Cull Update

[AimlessWanderer]

oh, I sometimes have zip ties in the pouch too 
those are eye drops (I had dry eyes for a while after the LASIK surgery)

Ah, ok  I was thinking superglue in vials that size would be great, but too easily opened accidentally. Artificial tears makes more sense. 

[Aloha]

Patina.  Its probably a whole topic unto itself.  I agree that my usage and wear on any tool is nice to see.  It wasn't so a while ago as I wanted my tools in their pristine condition.  When I began my voyage of buying to try I got nearly all my tools used so they can with patina.  Not a lot but no marks from me.  That probably when I began my polish stage.  I wanted to put the wear on the tool.  Later I began to quite like the look of honest wear.  Well, wear that appears to have been thru usage not abuse or neglect. 
   

[gerleatherberman]

If this has been coveref already, please ignore. Have you tried cloth wheel(on bench grinder, drill or dremel) polishing to get the major imperfections out if the steel surface? Then using the Mesh to finish it off?

[AimlessWanderer]

If this has been coveref already, please ignore. Have you tried cloth wheel(on bench grinder, drill or dremel) polishing to get the major imperfections out if the steel surface? Then using the Mesh to finish it off?

I haven't, to be honest, but if 600 grit wet and dry hasn't shifted it, I can't see a cloth/felt wheel fetching it out much quicker. 

Scratching it with a pin (aren't Swiss knives great ) I reckon they might be 4 to 6 thou deep in places. I'd probably be better off hitting the waterstones with them, if I wanted to get them perfect. I don't think it's worth that much effort though.

[gerleatherberman]

IMO. The cloth polishing wheels and compound are ideal for heavy polishing. Only downside is that it removes a lot of material to achieve the results. The SideClip would be fine I think, as the frame is very sturdy to begin with. I've polished out an entire Mr. Pinchy before with red compound and a 3400rpm 6" wheel. Only took an hour and it had those kind of pits and orange peel as well. Your MicroMesh pads as the last stage would give it a mirror-esque finish I think. If I hadn't gifted it to a friend(who fell in love with it for some reason), I'd snap some photos.

I've never tried the wheels for drills or dremels for large polish jobs, but I assume the time taken would be considerably longer. But, and I don't immediately recall, several members have used them with success. Just something to look into. I'm not an expert with it, but I do know from my limited experience that hand polishing is arduous at best when the metal surface isn't good to start with.

[AimlessWanderer]

IMO. The cloth polishing wheels and compound are ideal for heavy polishing. Only downside is that it removes a lot of material to achieve the results. The SideClip would be fine I think, as the frame is very sturdy to begin with. I've polished out an entire Mr. Pinchy before with red compound and a 3400rpm 6" wheel. Only took an hour and it had those kind of pits and orange peel as well. Your MicroMesh pads as the last stage would give it a mirror-esque finish I think. If I hadn't gifted it to a friend(who fell in love with it for some reason), I'd snap some photos.

I've never tried the wheels for drills or dremels for large polish jobs, but I assume the time taken would be considerably longer. But, and I don't immediately recall, several members have used them with success. Just something to look into. I'm not an expert with it, but I do know from my limited experience that hand polishing is arduous at best when the metal surface isn't good to start with.

Sadly, a Dremel is all I have  I do have a (slow) benchtop pillar drill, but again, I think I'd have my work cut out there. There's also the risk of dishing it and getting distorted reflections, which I think would look worse (more obvious) than a bit of minor residual pitting. Besides which, the first time I drop it, or dim wittedly put it in a pocket with something else metallic, it'll pick up a few new blemishes anyway

[gerleatherberman]

I know what you mean. I hesitate to carry my beater tools after I remove scratches. Even knowing I could just remove the new scratches as easily. And also repolishing, knowing it'll be scratched anyway. Multitool paradox!

[AimlessWanderer]

Light and time.

I've never been as adventurous in these areas. For many years, I didn't even own a working wrist watch. Today,  have three watches for the wrist, two for the pocket (three if you count the Voyager Lite from earlier), and a fob watch for the belt. I'll talk a little about these next.

Aside from the lights that were included in the combos shown previously, there's not a lot lurking in the drawer. Of those, the Sunwayman V10R is the most carried. I'm surprised the dimmer switch concept hasn't become more popular. I think it's a perfect way to regulate brightness. A simple on/off switch and a twist ring. The headlamps and paclite come out for camping and such, but the others rarely come out to play these days. It's always nice having a couple of spares in the drawer though.

By far the most carried light of all though, aside from whatever happens to be on my keys at the time, is my rather beaten up Quark AA. I tend to keep this set up up with the two cell tube, but I do have a single cell tube for it too. This light is almost a permanent fixture in my pocket carry for 6 months of the year.

[AimlessWanderer]

None of my watches are expensive. I've always bought a cheapie, use it till it breaks, chuck it, and buy another. If you total up the cost of all the watches that I've bought in my life, it wouldn't buy one luxury watch. For some reason, I'm happier to spend £50 on a knife than a watch.

Here's what I currently have.

A cheapo Sekonda chronograph. The chronograph function often malfunctions, with the hands not zeroing after use, but it holds reasonable time. Despite it's meagre cost, I've had a couple of watch enthusiasts go "oh that's nice, what's that?" when they've caught a casual glance of it, only to be told it costs less than a good night out. It's nice and easy to read too, which is a must for my gammy eyesight. I haven't worn it for ages though, and I need a new battery for it. I'll be doing that this month or next. Not a watch I wear often, but nice to have working when I'm in the mood for something a little more dressy than my plastic cased regular wear.

The Casio AO-S800W was cheap, and my first solar watch. Heinnie had it on sale, and it's been a good set it and forget it watch. It's a nice light watch, which doesn't snag of cuffs and pockets, and cheap enough that I won't get upset if I mangle it.

The G-Shock AWG-M100 was something I traded a couple of tools for on here. I'd never pay that much for a semi-digital watch, and have only ever paid that much for one watch in my entire life, but I had a couple of spare tools to weigh in for it. I love it. Looks good, handles my frequent arguements with gravity very well, and maintenance consists of leaving it on the windowsill for a day or two, while I wear something else. That's the level of maintenance I like in a watch

[AimlessWanderer]

If I'm going to wear a pocket watch, most times it will be the cheapo stainless cased Sekonda quartz. I don't mind giving that a hard time. The dial is nice and clear, and the half hunter case actually functions as a low level magnifier, for when I don't have any other mag glass of fresnel lens on me. I need to take this to get a new battery fitted. I can get the back off, but my eyesight isn't good enough to remove the stem to access the on battery.

The gold Rotary mechanical only comes out on events where I'm in black tie, or otherwise dressed quite formally. This was my most expensive watch ever, and is still pretty cheap. It's not a Swiss mechanism, but doesn't need to be. It needs to be accurate for one day every few years, and handles that just fine

The fob watch was cheap, very cheap, and has had some serious abuse. It was the only watch I'd wear (on a belt loop) when I was working in heavy engineering, and was handled with oily hands, bashed around, dropped, and still always gave me the time. I'll be getting a battery for this soon too. For the last couple of years, all I've worn has been has been my plastic fantastics. It's got quite a bit of wear on it now, but I don't mind that at all.

So nothing "exciting" on the watch front, but that's how I like it. While i've never minded paying for a decent pocket knife, when it comes to watches, I stick at the Rough Rider end of the spectrum, but lets be honest, they do some decent pocket knives too.

[AimlessWanderer]

I know what you mean. I hesitate to carry my beater tools after I remove scratches. Even knowing I could just remove the new scratches as easily. And also repolishing, knowing it'll be scratched anyway. Multitool paradox!

That won't bother me too much. I just want one of the Sideclips to look shinier than a brushed finish, even if it does have some signs of being a working tool. I'll persevere with the 600 grit and micromesh, and see what I end up with 

[gerleatherberman]

 
Looking forward to the results, AW!

[AimlessWanderer]

You'll be waiting a while 

I've got one of the four handle pieces done with 600 grit wet and dry, and I've now got to repeat all that work through each of the 9 sheets of micromesh. Then of course, there's whatever innards I choose to polish up too.

In the meantime, my mind has started drifting again 

This thread has been really useful for me, in respect of getting my head around what I have left, what I hope to add (mods), and then how much further I'd like to cut back.

I'm very mindful of the fact that I own a lot of stuff that isn't getting used, and that does irritate me a bit (OK, a lot  ). As an example, just veering away from knives and tools, lets look at pens. I have my favourites, both in terms of regular users, and ones that have some personal history attached to them. I also have a few cheap fountain pens, and a few mechanical pencils. So why the smurf have I got so many single use pens and pencils?

I was sorting through some stuff earlier today, and needed a pen. I didn't have one of my regular ones near me, so I grabbed the tub with all the "everything else" pens in.... and what I was doing before didn't matter anymore. There in the tub was a huge pile of pens and pencils that are just clutter. I know they all work, because it's only a few months ago that I went through them all, and chucked all the dead ones away. But in doing so, I kept items that don't get used.

My head started doing somersaults then. If I keep using my favourites, this tub is just going to sit there, until I next go through it, and chuck out all the pens that have dried up between now and then. The only thing stopping me throwing them out now, it that it would be a waste to throw away pens that work, but it's also a waste to just let them sit there until they dry up. So which is the biggest waste? Using my favourites, and letting these dry up, or putting the favourites aside, so I can use these up?

This is the kind of things my head does

Continued...

[AimlessWanderer]

... and this started me thinking about tools again.

I've got a load of knives I hardly ever (if at all) put into use. The pic attached is most but not all of the slippies that I've got, which never cut anything.

That same question (which is worse, using the favourites, and ignoring the rest, or putting the others to use, and spending less time with the favourites) applies here too. 20 years ago, i'd have been happy with any two or three of these, even though they're not my current favourites. They'd have done all my cutting tasks, and I'd have been happy to own them and put them to use. Now they just take up drawer space - but I don't necessarily want to get rid of them all either...

So the same quandary applies. Do I just stick them back in a drawer for another few years, or do I put my favourites away, and spend a few months with stuff that in some cases has never cut anything it it's life.

I haven't squared that circle yet

[tosh]

Hey Al

I'm intrigued by your cull.
I've reached a point where I too no longer want to hoard stuff. I'm currently debating the most effective way to down size the collection. The trade forums here obviously, but also considering ebay as much much bigger audience. Just wondered if you've sold many there ? I know that if using ebay I need to not mention the "knife" word also upload no pictures showing the blades either.
Have you (or any other members) had much selling success outside these two areas, i.e Gumtree, Facebook etc etc?

I'm going to really cull my collection - At least 80-90% of the Victorinox will go, Half the LM collection too possibly and a fair chunk of Gerber and SOG.

I've pondered the cull for quite sometime, But the recent sad news of Karl's passing has made me realise my collection would be a massive headache to my family, plus I'm getting sick of the sight of a lot of it.

[AimlessWanderer]

Never sold ANYTHING on ebay, Nick, or the others for that matter. I've always sold here, giving the tools a good home, and going for the safer sale, rather than the higher price.

Ebay for best price, here for "mates rates". Time scale plays a factor too. Drip feed here, or mass purge there. If you're happy to drip feed, offer stuff here, then shift it elsewhere if there's no takers. If there's anything you particularly want top dollar on, you've more chance elsewhere. I always try to chucka bit back into the kitty here too

My motivations were a bit different. I had to raise some cash due to being unable to work, and being a user rather than collector, I started getting claustrophobic being swamped by stuff that wasn't getting use. Not just MTO stuff either. If there's anything I'm unlikely to use in the foreseeable future (2 to 5 years, depending on the item) I want it gone. Ideally, I want to get my entire possessions down so I could comfortably go from a two bedroom house, to one bedroom flat, without feeling congested.

I have a long way to go...

[tosh]

You hit the nail on the head with the word " claustrophobic "  thats exactly the phrase I keep saying to myself. I'm pretty sick of the sight of all the stuff I've accumulated. The vast majority of mine is run of the mill which probably wouldn't sell for much here but would shift quickly on eBay
The rarer stuff I have would appeal much more to members here, but I'm in no rush to sell those as yet. I have around 5 very large plastic storage containers, I reckon I could in theory reduce it down to 1 extra large container - that's not counting Wenger. The Wenger is staying put for a while.
By the end of the year I'm hoping to have built a secure walk in closet in the loft. I'm then hoping to store everything completely out of sight - well that's the plan anyway 

[AimlessWanderer]

Good luck with it all, Nick 

[AimlessWanderer]

As mentioned in another thread, I've been trying out yet another combo today... 



I finally got round to fixing the smurfed up Micra that Leatherman shipped out unfinished. The scissor rivet was made too short I think, which meant it didn't peen up properly. As received, with no use or carry time, I could get 0.25mm (0.010") feeler gauges inbetween the blades at the pivot...



... and what seemed like about 0.5mm (0.020") side to side play...



... as new, from the factory, on their 30th anniversary ST300 set.

I managed to peen it up to a clearance of 0.04-0.05mm (just under 0.002") using pin punches, so it didn't completely mangle the top face of the rivet, or leave unsightly pop marks. The Micra is a tool, defect aside, which I've always struggled to incorporate into any of my combos with any real satisfaction. Same applies with the Style PS, which is why I decided to try them together.

The problem with that combo, is the only thing that the Style introduces, that the Micra doesn't have is the pliers. It's already got bottle opener, tweezers, scissors (which is good, because the spring on the Style PS scissors has snapped again), nail file, and a very similarly profiled screwdriver. As such, I might need to either replace the Style with something else, or mod it with something the Micra doesn't have.

Work in progress...

The little toothpick knife was dull, my fault, I should have checked first. In trying to hand sharpen it, there was a somewhat disconcerting flex to the blde, which rematerialised while trying to sharpen a pencil with it. Not a fault of the knife, but the overzealous operator. It did however make me wonder if this combo might require a little extra oomph, so I'll be adding some extras to the pockets tomorrow... (pic attached)

If I do piece together a working combo from this lot, I think it will benefit greatly from a pocket pouch. 

[AimlessWanderer]

So the same quandary applies. Do I just stick them back in a drawer for another few years, or do I put my favourites away, and spend a few months with stuff that in some cases has never cut anything it it's life.

I haven't squared that circle yet

I decided all the forgotten items need some carry time, even those that have never been used before. What's the point of owning them, if I can't enjoy them, right?

Over the last couple of days, I've been carrying these two knives. One hadn't been carried for over 10 years, and the other had never been carried (by me) at all.





I've really enjoyed straying beyond the normal carry items, and over the next few weeks, I'll be bringing a lot more dormant items back to the fore. It may well mean I feel swamped again, and get the urge to offload more, but I'd rather have that, than have a pile of stuff cluttering up drawers and not doing anything useful for several more years.

Here's the items that have had some use, but ended up forgotten about in drawers, which will be given another chance to vie for a more active life. Also, the four locally made pieces that have never actually made it to the pocket yet, despite being a few decades old in some cases. I hope to be giving them all some carry time over the next few weeks.

[Aloha]

Good to see you take those tools for a spin.  Who knows, maybe this time round one or a few might make the cut and see some usage  .  I like the retry tools that I liked but for whatever reason didn't stick.  My Skeletool is a great example of that.  I feel my Juice S2 and CS4 are tools that both deserved 2nd and 3rd tries.  I'm glad I did as the both see some pocket time so keeping them was worth it. 

[AimlessWanderer]

I think it's always worth revisiting stuff after a while. I've done it a few times. The Rebar, CS4 and XE6 were no better second time round, but the Sideclip was, and became one of my favourite pocket pliers. Life is also very different now, and the tasks have changed, which affects how well tools will suit my needs. The biggest change is my mindset, and wanting to use stuff that I previously didn't. Owning a NIB penknife from the 80s has become more pointless. I want it in my pocket.

I've lost the reasons to use my 7" stag handled bowie, but I can now use that NIB penknife, which wouldn't have been "enough" knife before. Yes, I could do everything I need to do now with the old favourites, but I can also discover new ones, from stuff that's already here. What was I saving those unused items for? The answer is, I was saving them for now There's no great monetary value to them, but there's potentially lots of usage value. I'm also less worried about breakage. I used to have a mindset whereby I would be very upset if a knife crapped out on me. I think now, I'd more easily think "never mind, I've got spares" and just move on to a different knife, happy that I'm outliving the tools, rather than pointlessly hoping they outlive me.

I remember when I got the pocket knife I inherrited from my grandfather. My grandmother was rooting through a tin, looking for something, and it had several of my grandfathers penknives in. Some had broken backsprings or cracked scales, and all of them looked well worn. THAT'S what I want to leave behind. Well worn stuff, not immaculate stuff. In fact, never mind leave behind, that's what I want to use now Stuff that I got new, that looks like it's been used daily for many years.

That's part of wanting to downsize too. With too many options, nothing gets enough use to develop that "faithful companion" look. In a strange way, I actually feel a bit disappointed that some of the items I've had for many years don't LOOK like I've had it many years. I do have a few though 

[AimlessWanderer]

When you've got stuff distributed through various kits, or strategically placed around the house, you don't get a true perspective of just how much stuff you've accumulated.

Earlier in the thread, I showed this pic...



... of a few miscellaneous lights that aren't doing much at the minute. As part of my "use stuff to find out if you want to keep it", I started playing around with lanyards, long lanyards that I can cow hitch to the belt, for all the lights that don't have pocket clips or aren't already fastened to something.

As you might expect, I discovered a few that needed a battery change, which progressed to checking the batteries in everything, which progressed further to getting all my lights together in one pic...

  More than I expected to see.

I did have even more, but have sold some, and given some away. None are particularly high powered. There's only one that goes above 200 lumens, and many of them are quite underrated to what's available now, but they're plenty good enough for my needs.

[AimlessWanderer]

Man down 

In working through all the lights, I discovered this Nitecore T0 has packed up. Last time I used it, all was well, but now it's kaput. Tried cleaning the threads and contacts, but no joy. Although I'm cutting down overall, I will replace this with something. Everything in the Fuse-ilier kit (which this is from) is orange, so I'll need to pick up a replacement of some description to continue that theme, unless I find a compatible replacement head.

I'm still working through the rest of the pile, so there may be more casualties yet. Failures are to be expected periodically with electronic stuff.

On the upside, I've got my Lumapower D-mini VX back up and running on 18650s. It's not a retina burning powerhouse at only 250/300lm at full tilt, but has excellent run times, particularly at the mid level. I'm not sure what the mid level is, but the high runs for 3 hours, and low is 13lm for 91hrs

[AimlessWanderer]

Sorted out a few drawers today. While some of my stuff is assigned to fixed kits, the bulk of it is still pick 'n' mix. Grab a pliers tool, grab a knife, and away you go.

Till now, I had all the pliers tools in one drawer, but there's certain tools I'll carry with a Swiss knife, and others I'll carry with a traditional folder. I decided to swap things round, and put the right pliers tools with the right knives. It just minimises the drawers to go through to put a day's toolset together (and makes it seem like I don't have so many pliers tools  )

Pic 1 - Swiss knives, relevant pliers tools, and mini-combos

Pic 2 - Traditional (mostly) folders, and relevant pliers tools.

Pic 3 - Neck knives, lock knives, clipped OHO slippies, and a couple of sheath knives.

[AimlessWanderer]

Following on from something that was discussed earlier in this thread, I thought of something which might help lend a little focus on where I go from here in terms of usage, and possibly even further downsizing. It was just a simple question that popped into my head...

In 10 years (or whenever) which tools do I want to look as good as they do today, and which do I want to look like they've been put to hard graft day in, day out?

At the moment, I (still) have so much stuff, even the most carried pocket knives might only see a month of carry a year. So nothing is really getting that "wow, you got some mileage out of that one" look. If I'm going to achieve that on any of my tools, I need to be focussing on using them a lot more.

Duplicates would be a good place to start.

For example, I have two Case Barlows, the herringbone one has had a lot more use than the one with scrolled bolsters (the equivalent of a couple of year's carry on one, and a couple of days on the other), but doesn't see as much carry time as it could. The horn IXL barlow has also probably seen about a year's worth of use, whereas the rosewood one hasn't even seen one day's carry. I'd like my brushed stainless Wenger Traveller to keep looking respectable, but would love the Evowood 14 to develop the "faithful companion" look. I have two Byrd Terns, which don't look much different in terms of condition, and maybe they should.

I have two Sideclips, though one is in pieces getting polished up a little. Maybe the other should show more signs of being used. Both of the sheath knives I made in 2007 have been been mollycoddled far too much, and need to start looking like they've worked for a living (they do have a little wear to them, but not 12 year's worth).

I don't mind using the others occasionally, in fact I'd get bloody annoyed with myself if I didn't, but maybe sticking to certain ones and kicking the snot out of them (knowing I have back ups) would make me feel more like I'm actually more value from these tools. It feels too much like a collection at the moment, instead of an arsenal of working tools. Maybe more battle scars, and evidence of repeated sharpening is what is needed to make me feel better about the glut that still remains ...

[AimlessWanderer]

Ok, I'm going to try to stick to picking from these tools on weekdays, and only let myself carry something different at weekends. Lets see how long it is before I get bored 

[Aloha]

Good read.  I love seeing tools and items that have had years of faithful service.  I particularly enjoy seeing leather thats worn.  I've seen hammers that show exactly where the owner has held it over the years.  Tools that show a respectable working life.  Whats I also enjoy is the thought that someone spent their hard earned money to acquire the tool and used the heck out of it. 

Now that being said, I can also appreciate a well cared for tool.  Once that has been used but shows little evidence of it.  I've always admired tools that look as good as they did when they left the package.  I know its hard to imagine a tool that has worked that shows little wear.  I've seen them and have a few.  They might not have decades on them but several years at the least.  They just were made to take it and come out fine. 

I have go to tools.  Tools that I carry when work needs to be done.  Tools I instinctively reach for when I have a project.  There are other tools that I consider stand by tools.  Great tools and tools I can rely on.  Fact is I just have to many to choose from.  Not every one will get life time of work in as a result.  Kit tools like my evacuation and car kit tools were chosen because I can rely on them.  My hike kit tools are there because if I needed them I know they'd perform.  Camping tools were chosen because they perform best in that role.  Since I don't use any of these tool often enough they wont develop the patina they should.  If I were to use the same fixed blade across several kits then you'd see some serious patina. 

I'm ok with how this will work out.  I try to keep my stand by tools close so they can get a work out.  I try to rotate what I carry or carry multiple items and use them throughout their carry time.  I was off today and worked in they yard all day.  I carried 2 fixed blades.  I used one to dig out a few weeds while the other broke down some boxes and cut jute to tie up plants.  I also carried my Surge and SI.  I tired to make it a point to used each tool.  If I used one cuting tool all day that tool would surely show wear over a shorter period.  I enjoyed using each tool as the task presented itself.  Yes I was way over prepared but I had fun with each tool.   

[AimlessWanderer]

I've seen hammers that show exactly where the owner has held it over the years.  Tools that show a respectable working life.  Whats I also enjoy is the thought that someone spent their hard earned money to acquire the tool and used the heck out of it. 

Now that being said, I can also appreciate a well cared for tool.  Once that has been used but shows little evidence of it.  I've always admired tools that look as good as they did when they left the package.  I know its hard to imagine a tool that has worked that shows little wear.

I'm really glad you just said that!

Those two points, the well used and well cared for, are why I made the decision regarding the two Wenger Travelers. The stainless one will show less wear externally that the Evowood will (which will hopefully wear like the hammers you mentioned), and so I want to keep the stainless one looking well maintained, while I don't mind the wooden scaled one looking like it been used hard for several years. I totally agree that there's a different type of elegance to both.

I have my hiking, camping, travelling kits too. My Diesel mod and fuse mod look pretty much immaculate compared to a lot of my gear. Even when I carry them, I don't always need to use them. My Wave mod looks like it's been dug out of a plane crash in comparison.

The faux pearl scaled penknife I was using recently, needs to stay as pristine as sensibly possible, which is why I made a little leather slip for it. It won't take wear well. Whereas the four main slippies that I'll be using have all had plenty of carry time already, and will just get better and better as time takes its toll. One of them was actually the only UK legal knife I owned for many years, and I'm impressed how well it still looks

Those are the four that I most want looking like I travelled the world with them.

My others will pick up some character along the way, that's inevitable. I have no desire for everything to look "wrecked", in fact the immaculate ones and the heavily used ones, both enhance the aesthetics of the other, to my mind. I'm quite happy to have occasional tools and regular tools, with the corresponding wear patterns. I just don't want to shuffle off this mortal coil looking like I never did anything with my tools, or that I abused everything I ever laid hands on

[AimlessWanderer]

As an aside, I gave my brother one of my Wenger Travelers (evo 14 I think) a few years ago. He has that one, whilst I have a multitude. His knife has been used responsibly (though not regularly sharpened  ) . Mine are all in decent nick, while his looks like it's been kicked from one end of the street to the other - and it's all just good honest wear. I know I've put at least as many miles in my tools as he has, but he put them all in one, whereas I didn't.