The new Vic lockback - review, critique and teardown (Pic heavy)

[Gareth]

(Image removed from quote.)

More than anything else it's this that has me kinda gobsmacked.   I won't say I've never had a Vic with a touch of lateral play, but that's something else again.  Hopefully just a bit of a teething issue and something they'll correct, but it's still a shame that made it through QC.

[ICanFixThat]

I wonder if even though it is made in Switzerland if the blade is not produced as a semi-finished part else where and then the assembly is done by Victorinox, or contracted out to another Swiss Company?  I suspect their new machinery for this knife needs a bit of tuning, or maybe since this is the first like this and was primarily aimed at the US if they are not assembled by hand using the manual machines? 

[Syph007]

I can't see this blade being made in Ibach.  Its not made the way Victorinox normally makes blades at all. 

[Joe58]

I seem to recall a few years ago a thread concerning the difference between Swiss Made and Made in Switzerland.

It originally started on a swiss watch forum. What they said over there, due to some consumer regulations, this had to be clarified.

And basically, Swiss Made means a product that all the parts may or may not be produced in Switzerland, then the item is assembled in Switzerland. Made in Switzerland denotes an item completely manufactured in Switzerland.

I think this is accurate as Vic uses outsourced parts now, I think. For instance, and correct me if I'm wrong, the scales are made elsewhere, as many of the small rivets, etc., etc.

I cannot recall off hand when Vic changed the stamping to Swiss Made, but according to this watch forum I was reading, it had to have been when this truth in advertising stuff came up.

It's even evident here in the US. Car makers for instance state USA. But as we know, the motor is from Canada, transmission from Mexico, what have you. Then the parts are assembled here.

And as always, I could be all wet. 

Joe

[Theron]

Got one coming now... Freaking huge letdown.
At least Father's Day is coming.   I can give it to my dad for cutting twine and such.

I can't believe Victorinox would put their name on this POS.

[PTRSAK]

ditto on what people are saying about the 111mm series. I got my first (an Alpineer) in a multi knife lot on eBay and I was not disappointed with it in any way. It presented like a typical SAK, just a bit bigger. I have actually been using it as my lunchbox knife and because I prefer the blade shape it has kicked my Opi out of that job.

I think Victorinox would have been better to scale the 111 up to 125 or 130 rather than produce this thing. I never really liked the look of it from the first time I saw it.

[RamoN]

I seem to recall a few years ago a thread concerning the difference between Swiss Made and Made in Switzerland.

It originally started on a swiss watch forum. What they said over there, due to some consumer regulations, this had to be clarified.

And basically, Swiss Made means a product that all the parts may or may not be produced in Switzerland, then the item is assembled in Switzerland. Made in Switzerland denotes an item completely manufactured in Switzerland.

I think this is accurate as Vic uses outsourced parts now, I think. For instance, and correct me if I'm wrong, the scales are made elsewhere, as many of the small rivets, etc., etc.




And as always, I could be all wet. 

Joe

This may be a false assumption but isnt the crossbow symbol one of the things that guarantees made in switzerland quality?

Thanks a lot for the review.

And a pity that vic as other manufacturers is jumping the low quality train 

[stax]

Great info in this thread.  Thanks Robert. 

[The Shadow]

Excellent review!  Thank you.

This knife is so disappointing, so I won't be buying one either.

[nuphoria]

Fantastic work sir, it deserved nothing less than disassembly and disdain!

I agree, the sheath looks rather useful... bloody shame about the standard on the knife though.

It seems they laughingly call this model the "Hunter Pro". A touch of hubris may be called for here.
I can't find the RRP for it - sounds like the $10 sale bin is reasonable though, especially if it comes with the sheath

[Chako]

Ouch. I bought one before reading this....I haven't received it yet from Tim. I hope I get a better copy.

[Syph007]

Fantastic work sir, it deserved nothing less than disassembly and disdain!

I agree, the sheath looks rather useful... bloody shame about the standard on the knife though.

It seems they laughingly call this model the "Hunter Pro". A touch of hubris may be called for here.
I can't find the RRP for it - sounds like the $10 sale bin is reasonable though, especially if it comes with the sheath

Honestly this feels like the $15 china made folders that are common from other companies.

If I had to bet, I bet the blade and locking parts are made in china, and Vic makes the rest.  The liners for example are normal Vic quality, nicely shaped and finished.. BUT completely inside the knife so you dont see them. 

There is no way Vic made the blade and locking parts in Ibach, no way at all. 

[Chako]

If they keep doing stuff like that...they are going to sully their good name.

[lowtech]

To bad for the lockback.
On the 111 and teh stability of peened brass - I´ve held about 8 or 10 abused 111 GAKS in my hands. On all of them, the peening was still very good although it was evident the knfes had been used as hammers, prybars, chisels and whatnot.

Bent saws, blades, broken blade tips and even a bent big screwdriver, but the peening seems to be strong enough for that kind of (ab)use.

And i have to second Syph that the Wenger Rangers are quite hefty knives, and if you want a swiss OHO locking fgolder, take a look at them (as long as you can)

Maybe MTO has an ever so slight influence on the Swiss and they will either improve on quality or continue the New Ranger after Wenger goes out of Business.
Unrealistic, but one my dream...

[Syph007]

Ya actually what this experience has done is have me wanting to track down some more wenger rangers before they are all gone.  I love those things.  I have 3, one 2 layer, one 3 layer, one with shears, but I need one with pliers now... hmmm  I think I saw some in Tim store still.

[felinevet]

There is no way Vic made the blade and locking parts in Ibach, no way at all.

You may be right but I think accuracy would dictate that we find out the truth about where they were made before making such a statement as fact. 

[felinevet]

Anyone who has purchased one from me can return it for a full refund if not satisfied. Just let me know.

[Syph007]

There is no way Vic made the blade and locking parts in Ibach, no way at all.

You may be right but I think accuracy would dictate that we find out the truth about where they were made before making such a statement as fact. 

You're right Tim.  I should have said. "I'd be very surprised if they were made in Ibach"

[felinevet]

 

There is no way Vic made the blade and locking parts in Ibach, no way at all.

You may be right but I think accuracy would dictate that we find out the truth about where they were made before making such a statement as fact. 

You're right Tim.  I should have said. "I'd be very surprised if they were made in Ibach"

[Chako]

No worries here Tim. I am a collector. I needed one of these no matter the quality. 

[Theron]

Anyone who has purchased one fromnda want to keep the sheath.  me can return it for a full refund if not satisfied. Just let me know.

That's very upstanding of you.   If mine comes without play,  I'll still be keeping it.
I actually just ordered two Ranger 78s for myself and my dad.   I think I'll give this Vic to my son or use it as a camping beater and keep the sheath for myself.

[sawman]

Tim, I think I speak for all of us when I say I don't think any disappointment is aimed at you - but rather shock over the fact this even left Vic's factory.  You're the greatest in my book Tim 

[rmagralha]

Tim, I think I speak for all of us when I say I don't think any disappointment is aimed at you - but rather shock over the fact this even left Vic's factory.  You're the greatest in my book Tim 

+1 

[gustophersmob]

I know there are some small items outsourced by VIc, like the forged corkscrew made in Japan, for example, but I don't think this is really the issue here.

Whether this model is outsourced or not, it is almost certain the final assembly is done in Ibach.  The true problems I see are the side play and the completely un-peened rivets.  That is a Vic in Switzerland problem, pure and simple.  Regardless of blade finish, material, size, shape, origin, etc, the sub-par assembly is all Vic, and they need to own it.

I guess I'm thinking that if the knife had been properly assembled, we would be debating the merits (or lack thereof) on the blade material, and shape, but wouldn't be questioning country of origin.

Not sure if my little rant even has a point    but it feels good to have it off my chest

[nic]

To swing back to the country of origin debate. WTO rulings state that the country of origin is the one in which the manufacturing company adds at least 70% of the value of the product. A 'swiss' knife could in theory be largely assembled out of pre manufactured parts, but I suspect that some finishing of major components is required, e.g. blade blanks would have to be machined and edged in the country of origin.

There are 'made in Italy' bicycles that have their frames constructed in Taiwan, which are then shipped to Europe unfinished in raw carbon, and the final spray and decal application is performed in Italy, and the components that are bolted on may be either Italian or Japanese. Those 'Italian' components may in turn have been largely assembled from parts manufactured in Romania.

It is a pity about new lockback though. There is a market for a cheap, tough folder, but I would have liked to have seen the main pivot at least be a secure screw. I have had a Portland made Gerber Gator for many years now, and having a sturdy, cost effective folder that you can beat on without worrying about the 'collectable' value is a wonderful thing.

[North Man]

Well done this review, hopefully all these issues will be corrected.

Brass pins can take very much even on a harder use folder,  need to be tight. Also there is a part on the locking mechanism i Wonder some on. The lockbar need to sink deeper...

[borgwarrior]

Quite some issues! Not to mention that here in hungary the stuff costs ~$100... no way I'm buying one until the design/QA is fixed...

[trailmaster]

I have been keeping my mouth closed on this... It is certainly out of my budget for now.

While i understand the need to get into new markets, I think Vic is completely out of line with that knife. If I wanted such a knife, I would be buying a Spyderco or a Benchmade.

Anyway it seems the model has some quality problems. Whether that is from outsourcing or from lack of experience with this type of knife remains to be seen. I will continue to carry my 91mm and not bother with it. However i do hope that Vic can make things str8 in order to preserve their reputation.

[Marius]

I received mine today. Both are pretty much the same.

In short summary:

• The pouch is too small for this knife.
  
• The blade not only has lateral play but also has longitudinal play when locked! I have several other lockback folders and when locked the blade on those is rock solid. Not on these.
  
• The knife feels arguably substantial in hand, is heavier and feels a bit more consistent than for example a similar Wenger Ranger 51 (single OH lockable blade). The Ranger is lighter and more cheap plastic hollow feeling. To me. But also the Ranger seems more carefully assembled.
  

Interesting that the blade is only stamped "Victorinox" and that "Swiss Made" is only on the scale. One can guess what this means.

I do not think I will return these. I feel bad for Tim to be stuck with two more of these turds.

[Chako]

I just got mine in today as well. My copy has no lateral play, but does suffer from some longitudinal play. However that play is very minimal. I have seen a lot worse. The feel of this knife is solid. I love the grip on the nylon handle material used. All in all, I like this knife.

I was getting the impression that this knife was utter junk. I am quite happy with it, and I wasn't expecting that at all.