Artifact for Self Defense

[ringzero]

An Artifact application that I'd never thought of:
http://www.moderncombativesystems.com/docs/bag22.htm

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[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

I always thought it'd make a decent impact tool

[John]

I had mentioned it before about the widgy bars the artifact is great for impact,gouging and scrapping defence tool,

there's plenty of different techniques I could tell you about but this is not the place to discuss self defence techniques 

[ringzero]

there's plenty of different techniques I could tell you about but this is not the place to discuss self defence techniques 

Why not?

I wouldn't mind reading a few of your techniques.  Always happy to learn something new.

Probably never be used, but who knows?

.

[John]

there's plenty of different techniques I could tell you about but this is not the place to discuss self defence techniques  

Why not?

I wouldn't mind reading a few of your techniques.  Always happy to learn something new.

Probably never be used, but who knows?

.

Nothing new but here's a few of my favs for close quarter/phone booth combat

use the prybar end for thrusting at the sternum gives a new meaning to the word pain  

also a raking motion across the back of the hand brings good seconds to make another move

then there's a slashing/raking motion across the forehead job done,you can make your escape  


I have more but try those out on yourself and you'll get the feeling for what you may dish out  


[edit] the sternum technique can also be a raking down motion  try it on yourself 

[John]

Nick the real technique in defence is to get away and not stand there trading blows if you can, especially if as you say the guy is wired in that situation I doubt any technique would work alone, except five guys sitting on him  but apart from those on chemical cocktails "not all are" most attacks/fights start quite calm at first and there's mostly a build up in aggression that's the time to get out of there IMO so now I come to the reason I don't like discussing impact or otherwise techniques:what works for one person/situation may not work for/in another there are so many variables it would be impossible to predict the out come  the best technique that has proven to work is total awareness of your surroundings thus avoiding confrontation in the first place JMHO

[Benner]

Artifact as an impact tool?    I'd feel more tactically equipped with a pencil.  

Like Nick says, too small really.

[Gadget Guy]

I spend a lot of time watching and learning about different impact weapons. Almost anything can be used as a impact weapon, but its how you use it that really matters.   

[Freudian Frog]

In the article they state its primary use for inverted edge tactics which seems very reasonable to me.

[Benner]

All these ideas are great, but if I was in a fully fledged fight the last thing I'd be doing is looking for my Artifact as an impact weapon.  A flashlight, pen or similar I could understand, but if I felt enough risk that I felt the need to use an Artifact, I'd be outta there.

[John]

John,  A fight is sometimes a slow build up....most I have dealt with are violent eruptions of anger/fury or combined with a motive to rob/steal.

I say this from being a cop for over a decade, training other cops in self defence and before that being a doorman for several years.

You are right in that having an awareness of your surroundings will help, but in most cases a tiny impact tool will hinder not help....you are also right that one technique will not work on everyone.

To me a true test of any teacher/sensei is if one states "This is THE technique/tool/gadget/move that will work on all" its time to walk away.

Nick I don't normally say I've done this and that but for 30 years I've boxed/kick boxed and studied a whole lot of other martial arts/weapons and at one point taught people self defence and worked doors in the 80's early 90's no big deal really as it makes me no more prepared for the unknown as the next person that said it may give me a tenth of a second advantage if the S*** should hit the fan,

I do agree with you that a small impact object will hinder for the most part   but used with/combined with say boxing it may give you a slight edge just like a roll of pound coins in the hand would again I'm not predicting the outcome   but really what I'm saying is this you gather together techniques put those aside,and start again gather techniques and so on until eventually maybe just one of thousands of learned technique will sit in the sub conscience and may just save the day should it happen.


Lastly and food for though for others reading this:there's a couple of sayings it's not the weapon you should really worry about but rather the person behind it and a person hell bent on one objective in mind just say for instance to bite your nose, well there's a 99.9% chance he probably will succeed.


P.S Ben people have been stabbed with pencils    

[John]

All these ideas are great, but if I was in a fully fledged fight the last thing I'd be doing is looking for my Artifact as an impact weapon.  A flashlight, pen or similar I could understand, but if I felt enough risk that I felt the need to use an Artifact, I'd be outta there.

I agree as there's a good chance it may break 

[ringzero]

All these ideas are great, but if I was in a fully fledged fight the last thing I'd be doing is looking for my Artifact as an impact weapon.  A flashlight, pen or similar I could understand, but if I felt enough risk that I felt the need to use an Artifact, I'd be outta there.

As an impact weapon the Artifact strikes me as being right on the edge of being useful.  There just isn't very much of it sticking out of the hand when gripped.  It might slightly increase the effect of a hammer blow.

The inverted edge technique looks viable.  The little bit of prybar that sticks out might be good if raked across an opponent's face.

However, in a fight nearly anything in the hand is better than nothing in the hand.

When out for a stroll at night, I habitually carry a 2AA MiniMagLED.  A good bit of the flashlight sticks out of either end of my fist, and I wouldn't want to be hit with either end.  Would also function as a fistload for punching - not as good a fistload as a roll of coins, but much better than nothing.

.

[ringzero]

Just a though for the UK'ers on the site.

If you have the time to prepare the blade, lock it in and use as a hammer fist, inverted cutter, eye stabby thingy etc etc then if investigated you have just lost a lot of "reasonableness" when answering questions at a later stage.

To prep such a tool would take away the element of "it was the first thing that came to hand"

Assuming an unarmed opponent, I'd rather beat on him with my MiniMag than resort to a knife or gun.

A simple 2AA flashlight, without an idiotic "strike bezel," is obviously not being carried primarily as a weapon.

.

[John]

Nick thanks for that I carry mine with no blade TBH as I have a SAK with me for legal cutting duties anyway

[Flash]

Nick thanks for that I carry mine with no blade TBH as I have a SAK with me for legal cutting duties anyway

Good man 

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

Nick thanks for that I carry mine with no blade TBH as I have a SAK with me for legal cutting duties anyway

Me too, as I hate that style of blade anyway

[Grant Lamontagne]

I think Nick has made an interesting point, scary as that may be.

Just a though for the UK'ers on the site.

If you have the time to prepare the blade, lock it in and use as a hammer fist, inverted cutter, eye stabby thingy etc etc then if investigated you have just lost a lot of "reasonableness" when answering questions at a later stage.

To prep such a tool would take away the element of "it was the first thing that came to hand"

This works for anyone in any jurisdiction, or at least any of the ones I have worked in.

However, the point that a lot of these self defense things should point out is that while you should try to be aware of your situation, and while you should try and get away if at all possible, there are times when it just isn't an option- as I'm sure the police, doormen and other security minded folks here will agree.  Things like using the Artifact, MagLite, keys etc aren't the kinds of things you should carry in case of attack, nor are they things that you can necessarily use when an attack is imminent.

What they are for, and what understanding their usefulness as a potential weapon is, is the case where you are already down, wrestling with someone, and you manage to get a hand free for a moment, and you grasp anything at all.  If you manage to get your hands on your keys, it's best to have an idea of how they can be used- and same with a MagLite, Artifact or so on.  It's not so much a knowledge of mag/kubaton techniques, but understanding the dynamics of everyday objects in such a manner that you can use them instinctively if something should happen- because in reality, adrenalin won't help the thought process.

So, it's a good idea, limited, but potentially useful.  Like the Lifehammer or ResQMe, or even the fire extinguisher in your kitchen, you hope it's something you never have to use, but it's good to have just in case.

Def

[Rodion]

Personally, I place little faith in my opponent's pain receptors. It's been my experience stupid people take a whole lot longer to notice they've been injured, thus allowing them to do large amounts of damage before becoming incapacitated. Now, if a woman is truly concerned about the whole thing, I suppose a better option would be a large, mean umbrella with an oak handle and steel spike (ideally?). Although, there is really no substitute for continuous hand to hand combat training.

[John]

Although, there is really no substitute for continuous hand to hand combat training.

If your talking about Kung-Fu, karate judo, jujitsu,kempo,taekwondo or any rehearsed hand to hand combat for that matter
then I'm afraid on the whole that wont always save the day,it's just like: no amount of land swimming will prepare you for the open sea.

I've seen black belts male and female get floored by a someone with no combat tanning at all   here's the thing: attack is they say the best defence I agree, advantage assailant it's that simple IMO, which is why I mentioned tuning/training in awareness to your surroundings may help thwart an attack if you see it coming and act first i'e attack first.

No amount of training in hand to hand combat will make you invincible it's not the be all and end all to every situation,if you think it is then you're in for a rude awakening when someone jumps out at you I only hope you're not heavily hurt  


Only fools take up self-defence classes train for a few years and then think they're "billy ten men" invincible  


[edit]Oh Rodion this is not directed at you but more the general public 

[Zack]

I would rather use my shoes i.e. running away than use the Artifact as a SD device.  The blade is dangerous to open quickly, and is almost too sharp to notice for the first few seconds.  When I stabbed myself with my UKPK I didn't know I had done it until my pants were wet with blood.

[John]

I would rather use my shoes i.e. running away than use the Artifact as a SD device. 

Very good advice here just make make sure they have non slip soles tho     

except like a mate of mine fell asleep and his assailant stole his rockports 

ok time to get my coat   

[Rodion]

If your talking about Kung-Fu, karate judo, jujitsu,kempo,taekwondo or any rehearsed hand to hand combat for that matter
then I'm afraid on the whole that wont always save the day,it's just like: no amount of land swimming will prepare you for the open sea.

I've seen black belts male and female get floored by a someone with no combat tanning at all   here's the thing: attack is they say the best defence I agree, advantage assailant it's that simple IMO, which is why I mentioned tuning/training in awareness to your surroundings may help thwart an attack if you see it coming and act first i'e attack first.

No amount of training in hand to hand combat will make you invincible it's not the be all and end all to every situation,if you think it is then you're in for a rude awakening when someone jumps out at you I only hope you're not heavily hurt  


Only fools take up self-defence classes train for a few years and then think they're "billy ten men" invincible  


[edit]Oh Rodion this is not directed at you but more the general public 

Well, I was talking about Krav Maga, kickboxing or MMA, but whatever strikes your fancy. Obviously, nothing will prepare you better than recreational street fighting in your spare time, but any kind of training beats walking around with an Artifact thinking yourself safer for it.

[Teofilo]

I would rather use my shoes i.e. running away than use the Artifact as a SD device.  The blade is dangerous to open quickly, and is almost too sharp to notice for the first few seconds.  When I stabbed myself with my UKPK I didn't know I had done it until my pants were wet with blood.

LOL!