Leatherman Signal - is LM making a survival multi?

[babola]

Boy scouts (admittedly ones with deeper pockets) will be all over this. It hits many spots for them.

The rest of us 'grownups' will stick with our existing tools complemented by a proper fire rod and either 2-finger whistle or a physical, keychain one.

[gadgetman7]

Well, I tried the knife and saw when I got home. The saw works very well, actually seemed to clog less than my Wave. Also cleaned up the edge on the knife. It now push cuts phone book pages. I'll cut some cardboard later and see how well it holds up.




Sent from Tracy Island

[Aloha]

Thanks for the write up and getting the tool.  I feel sad, this tool had some real potential, some real possibilities.  I'm also angry at LM for the price point.  I wish they'd seriously start sending prototypes to users not reviewers.  No offense but they wouldn't have to look far  LM you have a captive audience MTO.

Who will be next to get one now?

[captain spaulding]

I think you all know my thoughts about the Signal even before it was released and this first look at one in the wild just confirms everything I thought and said originally. 

To me it goes much deeper than just making a tool. Its more a slap in the face time after time of all these tools no one wants. Take a page from other companies and actual interact with your customers and base your products on their opinions like other HUGE knife companies.

[Obi1shinobee]

I think you all know my thoughts about the Signal even before it was released and this first look at one in the wild just confirms everything I thought and said originally. 

To me it goes much deeper than just making a tool. Its more a slap in the face time after time of all these tools no one wants. Take a page from other companies and actual interact with your customers and base your products on their opinions like other HUGE knife companies.

   Agree with Captain 

[babola]

...To me it goes much deeper than just making a tool. Its more a slap in the face time after time of all these tools no one wants...

You mean like that big multi-tool company which starts with 'G' ? 

[captain spaulding]

...To me it goes much deeper than just making a tool. Its more a slap in the face time after time of all these tools no one wants...

You mean like that big multi-tool company which starts with 'G' ? 

No. I was referring to Kershaw and Spyderco in reference to their folding knives. They truly listen to customers and are very present in the forums to get a idea of what the majority wants in their knives and they actually produce knives with these suggestions. Big surprise........ they sell very well. 

[gadgetman7]

I think several people had concerns about this one - myself included. It is well made but has some design flaws IMO. To be fair, we are a small minority of the users and are likely much more picky than the average consumer. I want to keep using it for a while and see how I like it later. I was pleasantly surprised by the saw and the edge the knife took so there may still be hope.


Sent from Tracy Island

[captain spaulding]

I think several people had concerns about this one - myself included. It is well made but has some design flaws IMO. To be fair, we are a small minority of the users and are likely much more picky than the average consumer. I want to keep using it for a while and see how I like it later. I was pleasantly surprised by the saw and the edge the knife took so there may still be hope.


Sent from Tracy Island

I know we are a minority here, but to be honest since youtube and knife reviewers the numbers of people who actually care about the various minor things and design of knives and multitools is growing. Either way if the majority of the people will not know any difference then why not please the people who will notice?

I will love to hear what you think after some use and time. I commonly change my opinions on things after the first few months. Keep us updated. 

[gadgetman7]

Will do.


Sent from Tracy Island

[tommywp]

Thanks for taking the plunge. Is there any way you could get a picture of the empty compartments with the pliers closed...maybe with some leatherman bits for scale.

[BASguy]

Well, I got to see one in the wild today because one of the welders on my crew got his.  What a joke..... He offered it, and $20, to me for my OG Wave.  What an absolute piece of crap.  This thing is overpriced by at least $70


Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun

[sawman]

Well, I got to see one in the wild today because one of the welders on my crew got his.  What a joke..... He offered it, and $20, to me for my OG Wave.  What an absolute piece of crap.  This thing is overpriced by at least $70


Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun

You'da gotten ripped off!  As others have said in here, LM is just not listening to their customer base. I know not every product can be a great success, but this isn't their first major folly recently. They screwed up the Juice, failed to update their Wave with the newer pliers, and could have done much better with their Wingman/Sidekick series had they just put a little more effort into them.

I'm sure you'll agree, the price point on the Signal is a blatant insult, a hard slap in our faces. If I had an extra $100 laying around, I would put it toward another Victorinox product to be perfectly honest. I seem to get much more hassle-free enjoyment from their stuff anyhow 

[gadgetman7]

While I think the price is high I still think this could be a good tool. The issues I have with it are mostly design related. After using it for a few days I can say that it's well made but the ergonomics are off for me. The plastic parts stay in place but I still don't like them and the file isn't very useful. In fact I've thought about trying to replace with a 3D printed bit holder. I'm not sure what's going on with Leatherman but it does seem that they aren't doing some obvious things like adding the Rebar head to the Wave series. I had to do that myself.


Sent from Tracy Island

[AimlessWanderer]

While I think the price is high I still think this could be a good tool. The issues I have with it are mostly design related. After using it for a few days I can say that it's well made but the ergonomics are off for me. The plastic parts stay in place but I still don't like them and the file isn't very useful. In fact I've thought about trying to replace with a 3D printed bit holder. I'm not sure what's going on with Leatherman but it does seem that they aren't doing some obvious things like adding the Rebar head to the Wave series. I had to do that myself.


Sent from Tracy Island

Sorry, I'm getting mixed messages here. You say it could still be a good tool, but you've got issues with the design aspects, some functions don't work very well, the ergonomics are off, and the price is too high. That kind of doesn't leave a lot to be enthusiastic about.

I'm not having a go at you, I'm just a bit confused as to how your various comments balance out and what the nett result is

[gadgetman7]

Understandable. I think the design of tool, as is, doesn't work well for me, but the tool itself seems to be well made. I simply think the design is off. Perhaps I should have said it differently. The fit and finish is good overall - except for the plastic bits. I think with a few design changes it could be a good tool. I'm not enthusiastic about the tool but a few comments that were made both here, and PMs to me, either explicitly or implicitly said that the tool appeared to be poorly made. To me there are two things at play, the design, which IMO, is flawed and the build quality which appears to be good. Then there's the price for the package which is too high.

I would not recommend the Signal as it currently is but with some design changes it could be a good tool.


Sent from Tracy Island

[AimlessWanderer]

Thanks for the clarification 

[BASguy]

Understandable. I think the design of tool, as is, doesn't work well for me, but the tool itself seems to be well made. I simply think the design is off. Perhaps I should have said it differently. The fit and finish is good overall - except for the plastic bits. I think with a few design changes it could be a good tool. I'm not enthusiastic about the tool but a few comments that were made both here, and PMs to me, either explicitly or implicitly said that the tool appeared to be poorly made. To me there are two things at play, the design, which IMO, is flawed and the build quality which appears to be good. Then there's the price for the package which is too high.

I would not recommend the Signal as it currently is but with some design changes it could be a good tool.


Sent from Tracy Island

I think Gadgetman is spot on here.  This "could" be a good tool.  Get rid of crappy plastic gimmick stuff and drop the price by at least 60% and they'd be in the ballpark for what this thing is worth. 


Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun

[Demel]

Understandable. I think the design of tool, as is, doesn't work well for me, but the tool itself seems to be well made. I simply think the design is off. Perhaps I should have said it differently. The fit and finish is good overall - except for the plastic bits. I think with a few design changes it could be a good tool. I'm not enthusiastic about the tool but a few comments that were made both here, and PMs to me, either explicitly or implicitly said that the tool appeared to be poorly made. To me there are two things at play, the design, which IMO, is flawed and the build quality which appears to be good. Then there's the price for the package which is too high.

I would not recommend the Signal as it currently is but with some design changes it could be a good tool.


Sent from Tracy Island

I think Gadgetman is spot on here.  This "could" be a good tool.  Get rid of crappy plastic gimmick stuff and drop the price by at least 60% and they'd be in the ballpark for what this thing is worth. 


Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun

If you drop the plastic piece, thinking of the wistle, what would you fill that space with? The file sits on the outside so that is easily removeable. I'm not into bushcraft so this tool has no interest to me, just want to know your thoughts.

[gadgetman7]

I think you could fit a bit holder(s) in there like the Skeletool or MUT.


Sent from Tracy Island

[BASguy]

Understandable. I think the design of tool, as is, doesn't work well for me, but the tool itself seems to be well made. I simply think the design is off. Perhaps I should have said it differently. The fit and finish is good overall - except for the plastic bits. I think with a few design changes it could be a good tool. I'm not enthusiastic about the tool but a few comments that were made both here, and PMs to me, either explicitly or implicitly said that the tool appeared to be poorly made. To me there are two things at play, the design, which IMO, is flawed and the build quality which appears to be good. Then there's the price for the package which is too high.

I would not recommend the Signal as it currently is but with some design changes it could be a good tool.


Sent from Tracy Island

I think Gadgetman is spot on here.  This "could" be a good tool.  Get rid of crappy plastic gimmick stuff and drop the price by at least 60% and they'd be in the ballpark for what this thing is worth. 


Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun

If you drop the plastic piece, thinking of the wistle, what would you fill that space with? The file sits on the outside so that is easily removeable. I'm not into bushcraft so this tool has no interest to me, just want to know your thoughts.

Good question, because obviously some re-design would have to go into this.  The comment about bush crafting actually got me thinking a bit more that perhaps they build on this concept and use this template as the basis for a true tradesman tool and push this gimmicky nonsense for the prepper crowd that will spend money for things they will never use anyway.   A tradesman tool has to be functional and price point serious.


Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun

[Demel]

Understandable. I think the design of tool, as is, doesn't work well for me, but the tool itself seems to be well made. I simply think the design is off. Perhaps I should have said it differently. The fit and finish is good overall - except for the plastic bits. I think with a few design changes it could be a good tool. I'm not enthusiastic about the tool but a few comments that were made both here, and PMs to me, either explicitly or implicitly said that the tool appeared to be poorly made. To me there are two things at play, the design, which IMO, is flawed and the build quality which appears to be good. Then there's the price for the package which is too high.

I would not recommend the Signal as it currently is but with some design changes it could be a good tool.


Sent from Tracy Island

I think Gadgetman is spot on here.  This "could" be a good tool.  Get rid of crappy plastic gimmick stuff and drop the price by at least 60% and they'd be in the ballpark for what this thing is worth. 


Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun

If you drop the plastic piece, thinking of the wistle, what would you fill that space with? The file sits on the outside so that is easily removeable. I'm not into bushcraft so this tool has no interest to me, just want to know your thoughts.

Good question, because obviously some re-design would have to go into this.  The comment about bush crafting actually got me thinking a bit more that perhaps they build on this concept and use this template as the basis for a true tradesman tool and push this gimmicky nonsense for the prepper crowd that will spend money for things they will never use anyway.   A tradesman tool has to be functional and price point serious.


Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun

How about this: keep the size frame, add a blunt nose option for the pliers, have an option for surge scissors, saw, or file for secondary tool, drop the can opener for a large flat driver, and lose the plastic whistle piece for a long bit holder for mut bits.

[BASguy]

Pretty good ideas..... You'd think someone at Leatherman would have have come up with this idea


Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun

[gadgetman7]

I think it would work with a bit holder and the blade exchange system from the Surge but they need to rethink the gate on the carabiner. I've been carrying the tool for a few days and the pinching is an annoyance but that may be my hand size. Also they need to get rid of the serrations and upgrade the steel on the knife.


Sent from Tracy Island

[sawman]

I think it would work with a bit holder and the blade exchange system from the Surge but they need to rethink the gate on the carabiner. I've been carrying the tool for a few days and the pinching is an annoyance but that may be my hand size. Also they need to get rid of the serrations and upgrade the steel on the knife.


Sent from Tracy Island

That's one thing I like very much about the Wave and Rebar are the separate serrated and plain blades. IMO, it's well worth the added tool slot to include both.

[Demel]

I think it would work with a bit holder and the blade exchange system from the Surge but they need to rethink the gate on the carabiner. I've been carrying the tool for a few days and the pinching is an annoyance but that may be my hand size. Also they need to get rid of the serrations and upgrade the steel on the knife.


Sent from Tracy Island

That's one thing I like very much about the Wave and Rebar are the separate serrated and plain blades. IMO, it's well worth the added tool slot to include both.

I like both. It depends on what type of work I'm doing. Usually I'm cutting a lot of cardboard. If I only have one blade I want it to be combo, but if I can get two blades, then having a dedicated serrated blade is great. It all depends on the work you do with it.

[babola]

I think it would work with a bit holder and the blade exchange system from the Surge but they need to rethink the gate on the carabiner. I've been carrying the tool for a few days and the pinching is an annoyance but that may be my hand size. Also they need to get rid of the serrations and upgrade the steel on the knife.


Sent from Tracy Island

That's one thing I like very much about the Wave and Rebar are the separate serrated and plain blades. IMO, it's well worth the added tool slot to include both.

I like both...

Me too. And as you pointed out it depends on the situation and the need.

Cheers!

[AimlessWanderer]

.... and what else you carry 

I frequently carry a separate folder, which means I don't need a plain edged blade on my multitool. Instead I want something that's going to compliment that blade, such as a serrated blade or a combo edged blade, or even (as is often the case with me) a modified knifeless tool with some other function added in place of the knife blade.

I would imagine that a large percentage of multitool users already carry a separate blade. It makes sense for those people to maximise the functions available on their pocket tool rather than just duplicate functions they already have.

[gadgetman7]

Sometimes I do, but daily I don't carry a separate knife, just my Skeletool CX. I would consider carrying just this one if the blade steel was better and they made a few design changes.


Sent from Tracy Island

[Kampfer]

Is there room for a longer blade in blade guard? I assume the pivot is the same size as wave, Rebar?