Long time away - I got a household plumbing question

[JP]

I have been away from forums for years and I don't want to join anywhere else. Coming back to the fold.I need your folks help. I am stumped on a household plumbing question.

Our household water keeps shutting off/losing flow.

We are on a well.

New pressure tank
New pressure gauge
New switch
New hot water tank

Good pressure on the gauge ~60
Well is ~180'
We can see water down the well often between ~20 and 40 feet below ground level depending on what was recently used.

The water at the tap will run fine and then something triggers it to stop altogether. No sputtering, flow just reduces to nothing pretty quickly.

Turn the tap off, wait a few seconds, turn it on and it is back.

This happens for either hot or cold water.

We have had plumbers out and the next thing to switch seems to be the well pump but the professionals didn't think that was the issue.

Any idea what the issue could be?

[Adam5]

I am an experienced electrician, not a plumber, so please take what I say with a grain of salt.

If the pressure is fine, and 60 psi is a good amount of pressure, then the well pump is probably in good shape. It seems to me that there is a problem with detection of low pressure, causing a lag in the pressure switch activating and sending power to the well pump. You stated that the pressure tank, switch, and gauge have been replaced. I wonder if the pipe between these components was replaced. A clog that pipe could cause your issue. For example, a severe clog in the small section of pipe that connects the pressure switch to the rest of the water piping could cause the pressure that the switch sees to decrease slower than at the tap.

I would observe the pressure gauge and pressure switch while the tap is opened and closed to see if  there is a lag between the pressure at the tap and at the pressure gauge/switch. If there is a significant lag, then I might be right about a clog.

[Grant Lamontagne]

Adam's response sounds logical to me and well worth looking into.

I have also sent up the Plumber Signal (it looks like the Bat Signal but is a plunger instead of a bat!) to get the attention of our own Mad Plumbarian, who may also have some thoughts.

Def

[JP]

Thank you for the quick replies.
I will test the water at the taps and keep an eye on the pressure gauge. lol, I should dig out the trail cams and put it on the gauge.

[MadPlumbarian]

Ok ok, I saw the plunger signal,  lol
Idk if you know how the system works? Also is the pump like cycling even without you turning it on? Or is it as soon as you turn a faucet on the pump turns on? It can be a few diff things, I’m kinda shocked with everything being new, yet something can be faulty eventhough it is new, yet it can also be something you didn’t mark down, so let me run a cycle by you so you can understand,

The pressure switch, (gray box) is set normally between 30/50psi, turns on as soon as the pressure drops below 30psi, thus turning the pump on, once the pressure of the system hits 50psi the switch turns off, now your whole system should be ready to go, the water should come up through a check valve so that none of the water flows back down and keep the pressure in the house, now the big blue tank has a rubber bladder, more or less just a ballon that is attached to that tire valve on the top of the tank, (I don’t remember what the psi on it should be but I want to say right below the low psi but don’t hold me to it) but the whole reason for it is two things, it acts as a shock absorber when that pump kicks on but also, when you open a faucet, your system is at 50psi, the bladder pushes pressure into the system and prevents it from turning on as soon as you open a faucet, without it as soon as you opened a faucet the pressure would drop fast enough that the pump would just kick on, the first thing I would do is turn the well off, and open a faucet letting all pressure out of the system and go over to the blue tank, take a tire pressure gauge and see if that valve on the top where the bladder would be has any pressure, if not just use a simple tire pump and put it up, if it doesn’t hold air then something’s wrong with either the valve, or if you get water there’s a hole in the bladder, but if it holds what you put in, either the pressure switch is not adjusted right or your check valve could be not working, it’s kinda hard doing everything by imagination, so check a few things after reading this and then put up another post, a pic would be great also, I’ll be off and on all day, hope this helps, from the bat plumber, lol if you need to, have the sergeant send out the plunger signal, lol, or just pm me, lol..

[JP]

Thank you for answering the Plunger call.
I will check the tanks pressure tonight and update.

I don't know how everything works in detail and the rundown is helpful

[MadPlumbarian]

No prob, if you have any other questions just ask away, it’s been awhile and some times it rough trying to run everything through the head without seeing it or hands on, but if you have any questions I’ll try to give you an answer, I’m on a few times a day..
JR

[Grant Lamontagne]

I'm Shatman.

 

Def

[MadPlumbarian]

Nice! I kinda like,,
JR

[JP]

Ok. Just had the water stop on me and then come back one within 5 seconds when the tap was left open. Flushed toilet and washing hands.

I left tap running, hot and cold, turned off water to the house. Ran lines empty. Checked pressure in bladder of tank ~45. Gauge read the same.

Turned house back on and taps are flowing. It has been running for 5minutes now and no cut out.

Just flushed and ran taps again and all is well.

The pump is in the well and I can't tell when it kicks on or off.

When the water does run out at the tap,it never sputter like air is trapped. They just lose pressure and flow reduces until nothing flows....wait a bit and comes back full force.

[Grant Lamontagne]

Loathe though I am to mention this because of the horrible images that come to mind, but....

Some time ago a friend of mine had problems with his well and pulled up the pump to find he and his family had been drinking and bathing in earwig filtered water because the foot valve was filled with the little smurfers.

Def

[MadPlumbarian]

It sounds as if your tank isn’t doing its job, yeah your pump is running, you know when because as you lose pressure and you have nothing then your pump kicks on to give you pressure then turns the pump off, till you lose pressure, the whole purpose of the tank and its bladder is to keep pressure on your system as the system drops from the 30/50psi, think of doing a push up, the pump is just energy to lift yourself up, your arms are tanks, if the pump was to run all the time you would be in an upright position the whole time, so the pump kicks lifting you upright, then the pump kicks off, as you start lowering it’s the tank giving the system pressure, till your nose hits the floor, then the pump kicks on making you go back into the upright positing, and then again, it turns off and the tank keeps pressure as you lower yourself, it’s the cycle, something sounds off,,
JR

[JP]

..... drinking and bathing in earwig filtered water.....
Def

Very possible. The old well cap was just a steel cap resting on the well. Friction fit with bolts, no gasket...sooooo earwigs and beyond are possible.

I have a tech coming in to service the water softener system tomorrow. I will try and get the crew that swapped the pressure tank to come back Wednesday.

I don't think the well is going dry.

[MadPlumbarian]

Interesting, check the pressures on the switch box, normally a 30/50psi, other times a 40/60psi for larger systems, but I might have an idea,,
JR

[JP]

The gauge on the pipe is reading 40psi. I don't see any other psi reading. On the little grey pressure switch box I don't see any psi markings anywhere....on the outside or underside when I take it off.

[MadPlumbarian]

The gauge on the pipe is reading 40psi. I don't see any other psi reading. On the little grey pressure switch box I don't see any psi markings anywhere....on the outside or underside when I take it off.

If the pressure on the pipe is saying 40 I’m going to guess that it’s a 30/50, now you did say that with no pressure on the system the tank measured 45lbs, normally those tanks are suppose to be lower the the low number of the switch, so if it’s a 30/50 the pressure on the tank should be like 28lbs,
The way to check to see what the switch is set at, normally there should be something letting you know maybe inside the cover, but if not, just grab a bucket and put it under the hose bib on the unit, start letting water out and watch the pressure gauge, as it drops watch to see how far it goes down, as soon as it stops and the system should have a little shake, even if your well is 100ft away the system should have the slightest shake, that’s your low, turn the bib off, then watch as the numbers go up, again as soon as it stops there should be a little shake that’s your high, depending on the box you might also hear a click, some make a noise when it turns on/off,
JR

[JP]

Update: Had a well tech come out today. Good amps to the pump, voltage a little high at 245.

Adjusted the pressure tank and took some pressure out of the bladder.

We couldn't trigger the water to stop flowing.

Hopefully that is the end of it and all the bits of earwig have been consumed.

[MadPlumbarian]

So alls good,,
JR

[JP]

So alls good,,
JR

So far, so good.... or is that good from afar?

[MadPlumbarian]

Sounds all good,,
JR