UK Legal Carry Thread!

[Neil]

just found this link on google after doing a search on multitools.it looks like it is a police forum.
it clears up a couple of points i think
http://www.ukpoliceonline.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=26098

Excellent link    Very interesting.  As I suspected it seems that the current climate has created a situation where a lot of the discretion has been taken away from the bobbies on the job  

Earlier I said who'd be a lawyer, I'll add to that who'd be a Police Officer   

Neil

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

I  want to be arrested by this guy http://www.ukpoliceonline.co.uk/index.php?s=&showtopic=26098&view=findpost&p=279710 Hows that for a bit of common sence

[Neil]

Personally I don't want to be arrested by any of them ... but I see your point

Neil

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

Personally I don't want to be arrested by any of them ... but I see your point

Neil

Well I was up near Victoria a few weeks back, and there was one WPC I wouldn'd have minded being arrested by

[Dunc]

A guy from where I work had a visit by the police and taken down the station  ( I believe his neighbour accused him assult ) .A very pretty WPC came and took him away and in the car she asked him if he had anything on him he shouldn't have . He had a small lock knife .She told him it was illegal to carry and best let her look after it until he came out of the station .

Sounds fair to me .

Dunc

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

A guy from where I work had a visit by the police and taken down the station  ( I believe his neighbour accused him assult ) .A very pretty WPC came and took him away and in the car she asked him if he had anything on him he shouldn't have . He had a small lock knife .She told him it was illegal to carry and best let her look after it until he came out of the station .

Sounds fair to me .

Dunc

Fair play to the lass

[Dunc]

I can't believe what I have just read     I suggest all UK members read this

http://www.britishblades.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71404

Theres alot of wound up Brits 

Dunc

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

I can't believe what I have just read     I suggest all UK members read this

http://www.britishblades.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71404

Theres alot of wound up Brits 

Dunc

That is truly stupid , you cannot flick a blade out on a UKPK, I know coz I've tried

I can't say I'm exactly shocked though, you take a chance ordering anything knifey from the US atm, especially the bigger retailers

I'm sure Sak's and MT's are ok though

[DaveK]

Looks like an over-eager HMCE officer jumping to conclusions to me. I reckon he'll get his knife back, but I suppose time will tell!

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

Yeah he'll probably get it back, but it does reinforce my opinion on getting knifey stuff from these shores though

[Benner]

It's funny this should come up as I was actually going to start a thread on this.

It seems that more and more knives are being seized ATM, so much so that I suggest that for the time being anyone who is in the UK should buy anything even remotely "tactical" from UK or European stores.  This is a real shame as I would always recommend the banner advertisers, but so much stuff is being lost at customs that I just don't think it is worth the risk.

If you do decide to chance it, try to avoid any knives where the blade can be flung out by not touching the blade and with force alone.  These seem to be seized the most as customs regard them as being gravity knives.  Sadly, this means nearly all Spyderco knives and similar. 

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

And with the exchange rate being what it is, there's not to much to be gained anyway now

[Benner]

And with the exchange rate being what it is, there's not to much to be gained anyway now

There still is a slight pay advantage with buying from the US, but I find the main bonus is the selection of blades they have over there.  I can think of a couple of knives I'd be interested in getting that aren't available over here, but simply won't risk customs taking it (even though they are perfectly legal  ).

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

And with the exchange rate being what it is, there's not to much to be gained anyway now

There still is a slight pay advantage with buying from the US, but I find the main bonus is the selection of blades they have over there.  I can think of a couple of knives I'd be interested in getting that aren't available over here, but simply won't risk customs taking it (even though they are perfectly legal  ).

Yeah there is still the choice, but as you pointed out, there's quite a risk you won't actully get it

[Benner]

And with the exchange rate being what it is, there's not to much to be gained anyway now

There still is a slight pay advantage with buying from the US, but I find the main bonus is the selection of blades they have over there.  I can think of a couple of knives I'd be interested in getting that aren't available over here, but simply won't risk customs taking it (even though they are perfectly legal  ).

Yeah there is still the choice, but as you pointed out, there's quite a risk you won't actully get it

A risk sadly I don't think is worth taking. 

I think traders that import stuff will do well ATM and will be the best bet for most folders.

[Gareth]

Looks like an over-eager HMCE officer jumping to conclusions to me. I reckon he'll get his knife back, but I suppose time will tell!

I wish this were true but I doubt it.  Unless he is prepaired to pay for legal council with the good chance he will incurr the costs it's never going to go near the courts.  Without that then he is never going to see his knife again.  He is now in the position that he has to prove that the knife is legal (which it is IMO) rather than the other way around.

The fact that Customs are wrong doesn't come into it, he has to be willing to fight it in court.   It shouldn't be that way but, at the moment, it is.   

[DaveK]

You might be right, let's see!

[Benner]

Looks like an over-eager HMCE officer jumping to conclusions to me. I reckon he'll get his knife back, but I suppose time will tell!

I wish this were true but I doubt it.  Unless he is prepaired to pay for legal council with the good chance he will incurr the costs it's never going to go near the courts.  Without that then he is never going to see his knife again.  He is now in the position that he has to prove that the knife is legal (which it is IMO) rather than the other way around.

The fact that Customs are wrong doesn't come into it, he has to be willing to fight it in court.   It shouldn't be that way but, at the moment, it is.   

That is exactly the problem people are having.  People are buying things from the US that are even legally sold here in the UK and are losing them due to technicalities.  They are doing nothing wrong but to prove that takes time and a lot of wedge so who is going to go to all that trouble for a folding knife?  I hope he does though.

[Benner]

I have removed the Lumabiner as I believe it has a liner lock.

If anyone knows any different let me know and I will put it back.

[Benner]

Maserin Marinera http://www.heinnie.com/product.asp?s=849wem1030116&strParents=&CAT_ID=92&P_ID=2922&strPageHistory=search&numSearchStartRecord=49

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

Ok the UK law regarding the carrying of blades is in the first post

Anyone who want's to expand upon it, please feel free

[Flash]

How about the new Spyderco Bug? 

Seems to be a slippie 

[Benner]

Ok the UK law regarding the carrying of blades is in the first post

Anyone who want's to expand upon it, please feel free

Looks good! 

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

How about the new Spyderco Bug? 

Seems to be a slippie 

Added, and I'll add a link as soon as I can find one

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

Ok the UK law regarding the carrying of blades is in the first post

Anyone who want's to expand upon it, please feel free

Looks good! 

Thank's mate

[jzmtl]

Looks like the new guy who just started at your custom likes knives more than you do. 

[Grant Lamontagne]

Ok if like me your tired of trawling the internet for interesting, but UK street legal edc how about we make a list of them here for easy reference for us poor oppressed Brits

Add your sugestions, and either Ben or myself will edit them into this thread to make life easier all round

So it's up to you fella's to make this idea work, so get listing

Folding knives

Spyderco Bug
Spyderco UKPK - http://spyderco.com/catalog/details.php?product=243
Spyderco Pride - http://spyderco.com/catalog/details.php?product=62
Spyderco T-Mag - http://spyderco.com/catalog/details.php?product=244
CRKT Edgie - http://www.crkt.com/edgie.html
Boker Buddy - http://www.heinnie.com/product.asp?s=hhwpvl1009267&strParents=&CAT_ID=116&P_ID=3578
Falkniven U1 - http://fallkniven.com/u1/us-u1.htm
Douk-Douk (small) - https://edcdepot.com/merchantmanager/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=43&products_id=160
Moki Thuja UK - http://www.heinnie.com/hy3ie71011594/Knives/Moki/Moki-Thuja-UK/p-92-175-1541/
Case knives (sub 3" bladed, non-locking models) - http://www.wrcase.com/knives/
Maserin Marinera - http://www.heinnie.com/product.asp?s=849wem1030116&strParents=&CAT_ID=92&P_ID=2922&strPageHistory=search&numSearchStartRecord=49


Swiss Army Knives - All those with a blade below 3" and where the blade does not lock.  Below are a good selection.

Victorinox Soldier (make sure it's the 2 handed ALOX version) - http://www.victorinox.ch/index.cfm?site=victorinox.ch&page=234&lang=E
Victorinox Swisschamp - http://www.victorinox.ch/index.cfm?site=victorinox.ch&page=167&lang=E

Multitools

Leatherman Juice series - http://leatherman.com/multi-tools/pocket-tools/default.aspx
Leatherman Knifeless Fuse - http://leatherman.com/multi-tools/full-size-tools/knifeless-fuse.aspx
Leatherman Squirt series - http://leatherman.com/multi-tools/keychain-tools/default.aspx
Gerber Shortcut - http://www.gerbergear.com/index.php/product/id/89
Gerber Clutch - http://www.gerbergear.com/index.php/product/id/97
Gerber Solstice - http://www.multitool.org/gerber/keychain-tools/gerber-solstice.html
Atwood tools (all bladeless models) - http://www.atwoodknives.com/
Swiss-Tech tools - http://www.swisstechtools.com/
Sebertech tools - http://www.sebertech.co.uk/acatalog/index.html
CRKT Guppie - http://www.crkt.com/guppie.html
CRKT Li'l Guppie - http://www.crkt.com/lilguppie.html
CRKT Get-a-way driver - http://www.crkt.com/gawdriver.html
Byrd Firebyrd - http://spyderco.com/catalog/details.php?product=207
Beretta Shotgun tool - http://www.heinnie.com/qp9l8i1009924/Pocket-Tools/Beretta/Berretta-Shotgun-Tool/p-94-400-2464/
Gatco/Timberline Frog Tool - http://www.multitool.org/miscellaneous-tools/medium-tools/gatco/timberline-frog-tool.html
Latshaw Pocketwrench II - http://thequinlans.org/knives/bob/tool/pocketwrench_ii.html

The UK carry laws...

CJA 1988 – Section 139: Offence of having article with blade or point in
public place
(1) Subject to subsections (4) and (5) below, any person who has an article to which this
section applies with him in a public place shall be guilty of an offence.
(2) Subject to subsection (3) below, this section applies to any article which has a blade or
is sharply pointed except a folding pocketknife.
(3) This section applies to a folding pocketknife if the cutting edge of its blade exceeds 3
inches.
(4) It shall be a defence for a person charged with an offence under this section to prove
that he had good reason or lawful authority for having the article with him in a public
place.
(5) Without prejudice to the generality of subsection (4) above, it shall be a defence for a
person charged with an offence under this section to prove that he had the article with
him —
a. for use at work;
b. for religious reasons; or
c. as part of any national costume.
(6) A person guilty of an offence under subsection (1) above shall be liable -
a. on summary conviction, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding six months,
or a fine not exceeding the statutory maximum, or both;
b. on conviction on indictment, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding two
years, or a fine, or both.
(Continues overleaf)
(7) In this section “public place” includes any place to which at the material time the public
have or are permitted access, whether on payment or otherwise.
(8 ) This section shall not have effect in relation to anything done before it comes into force.
The text quoted on this card is from the Criminal Justice Act 1988
and can be checked for veracity (or for any changes to the law) online at:
http://www.statutelaw.gov.uk/content.aspx?LegType=All+Prim
ary&PageNumber=1&Year=1988&NavFrom=2&parentActiveTextDocId
=2116646&ActiveTextDocId=2116820&filesize=4465
Please type the above URL into your web browser as one line of text, there are no spaces.


Handy link http://www.davidappleton.co.uk/bbforum/cja1988_s139_card.pdf

Gentlemen, am I missing something?  I see nothing in this statute regarding blade locks.  It says that only a folding pocket knife is permissible, but it says nothing about locking or slip jointed blades.

(2) Subject to subsection (3) below, this section applies to any article which has a blade or
is sharply pointed except a folding pocketknife.
(3) This section applies to a folding pocketknife if the cutting edge of its blade exceeds 3
inches.

This doesn't mean that an overzealous officer may not arrest you, but it certainly is enough for the charges to be thrown out.  Unless this is stipulated somewhere else that isn't listed here?  Otherwise, it seems that the fear of locking blades is akin to people laying blades across their hands here and saying something is illegal because it's more than three fingers wide.

The nice thing about the law, and why I suggested actually posting the actual letters of the law, is that if it isn't written and defined, it doesn't exist.

Def

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

I just posted the law that pertains to what you can actually legally carry, as that's the purpose of this thread . If someone want's to expand upon it (ie Nick or Ricky) then I'll be happy to add it

[Flash]

Yeah...a slipjoint is classed as a folding knife ie there is no mechanical lock in place.

You can carry a locking knife as long as you have reasonable excuse eg a carpenter going to work or a bushcrafter in the middle of deep woodland.

However, depending on the Officers discretion you may still need to argue your "reasonableness" during a tape recorded interview 

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

Yeah...a slipjoint is classed as a folding knife ie there is no mechanical lock in place.

You can carry a locking knife as long as you have reasonable excuse eg a carpenter going to work or a bushcrafter in the middle of deep woodland.

However, depending on the Officers discretion you may still need to argue your "reasonableness" during a tape recorded interview 

Thanks fella