Multitool.org Forum
Tool Talk => General Tool Discussion => Topic started by: NetsNJ on October 10, 2019, 03:57:16 PM
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What are your biggest multitool pet peeves?
For me, it has to be when the blade edge smacks against the floor of a handle because of poor design or QC. It enrages me. It is one thing on cheapos. But most SOGs (like the powerlock) and Gerbers (like the MP600) have this issue. These are not cheap tools! To their credit, I have never seen a Victorinox or Leatherman with careless enough design to let the edge get flattened on a handle. It really pisses me off, since it is so easy to fix. :facepalm:
What are yours?
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Any tools or the pliers rubbing
on the handles peeves me off ???
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Having to pick just ONE to carry. :whistle:
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:iagree:
Lets face it, we love tools and having to be "realistic" in what to carry is lame. Yesterday I didn't have that "problem".
I guess for me its QC. I've been lucky I guess. Reading thru threads of members who get lemons irritate me.
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Any tools or the pliers rubbing
on the handles peeves me off ???
I don't mind this, it's hard to get everything in a compact space. I don't mind if the side of the blade rubs against a handle and gets scuffed. I just can't stand the edge of the blade striking the floor of the handle channel. That impacts usability.
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All of the above, plus
- When tools rub on other tools. In particular, when an otherwise good quality (and not cheap) knife only has 2-3 blades, and the blades rub on one another.
- When the handles are uncomfortable. Sometimes I wonder if they actually bothered to “beta test” or even build and test a working prototype before putting the tool into production.
- How some cheap tools are labeled “for emergency use only”. So, the tool is too poorly made to stand up to the rigors of everyday use, but I’m supposed to trust it in an emergency? Are you smurfing kidding me?!?!
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When the blade hits the handle during closing is also one of my pet peeves.
And when the tip of needle nose pliers don't line up is also high on my list (I mean when the tool is brand-new, on a well used tool this is just part of normal wear).
And I agree with Aloha's statement about QC issues.
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Any tools or the pliers rubbing
on the handles peeves me off ???
This. I just had a tool wear the black oxide off the plier head after only opening it a few times.
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to me the biggest thing is the lack of quality holsters.
I carry a Surge every day for work on my belt and none of the manufacturers make a worthy sheath that can last more than a few months of use with the heaviest tools. i have to modify my own.
the 2nd thing would be when it bites me!
surge and supertool owners among others will know that palm pinch when you close it that i refer to..
i'm experienced with them and it doesn't catch me often, but the other day my surge reminded me again who's boss. :twak:
the 3rd thing i would like to see is more superficial artist design in MT's. engraved brass handles maybe? inlays? rare metals?
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Probably my two biggest pet peeves are
- due to lack of nail nicks or tool rub, you have to open several tools just to be able to open the tool you want
- due to size, design or location within tool; a tool is not really able to be properly used. If it isn’t going to do what it should, then why bother to include? Is it just there to make the number of tools higher, so it looks more useful than it really is?
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Putting the can opener too far to the right of the handle, so it can't hook on the tin and actually open it.
Making blades shorter than the handle allows.
Making washers the thickness of implements, wasting space.
Too much handle splay.
Not being able to order most stuff to Australia, or trying to, only to see the shipping go through the roof.
Not having a reamer in every multi-tool.
Having a thousand flatheads on a tool.
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Putting the can opener too far to the right of the handle, so it can't hook on the tin and actually open it.
Making blades shorter than the handle allows.
Making washers the thickness of implements, wasting space.
Too much handle splay.
Not being able to order most stuff to Australia, or trying to, only to see the shipping go through the roof.
Not having a reamer in every multi-tool.
Having a thousand flatheads on a tool.
I totally agree.
Lack of proper nail nicks also bother me.
Shipping to my country is a pain...
Enviado de meu moto g(6) usando o Tapatalk
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--Difficult to pull out tools, regardless it was dues to poor design/rub/QC/whatever
--Loose tool, especially knife, it really does suck if you pocket carry it (But it could be a user's fault)
--Poor, uneven grind on blade. It's just wrong when a 15 dollars Mora always get it right, but a MT which worth multiple times more can't even have an even grind.
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I don't like multitools which are big and heavy, yet have undersized implements (screwdrivers, knife, etc.). Examples include Leatherman OHT and Gerber M800.
Another problem -- multitools which are poorly finished, e.g., Super Bear Jaws, Leatherman Wave. Super Bear Jaws had poor grinding, making the individual tools ultra difficult to open. My Wave has sharp edges everywhere which chafe the hand when holding it. Internal tools pinch the palm when using the pliers.
Don't need corkscrews, can openers, bottle openers, USB ports, built in flashlight, ear wax spoons, etc.
One of my favorite multitools is the old Crescent Toolzall Pro, made by Bear and Sons.
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ear wax spoon does sound intriguing...
at least that's what we'll say it's used for :whistle:
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1. lack of quality holsters.
2. when it bites me!
Walley you made some great points :tu:. The palm pinch is something users rarely talk about with LMs. Its a thing for sure and can be negated by reversing the pivot on the outside tools. Someone mentioned this already on the forum but I forget who.
We know LM can make really good sheath as some of their older leather ones are terrific.
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I know people have had bad experiences with the sheaths but I have one that came with my Surge and its taken some abuse. With my love handles and tight belt, it still looks brand new. So they arent all bad.
However the leather sheath that came with my ST300 I cant get my belt through it...
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Putting the can opener too far to the right of the handle, so it can't hook on the tin and actually open it.
Making blades shorter than the handle allows.
Making washers the thickness of implements, wasting space.
Too much handle splay.
Not being able to order most stuff to Australia, or trying to, only to see the shipping go through the roof.
Not having a reamer in every multi-tool.
Having a thousand flatheads on a tool.
I 100% agree with the first few. The can opener one is really bad. I don't mind having multiple slotted drivers unless I feel like the tool is missing something that could have been in one of those spots, THEN it really bothers me.
I would also add:
Anytime a tool comes with a useless file! All files should have the notches (teeth?) on the edge, not just the sides. Also many files are made from a cheap stainless steel and are not hard enough to actually function. (see picture)
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Overcomplex locking mechanism for me.
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What are your biggest multitool pet peeves?
For me, it has to be when the blade edge smacks against the floor of a handle because of poor design or QC. It enrages me. It is one thing on cheapos. But most SOGs (like the powerlock) and Gerbers (like the MP600) have this issue. These are not cheap tools! To their credit, I have never seen a Victorinox or Leatherman with careless enough design to let the edge get flattened on a handle. It really pisses me off, since it is so easy to fix. :facepalm:
What are yours?
I got a PSTII that does exactly this. Blade rubbs on handle and dulls. Tried to improve that by taping the handle inside with little success.
Kicks my OCD whenever I carry this tool.
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Phillips Screwdrivers which slip, slip, slip. Can Openers that can't open a can. Bottle openers that can't open a bottle. Saws that might as well be fish scalers.
American companies that have excellent designs that would compete well with more well known offerings; but suffer from poor quality materials and/or bad workmanship; and a lack of interest in competing with more well known companies. The Bear and Sons Bear Jaws served as the basis for the SwissTool; but even on older examples, it's a notch below Leatherman. On newer ones, the quality control is so bad, it's a safety hazard (got cut bad due to a Bear Jaws lock that failed under light pressure). If Bear and Sons could match Leatherman in quality and have a slight design tweak to either change the lock or go back to non-locking tools, they would have one of the best offerings available. Kutmaster's Multimaster is pretty much the oldest multitool design to continue without major design changes. It's a rugged and quite tough design, but its quality control is rough, and their steel soft. I dinged my pliers on rebar binding wire; something most Leathermans (including Squirts) handle without issue. If they used a quality steel, and better workmanship, it would be my favorite. A 1/4 driver, a plier handle so solid, it's useful as a hammer, and the toughest pliers on the market--heck yeah! But by them going total cheap POS with it, it sucks. I support American-made; but it's a shame that two quite brilliant designs suffer from manufacturers who don't seem to care about their products. If they made a version of my favorite variant of Multimaster (tanto blade, blunt nose pliers, strap cutter in place of can opener) to the quality and workmanship of say a Leatherman Wave, I'd EDC that exclusively and never look back. Yet, my example can't cut wire, blades are as dull as a butter knife, and the bit driver is cut weird. Oh, and the magnet falls out every time I look at it.
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For me it's hard to open tools. I have a juice that I love; but I carry less and less because the flatheads break my nails when I try to open them! It frustrates me to no end.
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:iagree:
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We know LM can make really good sheath as some of their older leather ones are terrific.
yes, my original surge had a sheath that was awesome, but it was lost before i got a chance to wear it out.
if they would only make these again!
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I've got that one. It is a great sheath.
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With the Wave being Leatherman's best selling tool, there will be a lot of people who disagree with me here, but...
I've said this before. Probably my very first post on MTO, or within my first 5 posts:
I hate, I hate, I hate bits that can fall out, or are removable and can become lost.
Yeah, I'm looking at you, 2nd gen through current Wave. I'm looking at you, Surge, and you too, Signal. And there's more where that came from.
Just imagine being out in the middle of Podunk, lost, hungry, cold and tired. You remove your (strangely black) Signal emergency survival tool from your pack and try to start a fire. Or attempt to whistle so maybe someone can hear you. What do you discover? Blast! That stupid removable tool must not have secured back in the last time I used it.
Or you are high up on scaffolding or perched precariously on the front of a Chevy K5, a$$ in the air, feet on the bumper, back bent at an angle to reach to unscrew something in the engine bay. Your trusty Surge at your side, you whip it out in a flash only to realize the screw driver bit is not there because that little spring that holds it is broken or itself just fell out.
By the way, the Surge is among my favorites, despite having bit drivers, not because it has bit drivers.
And I get it. These types of modular tools are an improvement to many people's minds because they sort of increase the tool count or types without taking up more space and make the tool even more versatile. I just dont like built in known points of failure.
The only good thing to come out of a multitool bit driver was the fact that when I bought my used Surge, the spring was indeed missing and therefore so was the larger bit. I didnt know about Leathermans warrantee so I Googled how to fix it, I wound up here.
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With the Wave being Leatherman's best selling tool, there will be a lot of people who disagree with me here, but...
I've said this before. Probably my very first post on MTO, or within my first 5 posts:
I hate, I hate, I hate bits that can fall out, or are removable and can become lost.
Yeah, I'm looking at you, 2nd gen through current Wave. I'm looking at you, Surge, and you too, Signal. And there's more where that came from.
Just imagine being out in the middle of Podunk, lost, hungry, cold and tired. You remove your (strangely black) Signal emergency survival tool from your pack and try to start a fire. Or attempt to whistle so maybe someone can hear you. What do you discover? Blast! That stupid removable tool must not have secured back in the last time I used it.
Or you are high up on scaffolding or perched precariously on the front of a Chevy K5, a$$ in the air, feet on the bumper, back bent at an angle to reach to unscrew something in the engine bay. Your trusty Surge at your side, you whip it out in a flash only to realize the screw driver bit is not there because that little spring that holds it is broken or itself just fell out.
By the way, the Surge is among my favorites, despite having bit drivers, not because it has bit drivers.
And I get it. These types of modular tools are an improvement to many people's minds because they sort of increase the tool count or types without taking up more space and make the tool even more versatile. I just dont like built in known points of failure.
The only good thing to come out of a multitool bit driver was the fact that when I bought my used Surge, the spring was indeed missing and therefore so was the larger bit. I didnt know about Leathermans warrantee so I Googled how to fix it, I wound up here.
You're not alone. I do carry my Wave a bit, since it does have a pocket clip, but honestly, i prefer my 1999 model. Stronger scissors on that one too. Less reach to the bit driver; and easily lost non-standard bits don't make it better. It's why I cringed when the "improved" Super Tool 300 with that stinkin' bit driver was found on LM's image site. They "fixed" one of the major reasons why I like the ST300 so much. If I need bits, I carry a set of 1/4 bits and a small ratchet. If I want to use my MT, Gerber (and similar) adapters will fit on my ST300, Crater, and Rebar. And before we do the PST challenge, I'm itching for a Tool Adapter to use with the PST.
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One of the reasons I love my Surge (no wave at the moment) was for the removable bits. I need more than just a flathead or philips.
I used one of the torx heads to get into a panel. Saved me 10+ mins to go searching for hex keys. paid by the hour, but thats cutting into my nap time :rofl:
I can understand the dislike for removable bits but up til now, no issues with them.
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Having to pick just ONE to carry. :whistle:
this :rant:
i carry two fullsize usually,sometimes three :D
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Handle splay keeps getting wider, swisstools now have very wide splay when using the reinforced pliers. Then the individual springs always give up down wiggle on the knife blades. Gerber mp400 and leatherman juice have short stubby Philips shafts. Leatherman oht knife blades are way to short,juice can openers are barely adequate and worst of all no pocket clips for juices and 91 mm victorinox.
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1, Poor fit and finish. Everyone's QA sucks right now it seems.
2. Designed for widget count, not usability. Self explanatory.
3. Bad sheath. Bad sheaths lose tools, ride badly, and just annoy us all.
4. (semi)Propietary bits. The Vic Cybertools are great, but they don't made a wide enough variety of bits, they are hard to find, and Vic doesn't use them in any of their other tools. Using regular 4mm bits is hampered by the lack of retention. Likewise, Leatherman missed a boat and not a small one by NOT using their flat bits more. A simple bit holder key ring or sharpie-thick pocket tool that holds two long bits or 4 regular ones wouldn't be that hard to make. And it would probably sell.
But my penultimate peeve is.... budget parts at premium prices. Not going to point fingers, but...
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2. Designed for widget count, not usability. Self explanatory.
The trend of trying to rack up a super high tool count is getting ridiculous. They are counting things as a tool that are hard or impossible to use for the purpose stated. Example - the can opener on my Vic works really well. In fact, I don't even have a can opener in my kitchen...the Vic is all I use. But I have seen some can openers on MTs that are a joke.
There was that thread recently about cap lifters. They are right...that seems to be a simple tool to add so they are on EVERYTHING outdoorsy these days...shovels, hatchets, and every other outdoors implement that is made of metal. I mean really, you can pop the top off a bottle without one quite easy, but I guess it is low hanging fruit for them to add it to tool count.
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Bottle openers...The one on the Vics are perfectly fine as they don’t affect structural integrity. But most of the others are just.. :facepalm: :facepalm:
You can open a bottle with almost anything...function, not a tool.
I keep seeing pry tools that sacrifice strength for a bottle opener... :rant: :rant:
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Tools that don't work. Nothing worse than needing it in an emergency, only to have it fail. Thankfully, I fully test any new tool I get to ensure. All SAKs and LMs pass with flying colors. Gerbers can have rough QC, but always work well, at least on the MP-platform tools I own. Import models--hit and miss. Certain SOG tools are questionable (i.e. files). With certain, low-end tools ($20 and under) I would say 75% more fail my tests.
Spring-action pliers on full-sized/industrial tools. On keychain/compact MTs they're OK (though I do prefer such models as the Mini Bear Jaws that lack them), on SAKs they're a necessity to be able to work. On full-sized/heavy duty multitools; they weaken the pliers head, and are just plain irritating. When you get something really heavy like the WorkPro, it makes it harder to grip down on something, due to the resistance of the strong spring required due to the tool weight
Blasting cap crimpers on "civilian" tools not expressly designed for use by explosive ordinance/blasting professionals-i.e. many Leatherman Charge models, Kilimanjaro Magnus. They weaken the pliers head and are more or less useless to the average Joe.
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Cast and MIM plier heads , would prefer dropforged , and hardchromed .Then the tools could actually do serious industrial tasks .
Best Regards,
Chris
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Cast and MIM plier heads , would prefer dropforged , and hardchromed .Then the tools could actually do serious industrial tasks .
Best Regards,
Chris
They'd be stupid expensive if they did such, but I'd be game. Just no replaceable cutters or sprung pliers heads Gerber did it with the MP1, but messed up when they decided to add a spring-action pliers head. Because one: I hate those, and secondly, they weaken the plier head.
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With the Wave being Leatherman's best selling tool, there will be a lot of people who disagree with me here, but...
I've said this before. Probably my very first post on MTO, or within my first 5 posts:
I hate, I hate, I hate bits that can fall out, or are removable and can become lost.
Yeah, I'm looking at you, 2nd gen through current Wave. I'm looking at you, Surge, and you too, Signal. And there's more where that came from.
Just imagine being out in the middle of Podunk, lost, hungry, cold and tired. You remove your (strangely black) Signal emergency survival tool from your pack and try to start a fire. Or attempt to whistle so maybe someone can hear you. What do you discover? Blast! That stupid removable tool must not have secured back in the last time I used it.
Or you are high up on scaffolding or perched precariously on the front of a Chevy K5, a$$ in the air, feet on the bumper, back bent at an angle to reach to unscrew something in the engine bay. Your trusty Surge at your side, you whip it out in a flash only to realize the screw driver bit is not there because that little spring that holds it is broken or itself just fell out.
By the way, the Surge is among my favorites, despite having bit drivers, not because it has bit drivers.
And I get it. These types of modular tools are an improvement to many people's minds because they sort of increase the tool count or types without taking up more space and make the tool even more versatile. I just dont like built in known points of failure.
The only good thing to come out of a multitool bit driver was the fact that when I bought my used Surge, the spring was indeed missing and therefore so was the larger bit. I didnt know about Leathermans warrantee so I Googled how to fix it, I wound up here.
:iagree:
I'd say that removable bits on a MT might be my biggest pet peeve.
I won't buy a multitool with bits... ever. Having removable, interchangeable, customizable bits does nothing for me in my line of work, hobbies, or life, and I'd personally rather not have them. Having EDC functionality that I won't ever use actually feels uncomfortable for me - maybe because I have a somewhat minimalist mindset. More importantly, when I do need a screwdriver outside my house, I'd rather extract it with a nail nick than fiddle and flip bits around with my cold numb fingers. :climber:
I relegated my original wave (which I really do like) to my guitar bag some 12 years ago (after years of EDC) mainly because even that's got more screwdriver options than I want on my person all the time, and these days I don't need pliers much (aside from clipping guitar strings).
I don't like the new Wave at all - those tiny scissors make me sad.
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Uncomfortable handles. No further explanation needed.
Proprietary bits There's no reason a rebar or bigger can't have a 1/4 drive bit holder on each handle.
No awl.
Not having torx screws, I don't want to buy a special tool or send a tool back just because it needs a little tweeking I could do at home.
With two 1/4" drivers, awl and a heavy flat driver I would have all my bases covered.
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:iagree:
I'd say that removable bits on a MT might be my biggest pet peeve.
I won't buy a multitool with bits... ever. Having removable, interchangeable, customizable bits does nothing for me in my line of work, hobbies, or life, and I'd personally rather not have them. Having EDC functionality that I won't ever use actually feels uncomfortable for me - maybe because I have a somewhat minimalist mindset. More importantly, when I do need a screwdriver outside my house, I'd rather extract it with a nail nick than fiddle and flip bits around with my cold numb fingers. :climber:
I relegated my original wave (which I really do like) to my guitar bag some 12 years ago (after years of EDC) mainly because even that's got more screwdriver options than I want on my person all the time, and these days I don't need pliers much (aside from clipping guitar strings).
I don't like the new Wave at all - those tiny scissors make me sad.
The newer Wave scissors are better at tiny jobs, but I prefer the PST II type on the older model.
That's the reason I like the ST300 and Rebar so well. Even if I'm wearing cheap cotton jersey gloves under leather rancher's gloves, I can still get to the tool I need without taking my gloves off. I rarely need anything other than what an MT has on board. I think I've used two of my LM bits--but only because I couldn't find the proper one--namely a T-27 working on a gas trimmer. A small offset ratcheting screwdriver and a good helping of bits can fit in an Altoids Tin; and is what I use when I need a specialty bit. And the ratcheting action helps--a lot.
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Lack of modules as a system platform. Victorinox solves the problem by adding another tool and changing the name, tinker to super tinker to deluxe tinker etc. Leatherman had the juice line, S2 C2 Cs4 etc. Tools should be more modular in design, keep the frame and be able to order in what you want on it. Example, a side kick has no scissors, so why not have it as an add on, same handles same location etc. Leatherman has their flat bits which work ok until you add on the bit extender and it wobbles and uses only half the hole. Still dosnt solve the long reach problem until you buy the mutt accessories. New Free T4 has the file, why not be able to drop the file and have the serrated blade from the side kick etc. Awls vary by company but the T-4 awl actually is a good compromise, the juice awl wasnt well designed and always broke at the sewing hole because it was just behind the tip.