Outrider Mod

[Craig T]

New member greetings.  My apologies for a long post, but I believe the description is helpful for understanding my project.

I purchased a Victorinox Hardwood Cheese Knife recently.  There are two Vic Cheese knife models:
  - Cheese Knife version with plastic scales, serrated locking blade (slide lock), cheese blade (slip joint), corkscrew.
  - Hardwood Cheese Knife version with wood scales, serrated blade (liner lock), cheese blade (slip joint), cork screw, bottle and can openers, awl.

I have two primary uses for this knife.  First is to carry in my lunch box for tasks such as cutting tomatoes  (serrated blade works well), cutting apples (serrated blade not work as well as a smooth blade), misc other cutting, and even cutting cheese.

The second is to carry when I am out for the day and I might get a meal where a knife is not available (such as a Chinese restaurant).

I find that the skeletonized cheese blade does not cut cheese any better than a solid blade and it is much more difficult to clean.

The serrated blade works very well for some foods (tomato, bread).  I also like the serrated blade when cutting food on a plate (steak) because only the points of a few serrations touch the plate and are dulled, while the majority of the sharp cutting surfaces stay sharp.

The serrated edge is ground from one side of the blade so when cutting food such as an apple the blade tends to twist making it difficult to make accurate predictable slices.

My thought was to replace the cheese blade with a smooth edge blade.  In researching models to get a donor blade (Vic Cheese Knife is 111mm) I found the Outrider.  The arrangement is very similar to the Hardwood Cheese Knife except the blade is smooth (not serrated) and the lock is a slide not a liner lock.  Instead of a cheese blade it has a saw.  It also has one more layer with scissors, which would be a nice addition for my intended use.

I happened to find a new Outrider for a good price so I bought it with the thought of replacing the saw with a serrated locking blade and have all of the tools I want.  There are a few questions I am hoping you folks can help answer.

I have read some discussions about slide locks possibly not being as secure / strong as the liner lock.  The slide lock seems sufficiently secure, but what is the current status of slide vs. liner locks?

The Outrider’s smooth blade (slide lock) is a bit narrower than the Cheese Knife’s serrated blade (liner lock).  Is the narrower blade a result of the slide lock or some other reason?  Are there any Vic models with a smooth blade using a liner lock? (None of the model descriptions tell which type of lock is used and the photos do not show enough to determine.)

Is it possible / difficult to modify a wood scale to work with a slide lock?  The wood looks so much better than the plastic.  I do not mind losing the toothpick and tweezers.

Do I presume correctly that individual replacement parts are not available from Victorinox, only from donor knives?

Any info and words of wisdom is most appreciated.

Craig T.

[metasyntax]

Hi Craig, welcome to MTO! I'm no modder, but I can answer a few questions.

I have read some discussions about slide locks possibly not being as secure / strong as the liner lock.  The slide lock seems sufficiently secure, but what is the current status of slide vs. liner locks?

I think the consensus is that the slide lock is plenty strong enough for anything you ought to be doing with a SAK. Surely, using it on food, there should be no problem with strength. Personally, I prefer the slide lock because its smoother. Unfortunately, both have vertical play when locked open!

Are there any Vic models with a smooth blade using a liner lock? (None of the model descriptions tell which type of lock is used and the photos do not show enough to determine.)

Yes! As far as factory configurations go, with the slide lock you've got: (1) plain two-hand opening [adventurer, alpineer, outrider, hercules, ...], and (2) serrated two-hand opening [picnicker*, rucksack*, skipper, helmsman]. With the liner lock you've got: (1) plain two-hand opening [sentinel, centurion, parachutist], (2) plain one-hand opening [trekker NS], and (3) serrated one-hand opening [sentinel OH, trekker, GAK, fireman, forester, ...]. I'm not aware of a serrated two-hand opening liner lock model, but there might be one. The Sakwiki has tons more information on the configurations out there.

Also, most of the time (on the most common models), red scales are used on slide locks, black scales are used on liner locks. But check SAKwiki to be sure: there are black scaled slide locks and red scaled liner locks out there, they're just not as common or they're scale swaps.

(Edited to add: picnicker and rucksack are sometimes serrated. I have a serrated picnicker and a plain rucksack.)

Do I presume correctly that individual replacement parts are not available from Victorinox, only from donor knives?

Unfortunately, this is correct. Otherwise we'd all have yeomen and master craftsmen.

Good luck with your mod Craig! I wish I could help more, but I don't even know if it's possible to mix the slide and liner locks. I look forward to seeing what you can come up with, I think having both plain and serrated options (in the standard blade shape, not the rescue blade) would be a nice setup to have!

[Craig T]

Thanks for all the great info.

I just realized that the serrated blade on my cheese knife that I was planning on using to replace the saw in the Outrider has the cork screw as well.  So the spring will have a long indent that the cork screw sits in when folded. 

I will search for a serrated blade with liner lock and no tools on the back side.

How about using wood scales with the slide lock?  Anyone done that?  Was it difficult?

[Craig T]

My latest thoughts...

I have decided to mod my cheese knife by adding only a smooth blade with the slide lock.  It looks like the least expensive SAK is the Alpineer.  All of the large locking blades seem to also have a cork screw on the back side.  When adding a second blade to the cheese knife there will be an empty spot on the second layer that no longer has a cork screw. 

How do you folks handle that empty spot on the liner?  Is there another liner that does not have a cutout for the cork screw that can be used?  If the donor is an Alpineer, can the liner opposite to the cork screw without a notch be used?  Is there another tool that can go in that empty cork screw spot?

The Outrider is still up for a mod though.  I would like to replace the saw with a serrated blade and give it to my wife's sister to take car camping (in a Porsche) so not much room to pack camping gear. 

[Craig T]

It has been a while but I finally have my first mod completed.

For my first mod I decided the Outrider for my sister-in-law would be first.  This is to be used for car camping minimal food prep duties.

I added a serrated blade with a liner lock from a Sentinel donor.  The serrated blade is next to the smooth blade.  The Outrider main pin is 2.5 mm while the Sentinel is 3 mm.  I inserted a short length of brass rod into the Sentinel serrated blade pin hole, a little longer than the thickness of the blade.  A bit of hammering on the ends of the rod expanded it into the pin hole.  I filed it off flush with the blade and drilled a 2.5 mm hole.  Effectively making a brass bushing in the blade.

I wanted to also add a cheese knife blade but buying a SAK Cheese Knife just for the one blade would have cost more than I wanted to spend on this mod.  So I ground the teeth off of the wood saw from the Outrider and profiled it to approximately 30 deg.  When I experimented with this blade on cheese it seemed to cut as well or better than the skeleton cheese blade.

Oh, and I sharpened the Phillips screwdriver to a point to be used for an ice pick and such.

It was much more challenging reassembling than I thought it would be.  Resetting the springs required a bit of finesse and muscle.  Not quite sure how but I finally got it put together.

Here are a few photos of the completed Outriderel. Outridinel?  Outrentinel?

[eddie1115]

It has been a while but I finally have my first mod completed.

For my first mod I decided the Outrider for my sister-in-law would be first.  This is to be used for car camping minimal food prep duties.

I added a serrated blade with a liner lock from a Sentinel donor.  The serrated blade is next to the smooth blade.  The Outrider main pin is 2.5 mm while the Sentinel is 3 mm.  I inserted a short length of brass rod into the Sentinel serrated blade pin hole, a little longer than the thickness of the blade.  A bit of hammering on the ends of the rod expanded it into the pin hole.  I filed it off flush with the blade and drilled a 2.5 mm hole.  Effectively making a brass bushing in the blade.

I wanted to also add a cheese knife blade but buying a SAK Cheese Knife just for the one blade would have cost more than I wanted to spend on this mod.  So I ground the teeth off of the wood saw from the Outrider and profiled it to approximately 30 deg.  When I experimented with this blade on cheese it seemed to cut as well or better than the skeleton cheese blade.

Oh, and I sharpened the Phillips screwdriver to a point to be used for an ice pick and such.

It was much more challenging reassembling than I thought it would be.  Resetting the springs required a bit of finesse and muscle.  Not quite sure how but I finally got it put together.

Here are a few photos of the completed Outriderel. Outridinel?  Outrentinel?

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(Image removed from quote.)

Wow, I am impressed!  This is a very nice setup, and some genius decisions (saw into cheese knife, screwdriver into ice pick).   

[Craig T]

Thanks eddie.

I forgot one final detail.  The liner (with lock feature) added with the serrated blade from the Sentinel includes an extension and hole for a split ring for a lanyard.  The original Outrider had one also but I ground the original one off for two reasons.  It is closer to the side than the serrated blade liner and is aluminum, while the serrated blade liner is stainless steel.

I hope this performs the job for my Sister-in-Law as I am imagining it to do.

[T14]

Stunning work. I absolutely love it 
-Tom

[glenfiddich1983]

Nice work, great "out of the box" thinking on modding the wood saw into a cheese knife