wrenches

[Nikos]

"I had a look at adding a spoke wrench but there wasn't enough room for it anyhere sensible so i'll have a go at a bike tool soon."

maybe put one on top/below the 1/4" hex driver? there are already grooves for an O-ring, shouldn't be too hard to re-design them to be spoke wrenches

That was my hunch as well, but as Tofty said it wouldn't leave enough material to warrant the bit driver's structural integrity.

[redbaron]

"I had a look at adding a spoke wrench but there wasn't enough room for it anyhere sensible so i'll have a go at a bike tool soon."

maybe put one on top/below the 1/4" hex driver? there are already grooves for an O-ring, shouldn't be too hard to re-design them to be spoke wrenches

That was my hunch as well, but as Tofty said it wouldn't leave enough material to warrant the bit driver's structural integrity.

true

[Tofty]

Dear Santa...... 

Yes, dear??

These look great!  I'm drooling already! 
Def

Thanks guys,look out for the passaround thread if you haven't already signed up for it.

Follow up:

The bit drivers and wrenches work perfectly.  Very good fit. 

And again, the bottle opener is flawless.

Excellent news and thanks for the feedback.

Are you really sure it's rust and not just the bronze starting to acquire color? We are talking about 420 type steel and bronze, I have a hard time believing it should rust easily.

I haven't seen any rust at all on any of my numerous printed stainless pieces, who said that they had?

I would have to agree Tofty. Putting the spoke wrench in that area may compromise the structure. A bike specific tool would be the only answer I think.

If you build it, we will buy it!¡!

(Image removed from quote.)

"I had a look at adding a spoke wrench but there wasn't enough room for it anyhere sensible so i'll have a go at a bike tool soon."

maybe put one on top/below the 1/4" hex driver? there are already grooves for an O-ring, shouldn't be too hard to re-design them to be spoke wrenches

That was my hunch as well, but as Tofty said it wouldn't leave enough material to warrant the bit driver's structural integrity.

Lets go with a bike specific tool then, what features do you think are needed and what overall size would be preferable?

Tools:
3.23mm spoke wrench (for 15 guage spokes)
3.3mm spoke wrench (for 14 guage spokes)
etc

Size:
75mm (3") by 25mm (1") by 3mm(1/8") for example

Let me know what size of wrenches, allen keys and other tools you most often need on your bikes and i'll try to put something together.
I will start a new thread about this after i have an initial design drawn up.

[Steinar]

Are you really sure it's rust and not just the bronze starting to acquire color? We are talking about 420 type steel and bronze, I have a hard time believing it should rust easily.

I haven't seen any rust at all on any of my numerous printed stainless pieces, who said that they had?

Nobody, it was me misreading a post where it was pointed out the tool had no rust, while the bit had acquired a little. When I noticed my mistake it was too late to fix, so I hoped nobody would notice. No such luck.

[stealth007s]

Looks like that would be good to start the design Tofty. I'll take a look at my ride later this evening to get size specifics. I'm sure others will do the same if they're interested. Off the top of my head, 4mm hex key is the size I probably would use the most though 

[Tofty]

No worries Steiner, your point was still valid.

Thanks stealth007, i'm not sure if allen keys should be part of the tool or stored as a bit like the leatherman mako.

To make allen keys on a one-piece tool thats water-jetted or lasered from sheet metal would take a number of extra machining operations but with 3D printing it's no extra effort or expense so i may well take advantage and make it a uniquely 3D printed tool which also means it doesn't have to have a constant thickness so thicker features can be added if needed.

Any other tool suggestions?
One idea i had was to make the tool in two different pieces that fitted together for storage, both with a tyre lever on one end.
On bikes is there usually an arrangement of nuts and bolts that need an allen key on one side and a nut driver on the other? If so these are tools that need to be on opposite pieces of the design.

[Sparky415]

You know how much I like the 6mm hole for screwdriver bits, how about instead of allen keys just having a 6mm hole (or a hole in each piece?) and using ‘Allen screwdriver bits’ ?

hope that made some kind of sense   

[stealth007s]

So, here it is, the hex key sizes on my bicycle. 2.5mm, 3mm, 4mm & 5mm. If you could put them in the tool like the Mako does, it would be perfect. If you could make the hex keys all fit in the driver slot, that may work. Let's say, make the driver slot 5mm (the largest hex key size) and make hex keys that taper from 5mm to the size they would be (5mm to 2.5mm for instance). Kind of like the Leatherman bits. I am just using my sizes as an example.

The only wrench I would need for this is the pedal wrench at 15mm (open ended). Of course, the spoke wrenches would be a must, as well. You could do some common sizes of wrenches like the current version of the MTO pry bar.

If it is possible, putting two tire levers that would snap to each side of the tool would be nice. Another route would be making the tool like a tire lever and making the second lever snap to the tool. A pry bar is another that would be good to put on one end.

Any others with ideas?

[AimlessWanderer]

Tofty, as the printing process is 3D does this enable you to produce an in-line bit driver? Just thinking that in the 5mm model a slot could be mounted at the end so the points of the hex bit are seated on the horizontal axis (thickness centreline) of the tool, and chamfered above and below along the edge of the bit ...

... not sure if I'm being clear enough  ...

This would enable some downforce on the bit, but would mean that the section of the tool driving the bit would be considerably reduced. I'm not entirely sure without seeing a drawing just how detrimental that would be to torque (or how much torque it would be able to transmit), but at least it would enable some downforce. I can't see it being any weaker than say a Philips or cap lifter driver on a SAK, as though there will only be just over 2.5mm of contact (due to orientation at 15 degrees), this would potentially be over a 10mm length along the side of the bit - far stronger than a 2.5mm brass pin.

Is any of this making any sense? 


Like this ... ish ... viewed end on ... after consumption of copious halucenegens   

______       _______
I_____<     >_____I

[Tofty]

Thanks for the help guys, i've tried to implement as much of your input as possible.

As is always the way with this kind of project i got side-tracked a few times and started thinking along slightly different lines so came up with a couple of other tools:

The Spanner Frame



A nice and simple arrangement of hexes: 5, 5.5, 7, 8, 10, 13, 17 and a 1/4" driver, with o-ring retention.


Driving Star



A stubby 1/4" hex bit driver with a 13mm socket spanner and six driver points: 4mm hex, 5mm hex, T25 torx, No.2 Posidriv, 6.5 x 1.2mm flat driver and a 1/4" square driver, with o-ring retention.


But after messing around with them i got round to finishing version 1 of the 'Bi-Tool'.



It's got pretty much everything i could think of:
Two tyre levers,
A 1/4" square driver with o-ring retention,
2 vertical and one horizontal 1/4" hex drivers, one with o-ring retention, the other two with magnetic retention.
An open 15mm spanner for pedals,
Loads of metric sockets (5, 5.5, 7, 8, 9, 10, 12, 13, 14, 17)
3 hex drivers (3, 4, 5)
A No.2 Phillips driver,
A flat 5.5 x 1mm driver,
3 spoke wrenches (3.23, 3.3, 3.45)
A bottle opener.

Let me know what you think, it will need some material reduction as the two parts would come to around $100 at the moment.

[MadPlumbarian]

For the star, are the bits out on a 10-15deg?  Or are they straight out? If they were straight out and all had a hex at the base you could use a driver on all of them and just rotate it to use the next one? JR

[Raukodur]

the drive star idea looks really interesting.

[Sparky415]

There are some great ideas there Mate 

[Mr. Whippy]

Agree!  Those are very clever and aesthetically appealing tools. 

[Syph007]

Man Tofty, your designs are just awesome!

I know I can do the electronics and mechanics of building a CNC mill and lathe, but Im weak on the CAD side.  I have lots to learn, but seeing your stuff is very inspiring!

[Tofty]

For the star, are the bits out on a 10-15deg?  Or are they straight out? If they were straight out and all had a hex at the base you could use a driver on all of them and just rotate it to use the next one? JR

It's a good idea but the drivers are angled to give clearance to the 13mm socket at the back.



The drivers could be moved up the tools body to give the same clearance. I might give it a go later.

the drive star idea looks really interesting.

Thanks, i designed it as a replacement for a tool i end up using at work a fair amount but with a much greater range of functions.
It's only 35mm at it's widest point so it's alot smaller than it looks in the renders, which makes it quite cheap for a 3D printed item; about 25 euros.

There are some great ideas there Mate 

Agree!  Those are very clever and aesthetically appealing tools. 

Thanks guys, hopefully more to come and alot of improvements to make to the bike tools.

Man Tofty, your designs are just awesome!

I know I can do the electronics and mechanics of building a CNC mill and lathe, but Im weak on the CAD side.  I have lots to learn, but seeing your stuff is very inspiring!

The way i use CAD software is just machining by other means. The thought process in organising actions to create the finished item is pretty much the same (with solidworks at any rate). the important difference is that when you mess up in CAD it only takes a minute or two to correct your mistakes.


I got something almost related to this thread through the post this morning......



Which with a little cleaning up turned into......



Pointless but fun.

[Sparky415]

Reminds me.....

[Tofty]

Just paying homage to a classic in my own way.

[stealth007s]

I'm really digging that driving star!¡!


Sent from my iPhone 4S using Tapatalk

[Tofty]

Thanks Stealth, here's a size comparison render of the various one-piece tools i've made alongside a 3" straight widgy bar:




I've decided to add a third layer to the bi-tool and thereby ruining it's name completely.
I want to expand and enclose the bit holder as i'm worried about it's overall strength and as the 1/4" square driver sticks up so much a third layer won't increase the tools overall profile much.
It will add a third tyre lever, a 6mm hex driver, a 2.5mm hex driver, another open ended spanner; probably a 13mm and whatever else is suggested.
Of cause this new layer will not be required as nothing will be removed from the first two tools but i'm adding the option now so that all parts can be re-designed to fit together properly.

[Tofty]

Got a few of these tools delivered:




Spanner Frame.








Star Driver.











Apart from a few small tweeks to the design i'm really happy with the way these pieces turned out.
Now just working on the new version of the bi/tri-tool.

[nuphoria]

That's a rather clever design.

So is it made from a steel, and does it hold up well?

[AHB]

Interesting stuff Tofty..

[stealth007s]

Very nice Tofty!¡!

[Tofty]

Interesting stuff Tofty..

Very nice Tofty!¡!

Thanks guys, more to come eventually, i've just ordered the first part of the two/three part bike tool.
I meant to order them all but when changing something on one tool affects all of other tools it gets far too confusing so i'll finish them off later. It's made worse my the fact that i plan to have two variations of the middle tool part to allow for the choice of it all being a two or three piece tool set.

That's a rather clever design.
So is it made from a steel, and does it hold up well?

The truthful answer is that i don't really know about it's functional resilience. I haven't done any destructive testing yet.

The metal is a 420 type stainless steel blended with a bronze material.
The website says it has a rockwell hardness of 20-25 HRC with a yield strength of 455 MPa.
I think the spanner/wrench applications will work well but the driver profiles will wear quickly.

Directly printed titanium will be twice as hard and twice as strong so much better for tools but it's also 10 times the cost.
At the moment the stainless material is the best for the application but soon better materials will come along at the right price for most applications.

[nuphoria]

Wow, I didn't know they could do Ti as well

I don't have any understanding of the physical properties of printing materials, but I love that we can do this now. There's some exciting medical stuff happening with this technology too.

[Tofty]

Yep titanium.



But i must admit a new femur seems like a more sensible application that some stupid beads.