Canada to the rescue

[Lichtbote]

Hi lads,

i know it´s a long shot, but maybe there is a chance ......

One of my hobbies is model building, and i don´t know why but i have a sweet spot for the small canadian WW2 ships. Tugs and Corvettes usw. - not as usual the big boys like cruisers or battleships, i like the workhorses.

I have scratchbuilt a Glen class tug in 1/72, original was build by Russel Brothers, Owen Sound, Ontario ( http://stevebriggs.netfirms.com/osmrm/navytugsglen.html ). For a more interesting looking display i also made a towing barge.

I want to put 2 canadian build Hurricanes on it, but i could use some reference of them. Some are still alive and on display in Canada: http://members.madasafish.com/~d_hodgkinson/hawker-guide-RW.htm

Is there maybe anyone out there who has visited any of these places, and took pics of the planes?

Oh, and i would also love to see any old pics of Halifax harbour while WW2 (or a few years before or after that timeframe) - generic stuff.

Many thanks.  (I know there is only a very small chance.)

[enki_ck]

If we only knew someone who works in the Halifax harbour.

[ColoSwiss]

Something you might be interested in - HMCS Haida, a WWII Canadian destroyer is now a museum ship.

http://www.pc.gc.ca/eng/lhn-nhs/on/haida/index.aspx

[Aloha]

If we only knew someone who works in the Halifax harbour.
http://forum.multitool.org/Smileys/default/salute.gif

[enki_ck]

I'll give you a hint. This site is registered to a Halifax address.

[Lichtbote]

He might be not old enough  - I think the harbour looks now very much different. 

[Lichtbote]

Something you might be interested in - HMCS Haida, a WWII Canadian destroyer is now a museum ship.

http://www.pc.gc.ca/eng/lhn-nhs/on/haida/index.aspx

Thanks for the link. 

[Aloha]

I was messing with Lichtbote.


 I wonder if Grants dad would have any pic of the harbor. 

[Lichtbote]

Guessing from his age - maybe his grandpa. 


I´m looking for such harbour pics.

[Grant Lamontagne]

Yes and no.... I don't have any old pics of Halifax Harbour (neither does my Dad who is not from anywhere near here, nor do either of my grandfathers who are also from nowhere near here! ) but the company I work for has been working on the waterfront for over a century so I may have access to old photos.  I'll have a look at work and ask my boss to see what we might have kicking around.

If you want modern photos, well, I have a lot of those, including many taken from a kayak perspective.  http://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,47351.0.html

If you are researching Halifax, my house is in an area that would have been leveled by the Halifax Explosion in WWI, and the place I work bringing European cars into Canada is the spot where they used to haul seaplanes out of the water.

Def

[Lichtbote]

I just had a look for the pics - really nice.  But not what i need. 

I´m not generally researching Halifax, i´m looking for details like structure of the ground on the quays (where was sand, gravel, concrete, cobbled stones), the sides on the piers, little generic buildings on them, Storagehouses, loading cranes, stuff laying around, what sort of cars/trucks was there ........

To display my model-ships i´m thinking for making some pieces of a generic quay of that time, little dioramas that make the ships look like they were fotographed during their work (the tug, for example) or or alongside the quay (the Flower class corvette) for loading consumables before escorting another convoy over the atlantic ocean.

Any pics would be highly appreciated.   

On one of your tours you maybe encountered one of these nice lighthouses? Info on them (size, pics of details) would be great, too. 

[Grant Lamontagne]

I Googled "Halifax Harbour WWII" and found a lot of photos that might help you.  Here are a few:

This looks to be around Pier 9, which is where the Halifax Explosion was in 1917:



This would be the navy dockyard some time during WWII.  Halifax was a staging area for a lot of NA forces headed to Europe.



This one looks to be near what is now the Halifax Ocean Terminals, which consists of Piers 20-31.  It says Jetty 4, so it could be the area that is now partially a park and partially the Container terminal called Ceres.  It's hard to tell as just about all the buildings in the background are long gone or radically changed.



I also pass the Maritime Museum of the Atlantic almost every day.  I will stop in and see what else I can find for you.  Building models and dioramas was a HUGE hobby for me when I was younger.  Unfortunately after too many moves I saw many get destroyed and while I still plan to do it again, I haven't gotten back into it yet.

Def

[Lichtbote]

Grant, please check my attachments a few posts above.  Off course i used google first, before asking. But your explanations brings it more "to life" for me. 

I was hoping for some pics that don´t show up on google, maybe more close to details - in each case many thanks for whatever you can find (and if you find nothing, thanks for trying it). 

Yeah, transport of that stuff is always a pain, it breaks to easy.

That´s my scratchbuild canadian Glen tug, towing a Flower corvette. And the barge i want to put the Hurricanes on for their transport to the harbour for beeing shipped oversea.

[comis]

Wow, the tug boat has some decent details on it, can't wait to see the finish Corvettes USW.  Are they remote controlled?

[Lichtbote]

Thanks. 

Aye, it´s rc - but to be honest, mostly it´s on display only.

RC tugs are usually build in a much bigger scale (and a lot more simplified for sturdyness while handling), as the originals are so small. This build is around 33,5 cm - so i had to make some of the details from 0,5mm material. So it breaks very easy when handling .... one false move ..... On the other hand it looks this way much better on display. 

I´m a dumb smurf - instead of building bought kits out of the box, or with some refinements, i usually prefer objects like this great little tug class. And cause the big companies produce what everyone knows and buys (Bismark, Hood, .....) and not the smaller unsung heroes, all the workhorses. That´s why i often have to build my models from plastic sheet and profiles many times. That means in case of a damage i can´t buy any replacement parts. Or completly build a new one if it sinks and no recovery is doable.

That´s why it sees any water not that often. 

The Corvette is a old Matchbox pattern/now Revell made kit, that builds a nice ship out of the box. But for the more "fanatic" it´s also with some wrong details, and a sort of generic Flower. They were under a constant change while their service time, and no 2 flowers looked the same. So i will have to modify a lot to get at the end the HMS Clematis (or any other i might go for).  The second kit i have will be build as the Sudbury, it´s a canadian flower that was rebuild after the war as a ocean going tug.

[Whoey]

When I lived in Quebec we found in the garage some old powered planes (motorized but with kite style controls?) and a model boat made from balsa wood and what looked like laminated tissue paper, the boat was mostly a frame around a foam core which while I imagine added weight also added a lot of buoyancy which I suppose kept it from sinking.

I would love to have a workshop to be able to build scale models again. Like Grant, lots of moving around and having kits with hours and hours of work in them break took the wind out of the sails. That and real life I guess.

I would settle for some sort of close-able desk/workbench where I could leave things to dry without being disturbed by our cats.

My grandfather grew up in Dartmouth (across the bay from Halifax) and lived his whole life pretty much in that area. I would imagine if he had a camera there would be some pretty amazing photos from back in the day, but I'm not sure how much there is. Unfortunately he's not with us anymore, so I can't exactly ask about it.

[ColoSwiss]

If you're looking for generic shipyard photos "The Battleship Builders" has a lot of great shots of British yards.

That tug is neat! 

http://www.amazon.com/Battleship-Builders-Constructing-British-Capital/dp/1591140277/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1414100965&sr=1-1&keywords=battleship+builders

[jerseydevil]

If you're looking for generic shipyard photos "The Battleship Builders" has a lot of great shots of British yards.

That tug is neat! 

http://www.amazon.com/Battleship-Builders-Constructing-British-Capital/dp/1591140277/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1414100965&sr=1-1&keywords=battleship+builders

That looks like a book I need for my library of naval history anyway.  Capital ships (battleships and battlecruisers) are something I've been fascinated with since I was a little kid. 

Lichtbote, that tug is sweet.  The service the RCN performed in the Battle of the Atlantic is glossed over in many histories of World War II.  Good on you for keeping an interest alive. 

[ColoSwiss]

If you're looking for generic shipyard photos "The Battleship Builders" has a lot of great shots of British yards.

That tug is neat! 

http://www.amazon.com/Battleship-Builders-Constructing-British-Capital/dp/1591140277/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1414100965&sr=1-1&keywords=battleship+builders

That looks like a book I need for my library of naval history anyway.  Capital ships (battleships and battlecruisers) are something I've been fascinated with since I was a little kid. 

Lichtbote, that tug is sweet.  The service the RCN performed in the Battle of the Atlantic is glossed over in many histories of World War II.  Good on you for keeping an interest alive. 

JD, the book is first rate! Photos of things like gun pits and erecting shops, layouts of yards. Definitely worth the cost.

I've been on the Missouri, New Jersey, Alabama, and North Carolina. Also HMS Belfast in London.

[Lichtbote]

I would love to have a workshop to be able to build scale models again. Like Grant, lots of moving around and having kits with hours and hours of work in them break took the wind out of the sails. That and real life I guess.

I know what you mean, sometimes it´s months between 2 modeling sessions - additional having several projects running makes the completion of each project a long time thing. 
Over the years I have collected a nice amount of tools - but over 90% i´m still making with the same handfull of small tools nearly each modelbuilder has in a box (xacto knife, 2-3 tweezers, a cheap set of small files, various of these multi sided foam nail files for sanding and polishing, q-tips and toothpics, ....)

I would settle for some sort of close-able desk/workbench where I could leave things to dry without being disturbed by our cats.

Sounds like a great idea, maybe one of these oldstyle secretaire? They can be closed, have a workplace, lots of drawers, ....

My grandfather grew up in Dartmouth (across the bay from Halifax) and lived his whole life pretty much in that area. I would imagine if he had a camera there would be some pretty amazing photos from back in the day, but I'm not sure how much there is. Unfortunately he's not with us anymore, so I can't exactly ask about it.

Aye, same here. All they have seen, good and bad, is lost.

[jerseydevil]

If you're looking for generic shipyard photos "The Battleship Builders" has a lot of great shots of British yards.

That tug is neat! 

http://www.amazon.com/Battleship-Builders-Constructing-British-Capital/dp/1591140277/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1414100965&sr=1-1&keywords=battleship+builders

That looks like a book I need for my library of naval history anyway.  Capital ships (battleships and battlecruisers) are something I've been fascinated with since I was a little kid. 

Lichtbote, that tug is sweet.  The service the RCN performed in the Battle of the Atlantic is glossed over in many histories of World War II.  Good on you for keeping an interest alive. 

JD, the book is first rate! Photos of things like gun pits and erecting shops, layouts of yards. Definitely worth the cost.

I've been on the Missouri, New Jersey, Alabama, and North Carolina. Also HMS Belfast in London.

I've been aboard the New Jersey, North Carolina, Massachusetts, and Texas, along with the cruisers Quincy and Olympia.  The Texas is especially cool, she's the last survivor of the pre-Washington Treaty Dreadnought era.  She served with the US squadron of the Grand Fleet in WWI, and was present at the invasions of North Africa, Normandy, Iwo Jima, and Okinawa.  The New Jersey was Halsey's flagship at Leyte Gulf, which began 70 years today actually.

[Lichtbote]

If you're looking for generic shipyard photos "The Battleship Builders" has a lot of great shots of British yards.

That tug is neat! 

http://www.amazon.com/Battleship-Builders-Constructing-British-Capital/dp/1591140277/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1414100965&sr=1-1&keywords=battleship+builders

Thanks. At the moment one of my projects is it´s little brother, the canadian Tanuc class tug. 

That book looks interesting. I may have a look for it

I´m not searching for any generic harbours, i´m searching for the small details that may differ a canadian harbour from one on the british ground, not sure if there have been much .....

[Lichtbote]

Lichtbote, that tug is sweet.  The service the RCN performed in the Battle of the Atlantic is glossed over in many histories of World War II.  Good on you for keeping an interest alive. 

Thanks. 

Aye, but not only the canadian. Everyone seems to remember the raid of the Graf Spee, sinking the Hood and/or Bismark, the aircraft carrier battles on the Pacific. But nothing of that would have been possible without all the men on tugs, merchant ships, working in the harbour. To often their efforts (on all sides) are forgotten.

For a reason i can´t explain i just have those sweet spot for the look of many small canadian ships. 

[ColoSwiss]

If you're looking for generic shipyard photos "The Battleship Builders" has a lot of great shots of British yards.

That tug is neat! 

http://www.amazon.com/Battleship-Builders-Constructing-British-Capital/dp/1591140277/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1414100965&sr=1-1&keywords=battleship+builders

That looks like a book I need for my library of naval history anyway.  Capital ships (battleships and battlecruisers) are something I've been fascinated with since I was a little kid. 

Lichtbote, that tug is sweet.  The service the RCN performed in the Battle of the Atlantic is glossed over in many histories of World War II.  Good on you for keeping an interest alive. 

JD, the book is first rate! Photos of things like gun pits and erecting shops, layouts of yards. Definitely worth the cost.

I've been on the Missouri, New Jersey, Alabama, and North Carolina. Also HMS Belfast in London.

I've been aboard the New Jersey, North Carolina, Massachusetts, and Texas, along with the cruisers Quincy and Olympia.  The Texas is especially cool, she's the last survivor of the pre-Washington Treaty Dreadnought era.  She served with the US squadron of the Grand Fleet in WWI, and was present at the invasions of North Africa, Normandy, Iwo Jima, and Okinawa.  The New Jersey was Halsey's flagship at Leyte Gulf, which began 70 years today actually.

Been on the Olympia; unfortunately the main turrets are mock-ups and the secondary armament is also not correct. Where's the Quincy located?

[jerseydevil]

   Not the Quincy.  My bad, I was reading an article on the Battle of Savo Island earlier.  I meant to say the USS Salem, which is in Quincy, Mass.

[Lichtbote]

I've been aboard the Olympia.

   What a beautifull ship, i hope there will be enough money to preserve her for a long time.

I´ve build the kit as a child, in a childs way.  And i know the actual kit is still the clumsy old one (patterns from the 50´s i think), but i hope to build her one day in a way that does her beauty justice.

[ColoSwiss]

  Not the Quincy.  My bad, I was reading an article on the Battle of Savo Island earlier.  I meant to say the USS Salem, which is in Quincy, Mass.

Thanks for the info. If I ever get back to Mass, will try and check her and the 'Mamie' out.

Haida and the corvette Sackville are on the to-do list if I ever get up to eastern Canada (tentatively planned for a few years down the road).

[ColoSwiss]

I've been aboard the Olympia.

   What a beautifull ship, i hope there will be enough money to preserve her for a long time.

I´ve build the kit as a child, in a childs way.  And i know the actual kit is still the clumsy old one (patterns from the 50´s i think), but i hope to build her one day in a way that does her beauty justice.

My understanding is the ship is in very bad shape, and the group that controls her is broke. IIRC some teen-ager got himself killed on the ship some years back and his family was suing to have the ship scraped. Be a pity to lose her.

[Lichtbote]

My understanding is the ship is in very bad shape, and the group that controls her is broke.

That´s what i´ve heard, too.

Would really be a shame to loose her.

[jerseydevil]

My understanding is the ship is in very bad shape, and the group that controls her is broke.

That´s what i´ve heard, too.

Would really be a shame to loose her.

That it would.  Dewey's flagship at Manilla Bay, and she carried the Unknown Soldier from France to the US.  There are very few predreadnought-era ships left in the world.  My understanding is that the situation has stabilized somewhat, that she's not in immediate danger of being scrapped or scuttled right now.  Several years ago there was a good chance of that.  On a side note, directly across the river from where the Olympia is in Philadelphia, the USS New Jersey is moored in Camden.  When I was on the NJ, one of the tour guides in turret 2 taught us how the backup analog fire control computer in the turret lobby worked.  We aimed at the Olympia.