Multitool.org Forum
Outdoor Section => The Outdoor and Survival Forum => Topic started by: Aloha on August 23, 2015, 09:27:25 AM
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I've stumbled upon this neat product that IMO would be a good option to those in bear or most predator areas. I'd imagine this would be good in other situations.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sLfKQKWgWU
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Sorry for the late reply, but I wasn't a member back in August.
I know 3 guys who live in Alaska and each has encountered bears while not specifically hunting for them. I've asked them what they carry for bear defense and got laughed at. Seems they get that question a lot. Their most common recommended firearm for bear defense is a shotgun loaded with slugs, but most people just carry a pistol when hiking, fishing, or doing regular chores out doors in areas where there are bears, because it doesn't get in the way of those activities. Most Alaskans generally just carry the same pistol all the time for self defense whether against bad people or bad bears.
Canadian Prepper doesn't think the pen launcher is entirely safe if kept loaded and I agree with that assessment. I don't think a charging bear will wait while you load it. If firearms are not legal a large can of bear strength pepper spray might be a better choice for defense.
Most of the time bears aren't going to attack anyway. They just aren't interested in people and they typically run away as soon as they see or hear you. On that very rare occasion that you encounter a bear that doesn't back down I'd hope to have at least a shotgun with me, but I wouldn't want a shotgun full of flares or noise makers.
If it is legal to have a firearm with you at all, you might as well have live ammo in it. A live round fired into the air will make plenty of noise which will probably scare a bear away. My preference, however, would be a rifle. A variant of the AK, with a 30 round magazine, and my reasoning is simple. I have a better chance of hitting something with a light recoiling rifle than with a shotgun or a pistol, and if a bear charges at me my plan would be to go Tony Montana on it and empty most of that magazine. I know 30 round mags are not legal in Canada, but I'd still prefer a rifle, even with a 5 round limit. A defensive kill is a way different sort of thing than a sporting kill. You don't have to feel too bad about putting down an animal with more than one shot, if it was attacking you. Just my opinion, and you may feel differently.
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I ran into bears while geocaching in the woods 4 or 5 times this year and they didn't give me any trouble.
I just back off and go the other way. A nice whistle will generally scare them off. We're surrounded by nature reserves so shooting stuff is't really allowed unless you got a boatload of permits.
We do get about 1-2 people mauled by bears each year here, but it's mostly silly tourists trying to feed them, drunks who fell asleep on benches near the hills in wintertime or people unlucky enough to make a mother bear and cub feel cornered.
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The advise given to me as a kid was avoid surprising wild animals would solve most problems, so do talk or sing when out in the woods. Then again, large predators are borderline extinct here.
:nothingtoadd:
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You'll get no argument from me as to the "best" method of dealing with an attacking bear :tu:. As far as "best" precaution, making noise tends to be widely accepted. Making a bear "think twice", I'm all for carrying bear specific pepper spray. I have also read about marine flares being used as well, as a deterrent.
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I only encountered 1 bear this year, and at a good distance. A loud voice was enough to get it to depart camp. Bear bangers are fun, but not practical. My singing is repellant to most everything with hearing. I've been told my snoring is as well. My socks... Enough said! Foaming wasp spray that can shoot 3+ meters is cheaper, easier to obtain, multi-purpose, and more effective to use than "bear spray" which is classed as a weapon in many areas. I'd prefer an axe over a firearm. I can do many more things with an axe than I could with a long gun.
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The problem with wasp spray is its effects on eyes and lungs are permanent.
So now you have blind, pissed off bear tramping about the woods, a danger to itself and others.
This is both reckless and inhumane compared to the firearms option if available.
It is simply unethical to use a weapon that will cause permanent, crippling damage to a game animal without the option of a potentially clean kill, even if it is for self defense.
Carry a gun if you can and make it a good shot, carry bear spray and hope for the best if you can't get a gun.
If you cant do either; simply be aware. Awareness will get you out of more bad situations than any weapon by not getting you into them in the first place.
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Good to know. I've never had an opportunity to use any form of spray against a bear because, as you suggest, I've found avoidance is easier. While I'm a good shot against restrained paper (targets), carrying any firearm isn't an option when I camp off my motorcycle. Neither is an axe for that matter.
I will still carry wasp spray as a last option, as it is a multi-function product that is easy to obtain and has been proven to be much more effective than the bear sprays available here.
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I did a lot of hiking in Alaska in the mid '00s and encountered many bears, black and brown. None ever paid me any attention. As has been stated many times in this thread, awareness and common sense go a long way in the woods, mountains, prairie, etc... That being said, I also always had a can of bear spray in a sheath on my belt just in case.
In regard to firearms, go ahead and Google appropriate firearms for bear protection, specifically, suitable pistol cartridges. I dare you. You get to see plenty of that internet rudeness that most forums are famous for. "You're stupid if carry anything smaller than a .500 S&W" Junk like that. The same dude said that a .30-30 was inadequate for whitetail, let alone bears.... Really? The .30-30 has probably killed more deer than any other and has more energy than almost all handgun cartridges.
My belief is that, yes, bigger is better when you are dealing with an angry, attacking creatures. But you need to be able to shoot the firearm, regardless of caliber, effectively under duress. So familiarity and confidence are the biggest things. If all you can handle is a .380 Auto, carry it, be familiar with it, and be ready to use it.
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Being British, we don't use weapons.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVS1UfCfxlU
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Bear country? One of these would be my choice.
(http://i1102.photobucket.com/albums/g448/Jerseydevil379/Mobile%20Uploads/zoom_1895_zps61x5crrg.jpg) (http://s1102.photobucket.com/user/Jerseydevil379/media/Mobile%20Uploads/zoom_1895_zps61x5crrg.jpg.html)
M1895 Marlin in .45-70. One of these is my deer rifle. :D. With 405-grain bullets, there's nothing in North or South America that the .45-70 can't take on. Not bad for a 142-year old cartridge.
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Bear country? One of these would be my choice.
(http://i1102.photobucket.com/albums/g448/Jerseydevil379/Mobile%20Uploads/zoom_1895_zps61x5crrg.jpg) (http://s1102.photobucket.com/user/Jerseydevil379/media/Mobile%20Uploads/zoom_1895_zps61x5crrg.jpg.html)
M1895 Marlin in .45-70. One of these is my deer rifle. :D. With 405-grain bullets, there's nothing in North or South America that the .45-70 can't take on. Not bad for a 142-year old cartridge.
The cartridge that almost drove the American bison to extinction. :D I'd like to get a big bore rifle to hunt with someday. I hear the recoil is pretty severe, though.
Can't beat a good lever gun. I am quite fond of my 336 :tu: So fast
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Being British, we don't use weapons.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVS1UfCfxlU
Love that ad, still remember how hard I laughed the first time seeing this. :rofl: :tu:
I did a lot of hiking in Alaska in the mid '00s and encountered many bears, black and brown. None ever paid me any attention. As has been stated many times in this thread, awareness and common sense go a long way in the woods, mountains, prairie, etc... That being said, I also always had a can of bear spray in a sheath on my belt just in case.
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I don't own any firearms, but do too carry a bear spray with me in bear country, especially if I am alone hiking/taking pictures before the sunrise. Since we are on this topic, I do like this video made by Tom Smith from NOLs:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PExlT-5VU-Y
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Being British, we don't use weapons.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVS1UfCfxlU
That one is hilarious! :rofl:
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That video was hilarious but that was a cheap shot :whistle:
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That video was hilarious but that was a cheap shot :whistle:
Totally tongue in cheek ;) A little light humour is the only semi-productive thing I can contribute to this thread, and any excuse to post that ad again :D
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Up here in Canada, you can't have a handgun in the forest unless you have a special trapper's permit/bush pilot, etc. Thus, really short barreled shotguns are very popular for those who can't have a big caliber pistol for bear protection (and even for those who can...as a slug is far better than a .44 mag for close defense). Funnily enough, short barreled shotguns are legal in Canada provided they come from the factory as such. This is a good example...
https://www.canadaammo.com/product/detail/dominion-arms-grizzly-8-5-magfed-shotgun/
A little 8.5" barreled Grizzly shotgun packed with 5 slugs should do the trick.
I personally have been chased by black bears twice. Both times, I was young and it was my fault that they chased me. As an adult, I have had several run in with black bears and we both left the scene our own ways with no issues. Black bears have nothing on Grizzlies however. Out west, if I enjoyed the outdoors plenty, I would carry something be it bear spray, or a shotgun.
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That video was hilarious but that was a cheap shot :whistle:
Totally tongue in cheek ;) A little light humour is the only semi-productive thing I can contribute to this thread, and any excuse to post that ad again :D
I know 50, I too was being tongue in cheek with my response to the "family jewels" strike :D
I watched the video several times and love it. The bears spinning kick was awesome.
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@ Comis
The video you linked is outstanding info. Thank you very much for providing it. I have always felt some of the "better" known advice was............... interesting.
This guy really hit the nail on the head. I also liked his presentation and the manner in which it was delivered.