Moving the scissors on to the blade backspring on a 91mm?

[tommywp]

Closing in on the tool layout for my first mod. Anyone ever move the scissors on to the blade backspring on a 91mm? If so, any guidance...particularly around general fit and making a rest for the scissors?

I think the 93mm blade spring used to be used for the Pioneer+Scissors mod, so I'm hoping it's straightforward on the 91mm.

My goal is to get the scissors and corkscrew together on a bladeless mod, so if it's easier to swap the hook and corkscrew then I'd be all for that too.

 

[Don Pablo]

Scissors are thicker than the blade, even the old style blade. 
It's doable with a thinner tool, but scissors?

What you have to do is the syph way I believe. Replace the blade spring with the scissors spring, apparently the Corkscrew fits in place of the hook. You have to bend the spring or something like that to achieve enough snap on the scissors. 
Let me see if I can find the details.

[Don Pablo]

Ah ha.

Nice! 

Ya you cant just delete the blade layer or you get an ugly backscale with that cutout.  The only other thing that works is to put the scissors layer on the back and put the corkscrew on it.  Thats the only way Ive gone bladeless and kept the corkscrew.

That's another good option, what do you have to do to make the Corkscrew fit, besides adding washers?

I dont even add washers, the gap isnt enough to matter.  All I do is bend the backspring a bit to give the scissors better closed snap.  If you dont its pretty weak.  Other than that I dont change a thing.

If the scissors dont rest quite right after, sometimes its necessary to grind the scissors rest down just 1 mm or so so the scissors go down inside the sak further.  This isnt always needed though and I think depends on how hard or at what point I bend the scissors backspring.  You'll see what I mean if you try.

[Don Pablo]

Something to watch out for when doing it syphs way, is that you need an pre-2004(?) old style outer liner with no stamped indent. 

[tommywp]

Great information. Thanks,Pablo (and Syph too)!

Is the purpose of the bend to push the middle of the spring up towards the scissor or down towards the corkscrew?

Anyone know any tricks for identifying SAKS with the old style liner?

[Syph007]

Something to watch out for when doing it syphs way, is that you need an pre-2004(?) old style outer liner with no stamped indent. 

Ah good point (although I think you can hammer the new liner flat if needed) when I was doing these they were with my Ti scales so those were already flat.

[Don Pablo]

Great information. Thanks,Pablo (and Syph too)!

Is the purpose of the bend to push the middle of the spring up towards the scissor or down towards the corkscrew?

Anyone know any tricks for identifying SAKS with the old style liner?

It's to give the scissors better snap I believe, as replacing the hook with the Corkscrew reduces snap somehow. 

As for dating... You can get any SAK with a hook on the scissors to scrap for parts, since the only old style part you need are the outer liners.

For a SAK with old style outer liners. The crossbow stamp on the tang is a good indicator of age(though is not certain, as there was a year when SAKs were made with the new liners and old stamp), as is the lack of a hook on an old scissor model, or a corkscrew with a groove, etc.
And old SAK would do, and it shouldn't be hard to find on the U.S eBay. You could also ask Grant if any of his MTO store stock has the old style liners and buy one if so. 

[tommywp]

Thanks Pablo. Just got an old Ranger off ebay...what a piece of smurf. Wanted extra scissors in addition to the blade liner and figured it was worth a few extra bucks to add a metal file and technicians driver to the newly forming parts draw. File and scissors are in the best shape of all the tools, so I guess it meets my needs as a donor. Now to find the time and ballitos to give it a go...

[Don Pablo]

So does it have the old style thicker blade?
You can also tell by looking at the spine of the blade. Is the tang wider than the base of the blade, or same thickness as the base of the blade?

[tommywp]

Old style in red, new in black. I think I got the right one

[tommywp]

Do you know if there's any difference in scales over the years. If I use the outer liners from the old knife, can I swap on new scales?

[Don Pablo]

Yep, the red one is definitely old style. 

As for the scales, old or new scales on old or new liners, it makes no difference. 

[Don Pablo]

The red one must be pretty old... The liners beside the saw don't have a cut-out on the top, if you know what I mean. The saw teeth can catch on them. 
It should make no difference anyway, aside from you needing to close the saw with a bit more care, if you even do use them.

[tommywp]

Thanks man. I'm thinking about attempting: scissors with corkscrew, metal file with technician driver, openers with awl.

The skeletool is one of my favorites, and I feel like this 3-layer would be a great companion. I prefer the blade,pliers, drivers, and bottle opener on the skele to the SAK equivalents (and I added a little tap hammer to the carabiner that I can't get with an sak), and I think the sak scissors and metal file are best of breed and the awl/corkscrew/technicians driver are the 3 best backtools. I'm going back and forth about including the saw instead of the openers, but leaning towards the openers so that the awl can be added without any additional work and because the bottle opener ground down to a chisel and can opener as a pry tool might ultimately be more useful to me than a saw. One of the openers and the saw on the same layer would be ideal but doesn't sound possible.

I know the saw is a thin layer, but a huntsman is to big in the pocket for my tastes, so I think 3 layers is my max.

In terms of the mod, I think I have a grasp on everything except bending the blade spring so that it can accommodate the scissors. Think there's a pretty good chance of me smurfing this up, but we'll see. Preening should be interesting too. Was originally going to sacrifice the new craftsman (too big in the pocket for me, and can't justify carrying it instead of a PST2 or skele) but now I'm thinking of just using the old ranger and dealing with the fact that the tools are beatup...at least initially.

[tommywp]

I regards to the old saw liners, just did 20 full speed closes and it didn't catch the liner at all. And the saw is really well used on this thing..teeth are probably ground down too much to even be of much use anymore. I think the old liners are so tight against the tang that the saw can't go off course enough to snag.
 

[Don Pablo]

Thanks man. I'm thinking about attempting: scissors with corkscrew, metal file with technician driver, openers with awl.

The skeletool is one of my favorites, and I feel like this 3-layer would be a great companion. I prefer the blade,pliers, drivers, and bottle opener on the skele to the SAK equivalents (and I added a little tap hammer to the carabiner that I can't get with an sak), and I think the sak scissors and metal file are best of breed and the awl/corkscrew/technicians driver are the 3 best backtools. I'm going back and forth about including the saw instead of the openers, but leaning towards the openers so that the awl can be added without any additional work and because the bottle opener ground down to a chisel and can opener as a pry tool might ultimately be more useful to me than a saw. One of the openers and the saw on the same layer would be ideal but doesn't sound possible.

I know the saw is a thin layer, but a huntsman is to big in the pocket for my tastes, so I think 3 layers is my max.

In terms of the mod, I think I have a grasp on everything except bending the blade spring so that it can accommodate the scissors. Think there's a pretty good chance of me smurfing this up, but we'll see. Preening should be interesting too. Was originally going to sacrifice the new craftsman (too big in the pocket for me, and can't justify carrying it instead of a PST2 or skele) but now I'm thinking of just using the old ranger and dealing with the fact that the tools are beatup...at least initially.

FYI, your supposed to use the scissors spring, not the blade spring. 

[tommywp]

 

This is going to be interesting...