Blunt nose or Needle nose? your say....

[tosh]

I raised this question a few years ago, since then many new members have joined and so I'd like a updated view on this.

Personally I have zero use for a needlenose MT. I cannot actually think of a time when I needed to go and grab a pair. If I need pliers, Then pliers is what I need. I'm either gripping with considerable force, cutting, bending or twisting. All of which the current crop of Leatherman plier heads fail miserably. Occasionally they manage to cut something, but invariably it distorts the head.

So, who is the needlenose plier head aimed at? Yes, sparkys will find a use. But for DIY, construction etc etc, Needlenose will invariably be left in the toolbox and proper blunt nosed used instead.

I/m aware that Gerber do a fantastic blunt nosed head, but their internal tools are the archiles heel of the MP600 line. I have a box full of Gerber stuff, but would never edc any of the MP line as I feel the tool is too compromised.

The recent news of LM's new "FREE" series just leave me cold. just a case of the same old smurf, in smarter looking handles..yawn ZZZzzz.

I've now come to the only conclusion that I can think off. Leatherman knows their tools will NOT be able to stand up to daily punishment, and by bringing out a blunt head version that would open up a far more serious market, where users who were paying premium prices would expect a tool to deliver and leatherman secretly knows in the harsh real world their products can't cut mustard.

If Leatherman are reading this...prove me wrong.

Otherwise they should market their products more honestly. A handy pocketable gadget. But not to be used as a replacement for REAL  tools.

Because in reality virtually all multitools are nothing other than gadgets.

I love gadgets, I have several hundred of them!
But I wouldn't use any for real world use.

[AimlessWanderer]

Needle nose for me. I've just taken the blunt nosed pliers off my MP600 and put needle nosed on.

I don't need high gripping force with multitool pliers. I want precise control, whether that's reaching into nooks and crannies where my fingers won't fit, or holding something fiddly with one hand, while filing it with the other, or whatever. Blunt nosed are more cumbersome, and I'd rather have a more precise plier in my pocket, and go to fetch a more durable plier if I need it, than the other way round.

[Poncho65]

I use MTs on a jobsite and I have used a few of them pretty hard Masonry is one of the roughest trades on tools so I think I can vouch for LM being able to be used as a real tool I use needle nose quite a bit as I use it to grip stuff like small nails, you may not have much use for them but I sure do Blunt nose is fine but I do prefer the needle nose hybrid tools

[MickeS]

Needle nose for me. I've just taken the blunt nosed pliers off my MP600 and put needle nosed on.

I don't need high gripping force with multitool pliers. I want precise control, whether that's reaching into nooks and crannies where my fingers won't fit, or holding something fiddly with one hand, while filing it with the other, or whatever. Blunt nosed are more cumbersome, and I'd rather have a more precise plier in my pocket, and go to fetch a more durable plier if I need it, than the other way round.

Jupp!

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[Poncho65]

If I had waited I could have just agreed with Al

[Syncop8r]

So... multitools aren't for real-world use, although you expect Leathermans to be? 

For me: needle nose on smaller, finer MTs, blunt nose on the bigger real-world ones.

[AimlessWanderer]

If I had waited I could have just agreed with Al

 

As an aside, needle nosed pliers are also better for accessing older electrical cabinets, and loosening the nut on an angle grinder, if you don't have the cabinet key or peg spanner to hand. Much better for pulling turnings or thorns from the tread of your shoe too, or using an off-hand grinding wheel to grind something small. Far more important for my multitool to have versatility than brute strength.

It's very rare for my pocket pliers to not be "enough" for the job at hand.

[gregpost]

Needlenose on Leatherman tools are so good, useful, and in my opinion pretty tough. From pinching clamps, being fine enough to remove splinters and thorns, tough enough to twist fencing wire.

[tosh]

I beg to differ
Most of my tools are good quality...especially the pliers.
The jaws are so precise that when closed the tip can still grab a human hair. Yet powerful enough to bend nails, strong enough to cut through nails too!
I just don't agree, I think blunt nosed would be equally if not more versatile in real world scenarios.
If LM don't have the expertise to develop proper heads, then maybe they should consider outsourcing to proper tool manufacturers.

Regardless, I've probably got well in excess of 100 LM's - there isn't a single one that I would reach for if I needed to know it would get the job done.

I just find it bizzare that the new FREE range brings nothing new to real world scenarios.

[Syncop8r]

I just find it bizzare that the new FREE range brings nothing new to real world scenarios.

I think the Free series is more about quick and easy (outside) access.

[Poncho65]

Just have to agree to disagree on this one cause there is no changing your mind and definitely not changing mine on the matter

[AimlessWanderer]

I just don't agree, I think blunt nosed would be equally if not more versatile in real world scenarios.

I tried it. It didn't work in my real world scenarios. I don't need to bend or cut nails.  Different people have different plier needs though.

[MMR]

Needle nose pliers for me.

The times I need pliers, it’s usually to reach in places where my fingers won’t fit or are unable to grab.

I do t really have any need for a blunt nose pair of pliers, and the times I do; I prefer a proper linesman pliers as it’s usually electrical related


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[SteveC]

Just have to agree to disagree on this one cause there is no changing your mind and definitely not changing mine on the matter

 


I was going to pile on but I won't   

[tosh]

Al, I've never come across a angle grinder that uses a nut
I thought they were universally threaded boss's which require a two pin key?

I took a surge out once on a MTB ride, a mate had issues with his bike...the plers were completely useless. I edc'ed a wave for a while, again the pliers constantly let me down...and I won't even touch on the plethora of flat tips...dear god!!

I've just come to view multitools as such a drastic compromise that they are essentially useless in most cases - hence why not many people carry or use them. Clearly you are all biased as this is a MT forum 
I get the toolbelt carry for emergency..I really do get that. But as a daily workable tool...no..just NO! I'd prefer to carry a separate box cutter, pliers and 6way screwdriver.

But, the MT could be so much more... I really do think it could be built to the higher standards of stand alone tools and thus so much more versatile.

I'm not denying the needlenose has a place, for delicate work a Rebar/Fuse would be perfect
But C'mon, the Surge/ST300 are huge, yet they still carry the limiting needlenose heads...WHY??

[AimlessWanderer]

Al, I've never come across a angle grinder that uses a nut
I thought they were universally threaded boss's which require a two pin key?

Yup! They're the ones  if the peg spanner has gone walkabout (which they often do), stick the tips of LM pliers in each hole and twist. Can't do that with blunt nose 

I took a surge out once on a MTB ride, a mate had issues with his bike...the plers were completely useless. I edc'ed a wave for a while, again the pliers constantly let me down...and I won't even touch on the plethora of flat tips...dear god!!

I've just come to view multitools as such a drastic compromise that they are essentially useless in most cases - hence why not many people carry or use them. Clearly you are all biased as this is a MT forum 
I get the toolbelt carry for emergency..I really do get that. But as a daily workable tool...no..just NO! I'd prefer to carry a separate box cutter, pliers and 6way screwdriver.

But, the MT could be so much more... I really do think it could be built to the higher standards of stand alone tools and thus so much more versatile.

Again, we have walked different paths. I've found them invaluable. I came here because I was finding these pocket tools highly useful, not the other way round  I've spent a lot of time in heavy engineering machine shops, tool room workshops, marine environments, and set construction for plays. My pocket pliers were useful in every one of those. Most times I needed pliers, the ones in my pocket had done the job before the other guy had got his pliers (I let them go fetch before I got my pliers out, so he wouldn't be in my way  ). They've been equally useful gardening at home, lifting hot pots off the stove/fire while camping, or even just lifting the lid on the pot. At home, they pull staples, clear the clump of hair from the plug hole, the foil pull to open thing on juice cartons, that they never make long enough to get hold of, and pulled car fuses too. I only cut soft wire, never hard wire or nails. When I do need a lot of gripping force, it's usually with the main gripping are, not the tip. I completely wore out one on my multitools due to using them so much, a MP700, though I blame that on the hollow construction for hiding the spring in.

In fact, I have had times when even a Spirit's pliers were too blunt, and I've had to go looking for something finer.

[gerleatherberman]

I carry a BN OG Gerber MP and my main NN user tool simultaneously. Can't think of any reason a the average worker would need BN pliers over NN. I use BN pliers 10%-20% of the time with my restoration job. NN the rest of the time.
Love having BN pliers with me in the pocketable light weight OG MP, but they just don't do as much as NN pliers day-to-day for me. Everyone's mileage varies.

One of the worst things LM could have done to the Free series is made it BN from the factory(and the Free cannot stand the added cost of offering a BN option. Costs too much already). Most LM users wouldn't even know why the jaw tips were so huge. It is just too easy(for us MT guys) to make NN pliers into BN pliers. Doesn't work so well the other way around.

The reason most humans don't carry MTs is, because most humans simply don't need tools or don't know how to use them well enough to carry an MT.

And I have to disagree with the MP600 implements being overly compromised. You simply just don't know the ins and outs of using the tool. 

[Happy Gilmore]

Interesting topic as I have found that I would love to have a Crunch to COMPLIMENT a needle nose plier. There is something each can do better than the other. But a knipex 5" plier can compliment any good MT, but there is no world where I carry a dedicated needle nose plier to complement a blunt nose MT.

So for that reason I prefer needle nose pliers on a MT. But I think you should really check out the Crunch.

A MT can 100% replace a needle nose with no drawback whatsoever. But there are many good wrenchers that a MT could never compete with. Knipex 7" plier wrench for example. Which might be the best plier ever created.

[jrandom]

I have to say the needlenose is super practical for 90% of what most use the tool for. I have a couple of Swiss tools, I never carry use them simply because of their "needle" nose plier to too blunt. Also, have some first gen Gerber OTF  in all it's palm pinching bluntnose plierness, man that pffft'er has given me some pinch blood blisters from trying to plier to hard.

IMHO if you really need a blunt plier you shouldn't be using a multitool in the first place.

[ThePeacent]

I agree with all the above comments,
especially with GLBM in that I always carry a NN and BN multitool at work, and I use NN most of the time
Also, as he said is easier to blunt a NN tool than to lengthen and taper a BN 



And as Happy Gilmore and jrandom say, a Knipex will always beat any MT in pure force, torque ad strength so it makes sense to compliment a dedicated tool with a NN-pliers multitool, for delicate work, and no the other way around 

[gerleatherberman]

  ThePeacent.

[McStitchy]

I agree with all the above comments,
especially with GLBM in that I always carry a NN and BN multitool at work, and I use NN most of the time
Also, as he said is easier to blunt a NN tool than to lengthen and taper a BN 

(Image removed from quote.)

And as Happy Gilmore and jrandom say, a Knipex will always beat any MT in pure force, torque ad strength so it makes sense to compliment a dedicated tool with a NN-pliers multitool, for delicate work, and no the other way around 

Thanks for saving my time writing a rather lengthy comment     

Both have their place depending on the needs.

[Happy Gilmore]

Thanks for saving my time writing a rather lengthy comment     

Both have their place depending on the needs.

I think everyone needs to come to grips with the fact that at MT can't do everything. But a MT is STRICTLY better than carrying a dedicated needle nose plier 100% of the time.

Vice grip tools, the Kipex Plier Wrench, and a large wrench like the Knipex 7" Cobra have no actual substitute in function. Although I really want to give a Crunch a workout. I would be so happy if it truly compared to relatively similar sized vice grip.

Cheers,
H.G.

[Huntsman]

(i)I've just come to view multitools as such a drastic compromise that (ii) they are essentially useless in most cases - (iii) hence why not many people carry or use them.

Statement 1 - True - Of course MTs are a drastic compromise - That is their whole design concept and reason to be - And a brilliant compromise at that - 20 or more functions in one package - Fantastic
Statement 2 - False - This is just too ridiculous to even refute    
Statement 3 - False - At a production rate in the LM plant of 8,000 tools per day - never mind all the other MT manufacturers - This cannot be true

What I think is true is that, due to social and legal resons, people may be carrying tools less and (present company excepted of course) - We as humans are getting less capable of fixing things
But remember this is also due to the way everyday products are manufactured these days - They are made to be disposable not fixed - So this is not due to the capability of any tool !
Or the products are made so that only completely speciaist tools from that manufacturer can disassemble a product (think cars!)
A few decades ago I bought and replaced a heating element in a clothes iron - Try doing that today - You probably won't get the iron apart and no-one will sell you an element.

As to the OP question:
I am not a heavy user of MTs - But I use my various PB-MTs several times a week, usually around the home - They are all perfectly capable and the needle nosed pliers usually are fine for me
But yes sometimes I do need blunt nosed - So it's off to the tool box. I may even have a slight preference for blunt nosed. But as the NN MT pliers have rarely, to never, failed me this is just not an issue.

I was interested in Ponchos comment about gripping small nails with NN pliers - I guess this is for hammering a nail in rather than pulling out !!
This is my one fail for NN - as far as pulling a nail out of wood is concerned - The NN tip just slips off the nail so you do need BN pliers or a dedicated nail puller
Which, if you have a Centre Drive, you will have on your MT !!   

[Poncho65]

I guess I should have clarified that I use it for holding small nails so when I use a hammer I hit the correct nail 

[Huntsman]

I agree with all the above comments,

What even Tosh's ?          

No offence here intended, but could not resist that 
And as we have often said in this forum, and even in this thread - Each to his own

As for the Free series - I got a mail from LM telling me that they had thrown out all their previous concepts of MTs and come up with something completely new
I opened the mail with great anticipation - ......... Oh it's the Free series - Which I already knew about from MTo of course - and IMHO is hardly radical.
So I, at least partially, agree with you on that one Tosh

[cody6268]

Both here. They have their advantages and disadvantages.   Typically for me, working out on the fields, I have three different types of pliers on me; My MT (needle nose), linesman's or fencing pliers (blunt nose), and my Knipex 4" Cobras (groove joint or "Channellock").  Blunt nose is good for fencing and mechanical work. Needlenose great for fine tasks, largely electrical and fencing (plus, they really help putting T-post clips on the posts and fence); and the Cobras are mostly for "on the other side" type stuff on bolts.

[gerleatherberman]

I guess I should have clarified that I use it for holding small nails so when I use a hammer I hit the correct nail 

Amazing! You and me both, Poncho!

I use NN pliers for starting small and medium  finishing nails in antique furniture. Two reasons: 1. Keeps nail straight and less likely to bend. 2. If I miss the nail, the pliers catch it and keep me from pummeling the wood, then a punch takes over the job. Hammer marks all over people's antique furniture gets me in deep poo with the owners.

[Poncho65]

Amazing! You and me both, Poncho!

I use NN pliers for starting small and medium  finishing nails in antique furniture. Two reasons: 1. Keeps nail straight and less likely to bend. 2. If I miss the nail, the pliers catch it and keep me from pummeling the wood, then a punch takes over the job. Hammer marks all over people's antique furniture gets me in deep poo with the owners.

I can imagine

[Aloha]

It always comes down to what you do for a living that determine you tool needs.  I like both NN and BN tho we do see mostly NN when it comes to multitools.  Gerber MrPinchy was the first I saw with BN then the Crunch.  I really like the Swisstool goldilocks of plier tips.  I do fine with NN but when I do need a BN plier I reach for dedicated tools.  I did blunt my Kick which worked out great for what it is.