Any love for Wenger?

[North Man]

"I to had information that Wenger did use plastics very early but i can not confirm, and about the Eastman. This is just some information that i found researching, i do not know the full info since is just a small remark in Google books. If Eastman is the supplier or other at this time of history, not sure."

North Man - more from the SAK Owner's Manual - "A new type of celluloid, cellulose acetate, was introduced by Camille and Henri Dreyfus of Basel, Switzerland in 1904, and proved be more stable than cellulose nitrate. In 1929 the Tennessee Eastman Corporation added propionate and called it Tenite. In 1938 they made cellulose acetate with butyrate to make Tenite II. In 1952 the plastic called Cellite made from surplus stocks of WWII plastic aircraft windows was renamed Cellidor; chemically this was also cellulose acetate butyrate (CAB).  Cellidor has proved to both stable and very tough (see Test results)."

thanks, this made sence. I will note these interesting informations. I will have in mind the Eastman or Tennessee Eastman Corporation, so maybe the 1956 date is to have in mind.

[jcfiguet]

Hello everybody!

I am French, collector of Swiss knives and administrator of ' www.couteaux-du-soldat-suisse.ch '. I invite you to show it (french version), you will find lot of informations about Soldier knives between 1890 to 2012 (Wenger, Victorinox and other marks).

By reading your different posts, I see that some body have catalogs, newspapers or  about Wenger knives. Could you please scan these documents, especially those prior to 1991? You can contact me by 'PM' to have my e-mail address. Thanks !

Jean-Claude

[jcfiguet]

This from the SAK Owner's Manual:  "In a brochure from the 1960s Wenger says that theirs was the first company to make a plastic handle on a folding knife - a claim also made by the American cutlery company PAL."   
The book also has a brief history of plastics - including the odd fact that in the days of nitro-cellulose knife handles (early 1900s) the Camillus cutlery factory in New York had a hinged roof so the roof could blow off and not destroy the building in the event of an explosion of this very volatile plastic.  Both Wenger and Victorinox switched from the somewhat safer cellulose acetate of the 1930s to cellulose acetate butyrate - later called Cellidor.

thank you, yes this is interesting.
Victorinox history i got also mention 1930s. I did do some research aswell that the formula got changed over the years. The last years information from Victorinox mention organic cellulose acetat,
from the manual: Cellidor is a trade name for organic cellulose ester, which is a modified natural product.
 Also from the manual (evolution on the 91mm) -1937 Handles made from cellidor replace fiber
handles.
I to had information that Wenger did use plastics very early but i can not confirm, and about the Eastman. This is just some information that i found researching, i do not know the full info since is just a small remark in Google books. If Eastman is the supplier or other at this time of history, not sure.

Hello,

I confirm, Wenger did use plastics early (since 1951 on soldiers knives) with a red thermo-plastic named "Grilon".
Grilon is always used by Victorinox and Wender, Now this plastic is made (for Victorinox and Wenger) by the society "EMS" (ESSE international group).
You can read more informations here : http://www.esse-international.fr/doc/grilon.pdf

[ColoSwiss]

Hello everybody!

I am French, collector of Swiss knives and administrator of ' www.couteaux-du-soldat-suisse.ch '. I invite you to show it (french version), you will find lot of informations about Soldier knives between 1890 to 2012 (Wenger, Victorinox and other marks).

By reading your different posts, I see that some body have catalogs, newspapers or  about Wenger knives. Could you please scan these documents, especially those prior to 1991? You can contact me by 'PM' to have my e-mail address. Thanks !

Jean-Claude

Hello Jean-Claude,

Welcome to Multitool.

Check out SAKwiki. It has a lot of scanned catalogs for both Victorinox and Wenger, as well as links to other useful sites such as SOSAK. A lot of other good info there also.

http://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php

[Nhoj]

Just remember to give credit to the source, SAKwiki

[ICanFixThat]

...
We really need to find out whats been going on between 1975-1979.
...

Yes, hopefully we'll find this information soon.

[papercut]

I had had a burning desire to pick up the Ranger 78 for the past few months.  I really need to pull the trigger as it may become extinct soon.  The Amazon $44 price tag is psychologically holding me back...

Grr

[North Man]

Another top score for Wenger in Villmarksliv, only one that works perfekt after water test, dipped under water. Not so large test like on the multitools but well test anyhow. The people there know their stuff

 I got a Clava red and black, it is the same type as the tested one. A licensed product made in China.

Another thing, the modern braided fishing lines are mean, the older mono lines could very easy be cut with scissors or the nail clipper. Not sure i have mentioned this before. Anyhow here the serrated scissors works best. This is a 65mm..

[ICanFixThat]

Excerpt from 1972 Information Sheet included with knives at the time.

[ColoSwiss]

Looks interesting. Awaiting its posting on the wiki. 

[ICanFixThat]

Looks interesting. Awaiting its posting on the wiki. 

That's all there is; the other side of this is a reminder to fill out the warranty information "neatly", the form itself, and notes to oil and clean your knife.  Not too exciting, I thought I had posted this earlier, but it must have got bumped off the scanner for something more exciting at the time.  Since there was talk of the scales composition earlier I thought I'd post this, the choice of the knife they display says something I think.

Now I do have something that looks interesting from that original company... Ever hear of the Presidential Series?

[ColoSwiss]

Thought that was going to detain all 26 models and versions. 

There's a series of Classics with presidential signatures on them - Johnson, Reagan, Bush, Clinton.

The Wenger two-blade Crusader/Executive without a keyring was sold as the President. There was also a money clip version.

If its something else I don't have any info.

[ICanFixThat]

Thought that was going to detain all 26 models and versions. 

Ya I wish... it will happen one day... someone out there has the info...

There's a series of Classics with presidential signatures on them - Johnson, Reagan, Bush, Clinton.

The Wenger two-blade Crusader/Executive without a keyring was sold as the President. There was also a money clip version.

If its something else I don't have any info.

Something else... but just so you don't get too excited it's more of a name-game than anything new so it might take me a while to find time for it.   Maybe after I watch the movie Lincoln I'll be inspired, he's a top dog in the this series as well.

[North Man]

Excerpt from 1972 Information Sheet included with knives at the time.

(Image removed from quote.)

Hi
I nice quality piece for the SakWiki, part i have seen before in the Oct Field and Stream 1972. Here mentioned PIC Precise imports Cor. And not Precise International, mentioned subsidiary of Esquire inc. Is this a detail worth any?

Some of my thoughts:

Alittle info here and there is helpful, also interesting is the adverts since they show at the time details, and also how a SAK is presented outwards.
If we have in mind the backpacking boom of the 70s and that Wenger entered atleast from my info, the US marked is 1967.

The Backpacker magazine is 1973 and up, and from alot of the articles we see much of the different knives, the development of the modern SAK.  Also that Wenger Precise adverts mentioning they are the originator of how the SAK look today(1976).

Like we know the adverts 1977-1979 show much of interesting series and knives + functions.
It fit my belief that to enter a marked better, one need to show new models and things that are special.


The time, 1975 and up is therefore very interesting, on the changes/functions and more. We know from research that Wenger is early. In the early 70s Wenger was not large in the US marked, maybe the 70s had a good effect here. And in 1988, newspapers mentioning 10% of Wenger marked is in the US.
We know from history that Wenger in many cases or philosophy have had to come up with new ideas and functions to survive. The possibility to a larger knife is there when a universal wrench in combo with the phillips. Now a new series of knives can be made, when did these two new functions come?
Just that it is shown in 1977 means it must have been on the drawing board early. I hardly believe they are in adverts if not made yet, delay in production may happen but not is this case.
A manual part from 1975(if certain) show a universal wrench and phillips. I know from searching patents that not all are correct on the date of manufacture.

[basilio]

Excerpt from 1972 Information Sheet included with knives at the time.

Thanks!

[J Mackrel Jones]

"Just that it is shown in 1977 means it must have been on the drawing board early. I hardly believe they are in adverts if not made yet, delay in production may happen but not is this case."
 
North Man, Can you show us a photo of the advert of 1977 showing the wrench and phillips?

[basilio]

Waiting for North Man, I can post this link
http://www.multi-tool.org/advertisements
Scroll down and under the "Wenger" section there is an old advertisement with the Pointer/Setter showing both the wrench and phillips.
The above image has this file name "Backpacker Dec. 1977".

[North Man]

Hi
I wonder if it was this,

[North Man]

here is the backpacker magazine

http://books.google.no/books?id=8OMDAAAAMBAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq=backpacker+dec+1977&hl=no&sa=X&ei=MlBcUZ_HK4Sk4ATNioCQCQ&ved=0CDsQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=wenger&f=false
I had more info, they shut down the news archive of scanned papers,

[North Man]

here is the one from 1975 from the SAKWIKI, i am not sure on the date, if 75? I believe it was ICanFixThats, very grateful for his work!

http://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-browse_image.php?imageId=2104
Anyhow i have a strong feeling from research, during the 2 years time i searched every scanned paper and article. Wenger is early, we may have to find new dates? Any help would be nice

[J Mackrel Jones]

The "Man's two best friends" ad, when clicked on Properties, does indeed show a tag date of Dec. 1977.  The photo shows the universal wrench and ski-wax scraper, and no line guide on the fish-scaler.  Also the transfer-bar scissors patented in 1975.  Not the locking drivers, introduced in 1982.

An email I got from Wenger in 2010 says that the line guide was added to the fish-scaler in 1960 (which can't be so), and (surely a typo) that the reamer/leather punch went from the old quarter-round type to rectangular in 1995.
Wenger had a bad factory fire in 1986, destroying many company. 
The 1970s are as North Man has said an important time in the development of Wenger, and this period remains just as mysterious as so much of the Wenger story -- the early Boechat years (3-face tang stamp?), their absence in America during the World Wars...
Hopefully "one of us" with Wenger SAKs in boxes with dated papers can determine a more accurate timeline of the introduction of the Wenger tools.  These old ads are good data.

[North Man]

Hi 

Yes, these are my views aswell.

I know Wenger do their best always to give best informations. It is very difficult to find sometimes..
Very grateful for them.

It is very strange that the 70s should have so much difficulties for us?

[North Man]

I would recommend SAKWIKI. Just look at this 1960s early Sportsman series

http://www.sakwiki.com/show_image.php?id=2229

SAKs are Sportsmen knives, and in the 1977-1979 embossed icons to more easy identify with your interest are shown.

[ICanFixThat]

From what I see there seems to be a big change, at least in their marketing matereals, between the 1972 and 1975 knive-insert examples.  I'm pretty sure also that the 1975 Insert matches exactly the 1978 insert which would indicate to me that between 72 and 75 are probbaly the tool changes we are looking for in the 70s.

It is curious though that in 72 they say 26 models to choose from, and that same number of models it reported until much later.  That could be one of these 'ops' things in their printed materials or the importer decided that was the maximum number they wanted to handle.

[North Man]

Yes, interesting

[jcfiguet]

Hello,

On SAKWiki, we can find this catalog : http://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-browse_gallery.php?galleryId=98 indicated as "1963 Dealer's Circular from Distributor".

I think the fist page could be from a 1963 catalog, but the second page is probably from a 1972 or 1975 catalog : between the 2 pages we can see 2 generations of can openers...

[North Man]

Hi

Welcome to forum

Here is an interesting Max Oertli patent application, filed 1962 http://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/originalDocument?CC=CH&NR=377213A&KC=A&FT=D&ND=3&date=19640430&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP

[North Man]

Another company in the late 70s is REI (Recreational Equipment Inc) Knives by Precise/Wenger
No wrench here so far.

Adverts in Popular Science Oct 77
                Field and Stream Sep 78
                Field and Stream Nov 79 (Backpacker II with lockblade)

I wonder if there are some more early info to be found on them? Adverts, catalogues or other.

[North Man]

I did find long time ago the Windjammer, wrench and phillips in the Backpacker Oct-Nov 1979

And the REI company in late 70 had REI CO-OP designation , in the Backpacker Oct-Nov 79 it is a company CO-OP Wilderness Supply, again if there could be some infor to be found from them?

Most early on the embossed icons i found was 1977 like i have shown in this topic. Along with everything else 1975 is a key year.

[J Mackrel Jones]

Here is an interesting Max Oertli patent application, filed 1962 http://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/originalDocument?CC=CH&NR=377213A&KC=A&FT=D&ND=3&date=19640430&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP

The story of Kaspar and Max Oertli (not to mention daughter Lisette and the dashing General Saucy), the invention and re-invention of Wenger's "dog-leg" can-opener, the company exchanging French for German after World War II --these are covered in Young's book about the Swiss Army Knife.
Here is a photo of Eichenberger's 1963 opener and Oertli's 1964: