Multitool.org Forum
+-

Hello Lurker! Remove this ad and much more by logging in.


This years projects.

Dean51 · 55 · 1938

us Offline Dean51

  • *
  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 4,558
  • Geometry cuts but the steel determines how long.
This years projects.
on: June 16, 2019, 06:26:35 PM
Earlier this year I swore off getting any new knives, don't worry about me I'm still in the rabbit hole.
What I'm doing is working on knife projects, I've got a dozen knives here that need slight tweeks that will make a big difference in them. Or that I've reground but left half finished. The half finished grinds are as ground on a 120 carbide belt, they're a bit scratchy looking.

I ordered some new silican carbide sanding belts that came in yesterday, 400, 800 and 700 trizat.
So at 6 AM I pulled out these four knives and went to work. There's a lot of difference between 120 grit and 400 grit. I could have stopped there but they still had a scratchy look and and I wanted to try out the 800 grit. The 800 grit has a nice satin look, rather than the scratchy look it had before. I think I'll stop there for now, but maybe not I still have to try the trizat belt.1095 is the only steel I like polished because that seems to make it harder for a patina to get started.

Tomorrow I'm going to tackle the Euro barlows.




se Offline RF52

  • *
  • Absolutely No Life Club
  • *******
    • Posts: 5,772
Re: This years projects.
Reply #1 on: June 16, 2019, 06:37:40 PM
Nice! :like: Good looking knives :hatsoff:

Sent fra min FRD-L09 via Tapatalk



gb Offline Wspeed

  • *
  • Just Bananas
  • *************
    • Posts: 76,225
Re: This years projects.
Reply #2 on: June 16, 2019, 06:50:30 PM
 :iagree: excellent work  :like: :tu:
fail to prepare prepare to fail


us Offline SteveC

  • Global Moderator
  • Just Bananas
  • *
    • Posts: 67,609
Re: This years projects.
Reply #3 on: June 16, 2019, 06:56:31 PM
 :like: :iagree: :tu:

Nice job Dean !


gb Offline Sparky415

  • Zombie Apprentice
  • ********
    • Posts: 12,996
Re: This years projects.
Reply #4 on: June 16, 2019, 09:57:51 PM

 :iagree: :iagree:
Everything’s adjustable


us Offline Dean51

  • *
  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 4,558
  • Geometry cuts but the steel determines how long.
Re: This years projects.
Reply #5 on: June 16, 2019, 10:10:58 PM
 :salute:
Thanks all. I am having fun, i tend to go nuts with nothing to do.


us Offline David

  • Absolutely No Life Club
  • *******
    • Posts: 7,673
Re: This years projects.
Reply #6 on: June 17, 2019, 06:48:11 AM
Those knives are looking really good Dean. Good job!    :like:
What? Enablers! Are you serrrrious? Where? I dont see any.
Hold Fast


us Offline David

  • Absolutely No Life Club
  • *******
    • Posts: 7,673
Re: This years projects.
Reply #7 on: June 17, 2019, 06:58:07 AM
:salute:
Thanks all. I am having fun, i tend to go nuts with nothing to do.


Hmmm   :think:   nothing to do huh.    :think:   Let's see here.   :think:    May be Moose might get loose and come down for a visit.     :D

* Moose.jpeg (Filesize: 15.37 KB)
What? Enablers! Are you serrrrious? Where? I dont see any.
Hold Fast


us Offline MadPlumbarian

  • *
  • Point Of No Return
  • **********
    • Posts: 37,128
  • Plumbers Know Their Crap!!
Re: This years projects.
Reply #8 on: June 17, 2019, 07:22:05 AM
Very nice, have fun!
JR
"The-Mad-Plumbarian" The Punisher Of Pipes!!! JR
As I sit on my Crapper Throne in the Reading Room and explode on the Commode, thinking, how my flush beat John’s and Jerry’s pair? Jack’s had to run for the Water Closet yet ended up tripping on a Can bowing and hitting his Head on the Porcelain God! 🚽


il Offline pomsbz

  • *
  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 2,594
Re: This years projects.
Reply #9 on: June 17, 2019, 08:43:43 AM
Nice work!
"It is better to lose health like a spendthrift than to waste it like a miser." - Robert Louis Stevenson


spam Offline comis

  • *
  • *
  • Zombie Apprentice
  • ********
    • Posts: 11,217
Re: This years projects.
Reply #10 on: June 17, 2019, 08:56:43 AM
Dean, that's great work!  Very even looking, looks awesome!

Btw, thank you for you and Steves' previous comments on rounding the tang, my GEC 54's pull has gone down from a 9 to 8, I am in process of keeping the blades open to mildly weaken the spring(been a few days, not very noticeable difference, but gonna give it another week or two).  I don't want to round the tang too aggressively, since I think it only really affects the pull once it is partially open. 


mc Offline Gerhard Gerber

  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 3,832
Re: This years projects.
Reply #11 on: June 17, 2019, 11:10:56 AM
I could kill for some trizact belts, but it seems my chances of getting pregnant are better  :facepalm:

Very nice work Dean!  :cheers:

Many questions......

What grinder are you using? 

Grinding edge up?

Speed? (just for interest sake)


I'm very much interested in your technique simply because I can't figure out a way that will give such nice results and not lead to some cut belts.

Flip it over and cut fingers is the next option  :rofl:


us Offline Dean51

  • *
  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 4,558
  • Geometry cuts but the steel determines how long.
Re: This years projects.
Reply #12 on: June 17, 2019, 03:06:38 PM
GG lots of questions, I'll work on making up answers thru the day.

 


us Offline Dean51

  • *
  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 4,558
  • Geometry cuts but the steel determines how long.
Re: This years projects.
Reply #13 on: June 17, 2019, 03:35:10 PM
Sod busters which I never liked have become a favorite this year, as close to perfect as the GEC is there's always room for improvement or to personalize.
The #71 was a slight bit harder to open than I usually like, going to see if it can become a little easier to open and keep it's strong snap when locking open.

The spring on the GEC is just a bit shorter than the tang and that's not a problem other than it causes a bit more drag when opening.


Tangs are usually left as stamped and only finished enough to fit and flush the back spring. In this case I cleaned up the stamping marks and put a small angle (less than 10 degrees) on the tang end that contacts the spring. That made the first 10 or 15 percent of the opening much smother but didn't affect the rest of the opening.

I then added a small half radius to the tangs corner that smoothed it out until it was half way to the half stop. Where it still snaps in with authority.
If I can explain it better. I rounded the first part of the tangs corner but stopped half way and didn't put a full radius in the corner.


I didn't want to soften up the opening snap just smooth it out a bit, so the opposite tang corner got a very small radius. Really just took the 90 degree corner off.

It came out better than expected, now it's the perfect GEC sodbuster.






us Offline David

  • Absolutely No Life Club
  • *******
    • Posts: 7,673
Re: This years projects.
Reply #14 on: June 17, 2019, 04:02:37 PM
Sod busters which I never liked have become a favorite this year, as close to perfect as the GEC is there's always room for improvement or to personalize.
The #71 was a slight bit harder to open than I usually like, going to see if it can become a little easier to open and keep it's strong snap when locking open.

The spring on the GEC is just a bit shorter than the tang and that's not a problem other than it causes a bit more drag when opening.
(Image removed from quote.)

Tangs are usually left as stamped and only finished enough to fit and flush the back spring. In this case I cleaned up the stamping marks and put a small angle (less than 10 degrees) on the tang end that contacts the spring. That made the first 10 or 15 percent of the opening much smother but didn't affect the rest of the opening.

I then added a small half radius to the tangs corner that smoothed it out until it was half way to the half stop. Where it still snaps in with authority.
If I can explain it better. I rounded the first part of the tangs corner but stopped half way and didn't put a full radius in the corner.
(Image removed from quote.)

I didn't want to soften up the opening snap just smooth it out a bit, so the opposite tang corner got a very small radius. Really just took the 90 degree corner off.

It came out better than expected, now it's the perfect GEC sodbuster.

(Image removed from quote.)

The spring on last years 71 is stout. Sounds like you got it where you want it.    :tu:
What? Enablers! Are you serrrrious? Where? I dont see any.
Hold Fast


us Offline Dean51

  • *
  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 4,558
  • Geometry cuts but the steel determines how long.
Re: This years projects.
Reply #15 on: June 17, 2019, 09:29:03 PM

Hmmm   :think:   nothing to do huh.    :think:   Let's see here.   :think:    May be Moose might get loose and come down for a visit.     :D

I'll have a bucket of oats and corn for him and promise to eat only fish. :)


us Offline Dean51

  • *
  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 4,558
  • Geometry cuts but the steel determines how long.
Re: This years projects.
Reply #16 on: June 17, 2019, 11:30:34 PM

Many questions......

What grinder are you using? 

Grinding edge up?

Speed? (just for interest sake)


I'm very much interested in your technique simply because I can't figure out a way that will give such nice results and not lead to some cut belts.

Flip it over and cut fingers is the next option
  :rofl:

This is the grinder I'm using, it's a Ryobi 4x36. It's a good mower blade sharpener but the plate is one piece folded to fit. that fold makes the edge of the plate not perfectly flat all the way to the sides. You need to work on the side of the plate to get all the way to the tang, technique is needed to overcome that.
I'm going to make a 1 1/2" x 1/2" cut out on the rolled edge of the plate and correct that.

This is the grinder I want, My grinder is 1 hp and can run 2 10" wheels but I only keep one wheel on it at a time so it will spin up faster. I could bolt this attachment to the right side and be good to go.
Multitool 4x48, sold by Trick-Tools
 

Grinding


Grinder speed is default for the machine. The secret is no more than two passes before cooling in water and never apply to much pressure. Especially at the tip, a blade will pick up heat fast there. I'm a bit paranoid about heat, I won't let the blade get more than comfortable luke warm.  I have a gizmo that will slow down an AC motor and still let it retain torque but I don't use it.


Don't worry about cutting belts even at .014 behind the edge you're still .007 from the belt.  :whistle:
The first blade that wasn't practice I did nick the spine with the 80 grit belt, it cleaned up nicely. well mostly any way, at least it was not an expensive knife.
Laying the blade on the belt is just technique kind of like free handing. When you're an 1/8 from the belt level the blade , lower and level, lower and level then gently touch the belt level and grind.
 
My technique is to hold the knife like you were cutting a waist high box just firm enough to have control of the handle. Rest the butt of my other hand on the opposite side of the knife. The reason I use one finger on the blade is it's very easy to over grind the belly of the knife, using one finger allows you to keep pressure on the spine in the tip and belly area. Or apply more pressure to an area that might need more grinding. Work with a wet blade and finger tip so it will slide under your finger better.

To grind I work the blade two ways either pull the blade under my finger or pull my finger back towards the tip either way works. To work the tip and belly area and keep at least some finger prints I work it separably as I go. Instead of sliding my finger off the tip onto the belt. I use the handle and apply slight up words lift to the handle for the tip and belly area. That tip/belly area is the one you have to watch, with less metal it's easy to over grind or worse yet over heat.

Keep water handy.
A micrometer or caliper is needed with very little practice you can hold plus or minus .001 to .0005.
band aids. :rofl: you never know. I've never drawn blood but did loose a couple layers of skin working a Queen city muskrat tip.

This is hard to explain, it makes sense to me but not sure it it will come out and mean anything to you.
 


us Offline SteveC

  • Global Moderator
  • Just Bananas
  • *
    • Posts: 67,609
Re: This years projects.
Reply #17 on: June 17, 2019, 11:38:15 PM
 :like: :tu:


gb Offline Wspeed

  • *
  • Just Bananas
  • *************
    • Posts: 76,225
Re: This years projects.
Reply #18 on: June 17, 2019, 11:57:27 PM
Nice belt sander Dean  :like: :tu:
fail to prepare prepare to fail


us Offline David

  • Absolutely No Life Club
  • *******
    • Posts: 7,673
Re: This years projects.
Reply #19 on: June 18, 2019, 12:43:34 AM
This is the grinder I'm using, it's a Ryobi 4x36. It's a good mower blade sharpener but the plate is one piece folded to fit. that fold makes the edge of the plate not perfectly flat all the way to the sides. You need to work on the side of the plate to get all the way to the tang, technique is needed to overcome that.
I'm going to make a 1 1/2" x 1/2" cut out on the rolled edge of the plate and correct that.
(Image removed from quote.)
This is the grinder I want, My grinder is 1 hp and can run 2 10" wheels but I only keep one wheel on it at a time so it will spin up faster. I could bolt this attachment to the right side and be good to go.
Multitool 4x48, sold by Trick-Tools
(Image removed from quote.) 

Grinding
(Image removed from quote.)

Grinder speed is default for the machine. The secret is no more than two passes before cooling in water and never apply to much pressure. Especially at the tip, a blade will pick up heat fast there. I'm a bit paranoid about heat, I won't let the blade get more than comfortable luke warm.  I have a gizmo that will slow down an AC motor and still let it retain torque but I don't use it.


Don't worry about cutting belts even at .014 behind the edge you're still .007 from the belt.  :whistle:
The first blade that wasn't practice I did nick the spine with the 80 grit belt, it cleaned up nicely. well mostly any way, at least it was not an expensive knife.
Laying the blade on the belt is just technique kind of like free handing. When you're an 1/8 from the belt level the blade , lower and level, lower and level then gently touch the belt level and grind.
 
My technique is to hold the knife like you were cutting a waist high box just firm enough to have control of the handle. Rest the butt of my other hand on the opposite side of the knife. The reason I use one finger on the blade is it's very easy to over grind the belly of the knife, using one finger allows you to keep pressure on the spine in the tip and belly area. Or apply more pressure to an area that might need more grinding. Work with a wet blade and finger tip so it will slide under your finger better.

To grind I work the blade two ways either pull the blade under my finger or pull my finger back towards the tip either way works. To work the tip and belly area and keep at least some finger prints I work it separably as I go. Instead of sliding my finger off the tip onto the belt. I use the handle and apply slight up words lift to the handle for the tip and belly area. That tip/belly area is the one you have to watch, with less metal it's easy to over grind or worse yet over heat.

Keep water handy.
A micrometer or caliper is needed with very little practice you can hold plus or minus .001 to .0005.
band aids. :rofl: you never know. I've never drawn blood but did loose a couple layers of skin working a Queen city muskrat tip.

This is hard to explain, it makes sense to me but not sure it it will come out and mean anything to you.

I mostly unstand your technique but not sure I could pull it off as well as you do.    :tu:     :)
What? Enablers! Are you serrrrious? Where? I dont see any.
Hold Fast


us Offline Dean51

  • *
  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 4,558
  • Geometry cuts but the steel determines how long.
Re: This years projects.
Reply #20 on: June 18, 2019, 02:15:09 AM
I mostly understand your technique but not sure I could pull it off as well as you do.    :tu:     :)

A couple garage sale case's and a paring knife died before I had the nerve to touch my knives.  :rofl:


mc Offline Gerhard Gerber

  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 3,832
Re: This years projects.
Reply #21 on: June 18, 2019, 10:43:31 AM
Thanks for taking the time to reply Dean   :tu:

I'm struggling with belt and platten issues, but looking at your photos I realized I need to setup my grinder differently at get more angles of attack  :salute:

Quote
This is the grinder I want, My grinder is 1 hp and can run 2 10" wheels but I only keep one wheel on it at a time so it will spin up faster. I could bolt this attachment to the right side and be good to go.
Multitool 4x48, sold by Trick-Tools
:salute:

While getting advice on the above-mentioned issue a knife maker my senior in years and experienced explained to me why the disc grinder is such an indispensable tool....looks like that machine has the bases covered.  :salute:


us Offline Dean51

  • *
  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 4,558
  • Geometry cuts but the steel determines how long.
Re: This years projects.
Reply #22 on: June 18, 2019, 11:54:55 AM
Thanks for taking the time to reply Dean   :tu:

I'm struggling with belt and platen issues, but looking at your photos I realized I need to setup my grinder differently at get more angles of attack  :salute:
 :salute:

While getting advice on the above-mentioned issue a knife maker my senior in years and experienced explained to me why the disc grinder is such an indispensable tool....looks like that machine has the bases covered.  :salute:

You can't really find a great platen on a grander from shelf stock at Lowe's.
There are belt grinders dedicated to knives but they are way out of my league and budget.
The right side is the only angle of attack I have on that grinder. The tensioner housing gets in the way on the other side. Today I'm going to cut out a couple of inches of the right side platen radius, which will put me into good flat plate.

Most people who do this use 2"x 72" or longer belts but room issues an the fact this grinder does other general work a 4"x 48" would be ideal for me. Both sides of the belt would in a sense give me 96" inches of usable belt.


us Offline Aloha

  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Point Of No Return
  • *
    • Posts: 31,235
Re: This years projects.
Reply #23 on: June 18, 2019, 03:23:29 PM
Very nice job.  I enjoy this these type projects.  Really satisfying work. 
Esse Quam Videri


us Offline Dean51

  • *
  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 4,558
  • Geometry cuts but the steel determines how long.
Re: This years projects.
Reply #24 on: June 18, 2019, 07:33:45 PM
Made the grinder modifications this morning. A milling machine would have been nice but around here it got hogged out with a 3" cut off wheel.
This gets me to flat platen and will make getting the tang area Much easier It even allows for thumb studs.
The next project will be the Rat 2 for $35 it's a nice enough knife but at .024 behind the edge it has poopy edge geometry. Hard use maybe but I have tools for that.



Yesterday I tried the 700 trizat paper on the loin steel barlows M390, that was a waste of time.  M390 was just to hard for it. I used it today on some 1095 a few passes and the old grinding marks were gone polished to a nice satin sheen.  :D



mc Offline Gerhard Gerber

  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 3,832
Re: This years projects.
Reply #25 on: June 19, 2019, 09:38:45 AM
You can't really find a great platen on a grander from shelf stock at Lowe's.
There are belt grinders dedicated to knives but they are way out of my league and budget.

I got a weld-it-together-yourself kit, I like to tell myself splurging on on 1.5kW motor and VFD was a good investment, but I've run into a belt bump issue 220 grit and upwards......eats a worm into the blade.

Except for being a bit short, my platen is mild steel, so that wasn't a great start  :facepalm:  I could make and harden a platen myself......IF I could get 50mm wide steel  :facepalm:


gb Offline Sparky415

  • Zombie Apprentice
  • ********
    • Posts: 12,996
Re: This years projects.
Reply #26 on: June 19, 2019, 07:47:17 PM
ceramic kitchen tile?  :think:
Everything’s adjustable


us Offline Dean51

  • *
  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 4,558
  • Geometry cuts but the steel determines how long.
Re: This years projects.
Reply #27 on: June 20, 2019, 12:15:47 AM
You would have to find a way to attach ceramic.


mc Offline Gerhard Gerber

  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 3,832
Re: This years projects.
Reply #28 on: June 20, 2019, 09:52:31 AM
 :iagree:

There's a lot happening pretty fast, I considered glass and tiles.....same problem.


mc Offline Gerhard Gerber

  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 3,832
Re: This years projects.
Reply #29 on: June 20, 2019, 09:54:46 AM

Tangs are usually left as stamped and only finished enough to fit and flush the back spring. In this case I cleaned up the stamping marks and put a small angle (less than 10 degrees) on the tang end that contacts the spring. That made the first 10 or 15 percent of the opening much smother but didn't affect the rest of the opening.


I hope to own one....or a few  :rofl:.......some day, but this is the first time I thought to myself "GEC could/should do better"  :think:


 

Donations

Operational Funds

Help us keep the Unworkable working!
Donate with PayPal!
April Goal: $300.00
Due Date: Apr 30
Total Receipts: $152.99
PayPal Fees: $8.68
Net Balance: $144.31
Below Goal: $155.69
Site Currency: USD
48% 
April Donations

Community Links


Powered by EzPortal