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Which 9mm pistol to get?

us Offline captain spaulding

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #30 on: January 29, 2012, 10:37:45 AM

Unless you're a hard core tactical operator, you're not going to be thinking about giving away your position, clearing rooms, and accurate follow up shots. 

Some are more talented than others.  ;)

shot spread is your friend :)

I would completely disagree. If you are using shotgun ammo in the low numbers or buckshot that would be the last thing you would want. In a home defense situation you want a accurate shot so the projectile looses all or most its energy in the target. When some of that shot spread misses your target all that buckshot is going through multiple walls without issue.

grab the phone, call 911, wedge the phone between your shoulder and ear, grab your defense gun

911 is honestly the last thing on my mind in that situation. If 911 was called I would not wedge a phone in my ear and shoulder while I was attempting to protect myself and family.


If you're shooting from a traditional stance (gunstock at the shoulder) for most people it's going to interfere with staying on the phone (which 911 will want you to do until the cops show up.)

911 will also tell you to not shoot a intruder.  :facepalm: 

Anything is better than nothing though :D

I COMPLETELY AGREE!!!!!!!!     :D :D :D

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us Offline 665ae

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #31 on: January 29, 2012, 10:47:46 AM
I stand by my points :D  as I'm sure you stand by yours.  In the interest of everyone else, I will bow out.

Your kung fu's the best.
If you took all the intestines out of your body and stretched them end to end... you would die.


us Offline captain spaulding

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #32 on: January 29, 2012, 10:56:12 AM
I stand by my points :D  as I'm sure you stand by yours.  In the interest of everyone else, I will bow out.

Your kung fu's the best.


Yea this is going no were and agree that everyone has there own methods and what work for some might not work for others.  :salute:





  :D  :P
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ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #33 on: January 29, 2012, 04:50:52 PM
As I see it, the spread is a good thing as well.  While it may not be a killing or stopping shot, anyone who is breaking into your house likely does not have the training or experience necessary to realize that the sudden holes that have appeared in his person are not lethal.  Even if they only take a few pellets they will probably try to get away, not realizing that the hits were not lethal. 

Frankly I am not convinced that guns are the best thing for home defense to begin with.  While there are certain benefits, there are also huge drawbacks, the worst of which is hitting a family member or neighbor, and even in the most righteous and justified of situations, killing another person can have serious emotional ramifications on the shooter. 

Personally I think if home defense is your goal then dogs are your best bet.  Having worked security in one form or another for most of my adult life, and having spent several years working in jails I can say honestly that 99% of people who do home invasions or b&e's are the type of people looking for a quick and easy score.  A dog, any dog can make for serious complications, largely because a dog's bark will cause them to lose the advantages of surprise and stealth.  A dog the size of my Daisy (120 pounds) can put up an amazing amount of fight and can attack an intruder before they can defend themselves and knows the household layout better than an intruder, giving the dog the tactical advantage.  Smaller dogs like Mikey's are still potentially dangerous as they can leave a very easily identifiable bite pattern on an intruder making it easier to identify them later.  Plus, when a 5 pound dog sinks their teeth into someone, the victim's reaction is to try to disengage them, which often results in a few small puncture wound becoming a large, bloody tear in the flesh.

This isn't a suggestion that you shouldn't have a gun for home defense, it's a suggestion that if you are that concerned about protecting your home and family, your gun shouldn't be your only line of defense.  You and your gun are reactive while a dog (especially multiple dogs) is proactive.

Def
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Offline Styerman

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #34 on: January 29, 2012, 05:06:08 PM
Noisy packs of large doggies are good . Re shot size : lots of BS has been talked about shotties , perps do not crap themselves at the sound of one being racked , at in house ranges the spread is not what you think - if you don't believe me , go to the range and do some patterning at distances between 3 and 20 feet . I'm partial to #4 , plenty of authority , overpenetration not too bad . 00 Buck/SSG's are great for longer ranges ( 20-40 yds. ) but pretty dangerous in an average house . Again , get a piece of drywall and blast it a few times , put bleach jugs filled with water behind it - will give you a fair idea of overpenetration .

Try and take a practical shottie course , and learn how to manouver with one in confined spaces . Get some blue rounds ( inert practice ) , so you can hone you action working skills .

Chris


us Offline Chain Gang

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #35 on: January 29, 2012, 05:14:56 PM
The average response time of a 911 call is 23 minutes, the response time of a .357 is 1400 feet per second.


ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #36 on: January 29, 2012, 05:37:25 PM
The average response time of a 911 call is 23 minutes, the response time of a .357 is 1400 feet per second.

Yes, and a fraction of a second after you squeeze off a round from a .357 your family and neighbors become potentially endangered.  Hand cannons like a .357 are "outdoor guns" in my opinion, and I don't recommend them in an enclosed environment- and that's a suggestion for people capable of and trained to handle a big weapon.  If you want a solid round gun I would suggest the average person stick with a .22.  Low recoil means it's easier to fire off multiple accurate shots, and while it may not be as macho, a .22 at relatively close range (under 20 feet) is still lethal.

Def
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ye Offline Sam Quint

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #37 on: January 29, 2012, 05:40:35 PM
A web site I infrequently visit, dedicated to weapons testing:

http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot3.htm


ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #38 on: January 29, 2012, 05:48:25 PM
Interesting link Sam.  Thanks for posting it!

Def
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us Offline Chain Gang

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #39 on: January 29, 2012, 05:54:43 PM
I think a big bore handgun using this ammo would work and you would not have to worry about over penetration.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glaser_Safety_Slug


Offline Styerman

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #40 on: January 29, 2012, 05:56:57 PM
One point against shotties , bear in mind that most civilian shoot en ups happen at 3-7 ' , unless you are Arnie , a shottie is tuff to control one handed . A one handed weapon is somtimes handy , so you can grab/push a loved one out of the way , or fend an unarmed BG off to get at the more serious threat (ie:the one with the gun )  .

Forget about reloads , they happen in LE , but are more of an Admin thing in Civie. shootings . ( reload after you've popped a couple , in case there are other bag guys around ) . With red/blue rounds and practice a speedloader/spoeed strip will work .

Civilians and LE alike have tumbled mag issues ( inadvertent contact with the mag release ) . That doesn't happen with revolvers . This is why quite a few Euro Military semis used to have mag release catches at the bottom of the mag . Then along came the IDPA/IPSC craze , and now they have all but dissapeared . IMVHO , there was a lot of good points to them .

I guess my advice would still be a 4" K frame , for mixed bag ( range/house use ) , for street use a 2" J frame . Since the semi craze , lots of good old skool revolvers are floating around at good prices . Old Model 10's can be had for cheap , ditto S&W K38's .

Chris


ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #41 on: January 29, 2012, 07:09:49 PM
I think a big bore handgun using this ammo would work and you would not have to worry about over penetration.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glaser_Safety_Slug

Good point, as long as you make certain to keep the gun loaded with those rounds, or keep them close to the gun.  The last thing you'd want is to have to feel around in an adrenalin dump after being woken up and try to find the "right" rounds before the bad guys find their way upstairs.

Def
Leave the dents as they are- let your belongings show their scars as proudly as you do yours.


us Offline Chain Gang

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #42 on: January 29, 2012, 07:54:13 PM
My home defense tip of the day.Go to Walmart and buy the package of 4 LED night lights.They have a light sensor,off in the day on on at night.They are not real bright so they won't affect your night vision.I put them in every room except my bedroom.These give off enough light so you can acquire your target without giving your position away.High  intensity lights attached to weapons look sexy but gives the bad guys a perfect target to shoot at.


Offline Styerman

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #43 on: January 29, 2012, 08:17:13 PM
Weapons lights have their place , but you sure as heck need proper training . Do not use one for general searching , or you will for sure have a fatal accident .

Chris


ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #44 on: January 29, 2012, 10:18:15 PM
Weapons lights have their place , but you sure as heck need proper training . Do not use one for general searching , or you will for sure have a fatal accident .

Chris

I suppose it would be just as effective as carrying around a neon sign that says HERE I AM!   :ahhh

Def
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Offline Styerman

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #45 on: January 29, 2012, 11:24:05 PM
Normally , they aren't just turned on and left on . It's usually a short burst , followed by a short burst if you follow me .

Other uses are for takedowns , kinda like the takedown lites on a cruiser . You can't see jack when they are aimed at you . 

They are are handy so you can identify a humanoid shape you are about to blow away .

Also handy as hell for poaching , as any downeaster should know !

I have taken practical rifle and shottie classes , they do have uses , but these are very limited . Personally , I wouldn't have one on a home defence piece .

Chris


us Offline jerseydevil

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #46 on: January 30, 2012, 03:12:40 AM
I've been following this thread with some interest. I have to agree with everyone who has mentioned a revolver. I have a S&W Model 19 Combat Magnum in .357 with a 4 inch barrel. It's a great handgun, built on a K-frame so it's fairly light and handy. The one disadvantage to the lighter frame is that it's not something that you'd want to shoot full power .357 loads out of exclusively. Being able to use .38 Specials is a big plus. Someone mentioned the Model 10 earlier, and I agree, you can find them rather inexpensively. The Model 10 is a true classic, simply an update of the original M&P. A revolver and cartridge combination in its basic form doesn't stay in production for over 110 years if it isn't effective!
There's no such thing as "Too pretty to carry".  There's only "Too pretty NOT to carry"...... >:D


us Offline captain spaulding

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #47 on: January 30, 2012, 03:36:12 AM
I've been following this thread with some interest. I have to agree with everyone who has mentioned a revolver. I have a S&W Model 19 Combat Magnum in .357 with a 4 inch barrel. It's a great handgun, built on a K-frame so it's fairly light and handy. The one disadvantage to the lighter frame is that it's not something that you'd want to shoot full power .357 loads out of exclusively. Being able to use .38 Specials is a big plus. Someone mentioned the Model 10 earlier, and I agree, you can find them rather inexpensively. The Model 10 is a true classic, simply an update of the original M&P. A revolver and cartridge combination in its basic form doesn't stay in production for over 110 years if it isn't effective!


For a Devils fan your pretty smart.   :P  :D
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us Offline jerseydevil

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #48 on: January 30, 2012, 03:48:27 AM
I've been following this thread with some interest. I have to agree with everyone who has mentioned a revolver. I have a S&W Model 19 Combat Magnum in .357 with a 4 inch barrel. It's a great handgun, built on a K-frame so it's fairly light and handy. The one disadvantage to the lighter frame is that it's not something that you'd want to shoot full power .357 loads out of exclusively. Being able to use .38 Specials is a big plus. Someone mentioned the Model 10 earlier, and I agree, you can find them rather inexpensively. The Model 10 is a true classic, simply an update of the original M&P. A revolver and cartridge combination in its basic form doesn't stay in production for over 110 years if it isn't effective!

For a Devils fan your pretty smart.   :P  :D

 :D You'd be even more impressed if you knew my baseball team.........There are two revolvers I would LOVE to own. One is an early M&P, preferably with US military markings. The other is a Colt New Service Model 1909 in .45 Colt. The most powerful military sidearm EVER issued. :drool:
There's no such thing as "Too pretty to carry".  There's only "Too pretty NOT to carry"...... >:D


Offline Styerman

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #49 on: January 30, 2012, 03:11:51 PM
I had a 6" WWII vintage M&P , early production , prewar quality finish - sweetest DA I have ever felt . I also a a New Service in .45 long Colt . Wish I had not sold them . Smith's were always sweeter in the DA dept. but vintage Colts were pretty good too. My last Colt revolver was a 2.5" .38 Diamondback , sweet for a snubbie .

Chris


us Offline Mike

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #50 on: January 31, 2012, 11:07:35 PM
Who needs a gun?  :D

http://www.komonews.com/news/local/Federal-Way-resident-roughs-up-burglar-throws-him-off-a-balcony-138379689.html

Personally, I'm a revolver guy myself and I have a shotgun. But it doesn't matter as long as you are proficient and comfortable with what you use. Again, training and practice, training and practice, training and practice.

Mike
« Last Edit: January 31, 2012, 11:09:39 PM by Mike »
Common sense ..... so rare, it's virtually a super power.


ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #51 on: January 31, 2012, 11:34:17 PM
And if that doesn't work, there's always practice and training!  :D

Def
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us Offline Mike

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #52 on: February 01, 2012, 01:40:42 AM
And if that doesn't work, there's always practice and training!  :D

Def

 :D

Mike
Common sense ..... so rare, it's virtually a super power.


us Offline bushidomosquito

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #53 on: February 01, 2012, 03:59:38 AM
The Walther PPQ is next on my list. I simply cannot find anyone saying a bad word about it.

Sent from my Glock 23 using Doubletaptalk


us Offline New_World

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #54 on: March 03, 2012, 08:10:53 AM
Mossburg is good but the Rem is a little better quality.Either one would work for me.As far as buying on line you have to go through a licensed dealer to do the transaction.A dealer usually charges $25 to do this.Some small time dealers will order your gun for you and usually charge 10% of the whosale price for their fee.

I've been looking at those rem 870 shotguns.
I think I'm going to get one soon. :cheers:
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us Offline Chain Gang

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #55 on: March 03, 2012, 08:21:46 AM
I sold my Glock 26(Baby Glock 9 mm)and bought a Model 22(40 SW).After I install a light lazer combo unit it will be my bedside companion.I just have more faith in the 40 over the 9mm.Now if I can only afford the ammo. :think:


no Offline Medic82

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #56 on: March 03, 2012, 10:33:21 PM
Have been following this tread with some interest and my 2 cents is that I really don’t have anything to contribute with since the hole scenario of planning for a home invasion or CCW is so farfetched for a Norwegian gun owner. But to completely derail this thread I just wonder why on earth you yanks like polymer guns so much, every polymer gun that I have tried, various Glocks, H&K P30, a Beretta that I don’t remember the name to, S&W M&P 9 and Ruger 22/45 I have hated. Sure they are light weight but that is the only thing that is to like about it in my opinion. The recoil absorption is crap and the trigger is crap even after you have done a trigger job on it. The only thing that I like about a Glock is this, and yes that is me :D


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ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #57 on: March 04, 2012, 12:12:45 AM
Looks like you were having a great time!  :D

Def
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no Offline Medic82

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #58 on: March 04, 2012, 12:18:15 AM
How wouldn’t with a full auto Glock? :P That was a 17 round magazine that disappeared in no time.
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ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: Which 9mm pistol to get?
Reply #59 on: March 04, 2012, 12:52:46 AM
I fired one like that once.  I think I giggled like a schoolgirl for about half an hour after that! 

Def
Leave the dents as they are- let your belongings show their scars as proudly as you do yours.


 

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