CPR, first aid etc?

[Grant Lamontagne]

I recently started noticing how few people out there actually know anything about CPR and basic first aid.

I am far from being a paramedic, but I have never had any serious issues diagnosing and providing immediate aid wherever I am, be it CPR or cleaning/bandaging wounds, performing the Heimlich maneuver on myself or others and so on.  I am not currently CPR certified, but I don't think it has changed much since the last time I was.

I also know my way around most commercially available first aid kits.  And, thanks to an old episode of M*A*S*H* and my penchant for good knives, I feel reasonably confident that I could perform an emergency tracheotomy if required, although I hope it never is. 

What is everyone else's thoughts on medical preparedness and training?  Do you have any formal training or do you take an impromptu nap at the sight of blood?

Def

[magentus]

When I was a teenager I was getting off the bus to college and a young woman on the pavement had what turned out to be an epileptic fit. As person after person walked passed her I knelt with her and called for help. The bus driver jumped out of his cab after calling his control to ring for an ambulance, and gently helped the young woman until the ambulance arrived. His son was epileptic and he knew exactly what to do. He told me I'd done the right thing by just being with her and protecting her from hurting herself until the fit had passed. I felt really disgusted that so many people had ignored this poor person, and I knew I didn't want to be in a position where I felt that helpless again.

I have been First aid trained for about 25 years now, 11 as an office worker (no casualties), 4 as a joiner (loads!) and 10 as a care worker and warden on a retirement complex (lots and lots of practise!). I've also helped family members and pets.

I've fainted once at work but that wasn't  in a first aid situiation - it was cleaning and dressing a necrotic wound on a hot summers day in a stuffy room. I knocked over a jug of ribena on my way down and my teammates thoght I had split my head open 

I also had some ptsd about 3 days after a particularly traumatic incident while I was driving - just had to stop the car while I broke down. Luckily my wife is from a councelling background and helped immensely.

Remaining calm and supportive during a medical emergency is just as important a lot of the time as the technical knowledge you need and remember first aid is exactly that  - keeping the person safe until the professionals arrive.

I'd recommend training to everyone. You always think you won't know what to do when it comes to it, but you do - the training kicks in and before you know it the ambulance has arrived.

BTW Grant, the Heinlich is now frowned upon and CPR changes every sodding time I refresh my training!

[Smashie]

Well my first aid training is up to date, although nowadays I'm less likely to have to deal with knife and gunshot injuries (thank god).

I'm continually frustrated by people who have a first aid kit and have no clue to even do the basics! One course I did 5 years ago was a free course for baby and toddler first aid, knowing what you can't do is actually just as important as knowing what you can do.

I do carry a very comprehensive FAK in the car that I can deal with most things if I need to whilst waiting for the paramedics to arrive.

[LoopCutter]

First rule is "stay calm".

If you take control of care, delegate others around you tasks; call 911 , then  help to stabilize head / neck, control bleeding, etc.

CPR has changed, my last training was with breathless technics. Just compressions. 

Both my sons are professional fireman, and are trained Basic life support care.  The youngest was a paramedic before a fire fighter and serves as one as his second job.  He is very good at taking control of a scene and rendering care. I even know several of his victims who are yet here because of his training. 

He can perform those tasks on anyone and any situation, BUT , not on his own child or loved one.

I am not a paramedic, nor pretend to be one. I have been part of enough training sessions and a few live case situations that I can assess a situation and do well. Only because of practice.

I obtain yearly first aid/CPR training for work and have my 30 hour (or 40?) OSHA cert.  avoidance is best practice.

Best advice is to get basic and CPR training at least once a year, pay attention and do the practices as a victim and care giver.

Someone you care for may benefit from those skills.

You can not be a should've or could've person. 

PS:  I not sure about the trach procedure, just make sure it is a thin, sharp blade and you have tube to insert to keep slit open. 

Also, an AWL with eye is to BIG for stitching a cut. 



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[AimlessWanderer]

I am health and safety trained, but not first aid trained. I have had to opportunity for first aid training several times, and even been asked numerous times to take the course. I declined.

I'm the wrong person for that job, because I'd flake. Seriously. I just can't handle seeing that kind of stuff, never mind getting stuck in with sorting it out In a situation where there's anything more than a minor cut, I'm likely to need more help than they are  I know it sounds wimpish and cowardly, but I would rather stand aside and let someone else step up to the role who has a little more composure. Putting me through the training would be pointless. If I see something I think I can help with, then I will - but I don't see me passing out or throwing up on someone who desperately needs help, to be particularly useful.....

Full respect to anyone who does the course, and is made of the right stuff to put it to use and help the needy.  I know how bad it might sound to be "chickening out" of this stuff, but sometimes the bravest and wisest option is to simply admit you're just not the right guy for the job, get the hell out of the way, and let someone more competent take over

Sorry guys 

[Grant Lamontagne]

I watched a video this morning of a young family with a three year old child that had stopped breathing.  Luckily there was a police officer close enough to help after a call was made to 911.

I can imagine those parents felt pretty useless ad they watched, unable to do anything but watch their child turn blue and hope that someone able to deal with it would arrive in time.

For what amounts to very simple training, I just don't see why you wouldn't learn CPR, especially if you are responsible for children.

Def

[Steinar]

I think I've been through four or five first aid courses in my life, but I'm rusty and should refresh. Basically, over here, you have to actively avoid it to not learn CPR. It's compulsory when taking a drivers license, the boy scouts and 4H teaches it to the kids, many companies (even if they only employ office workers) will get the Red Cross or similar to hold courses as a basic safety measure, etc, etc. I think elementary first aid should be viewed as a basic skill most adults should know.

[Steinar]

I'm the wrong person for that job, because I'd flake. Seriously. I just can't handle seeing that kind of stuff, never mind getting stuck in with sorting it out In a situation where there's anything more than a minor cut, I'm likely to need more help than they are  I know it sounds wimpish and cowardly, but I would rather stand aside and let someone else step up to the role who has a little more composure. Putting me through the training would be pointless. If I see something I think I can help with, then I will - but I don't see me passing out or throwing up on someone who desperately needs help, to be particularly useful.....

That's life, we're all different, and part of life is realizing both what one is capable and incapable of, and then making the best of that.   

[Aloha]

I'm not currently CPR certified however I can and will render aid in most situations.  I know my limits which as mentioned in an of itself is important.  I was talking to my roommate recently who is CPR/AED and first aid certified that I need to renew my training. 

[jerseydevil]

I was an EMT for a while in NY state when I was away at college. I certainly saw my share of unlovely events, some very bad indeed. Though my license is expired, I do remember much of my training, and make it a point to keep my CPR cert up to date.   I keep a basic FAK in my bag, and part of my job is making sure the larger kits at work are stocked and up to date.

[Grant Lamontagne]

I'll bet you have.  I have been on the scene early on in several accidents in my life and I am glad I know how to tie a tourniquet.  I'm sure there are a few other people on this planet are also glad that I know how to do that.  If I hadn't, they might not have many opinions on anything these days.

I've been in a few messy scenes and fortunately I have always kept a level head when things go horribly wrong, treating it like a series of problems that need to be dealt with rather than thinking of it as a person's innards.  I can't watch surgery or something on TV, but I can deal with organs in person, which is kind of weird. 

I considered working as an EMT when I was younger but I didn't because I am squeamish when things aren't an emergency.   

Even so, I have always hated the idea of trusting my well being to others so I have always fixed my own problems, at least until I could get help.  I even went so far once as to stitch up my right wrist, which was difficult because I am right handed, and it was on the far side that you really can't see easily.  I was young then, and playing with a large knife and cut myself with it, and didn't want to let my parents know what I'd done so I fixed it myself! 

I really have very little faith in the humanity around me on a daily basis, so unless someone has specific training, I'll handle it myself until the smart people arrive.

Def

[Tomcat_81]

I got 4 trainings in the last 10 years and am lucky enough to give serious first aid about once a year 
Thank god it has only been gushing blood and no CPR necessary until now.

Regular trainings are required in my job (teacher surrounded by a lot of tools ;-)) and also obligatory during the drivers' training in Germany.

I always carry nitrile-gloves, a face-shield for CPR and a lot of bandages'n'stuff with me.
And, yes, Grant, of course I always carry that cursed mobile ;-)

Thumbs up for the trainings. You always forget and re-learn!

Tomcat

[Grant Lamontagne]

I have thought about getting a CPR mask for a while.  As a germophobe I really don't like the idea of putting my mouth on a stranger's, especially if they are frothing or vomiting.  I would also hate to think something bad happened to someone because I was squeamish.

Def

[Chako]

Get one, they are only a few bucks at most. 

Being a science teacher, I have a fairly good first aid background, at least good until the real pros arrive.

[cody6268]

I just got certified American Red Cross Adult and Pediatric First Aid, CPR, and AED as a part of a requirement for my mechatronics class at community college.  I also got OSHA 10--I think I was one of the handful that actually managed to stay awake during the whole course of that.  I came out of that course with various safety improvements that needed to be made on the farm--notably a system to prevent the blowtorch O2 and Acetylene tanks from turning over again (don't ask me how it happened the first time)  and to barricade off a hole in the barn loft floor (which was made to be able to throw hay down below, but is really nothing more than a fall hazard anymore).

[jerseydevil]

I'll bet you have.  I have been on the scene early on in several accidents in my life and I am glad I know how to tie a tourniquet.  I'm sure there are a few other people on this planet are also glad that I know how to do that.  If I hadn't, they might not have many opinions on anything these days.

I've been in a few messy scenes and fortunately I have always kept a level head when things go horribly wrong, treating it like a series of problems that need to be dealt with rather than thinking of it as a person's innards.  I can't watch surgery or something on TV, but I can deal with organs in person, which is kind of weird. 

I considered working as an EMT when I was younger but I didn't because I am squeamish when things aren't an emergency.   

Even so, I have always hated the idea of trusting my well being to others so I have always fixed my own problems, at least until I could get help.  I even went so far once as to stitch up my right wrist, which was difficult because I am right handed, and it was on the far side that you really can't see easily.  I was young then, and playing with a large knife and cut myself with it, and didn't want to let my parents know what I'd done so I fixed it myself! 

I really have very little faith in the humanity around me on a daily basis, so unless someone has specific training, I'll handle it myself until the smart people arrive.

Def

I always managed to not throw up until everything was taken care of. I've tied a tourniquet before, have done CPR three times (one didn't make it ), saw a guy hit by a .30-30 after his buddy mistook him for a deer...... It was a rural area, and the closest ER was 20 minutes away at full speed. NY used to have an EMT-R(ural) certification for areas like that. We were trained to do trachs, etc. Our school made national news in 1998 for a hazing incident involving freshmen football players, funnels, and a LOT of whiskey. That was a long night, one kid actually died on us in the back of the ambulance. We got him going again fortunately. I don't talk about the real bad calls. Going on 20 years later I still have the occasional nightmare.

For a call like that, your training kicks in. You're so busy doing what you have to do that you're not thinking about it, just doing what you have to do. Afterwards, well......

[jerseydevil]

Oh, and I've stiched myself up several times too.

[magentus]

I have thought about getting a CPR mask for a while.  As a germophobe I really don't like the idea of putting my mouth on a stranger's, especially if they are frothing or vomiting.  I would also hate to think something bad happened to someone because I was squeamish.

Def

You can always improvise with a plastic bag - cut a hole in it with a knife - who here carries a knife? 

[Grant Lamontagne]

Just remember to cut the bag before putting it over the patient?   

Def

[Tomcat_81]

Thumbs up for Jerseydevil! 

[AimlessWanderer]

Just remember to cut the bag before putting it over the patient?   

Def

Nah, the shock of going at their face with a blade might be enough to resuscitate them 

In all seriousness, there was a newspaper article over here many years ago, where an ambulance had been involved in a traffic accident. At the time they were rushing a heart attack patient to hospital, and the crash actually resuscitated the patient and saved their life 

Not that I would recommend this as a technique of course..... 

[Grant Lamontagne]

CPR has changed, my last training was with breathless technics. Just compressions. 

This gets to me- yes, I understand that better techniques have been developed over the years, and I can appreciate not having to put my mouth on a stranger's, especially since I mentioned above that I'm a bit of a germophobe.

That having been said, I also feel that any training is good, and I don't see much need to recertify for the average person, as the techniques I learned years ago are still very effective.  The human body has not really evolved significantly in the last 20 years- hearts, lungs etc have not changed location, materials or function since long before I was born, and the things that worked 20 years ago should still work today. 

That being said, yes, a professional should recertify, and the average person should check it once in a while, but I have never been asked at the side of the road if my certificate was up to date while helping someone.  I won't go to jail if I use an older version of CPR.

I realize that makes me sound like an idiot, but these courses take time and cost money, and I usually only seem to have one or the other of those, not both.

First rule is "stay calm".

If you take control of care, delegate others around you tasks; call 911 , then  help to stabilize head / neck, control bleeding, etc.

Absolutely.

In a crisis situation, people are going to freak out and actually be quite detrimental to whatever actually needs to be done.  Giving them a single task to focus on and keep them occupied will keep them out of the way and allow them to feel like they are being useful, as well as freeing up the actually useful people for more significant tasks.

Even making them concentrate on keeping the other freaking out people away is a valuable service.

Def

[Grant Lamontagne]

Just remember to cut the bag before putting it over the patient?   

Def

Nah, the shock of going at their face with a blade might be enough to resuscitate them 

In all seriousness, there was a newspaper article over here many years ago, where an ambulance had been involved in a traffic accident. At the time they were rushing a heart attack patient to hospital, and the crash actually resuscitated the patient and saved their life 

Not that I would recommend this as a technique of course..... 

That's a lucky coincidence, and not one I am ever hoping to test, regardless of which position you are playing!

Ambulances get in accidents all the time, at least around here.  I used to work with a lot of paramedics and the amount of time they were off work due to accident related injuries was very significant.  The nature of their jobs makes them a target for idiots who are too busy doing anything but driving to notice the loud sirens or flashing lights.   

Last week I was coming off the highway and there were traffic lights at the bottom of the ramp, which meant traffic backs up to the highway level, and sometimes well onto the highway.  The ramp is two lanes and I was in the left lane about halfway down when I heard a siren behind me.  It was a fire chief in an SUV, so I pulled up over the curb and well out of the way.  Everyone else did as well, as much as they were able at least, not in what I would consider a "timely manner" but they did eventually and the fire chief made it through.  Most folks, including a pickup truck with large flat deck trailer pulled back into their lanes- of course they all had to move forward to pull off to the side, and forward again to pull back into their lanes, which meant they were all trapped when the pump truck came along a few seconds later.  The guy in the pickup ended up having to drive forward and into the intersection on a red light to get out of the path that the pump truck needed.

Am I ever glad it wasn't my house on fire, or I'd have beaten every one of those idiot drivers to a bloody pulp at the side of the road.  I hope that no one was harmed or killed because people are too stupid to get out of the way of a fire truck.   

Def

[Sazabi]

I'm certified in Basic Life Support (basically, CPR plus a couple select other skills) through the AHA, though I would love to get certified in First Aid and a couple other things; it's on my forever-long to do list, though. :/

[ryan1835]

ive got an emergency first aid ticket, mainly CPR so i can go into HV rooms at work 

[Alan K.]

I had very comprehensive first responder training 30 years ago.  I think everyone should have some first aid training, enough to at least prevent the average person from panicking and possibly making things worse. First aid kits are best if you only stock them with items that you know how to use, and when the contents are kept clean and up to date.  Remember, you're not just carrying a first aid kit to help other people, but also so that other people who may have the skills but not the supplies can help you if you become hurt or incapacitated.

[MadPlumbarian]

Our older kid was in the hosp from birth to seven months old, and they wouldn't let us take him home without taking a LOT of their classes! I've had to put feeding tubes down the nose in order to feen him, I've also had to Heimlich not him but his little brother(around 8 ), and another time a family member, all while his wife who's food he was choking on just stared at him like what did I do, is it that bad? Honestly I'm surprised we all didn't choke! After all was cool the, wife and I went to Burger King.. lol.. that happened a lot too! Anything else was more or less a flesh wounds two in which electrical tape did the job, others were a gym sock or just normal bandages. I take that back our dog was choking on something and I did have to reach down his throat to pull something out.
But I carry my mini fak which is in the wallet and is just a bandage and wipes, but then a larger one in my bag which has all sorts of goodies, you just never know when it might come in handy, and it only takes that one time to pay for everything in its weight in gold!
JR

[Grant Lamontagne]

I guess the phrase "up your nose with a rubber hose" is a lot more meaningful at your house?   

Def

[MadPlumbarian]

I guess the phrase "up your nose with a rubber hose" is a lot more meaningful at your house?   

Def

You think? Especially back in 2000-01! That crap wasn't fun, the Mrs could, but wouldn't, do it, she couldn't stand listening to him scream as if was happening, but I couldn't blame her..
JR

[MadPlumbarian]

Here's a throwback, 16yrs ago!
JR