84mm SAK love

[Faddy Daddy]

Appreciate you guys getting me up to speed. I'd only picked up bits and pieces and honestly, I don't really read much about the evolution series on this forum so I wasn't sure how popular they were/are. Yeah, seems would be a great option if from time to time the explorer or huntsman etc feel a little heavy in pocket 

The Evolution S557 for example, is a great Sak. Here's a recent topic with pics side by side with an Explorer 
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,72845.0.html#_

Nice! Though ... the reason I'm eyeing the evolution models is because of being a bit smaller/lighter. That S557 is a pretty wide beast, I think even more than my old deluxe tinker. I was thinking that 14 looks rather nice, standard blade, nail file and with scissors.

[MacGyver]

Appreciate you guys getting me up to speed. I'd only picked up bits and pieces and honestly, I don't really read much about the evolution series on this forum so I wasn't sure how popular they were/are. Yeah, seems would be a great option if from time to time the explorer or huntsman etc feel a little heavy in pocket 

The Evolution S557 for example, is a great Sak. Here's a recent topic with pics side by side with an Explorer 
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,72845.0.html#_

Nice! Though ... the reason I'm eyeing the evolution models is because of being a bit smaller/lighter. That S557 is a pretty wide beast, I think even more than my old deluxe tinker. I was thinking that 14 looks rather nice, standard blade, nail file and with scissors.

Oh ok, i get it...  Yes the E14 is a great compact knife, the scales are a little chunkier than the standard Vic's but it's more ergonomic.
I have an S16 myself and like it a lot 

[Faddy Daddy]

Oh ok, i get it...  Yes the E14 is a great compact knife, the scales are a little chunkier than the standard Vic's but it's more ergonomic.
I have an S16 myself and like it a lot 

Yep, I started looking at the evolutions because of the tad smaller size and then reading about how people seem to really like the 84mm's as well. Seems owning at least one would make for a nice alternative and add to a very small but growing collection.

Also, to see if I am following this correctly, it seems Vic has pretty much stopped manufacturing the "84mm" styles and the effort is now going to the "evolution" series which is a meld of their own ideas with old Wenger models?

[Faddy Daddy]

Oh, and nice to hear you like the S16 MacGyver, as I'm sure you know, it's the same as the 14 except with the 90 degree phillips instead of the corkscrew. Size wise it seems like a really nice pocket carry for day to day

[MacGyver]

Oh ok, i get it...  Yes the E14 is a great compact knife, the scales are a little chunkier than the standard Vic's but it's more ergonomic.
I have an S16 myself and like it a lot 

Yep, I started looking at the evolutions because of the tad smaller size and then reading about how people seem to really like the 84mm's as well. Seems owning at least one would make for a nice alternative and add to a very small but growing collection.

Also, to see if I am following this correctly, it seems Vic has pretty much stopped manufacturing the "84mm" styles and the effort is now going to the "evolution" series which is a meld of their own ideas with old Wenger models?

Well, Vic didn't stopped manufacturing the classic 84mm's at all, there are still some models, but up to 2 layers max. and no scissors.

There's the Small Tinker, Tourist, Sportsman, Recruit, Bantam, Waiter, Walker, and the Alox Cadet.

My current edc's are either the Small Tinker or the Tourist. Heaven forbid they ever stop making those... 
What they stop making where the larger 84mm models, with scissors unfortunately.
The Small Climber and Salesman (small Super Tinker) where great models, and also my ultimate dream sak's. I hope they'll make tem again someday... 

The Evolutions are basically Wengers with better springs, Vic can opener, Awl and Vic Philips/Corkscrew, and Vic style toothpick and tweezers. The rest is all Wenger design.
Personally I think Vic kept way too much Wenger models, but they are good models nevertheless

[AimlessWanderer]

Oh ok, i get it...  Yes the E14 is a great compact knife, the scales are a little chunkier than the standard Vic's but it's more ergonomic.
I have an S16 myself and like it a lot 

Yep, I started looking at the evolutions because of the tad smaller size and then reading about how people seem to really like the 84mm's as well. Seems owning at least one would make for a nice alternative and add to a very small but growing collection.

Also, to see if I am following this correctly, it seems Vic has pretty much stopped manufacturing the "84mm" styles and the effort is now going to the "evolution" series which is a meld of their own ideas with old Wenger models?

I'm a big fan of the Wenger Traveller, which is essentially the Evo14. It's the only knife that I have multiple variations of - no, actually I have two PTCs (Evo88) too - but that aside I think it's the perfect size, with fantastic tools. Note, I carry a separate pliers tool which handles any Phillips requirements.

I would recommend getting yourself a 14 or 16 depending on whether you want corkscrew or Phillips.

[Faddy Daddy]

Oh ok, i get it...  Yes the E14 is a great compact knife, the scales are a little chunkier than the standard Vic's but it's more ergonomic.
I have an S16 myself and like it a lot 

Yep, I started looking at the evolutions because of the tad smaller size and then reading about how people seem to really like the 84mm's as well. Seems owning at least one would make for a nice alternative and add to a very small but growing collection.

Also, to see if I am following this correctly, it seems Vic has pretty much stopped manufacturing the "84mm" styles and the effort is now going to the "evolution" series which is a meld of their own ideas with old Wenger models?

Well, Vic didn't stopped manufacturing the classic 84mm's at all, there are still some models, but up to 2 layers max. and no scissors.

There's the Small Tinker, Tourist, Sportsman, Recruit, Bantam, Waiter, Walker, and the Alox Cadet.

My current edc's are either the Small Tinker or the Tourist. Heaven forbid they ever stop making those... 
What they stop making where the larger 84mm models, with scissors unfortunately.
The Small Climber and Salesman (small Super Tinker) where great models, and also my ultimate dream sak's. I hope they'll make tem again someday... 

The Evolutions are basically Wengers with better springs, Vic can opener, Awl and Vic Philips/Corkscrew, and Vic style toothpick and tweezers. The rest is all Wenger design.
Personally I think Vic kept way too much Wenger models, but they are good models nevertheless

I really want to thank you MacGyver, El Corkscrew and 50ft-trad as well. 
It's really starting to come together for me now and I get a kick out of learning about the various models and variations. As El Corkscrew first pointed out and MacGyver reinforced, it's all about the scissors I suppose you could say.

I do like the Tourist and could see carrying one, however I really do want scissors for my dream SAK so I suppose I'm better off with the Evo's or the larger 91mm. (as far as buying new goes anyway).

Yep, I already have a deluxe tinker, (given to me by my grandpa so many years ago), and have ordered an explorer, a mountaineer and a huntsman which in my view are all out takes of the climber, right? I mean the huntsman is a climber with a saw, the mountaineer is a climber with a file, and the explorer is a climber with the magnifier/Phillips combo, right? (See, an old geezer like me can learn a little  )

It's funny, for many years I carried a LM micra, got very dependent on scissors and then had it confiscated by TSA. After missing it for several years I finally started doing some research online, thus finding this forum. I did get another micra and was focusing on the LM's until I came across a rebar and realized it's just way too big for what I want and I RARELY use pliers. Lo and Behold, in the back of my drawer sat Grandpa's old deluxe tinker and now I'm hooked on SAK's!

One more question if you guys don't mind, just for curiosity. I'm assuming the Evo's scissors are all Vic, was there much of a difference between Wenger and Vic scissors on the 84 or 85mm tools? I only ask because one post I read somewhere mentioned that they thought the 84mm scissors were actually better than the 91mm versions but I don't know if they were talking about the old Vic's or Wengers. Also was it the Wengers that had serrated or self sharpening scissors?

[MacGyver]

Great story mate 
Glad your love and interest in sak's got back and it's growing.

So about the scissors Vic vs Wenger design:

All the scissors on the Evolution (Delemont) series are Wenger ones, meaning they are serrated on the blades and supposed to be self-sharpening because of that. Also the spring mechanism doesn't use a leaf spring like Vic but a leaver that uses the actual back spring of the tool.
Vic uses the leaf spring system, that is maybe a little less tough, but springs are easily raplaceble and cost next to nothing.
I have to say, I've yet to break or even damage a spring on a Vic scissors, one just need to use it carefully and right and they'll last ages.

Wenger scissors works best for paracord and similar materials because of the serrations,  but the Vic  works best for paper, finger nails and such.

[El Corkscrew]

Great story mate 
Glad your love and interest in sak's got back and it's growing.

So about the scissors Vic vs Wenger design:

All the scissors on the Evolution (Delemont) series are Wenger ones, meaning they are serrated on the blades and supposed to be self-sharpening because of that. Also the spring mechanism doesn't use a leaf spring like Vic but a leaver that uses the actual back spring of the tool.
Vic uses the leaf spring system, that is maybe a little less tough, but springs are easily raplaceble and cost next to nothing.
I have to say, I've yet to break or even damage a spring on a Vic scissors, one just need to use it carefully and right and they'll last ages.

Wenger scissors works best for paracord and similar materials because of the serrations,  but the Vic  works best for paper, finger nails and such.

+1 and agreed 

[MacGyver]

Aw maann.... bloody smartphone deleted half of my original post....  i wrote a lot more stuff...

Anyway...

the Wenger scissors have a bit less cutting area than similar sized Vic's that have a bit longer blades. The Vic's are also a bit more beefier and thicker as a tool, Wenger ones are a little thinner.

It's really a matter of preference here, some guys love the Wenger scissors, others prefer Vic's scissors. I personally prefer Vic's scissors for general purpose edc 

These days i usually edc an alox Classic (53mm) on my keys for the scissors and nail file and a Small Tinker or Tourist for my main Sak. It's enough for my needs
 I go with all my other 91mm's when i'm off, or go to the country, hiking, etc...

If you can find a store that has many models you should check them out, try them and then decide for yourself based on your taste and needs. Nothing better than trying stuff out and holding it in your hands for the first time. On line buy is handy and practical but only when you know and handled what you are buying, IMHO anyway... 

[AimlessWanderer]

Personally, I prefer the Victorinox scissors too, but the Wenger ones are still more than acceptable.

The only downside that I've found is in trimming nails. The serrations leave a very rough finish to the nail, but the Wengers also have a nail file, so that's easily fixed.

[jaya_man]

Yep, the show stopper for me are the self sharpening scissors... never did prefer them... gotta have scissors on my SAKs... but that locking bottle opener /flat sd sure is nice...


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[MacGyver]

Still on the scissor's topic, here's a good topic about Wenger scissor's and a comparison with Vic's with some good pics on several sizes

https://forum.multitool.org/index.php?topic=50635.0

and more Vic info:
http://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Scissors

A great pic comparing all Vic's sizes:

[Faddy Daddy]

Still on the scissor's topic, here's a good topic about Wenger scissor's and a comparison with Vic's with some good pics on several sizes

https://forum.multitool.org/index.php?topic=50635.0

and more Vic info:
http://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Scissors

A great pic comparing all Vic's sizes:

(Image removed from quote.)

Thanks for all the awesome info MacGyver! Can't wait to look through these threads as soon as I get a chance.
So I was wrong thinking the Evo series having Vic scissors, I should have known from the pics and as you pointed out with the leaf spring vs lever.
I will say I am very impressed with the scissors on my deluxe tinker - I didn't think they'd compare to well to the micras I'd been so used to but I was wrong. They work great and I enjoy having them handy. In fact I've been carrying the SAK this past week and leaving the micra behind. Luckily I have three kids I can pass down to ha ha.

Also I have to apologize for hijacking this thread. And then to learn that the evo series aren't even true 84mm's, jeez! I did start taking a fancy to that wood evo 14 as well, but read a review on Amazon that it was about as thick as the explorer, and I think someone also pointed out earlier that the evo scales are quite thick. So, maybe that wouldn't be downsizing at all. As you say MacGyver - nice to handle a few at a local store and yes, I have plenty around me.

[Faddy Daddy]

Still on the scissor's topic, here's a good topic about Wenger scissor's and a comparison with Vic's with some good pics on several sizes

https://forum.multitool.org/index.php?topic=50635.0

and more Vic info:
http://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Scissors

A great pic comparing all Vic's sizes:

(Image removed from quote.)

Love all this info MacGyver! Awesome 

From what I can tell, my deluxe tinker was made sometime after 1991 as it has the cup shaped spring end which rides in a groove, but still uses a screw on the pivot vs a rivet. I couldn't quite tell when Vic switched from screws to rivets - the article just seemed to mention Vic went from steel rivets to nickel-silver alloy sometime around 2007. Just love this info though, thanks so much!

[MacGyver]

Still on the scissor's topic, here's a good topic about Wenger scissor's and a comparison with Vic's with some good pics on several sizes

https://forum.multitool.org/index.php?topic=50635.0

and more Vic info:
http://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Scissors

A great pic comparing all Vic's sizes:

(Image removed from quote.)

Love all this info MacGyver! Awesome 

From what I can tell, my deluxe tinker was made sometime after 1991 as it has the cup shaped spring end which rides in a groove, but still uses a screw on the pivot vs a rivet. I couldn't quite tell when Vic switched from screws to rivets - the article just seemed to mention Vic went from steel rivets to nickel-silver alloy sometime around 2007. Just love this info though, thanks so much!

You're welcome mate, glad i could help in any way 

This forum has a world of info on tool evolution and details and lot's of great member's with lots of knowledge, much more than me, i'm sure some of the experts can shine even more light on some of those questions.

If you're interested in info on Vic's tool evolution, this topic and this site are great to learn about tool evolution by year:

https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,51872.0.html

http://victorinox.metodi.me/91mmtools.php#scissors

And some great pictures too 

[jaya_man]

Still on the scissor's topic, here's a good topic about Wenger scissor's and a comparison with Vic's with some good pics on several sizes

https://forum.multitool.org/index.php?topic=50635.0

and more Vic info:
http://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Scissors

A great pic comparing all Vic's sizes:

(Image removed from quote.)

Love all this info MacGyver! Awesome 

From what I can tell, my deluxe tinker was made sometime after 1991 as it has the cup shaped spring end which rides in a groove, but still uses a screw on the pivot vs a rivet. I couldn't quite tell when Vic switched from screws to rivets - the article just seemed to mention Vic went from steel rivets to nickel-silver alloy sometime around 2007. Just love this info though, thanks so much!

Some info here:

http://victorinox.metodi.me/91mmtools.php


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[El Corkscrew]

El Tourist

[MacGyver]

 

[strmliner]

Was reading the latest here about 84mm SAKs and had a few pictures to share.

• The first is a comparison of the 84mm vs 91mm Golfer (I really like both)
• The 2nd, 3rd, & 4th pictures are of an early 1970's Tinker

[MacGyver]

Was reading the latest here about 84mm SAKs and had a few pictures to share.

• The first is a comparison of the 84mm vs 91mm Golfer (I really like both)
• The 2nd, 3rd, & 4th pictures are of an early 1970's Tinker

       

[El Corkscrew]

Tourists...

[Fast Bill]

Sportsman.

[MacGyver]

Small Tinker as always... 

[Fast Bill]

Small Tinker Too !
and Rambler for good measure

[strmliner]

Sportsman.

Always a favorite...

       

[this_is_nascar]

For those of you who EDC the Tourist, how do you handle the lack of scissors? 

Carry a Classic or similar?

Sent from my XT1635-01 using Tapatalk

[AimlessWanderer]

For those of you who EDC the Tourist, how do you handle the lack of scissors? 

Carry a Classic or similar?

Sent from my XT1635-01 using Tapatalk

The Tourist was my first Swiss knife. At the time, I owned a Swisstool CS Plus, and relied upon that for the scissors. It didn't work out, and every Swiss knife I have bought since then has had scissors or been mod fodder.

I still own that Tourist, but it rarely gets carried. Why should I, when there are so many models that have scissors on board? I don't see the point of having to carry a second knife to make up for the shortsightedness in pocketing the first one which has an incomplete tool set. That makes no sense. Occasionally I will pair it with a pliers tool with scissors, but even then, it still tends to lose out on duty time to knives that have them.

[Faddy Daddy]

For those of you who EDC the Tourist, how do you handle the lack of scissors? 

Carry a Classic or similar?

Sent from my XT1635-01 using Tapatalk

The Tourist was my first Swiss knife. At the time, I owned a Swisstool CS Plus, and relied upon that for the scissors. It didn't work out, and every Swiss knife I have bought since then has had scissors or been mod fodder.

I still own that Tourist, but it rarely gets carried. Why should I, when there are so many models that have scissors on board? I don't see the point of having to carry a second knife to make up for the shortsightedness in pocketing the first one which has an incomplete tool set. That makes no sense. Occasionally I will pair it with a pliers tool with scissors, but even then, it still tends to lose out on duty time to knives that have them.

Well said 50ft-trad. I am in complete agreement on the necessity of scissors.

[MacGyver]

For those of you who EDC the Tourist, how do you handle the lack of scissors? 

Carry a Classic or similar?

Sent from my XT1635-01 using Tapatalk

I carry the small tinker/tourist 90% of the time these days, and i've always carried a alox classic sd on my keys. I carry the classic not only for the scissors but also for the nail file, as i like to keep it separate from my main sak use. Since i'm not really a very die hard fan of the scissors or think they are so irreplaceable that a good blade can't do at least 90% of it's job, the size of the classic scissors is enough for nearly all my regular edc tasks.

I do occasionally carry 91mm's, with scissors, but not that often these days. I've decided the 91's are just too big and bulky for most of my edc needs and pocket size carry. Why should i carry a Spartan or Tinker if i have the exact same sak in a shorter, more pocket friendly package that suits most of my needs?
84mm is my perfect sak size, i'll endure the lack of scissors in the current models with the help of my classic.

If Vic ever brings back the 84mm scissors models i'll be the first in line to buy them (all...  )