Soldier or Pioneer?

WH867 · **on:** December 06, 2008, 05:13:41 AM

I just got this today. Is this a Soldier that just happens to have a keyring or a pioneer with Soldier scales and blade #? Just curious

Freudian Frog · **Reply #1 on:** December 06, 2008, 06:08:34 AM

Errr, wouldn't that be a solja?

Sea Monster · **Reply #2 on:** December 06, 2008, 06:56:34 AM

Way I figure it

Swiss Shield & Blade # = Soldier,

and since lanyard ring does not necessarily = Pioneer,

what you got thar' be a Soldier w/ Lanyard ring?

Anyway - Check out SOSAK online, there's all sorts of info on the soldier history and variations to be had

Smitty44 · **Reply #3 on:** December 06, 2008, 07:05:37 AM

Looks like a Pioneer to me.http://www.swissarmy.com/MultiTools/Pages/Product.aspx?category=originalswissarmyknives&product=53960&

max6166 · **Reply #4 on:** December 06, 2008, 07:51:38 AM

According to Def's great article, I believe it would be classified as one of the "Soldier with keyring" variants that he mentions. The date stamp and shield are military requirements, after all...

Mike, Lord of the Spammers! · **Reply #5 on:** December 06, 2008, 08:35:01 AM

I'd say it was a Soldier with a keyring too

Swiss Man · **Reply #6 on:** December 06, 2008, 06:27:39 PM

It's a Soldier that went AWOL.

Dunc · **Reply #7 on:** December 06, 2008, 06:36:17 PM

I'd say soldier . There seems to be another on ebay http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260322639062&ssPageName=ADME:B:WNA:US:1123

Dunc

NutSAK · **Reply #8 on:** December 07, 2008, 03:37:06 PM

That's a Soldier, simply because it has the soldier shield.

I have another interesting variant: A vintage red Pioneer with a Soldier blade and no keyring.

cgjones · **Reply #9 on:** December 07, 2008, 06:55:40 PM

Quote from: NutSAK on December 07, 2008, 03:37:06 PM

I have another interesting variant: A vintage red Pioneer with a Soldier blade and no keyring.

I've got a similar Pioneer. It has a keyring and the blade is stamped 85.

ephraim · **Reply #10 on:** December 07, 2008, 11:00:18 PM

I am by far no expert but I thought the only difference between the pioneer and the soldier was the lanyard ring. As far as I know they have the same tools. I say it is a pioneer.
here is the link with the pioneer
http://www.swissarmy.com/MultiTools/Pages/Product.aspx?category=everyday&product=53960&
here is the soldier
http://www.victorinox.ch/index.cfm?site=victorinox.ch&page=234&lang=E

NutSAK · **Reply #11 on:** December 07, 2008, 11:43:17 PM

The differences:

shield - plain silver cross on old pioneers, Vic logo shield on new pioneers. Soldiers, AFAIK, have always had a unique Swiss cross or shield (crest) never found on Pioneers. The exception to that is the DAK, which has the year stamped on the scale instead of the blade.
keyring - most Pioneers have keyring, very few Soldiers do. Some Soldiers have bails, and some have hollow rivets also.
engraving plate - on all new-style Pioneers
year stamp - on all soldier blades except the DAK. Production overruns are also found on Pioneers of all models.

I think the shield on the scales is key to identifying this one, as I've never seen a Pioneer with a Soldier shield. Taking all of that into consideration, I can't see how it cannot be a Soldier.

This is all stated in Def's article linked above.

NutSAK · **Reply #12 on:** December 07, 2008, 11:46:02 PM

Quote from: cgjones on December 07, 2008, 06:55:40 PM

Quote from: NutSAK on December 07, 2008, 03:37:06 PM
I have another interesting variant: A vintage red Pioneer with a Soldier blade and no keyring.

I've got a similar Pioneer. It has a keyring and the blade is stamped 85.

Mine's a '97. I've also owned a few Farmers with date-stamped blades. I'll bet you can find Soldier blades from production overruns on all Pioneer-model knives if you look hard enough. '97 is a year that I've seen a few of.

WH867 · **Reply #13 on:** January 09, 2009, 03:02:28 AM

My 95 had a younger brother show up today.

.

Grant Lamontagne · **Reply #14 on:** January 09, 2009, 03:26:58 AM

That is indeed the rare Soldier with keyring model.

It is a Soldier because it has the military shield, no engraving panel and a date stamp, making it more a Soldier than a Pioneer.

Def

Neil · **Reply #15 on:** January 09, 2009, 03:56:01 AM

I suppose the question now is, why are there Soldiers with keyrings?

Neil

Mr. Whippy · **Reply #16 on:** January 09, 2009, 04:39:18 AM

For tank divisions?

Gareth · **Reply #17 on:** January 09, 2009, 10:38:38 AM

Quote from: Mr. Whippy on January 09, 2009, 04:39:18 AM

For tank divisions?

For keeping the keys on?

Grant Lamontagne · **Reply #18 on:** January 09, 2009, 01:57:10 PM

It's just a variation- my best guesses are they did a test run to see how the public would respond, or a new guy was operating the Soldier Making Machine and thought he had to include keyrings, and it took a bit before anyone noticed.

Def

max6166 · **Reply #19 on:** January 09, 2009, 07:02:11 PM

I still think it is very weird that the Soldiers stopped having a bail (and no keyring). Soldiers must run into many situations where a lanyard would be useful, or where it would be handy to clip their SAK to something.

tanker · **Reply #20 on:** January 10, 2009, 01:47:32 AM

Wow I didn´t know the SAK I bought some time ago was the Soldier, the official Swiss Soldier´s Knife!

(I bought it just because I liked it a lot)
Many THANKS to this forum.

Mine has a ´07 stamped on the blade, my lucky number

Sea Monster · **Reply #21 on:** January 10, 2009, 04:15:06 AM

This thread got boring when people stopped posting pictures.

AndyTiedye · **Reply #22 on:** January 10, 2009, 04:54:26 AM

Quote from: max6166 on January 09, 2009, 07:02:11 PM

I still think it is very weird that the Soldiers stopped having a bail (and no keyring). Soldiers must run into many situations where a lanyard would be useful, or where it would be handy to clip their SAK to something.

Then they'd get a Wenger "Standard Issue"

max6166 · **Reply #23 on:** January 10, 2009, 05:04:20 AM

Quote from: AndyTiedye on January 10, 2009, 04:54:26 AM

Quote from: max6166 on January 09, 2009, 07:02:11 PM
I still think it is very weird that the Soldiers stopped having a bail (and no keyring). Soldiers must run into many situations where a lanyard would be useful, or where it would be handy to clip their SAK to something.

Then they'd get a Wenger "Standard Issue"

Yep, that's one of the reasons why I prefer the SI.

Benner · **Reply #24 on:** January 10, 2009, 07:26:44 PM

Quote from: max6166 on January 10, 2009, 05:04:20 AM

Quote from: AndyTiedye on January 10, 2009, 04:54:26 AM
Quote from: max6166 on January 09, 2009, 07:02:11 PM
I still think it is very weird that the Soldiers stopped having a bail (and no keyring). Soldiers must run into many situations where a lanyard would be useful, or where it would be handy to clip their SAK to something.

Then they'd get a Wenger "Standard Issue"

Yep, that's one of the reasons why I prefer the SI.

There are a few bits better on the SI IMO.