Australian Knife Laws

[Vidar]

You’re not going to have a problem carrying a larger knife or fixed blade if you’re out hunting or camping or similar, it’s in the city doing basic EDC that’s the issue.

I found this UK lawyer discussing a case of wearing multitool in public interesting:

Basically everyday carry in case some tool might be needed was not deemed by a court as good enough to reason to carry a multitool. Instead you should have a specific task in mind to justify carrying. (And presumably for the offending blade - not sure a task involving the file would justify wearing a multitool with knife).

He has some other relevant videos too. Although they are UK specific some of the legal logic behind might be similar elsewhere. In one he says police might try to ask leading questions as "You think this might be used as a weapon?" - a question one should sidestep.

[Valkie]

Sounds like we have a plan

Tbh I’m seriously thinking those of us in New South Wales need to get a petition or something happening

I totally get the need for teenagers not to be carrying 12” kitchen or hunting knives but it’s ridiculous we may get fined and presumably a conviction for carrying a 58mm SAK let alone a 91mm

It’s been reported on the news a number of times recently that knife crime has been steadily decreasing for the last 20 years but the pollies are under public pressure to do something.

It won’t make any difference to a criminal or teenager, they’ll carry on regardless but for the law abiding multi tool carrier it puts us in a really difficult position

In the UK you can carry a non locking folding knife under 3”, this seems a much better compromise. There’s no way we’re going to get something better than that but it does seem something to aim for

Thoughts?

My problem, and it is a problem.
Is that they are attacking the wrong thing.

Instead of attacking the problem (people being stabbed and threatened by large kitchen bladed knifes by criminals)

The put a blanket ban on ALL blades regardless of the legitimacy or innocence of the carrier.

If the existing laws were fully enforced and criminals were punished adequately, a blanket knife ban would be stupid.
And just carrying (or not) a knife does not make you dangerous or less threatening.

In the case a of a recent knife attack.
The attacker was brandishing and using a large carving knife (not a multitool or pocket knife)
When the weapon was knocked from his hand by a defender, he ran of and "somehow" managed to find another huge knife with which to threaten people.
This was in a shopping center.

It just so happens that there are a multitude of "knives" throughout every shopping center.
K Mart has them
Woolworths has them
Numerous kitchen product suppliers have them.
And most food preparation outlets have them.

So access to large knives is quite simple and easy.

But the grubberment says "lets go after everyone with a knife to show we mean business"

If anything this has made the use of knives Worse than before.

Where will it all end?

We are now given useless blunt, weak wooden knives to eat our meals with and wooden forks that cannot penetrate butter, let alone food.
We are made to feel like criminals all the time (all the better to control us)
Its a total joke.

Instead of targeting the innocent.
Make the law stand firm and PUNISH the ones using them illegally.

I can see a time when Martial Arts is made illegal.
when carrying a walking cane is illegal.
when we are no longer allowed to have knives at home (its already illegal to have one in the car)
Work tools will have to be registered
and the grubberment will have you completely under control.

[Echotech]

My problem, and it is a problem.
Is that they are attacking the wrong thing.

Instead of attacking the problem (people being stabbed and threatened by large kitchen bladed knifes by criminals)

The put a blanket ban on ALL blades regardless of the legitimacy or innocence of the carrier.

If the existing laws were fully enforced and criminals were punished adequately, a blanket knife ban would be stupid.
And just carrying (or not) a knife does not make you dangerous or less threatening.

In the case a of a recent knife attack.
The attacker was brandishing and using a large carving knife (not a multitool or pocket knife)
When the weapon was knocked from his hand by a defender, he ran of and "somehow" managed to find another huge knife with which to threaten people.
This was in a shopping center.

It just so happens that there are a multitude of "knives" throughout every shopping center.
K Mart has them
Woolworths has them
Numerous kitchen product suppliers have them.
And most food preparation outlets have them.

So access to large knives is quite simple and easy.

But the grubberment says "lets go after everyone with a knife to show we mean business"

If anything this has made the use of knives Worse than before.

Where will it all end?

We are now given useless blunt, weak wooden knives to eat our meals with and wooden forks that cannot penetrate butter, let alone food.
We are made to feel like criminals all the time (all the better to control us)
Its a total joke.

Instead of targeting the innocent.
Make the law stand firm and PUNISH the ones using them illegally.

I can see a time when Martial Arts is made illegal.
when carrying a walking cane is illegal.
when we are no longer allowed to have knives at home (its already illegal to have one in the car)
Work tools will have to be registered
and the grubberment will have you completely under control.

Yep, that’s it in a nutshell

[Farmer X]

K Mart has them
Woolworths has them

K-Mart and Woolworth's are still profitable in Australia?

And you're right: punish the fool, not the tool.

[ReamerPunch]

K-Mart and Woolworth's are still profitable in Australia?

And you're right: punish the fool, not the tool.

Woolworths made so much money they're getting sued.

[Farmer X]

They had quite the opposite problem in the States: they made so little money that they tanked!

[Huntsman]

Very, very, very different Woolworths in US, UK, SA and Aus -

They all share the same name but diverged from the parent decades ago

[ReamerPunch]

In Queensland the government introduced "Jack's Law", named after a 19yo kid who was stabbed in the city. It allows Police to use a metal detector on anyone they like in a safe night precinct or public transport hub. The police deploy at the transport hubs and wand EVERYONE. Anyone they find with a knife or Multitool they charge - even if they have a valid excuse for carrying one as set out in Queensland's knife laws. It's up to you then, to argue your case in court. In the one case I've read where that has happened, the prosecutor offered a deal of a guilty plea in exchange for a $100 fine and no criminal conviction recorded. I expect most people will take the deal as pleading innocent means spending extra on court fees and no guarantee that the judge will find in your favor. Apparently the father of Jack is going to NSW to try to convince the premier there to implement Jack's law, as it has been so successful in Queensland, based on them seizing 1000's on knives. In Queenslnad, they're also looking at extending the places where they can use Jack's law to shopping centres.

I can't help but feel that this is wrong, that the government is targeting innocent people who are lawfully carrying a knife, just to make it look like they're being "tough on knife crime". It feels almost like a dumb version of Minority report - where they try to arrest you for a crime that you might commit in future, by acting that if you're carrying a knife, you're automatically up to no good. https://mypolice.qld.gov.au/news/2024/03/28/morayfield-commuter-safety-crackdown/

Jack's Law will soon be implemented in Western Australia. There will be "designated knife wanding areas" like shopping centres, train stations, etc, and police can establish temporary ones, and will be able to search anyone, no concent required. If you are found to be carrying a knife, it's up to 3 years in prison, or $36k fine.

[Farmer X]

I'm all for doing something about crime, but "Jack's Law" takes the wrong approach. My preferred method would be this: you were found guilty, and a knife was used in commission of the crime? Boom, 10-20 years tacked on, just like that!

Those of you who have sent packages to me know I live in a big city. Some areas of that city are pretty sketchy. Banks in those areas often have two sets of doors you have to pass through before entering the lobby. One door locks behind you, and you get a quick scan with a metal detector. Though I've never had issues while carrying a pocket knife, I've always been resentful of those metal detectors. The same could be said of "wanding." If possible, I avoid such locations and circumstances.

I went through my previous posts and noted a point that I forgot to make. As long as I stick with manual folders whose blades are under three inches long, "I like it and I want to carry it" is all the "good cause" I need. I'm pretty fortunate in that regard.

[Vidar]

I want everybody with a sensible cause to be able to carry useful tools without being hassled. On the other hand I don't want baddies to be able to freely roam around with knives. And as even baddies are innocent until proven quilty (of already doing something) that will be after the fact and too late. Thus when politicians want to be proactive we end up with police having rights to search and question any sensible reasons for carry. Sadly it seems to me that what the law considers sensible carry doesn't actually cover what I and many others consider sensible - in the eagerness to sort out wannabe baddies they seem to sort out quite a few others too who actually have fair use.

Today we had some bizarre case over here with a guy going on a rampage with a hand saw and sawing some random person on a beach. I almost expect carrying saws in public to be banned next as a result. Not that it would have made any difference.