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Wool as an outer layer 3472

Zombie Apprentice Posts: 18,295 Plumbers Know Their Crap!!
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #180 on: September 26, 2017, 07:33:06 PM »
MadP, there has to be someone who has free wool blanket coat patterns online.  I'm sure you can make one for the price of the blanket, zippers, thread, time, for much cheaper than $300.  Go go it.
True, but I ain’t that good, knowing my luck it would probably end up not fitting me and look wacky.
JR

"The-Mad-Plumbarian" The Punisher Of Pipes!!! JR


Wielder of the Bow of Banishment. Admin Team Point Of No Return Posts: 30,960 El Presidente del Fan Club Micky D
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #181 on: September 27, 2017, 12:45:52 PM »
That lined one looks interesting.  I also like the short cape on the shoulders.  Other than the possibility of design though, I'm not quite sure what these are supposed to do better than a good surplus military coat would do just as well, if not better.  :think:

Try not to be the person who blunders around and causes everyone else to get out the way.  Everyone else thinks you're a utter...
Zombie Apprentice Posts: 16,626 I'm not a pessimist, I'm an experienced optimist!
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #182 on: September 27, 2017, 03:25:41 PM »
An interesting point has been touched on here. These days, we fixate upon getting the kit to suit our routine (first world problem), whereas in the old days, you adapted the routine to suit the kit available. We survived a good few millennia without synthetic materials, but it is almost deemed defeatist these days to have to compromise your routine in any way to accommodate kit limitations .... :shrug:



The cantankerous but occasionally useful member, formally known as 50ft-trad
Wielder of the Bow of Banishment. Admin Team Point Of No Return Posts: 30,960 El Presidente del Fan Club Micky D
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #183 on: September 27, 2017, 03:46:38 PM »
An interesting point has been touched on here. These days, we fixate upon getting the kit to suit our routine (first world problem), whereas in the old days, you adapted the routine to suit the kit available. We survived a good few millennia without synthetic materials, but it is almost deemed defeatist these days to have to compromise your routine in any way to accommodate kit limitations .... :shrug:

That's an excellent way of thinking about it I'd say. :tu: 

Try not to be the person who blunders around and causes everyone else to get out the way.  Everyone else thinks you're a utter...
Sr. Member Posts: 426
Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #184 on: September 27, 2017, 06:21:09 PM »
I've been seeing a bit of uprise in the line of thought that wool is a great outer layer for hiking, backpacking and other outdoor activities even in rain, snow and sleet.

While I understand that wet wool still keeps it's insulation value, tests have shown that it still acts like a wet piece of clothing when it comes to windchill. And I can personally attest to that.
So am I missing something with this wool outer craze?
Yes, you're missing something...and it's in your own post. wool as an OUTER layer.

If it's your outer player then it's not directly against your skin. If your middle layer is windproof, it will block the windchill.

I lived in Alaska for 32 years and wore either a Filson Mackinaw Cruiser or a Filson Double Mackinaw Cruiser (pictured) for a couple decades worth of winters without a problem. Both are virgin wool.



I still have my Double mackie even though I live in Texas now. It's just too nice a coat to part with.

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« Last Edit: September 27, 2017, 06:35:42 PM by Tired_Yeti »
Sr. Member Posts: 426
Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #185 on: September 27, 2017, 06:32:20 PM »
Seems to work for sheep :shrug:





 :whistle:

 

The fiber we know as wool that comes from sheep is made up of amino acids, which are the building blocks of protein. As wool grows on a sheep, it gets keratinized, which simply means it hardens. Other examples of keratinized proteins are fingernails and hair.

Wool fibers on a sheep have flat, overlapping scales that always point away from the sheep's body. When these wool fibers get processed and made into clothing, however, the fibers are stretched out. The orientation of the scales gets mixed up and they can be pointing in any random direction.


As any shepherd will tell you, sheep do just fine in the rain and don't shrink like a wool sweater. This is because their wool fibers have scales that are all pointing in the same direction.

When they get wet, they can slide back into position without getting caught or locked into place. No felting takes place on sheep in the rain, so they don't shrink!

Sheep also produce a natural oily substance called lanolin. Lanolin covers the wool fibers of their coats, acting as a natural lubricant that prevents fibers from locking together. Lanolin also repels water, which makes sheep somewhat waterproof when they're out in the rain. This is good for sheep, since it prevents their wool from getting soaked and waterlogged, which would be very uncomfortable since they have so much wool!
Hmm...except that wool is curly so the orientation of each fiber changes over its length. So the overlapping scales, which are also found on human hair, don't always point away from the animal's body.

Lanolin is the secret--which you had mentioned. It's what gives wool it's water resistance.


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« Last Edit: September 27, 2017, 06:33:50 PM by Tired_Yeti »
Zombie Apprentice Posts: 11,217
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #186 on: September 27, 2017, 06:42:54 PM »
I've been seeing a bit of uprise in the line of thought that wool is a great outer layer for hiking, backpacking and other outdoor activities even in rain, snow and sleet.

While I understand that wet wool still keeps it's insulation value, tests have shown that it still acts like a wet piece of clothing when it comes to windchill. And I can personally attest to that.
So am I missing something with this wool outer craze?
Yes, you're missing something...and it's in your own post. wool as an OUTER layer.

If it's your outer player then it's not directly against your skin. If your middle layer is windproof, it will block the windchill.

I lived in Alaska for 32 years and wore either a Filson Mackinaw Cruiser or a Filson Double Mackinaw Cruiser (pictured) for a couple decades worth of winters without a problem. Both are virgin wool.

(Image removed from quote.)(Image removed from quote.)

I still have my Double mackie even though I live in Texas now. It's just too nice a coat to part with.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

so basically a windproof mid layer under the wool outer. why does that sound reversed somehow?

Solving problems you didn't know you had in the most obscure way possible

"And now, it's time to hand this over to our tame race axe driver. Some say, he can live in the forest for six months at a time without food, and he knows of a secret tribe of only women where he is their God. All we know is, he's call the Styx!" - TazzieRob
Wielder of the Bow of Banishment. Admin Team Point Of No Return Posts: 30,960 El Presidente del Fan Club Micky D
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #187 on: September 28, 2017, 09:17:09 AM »
I've been seeing a bit of uprise in the line of thought that wool is a great outer layer for hiking, backpacking and other outdoor activities even in rain, snow and sleet.

While I understand that wet wool still keeps it's insulation value, tests have shown that it still acts like a wet piece of clothing when it comes to windchill. And I can personally attest to that.
So am I missing something with this wool outer craze?
Yes, you're missing something...and it's in your own post. wool as an OUTER layer.

If it's your outer player then it's not directly against your skin. If your middle layer is windproof, it will block the windchill.

I lived in Alaska for 32 years and wore either a Filson Mackinaw Cruiser or a Filson Double Mackinaw Cruiser (pictured) for a couple decades worth of winters without a problem. Both are virgin wool.

(Image removed from quote.)(Image removed from quote.)

I still have my Double mackie even though I live in Texas now. It's just too nice a coat to part with.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Those look like fantastic coats.  :drool:

Try not to be the person who blunders around and causes everyone else to get out the way.  Everyone else thinks you're a utter...
Sr. Member Posts: 426
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #188 on: September 28, 2017, 03:16:03 PM »
I've been seeing a bit of uprise in the line of thought that wool is a great outer layer for hiking, backpacking and other outdoor activities even in rain, snow and sleet.

While I understand that wet wool still keeps it's insulation value, tests have shown that it still acts like a wet piece of clothing when it comes to windchill. And I can personally attest to that.
So am I missing something with this wool outer craze?
Yes, you're missing something...and it's in your own post. wool as an OUTER layer.

If it's your outer player then it's not directly against your skin. If your middle layer is windproof, it will block the windchill.

I lived in Alaska for 32 years and wore either a Filson Mackinaw Cruiser or a Filson Double Mackinaw Cruiser (pictured) for a couple decades worth of winters without a problem. Both are virgin wool.

(Image removed from quote.)(Image removed from quote.)

I still have my Double mackie even though I live in Texas now. It's just too nice a coat to part with.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

so basically a windproof mid layer under the wool outer. why does that sound reversed somehow?
Maybe you're envisioning a thin wool jacket? The Filson coats I wore were made of 24oz. and 26oz. virgin wool. They were definitely made to be your outer layer. You'd have a hard time fitting something over one. You might be able fit a very oversized raincoat or poncho over one, I suppose.
Wool is durable and retains its thermal properties even when damp so if your under layer blocks the wind from your skin, a heavy wool coat will still keep you warm. At least in my experience.
The downside, in my experience, is that wool can be rather heavy; whereas, Gortex isn't. You can imagine a coat made of 24oz. per square yard fabric isn't lightweight.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Sr. Member Posts: 426
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #189 on: September 28, 2017, 03:28:14 PM »
Those look like fantastic coats.  :drool:
I love them! They look stylish, have pockets for days, and they're warm. They're virgin wool so they can feel a little scratchy. Below about 20 degrees F, you might need to start adding layers under it.
https://www.filson.com


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Zombie Apprentice Posts: 11,217
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #190 on: September 28, 2017, 04:04:55 PM »
I've been seeing a bit of uprise in the line of thought that wool is a great outer layer for hiking, backpacking and other outdoor activities even in rain, snow and sleet.

While I understand that wet wool still keeps it's insulation value, tests have shown that it still acts like a wet piece of clothing when it comes to windchill. And I can personally attest to that.
So am I missing something with this wool outer craze?
Yes, you're missing something...and it's in your own post. wool as an OUTER layer.

If it's your outer player then it's not directly against your skin. If your middle layer is windproof, it will block the windchill.

I lived in Alaska for 32 years and wore either a Filson Mackinaw Cruiser or a Filson Double Mackinaw Cruiser (pictured) for a couple decades worth of winters without a problem. Both are virgin wool.

(Image removed from quote.)(Image removed from quote.)

I still have my Double mackie even though I live in Texas now. It's just too nice a coat to part with.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

so basically a windproof mid layer under the wool outer. why does that sound reversed somehow?
Maybe you're envisioning a thin wool jacket? The Filson coats I wore were made of 24oz. and 26oz. virgin wool. They were definitely made to be your outer layer. You'd have a hard time fitting something over one. You might be able fit a very oversized raincoat or poncho over one, I suppose.
Wool is durable and retains its thermal properties even when damp so if your under layer blocks the wind from your skin, a heavy wool coat will still keep you warm. At least in my experience.
The downside, in my experience, is that wool can be rather heavy; whereas, Gortex isn't. You can imagine a coat made of 24oz. per square yard fabric isn't lightweight.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Could be that I'm also thinking about something more loosely woven.
So how did you layer the things under it? For some reason a windproof layer to me is a bright colored windshirt and that is tripping me up very much

Solving problems you didn't know you had in the most obscure way possible

"And now, it's time to hand this over to our tame race axe driver. Some say, he can live in the forest for six months at a time without food, and he knows of a secret tribe of only women where he is their God. All we know is, he's call the Styx!" - TazzieRob
Global Moderator Zombie Apprentice Posts: 17,376
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #191 on: September 28, 2017, 05:09:18 PM »
I've heard of those Filson jackets.  Really great looking and from your account sounds like a wonderful article of clothing. 

Esse Quam Videri
Newbie Posts: 16
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #192 on: September 30, 2017, 10:36:50 PM »
An interesting point has been touched on here. These days, we fixate upon getting the kit to suit our routine (first world problem), whereas in the old days, you adapted the routine to suit the kit available. We survived a good few millennia without synthetic materials, but it is almost deemed defeatist these days to have to compromise your routine in any way to accommodate kit limitations .... :shrug:

Chalk that up to how much we're bombarded by advertisements. Most magazines are nothing more than disguised press releases to get you buy the next better thing.

Newbie Posts: 16
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #193 on: September 30, 2017, 10:49:25 PM »
Wool is durable and retains its thermal properties even when damp so if your under layer blocks the wind from your skin, a heavy wool coat will still keep you warm. At least in my experience.
The downside, in my experience, is that wool can be rather heavy; whereas, Gortex isn't. You can imagine a coat made of 24oz. per square yard fabric isn't lightweight.

Yup. Back before synthetics, your only options were wool, fur, or waxed cotton, and they're all heavy compared to today's technologies. When you think about it, the lightweight down jackets we now see everywhere are a relatively modern invention (by Eddie Bauer in the 1940s). To get that level of warmth back in the day, you'd probably have to pile on two jackets.
Absolutely No Life Club Posts: 6,104
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #194 on: September 30, 2017, 11:09:12 PM »
They had matching pyjamas....

On the subject of buying the latest biggest and best gear....

Zombie Apprentice Posts: 11,217
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #195 on: October 01, 2017, 10:39:08 AM »
When you take into consideration that we also have a lot of approaches and discussions within those approaches, no wonder it gets to confusion through over analyzing things.

In the ultra light community you've got guys like Andrew Skurka and Chris Townsend who are well known, respectable and knowledgeable. The two of them have very different opinions on windshirts for instance.
Then you can add guys like Ross from Woodtrekker or Piotr Ma who aren't household names but fit in some area between lightweight backpacking and other outdoor, more traditional, activities for lack of a better description that add up weight. Again a lot of differences in weight and approach.
On topof that you have a lot of strong traditional communities like the bushcraft community that have their approach. Actually the garment that led to my initial confusion if the Lester river Boreal shirt

Solving problems you didn't know you had in the most obscure way possible

"And now, it's time to hand this over to our tame race axe driver. Some say, he can live in the forest for six months at a time without food, and he knows of a secret tribe of only women where he is their God. All we know is, he's call the Styx!" - TazzieRob
Global Moderator Zombie Apprentice Posts: 17,376
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #196 on: October 01, 2017, 04:39:24 PM »
When you take into consideration that we also have a lot of approaches and discussions within those approaches, no wonder it gets to confusion through over analyzing things.

In the ultra light community you've got guys like Andrew Skurka and Chris Townsend who are well known, respectable and knowledgeable. The two of them have very different opinions on windshirts for instance.
Then you can add guys like Ross from Woodtrekker or Piotr Ma who aren't household names but fit in some area between lightweight backpacking and other outdoor, more traditional, activities for lack of a better description that add up weight. Again a lot of differences in weight and approach.
On topof that you have a lot of strong traditional communities like the bushcraft community that have their approach. Actually the garment that led to my initial confusion if the Lester river Boreal shirt

Seems whomever you tend to feel more akin to in terms of philosophies is the direction one will head.  When one is peeling off labels from food tins to save weight (  :whistle: ) then certain material make sense.  Certainly the traditionalist will tend to favor natural materials.  Then you have everyone in between. 

I seem to be in the middle somewhere.  I do love my wool.  I go to my local resell shops and scour the isles to find wool.  I have got some decent pieces.  Since it doesn't rain a whole lot in SoCal let alone snow (  ;) ) I can get away with nearly any material.  I do not want or like to have my outer layer wet tho which is why I'll choose a breathable outer layer with a wool mid layer.   

Esse Quam Videri
Zombie Apprentice Posts: 11,217
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #197 on: October 01, 2017, 05:23:57 PM »
I think something can be learned from all approaches and a mix of them can give just about anyone the right answer for that individual

Solving problems you didn't know you had in the most obscure way possible

"And now, it's time to hand this over to our tame race axe driver. Some say, he can live in the forest for six months at a time without food, and he knows of a secret tribe of only women where he is their God. All we know is, he's call the Styx!" - TazzieRob
Global Moderator Zombie Apprentice Posts: 17,376
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #198 on: October 01, 2017, 09:55:23 PM »
I think something can be learned from all approaches and a mix of them can give just about anyone the right answer for that individual

Yes I very much agree.  We do know there are those who are slaves to traditions and those who need the next new material.  I like technology as much as the next guy and also respect what has worked.  The link I attached in one of my posts showed some wonderful advances in wool and how water and wind resistant/prof it has become.  I'm all for this type of advance especially when keeping the integrity of the wool. 

Esse Quam Videri
No Life Club Posts: 3,309
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #199 on: October 13, 2017, 12:31:26 PM »
ARISE!!!!  :ahhh

We had a bit of a cold spell this week, had to get out some warm clothes that had been packed away for a few weeks already.....

One of those was a wool sweater I got when I was 17, 1992 I think, critical point being that was in the middle of my growth spurt, so the sweater/jersey still fits....

I wore it regularly to work up until about 5 years ago, when it got relegated to about the house clothing.

That's a quarter century of service with some life left.  :salute:

The main reason why Fleece has replaced wool in my wardrobe is price and quality, one went up and the other down.......no prizes for guessing which  :facepalm: 
Zombie Apprentice Posts: 11,217
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #200 on: October 13, 2017, 06:23:45 PM »
so it felt like seeing an old friend after years of mischief?

Solving problems you didn't know you had in the most obscure way possible

"And now, it's time to hand this over to our tame race axe driver. Some say, he can live in the forest for six months at a time without food, and he knows of a secret tribe of only women where he is their God. All we know is, he's call the Styx!" - TazzieRob
Absolutely No Life Club Posts: 7,439 Smurf smash!
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #201 on: October 13, 2017, 07:19:19 PM »
so it felt like seeing an old friend after years of mischief?

"felt"... *snigger*

:facepalm:

I'll see myself out, thank you...

"Hoarder of weirdness,
Always posting random things,
I'm AlephZero" :ninja:
Zombie Apprentice Posts: 11,217
Re: Wool as an outer layer
« Reply #202 on: October 13, 2017, 07:56:23 PM »
so it felt like seeing an old friend after years of mischief?

"felt"... *snigger*

:facepalm:

I'll see myself out, thank you...

no need

Solving problems you didn't know you had in the most obscure way possible

"And now, it's time to hand this over to our tame race axe driver. Some say, he can live in the forest for six months at a time without food, and he knows of a secret tribe of only women where he is their God. All we know is, he's call the Styx!" - TazzieRob

 

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