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question about alox finishes

buck · 46 · 5362

us Offline buck

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question about alox finishes
on: April 22, 2015, 11:36:03 AM
I would guess that the colors are anodizing on the aluminum scales and that every color other than silver will wear off carried in the pocket.

Is this a correct assumption? 
How much carry in the pocket with keys etc. does it take to start wearing the color/anodizing off?
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cy Offline dks

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #1 on: April 22, 2015, 11:40:47 AM
The silver also wears off but you do not notice it so much.

The anodisation is not that bad actually and is quite hard wearing, but if you drop the knife a lot or carry it in the same pocket as coins keys etc. it will wear off at some point in some places, after a few years..

now we wait for the experts   :D
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us Offline buck

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #2 on: April 22, 2015, 11:59:08 AM
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wales Offline magentus

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #3 on: April 22, 2015, 12:04:35 PM
I would guess that the colors are anodizing on the aluminum scales and that every color other than silver will wear off carried in the pocket.

Is this a correct assumption? 
How much carry in the pocket with keys etc. does it take to start wearing the color/anodizing off?

As far as I know Victorinox just anodise which will begin to wear quite quickly, but Syph007, one of our modders here is now hard anodising which I guess reduces the wear and tear.

I imagine Syph will be along soon to give you actual facts rather than guesswork.
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cy Offline dks

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #4 on: April 22, 2015, 12:06:15 PM
I think the owner of the picture is a member here too. I do not think he will mind.

Some people like the worn out look of coloured alox.

Personally I only use the silver ones as I do not like that look and many of the coloured ones are also limited runs and more expensive (you pay for the exclusivity)
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cy Offline dks

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #5 on: April 22, 2015, 12:08:24 PM
I think the anodising used is hardened. I remember reading that it is actually harder than the blade of the knife or around the same. I think it was at the Victorinox site.
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us Offline SAK Guy

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #6 on: April 22, 2015, 02:50:10 PM
- Robert




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wales Offline hiraethus

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #7 on: April 22, 2015, 03:09:11 PM
Anodising is an electrolytic process, using acids and electricity, that creates an aluminium oxide (alumina) layer on the surface of the aluminium.  While aluminium oxide is itself very hard and is used as an abrasive or bearing surface because of this, on an anodised part the layer is very thin.  Typically this layer is only 10 to 30 µm (0.0004 to 0.0012 in) thick or up to 150 µm (0.006 in) for hard anodising, also known as type III anodising.

The anodising is fragile and wears off not only because it's a thin layer, but also because it's a brittle material on top of a relatively soft surface that is easy to damage (the aluminium itself).  That said, the anodising on Victorinox Alox scales does seem to be particularly easy to damage.  Certainly that on my Fenix torches, which are subject to the same conditions as my knives, holds up much better.

The colour is actually dye which is added to the porous aluminium oxide layer after the electrolysis but before the final sealing process.  Aluminium oxide is actually silvery-white in colour.


ca Offline Syph007

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #8 on: April 22, 2015, 03:18:11 PM
The stock victorinox anodize is thin and very fragile yes.  This is especially true on the inner edges that are sharp.  The standard to anodize parts and have them look good is to round all edges to a minimum 1/32" roundover.  If they are left sharp they will never coat well since the alox cells grow perpendicular to the surface.

The hard anodize I get done is actually a harder finish ( the cells are closer together in the surface matrix ).  Hard does not mean strong though and it will still chip and succumb to the softer underneath Aluminum if dropped.

But to get the hard anodized finish to have a all over worn look will take significanly longer if pocket carried compared to stock.  Ive been doing this 4 years now and noone yet has a pocket worn one where the color is only left in the recesses.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2015, 03:19:35 PM by Syph007 »
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00 Offline kosmo

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #9 on: April 22, 2015, 03:29:44 PM
The stock victorinox anodize is thin and very fragile yes.  This is especially true on the inner edges that are sharp.  The standard to anodize parts and have them look good is to round all edges to a minimum 1/32" roundover.  If they are left sharp they will never coat well since the alox cells grow perpendicular to the surface.

The hard anodize I get done is actually a harder finish ( the cells are closer together in the surface matrix ).  Hard does not mean strong though and it will still chip and succumb to the softer underneath Aluminum if dropped.

But to get the hard anodized finish to have a all over worn look will take significanly longer if pocket carried compared to stock.  Ive been doing this 4 years now and noone yet has a pocket worn one where the color is only left in the recesses.

I use to work with equipment made with 6061 and 7075 aluminum.  They would hold up well with hard black anodizing.  But will probably be more expensive too.  I'm not sure how well these do with color anodizing.
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us Offline SAK Guy

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #10 on: April 22, 2015, 03:58:21 PM
I'll just leave this here.......  :D

- Robert




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us Offline Aloha

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #11 on: April 22, 2015, 04:32:16 PM
I have nothing to add other than I like both worn and minty fresh alox.  Sakguy has the best looking worn alox pics which really made me appreciate the look. 
IMG_6645.jpg
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IMG_7496.jpg
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us Offline SAK Guy

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #12 on: April 22, 2015, 04:46:16 PM
Thanks Aloha!  Nice ALOX pics btw!!  :2tu:
- Robert




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us Offline buck

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #13 on: April 22, 2015, 04:47:56 PM
I'm curious what other worn colors look like, especially silver, dark gray, and gold.

I'd be obliged if anyone has pictures to share.
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us Offline Aloha

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #14 on: April 22, 2015, 04:53:43 PM
Thanks Aloha!  Nice ALOX pics btw!!  :2tu:

You da man  :tu:

I'm curious what other worn colors look like, especially silver, dark gray, and gold.

I'd be obliged if anyone has pictures to share.

I dont think silver really shows wear like the color but here is my 79 Soldier
IMG_6503.jpg
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us Offline sawman

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #15 on: April 22, 2015, 05:00:57 PM
Or you could always get a Syph custom with to my info a little bit better coating.
SAW


ro Offline Corwyn

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #16 on: April 22, 2015, 05:05:42 PM
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us Offline SAK Guy

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #17 on: April 22, 2015, 05:48:20 PM
It's funny, I have older red ALOX that look nearly new but have chips along the edges (like Syph said), older ones that are evenly well worn and then my orig ALOX, bought new in '82-'83, daily carried and used fairly heavily (even hammered finishing nails/tacks with the spine) for 20+ years and it still looks pretty good. Still tight and snappy too! :2tu:



I think the hardness might be batch specific on some of the older ones.

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cy Offline dks

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #18 on: April 22, 2015, 06:21:59 PM
Here are a few including a new orange and a (bought) used orange (well, copper) knife, as well as a plain black one.

The 2nd from the left has been carried regularly by me for over  a year and has been dropped several times, but, apart from a chip on the edge of the alox from a drop on asphalt it still looks new.

I generally do not have coins in my pockets and try to keep the knife in a different pocket from the keys. No other precautions are taken by me.

I wonder how people manage to get a worn look so quickly.  :D Maybe it is like "worn look" blue jeans or forced patina - some people actually try to get the look by intentionally carrying the knife with coins or rubbing it  :rofl:
IMG_20150422_190106.jpg
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« Last Edit: April 22, 2015, 06:23:08 PM by dks »
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nz Offline zoidberg

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #19 on: April 22, 2015, 11:52:29 PM
Thanks Aloha!  Nice ALOX pics btw!!  :2tu:

You da man  :tu:

I'm curious what other worn colors look like, especially silver, dark gray, and gold.

I'd be obliged if anyone has pictures to share.

I dont think silver really shows wear like the color but here is my 79 Soldier

If you ever change your mind I call dibs.  :whistle:


us Offline Aloha

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #20 on: April 23, 2015, 12:02:43 AM
Thanks Aloha!  Nice ALOX pics btw!!  :2tu:

You da man  :tu:

I'm curious what other worn colors look like, especially silver, dark gray, and gold.

I'd be obliged if anyone has pictures to share.

I dont think silver really shows wear like the color but here is my 79 Soldier

If you ever change your mind I call dibs.  :whistle:

You Sir have perpetual dibs  :tu:

@Corwyn and DKS those are some beauties gents  :salute:
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us Offline Gadget Guy

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #21 on: April 23, 2015, 12:28:09 AM
I know I'm a little strange ( :rofl:), but I actually like my alox knives to have wear. To me it makes the knife seem like a favorite pair of jeans.  :tu:

To answer the original question, it depends... I've had some alox knives lose their finish fairly quickly when I have a bunch of stuff in my pockets. Other knives I baby a little bit and carry them alone and those knives have very little wear. If I was worried about a special knife I'd probably get a case for it.   :tu:
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us Offline buck

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #22 on: April 23, 2015, 01:00:37 AM
http://forum.multitool.org/index.php?topic=33222.0

I love this little green guy.  So much character.
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us Offline Aloha

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #23 on: April 23, 2015, 01:18:02 AM
http://forum.multitool.org/index.php?topic=33222.0

I love this little green guy.  So much character.

Very nice.  I love those SAKs that are put back into service.
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us Offline scattergun13

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #24 on: April 23, 2015, 01:52:50 AM
If someone wanted to distress the finish on an Alox, how would they go about it. Aside from normal carry and pocket wear. I wouldn't mind trying it on one of my doubles.

Stew...
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nz Offline zoidberg

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #25 on: April 23, 2015, 01:56:42 AM
If someone wanted to distress the finish on an Alox, how would they go about it. Aside from normal carry and pocket wear. I wouldn't mind trying it on one of my doubles.

Stew...

Rub it on a brick or with some worn sandpaper maybe.  :think:  The alox that is mate.  ;)


us Offline scattergun13

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #26 on: April 23, 2015, 02:17:40 AM
If someone wanted to distress the finish on an Alox, how would they go about it. Aside from normal carry and pocket wear. I wouldn't mind trying it on one of my doubles.

Stew...

Rub it on a brick or with some worn sandpaper maybe.  :think:  The alox that is mate.  ;)

Thank you for clarifying. I was about to seriously damage myself then go see if the finish on my Alox had changed any.  :rofl:
" If it was built by matt2silver then I want2buy it...


nz Offline zoidberg

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #27 on: April 23, 2015, 02:23:24 AM
If someone wanted to distress the finish on an Alox, how would they go about it. Aside from normal carry and pocket wear. I wouldn't mind trying it on one of my doubles.

Stew...

Rub it on a brick or with some worn sandpaper maybe.  :think:  The alox that is mate.  ;)

Thank you for clarifying. I was about to seriously damage myself then go see if the finish on my Alox had changed any.  :rofl:
  :D


us Offline Gadget Guy

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #28 on: April 23, 2015, 02:25:25 AM
If someone wanted to distress the finish on an Alox, how would they go about it. Aside from normal carry and pocket wear. I wouldn't mind trying it on one of my doubles.

Stew...

I would start with very fine steel wool (0000) and work up from there. A well worn scotchbrite pad would do the trick as well.  :tu:
Sometimes change is a good thing, other times not so much!


ca Offline Syph007

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Re: question about alox finishes
Reply #29 on: April 23, 2015, 02:26:20 AM
If someone wanted to distress the finish on an Alox, how would they go about it. Aside from normal carry and pocket wear. I wouldn't mind trying it on one of my doubles.

Stew...

Rub it on a brick or with some worn sandpaper maybe.  :think:  The alox that is mate.  ;)

Thank you for clarifying. I was about to seriously damage myself then go see if the finish on my Alox had changed any.  :rofl:
(Image removed from quote.)  :D

If you want to naturally age them, I suppose you could put them in a bag with keys, coins and other stuff pockets have, and shake until happy. :D
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