It's a multitool, but not as we know it.

[tosh]

Has the multitool past it's peak, the era when functionality and practicality were deemed more important than gimmicks and bright colours.

Judging by the latest offerings from both SOG and Gerber, who have decided to outsource production to China - a name long synonymous with poor quality tack.

I do wonder if the multitools heyday has peaked - the days when you could rely on the brand name, that in itself would be a guarantee to get the job done - the current offerings from China....well, would you really trust your life on them.

My late grandmother worked for Chestermans of Sheffield - this is pre-Rabone-Chesterman.
She often spoke when Chestermans decided to merge with another company. It may have been Rabone, I couldn't say.
But, at that time my grandmother who was assigned chargehand Q/C status was asked to show the new partner around. he looked at the Rules, Levels  etc etc that were being manufactured and remarked to my grandmother that these would soon all be a thing of the past.

"Someone who buys one of these needs never to buy another in his lifetime, is such the quality - but that makes very poor buisiness sense" he said.

A while later once the merge was completed, the markings on the new Rules were no longer engraved but were simply printed on, the steel quality was also reduced.


Somewhere, wrapped in grease paper I have some of the old Chesterman rules, superb quality, heavy, with deep engravings. I also "had" one of the later versions - it got chucked years back. It was awful, the printed markings had all but rubbed away, the steel gauge was thinner. All in all a very poor replacement.

You can still buy this junk at the big DIY stores  - it's  a shame that the "Chesterman" brand name has to be associated with, what is in effect NOT a real Chesterman!!


I think maybe SOG and Gerber are also heading down that downward spiral.

[JAfromMn]

My quick 2 cents.

I think if we All quit buying these made in China crap tool's they would have to go back to making quality made in usa tool's again.

I've been worng before but that's what I think and what Try to do.

[tosh]

My quick 2 cents.

I think if we All quit buying these made in China crap tool's they would have to go back to making quality made in usa tool's again.

I've been worng before but that's what I think and what Try to do.

That's pretty much my view too.

Most of my new MT's/SAK's purchases with the exception of 1 or 2 gimmicks are Vic/Wenger and a couple of Leathermans. The rest being discontinued lines from SOG, Gerber, Schrade, Leatherman etc etc.
However, after pondering the topic some more, I do think China suffers badly here.
When all is said and done obviously SOG and Gerber are struggling to compete in todays market so outsource to foreign manufacturerers - China.

In doing so, knowing full well that ALL complaints will be aimed at the source of manufacture regardless that the manufacturer was obviously following guidelines set out by the parent company in the first place. mean while said parent company sits back and revells in past glory days - leaving China to take all the flak.

I know I've totally gone back on myself here, but I've only just seen it from that perspective.

But the bottomline is that current offerings in terms of multitools been manufactured in the far east are poor in comparison to deleted lines.

But this needn't be so.
 
We need only look at apple. A truly amazing story of ever there was one. for years they were dominated by microsoft yet today apple........well. we all know.

The ipad, iphones, itouch are all made in China I believe. And yet again the quality is simply stunning, and furthermore, they are all the most expensive brand names in the their class. Which to me, spells out that the late Steve Jobs was quite right. If the product is that good, people will still buy it regardless, which then brings us back to what China does can and does produce when the parent company is watching the quality control.

[Farmman]

I have recently returned brand new Leathermans where the locks did not engage. I believe this is probably due to a slacking on the qc side of things. I know that you and I both share the same dismay at some of the rubbish turned out in our very own city which trades on past glories.
I believe where a company chasing a profit cuts corners using cheaper materials and allowing for reduced qc then where ever the product is manufactured the product will suffer and eventually so will the brand name.

[dks]

I think people are quick to blame bad quality on the country rather than the brand.

I am sure if SOG etc. wanted a good quality product from China they could get a good product from China. Buck, AG Russell, spyderco etc. have Chinese products that, for the price, are as good as their US made products.

I still remember British Leyland and its products and they did not manufacture anything in China. Also several US made cars were not known for their excellence; remember a few years ago when the US car companies were going broke? Does Richards of Sheffield have a good name?

I think we are all happy to excuse a bad product by blaming the country it was made in.
For the crap SOG and Gerber products I blame SOG and Gerber. I am sure if they made their products in the US and asked for the same QC standards that they asked for in China their products would have been just as bad and more expensive too.
I have a few GEC knives but I am only really hapy with one of them. I am generally happy with all my RR and SRM knives. I usually carry a GEC because I like it more than my RR, not because of its quality.

We need to stop excusing the brands, with blanket statements placing the blame on their subcontractors who are just delivering the product they were asked to deliver.

[Millhouse]

Goods made in China can be as good or as bad as you want them to be. It all comes down to how much you are prepared to pay to manufacture each unit.

Some folk here label all goods made in China as crap, a suggestive thought.

[Zed]

I have to say ive had a few good knives from china where is the Gerber mp800 made  as well made  ive had a few sogs and most have been fine other than the scissors not engaging in the lock but after i took them off and fitted them back on they have been fine, some times i think its luck 

[AimlessWanderer]

I think people are quick to blame bad quality on the country rather than the brand.

We need to stop excusing the brands, with blanket statements placing the blame on their subcontractors who are just delivering the product they were asked to deliver.

I've expressed similar statements in other threads. If you buy an item, the brand owning the rights to that item have the responsibility ... full responsibility ... for ensuring it is safe and suitable for it's intended purpose. As for China - the Octane, Balance, Dime, Li'l Guppie and several others are tools I trust and enjoy using, and in many ways are better for me than Western manufactured equivalents.

As eluded to earlier, this is not a new thing. Sheffield, England was synonymous with quality cutlery years ago, even though a lot of what they produced at some of the factories was very poor. Some of it still leaves a lot to be desired, though the worst culprits have mostly disappeared. There was and still is some excellent manufacturers in the area though, and I have new and old from both ends of the quality spectrum. My Samuel Staniforth knives are excellent, my Jack Adams knives leave much to be desired. You can still buy hand made saws from here, where every tooth is set and sharpened by hand - the factory made lesser quality (?) production has now moved overseas - still cuts wood but now much cheaper

Made in UK, Made in China, Made in USA ..... it all means absolutely nothing these days in and of itself. What standard was it made to, from what materials and via what method? One Portland USA company makes all their own tools right there, while the other contracts overseas. You've more chance of finding me with one of the outsourced tools in my pocket, as personally I've found a lot of them to not just be better value, but better tools too in many cases

Multitools haven't peaked - what has peaked is what people generally are prepared to pay for an item, and if manufacturers globally have to cut costs in order to sell goods and stay alive, this will reflect in the quality of the tools.

[Zed]

I think people are quick to blame bad quality on the country rather than the brand.

We need to stop excusing the brands, with blanket statements placing the blame on their subcontractors who are just delivering the product they were asked to deliver.

I've expressed similar statements in other threads. If you buy an item, the brand owning the rights to that item have the responsibility ... full responsibility ... for ensuring it is safe and suitable for it's intended purpose. As for China - the Octane, Balance, Dime, Li'l Guppie and several others are tools I trust and enjoy using, and in many ways are better for me than Western manufactured equivalents.

As eluded to earlier, this is not a new thing. Sheffield, England was synonymous with quality cutlery years ago, even though a lot of what they produced at some of the factories was very poor. Some of it still leaves a lot to be desired, though the worst culprits have mostly disappeared. There was and still is some excellent manufacturers in the area though, and I have new and old from both ends of the quality spectrum. My Samuel Staniforth knives are excellent, my Jack Adams knives leave much to be desired. You can still buy hand made saws from here, where every tooth is set and sharpened by hand - the factory made lesser quality (?) production has now moved overseas - still cuts wood but now much cheaper

Made in UK, Made in China, Made in USA ..... it all means absolutely nothing these days in and of itself. What standard was it made to, from what materials and via what method? One Portland USA company makes all their own tools right there, while the other contracts overseas. You've more chance of finding me with one of the outsourced tools in my pocket, as personally I've found a lot of them to not just be better value, but better tools too in many cases

Multitools haven't peaked - what has peaked is what people generally are prepared to pay for an item, and if manufacturers globally have to cut costs in order to sell goods and stay alive, this will reflect in the quality of the tools.

I think that sums it up Al, folk havnt got the extra cash these days so manufacturers need to cut costs to charge less, 

[gregozedobe]

I have to agree with many of the previous posts.  The country of manufacture is largely irrelevant to the quality of the product. 

What does count is the quality of the design, the materials used, the labour skills and machinery used to make the components and assemble it, and last but definitely not least, the quality control/assurance processes that are applied.  Skimp in any of these areas and the product will suffer. 

All businesses are under pressure these days to maintain or increase profits, and many of the leadesr in business today have a fairly short-term outlook to get their "performance-based" bonusses (sp ?), and so are willing to trade on their past reputation for excellence for short term gains.  The general public often aren't aware of the drop in standards and/or are unwilling to pay what it takes to make a good quality product, so it works for some comapnies (for a while at least).  That explains why a lot of products made in China are of lesser quality, it is because the companies responsible have decided to cheapen production, not because they are made in China.

It was a similar situation with "made-in-Japan" products after the second world war.  At first they aimed at the cheaper end of the market, but over time many companies constantly improved their quality and it wasn't long before they were as good as the world's best in many areas (eg Nikon, Honda, Kai etc etc). 

The same is currently happening with cars - look at how much Hyundais have improved over the last 10 years, and they are still getting better.

As enthusiasts we can vote with our wallets and only buy good quality products, regardless of where they are made.  We can also try to educate those around us and encourage them to buy decent stuff, not rubbish. 

[dks]

Sort of similar theme and points from BF, regarding Grants favourite brand  :

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1010002-Accidentally-bought-a-Taylor-Schrade

It is nice to see the change in BF from a few years ago, regarding all chinese products being bad.

[Steinar]

QA is the reason I don't buy the economy Victorinox SAKs. I don't want to say to Vic "It's OK, just slack off on QA, I'm not willing to pay for it."

[jerseydevil]

I had the "China=crap" mentality for quite a while.  Nowadays, however... My Gerber Strata shares time on my hip with Us made Gerbers, Leathermen, and Victorinox.  Kershaws, Spydercos, and Enlans are all in my folder rotation.  I've owned and carried slipjoints by Case, Queen, Gec - check my pocket, and as often as not you'll find a Rough Rider Barlow in there.  My Octane gets lots of use on days off.  If the company placing the order with the factory specifies a certain quality, that's what the factory will aim for.  I worked for a silverware company right out of college, and most of our products were imported.  Chinese factories are just as able to produce quality goods as those in the US or UK.  If I had to choose between the examples of the Buck 301 (US) and 373 (China) that I've owned, the 373 wins.  I'm more interested in how something performs than where it's from.

[MultiMat]

Yep it has all been said before. If a company orders a cheap piece of crap guess what they get ...... a cheap piece of crap. Taylor Tools have been doing it for years , the fact that they get away with it & still remain in business is the real mystery. I think SOG could well be walking down the same sad path Taylor has taken Schrade  .

The Multitasker range of tools are made in China to a unprecedented high level & for a competitive price as well  . If Multitasker tweak their design & focus on the non gun market they could potentially blow Leatherman & Victorinox into the weeds   

[lowtech]

I have to say ive had a few good knives from china where is the Gerber mp800 made  as well made  ive had a few sogs and most have been fine other than the scissors not engaging in the lock but after i took them off and fitted them back on they have been fine, some times i think its luck 

IIRC, teh Box said assembled in the USA from US and foreign parts or something like that.