Atwood Prybaby vs the Navy 2001 Emergency prytool

[Mr. Whippy]

So today was the day.  First up are a series of shots comparing the Navy tool with an Atwood Roid Rench and a standard Atwood G5 Prybaby.

The first thing to notice is, the Navy tool is much smaller in all dimensions:





The wrenches and prytip have crisp, distinct outlines.  The machining appears to be top rate:

Navy on left, Atwood on right:



Atwood on top of Navy:


Navy on top of Atwood:


So today, I went out to test it (the Navy) head to head with Atwoods.  The first thing I found out is, the Navy is all metric:

You can see it simply doesn't work for a standard nut.

As it turns out, the openings have very tight tolerances.  Very tight:



These nuts are on a Honda mini dirt bike. When I moved on to Home Depot brand metric nuts, they wouldn't fit.  While the Honda nuts are highest quality, the Home Depot ones have irregular and slightly thicker walls.  Crappy metrics not allowed.

The thing is, the tool is so short, with edges that aren't eased, so it's quite painful to reef down on the wrenches.  I couldn't really loosen truly tight nuts, but with high quality metric nuts/bolts, the tool fits very snugly and is not at risk of damaging the nut.

Then I turned to the prytip/standard driver.  This was a bit of a disappointment.  Turning woodscrews damaged the tips on the very first try:




On the same screws, the Atwood was undaunted:



I suspect the damage is due to the sharpening done to the Navy tool. It makes the tip too weak for torquing screws, IMO.

In summary, the Navy tool has tight tolerance metric wrenches, but due to the sharpness of the edges of the tool, the shortness and the thinness of it, it is extremely difficult to generate a lot of torque on the tool.  However, it would hold a metric nut just fine.

The prytip is not a good screwdriver.  It would be a very good wire stripper however, due to the sharpness of the V grind.

I almost forgot:
1.  The prying ability is very limited--even moreso than the Atwood.
2.  The bottle opener works very well.

This tool has potential, and for the price, it'd be a reasonable Christmas stocking stuffer.  Definitely not an Atwood, it's still a pretty solid little tool for $10.

[jekostas]

Very interesting.  Mirrors my experiences with the Navy 1001.

Tight tolerances, light duty only due to the size.

[Grant Lamontagne]

Still,  one could look at it as ten dollars for a screwdriver that doesn't work, a wrench that only works on some nuts but even so gives you no leverage, a bottle opener and a pry bar with as little leverage as the barely functional wrench.

It just goes to show that pretty precision machining isn't all it's cracked up to be.  The tool is still interesting, and now the good news is we get to see if there's any kind of warranty on it, and if so, how good their customer service is!   

Def

[Mercury]

Great show Nate, thanks for the work there.  I like atwood tools and the only thing I don't like is the fact that they are so small, it seems hard to actually use them.   This showed me it could be worse!

[Mr. Whippy]

I had meant to say (but forgot to):

If you're looking at one piece tools that small, I would recommend the TT Keeper or Chopper.  The screwdriver tips are seriously high quality and are only slightly more expensive than the Navy tool.

[kirk13]

That was very interesting!It seems it really boils down to paying your money and taking your choice.Thanks for doing the test

[symphonyincminor]

The damage would indicate that the Navy knock-off isn't heat-treated.

At the price point, it wouldn't surprise me.

Anybody, in any country, with a CAD program can reverse-engineer pretty much anything. This is a ***** product from someone who is incapable of creating their own designs.

Thanks for the tests!!

[Seamaster]

Thank you very much for sharing the results of your research. Well done.

Like I said in "the other" thread that slightly derailed into a discussion on business ethics: Compromised design leads to compromised production leads to compromised performance.

The only problem with the real Prybaby is that it is so difficult to obtain. If only e.g. Chris Reeve, Spyderco or Leatherman produced them under licensing from Peter.

[AHB]

Thanks for write-up Nate. Great comparison pics too..

[AimlessWanderer]

Thanks for the insight. It's a pity the driver function failed so quickly. 
Still seems like a cheap "better than nothing" tool though for those with limited means or who aren't sure if a one piece tool is for them

[jzmtl]

The damage would indicate that the Navy knock-off isn't heat-treated.

At the price point, it wouldn't surprise me.

Looks like it's chipped, so it's treated too hard/ground too thin for the purpose. If it wasn't heat treated something would've show at wrench use stage.

The only problem with the real Prybaby is that it is so difficult to obtain. If only e.g. Chris Reeve, Spyderco or Leatherman produced them under licensing from Peter.

I think price qualify as another.

[Mr. Whippy]

The damage would indicate that the Navy knock-off isn't heat-treated.

At the price point, it wouldn't surprise me.

Looks like it's chipped, so it's treated too hard/ground too thin for the purpose. If it wasn't heat treated something would've show at wrench use stage.

The only problem with the real Prybaby is that it is so difficult to obtain. If only e.g. Chris Reeve, Spyderco or Leatherman produced them under licensing from Peter.

I think price qualify as another.

It doesn't show well in the pictures, but it's almost like it crushed/smeared the edge of the V (where it's been chisel ground)

[jekostas]

Well, Navy is a knife maker first and foremost so I have a feeling that they heat-treated the 2001 just like a knife - ie. way too hard.  I've had zero problems with the 1001, and the edge holding on the blade has been pretty good thus far.

[Mr. Whippy]

So, after the tool was damaged, I contacted the seller:

Hi,

I received my Emergency rescue survival multitool. However, the first time I tried using the screwdriver tip, the tool showed significant damage to the screwdriver:
http://i190.photobucket.com/albums/z231/bluebadger88/misc/Chinese%20Atwood/Picture021.jpg

This picture shows the damage.

My question is, what sort of warranty replacement policy do you have?

Thank you

Here's their reply:

hi,
sorry in u case first,
can u send me full pic,
i will report to supplier & claim u tools,
plesae let me know u address,
i will ship the new one to u,
portable

And, today the replacement arrived!  I don't know if it's any tougher, but they did send a replacement. 

[jekostas]

And, today the replacement arrived!  I don't know if it's any tougher, but they did send a replacement. 

Huh.  Two weeks to get a new tool in hand and you didn't even send it in.  I can't even get the Canadian Leatherman service centre to *look* at something in two weeks.

[Grant Lamontagne]

And, today the replacement arrived!  I don't know if it's any tougher, but they did send a replacement. 

Huh.  Two weeks to get a new tool in hand and you didn't even send it in.  I can't even get the Canadian Leatherman service centre to *look* at something in two weeks.

Tell them you are an MTO member. I don't thunk they like me very much after some issues with a Juice model but they were a lot more helpful when they found out who I was.

Def

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk

[Mercury]

And, today the replacement arrived!  I don't know if it's any tougher, but they did send a replacement. 

Huh.  Two weeks to get a new tool in hand and you didn't even send it in.  I can't even get the Canadian Leatherman service centre to *look* at something in two weeks.

Tell them you are an MTO member. I don't thunk they like me very much after some issues with a Juice model but they were a lot more helpful when they found out who I was.

Def

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk

Ahhh, honest leverage. 

[Grant Lamontagne]

I had a bad experience with them once- I'd sent in a Juice XE6 with a problem, although for the life of me I can't remember what the problem was.  They sent me back another, more used one.

I found the thread- it had a bent screwdriver:
http://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,708.0.html

Anyways, I'd bought a brand new one with a problem, and they replaced it with a used one.  I contacted them, and there were some further problems after that I never documented because of the level of embarrassment it would cause them.  It wasn't until I told them who I was, how unamused I was at their incompetence and how I was cataloging the entire situation online that they finally decided to make things right.

As I said, they probably don't care for me, but there's always a chance that they may give you the benefit of the doubt if you are one of us.

Def

[Mercury]

That is outrageous, the idea of trying to pass off a used LM with issues to the owner of a new LM with issues.  I have only gotten 1 refurb leatherman from LM USA, and it was a good one.  Everything else has been new.  I have never let them know I am a member here, but I did tell an Ebay seller once and he changed his crappy tune instantly.  I mean, he went from cursing at me over email to offering me free stuff and apologizing repeatedly. 

I can't even remember what my issue was, but it wasn't a huge deal until he went off on me.  Called me all sorts of names and threatened to notify ebay of my "behavior", until I told him about MT.o.  All of a sudden he said I was right and he never should have acted that way!

[Grant Lamontagne]

There was more to the story, and I don't like using the forum that way.  I don't suggest members use membership that way, but in some cases it works in our favor.

Of course if I ever find anyone is using membership here to purposely defraud someone I'll be sure to expose them...   

Def

[Mercury]

Grant,

I would never use my membership here for any sort of gain, and I've only mentioned it the one time.  I was being seriously wronged and treated terribly, and I felt the need to warn the gentleman that I would publicize the farce should he fail to at least treat me fairly. 

I don't want to paint this place in a negative color whatsoever.  I appreciate all the respect and generosity offered here and if I overstepped my bounds I sincerely apologize.  Please understand that I meant no disrespect by my actions and surely had the purest of intentions when I told this guy about the forum.

[Grant Lamontagne]

I never expected or insinuated that you may have abused it! 

I was only suggesting it in case anyone thought they may be able to get away with things by using our name.

Def

[Mercury]

I never expected or insinuated that you may have abused it! 

I was only suggesting it in case anyone thought they may be able to get away with things by using our name.

Def

Ahh, that's a relief.  I feel better, thanks!   

I fully agree with you though, using the forum name to get away with anything is downright wrong.  In rare cases such as the ones described, it may help but I can see how it can turn south. 

[Grant Lamontagne]

Well the replacement Navy tool has arrived at my place now, so I'll be adding it to my EDC rotation to see what I think of it.  With as little experience with one piece tools as I have, it might be interesting to see how my results compare to Mr Whippy's.

Def

[Mercury]

I don't think I could get on with the Navy tool, I just don't care much for smaller keychain tools, even the atwood line.  I had to get the full pocket widgy bar to replace my micro because the micro was too small for me to really do much with.  It will be interesting to see another perspective.

[chris777]

I kind of got less than satisfactory replacements from LM, However I do admit they were "upgrades" to discontinued models, so I let it slide. 

But my wave seems to have a habit of gunking up on the knife blades. Not to mention all the scuffs and scratches on the blades, and the PE being resharpened enough to loose its point.

and my blast has dinged drivers, the blade is slightly bent , & after oiling it trying to work the kinks out the plier head actually wore a valley in the handle instead of working itself out. (I thought the grinding was inside the pivot, as I had no idea that it could do something like it did especially while dripping with oil)

I will say that If I had turned in New tools, and got the ones, I did I would be complaining, But since they did give me a decent if dissapointing return, I let it slide. 

I will also say this, overall LM quality and build are no where near what it used to be with LM, as I can see from these newer models, especially compared to my orifinal wave, and my recently aquired pst, and pulse. but I digress.

As for atwoods, I would love to have one, But I am disabled.  I couldnt think of getting one before I got my disability income, abd by the time I did get it, Peter had started the auctions/raffle or whatever it is, and combined with for the most part 60bucks plus minimum, on something like a keyton, I just cant justify the price right now, Maybe someone will sell me a dinged up user sometime, but the collectors have ruined it , or rather the speculators.

So I may just try one of these knock offs, or a pirrana.

[Mr. Whippy]

Of the two, the Piranha is a MUCH nicer tool.  Very handy.  Not really a keychain tool, more like something to slip in your pocket.

[chris777]

How thick is it? could I stuff it in my wallet?  It realize its thicker than a card tool, but is it too thick or too long to stuff in my wallet?

[Mr. Whippy]

How thick is it? could I stuff it in my wallet?  It realize its thicker than a card tool, but is it too thick or too long to stuff in my wallet?

It's minimally thicker than a SwissCard, but it's not nearly as wide.  It would fit well in a wallet, especially if it can stick out a little out the top