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Running Lean: An Experiment

gb Offline AimlessWanderer

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #90 on: March 01, 2020, 07:35:34 PM
I've left myself a lot of options with traditional pocket knives, but I'm not begrudging that  :D Each one of these is a knife I could comfortably carry and have faith in for a day's use.

I did miss having a simple penknife in the last six months, sometimes that's all I need, so I made sure one was included this time. The Baby Copperhead was close, but I feel better having the Rodgers to hand. Likewise, I'm happier having the Scout Jr to hand, and having a chance to put some use/patina on that Carver Congress too.


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it Offline SirVicaLot

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #91 on: March 02, 2020, 02:11:41 AM
After your initial post today, I really thought you would end up with max 5 tools out. I am surprised you decided to leave more out of the box.


gb Offline AimlessWanderer

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #92 on: March 02, 2020, 02:55:57 AM
After your initial post today, I really thought you would end up with max 5 tools out. I am surprised you decided to leave more out of the box.

I was a little surprised how full the drawer remains myself, yet it feels right. I suppose a little of everything adds up to a lot. I have however dropped from three drawers crammed full of stuff, down to one, and feel a lot happier as a result. If I'd had put a few less traditionals in there, (there are more trads than I initially envisaged) and not put in the accessories, you could say I'd comfortably dropped to just half a drawer.

Obviously this is day one. After a few months I may find there's still too much, or that I got the mixture wrong. It will be interesting to see how I feel about this all in six months time.



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it Offline SirVicaLot

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #93 on: March 02, 2020, 03:45:03 AM
You have certainly dropped a lot of stuff already  :tu:

Inspired by your challenge I have decided to do something similar. Trying to get by with only 4 MT‘s. After testing a lot of different SAKs and MT’s over the last year, I think I have found what works for me. I will go with the following:

Classic on a neck chain for scissors and the occasional finger nail. Pioneer for the jobs that come up everyday.
For everything that requires a tool neither the Pioneer nor the classic supply, I will reach for the Spirit.
For hard jobs like wood working, renovation (abuse kind of jobs for MT‘s) I will switch out the Spirit for the Swisstool.

Those 4 tools should be able to handle everything that comes my way on a regular basis. Will see how that goes  :tu:


gb Offline AimlessWanderer

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #94 on: March 02, 2020, 04:56:08 AM
You have certainly dropped a lot of stuff already  :tu:

Inspired by your challenge I have decided to do something similar. Trying to get by with only 4 MT‘s. After testing a lot of different SAKs and MT’s over the last year, I think I have found what works for me. I will go with the following:

Classic on a neck chain for scissors and the occasional finger nail. Pioneer for the jobs that come up everyday.
For everything that requires a tool neither the Pioneer nor the classic supply, I will reach for the Spirit.
For hard jobs like wood working, renovation (abuse kind of jobs for MT‘s) I will switch out the Spirit for the Swisstool.

Those 4 tools should be able to handle everything that comes my way on a regular basis. Will see how that goes  :tu:

You should be well covered by those.  :tu: The one I have on my neck lanyard is an alox Rambler. Occasionally that's all I have, particularly in summer when pocket space is limited. What duration of time do you intend?


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it Offline SirVicaLot

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #95 on: March 02, 2020, 05:32:12 AM
Don‘t really have a certain duration in mind, as I don‘t want to turn this into a XX Day Challenge. I just want to see if I even try to reach for other MT‘s and why I wanna do it.
Is it because I am missing something, or just because I want to change things up. I can see me grabbing the Explorer for example, because I like playing with the magnifier. But I don‘t think it will turn into my main pocket carry.

The Fieldmaster Challenge has showed me which tools I mostly use, and the Pioneer plus classic seemed the logical conclusion. Will see if that will prove true.



us Offline Douglas

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #96 on: March 02, 2020, 05:41:07 AM
AW,
I've followed this of and on sense you first posted.  I must say a very impressive endevor with equaly impressive results.  Before joining MTo I was content with just my Swisstool X and a single PE locking flipper.  Then the MTo SAK bug bit and it seamed I "needed" every SAK out there.  Fortunately finances kept things somewhat in control.  Then I won a Spirt XBS in one of the monthly donation GAWs. (Thanks BOSS)  That put all the other SAKs aside and started my Collection of Swisstools and Spirits.  I love those tools and have way more than I need and I'm Ok with that and will probaly add more as I come across ones I don't already have.  As to my daily carry, well now that most days are spent working in the office I find a Classic/ Rambler/ or Mini Champ, a Compact and a Spirit ALL I need or Desire.  Other than an occasional Challenge I realy don't see that changing.  I guess I'm glad fortunate to have not been bitten by the MTo bug any harder than I was, your journy seams to have been burdonsome at times.  Glad to see you have found your peace. 
Now just to stir things up a bit, would you have any interest in trading that beautiful Spirit Rt in the Multitool Snoozers section? :whistle:

Go ahead!  :twak: :twak: I deserve it!  :twak: :twak:

"LOGIC!  My God, the man's talking about logic!  We're talking about Universal Armageddon!"
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it Offline SirVicaLot

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #97 on: March 02, 2020, 05:49:49 AM
You asked for it:  :twak:

You‘re welcome  :D


us Offline Douglas

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #98 on: March 02, 2020, 05:56:27 AM
 :facepalm:
NOT YOU!  :twak:
Only AW!
But seeing you popped up first.  :whistle:
Those tools should do just about anything you're likely to run into on any given day, SVL.
I've just realy become fond of my Compact with it's full sized traditional Vic scissors.
It's also amazing how often the eye glass driver and straight pin come in handy.
"LOGIC!  My God, the man's talking about logic!  We're talking about Universal Armageddon!"
Dr.  McCoy

MTo...The BEST place on Earth!


it Offline SirVicaLot

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #99 on: March 02, 2020, 06:06:16 AM
Well, AW can give you a  :twak: too, I was just lending a hand  :D

I tried the Compact, but it has too much stuff missing. It is just not working for me  :dunno:


gb Offline AimlessWanderer

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #100 on: March 02, 2020, 06:13:54 AM
AW,
I've followed this of and on sense you first posted.  I must say a very impressive endevor with equaly impressive results.  Before joining MTo I was content with just my Swisstool X and a single PE locking flipper.  Then the MTo SAK bug bit and it seamed I "needed" every SAK out there.  Fortunately finances kept things somewhat in control.  Then I won a Spirt XBS in one of the monthly donation GAWs. (Thanks BOSS)  That put all the other SAKs aside and started my Collection of Swisstools and Spirits.  I love those tools and have way more than I need and I'm Ok with that and will probaly add more as I come across ones I don't already have.  As to my daily carry, well now that most days are spent working in the office I find a Classic/ Rambler/ or Mini Champ, a Compact and a Spirit ALL I need or Desire.  Other than an occasional Challenge I realy don't see that changing.  I guess I'm glad fortunate to have not been bitten by the MTo bug any harder than I was, your journy seams to have been burdonsome at times.  Glad to see you have found your peace. 
Now just to stir things up a bit, would you have any interest in trading that beautiful Spirit Rt in the Multitool Snoozers section? :whistle:

Go ahead!  :twak: :twak: I deserve it!  :twak: :twak:

Several people have tried to get me to part with the RT. All have failed :D

My journey only really became burdonsome, once I had ticked all the boxes I needed to tick. For several years, it was an adventure, a quest for the best tools for me. Once I realised I had all I needed, I was also saddled with a vast amount of stuff I didn't need. I gradually sold of most of it, but all the stuff I've recently been wrestling with, was stuff that worked for me. Why on earth would I want to sell that, after a long quest to discover it or build it? Yet I was still overwhelmed with it all. This segregation to Users and Snoozers, is quite liberating from all the negativity it had started to cultivate.

I'm sure I will need to delve into that box in future. I have lost tools, had them stolen, and broke them or worn them out. I'd rather have some tried and tested tools in the box to fall back on, rather than have to restart the test based on whatever happens to be available at the time. Not only would I not be likely to get an RT again, I'd struggle for a good condition Sideclip, KF4, blunt nose integral cutter MP600, MP400 with corkscrew, all my 84mm Vics with scissors, and so on, and so on. I wish I'd added a spare Wings Slipit to the fold a few years ago. There's not really anything else like that on the market right now. Maybe other tools will go the same way.

So now, I am unburdoned and future proof (to an extent). Liberated yet secure. I might not have backups of every tool, but do have back ups for every role, and I don't need to worry what tools might be available in 15 year's time.


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gb Offline AimlessWanderer

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #101 on: March 02, 2020, 06:21:21 AM
Well, AW can give you a  :twak: too, I was just lending a hand  :D

I tried the Compact, but it has too much stuff missing. It is just not working for me  :dunno:

What's your minimum requirement of a Swiss knife? I have a Compact in a first aid kit, and think it's a great knife. My minimum requirement, is generally "Climber" like. Blade, scissors, openers, drivers, awl. While the driver compliment is compromised, there's only really the awl that's missing on the Compact, and I can fudge it with the fixed arm of the scissors if I'm desperate.


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wales Offline Smashie

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #102 on: March 02, 2020, 12:10:25 PM
That's a heck of a clear out, but at least it has solid logic behind it :tu:
“Strong minds discuss ideas, average minds discuss events, weak minds discuss people.” - Socrates
"I'm not feeling very talky today, off you smurf". - Smashie
Complaining is mental preparation for failure.
Si vis pacem, para bellum


us Offline Aloha

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #103 on: March 02, 2020, 03:04:02 PM
"I know there should be another 6 months to go, but I had a revelation last night. I was thinking how much happier I've been during the course of this experiment, and realised that it isn't just going to lead to a solution to my frustrations, it IS the solution. I wasn't getting annoyed with owning stuff that wasn't getting used, but with SEEING it all every time I wanted to change something. Stuffing the rest of the stuff out of sight, and just keeping regular carry in a drawer, gives the scale of array I want, without having to sell off tools I'd really rather not part with."

It all made sense when you posted the above sentiment.  There is a balance for those of us who have amassed a lot of really good tools. After looking thru what you've decided on and why  :salute:.  I do think you'll be quite happy as would anyone.  Theres are lot of capability and diversity. 

Esse Quam Videri


gb Offline AimlessWanderer

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #104 on: March 02, 2020, 03:13:48 PM
Cheers Mark.  :tu: I think the quantity of tools I've left out, is about on a par with what I had before I joined MTO, except they're far better suited to me.


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gb Offline AimlessWanderer

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #105 on: March 02, 2020, 03:27:06 PM
"I know there should be another 6 months to go, but I had a revelation last night. I was thinking how much happier I've been during the course of this experiment, and realised that it isn't just going to lead to a solution to my frustrations, it IS the solution. I wasn't getting annoyed with owning stuff that wasn't getting used, but with SEEING it all every time I wanted to change something. Stuffing the rest of the stuff out of sight, and just keeping regular carry in a drawer, gives the scale of array I want, without having to sell off tools I'd really rather not part with."

It all made sense when you posted the above sentiment.  There is a balance for those of us who have amassed a lot of really good tools. After looking thru what you've decided on and why  :salute:.  I do think you'll be quite happy as would anyone.  Theres are lot of capability and diversity.


Thanks mate  :cheers:

Yes, this was all about finding the right balance of tools - enough to stop me wanting more, but not too much as to feel swamped. Capability wise, they are all tried and tested, and I know they suit me well. The diversity feels right too, and doesn't leave me hemmed in to one particular kind of load out. I can grab any one item, and build a combo around it, or just grab either the Balance or the Deluxe Tinker as solo tools.

Thanks for following along through this process  :salute:


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it Offline SirVicaLot

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #106 on: March 02, 2020, 03:29:08 PM
What's your minimum requirement of a Swiss knife? I have a Compact in a first aid kit, and think it's a great knife. My minimum requirement, is generally "Climber" like. Blade, scissors, openers, drivers, awl. While the driver compliment is compromised, there's only really the awl that's missing on the Compact, and I can fudge it with the fixed arm of the scissors if I'm desperate.

Inline Awl, Bottle Opener (as sturdy as possible because i use it mainly as a prybar/scraper), Philips driver, Large blade, Scissors. As of today, there is only one SAK that checks all these boxes, and that is the PX. Yet I don‘t like the scissors on the PX, because they are mounted the wrong way compared to the 91mm line. 
This is why I chose Pioneer plus classic with the added bonus of a nail file.


us Offline Aloha

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #107 on: March 02, 2020, 03:32:15 PM
Pioneer plus Classic is a strong pairing.  Whenever I chose a scissorless SAK I always paired it with a 58mm.  This combo eventually led me to the Manager. 
Esse Quam Videri


us Offline Aloha

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #108 on: March 02, 2020, 03:35:27 PM
Your journey is one that I enjoyed.  I know others do not put this much effort into their carries but I do so  :salute:.  The conversations with a thread like this also help me with those SAKs that are distracting me  :D.  I don't have to cover all bases but I want to be happy with what I carry.  Fact is tho, with the right combination and experience with that combination and we are pretty well covered in most all situations. 
Esse Quam Videri


gb Offline AimlessWanderer

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #109 on: March 02, 2020, 04:57:20 PM
Your journey is one that I enjoyed.  I know others do not put this much effort into their carries but I do so  :salute:.  The conversations with a thread like this also help me with those SAKs that are distracting me  :D.  I don't have to cover all bases but I want to be happy with what I carry.

We do have a lot of similarities in our approach, and both have a desire to "get it right", whatever right happens to be based on the priorities at the time.  :tu: Distractions is right too, particularly when they are agonisingly close to fitting our needs. They can draw brain power trying to figure out how to accommodate and compensate for the elements that don't align how we want, and attention is drawn away from something else that already works perfectly fine. I think (hope) this reduced array is free of all that.

Fact is tho, with the right combination and experience with that combination and we are pretty well covered in most all situations.

Did your brain just fail, or mine?  :think:


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gb Offline AimlessWanderer

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #110 on: March 02, 2020, 04:58:55 PM
Inline Awl, Bottle Opener (as sturdy as possible because i use it mainly as a prybar/scraper), Philips driver, Large blade, Scissors. As of today, there is only one SAK that checks all these boxes, and that is the PX. Yet I don‘t like the scissors on the PX, because they are mounted the wrong way compared to the 91mm line. 
This is why I chose Pioneer plus classic with the added bonus of a nail file.

 :tu:  :salute:


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us Offline Aloha

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #111 on: March 02, 2020, 05:05:19 PM
 :whistle: MINE BRAIN FALIED  :oops:

What I meant to say was, With those combinations  ( of tools left out ) and experience with them, you can tackle most anything.   
Esse Quam Videri


gb Offline AimlessWanderer

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #112 on: March 02, 2020, 05:12:59 PM
:whistle: MINE BRAIN FALIED  :oops:

What I meant to say was, With those combinations  ( of tools left out ) and experience with them, you can tackle most anything.

 :tu: :D :salute:


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gb Offline AimlessWanderer

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #113 on: March 02, 2020, 05:35:14 PM
All my available to use pocket carry tools, now fit comfortably in one drawer, along with a few matching accessories - the tool adaptor for the Switchplier, Victorinox L wrench, bit adaptor and bits for the Fuse, a clip lanyard, and a small pair of nail clippers.

 :oops: Not just an idiot photographer, but an idiot typist too  :facepalm:

That should have said tool adaptor for the Sideclip  ::)


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us Offline ElevenBlade

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #114 on: March 02, 2020, 07:33:20 PM
This experiment is now over!

I know there should be another 6 months to go, but I had a revelation last night. I was thinking how much happier I've been during the course of this experiment, and realised that it isn't just going to lead to a solution to my frustrations, it IS the solution. I wasn't getting annoyed with owning stuff that wasn't getting used, but with SEEING it all every time I wanted to change something. Stuffing the rest of the stuff out of sight, and just keeping regular carry in a drawer, gives the scale of array I want, without having to sell off tools I'd really rather not part with.

The thing that had been holding me back from selling stuff, is knowing it will likely be at a loss, and knowing it would be both pricey and difficult to source them again, should I need to replace any of the items I leave out. Each of the items that I was undecided about, have proven themselves to be great in use, and well suited to me. I just had too many items available in each role. I'll be opening the box again today, sorting through everything, and refining what stays confined to the box out of sight, and what remains in the open for use. The rest will be shut away in the box until I break or lose something, and need to fish out a replacement.

The first thing I'm going to change, is all carbon steel stays out. That way I can keep them maintained. Shutting stainless "spares" away for 5-10 years or whatever, should be far less risky. The second thing that stays out, is anything that's already been used heavily, or items that had 6 months or more of near exclusive carry. That includes a few slippies from the early days. On top of this, I'll leave out a few options so that whatever crops up in life, I have a suitable option in the drawer, and spares in the box.

Tools that neither get chosen to be left out, nor are direct spares for that role, probably need ditching (selling, giving away, or breaking for spares). Exemptions are thing I might need on very rare occasions, such as the marlinspike on a British Army Knife. Stuff like that will go in the toolbag with hammers and screwdrivers and stuff - away from the regular carry drawer, but still available if needed. All that leaves then, is mod fodder. These can be put in yet another box for tinkering with at my leisure.

I'll update with the new line up once it's sorted  :tu:

Its amazing how that seems to have hit you like a ton of bricks.

I think I'm in the same boat as you. 

I start amassing tools for use, and there's quite a bit of thought behind what I get.  It's true - once you tik all the boxes, it becomes worse.  It's rather irritating to have to look at tools that you thought you'd use, but don't.  It becomes a reminder of spent mental energy.   I find that when several boxes are checked off, there's one new one that comes up.   

Last May, I gave away, sold, or junked several of my tools.  Just three months ago, I gave away my Vic Huntsman. The Huntsman is the one that meets all the criteria for what I need and use.  It did, however, had one glaring feature that none of my main users had - it didn't fit in my watch pocket.   The more you try to get things right, no more you're going to get yourself frustrated.  And as someone on another thread said: "I don't want the perfect multi-tool".

Seeing a giant box full of my "not-quite-right-anymore" or "that-was-before-they-invented" tools was indeed frustrating. 

I think you've hit the nail on the head - it gets to the root of our existential crisis.  Separating the ones you won't use out helps quite a bit.  Whether you're comfortable selling them is another story.  Suffice it to say I was content with throwing a few unsafe liner-locking ones in the trash. 



gb Offline AimlessWanderer

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #115 on: March 02, 2020, 10:37:49 PM
I think you've hit the nail on the head - it gets to the root of our existential crisis.  Separating the ones you won't use out helps quite a bit.  Whether you're comfortable selling them is another story.  Suffice it to say I was content with throwing a few unsafe liner-locking ones in the trash.

For the most part, I'd already got rid of the ones I won't use well before this thread begun, and simply had too many good options left. Just look how few were losers, and some of them have moved to the mod fodder box. I'd invested time, money and energy into modding tools to knifeless for example, and ended up with seven of them! I don't need seven, but each one was "too good to part with". I had a great swathe of traditional knives that worked for me, and a good clump of non-locking clipped one hand opening folders too. It wasn't that I had tools I wouldn't use, rather too many that I would.

The other thing was that I'd had fun doing those mods, both in the preparation and the modifications themselves. I'd also enjoyed using the fruits of my labours. That makes parting with them harder too. The Swiss knives are the same. A lot of effort and beer vouchers went into putting everything together, either as tools that already work for me, or as ingredients for mods. Undoing all that effort, wasn't a palatable solution either.

Turns out that sorting them into "now" and "later" was the answer, and as you said, it hit me like a ton of bricks once I finally got there. Once i'd gotten that concept in mind, the tools almost sorted themselves.


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gb Offline AimlessWanderer

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #116 on: March 05, 2020, 05:09:54 PM
Combos are king!

Picking the right individual tools, wasn't enough by itself. Those tools have to work well with others. While I have reduced the number of tools in play, combinations are not something I am short of. Here's an overview of the combinations I have left myself. Obviously tools can be combined in other ways too, but these are the main configurations.

1) Keyring - unchanged

2) Neck lanyard - unchanged

3) Wenger Evowood 14 and companions

4) Wenger stainless PTC and companions

5) Gerber Splice and any traditional slippie

6) Gerber Balance and any traditional slippie

7) Leatherman Sideclip and any Swiss knife


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gb Offline AimlessWanderer

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #117 on: March 05, 2020, 05:17:27 PM
More combinations:

8 ) Spirit X and Voyager Lite

9) Modern clipped OHO slippie and Balance

The modern slippies can also compliment any of the other traditional slipjoint or Swiss knife combinations. The two primary lights are the same. A well used 4Sevens Quark AA2 Tactical, and the infinitely variable Sunwayman V10R.

10) Fully loaded. When a very comprehensive carry is wanted, the orange tools come out to play. There's also a bit adaptor set for the Fuse which isn't included in the picture


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br Offline Hevy (CT-782)

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #118 on: March 05, 2020, 08:33:29 PM
Nice combinations AI. The orange set is awesome!

Enviado de meu moto g(6) usando o Tapatalk



gb Offline AimlessWanderer

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Re: Running Lean: An Experiment
Reply #119 on: March 05, 2020, 09:15:12 PM
Nice combinations AI. The orange set is awesome!

Enviado de meu moto g(6) usando o Tapatalk

Thanks mate  :cheers: I'm really happy how they worked out


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