Why lock blades?

[cbl51]

Like most my posts of late, I will say right off that I’m an old fart. I feel this makes it clear right off that my outlook may indeed be slanted, and even prejudiced in view. Yeah, the old “back when when I was young bull hockey. “

Looking at todays modern knife market from that standpoint of someone who grew up when James Dean was still alive, cars had tail fins, and ‘Ike’ was in the White House, is a sometimes shocking thing. Kind of like driving a car for almost 20 years, then getting a new one and being shocked at all the devises and gizmos on the cat that seem like things out of sci-fi show. Self braking and radar? Lane drift alarms? Cruise control that keeps a preset distance? Hell, I didn’t even have cruise control on my old Tacoma that had been carrying around since 2001.

Growing up in those post WW2 years was a whole different era in both technology and attitude. Life was indeed simpler in all ways. If there was a grey area, it was very very narrow. There was no anti knife phobia, and there wasn’t even any anti gun bull crap around. Every singe man that had his pants on, had a pocket knife in one of those pockets. Maybe not much of a knife by todays knife nut standards, but it was a sharp cutting tool that was used daily. Used. Because there were no easy open pull tabs, and everything was tied up in that white twine and heavy brown paper. Sometimes the brown paper packages were wrapped up in that wide brown tape that was put wet and dried like steel bands. You were not getting into that package without the help off a sharp cutting tool.

The knives in those days were of a very narrow type. A simple small slip joint, usually between 2 3/4 to 3 1/2 closed length, most often about 3 inches. It may have one blade, but most often was one main blade about 2 inches and a small 1 1/2 inch pen blade tucked in there on the side. These small slip joint pocket knives were so ubiquitous to life that they were sold in every five and dime store, hardware store, train station shop. Even most of the women folk had one their purse to sharpen a pencil out open a package. The ball point pen thing hadn’t quite happened yet, so most folks carried a pencil. It didn’t leak, go dry, and the writing didn’t run fit got rained on.

Most the men I grew up around back then were WW2 veterans. My Uncle Charlie got his feet wet on a beach in France and walked most the way to Berlin. He had an old Camillus TL-29 that he carried from his army days, and wouldn’t think of carrying anything else. I brought him hoe a new Camillus TL-29 from our supply room while I was wth the army engineers, and you’d have thought I’d given him a treasure. Only then would he retire his almost worn out TL-29.

My Uncle Charlie was so typical of those men from that era. The ones called ‘The Greatest Generation.” They worked their way through a Great Depression, Fought through a world war, and then with no fanfare went home and went about the business of life doing job, and raising a family. They were truck drivers, welders, machinists, carpenters, brick layers, mechanics, electricians, and other blue collar workers. They all carried a similar pocket knife. The humble little slip joint of modest size.

Growing up around these men, the small slip joint was my own life long pocket knife. Up until the 1980’s, and I tried a fe w of the ‘new’ knives coming out with thumb studs and pocket clips. Just too alien for me. A scout knife, a stockman, a Barlow was pretty much my speed. I started with SAK’s in 1969, and they have been a mainstay in my pocket knife rotation ever since. That was 51 years ago. If my pocket knife was not up to the job, I used another knife that was around back then, the sheath knife. I refuse to call it a fixed blade because it was never broken and had to be fixed. The sheath knife, belt knife, huntin’ knife, was always around. When I was a kid, (God, I hate myself for saying that!) the men who carried the small slip joints all had a larger sheath knife around, and if they thought they may are dong a job that thier little pocket knife was not enough knife for, they just put the sheath knife on their belt. It wasn’t all that unusual in the 1950’s to see a small sheath knife on the belt. The Little Finn knives made by Case, KaBar, Camillus, Western, PAL, Imperial and others were small, compact, but rugged.

And I guess in this overly long winded post, that brings me to my point. The modern do-it-all lock blade that can deanimate enemy sentries or pry open a Russian tank hatch. Why?

Theres been a great deal of development in blade locks, and a great deal of hype on how strong they are. Why? If you need that strong a knife, why would you not just go with a sheath knife, a belt knife? A knife that is one piece of steel all the way through the handle to the end of the tang. Aside from the hype of the manufactures of these knives of course, a great deal of the modern knife market makes no sense. Its like they built a more complicated mouse trap, with more moving parts, a greater chance of failure, and a higher price tag of course. Jeff Randall of EESE knives once said in an interview that 99% of the knife market is BS. I agree with him.

A great deal has been made of the “hard use”knife.” I can’t think of harder use than staying alive in the harsh winter of the Rocky Mountains in the mountain men era, or building a settlement in the Cumberland gap country as America spread westward past the Blue Ridge mountains. Or invading and retaking a continent from Nazi rule, with fighting form village to town, house to house, and sometimes room to room. Or taking back a jungle covered country like Burma from the Japanese. The old Green River knives, Hudson Bay knives, Bowie knives, Kabars and Camillus MK2’s didn’t fold.

When it comes to the so called hard use, why bother with something that is already hinged in the middle and ‘broken’?

This whole post came about because this morning our daughter called and told us John, my son-in-law, had got his stitches out. He had cut himself quite badly while we were out there visiting for the new year, with one of his large lock blade one hand opening knives. He was working out back on the landscape and the blade of his folder collapsed and cut his index finger and middle finger to the bone. His shocked reaction while driving him to the local ER was, “I don’t understand it, the blade was locked open! It’s never failed before!” I told him theres a first time for everything. In the past, John has been a bit critical in a friendly way, about my ‘old fashioned pocket knives’ not having a lock on the blade.

This is the third time I’ve known of this taking place. The kid where I used to work, amputated his right index finger with his Buck knife, and when told he was being unsafe, he replied “It’s a Buck knife, it’l take it.” Well it didn’t. The kid that was at the hand surgeon when I got my left thumb operated on for a joint problem was there trying to get some use back to this right fingers where some nerves had go severed when his locking blade tacticool knife had folded when it wasn’t supposed to.

All these young men had an almost Jihadist fanatics faith in the locks that held the blades open. They all had unpleasant ER visits.

Guys, the modern knife market is not doing you any favors. If you need a knife that won’t fold on you, use a sheath knife that isn’t already broken. Something that is just one piece of steel from pointy tip to the end of the handle. No joint, no break in the structure of the whole thing. At most if you act stupid, you’ll just break the blade off.

Any knife that folds is already broken. Any lock, just like any man made item can fail, and will in time if pushed hard. Maybe its time for the un-folding pocket knife to come about.

[ElevenBlade]

Innovation always generates new problems, and I think this is just part of that continuum.  Not an answer or excuse, more of an observation.
We never needed seatbelts until cars could move fast.
We never needed the guard behind a tractor-trailer until cars were small enough to fit under the back.
We never needed advanced directives before the advent of modern medicine
We never needed fireproofing before we had our kitchens indoors.
... and the list goes on.

My grandfather, and everyone in his time had a penknife - a 2 bladed slipjoint less than 3 inches, but perhaps more importantly, barely a centimeter deep.  That slipjoint did everything it did, and what it didn't do - a sheath knife did.  In my grandfather's case, if the pen knife didn't do it, he didn't do it. 

Then one day, a Buck knife became 5 inches long an inch deep, and capable of just about anything. And, as we know we "let the knife do the work".  So the work began to involve reverse grips, pull cuts, and piercings.  The scalpel-like precision of a penknife was no longer the only work that the knife was doing.  Meanwhile, WWII paratroopers didn't have the luxury of using two hands to cut themselves loose. 

Like much of innovation - it's a cycle of making a change and pushing the boundaries of that capability, creating a new problem, and solving that with another change.

In my grandfather's time, there was no anti-knife sentiment because a penknife would hurt the user if it was mishandled,  Everyone knew that, and respected the tool and the person who took the responsibility to use it.  Now we can flick a knife open with one hand, and we can stab with it.  If it cuts the user or someone else, we blame the tool. 
Am I leading into the argument that we should blame the user, and not the tool?  No - I'm simply saying that the different versions of the tool are capable of different things.  With the human nature of pushing the boundaries of the capabilities of the tools we use, and the mental image of the purpose of the tool, and the "form" - the size, shape, and features - changes. 

Heres a thought experiment - define "chair". 
Four legs?  No, mine has just one with 5 limbs below.  flat platform to sit on?  No mine is a saddle angled forward ergonomically. Armrests? Not mine. 
We can't define it, but we know what it is when we see it, and we know what to do with it. 

Just like there was one fine day when you could roll yourself from your office cubicle to your co-workers cubicle without actually picking your butt off the seat, there was a point in time when a pocketknife could easily harm the user because it was usable for something other than a controlled longitudinal slice or push cut of something relatively small.  "Never cut towards yourself.  Push with your thumb behind the blade with the same force you push the handle", they told me when I was ten years old.  They don't say that anymore. 

To be sure - some jurisdictions ban locking blades.  Why?  Because one is more confident in their own safety when stabbing with a lockback than with a slipjoint.  Debate the what-ifs all you want, major US cities, the UK and many places in Europe see this as an important distinction.  The point I'm trying to raise is, again, what was my grandfather's penknife used for, and what was my Cold Steel Tanto designed for?

Nowadays people baton firewood with their pocketknife.  They grip the handle in a fist and reverse pull-cut though 5 pieces of paracord.  They trust in their liner lock, axis lock, power lock, lever lock, frame lock... like we all trust that our brakes won't fail the next time we drive our cars. 

I fear that one day we will trust that our self-driving car will brake when it's needed. 

I guess my point is two-fold. 
One, that we are in this world of tactical folders and simultaneous knife bans because we create safety measures (technologically or legislatively) for the problems that we create by pushing the boundaries of the tools we have at a given time. 
Two, that we are in this cultural and social situation because individually we each aren't able to live long enough to remember the time when you couldn't use the tool to do what it does now. 

So without reading the thoughts of each others generations, we will never really understand why knives and guns are tools, or conversely, why they are weapons. 

Someone once said you can judge a man's character by the condition of his pocketknife.  I think that's true.  But in my own way, I go a bit further.  I choose to live in the US, but choose to follow the knife laws of the UK to the best of my knowledge and with a couple of exceptions for camping trips. 

Why?

How do you define "chair"?

[Max Stone]

Most thought-provoking post. If you look at multitool development, the first products had blades and tools that did not lock. And when doing the PST challenge in December, it was the lack of a lock on the Phillips driver that I missed the most (not on the blade), as I had it fold back a couple of times driving screws. But maybe there’s a common element between the modern folder and modern multitool; that they are both general purpose tools that have limitations. And regardless of how good the design is, it can never replace a tool specifically designed and optimized for a task, like a proper screwdriver or fixed blade. 

[Vidar]

I think I'll just join the choir?

Personally I never trust a lock, and make sure to never depend on it in any way. Basically I use folding knives as if the lock isn't there. If that lock then suddenly comes into use for whatever reason it has likely done something good and worked as an extra safety. With correct use locks are a good thing - but correct use is the key.

The flip side is that a seemingly reliable lock might allow and tempt user into wrong and dangerous practices. In that respect knife manufacturers whose marketing plays at trusting their locks might set their customers up for injury.

Sometimes I wonder if locks should be made with a bit of controlled give to them - like a fair warning to prevent bad habits.

[comis]

Any knife that folds is already broken. Any lock, just like any man made item can fail, and will in time if pushed hard. Maybe its time for the un-folding pocket knife to come about.

Amen to that, I think what cb51 wrote about bring home the message--if forefathers could survive all those harsh conditions with slipjoints and 'fixed' blade reliably, modern buyers need to rethink what's their definition of 'hard use' and why is everyone paying premium for additional features.  At the end of the day, lane drift alarm and self-barking never can replace safe driving.  Knife lock can never replace knife safety knowledge.

[magentus]

Why? Because these knife companies need to keep in business. All of us have at home, far more knives than we practically need, but unless we keep buying there'll be no more knife companies.

The beast that is advanced stage capitalism has to come up with constant 'innovation' in order to stay alive and there's a real market out there for men, increasingly seperated from a 'hands on' lifestyle, to buy a knife or knives that makes them feel like they could survive some sort of crisis.

Truth is that a fixed blade and/or a folder will do pretty everything we need a blade for. But that doesn't feed the beast   

[pomsbz]

A one handed opening blade requires a lock pretty much. OHO as a requirement is a function of the immediacy of the age rather than a necessity but I would assume that an entire societal mindset change, a reset, would be required to change this fact and the drive in is the opposite direction.

[sak60]

CBL51
I think I can say +1 pretty much all of your post, especially the knife and gun phobia. I’m a ‘60 vintage  , and there was never any thought of knives in the way they are now. It was a part of the list of kit requirements when going away on camp as a Cadet, which was compulsory for 2 years in high school. Our school had a .22 small bore range and I took my.22 to school for Friday afternoon range practice on the school bus. Any new rifle I purchased later on (mid-late 70’s) I took home on the public transport (boxed up).
As far as folders are concerned I never new about lock blades till I was a teenager, in fact all my first knives were sheath knives, however I have had a folder fold on me and it was a slip joint ( yes I was using it as a screwdriver).I understand looking at the present with eyes from the past and wish some things weren’t the way they are too, though I can see the benefits in some improvements and think lock blades are a natural progression, especially after the introduction of the 110. I mostly use lock blade folders now. I do wish the general perception of knives was different.
Love the post 

[Nix]

Lock blades feel safer and, I think , are safer.

Mrs Nix won't use anything else. The lock makes the knife feel more secure to her.

I had an early Spyderco lock fail once (twice actually) where I got a minor cut. So lock blades are not fool-proof; I'm proof of that.

But....I've also managed to cut myself multiple times with fixed blades and slipjoints. I'm a strong believer in the fixed blade knife. All subsequent 'improvements' have been gimmicks or compromising conveniences. However, I've also nicked, cut, and stabbed myself more with fixed blades than any other type of knife.  For no apparent reason, the locking blade knife has been the type least injurious to me.

Bottom line, if you don't respect the blade....

[chip]

Why lock blades?

Locking knives are great. I carry one in the form of the wave at work and tenacious at home. They offer the safety of a fixed blade when having to stab when required (opening sacks) with the convenience of a folder (pocket carry).

What’s not to like.

[Rapidray]

Great posts and great information! Even better memories as being able to carry a pocket knife in school and actually using it and never given a second look.

[ElevenBlade]

Why lock blades?

Locking knives are great. I carry one in the form of the wave at work and tenacious at home. They offer the safety of a fixed blade when having to stab when required (opening sacks) with the convenience of a folder (pocket carry).

What’s not to like.

[Aloha]

The modern do-it-all lock blade that can deanimate enemy sentries or pry open a Russian tank hatch. Why?

After getting my BK2 I wonder the same thing  .  Could it be as simple as designers pushing the limits of a folder, as ElevenBlade says, innovation?  Certianly our upbringings have a lot to do with how we see tools and the "need" or not of their development.     

I grew up in a much different environment.  I grew up in an urban landscape with no hunters, little open space, and mother dominated homes.  I was not privy to seeing pocket knives as tools.  I remember movies like Westside Story where the switch blade as a weapon.  I remember zip guns.  No one hunted or went to target ranges.  Early on I saw these not as tools and it wasn't until much later that I began to see my childhood influenced how I thought.

My inner-city childhood vs rural life couldn't have been more different.  I spent a great deal of my early life cooking for a living so a "fixed blade" was my tool.  Not much I cannot do with a chefs knife.  I'm not sure if having a lock makes me less careful?  Having recently really begun to appreciate the classic slip joint I find myself no less as careful as when I use a fixed.  Downward pressure on the cutting edge always. 

I wonder how many injuries have occurred simply from foolishness?  Having been in the kitchens cooking and around knives I have seen some cuts happen.  It usually rushing or a momentary loss of attention.  With the tactical side of folders these days I wonder if the design itself pushes some to push these features? 

   

[ElevenBlade]

The modern do-it-all lock blade that can deanimate enemy sentries or pry open a Russian tank hatch. Why?

After getting my BK2 I wonder the same thing  .  Could it be as simple as designers pushing the limits of a folder, as ElevenBlade says, innovation?  Certianly our upbringings have a lot to do with how we see tools and the "need" or not of their development.     

I grew up in a much different environment.  I grew up in an urban landscape with no hunters, little open space, and mother dominated homes.  I was not privy to seeing pocket knives as tools.  I remember movies like Westside Story where the switch blade as a weapon.  I remember zip guns.  No one hunted or went to target ranges.  Early on I saw these not as tools and it wasn't until much later that I began to see my childhood influenced how I thought.

My inner-city childhood vs rural life couldn't have been more different.  I spent a great deal of my early life cooking for a living so a "fixed blade" was my tool.  Not much I cannot do with a chefs knife.  I'm not sure if having a lock makes me less careful?  Having recently really begun to appreciate the classic slip joint I find myself no less as careful as when I use a fixed.  Downward pressure on the cutting edge always. 

I wonder how many injuries have occurred simply from foolishness?  Having been in the kitchens cooking and around knives I have seen some cuts happen.  It usually rushing or a momentary loss of attention.  With the tactical side of folders these days I wonder if the design itself pushes some to push these features? 

 

 

I try to be mindful that our friends here on MTo are from all around the globe, even some using Google Translate to communicate, and we all have different upbringings, cultures, and laws. For that reason, I try to avoid being too specific, for fear of being unrelatable - but I think you hit the nail on the head in my world. 

I had a similar upbringing... "mother-dominated homes" Yes.  Exactly.  Nobody's father took them hunting, except for the two guys whos dad taught all of us everything we learned in the Scouts....  Nobody's father fixed anything around the house - except for that one guy who was lucky because his "dad is a contractor".  I told you about my grandfather... but I didn't tell you about my dad, who never once carried the 3-blade stockman he owned, and never needed to fix the gutter in the building we didn't actually own. 

I also didn't mention the detail that where I live, chefs and line cooks have been arrested and jailed time and again for carrying a pocketknife with a visible pocket clip for work, - the one they carry to preserve their expensive German steel.

It's just a reality of life around here in the suburbs - where we do get to have guns and knives - but the guns aren't for harvesting food., the knives aren't for working the back yard. 

Pay close attention to this very entertaining video, and tell me if you notice what's in the back of Jimmy's mind.


To circle back to the original question.  I think I'll just bluntly answer what I've been skirting around... While it's certainly not the whole "why", it's representative. 

Why lock blades?

To stab

 

[cbl51]

Why lock blades?

Locking knives are great. I carry one in the form of the wave at work and tenacious at home. They offer the safety of a fixed blade when having to stab when required (opening sacks) with the convenience of a folder (pocket carry).

What’s not to like.

Whats not to like???

The simple statement that you make about how they offer the safety of a fixed blade tells me that you totally miss the whole point. They do NOT offer the safety of a fixe blade. That is an illusion put out by the knife manufacturers to sell their over hyped and over priced knives.

This is the third time I've seen a young man get very seriously injured by a "locked" knife. All three of them had one big thing in common; they all were amazed and even dumfounded that the knife folded on them when pushed. All the way to the hospital, John kept repeating to himself that he didn't understand what happened, the blade was locked. And John is soooo typical of the young men of his generation.

John grew up in a typical Southern California mega suburbia. His father was an engineer with lots of lab experience endnote an outdoorsman. He knows very little about knives, and bought what was a highly advertised knife, a ZT with tiger stripes on the blade. Tiger stripes?

Like most the guys ins generation, he never even handled a slip joint, and his sole knife experience was the one hand wonder lock blades. He never learned proper safe knife handling, and when I tried to gov him some fatherly advice, his reply was "That's okay, I'm not using one of those old fashioned knives that don't lock." He was convinced that he had the ultimate folding knife that would never fold on him because of the mighty lock. Now he has a partly disable right hand and is looking at an operation by. a hand speSmurfpillst to restore full use to this right index finger, which the stitches are now out, but it doesn't work much.

Theres a whole generation of guys that have b been taken in by the knife industry. The industry has created an artificial market to stimulate sales by pushing a BS product. A product that is an accident waiting to happen.

In the old days, a man carried a pocket that had a couple blades, and would fold up on him if he acted stupidly with it. if he needed a stronger blade, he'd use a fixed blade, as it is called now. Darn near every man had a small fixed blade. They were made by Case, Kabar,  Western, Camillus, Buck, and others. They were not expensive as there was not much to them. A blade and a handle and a sheath to put them in. The could not fold up unless you actually snapped the blade off, and that took a real effort.

There is absolutely nothing that a  lock blade can do that a fixed blade can't as well if not better and safer.

[cbl51]

To circle back to the original question.  I think I'll just bluntly answer what I've been skirting around... While it's certainly not the whole "why", it's representative. 

Why lock blades?

To stab

 

Thank you for the honesty.

A Victorinox SAK is a pocket knife. A Buck 301 stockman is a pocket knife.

Some knife that can be flicked open with one hand and blade locks, is a weapon. The modern knife industry is selling fantasy with the over hyped knives they sell to young men who don't know any better.

[SteveC]

Thank you for the honesty.

A Victorinox SAK is a pocket knife. A Buck 301 stockman is a pocket knife.

Some knife that can be flicked open with one hand and blade locks, is a weapon. The modern knife industry is selling fantasy with the over hyped knives they sell to young men who don't know any better.

That's painting it with a pretty broad brush 


Lockbacks with OHO have their place and uses, this is coming from someone who pretty much carries slipjoints only. I do use a modern OHO locker for a work knife as it is much safer for rough use.

[ElevenBlade]

Whats not to like???

The simple statement that you make about how they offer the safety of a fixed blade tells me that you totally miss the whole point. They do NOT offer the safety of a fixe blade. That is an illusion put out by the knife manufacturers to sell their over hyped and over priced knives.

This is the third time I've seen a young man get very seriously injured by a "locked" knife. All three of them had one big thing in common; they all were amazed and even dumfounded that the knife folded on them when pushed. All the way to the hospital, John kept repeating to himself that he didn't understand what happened, the blade was locked. And John is soooo typical of the young men of his generation.

John grew up in a typical Southern California mega suburbia. His father was an engineer with lots of lab experience endnote an outdoorsman. He knows very little about knives, and bought what was a highly advertised knife, a ZT with tiger stripes on the blade. Tiger stripes?

Like most the guys ins generation, he never even handled a slip joint, and his sole knife experience was the one hand wonder lock blades. He never learned proper safe knife handling, and when I tried to gov him some fatherly advice, his reply was "That's okay, I'm not using one of those old fashioned knives that don't lock." He was convinced that he had the ultimate folding knife that would never fold on him because of the mighty lock. Now he has a partly disable right hand and is looking at an operation by. a hand speSmurfpillst to restore full use to this right index finger, which the stitches are now out, but it doesn't work much.

Theres a whole generation of guys that have b been taken in by the knife industry. The industry has created an artificial market to stimulate sales by pushing a BS product. A product that is an accident waiting to happen.

In the old days, a man carried a pocket that had a couple blades, and would fold up on him if he acted stupidly with it. if he needed a stronger blade, he'd use a fixed blade, as it is called now. Darn near every man had a small fixed blade. They were made by Case, Kabar,  Western, Camillus, Buck, and others. They were not expensive as there was not much to them. A blade and a handle and a sheath to put them in. The could not fold up unless you actually snapped the blade off, and that took a real effort.

There is absolutely nothing that a  lock blade can do that a fixed blade can't as well if not better and safer.

  cbl!

It's an unfortunate aspect of our culture.  A vast majority of us drive like our brakes won't fail.  walk like the floor isn't slippery, cut like the lock won't collapse.  And then we sue the manufacturer or owner. 

In my less-foolish, not-yet-wiser years I only really ever use two locking knives: a Victorinox and a Camillus, not counting pliers based MTs.  I open them carefully with two hands (assuming the back spring will overcome my strength, and I use them as if the lock will fail.  Then, harkening back to the "snap or pinch closed" debate, I pinch them closed under the assumption that my fingers can slip into the slot of the handle. 

As always, your posts are appreciated.   

[cbl51]

That's painting it with a pretty broad brush 


Lockbacks with OHO have their place and uses, this is coming from someone who pretty much carries slipjoints only. I do use a modern OHO locker for a work knife as it is much safer for rough use.

Painting with a broad brush gets the job done faster.

I'm sorry but the elephant in the room should be addressed. I grew up watching and learning from men who just got back fighting a world war. They didn't feel the need for a locking blade knife, and they did the job of life very well. In fact, the only people who carried knives with locking blades in my youth were the punks. The Italian style switch blades and stilettos that were some kind of a badge of manhood. The modern one hand flipper is the modern switch blade for the wannabe James Dean's of our age.

Safer for rough use?

Is there anything that lock blade will do for you that a Buck 102, Esee Izula, Matini puuko, Mora fixed blade or any other trout and bird size sheath knife will do? Aside from fold up that is?

Come on, are you really going to say that a small fixed blade will not stand up to "rough" work better than any folding knife?

There comes a point where the tool become a weapon because of design.

[toolguy]

Your posts have come off as bitter and angry.

Too bad.

[SteveC]

You are obviously looking for a fight. I never said anything about a lockback being better suited than a fixed blade for rough use.

A modern lockblade it definitely more suited for rough use than a slippie. 

All knives are weapons if used as such,  I'm done here  .

[ElevenBlade]

as an aside - I like to have an awl on my EDC because I think its a safer method of stabbing into things, not just wood and leather, but cardboard, sacks, plastic, etc.

[ElevenBlade]

cbl51

You sound like someone who's son in law hurt himself badly with a lockback knife.

Wishing him a speedy recovery, and some comfort for you and your family

[Vidar]

as an aside - I like to have an awl on my EDC because I think its a safer method of stabbing into things, not just wood and leather, but cardboard, sacks, plastic, etc.

As an aside to the aside - I find myself wanting locks more often for awls and screwdrivers than for knives.

On another aside - adjusting the spring on a slip joint folding tool is a balance in itself: Too little and it folds back too easily. Too hard and people might mistake it for a lock and when it does fold back it does so sudden and with power. I'd prefer an honest lock over a very hard spring. 

[JBW1]

Great perspectives. Thank you guys for the read.

[David]

There comes a point where the tool become a weapon because of design.

Some knife that can be flicked open with one hand and blade locks, is a weapon.

Those two statements right there are about the two biggest piles of bravo sierra I've seen in some time. Anything held in your hand can be used as a weapon even your SAK and 301.

[JBW1]

A wooden spoon wielded by an angry grandma Has been used as a weapon against unruly kids more times than grandpas pocket knife, weather locking or slip joint....

[Sos24]

I think the popularity of lock blades is cannot to three aspects in modern society
- society’s perception of knives
- current laws and their interpretation
- rural vs urban life

Society’s perception of knives has drastically changed over the years.  Many people, especially in cities, view anything over the size of a SAK or small traditional knife as a weapon.  Most of your statement of not needing a lock blade is because you are pairing a slip joint and a sheath knife.  Well, in many places in modern society, if you are visually carrying a sheath knife then you might get the police called on you or at the very least confronted about why you are carrying a weapon.  A lock blade folder will never be as good as a sheath knife but at least I can shove it in a pocket where it is not drawing attention until I need it.  As long as I know the limitations then it is better suited for tougher tasks then a slip joint and more acceptable by much of society than a sheath knife, so it is a compromise.

When I was growing up, I was given a camp knife ant 8 and carried a knife every since.  I was given my first sheath knife at 12 and carried that a lot when planning on doing stuff outside.  No one thought anything of it.  Now in that same state, children under 16 may not possess a “dangerous knife”.  “Dangerous knife” is up to the interpretation of LE and prosecutors, but I’m pretty sure most sheath knives would be interpreted as such, where as a lock blade might escape.  Some states have laws against “Bowie knives” lr “dirks”, etc.  Again the term is not legally defined.  A knowledgeable person may be able to explain differences, but that is not the majority of society.  If asked some will say a “Bowie” is just another name for non-folding non-kitchen knife.  Then the law adds in terms such as “like kind” or “similar” and the area of legally acceptable gets even slimmer.  If the description says “Bowie style” blade then even a small blade could be that.  A “tanto” blade could be “similar” to a dirk because it has 2 sharpened edges and a point.  That may seem stupid, but for some that is the environment that we live in.

The situation is even worse if you are in a city because knives are viewed by many as weapons and not tools.  And anything bigger than a small pocket knife that is visible becomes “he has a weapon”.   If in remote areas there is not as much thought given, but even in some areas and especially cities, many don’t see a need for a knife, until they need one, because it is perceived as a weapon, especially if visible sheath knife.

So yes, a slip joint and a sheath knife are better utility, but based off environment, laws and perception sometimes a compromise is required and during those times a lock blade is very useful.

[ReamerPunch]

I've seen people on youtube review knives and multi-tools, and damning them for being slipjoint, as if they'll spontaneously set their users on fire or something.

It goes beyond knives, though. Remember when you looked left, then right, and crossed the road? My school did not have a crossing guard. Despite that, I am still alive. But nowadays you need a crossing guard because kids are becoming less aware of how the world works.

[ElevenBlade]

By that estimation, a screwdriver, pencil, or guitar string can be a weapon too.

Not to be contrarian, but then were do you draw the line?

Again, trying to tread lightly, and not having an answer in my own personal viewpoint.

The law of the place I live considers a OHO lockback a weapon, whereas a slipjoint is not.

I ask you.  How is that BS?  If I venture out of my neighborhood and carry a OHO lockback I will be arrested for carrying a weapon.  If I carry a Vic Spartan, I won't.  Period

You can use your personal judgment, or you can go by what the law says. 

However, calling BS on where somoene draws that line without drawing their own is nothing more than an ad hominem fallacy.

Again, I'm not saying I agree with, or like this very circular distinction.  I am saying that it's a strongly enough held distinction to consider a benchmark of sorts, and it's worth considering the why's and wherefores.