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Weapons of War Through History

Wilfried · 154 · 17869

be Offline Wilfried

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Weapons of War Through History
on: January 25, 2014, 03:38:01 PM
In this thread you can post anything which has to do with the weapons which have been used through history for waging war.

Whether it be weapons of the Roman Legions, the Assyrians, the Chinese, the Saxons, the Vikings or weapons of Ancient Greece or Egypt or from the Middle Ages, the Gulf Wars, the Great War or the Second World War: you’re invited to say something about it and to post pictures.

Needless to say that contemporary or possible future weapons are also welcome.

Please leave out all political and / or religiously related comment, either explicitly or implicitly.

Maybe many of us can learn more about history, which is the main goal of this thread.

I sincerely hope we’ll all have a great time with this thread!


us Offline jerseydevil

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #1 on: January 25, 2014, 03:40:19 PM
Oh man, my dream thread!  :woohoo:  When I get off from work, prepare to learn more about things from Mausers to Dreadnoughts than you ever planned on knowing......
There's no such thing as "Too pretty to carry".  There's only "Too pretty NOT to carry"...... >:D


pt Offline RamoN

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #2 on: January 25, 2014, 03:46:10 PM
Oh man, my dream thread!  :woohoo:  When I get off from work, prepare to learn more about things from Mausers to Dreadnoughts than you ever planned on knowing......

Looking forward to it  :tu:


I may spend my sunday writing some info about japanese weapons.......... It will be a loooooong post also


be Offline Wilfried

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #3 on: January 25, 2014, 03:46:37 PM
Oh man, my dream thread!  :woohoo:  When I get off from work, prepare to learn more about things from Mausers to Dreadnoughts than you ever planned on knowing......


I knew it! I KNEW IT!    :D

This is going to be a lot of fun!    :tu:


be Offline Wilfried

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #4 on: January 25, 2014, 03:55:26 PM
Char B1


The Char B1 was a French heavy tank manufactured before World War II.

The Char B1 was a speSmurfpillsed heavy break-through vehicle, originally conceived as a self-propelled gun with a 75 mm howitzer in the hull; later a 47 mm gun in a turret was added, to allow it to function also as a Char de Bataille, a "battle tank" fighting enemy armour, equipping the armoured divisions of the Infantry Arm.

Among the most powerfully armed and armoured tanks of its day, the type was very effective in direct confrontations with German armour in 1940 during the Battle of France, but slow speed and high fuel consumption made it ill-adapted to the war of movement then being fought.

After the defeat of France captured Char B1 (bis) would be used by Germany, with some rebuilt as flamethrowers or mechanised artillery.




Char B1 bis "Rhône"




Char B1 bis "Flandres"



us Offline jerseydevil

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #5 on: January 25, 2014, 03:59:20 PM
 :D
Oh man, my dream thread!  :woohoo:  When I get off from work, prepare to learn more about things from Mausers to Dreadnoughts than you ever planned on knowing......


I knew it! I KNEW IT!    :D

This is going to be a lot of fun!    :tu:

 :D Yes it will.

I may spend my sunday writing some info about japanese weapons.......... It will be a loooooong post also

The IJN has fascinated me for years.  People don't realize that in 1941 the best-trained and equipped navy in the world was the Japanese.  The US Navy found that out the hard way at night in the waters around Guadalcanal. 
There's no such thing as "Too pretty to carry".  There's only "Too pretty NOT to carry"...... >:D


gb Offline Mike, Lord of the Spammers!

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #6 on: January 25, 2014, 04:06:02 PM
I remember the A6M was dismissed as no threat when it came out, as they wrongly assumed an aircraft couldn't have that level of performance!

A lot of Japanese wartime equipment was of good quality, and was comparable to western designs (except armour which was always barely adequate) it was just poorly fielded. There submarines could of been a very serious threat had they used them in the same way as the USN and RN did towards the end of the war.

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ca Offline Chako

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #7 on: January 25, 2014, 04:29:01 PM
A little Leatherman information.

Leatherman series articles


be Offline Wilfried

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #8 on: January 25, 2014, 05:50:51 PM
Lun-class ekranoplan



The Lun-class ekranoplan (NATO reporting name Duck) was a ground effect vehicle (GEV) designed by Rostislav Evgenievich Alexeev and used by the Soviet and Russian navies from 1987 to sometime in the late 1990s.

It "flew" using the lift generated by the ground effect of its large wings when close to the surface of the water - about four metres or less. Although they might look similar and/or have related technical characteristics, ekranoplans like the Lun are not aircraft, seaplanes, hovercraft, or hydrofoils - ground effect is a separate technology altogether.

The International Maritime Organization classifies these vehicles as maritime ships.

The name Lun comes from the Russian for harrier.

The Lun was powered with eight Kuznetsov NK-87 turbofans, mounted on forward canards, each producing 127.4 kN (28,600 lbf) of thrust. It had a flying boat hull with a large deflecting plate at the bottom to provide a "step" for takeoff.

Equipped for anti-surface warfare, it carried the P-270 Moskit (Mosquito) guided missile. Six missile launchers were mounted in pairs on the dorsal surface of its fuselage with advanced tracking systems mounted in its nose and tail.

The only model of this class ever built, the MD-160, entered service with the Black Sea Fleet in 1987. It became retired in the late 1990s and is now sitting unused at a naval station in Kaspiysk.



MD-160, the sole Lun-class ekranoplan



Lun-class at Kaspiysk, Russia, in 2010

« Last Edit: January 25, 2014, 05:53:49 PM by Wilfried »


us Offline jerseydevil

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #9 on: January 25, 2014, 06:43:21 PM
The Caspian Sea Monster.  Very cool!  :tu:

@Mike - there's a big post about the Zero composing itself in my head at the moment, but I'll have to wait until this evening to type it out......
There's no such thing as "Too pretty to carry".  There's only "Too pretty NOT to carry"...... >:D


be Offline Wilfried

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #10 on: January 25, 2014, 07:13:10 PM
French Tanks of the Second World War


Video 1: Char B1, Char Somua and Renault R35

Video 2: Char B1


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-iD6ds_3rCc


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2JJqDIQOuJE


be Offline Wilfried

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #11 on: January 25, 2014, 07:45:52 PM
Roman legionary's clothing, armour and equipment


The Roman legionary was a professional soldier of the Roman army after the Marian reforms. Legionaries had to be Roman citizens under the age of 45. They enlisted in a legion for twenty-five years of service, a change from the early practice of enlisting only for a campaign. The last five years were on veteran lighter duties.

The Roman soldier underwent especially rigorous training; discipline was the base of the army's success, and the soldiers were relentlessly and constantly trained with weapons and especially with drill — forced marches with full load and in tight formation were frequent.

Discipline was important and infractions were heavily punished by the centurions. However, honours, rewards and promotions were frequently awarded to legionaries who distinguished themselves in battle or through exemplary service.

Roman military personal equipment was produced in large numbers to established patterns and used in an established way. These standard patterns and uses were called the res militaris or disciplina. Its regular practice during the Roman Republic and Roman Empire led to military excellence and victory.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BzTt2uKUhYk


scotland Offline Gareth

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #12 on: January 25, 2014, 08:28:42 PM
A couple of old sabres of mine.



Top one is the British 1885 pattern.  The bottom one is a little more tricky as it pre-dates most standard issue 'patterns', but it is very similar to several late C18th Naval officers blades I have seen.  Think Waterloo etc. 8)
« Last Edit: January 25, 2014, 08:30:22 PM by Gareth »
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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #13 on: January 25, 2014, 09:43:05 PM
The Caspian Sea Monster.  Very cool!  :tu:

@Mike - there's a big post about the Zero composing itself in my head at the moment, but I'll have to wait until this evening to type it out......
Looking forward to it mate :)

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ca Offline Chako

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #14 on: January 25, 2014, 09:51:50 PM
Those are nice Gareth.

Here are a few shots of the war of 1812 celebrations that hit my town this past summer. It was a bit interesting to see folks parade in British uniforms, mingling with American ship crews in period wear. It was a bit surreal to be truthful. While I took these photos, I couldn't help think what our ancestors would think of this 200 years ago.









And the related Fort Mackinac that also featured in the same war.





http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_of_1812

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Mackinac
« Last Edit: January 25, 2014, 09:53:30 PM by Chako »
A little Leatherman information.

Leatherman series articles


be Offline Wilfried

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #15 on: January 26, 2014, 12:29:55 AM
Focke-Wulf Fw 190 Würger (Shrike)


The Focke-Wulf Fw 190, also known as the Butcher Bird, was a German single-seat, single-engine fighter aircraft designed by Kurt Tank in the late 1930s and widely used during World War II.

Powered by a radial engine in most versions, the Fw 190 had ample power and was able to lift larger loads than its well-known counterpart, the Messerschmitt Bf 109.

The Fw 190 was used by the Luftwaffe in a wide variety of roles, including day fighter, fighter-bomber, ground-attack aircraft and, to a lesser degree, night fighter.

When the Fw 190 started flying operationally over France in August 1941, it quickly proved itself to be superior in all but turn radius to the Royal Air Force's main front-line fighter, the Spitfire Mk. V, especially at low and medium altitudes. The 190 maintained superiority over Allied fighters until the introduction of the improved Spitfire Mk. IX in July 1942 restored qualitative parity.

The Fw 190 was well liked by its pilots. Some of the Luftwaffe's most successful fighter aces claimed a great many of their kills while flying it, including Otto Kittel, Walter Nowotny and Erich Rudorffer.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1H1JDbCxeE


us Offline jerseydevil

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #16 on: January 26, 2014, 02:07:13 AM
Nice pics, Chako.  I've fired a Brown Bess several times.  Flintlocks are a bit scary for us leftys though.... Wilfried, those videos are excellent.  :tu:  And finally, Mike.....

The A6M was an excellent fighter, but what made it so also made it extremely vulnerable.  The Zero and its IJAAF counterpart the Ki-43 "Oscar" were built strictly for performance and maneuverability.  The designers did this by basically wrapping the smallest, lightest airframe around the largest engine availible.  This isn't uncommon practice in other air arms, but the Japanese took it to an extreme.  Neither fighter had self-sealing fuel tanks or armor for the pilot.  Against a fighter such as the F4F Wildcat or the P-40, both Japanese aircraft could out-climb and outturn the American.  The US fighters could out-roll the Japanese aircraft though, allowing the American to reverse a turn much more quickly, especially against the Zero.  The American planes could also out-dive the Japanese, allowing them to break off an engagement easier.  In level flight, the P-40 and the Zero had the same top speed, but the P-40 could dive at almost 500mph.  The US fighters were also considerably more rugged than the Japanese.  The Wildcat and the later Hellcat are legendary for their ability to take punishment and still make it home.  Grumman was known as the "Iron Works" for this.  The Ki-43's armament was pitiful, only two 7.7mm machine guns!  The Zero at least had two 20mm cannon along with two MGs, but the cannon had very limited ammunition capacity, and a very slow rate of fire.  In a dogfight, this last was a problem.  The standard US aircraft gun was the .50 caliber AN/M2 Browning, which could fire at 750 RPM.  Four or six of these, in the wings of the F4F depending on the model, would cut through a Zero like a buzzsaw.  When tactics like the Thatch Weave were used, US pilots discovered that their aircraft could take the Zero on, on almost equal terms.  DON'T TURN WITH A MITSUBISHI was hammered into US pilots from mid-1942 on.  By 1943, the Zero was outclassed by the F6F and the F4U Corsair, which could turn, climb, dive, and roll better.  Pilot quality was also a huge advantage for the US.  The prewar Japanese pilots were the best of the best, but the training weeded out even the very good pilots who didn't quite make the cut.  This artifically limited the number of pilots in service, and by the time it was realized that veteran crews were being lost rapidly and need replacement, it was too late to achive the same level of quality.  The USAAF and USN rotated their pilots home to become instructors, to teach new pilots what they had learned in combat.  The Japanese did not.  "They won't let you go home until you die" was a saying in the IJN.  New Japanese pilots did not get to learn those valuable lessons, and it showed during the massive carrier battles in 1944-45.   

Sorry for that long bit of reading.  Hope that made sense.  :)
« Last Edit: January 26, 2014, 02:25:55 AM by jerseydevil »
There's no such thing as "Too pretty to carry".  There's only "Too pretty NOT to carry"...... >:D


gr Offline kkokkolis

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #17 on: January 26, 2014, 10:47:52 AM
We have a knives forum here (some SAKs and MTs too, but mostly knife making oriented) almost dead now after the unexpected death of it's admin. It prohibits strictly any notion of using knives for self defense and as a weapon. I understand it but still admire the MTO that reached such a level of maturity that there's no need to have those austere rules. I see no blood thirsty people here, just folks interested in man's (woman's too) best companion, the tool, and also the historical aspects of it.
I hate violence and war but I like war history and weapons engineering as much as any engineering, mostly that that works without electricity, such as weapons, clocks etc. I have many books and an encyclopedia of it and GBs in my hard disk, I even collected some toy soldiers. In the army I was a physician but found myself more interested in Stingers, Apachees, G3s and such (served at Army Airwing Battalions and Special Forces boot camp). So I see me participating here with a post or two.


gb Offline Mike, Lord of the Spammers!

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #18 on: January 26, 2014, 10:50:51 AM
Excellent post mate :)

Its interesting that the Japanese aircraft development closely paralleled that of Italy where maneuverability was considered the ultimate goal too and were also poorly protected and armed too. And neither of them rectified the situation until the received the DB601 from the Germans either!

Neither county produced armour of any real quantity or quality and there small arms beyond the basic rifles were generally obsolete or unreliable.

Both had great navies, but both were frittered away due to poor tactics and leadership.

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be Offline Wilfried

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #19 on: January 26, 2014, 12:36:51 PM
@jerseydevil and Mike


Thanks for the info on Japanese / American fighters and the parallels between the Japanese / Italian armies!

 :)



us Offline ducttapetech

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #20 on: January 26, 2014, 01:20:31 PM
Oh yeah! This is just my kind of thread!

Nice history guys!

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gr Offline kkokkolis

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #21 on: January 26, 2014, 02:15:17 PM
Sometimes by the term weapon we fancy strong aggressive elements. But in fact there were always unsung or underestimated pieces of equipment that really made the difference and proved decisive.
One example are the Roman legionaries' sandals that permitted them to walk for many miles a day and then fight on most terrain. Still, government issue boots remain one of the most important elements of battle worthy infantry and the preservation of them is  frequently (if not always) an obsessive ritual in today's armies.
The shield of Greek phalangites, called aspis or hoplon, made a great difference in their time. They were fastened in the left arm and the palm holded one side of it. That way they were highly maneuverable and became an offensive rather than an defensive weapon. Greek hoplites covered with them themselves and the right side of the comrade in left but when charging they used them to apply thrust on enemies' lines and disorganize them. With a movement up and left they exposed their opponents' body and pierced it with their spear (dory, xyston) or sword (xiphos, phasganon).
And many other examples exist wher battles were won not because of artillery and rifles but engineered bridges, food in cans, reliable lighters, proper clothing, water sanitizers, stirrups, horseshoes, lines of communication etc.


us Offline ducttapetech

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #22 on: January 26, 2014, 02:36:01 PM
And duct tape. Big one in WW2. Duct tape is what brought man out of the stone age. :))

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be Offline Wilfried

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #23 on: January 26, 2014, 03:41:16 PM
Description and Design of Roman Forts



Roman building and their architecture was often rigid - the design of their forts and stockades were tried and tested and always followed the same architectural design. The Roman fort featured the following elements:

A strategic site was always chosen

A fort could hold up to 800 men

The fort was rectangular

The fort was surrounded by a wide ditch

A stockade was erected on top of the ditch which formed a defensive barrier made of timber posts

A rampart was built with the earth from the ditch together with heavy stones

Each fort had four gateways affording entrances on each side

Watchtowers were also a feature reaching a height of 30 feet (9 metres)

Roman Architecture and design dictated that two main streets crossed the fort

Wooden structures were built serving as the Commanders headquarters, houses, hospital, workshops, barracks (sometimes tents) granaries, stables and a prison

There was even a Fire Brigade within the fort!

Some of the wooden Roman Forts were later replaced with stone buildings

Stone Roman forts and buildings featured one of their great inventions - concrete! Concrete was made by mixing a strong volcanic material ( called pazzolana ) with rubble and a mixture of limes.



Lunt Roman Fort, Baginton, Warwickshire




Roman legionaries build a fortress wall

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTPKUI9zs_o


ch Offline Etherealicer

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #24 on: January 26, 2014, 04:00:19 PM
Enjoy.

Swords : Complete History of Swords (Full Documentary)
Nice documentation, I truly enjoyed watching it.

Some Remarks.
- I believe that the Sword was always a side-arm and therefore it was not replaced by the rifle / musket but by the knife / Pistol. I think the primary battlefield weapon was the spear, which was relieved by the pole-arms who where replaced by musket and later the rifle.
- The way they described the rapier, one would think all swords before that were clumsy hacking blades. Though already the Roman Gladius had a pommel for counter weight, the reason why European swords always were well balanced. In comparison Eastern / Asian swords don't feature a pommel (I'm sure there are exceptions).
- They completely forgot the KING OF SWORDS, the European LONGSWORD. More on that in Swords and their history
- They barely mentioned Talhoffer and completely omitted von Lichtenauer, but spend a lot of time inteviewing Ioan Gruffudd??? And I like "King Arthur" and its OK to show how the fascination with swords is still alive but still, in my Eyes too much focus on the modern periods when the sword was already obsolete.
- European swords are primarily thrusting weapons.
- Finally, what I always miss when comparing the European Sword vs. THE katana. Is the fact that Japan had an entirely different kind of armor. Also, the curved shape of the katana is actually not that good for a man fighting on foot BUT its brilliant if you want to fast-draw your sword (or if you fight from horseback). Also when discussing the Napolean-war they remark on how much more effective the thrusting rapier of the French cavalery was when compared to the slashing saber of the allied cavalery but they fail to include that in their comparison of the Katana vs. the European Sword. Also European swords, if anything are lighter than a katana.
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be Offline Wilfried

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #25 on: January 26, 2014, 05:37:21 PM
Minerva Armored Car



The Belgian Army, pioneering the use of armored cars

By 1914, the good road network and flat terrain of Belgium favored large-scale use of armored cars. In 1912 the Belgian Army was already pioneering small patrol units of regular road cars equipped with machine-guns.

The most well known of these vehicles was the Minerva, built at Antwerp. This 16CV sturdy and powerful car design was shipped "naked" (without bodywork) to Cockerill works, located in Hoboken, and equipped with 4mm (0.15 in) armored plates.


Design of the Minerva

To cope with the extra weight, double wheels were added to the rear drivetrain. For better rigidity, there were no doors, the crew having to climb into the vehicle. The single open-top superstructure (also called "bathtub") housed the driver, commander, gunner and gun servant (although the crew could be from three to six including sharpshooters).

The superstructure was flat at the front and rounded at the end, whilst the ring mount for the machine-gun was placed at the rear and allowed it to traverse fully. The machine-gun, a standard air-cooled 8mm Hotchkiss model 1912 or 1914, was protected by a shield. The engine hatch was armored, as well as the radiator, by a small twin hatch.


Evolution and wartime action

Around thirty Minerva were converted as armored cars in 1914, before the factory was captured during the German advance - by 1916, the design was completely revised. The open-top was fully enclosed, the machine gun now relocated aft under an armored cupola and two side doors added.

They were used in small three-cars platoons of the motorized cavalry units, chiefly for reconnaissance, fire support for infantry and long missions behind the German lines.

Their robust capabilities allowed some of them to remain in service until 1933-35 with gendarmerie units.





be Offline Wilfried

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #26 on: January 27, 2014, 01:50:35 PM
F-86 Sabre


The North American F-86 Sabre (sometimes called the Sabrejet) was a transonic jet fighter aircraft.

Produced by North American Aviation, the Sabre is best known as the United States's first swept wing fighter which could counter the similarly-winged Soviet MiG-15 in high-speed dogfights over the skies of the Korean War. Considered one of the best and most important fighter aircraft in the Korean War, the F-86 is also rated highly in comparison with fighters of other eras.

Although it was developed in the late 1940s and was outdated by the end of the 1950s, the Sabre proved versatile and adaptable, and continued as a front-line fighter in numerous air forces until the last active operational examples were retired by the Bolivian Air Force in 1994.





F-86 Sabre: Jet Strike!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKRIdPSM3Z8


00 Offline kirk13

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #27 on: January 27, 2014, 01:54:18 PM
 Just as an additional FYI,the one in the picture carries the markings of Col. John Glenn,whilst on detachment to the USAF from the Marines. Glenn of course being the first NASA astronaut to orbit the earth,albeit with out a Master Craftsman :P
There is no beginning,or ending,and for this we are thankful,cos now is hard enough to understand!


be Offline Wilfried

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #28 on: January 27, 2014, 03:43:22 PM
MG 42





The MG 42 (shortened from German: Maschinengewehr 42, or "machine gun 42") was a 7.92×57mm Mauser general purpose machine gun that was developed in Germany and entered service with the Wehrmacht in 1942. It supplemented, and, in some instances, replaced the MG 34 general-purpose machine gun in all branches of the German Armed Forces, though both weapons were manufactured and used until the end of the war.

The MG 42 has a proven record of reliability, durability, simplicity, and ease of operation, but is most notable for its ability to produce a high volume of suppressive fire. The MG 42 had one of the highest average rates of fire of any single-barreled man-portable machine gun: between 1,200 and 1,500 rpm, which results in a distinctive muzzle report.

There were other automatic weapon designs with similar firepower, such as the French Darne, the Hungarian-Gebauer single-barreled tank MGs, the Russian 7.62mm ShKAS aircraft gun and the British Vickers K machine gun. However, the MG 42's belt-feed and quick-change barrel system allowed for more prolonged firing in comparison to these weapons.





VIDEO 1

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GL09sLcKW4M


VIDEO 2 - for those who can't get enough of it     :D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N59msUnyy1g


us Offline jerseydevil

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Re: Weapons of War Through History
Reply #29 on: January 27, 2014, 04:05:37 PM
Ah, the Sabre. :dd:  One of the most beautiful fighters ever built.  The MiG-15 was intended more as a bomber destroyer than an air superiority fighter, hence its cannon armament.  Like in my post above regarding the Zero, the guns on the MiG had a slow rate of fire, which was a disadvantage in a dogfight.  Plus, the trajectories for the 23mm and 37mm guns were different.  American pilots reported cases of the 23's going over their aircraft, while 37mm shells went below them!  :o  The Sabre also had a radar gunsight while the MiG did not.  However, one famous US ace, Gabby Gabreski, didn't bother with it.  He chewed gum in the cockpit, and in action stuck it to the windscreen and aimed with that.  Didn't hurt that he'd already racked up 32 kills flying P-47's over Europe before he got 6 MiGs over Korea......


The above post was done at work all from the useless stuff rattling around my head, without reference materials.  That No Life tag under my profile pic is appropriate at times....  :facepalm:
« Last Edit: January 27, 2014, 04:10:49 PM by jerseydevil »
There's no such thing as "Too pretty to carry".  There's only "Too pretty NOT to carry"...... >:D


 

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