Wruw :)

[jalind]

Tissot T-Trend Quadrato Mechanical Chronograph

T005.514.11.061.00
ETA (Valjoux) 7750

Tissot's "T-Trend" line no longer exists. Tissot follows fashion trends more than some other brands and their collections evolve faster. The T-Trend collection came and went after a few years as part of that. Tissot made the Quadratto in both quartz and mechanical models, muddying the waters in trying to find a mechanical. A low price wa the usual indicator of quartz but knowing the reference number(s) for the mechanical is definitive. The quartz version of this chronograph with an ETA G10.211 inside had a street price of about $300 USD new. The Valjoux 7750 was at least several times that. It's easy to tell the chronographs apart if you know where the subdials should be. The quartz has them at the 10-2-6. A straightforward 7750 has its subdials at 6-9-12 with day/date at the 3. The T-Trend line was discontinued a number of years ago and everything I've seen online is "out of stock" now.



The one downside to this specific design is the crown being set down between the pusher and it's decagonal with no knurling. Not as easy to wind the movement as with more accessible crowns. There is a "nail nick" formed into the case below it that isn't obvious until you look, but that helps pull the crown out to set day/date and time.



Dial work and hands have dimensional, texture and pattern subtleties that don't reveal themselves until one lets light play across it watching the highlights shift and change.



It is, as one can see from the side, a chunky watch by necessity to house the tall 7750 movement, and it's not a lightweight either with a square case. The mass of the head would be particularly noticeable on a leather strap. The bracelet helps to counterbalance it even though it adds to overall mass.

There was some talk that the Tissot Quadrato models within their (former) T-Trend line were inspired by Breaking Bad and the Monaco chronograph White was given. Not so. The Quadrato watches pre-dated that, following a fashion trend with square and rectangular watch cases that came and went as such trends usually do. Wait long enough and the square case will return. In the meantime I will continue to enjoy the visual beauty of its case shape with the dial and hands in particular. I'm not a chronograph aficionado although I've got a few. Pursued finding this one as it was visually more interesting to me than the 3-hand with date version housing an ETA 2824-2 inside.
 
John

[twiliter]

More nice ones John! 

I think you have more watches than I have SAKs! 

Here's my one watch again, keeping good time. Vic lists this as weighing 96.3g, and the titanium doesn't bother my skin in the least. The paracord strap is way more comfy than I ever expected, and it's easy to adjust when my wrist shrinks or swells, depending on what I'm doing (or not doing), or if I get it wet (the strap shrinks a small amount). I have fallen asleep with it on, so it's super wearable, which is the one thing I wanted (aside from legibility, watches that are hard to read hold no appeal for me). I probably overshot the mark for having a single watch, I'm happy with it, but I read that Vic will be releasing the INOX automatic in October. I will be interested in that, but if they don't offer it in titanium, I'll probably pass, this one is fine with me. 

[jalind]

More nice ones John! 

I think you have more watches than I have SAKs! 

Here's my one watch again, keeping good time. Vic lists this as weighing 96.3g, and the titanium doesn't bother my skin in the least. The paracord strap is way more comfy than I ever expected, and it's easy to adjust when my wrist shrinks or swells, depending on what I'm doing (or not doing), or if I get it wet (the strap shrinks a small amount). I have fallen asleep with it on, so it's super wearable, which is the one thing I wanted (aside from legibility, watches that are hard to read hold no appeal for me). I probably overshot the mark for having a single watch, I'm happy with it, but I read that Vic will be releasing the INOX automatic in October. I will be interested in that, but if they don't offer it in titanium, I'll probably pass, this one is fine with me. 

Thanks!
Did you see my answer to your question about the Seiko above?
About 2x the weight of your INOX, some of which is the steel bracelet.
Gave the weight of a few others for comparison.

I do have a few watches and usually wear nearly all of them in rotation. Hadn't been for a while but started again. Mechanicals, in general, are heavier than the equivalent quartz due to the movements, including the materials they're made of. Quartz use a good amount of plastic as the movement isn't undergoing the stress of a mainspring.

Very nice Vic INOX Ti 
I like its hour markings combined with the chapter ring for minutes and seconds. It's uncluttered making it very easy to read quickly.

I don't have any Titanium watches but have handled a few and they're extremely light compared to steel or precious metals. A heavy watch on my wrist doesn't bother me, not nearly as much as one that's very large and doesn't wear well. My one Invicta that I half regret buying has mediocre fit and finish on the case and terrible fit and finish on the steel bracelet. Had to spend significant amount of time putting a very small chamfer to round the edges of the links.

John

[twiliter]

I saw that John, thanks. I don't know what a watch twice as heavy would be like because I have no experience with it, but I would think I could get used to it. I think if I started with a G Shock, that mine would feel heavy too, all about what you're used to probably. I just wonder how heavy I could go without feeling like I needed something on the other wrist to balance it out. 

[twiliter]

Also, I have never swam down more than 4 or 5 meters, so the 200m dive rating is overkill for me. I don't scuba dive, so I don't see the point of that much water resistance personally. I have flown at very high altitudes, but in a pressurized cabin, so that's overkill too. So I suppose if I ever fell out of an airplane at extreme altitude over the Mariana trench and sank to 200 meters my watch would survive (if they ever found me).  I guess it's a good selling point seeing how many dive watches there are. It's like the cap crimper MTs, how many do they make vs. how many people really need one... 

I must admit dive watches are way cooler than cap crimper MTs though. 

[jalind]

Also, I have never swam down more than 4 or 5 meters, so the 200m dive rating is overkill for me. I don't scuba dive, so I don't see the point of that much water resistance personally. I have flown at very high altitudes, but in a pressurized cabin, so that's overkill too. So I suppose if I ever fell out of an airplane at extreme altitude over the Mariana trench and sank to 200 meters my watch would survive (if they ever found me).  I guess it's a good selling point seeing how many dive watches there are. It's like the cap crimper MTs, how many do they make vs. how many people really need one... 

I must admit dive watches are way cooler than cap crimper MTs though. 

Similar to some of my thoughts regarding dive watches. If I fall overboard and it's heavy enough it will pull me down into the deep, unable to surface and in my panic, unable to get it off my wrist. When they finally recover my remains, the watch will still be fully functional, having survived what I did not. 

Helium Release Valves:
I am amused when I see helium release valves on watches and office "Desk Divers" wearing them. Few who own a dive watch with one understand what it's for unless they've been around commercial deep diving operations. Only those doing professional saturation diving to extreme depths and living in a sealed accommodation chamber pressurized for that depth for days or weeks at a time would ever need one. A large pressurized hyperbaric chamber is maintained on the surface, or an ambient one is maintained at the working depth under water. It has everything needed for a crew to live for days or weeks at a time. The chamber is slowly pressurized to their planned underwater working depth and it's maintained for the duration of days or weeks the crew will be working at that depth. From a surface chamber system, the diving crew using a large pressurized diving bell they enter through a transfer chamber to descend and ascend from their working depth under water which can be done quite rapidly as there is no compression or decompression taking place. At the end of their work tour, which can be days or weeks, they start dry decompression to sea level in their pressurized accommodation chamber. This can take several days if they've been working very deep. It's called saturation diving because the air is a special mix of oxygen, hydrogen and helium. The watch will have very slowly taken on helium around its gaskets in the environment in which they were living. If it weren't allowed to escape from the watch through that valve, it could blow the crystal off the watch and that phenomenon is what led to the helium valve being put on watches for saturation diving. All he screw-down for it does is enable the valve to operate when the pressure inside the watch exceeds pressure outside the watch, it could blow the crystal off the watch. The valve itself is weaker than the rest of the watch case so it's kept shut (screwed down) unless it's actually being used during dry decompression. Some watches have bezel, crystal and gasket designs that eliminate the need for a helium valve. A commercial diver doing deep dives for short periods using wet compression and decompression during the dive itself would never need or use one.

More about saturation diving here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saturation_diving

John

[jalind]

Xezo Air Commando GMT
21j ETA 2893-2

Xezo is a small company based in Texas that specializes in sunglasses, pens and watches for men. They have offered some leather goods in the past. Their watches are made for them by a company in Switzerland, and the pens by a company in Germany, to specs from the company in Texas. This kind of arrangement is often referred to as "Private Label" and finding out exactly who in Switzerland is making them for Xezo can be difficult as it's usually protected by non-disclosure agreements. The company is in Lengnau but there are a number of Swiss watch companies located there and I wouldn't try to hazard a guess.

This GMT is powered by an ETA 2893-2, a 2892A2 with a 4th central 24-hour GMT hand and date display. The 2892A2 is generally considered a step up from the 2824 family as it's a newer design and tends to be used in more expensive timepieces, but for all practical purposes it isn't much of one in most applications. The 2892A2 is used as a base movement (ebauche) for many prestige and luxury watches, such as Omega, onto which they place their own in-house parts to complete the movement (typically proprietary regulating mechanisms and/or complications). ETA only offers three grades in the 2892 family, omitting the lowest, basic one available for the 2824 family.



It's called an Air Commando as the chapter ring and bezel allow for performing a timing function in the manner used prior to the development of the chronograph stopwatch type complication. The additional screw-down crown at the ten allows rotating the chapter ring numbered 1-12 in light blue. The bezel is numbered in minutes with unidirectional rotation. Elapsed time can be measured by aligning the main index of the hour chapter ring with the main hour hand for elapsed hours, and the index on the bezel for elapsed minutes by aligning it with the main minutes hand. Long distance flight plans generally have several legs to follow at different compass headings for different distances. At a known ground speed, the amount of time to be flown at the heading for each leg can be calculated. Some chronographs, such as the Soviet Poljot Shturmanskie, used a combination of stopwatch mechanism for elapsed minutes (in 30 minute increments) and a rotating chapter ring to measure elapsed hours. The method used with this watch is definitely old-school.

The fourth, 24-hour hand is used with the smaller 1-24 indices in red Arabic and can be set independently of the main 12-hour time. It would ostensibly be set to GMT for navigation purposes as that would be used with a sextant for calculating longitude. At one time, sextants were carried and used by navigators in long-distance aircraft. The C-141 military cargo jet had a sextant dome above the flight deck when they were built (I flew in one that still had it). AFIK, they've all been capped over now. The rotating 12-hour chapter ring can be used for a third time zone if desired.



The silver dial has a very nice guilloche pattern, but unlike the Rotary, this one is not engine turned. It appears to be stamped into the dial with some three dimensional scalloped depth to give it the appearance of an engine turned dial. Likewise, the blue hands are colored to have the appearance of flame or furnace blued hands. Sapphire crystal has an AR coating on the underside. The result is a retro style and function using modern materials and movement.

This was my first true GMT watch. Xezo still makes an Air Commando line, but only the GMT has an ETA 2893-2, and its price reflects that. The other, non-GMT mechanical have Miyota 9015 movements inside and all but one of the chronographs are all Ronda quartz movements. The one model with a Valjoux 7750 inside is obvious from the dial layout and its very high price. Xezo is one of the companies that felt the squeeze as ETA started reducing supply of movements, the 2824 family in particular, to companies outside the Swatch Group. Xezo has watches made in limited edition batches. This one is #30 of 500 total. If the line is continued, a change is made to the design or style to differentiate it from prior editions.

John

[McStitchy]

Tissot T-Trend Quadrato Mechanical Chronograph

T005.514.11.061.00
ETA (Valjoux) 7750

Tissot's "T-Trend" line no longer exists. Tissot follows fashion trends more than some other brands and their collections evolve faster. The T-Trend collection came and went after a few years as part of that. Tissot made the Quadratto in both quartz and mechanical models, muddying the waters in trying to find a mechanical. A low price wa the usual indicator of quartz but knowing the reference number(s) for the mechanical is definitive. The quartz version of this chronograph with an ETA G10.211 inside had a street price of about $300 USD new. The Valjoux 7750 was at least several times that. It's easy to tell the chronographs apart if you know where the subdials should be. The quartz has them at the 10-2-6. A straightforward 7750 has its subdials at 6-9-12 with day/date at the 3. The T-Trend line was discontinued a number of years ago and everything I've seen online is "out of stock" now.

(Image removed from quote.)

The one downside to this specific design is the crown being set down between the pusher and it's decagonal with no knurling. Not as easy to wind the movement as with more accessible crowns. There is a "nail nick" formed into the case below it that isn't obvious until you look, but that helps pull the crown out to set day/date and time.

(Image removed from quote.)

Dial work and hands have dimensional, texture and pattern subtleties that don't reveal themselves until one lets light play across it watching the highlights shift and change.

(Image removed from quote.)

It is, as one can see from the side, a chunky watch by necessity to house the tall 7750 movement, and it's not a lightweight either with a square case. The mass of the head would be particularly noticeable on a leather strap. The bracelet helps to counterbalance it even though it adds to overall mass.

There was some talk that the Tissot Quadrato models within their (former) T-Trend line were inspired by Breaking Bad and the Monaco chronograph White was given. Not so. The Quadrato watches pre-dated that, following a fashion trend with square and rectangular watch cases that came and went as such trends usually do. Wait long enough and the square case will return. In the meantime I will continue to enjoy the visual beauty of its case shape with the dial and hands in particular. I'm not a chronograph aficionado although I've got a few. Pursued finding this one as it was visually more interesting to me than the 3-hand with date version housing an ETA 2824-2 inside.
 
John

That watch carries a lot of character.
The chunky appearence suits it well 

[McStitchy]

Also, I have never swam down more than 4 or 5 meters, so the 200m dive rating is overkill for me. I don't scuba dive, so I don't see the point of that much water resistance personally. I have flown at very high altitudes, but in a pressurized cabin, so that's overkill too. So I suppose if I ever fell out of an airplane at extreme altitude over the Mariana trench and sank to 200 meters my watch would survive (if they ever found me).  I guess it's a good selling point seeing how many dive watches there are. It's like the cap crimper MTs, how many do they make vs. how many people really need one... 

I must admit dive watches are way cooler than cap crimper MTs though. 

Similar to some of my thoughts regarding dive watches. If I fall overboard and it's heavy enough it will pull me down into the deep, unable to surface and in my panic, unable to get it off my wrist. When they finally recover my remains, the watch will still be fully functional, having survived what I did not. 

Helium Release Valves:
I am amused when I see helium release valves on watches and office "Desk Divers" wearing them. Few who own a dive watch with one understand what it's for unless they've been around commercial deep diving operations. Only those doing professional saturation diving to extreme depths and living in a sealed accommodation chamber pressurized for that depth for days or weeks at a time would ever need one. A large pressurized hyperbaric chamber is maintained on the surface, or an ambient one is maintained at the working depth under water. It has everything needed for a crew to live for days or weeks at a time. The chamber is slowly pressurized to their planned underwater working depth and it's maintained for the duration of days or weeks the crew will be working at that depth. From a surface chamber system, the diving crew using a large pressurized diving bell they enter through a transfer chamber to descend and ascend from their working depth under water which can be done quite rapidly as there is no compression or decompression taking place. At the end of their work tour, which can be days or weeks, they start dry decompression to sea level in their pressurized accommodation chamber. This can take several days if they've been working very deep. It's called saturation diving because the air is a special mix of oxygen, hydrogen and helium. The watch will have very slowly taken on helium around its gaskets in the environment in which they were living. If it weren't allowed to escape from the watch through that valve, it could blow the crystal off the watch and that phenomenon is what led to the helium valve being put on watches for saturation diving. All he screw-down for it does is enable the valve to operate when the pressure inside the watch exceeds pressure outside the watch, it could blow the crystal off the watch. The valve itself is weaker than the rest of the watch case so it's kept shut (screwed down) unless it's actually being used during dry decompression. Some watches have bezel, crystal and gasket designs that eliminate the need for a helium valve. A commercial diver doing deep dives for short periods using wet compression and decompression during the dive itself would never need or use one.

More about saturation diving here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saturation_diving

John

A treat to read John, even I understood it 

[jalind]

Tissot T-Trend Quadrato Mechanical Chronograph

T005.514.11.061.00
ETA (Valjoux) 7750

Tissot's "T-Trend" line no longer exists. Tissot follows fashion trends more than some other brands and their collections evolve faster. The T-Trend collection came and went after a few years as part of that. Tissot made the Quadratto in both quartz and mechanical models, muddying the waters in trying to find a mechanical. A low price wa the usual indicator of quartz but knowing the reference number(s) for the mechanical is definitive. The quartz version of this chronograph with an ETA G10.211 inside had a street price of about $300 USD new. The Valjoux 7750 was at least several times that. It's easy to tell the chronographs apart if you know where the subdials should be. The quartz has them at the 10-2-6. A straightforward 7750 has its subdials at 6-9-12 with day/date at the 3. The T-Trend line was discontinued a number of years ago and everything I've seen online is "out of stock" now.

(Image removed from quote.)

The one downside to this specific design is the crown being set down between the pusher and it's decagonal with no knurling. Not as easy to wind the movement as with more accessible crowns. There is a "nail nick" formed into the case below it that isn't obvious until you look, but that helps pull the crown out to set day/date and time.

(Image removed from quote.)

Dial work and hands have dimensional, texture and pattern subtleties that don't reveal themselves until one lets light play across it watching the highlights shift and change.

(Image removed from quote.)

It is, as one can see from the side, a chunky watch by necessity to house the tall 7750 movement, and it's not a lightweight either with a square case. The mass of the head would be particularly noticeable on a leather strap. The bracelet helps to counterbalance it even though it adds to overall mass.

There was some talk that the Tissot Quadrato models within their (former) T-Trend line were inspired by Breaking Bad and the Monaco chronograph White was given. Not so. The Quadrato watches pre-dated that, following a fashion trend with square and rectangular watch cases that came and went as such trends usually do. Wait long enough and the square case will return. In the meantime I will continue to enjoy the visual beauty of its case shape with the dial and hands in particular. I'm not a chronograph aficionado although I've got a few. Pursued finding this one as it was visually more interesting to me than the 3-hand with date version housing an ETA 2824-2 inside.
 
John

That watch carries a lot of character.
The chunky appearence suits it well 

Thanks
That's exactly what attracted me to the chronograph model in particular.


There isn't much else around like it unless you consider the current Tag Heuer "Monaco" which is a replica of the original Heuer Monaco made famous by Steve McQueen in the 1971 film, Le Mans. The Tag Heuer has a completely different dial layout, and its crown is on the left with the pushers on the right. Only resemblance to the Tissot is the square case shape.

Tissot is one of the eighteen watch companies that are part of the Swatch Group. It's in the middle tier alongside Hamilton, Mido, Certina and a couple others. Below them is a basic tier. Above them is a high tier, and above that is the prestige and luxury tier. There are two very large groups in Switzerland among numerous smaller ones and independent companies. The Richemont Group is the other big one with another eighteen watch companies under its umbrella, the most well-know of which is Officine Panerai.

John

[twiliter]

Swatch owns ETA also. I would like to see Vic use the Ronda R150 mechanical in the new INOX automatic, that would be very cool, get away from the common (but proven) 2824. The only watch I can find that uses the R150 is the Shinola Lake Erie Monster, of which they sold all of the 500 available, and it's also a dive watch (and kinda pricey).  I hope more choices for that movement become available. Will be interesting to see. 

Not sure what to make of the Shinola watches, but the name makes me think of shoe polish, like the kind we don't know smurf from. 

[jalind]

Orient Voyager Dual Time (GMT)
DH01002D
21j 48K41 hacking

One look and those who know slide-rule watches may think this one is another aviation E-6B slide-rule, but it's not. Aviation slide-rules will have index marks for fuel and oil quantity conversions, and feet to meters along with the statute miles, nautical miles and kilometers conversion indices found on this one. Aptly named "Voyager" by Orient, it's more of a traveler's watch with the slide rule set up for speed and distance conversions. A step up from much of Orient's basic watches, this one has sapphire crystal and a very nicely decorated movement. It's on the verge of being an Orient Star and probably would be if the movement could be hand wound, the one downside of the 48K41 movement. It is an evolutionary improvement on Orient's 46 family maintaining the power reserve indicator below the 12 and the date subdial just above the 6.



The second screw-down crown at the 4 operates the slide rule. It must be unscrewed and allowed to pop out before it can be turned. As with nearly all Orient watches, the crowns are signed with an Orient logo. Second time zone is set much as one would on a GMT watch with the main crown in the second position. One direction advances the date and the other advances the second 24-hour time displayed in the window at the 3. This makes it a different from the typical four-hand GMT, but those who have seen a World Time will recognize it's using the same WT mechanism to drive the 24-hour wheel.



As is typical of Orient, the lume is extremely bright.



From a practical standpoint one can use the slide rule, but it requires good sharp eyes or good glasses. Yet another of my numerous GMT and World Time watches.

John

[jalind]

Swatch owns ETA also. I would like to see Vic use the Ronda R150 mechanical in the new INOX automatic, that would be very cool, get away from the common (but proven) 2824. The only watch I can find that uses the R150 is the Shinola Lake Erie Monster, of which they sold all of the 500 available, and it's also a dive watch (and kinda pricey).  I hope more choices for that movement become available. Will be interesting to see. 

Not sure what to make of the Shinola watches, but the name makes me think of shoe polish, like the kind we don't know smurf from. 

Shinola:
They are a designer micro-brand based in Detroit Michigan. I hadn't seen any mechanicals from them, only quartz, and their prices on those are higher than I would pay for quartz. They are discounted on Amazon but not enough for me to buy one. Shinola has been making - or assembling - their own quartz movements in-house, with at least some Swiss parts (from Ronda ?? they obviously don't state). Didn't know about the R-150 Shinola until you mentioned it. Its price is much too high for a basic 3-hand mechanical watch from a designer brand with the brand recognition they have. They're not considered a prestige brand although it's apparent they're striving to become one (a very difficult task). I am excited to see alternatives to ETA, however, and watching what happens with the Ronda will be interesting. The price on a R-150 movement is allegedly about 60 CHF (Swiss Francs), which isn't much off from the going price for Sellita SW200-1 or ETA 2824-2 movements. Just saw them on Alibaba for $80 USD albeit with a minimum order quantity; someone is making a modest amount reselling them. ETA movements end up in gray market resale like this after a company buys more than they need to get a quantity price break, and then sells out the excess on places like Alibaba. It's one of the major paths by which high quality high-beat Swiss mechanical movements end up in the higher end luxury watch counterfeits that sell for $300 USD (as compared to the $25 quartz Rolex Submariner fake that can be readily found in downtown Matamoros, Mexico).

I'm also waiting to see what happens with some of the other movements that have emerged:

• Eterna caliber 39, a movement designed for modularity integrated into the movement, allowing the base ebauche to be built into a variety of variations and complications, instead of being designed for stack-on modules such as the ETA 2892A2. The irony, if you didn't know it, is Eterna created ETA, the movement company. That's where the name ETA came from. As the industry collapsed, the forerunner of The Swatch Group picked up ETA and pulled various other movement companies into them, including Peseux, A. Schild, Valjoux, and Unitas, some calibers of which survive to this day. I don't believe any of A.Schild's made the cut, but if you ever buy a vintage Rado made before ETA absorbed A.Schild, odds are it has an A.Schild movement inside. They were a major competitor with ETA.
• Soprod A-10, which seems to be targeted to the prestige watch companies, such as Stowa (Pforzheim, Deutschland).
• Horage K-1 which is funded (I believe in part) by - of all things - a Kickstarter campaign. A key Horage player was behind the modularity concept for the Eterna Caliber 39 movement and it shows in the K-1.

Developing a reliable, durable, precision mechanical movement capable of high accuracy is expensive and the knowledge of how to go about it for a high volume production workhorse is a Black Art known only to a small number globally. This is why there hasn't been much development since the 1970's when quartz just about killed off the mechanical watch, the Swiss ones in particular.

Another US micro-brand, Xetum, is in the San Francisco Bay area:
https://www.xetum.com/
They have a very limited range of models, but what they do have is interesting. They are automatics with the two most expensive lines housing ETA movements, and the least expensive housing the Miyota high beat 9015. Their pricing is also high, but IMO not nearly as severe as the Shilola quartz, although the prices on their Miyota 9015 powered are more than I would pay. They're a micro-brand with not much more than their brick and mortar store in the SF Bay area and their online storefront. Xetum's ETA powered are in line with brands just below the prestige market. The problem is inability to get discounted prices like one can for other brands.

I'm not that big a fan of quartz although I have a few, but it's very few compared to the mechanical. I'm a retired US Army major with 21 years service. Got one of the first Texas Instruments LED watches about 1977 or 1978. Ran through batteries like smurf through a goose. Also had one of the first LCD watches that had tritium back lighting for nighttime viewing. Still have that one although the H3 has long since gone dead (half life of H3 is 10 years). Got one of the Seiko SQ in 1980 with a higher than normal accuracy jeweled movement approved for railroad use; their SQ line was as cut above their normal quartz watches. The second hand started double-ticking the low battery warning while I was deployed to the middle of nowhere. Immediately found a mechanical and used it for the duration of that expedition. Never relied on a quartz again while in the military although I maintained a couple for dress use at semi-formal and formal events. That mechanical, made by Hamilton, had to be returned as it belonged to the US Gov't, not me. I bought my own, which I could do (had to store receipt in safe place to prove it was mine), and soon bought a second one as backup.

The problem with quartz for a military watch is the battery running out of electrons in the middle of the wilderness in some Godforsaken 3rd World country. Can't get a watch battery. Even if you could get one, you don't want to be muddling around removing a screw down watch back without a proper case wrench and a very clean dust-free work space. Living on the ground under a modicum of canvas along with the dust, dirt, mud, sand, spiders, scorpions, fleas, chiggers, and other assorted insects and arachnids isn't conducive to performing watch battery changes. Haven't lived until you've lived in a poncho with a poncho liner for a few days as your unit is moving much too quickly to do otherwise. The other problem with the Seiko SQ is its perfectly flat crystal which is like a signalling mirror. Had to keep it covered up when I wasn't looking at it (used wide nylon watch strap with flap for that, a PITA). I find it odd that most current real military watches as used by the UK and available in the US Armed Forces supply system (rarely issue them) are quartz. They're considered expendable, most likely to be replaced when the battery quits, although within the US logistics system, one would still have to provide a reason why it's being replaced, same as with common hand tools. That's OK in garrison, but out in the wilderness, getting replacements through the supply system quickly would be problematic when the focus is on bullets and beans and parts to repair weapons, weapons systems and prime movers. Not that it matters much as there's no general need to issue anyone a watch. In the US Armed Forces, everyone who has a watch has brought their own watch to the party, one that they bought with their own money. Among the most popular are various G-Shock as they're nearly indestructible and they're cheap. The Solar Atomic models are among the most common. The Timex Ironman also shows up, but they don't seem to be as robust. The digitals are OK but I'm a Luddite that wants a 3-hand analog dial that's very easy to read.

Lived under some rather harsh conditions for months at a time. Comes with being a boot prints in the dirt, sand, mud, dusty mud, dusty sandy mud and frozen sandy dusty mud soldier. There are many things that occur in which some number of US Armed Force personnel are deployed that nobody ever hears about, such as this one called Shaba II in the late 1970's:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaba_II
I can neither confirm nor deny anything you might read in that Wikipedia article beyond an event called Shaba II occurred, US Armed Forces were involved (not just the USAF) and I was among them. For many years I could not admit that much. I'm working up a posting about Military Watches for that thread but not done with it yet. Your Victorinox INOX is more military watch than the nonsense I've seen touted as military to market them to the unknowing. I believe its one downside for tactical military use is the same as my Victorinox, a dead flat crystal. They're great field watches which hits nearly all the requirements for a military watch.

Been using mechanical watches ever since and haven't looked back, beyond a very few quartz with interesting movements, such as Seiko's circa 2000 very high accuracy perpetual with 10-year battery (two 8F32 and one 8F56), and more recently a couple  Bulova with their high accuracy Precisionist movements and smooth sweeping seconds hands, and then the Balmer Big Date and its Ronda jeweled mid-tier movement. Price on that one was just over $100 USD and couldn't pass it by as the dial also looked great and execution of the fit and finish is excellent.

If you're interested in watches I encourage you to learn about the Swiss watch industry in general, various brands, and not just the ones with widespread recognition. Brands such as Atlantic, Epos and Ebel are unknown in North America. Germany has two watchmaking regions: Pforzheim in the west between Karlsruhe and Stuttgart, and Glashuette in the east near Dresden. The Glashuette firms were resurrected from collective state ownership after the reunification. Many of the brands from both regions are all but unknown here: Stowa, Aristo, Archimede, Limes, Laco (uses Miyota 8200 movements), Nomos, Union, and Muehle.

Orient, a major Japanese brand considered #2 behind Seiko in quality and workmanship, has very limited exposure in North America beyond the dive watch aficionados and their forums. Sandoz, from a Swiss chemical products family that also produced watches has long licensed its brand name and logos to three different firms. One is in Singapore, another in Hong Kong and the third in Spain. They're all unrelated to each other other than the licensed name. The Singapore have been considered the best of the three and last I was able to find some (a reclusive company) they were still using ETA 2824 family movements. How they were getting them is beyond me. Another name found in Asia is Enicar, which is Racine spelled backward. The brand is now owned by the Hong Kong company that had been the Chinese distributor of them since the 1930's. They bought Enicar when the firm declared insolvency in Switzerland during the quartz crisis. They still make some of their watches in Switzerland and have an address with a presence there, but they're rarely seen now outside of China where they are heavily marketed and very popular due to successful marketing by its Hong Kong owner. Doesn't seem to be any interest in marketing them outside of China although they do show up in the immediate region (other than Japan).

John

[McStitchy]

Very interesting insights John 

Funny you mention flat crystal.
The Sinn 157 as well as it's Tutima counterpart have that "feature" too.
They were issued to German Airforce Pilots and crew.
I would also say that very bright illuminated hands are not ideal in real life combat conditions.

Btw, Sinn is in Frankfurt am Main. But I wouldn't call Frankfurt a watchmaking region because of that.

[twiliter]

Thanks again for the reply John, I am learning a lot! 

Thanks for your service also. 

I think I like Vic watches because of the reputation and brand, and I think they capitalize on that, and rightly so. I'm not too keen on the Shinola brand, I think they are making more of the name recognition than it deserves. They might be fine watches, but nothing that jumps out at me enough to consider buying one. I'm sure it's hard to navigate all the different boutique brands and the different merits of each, but I do see some that have interesting histories or a reputation for quality, or both. The movements and manufactures, and history behind them is fascinating, and I'm sure I'll be wanting a mechanical watch at some point, so all the good info from your posts and other research I'm able to do will help a lot. I do have some criteria though if I ever get another one. It will have to be very readable, very comfortable (and hypoallergenic), and not overpriced for what it is. I really appreciate Swiss quality, and I think the reputation is well deserved, but by the same token I see there are a lot of luxury watches that are really absurdly priced for no logical reason. I'm more about quality and functionality than hype or trying to outdo my golfing buddies (not that there's anything wrong with that, it's just not what I'm in to), so a high quality, good looking, wearable, relatively simple, functional watch is what makes the most sense to me. There is probably an automatic in my future, and I want to be as happy with it as I am with my quartz INOX. 

btw, the crystal on my watch is so flat, the reflection it casts at 20 feet is about the same size as the crystal itself, which I find pretty amazing! A small adjustment is all it takes to keep it from blinding me, but I'm sure it would be a problem for any covert/camo operations, someone would probably have to put some mud on it or something. 

[jalind]

Thanks again for the reply John, I am learning a lot! 

Thanks for your service also. 

I think I like Vic watches because of the reputation and brand, and I think they capitalize on that, and rightly so. I'm not too keen on the Shinola brand, I think they are making more of the name recognition than it deserves. They might be fine watches, but nothing that jumps out at me enough to consider buying one. I'm sure it's hard to navigate all the different boutique brands and the different merits of each, but I do see some that have interesting histories or a reputation for quality, or both. The movements and manufactures, and history behind them is fascinating, and I'm sure I'll be wanting a mechanical watch at some point, so all the good info from your posts and other research I'm able to do will help a lot. I do have some criteria though if I ever get another one. It will have to be very readable, very comfortable (and hypoallergenic), and not overpriced for what it is. I really appreciate Swiss quality, and I think the reputation is well deserved, but by the same token I see there are a lot of luxury watches that are really absurdly priced for no logical reason. I'm more about quality and functionality than hype or trying to outdo my golfing buddies (not that there's anything wrong with that, it's just not what I'm in to), so a high quality, good looking, wearable, relatively simple, functional watch is what makes the most sense to me. There is probably an automatic in my future, and I want to be as happy with it as I am with my quartz INOX. 

btw, the crystal on my watch is so flat, the reflection it casts at 20 feet is about the same size as the crystal itself, which I find pretty amazing! A small adjustment is all it takes to keep it from blinding me, but I'm sure it would be a problem for any covert/camo operations, someone would probably have to put some mud on it or something. 

Thanks . . . I consider my service to have been a real privilege. Had a scholarship that paid for my undergrad degree. The payback turned into 21 years. Some once in a lifetime experiences, a few of which I was very glad were only once in my lifetime, but it came with the territory and I knew that up front with eyes wide open.

This is how we dealt with problem watches although it was a PITA and the Velcro was a potential noise problem. I had a different watch on it for a couple years (a Seiko), stashed it in a box when I quit using the Seiko, and then put this dirt cheap early 1970's "Chalet" on it a few years ago to show someone how we used it (bought at Kmart circa 1972). The Chalet exceeds the definition of a "beater" watch! I wore it when I was doing underground hard rock mineral mining in a life prior to the military (copper mining in central Arizona). Made enormous amounts of money to help pay for my undergrad degree which was mostly funded by a scholarship from Uncle Sam, but not completely. Much, much, much different from coal mining (you'd never, ever get me into a coal mine).

Rather amazing that they still make these, or at least they did a few years ago! Has a flap you can cover the watch with.



This is with the watch covered . . .



Or you could flip the cover around and wear it open . . .



Closed up on my wrist . . .



This is the Seiko I used it with . . . the one with the dead flat mirror-like crystal . . . put the steel bracelet back on it when I replaced it with the Hamiltons.



Back to the Swiss Made Chalet "beater" watch . . . this is what the movement in it looks like . . . IIRC 1 jewel. You don't get much cheaper than this with die cut sheet metal bridges riveted together! The wheels (gears) are also die cut sheet metal. It's what you got for about $5 USD at Kmart in the early 1970's before there were dirt cheap quartz watches. What's truly amazing is that it still runs with reasonable accuracy - well under 30 seconds gain or loss per day! And to think what I put it through for some years, too!! Don't make 'em like this no more.



And the Swiss Watch Industry would like you to think they only made carefully crafted and painstakingly assembled high precision movements. HA! They pumped out gazillions of these cheapies until the quartz crisis hit.

John

[McStitchy]

...
Back to the Swiss Made Chalet "beater" watch . . . this is what the movement in it looks like . . . IIRC 1 jewel. You don't get much cheaper than this with die cut sheet metal bridges riveted together! The wheels (gears) are also die cut sheet metal. It's what you got for about $5 USD at Kmart in the early 1970's before there were dirt cheap quartz watches. What's truly amazing is that it still runs with reasonable accuracy - well under 30 seconds gain or loss per day! And to think what I put it through for some years, too!! Don't make 'em like this no more.

(Image removed from quote.)

And the Swiss Watch Industry would like you to think they only made carefully crafted and painstakingly assembled high precision movements. HA! They pumped out gazillions of these cheapies until the quartz crisis hit.

John

  Now that's something to think about.

I cannot remember what brand my first watch was I've got as a kid. Mechanical, handwind, just time, acrylic domed glass, and for some unknown reason always ran 30min. slow from 6pm on 

The second one was a Pulsar digital... and it was eating batteries like the flashlight I had.

Then a simple Casio followed which lasted for years.

[jalind]

Bulova Corvara
63B101
2008
ETA 2824-2

Part of Bulova's Swiss Made Accutron line prior to their "Accutron" trademark shuffling, the style of this one is all about pinstripes which carry through the dial, case and integrated bracelet. Crystal is slightly curved sapphire with AR coating. Hands are skeleton broadswords and the lume is quite good. Landing between a sports watch and a formal dress watch, without a screw down crown and rated for 100m water resistance, this one can be worn with most anything. It was made about a year or so before Bulova started using Sellita SW200-1 movements instead of the ETA 2824-2.



The prominence of the dial pinstripes depend on light direction as do the skeleton outlines of the hands between their tips and the . . .







Several years ago the Swiss Made "Accutron" line was renamed "Accu-Swiss" when Bulova created the Accutron II Precisionist line of high frequency quartz watches.

John

[twiliter]

That's a nice looking one John, maybe a little hard to read for my taste, but I like the pinstripes! 

[jalind]

That's a nice looking one John, maybe a little hard to read for my taste, but I like the pinstripes! 

Thanks
Easier to read than it looks in the photos - which I need to rework.

John

[McStitchy]

I love your watch series here John 

I'm not fond of the stripes on the dial too much, and the black skeleton hands seem to make it hard to read for me too.
But the outer apparence is nice. The four screws on the case front are actually real too.
And it's driven by a solid and reliable movement I think.

 

[jalind]

Seiko "Ice Monster"
SRP481
24j 4R36A hand-wind & hack

The 4R36 and its family are a significant evolution of the 7S36 movement family. The most noticeable to the end user are the addition of hand-wind and hacking, a long-term complaint about the 7S26/36 movement family and its predecessors. Seiko made other other tweaks based on their development of the 6R15. This new family has been gradually displacing the 7S26/7S36 over the past several years. As I understand it, these are not and cannot be used as a drop-in replacement though. IIRC, the movement height and stem are different. There are some conversion mods being done on older Seiko models, but they aren't completely straightforward.

This may have the appearance of a dive watch, but it really isn't one. It accrued the "Ice Monster" name from its dial and the line of these in various colors are referred to as "Baby Monsters" because of their striking similarity in appearance. They're not much smaller or lighter though. The crown does not screw down and they're rated to 100m which makes them a sports watch. The minimum for a dive watch is 200m and a screw down crown is essential for diving. Typical of Seiko, the 120-click bezel ratchet is extremely smooth.




Dial and hands have the usual impeccable finishing work.



Lume has the typical beacon brightness.



John

[McStitchy]

Beautiful 

[jalind]

Beautiful 

Thanks Matt

[David Bowen]

Wearing a G-Shock today

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

[jalind]

Hamilton Khaki Field Chronograph
H71416147
Valjoux (ETA) 7750

These were part of Hamilton's Khaki line about a decade ago ago. Bought it nine years ago and had to do a bit of searching to find this specific model as there were two different sizes with different dial colors, some with stainless steel bracelets and some with leather straps.







John

[jalind]

(Image removed from quote.)

Wearing a G-Shock today

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

 
The very nearly indestructible watch.

John

[McStitchy]

Hamilton Khaki Field Chronograph
H71416147
Valjoux (ETA) 7750

These were part of Hamilton's Khaki line about a decade ago ago. Bought it nine years ago and had to do a bit of searching to find this specific model as there were two different sizes with different dial colors, some with stainless steel bracelets and some with leather straps.

(Image removed from quote.)

(Image removed from quote.)

(Image removed from quote.)

John

Oh oh.... I do like that   

I would not change a thing on it John.
How is the illumination of the hands?

[jalind]

Hamilton Khaki Field Chronograph
H71416147
Valjoux (ETA) 7750

These were part of Hamilton's Khaki line about a decade ago ago. Bought it nine years ago and had to do a bit of searching to find this specific model as there were two different sizes with different dial colors, some with stainless steel bracelets and some with leather straps.

(Image removed from quote.)

(Image removed from quote.)

(Image removed from quote.)

John

Oh oh.... I do like that   

I would not change a thing on it John.
How is the illumination of the hands?

Funny you should ask . . . just happen to have the photo on file . . . index at the 12 partially covered by the tip on the chrono seconds. Only main time is lumed which is OK with me. Using a chrono complication in the dark is all but impossible. Glad I got it when I did . . . before Hamilton (and Tissot) started using a different and lower cost chrono movement that ETA came up with to reduce cost for Hamilton, Tissot and a couple others.



John

[McStitchy]

Hamilton Khaki Field Chronograph
H71416147
Valjoux (ETA) 7750

These were part of Hamilton's Khaki line about a decade ago ago. Bought it nine years ago and had to do a bit of searching to find this specific model as there were two different sizes with different dial colors, some with stainless steel bracelets and some with leather straps.

(Image removed from quote.)

(Image removed from quote.)

(Image removed from quote.)

John

Oh oh.... I do like that   

I would not change a thing on it John.
How is the illumination of the hands?

Funny you should ask . . . just happen to have the photo on file . . . index at the 12 partially covered by the tip on the chrono seconds. Only main time is lumed which is OK with me. Using a chrono complication in the dark is all but impossible.

(Image removed from quote.)

John

   thanks !  Perfect.