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The Wingman has been shot down!

ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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The Wingman has been shot down!
on: June 03, 2012, 01:17:11 PM
The Wingman I've had as part of my work gear for the past few months will be retired and replaced as soon as I get home.  The Wingman,  or should I say Rustman has developed far too much rust for continued use, and if it doesn't get replaced soon, there won't be a Wingman left to use.

This isn't another Rusty Leatherman thread, check the photos at the bottom.

It is noteworthy that I live in a very corrosive atmosphere (right on the ocean, with all the rain and temperature changes that implies) and that the Wingman is in my work vest, exposed constantly and put away wet, however the Zilla Junior was my work tool prior to the Wingman's extended sortie and the only significant rusting on it was the screwdriver ends. 

This Wingman will be cleaned, oiled and find it's way into the drawer and probably won't come back out any time soon. I'm very disappointed in it.

Def

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Leave the dents as they are- let your belongings show their scars as proudly as you do yours.


us Offline powernoodle

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #1 on: June 03, 2012, 01:32:42 PM
Thats some impressive rust.  I guess that Leatherman would say that putting the tool away while wet is not advisable, but stuff happens out in the real world.  Though I know that the Wingman has many fans, I have never much cared for it (due to the scissors, wire cutter, etc.), and this just adds to that conclusion.  I want to like it though, and am still trying.


scotland Offline Gareth

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #2 on: June 03, 2012, 02:10:31 PM
Obviously not the tool for that environment. :-\  Is it the file causing the rust or is it really just all over?
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us Offline sawman

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #3 on: June 03, 2012, 02:25:55 PM
Have you considered sending it into LM for warranty repair?
SAW


ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #4 on: June 03, 2012, 02:26:32 PM
The rust appears to be on all the pivot points, both at the plier end and the tool end as well as the file. The blade is seized shut at the moment.  While I can get the scissors out without an issue the spring has gotten a bit nasty.

As for the excuse that a tool needs to be better looked after, I agree to an extent, but how many of you have polished and oiled a hacksaw blade or hammer after each use? How many of you regularly spray down your monkey wrenches after each use?  My guess is not many.  I'd also like to point out that my Raker Ring Tool is just as exposed but shows no rust, and neither does my tape measure or it's eClipse clip that holds it in my pocket, or my Fisher Bullet. Heck, even the Photon Proton in my vest only has a little bit of rust around the keyring and it's been in my vest for years.

Def

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ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #5 on: June 03, 2012, 02:30:21 PM
Ugh. I just used the RRT to pry the blade open and it ain't pretty.

Def

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Leave the dents as they are- let your belongings show their scars as proudly as you do yours.


us Offline sawman

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #6 on: June 03, 2012, 02:35:41 PM
This makes me appreciate my Vic stuff even more...  :whistle:
SAW


gb Offline AimlessWanderer

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #7 on: June 03, 2012, 02:38:13 PM
That looks pretty grim to me mate. Has ANY other tool you've carried at work corroded that badly? What's tool of choice to replace it?


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scotland Offline Gareth

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #8 on: June 03, 2012, 02:55:30 PM
I'm wondering if there is a case of some dissimilar metal corrosion going on here?  If the grades of steel are different enough it could be possible I think.  Just a stab in the dark. :shrug:
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ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #9 on: June 03, 2012, 03:00:45 PM
Have you considered sending it into LM for warranty repair?

I probably wouldn't send it in for a variety of reasons like this could be considered abuse, I have other tools so no worries if this one doesn't see any more use and its too much of a hassle since this one is almost cheap enough to be replaced rather than send it in with delivery confirmation, tracking etc.

As for the other tools, the Zilla Jr is the only one I have subjected to vest carry, and it was with me for about a year in my work vest while the Wingman has been riding along for 2-3 months.  Usually tools are on my belt in a sheath and rotate but I found myself a few times without a tool and decided to remedy that by assigning one permanently to my vest.  Plus when I put on my coveralls it makes the tool on my belt difficult to access but my vest always goes on over top of the coveralls so that means anything in a vest pocket is always accessible.

As for what to replace it with, I haven't decided yet. Ideally I'd like something with a pocket clip so that narrows the choices considerably. I have a spare eClipse somewhere so I could modify a non clip tool into a clip tool if need be. Honestly, I'm giving serious thought to a Spirit or SwissTool, or even my Octane.

Def

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ca Offline Syph007

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #10 on: June 03, 2012, 03:22:30 PM
I live nowhere near the sea and my wave looked very similar after a week in my slightly damp garage.  That was what ended leathermans for me as the go to tool and my full size Swiss tool took over that role. 

Complain all you want about slippery drivers, but that polish is there for a reason, and its to provide no micro nicks for rust to even think about grabbing hold of.

I still like and use leathermans too, but I wish they'd use better steel. 
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us Offline JimShockz

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #11 on: June 03, 2012, 04:02:23 PM
The Wingman I've had as part of my work gear for the past few months will be retired and replaced as soon as I get home.  The Wingman,  or should I say Rustman has developed far too much rust for continued use, and if it doesn't get replaced soon, there won't be a Wingman left to use.

This isn't another Rusty Leatherman thread, check the photos at the bottom.

It is noteworthy that I live in a very corrosive atmosphere (right on the ocean, with all the rain and temperature changes that implies) and that the Wingman is in my work vest, exposed constantly and put away wet, however the Zilla Junior was my work tool prior to the Wingman's extended sortie and the only significant rusting on it was the screwdriver ends. 

This Wingman will be cleaned, oiled and find it's way into the drawer and probably won't come back out any time soon. I'm very disappointed in it.

Def

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ca Offline Chako

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #12 on: June 03, 2012, 04:42:24 PM
that is not a Wingman...it is a Rustman!

Sorry to hear and see this. If the Tini SOGs were not so hard to find, I would suggest that, as I do think the finish would last in such a harsh environment.

Just be glad you're not made out of stainless Def.  :D
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ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #13 on: June 03, 2012, 05:22:07 PM
Mayne not all of me but my left foot has a good chunk of it!

Def

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us Offline Singh

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #14 on: June 03, 2012, 05:39:14 PM
That was what ended leathermans for me as the go to tool and my full size Swiss tool took over that role.  Complain all you want about slippery drivers, but that polish is there for a reason, and its to provide no micro nicks for rust to even think about grabbing hold of.

Nailed it.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2012, 05:40:46 PM by shamus »


gb Offline nuphoria

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #15 on: June 03, 2012, 07:41:58 PM
Complain all you want about slippery drivers, but that polish is there for a reason, and its to provide no micro nicks for rust to even think about grabbing hold of.

I still like and use leathermans too, but I wish they'd use better steel. 


I totally agree with you :salute:


Grant, that really is a sorry looking tool dude!
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ca Offline jzmtl

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #16 on: June 03, 2012, 07:47:58 PM
How many of you regularly spray down your monkey wrenches after each use?

Mine get enough motor oil and grease on them it's like they are constantly being oiled.  :D

Maybe you should try some of that ceracoat stuff, consider wingman is already much more polished compare to other LM, pretty much as slick as swisstool.

Or some tuff cloth, people use them always praise how they keep protecting even long after application.


us Offline powerring

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #17 on: June 03, 2012, 07:55:37 PM
That is tragic man.  I'm sorry to see that it rusted on you.  On the plus side, I won't cost $100 to replace.

Maybe it's time for Leatherman to look into using some H1 steel (a la Spyderco and Benchmade in some of their blades).  I wonder if H1 would work well or be cost efficient in a multitool form factor?   It presumably wouldn't rust. 

I've always had a gut feeling that the shiny Vic Spirit steel would do well in a more humid or corrosive environment. 


ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #18 on: June 03, 2012, 08:10:18 PM
Just yo emphasize some details here- this tool is still functional. It needs to he cleaned and oiled but I doubt there is any permanent damage, so I won't be replacing it or sending it in for repair or replacement.

The reason this is going off duty is because prolonged use in my environment would be detrimental to it. Being on my work vest it gets exposed to sea air, salt spray, heavy rains, wind, snow and radical temperature shifts.  And, unlike a tool kept safely in the sheath under a coat, it's right out in the open getting wet, getting sprayed, heating up in the sunshine and cooling down in the wind.  This is something of an extreme situation for a tool.

That having been said, the Wingman, regardless of treatment has failed me as an EDC model.  That isn't to say its a bad tool or that people should avoid it or Leatherman sucks or anything like that.  Yes, I could try Tuff Cloth, yes, I could spray it with oil every night or I could keep it in a temperature controlled humidor and sing softly to it before I go to bed.

What I am saying is that this tool is simply not the right one for this application or circumstances. I am disappointed in it but these things happen.  For folks who want a tool they don't have to think about or baby, this may not be your thing.  I want a tool that can stand up to what I do on a daily basis and I don't have to worry about it- and it has to be ready when I am.  It's a good thing I didn't need the blade today though..... of course if I did then I could have just reached for my Compact- after all, two is one, right?

Def

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ca Offline jzmtl

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #19 on: June 03, 2012, 08:33:05 PM
Dang, did you type all that on your phone? Would've taken me ages.


ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #20 on: June 03, 2012, 08:45:03 PM
Sadly I did.... my thumbs are about to fall off!

Def

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ca Offline Suveges

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #21 on: June 04, 2012, 12:00:14 AM
This is one thing that makes me appreciate living in Calgary.  It's absolutely bone dry, which causes dry skin and nosebleeds but I couldn't get something to rust that badly if I tried.


us Offline Mercury

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #22 on: June 04, 2012, 12:03:33 AM
Bummer about the Wingman Grant.  I am not a fan of that tool to begin with, but seeing it rust like that with the level of polish it has is just disappointing. 

In Leatherman's defense though, I have carried plenty of their tools for years now, and I live in a VERY humid environment.  My tools all live in leather sheaths, and I don't clean them every day or even every week.  My hands are sweaty most of the time, and I don't wipe the tool off before stowing it in the sheath.  I get them wet all the time.  I have never had one develop any rust that would have bothered me.  Hell, I kept my sideclip in the rear pocket of my pants for a year, and that is one sweaty place.  Not a speck of rust.  My Charge has recently seen a full dunk in water, and I forgot about it in it's sheath for two days before cleaning it back up.  No rust. 

The only Leatherman I have had rust on me to the point it bothered me was my C33X.  That blade lived in my right rear pocket every day for three months, and was flecked with rust by the end of the second week.  But not near as bad as your Wingman Grant.  I guess your environment is pretty extreme!

Sorry about the rant, and it wasn't due to your post Grant, I just get so sick of seeing Leatherman bashed by users here saying "Leatherman's rust, shoulda bought a Vic".  That's akin to saying "A gerber pinched me once, I'll never buy another".

I use Leatherman products daily, and always will.  I also use Gerber and Vic products.  Each has their shortcomings, and none is definitely better than the others overall.



us Offline Bruce909

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #23 on: June 04, 2012, 01:54:14 AM
Have you considered your acidic abrasive personality as the root cause of the problem - :rofl:

I do think that a TiNi SOG P3 would be a good test candidate in your vest.  You just need to figure out the pocket clip part.

Bruce


ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #24 on: June 04, 2012, 02:42:45 AM
Here's a photo of me that my boss took at work the other day:



In my right pocket you see my tape measure with eClipse pocket clip while on the left you see my Fisher Bullet, Photon Proton and Wingman.  You can see how exposed it is there, and I spend hours at a time out in the weather.

Maybe the Wingman is the right tool for the consummate indoorsman?  :D

Def
Leave the dents as they are- let your belongings show their scars as proudly as you do yours.


us Offline darth_guy101

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #25 on: June 04, 2012, 04:29:22 AM
My Wingman has gone on several sweaty bike rides and camping trips and has developed no rust. Granted I live in a place that has gotten something like 10" of rain in the last 2 years...
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us Offline Gryffin

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #26 on: June 04, 2012, 04:36:26 AM
I just get so sick of seeing Leatherman bashed by users here saying "Leatherman's rust, shoulda bought a Vic".  That's akin to saying "A gerber pinched me once, I'll never buy another".

I'm with Merc. I've carried just about every multitool in christendom at one time or another, and have never seen red rust like that on ANY Leatherman. The closest I got was the first time I took my PST fishing in salt water, where it was repeatedly wetted with salt water (disgorging hooks, cutting bait, snipping line), then backed dry in the sun. And even then, it didn't rust red, it got a white oxidation instead, and a dark staining that I never got rid of.

I know the Wingman is a budget priced tool, but that kid of rust tells me there's carbon steel in those pivots somewhere, and if true, that would be disappointing.

Def, I appreciate your unique circumstances. Maybe something in TiNi or other coating would be a good idea.
« Last Edit: June 04, 2012, 04:38:01 AM by Gryffin »


us Offline sergemaster

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #27 on: June 04, 2012, 09:15:52 AM
Amici,
Maybe a good suggestion would be to give all Leatherman multi tools a spray of Birchwood Casey Sheath gun oil as a good rust preventative going forward. Works on gun barrels, why not the Wingman?

Cheers,
Serge
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se Offline kinskibrain

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #28 on: June 04, 2012, 10:02:05 AM
Sorry to see that rust Grant. I'm going to post some pics of the Wave that I ended up buying for my brother. His Wave has also developed rust here and there. The tool has not jammed but there is plenty of rust all over it. He works on the open sea though so I can't think of a more challenging environment for steel.


ca Offline Grant Lamontagne

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Re: The Wingman has been shot down!
Reply #29 on: June 04, 2012, 11:58:25 AM
I just get so sick of seeing Leatherman bashed by users here saying "Leatherman's rust, shoulda bought a Vic".  That's akin to saying "A gerber pinched me once, I'll never buy another".

I'm with Merc. I've carried just about every multitool in christendom at one time or another, and have never seen red rust like that on ANY Leatherman. The closest I got was the first time I took my PST fishing in salt water, where it was repeatedly wetted with salt water (disgorging hooks, cutting bait, snipping line), then backed dry in the sun. And even then, it didn't rust red, it got a white oxidation instead, and a dark staining that I never got rid of.

I know the Wingman is a budget priced tool, but that kid of rust tells me there's carbon steel in those pivots somewhere, and if true, that would be disappointing.

Def, I appreciate your unique circumstances. Maybe something in TiNi or other coating would be a good idea.

I agree- I don't want to perpetuate the rumor that Leathermans rust, but the fact is, this Leatherman did rust.  However, it was also under fairly wet conditions.  Does that make it ok?  Not for my needs.  Does that mean it could happen to someone else?  Yes.  Does that mean it will happen to everyone else?  Not necessarily.

As for a new vest tool, I will think about it but the Wingman will probably ride with me for another day or two simply because I have been far too busy at work to stop and consider other options.  I have just finished three sixteen hour days in a row, and I'm off to do what will hopefully only be eight hours or so...  Def's brain is mushier than usual right now... oh yeah, and it's raining... :P

Def
Leave the dents as they are- let your belongings show their scars as proudly as you do yours.


 

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