Post by: enki_ck on September 01, 2014, 12:40:43 AM
Quote
Multi-function hand tools comprised of any combination of pliers, wire cutters, combo edge knife blade with a liner lock, wood saw, screwdriver bit driver, bottle opener, can opener, awl, fire starter, signal whistle, hammer, carabiner, pocket clip, lanyard hole, and removable ceramic sharpening stick
Some of those features seem interesting, and it will probably be a MUT version or something of the sorts. Not too sure if I like the implementation of a combo edged blade on it though. :shrug:
http://www.trademarkia.com/signal-86337513.html
Post by: detron on September 01, 2014, 12:44:48 AM
Post by: captain spaulding on September 01, 2014, 01:09:11 AM
Post by: BIG-TARGET on September 01, 2014, 01:19:55 AM
Well to be honest I do not have high hopes for it. I hate to be so negative, but i'm not a fan of multitools with fire starters/whistles/ect.... They are usually of terrible quality and gimmicky in my opinion. I guess only time will tell though.
Plus! Some of us were spoiled with Les Stroud using the Wave doing his original series :think:
Post by: Higgins617 on September 01, 2014, 02:00:54 AM
Post by: detron on September 01, 2014, 02:04:09 AM
I agree with the fact that most of the time the whole signal and whistle deal is gimmicky and cheap, but if you guys are right and it is based on the MUT. Don't you think that will mean they have to keep the quality up to a higher level than the Stroud tool for instance? I mean even Leatherman's cheap options don't totally sacrifice quality. Not trying to argue, just holding out hope that it'll be another cool offering.
first, just because I mentioned MUT, don't make that gospel, I am just an idiot, not an expert.
Post by: Higgins617 on September 01, 2014, 02:20:47 AM
Post by: detron on September 01, 2014, 02:21:45 AM
No I know, it's all speculation and that is half the fun. I wasn't quoting you on it just trying to add another look at the situation. Sorry
no harm, just did not want you to assume I was intelligent
Post by: Rux on September 01, 2014, 02:22:30 AM
Post by: enki_ck on September 01, 2014, 02:24:58 AM
I said it too cause carabiner, hammer, clip and bit driver scream MUT chasis. :)I agree with the fact that most of the time the whole signal and whistle deal is gimmicky and cheap, but if you guys are right and it is based on the MUT. Don't you think that will mean they have to keep the quality up to a higher level than the Stroud tool for instance? I mean even Leatherman's cheap options don't totally sacrifice quality. Not trying to argue, just holding out hope that it'll be another cool offering.
first, just because I mentioned MUT, don't make that gospel, I am just an idiot, not an expert.
Btw, a whistle is a must in the hills cause with wind blowing towards you and you yelling at the top of your voice it is likely that a person 20meter from you won't hear you.
But not necesseraly one mounted on a multy though. ;)
Post by: Syph007 on September 01, 2014, 02:28:16 AM
Post by: zoidberg on September 01, 2014, 02:39:04 AM
I said it too cause carabiner, hammer, clip and bit driver scream MUT chasis. :)I agree with the fact that most of the time the whole signal and whistle deal is gimmicky and cheap, but if you guys are right and it is based on the MUT. Don't you think that will mean they have to keep the quality up to a higher level than the Stroud tool for instance? I mean even Leatherman's cheap options don't totally sacrifice quality. Not trying to argue, just holding out hope that it'll be another cool offering.
first, just because I mentioned MUT, don't make that gospel, I am just an idiot, not an expert.
Btw, a whistle is a must in the hills cause with wind blowing towards you and you yelling at the top of your voice it is likely that a person 20meter from you won't hear you.
But not necesseraly one mounted on a multy though. ;)
A Mini-MUT maybe? :think:
Post by: enki_ck on September 01, 2014, 02:40:31 AM
SkeleMUT? :ahhhI said it too cause carabiner, hammer, clip and bit driver scream MUT chasis. :)I agree with the fact that most of the time the whole signal and whistle deal is gimmicky and cheap, but if you guys are right and it is based on the MUT. Don't you think that will mean they have to keep the quality up to a higher level than the Stroud tool for instance? I mean even Leatherman's cheap options don't totally sacrifice quality. Not trying to argue, just holding out hope that it'll be another cool offering.
first, just because I mentioned MUT, don't make that gospel, I am just an idiot, not an expert.
Btw, a whistle is a must in the hills cause with wind blowing towards you and you yelling at the top of your voice it is likely that a person 20meter from you won't hear you.
But not necesseraly one mounted on a multy though. ;)
A Mini-MUT maybe? :think:
Post by: Higgins617 on September 01, 2014, 02:49:39 AM
Post by: detron on September 01, 2014, 02:53:21 AM
Post by: captain spaulding on September 01, 2014, 03:02:53 AM
well, MUT is Military Uniform Tactical (I think) so maybe this will be an SOL? :D :rofl:
:rofl:
That might be a terrible or great name for that tool. I can't quite tell.
Smurf
Out
of
Luck
in case anyone is not familiar with the term.
Post by: detron on September 01, 2014, 03:08:01 AM
well, MUT is Military Uniform Tactical (I think) so maybe this will be an SOL? :D :rofl:
:rofl:
That might be a terrible or great name for that tool. I can't quite tell.
Smurf
Out
of
Luck
in case anyone is not familiar with the term.
or
Smurf
Outta <-- yep, butcher the language
Luck
Post by: Ryo Saeba on September 01, 2014, 03:14:05 AM
Post by: ironraven on September 01, 2014, 03:24:44 AM
I'm hopeful, but expecting less that total love.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 01, 2014, 03:32:33 AM
Post by: detron on September 01, 2014, 03:36:50 AM
Can't be an SOL- AMK has that copyrighted as their "Survive Outdoor Longer" line.
good point, maybe they can pair a Rebar with this Fubar? :rofl:
Post by: Monrogue on September 01, 2014, 03:53:43 AM
Post by: Nhoj on September 01, 2014, 04:03:26 AM
Also if it is of MUT design and the carabiner has the bottle opener how does it have a can opener. If they added one then it would have two bottle openers.
Post by: JAfromMn on September 01, 2014, 04:07:09 AM
I definitely have a spot in my collection for a Leatherman survival tool.
Post by: detron on September 01, 2014, 04:08:23 AM
I'm looking forward to seeing what they make.
I definitely have a spot in my collection for a Leatherman survival tool.
isn't that what the PST was? Personal (or Pocket) Survival Tool?
Post by: BIG-TARGET on September 01, 2014, 04:17:55 AM
Or if you're a Mystery Science Theater 3000 fan:well, MUT is Military Uniform Tactical (I think) so maybe this will be an SOL? :D :rofl:
:rofl:
That might be a terrible or great name for that tool. I can't quite tell.
Smurf
Out
of
Luck
in case anyone is not familiar with the term.
or
Smurf
Outta <-- yep, butcher the language
Luck
Satilite
Of
Love
:doh:
Post by: JAfromMn on September 01, 2014, 06:09:56 AM
Just noticed they registered another patent, and by the description of it, it's survival/bushcraft oriented.QuoteMulti-function hand tools comprised of any combination of pliers, wire cutters, combo edge knife blade with a liner lock, wood saw, screwdriver bit driver, bottle opener, can opener, awl, fire starter, signal whistle, hammer, carabiner, pocket clip, lanyard hole, and removable ceramic sharpening stick
Some of those features seem interesting, and it will probably be a MUT version or something of the sorts. Not too sure if I like the implementation of a combo edged blade on it though. :shrug:
http://www.trademarkia.com/signal-86337513.html
I got high hopes.
I think the creator's of the pocket survival tool can still come up with something awesome for us.
S.M.U.T
U
I
V
A
L
Post by: bdAmmo on September 01, 2014, 07:58:05 AM
Come on Leatherman, don't let us down on this one.
Post by: Yalius on September 01, 2014, 08:03:22 AM
If it is based on a MUT frame, I'll really be looking forward to it.
Post by: Mercury on September 01, 2014, 09:28:44 AM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 01, 2014, 09:40:52 AM
Post by: babola on September 01, 2014, 10:35:53 AM
The way I read this is the new MT could end up having few, many or potentially all those features and implements mentioned.
Post by: DazMechanical on September 01, 2014, 12:36:11 PM
Post by: BIG-TARGET on September 01, 2014, 01:25:34 PM
Like this guy who did a pretty objective review.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlZbEJaPzqw
Post by: enki_ck on September 01, 2014, 01:29:28 PM
"...comprised of any combination of pliers, wire cutters, combo edge knife blade with a liner lock, wood saw, screwdriver bit driver, bottle opener, can opener, awl, fire starter, signal whistle, hammer, carabiner, pocket clip, lanyard hole, and removable ceramic sharpening stick"By past patents, that means all of them will be included. :)
The way I read this is the new MT could end up having few, many or potentially all those features and implements mentioned.
Post by: TheDude on September 01, 2014, 02:10:55 PM
This would solve my MUT MOD dilemma. :think:
:gimme: As long as it's got a hammer, pry-tool, strap cutter and saw. :drool:
Post by: DazMechanical on September 01, 2014, 02:26:18 PM
Survival Lifestyle Utility Tool? >:D
:rofl:
Post by: TheDude on September 01, 2014, 02:41:55 PM
Post by: DazMechanical on September 01, 2014, 03:09:57 PM
Survival Lifestyle Utility Tool? >:D
:rofl:
Sorry Dude, I thought you were being funny :facepalm:
Leatherman S.L.U.T ???
Post by: TheDude on September 01, 2014, 03:11:49 PM
Post by: Etherealicer on September 01, 2014, 03:58:21 PM
I was looking at the MUT many times and a civilian version might just be it.
BUT for me any survival tool stands and falls with its blade, I find therefore the plier-based frames as unsuitable. Of course you can combine it with a fixed blade, but then it should be very compact, like the PST (IMHO of course).
:rant: Semi-Random Rant :rant:
I also don't like the term "survival", it means nothing unless it is attached to a terrain (setting): Woodland survival, swamp survival, post zombie apocalypse urban survival. From the tool selection it appears to be geared towards the last one :P.
Tools I find pointless:
screwdriver bit driver, bottle opener, can opener
Tools I kinda miss
Pry tool (due to the bit driver, there is now screwdriver that can take this function).
Marlin Spike
Awl with sewing eye.
and maybe
Scissors (Not a fan of scissors in general, but for 1st aid situations I find scissors quite helpful)
Rescue blade (again 1st aid, but also in mountaineering useful)
Post by: TheDude on September 01, 2014, 05:46:07 PM
I think you'd want an MP600 EOD
Post by: rdub934 on September 01, 2014, 07:13:36 PM
Post by: Nhoj on September 01, 2014, 08:13:47 PM
Post by: collim1 on September 01, 2014, 08:31:50 PM
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: rdub934 on September 01, 2014, 09:07:29 PM
Doubtful Leatherman will release it if it's not done right. Unlike Grylls and Strouds multi tools.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
True. As was stated earlier in the thread, even the cheaper Leathermans are still quality pieces. I know a lot of people hate them, but the Wingman/Sidekick are still solid despite making compromises to reduce cost - anvil style cutters, thin sheet metal, thin implements, etc... My Wingman is almost my favorite LM (just can't beat the Wave). Leatherman couldn't survive with their warranty if they put out a garbage tool.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 01, 2014, 09:32:18 PM
I'm reserving judgement till I've seen piccies though
Post by: kirk13 on September 01, 2014, 10:46:41 PM
Post by: captain spaulding on September 01, 2014, 10:48:30 PM
Someone wake me up when there's a PST3 :whistle:
You may be sleeping a while. :whistle:
Post by: kirk13 on September 01, 2014, 10:53:36 PM
Someone wake me up when there's a PST3 :whistle:
You may be sleeping a while. :whistle:
Zzzz?
Post by: detron on September 01, 2014, 10:56:46 PM
Post by: Mercury on September 01, 2014, 11:02:11 PM
it would be nice to have a PST III, I would buy some of them
I would definitely buy one. :tu:
Post by: detron on September 01, 2014, 11:04:09 PM
it would be nice to have a PST III, I would buy some of them
I would definitely buy one. :tu:
Leatherman should take note, that PSTs (I and II) sell EVERY DAY on ebay. EVERY DAY
Post by: Mercury on September 01, 2014, 11:06:29 PM
it would be nice to have a PST III, I would buy some of them
I would definitely buy one. :tu:
Leatherman should take note, that PSTs (I and II) sell EVERY DAY on ebay. EVERY DAY
I agree. The Classic Leatherman designs were incredible. Unfortunately, people nowadays want different stuff.
Post by: babola on September 02, 2014, 05:31:06 AM
I agree. The Classic Leatherman designs were incredible. Unfortunately, people nowadays want different stuff.
Yeah, they've seen the "new" features, bells and whistles, OHO & OHT this & that and will only demand more from now on. Most of them will see the original simple stick-profile tool design from the past as uninventive, overly simplistic and boring. I always tend use the new-vs-old Wave analogy here, there was nothing wrong with the narrow, lanky original design...look how much wider the new one had become. I only hope the 3rd gen won't be even 'fatter'.
That said, some of the new MT designs that came out of LM in recent times have much going for, if developed well in the future. One of those is a skeleton tool design, started with Skeletool and followed into many other lines like Style, Freestyle and MUT.
I wouldn't mind seeing a new model being based on full-size MUT design. Who knows...
Post by: Lichtbote on September 02, 2014, 12:13:29 PM
Most of them will see the original simple stick-profile tool design from the past as uninventive, overly simplistic and boring.
If it would be only that, it would be no big deal.
But they are stupidly and unneeded unhandy to open/use, and with their edges outside really uncomfortable to use their pliers. At least if you really use them, and that not only for tinkering at the desk of your living room or a workbench. There you can pull it out, use both hands to open it, choose the tool you want, close it again ..... and finally, get the work done.
It´s a different task if you are holding the work with your left hand, and it will slip away or fall down if you let it go to use the left hand too for selecting the tool. Or standing on a ladder, needing one hand to ensure you don´t go down to fast and unwanted.
I stay to my opinion - oho makes a MT a Multi-TOOL, cause now you can use it with a certain usefullness. Before that MTs were for me more Multi-TOYs, not even worth to carry their weight.
Post by: kirk13 on September 02, 2014, 06:13:24 PM
I stay to my opinion - oho makes a MT a Multi-TOOL, cause now you can use it with a certain usefullness. Before that MTs were for me more Multi-TOYs, not even worth to carry their weight.
I have to take issue with this!
Of all the MTs I've owned or tried,the only one that's had the tools I regularly use available as oho was the LM OHT...pity it had locking blades( making it more or less illegal to carry in the UK) and lacked scissors.
The only tools I've had which have offered truly useful tool sets as outside opening options have been the Victorinox ones...funny enough,they're practically illegal too!
As to the flicky Plier Gerbers,and butterfly opening LMs? The number of times I've needed an oho tool have been very limited( only one springs to mind,and funnily enough,I needed the pliers,and was carrying my MP425, and it ended up failing..)
For you,sir,they may have been Multi-toys,but for me they have been,and continue to be valuable assets in the retail enviroment I work in,and have been,and continue to be valuable assets in my hobby pursuits,which include my shooting!
Post by: Syph007 on September 02, 2014, 06:33:58 PM
OHO can be nice, but Ive never been in a situation where it was needed. Im not a fan of the flick out pliers at all so that for me is not a selling point.
After being excited to see what the leap was, Im less excited about anything new they come out with now until I see it first.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 02, 2014, 07:03:24 PM
I stay to my opinion - oho makes a MT a Multi-TOOL, cause now you can use it with a certain usefullness. Before that MTs were for me more Multi-TOYs, not even worth to carry their weight.
I have to take issue with this!
Of all the MTs I've owned or tried,the only one that's had the tools I regularly use available as oho was the LM OHT...pity it had locking blades( making it more or less illegal to carry in the UK) and lacked scissors.
The only tools I've had which have offered truly useful tool sets as outside opening options have been the Victorinox ones...funny enough,they're practically illegal too!
As to the flicky Plier Gerbers,and butterfly opening LMs? The number of times I've needed an oho tool have been very limited( only one springs to mind,and funnily enough,I needed the pliers,and was carrying my MP425, and it ended up failing..)
For you,sir,they may have been Multi-toys,but for me they have been,and continue to be valuable assets in the retail enviroment I work in,and have been,and continue to be valuable assets in my hobby pursuits,which include my shooting!
:salute:
Beauty is very much in the eye of the beholder, and I constantly find it enlightening to see what challenges other people find in their daily lives and what tools offer best solution. That's one of the many great things about this place.
JA's reviews are a great insight into how a tool performs in his environment, but he faces a great many challenges that I never do. Expand that across the full membership here, and a tool which is pathetic and useless to one person, is 100% perfect for another. I love the Spirit, and find it to be an excellent tool - for Mr Whippy it's next to useless. Kirky and JA had great results with the OHT in two completely different spheres of life, but for me it's sorely lacking in some respects and "wastes space" with tools I'll never need. I heard Cupboard and Gareth raving over one of the smaller drivers on one of the older tools at the UK Meet, as it was so good for electrical connections .... a job I'd very rarely face ... but when I fitted a light in a friends kitchen a week ago, I found my tool carry at the time completely ineffective and ended up using a Vic Manager to do the job as it was the only thing that was anywhere near suitable. If I'd carried the tool the guys were raving about (I think it was the Sideclip) or something else with a similar driver, I'd have had the job done in a fraction of the time
Whilst I'm as bad as the next man for slating a tool that somone else loves (eg Juice :P), we do need to bear in mind that we all have different requirements, and there will be times when the tool we hate and love to decry, will perform many times better than the tool we rave about and carry daily. At times I do actually carry the tools I loathe (eg Juice :rant:) because for the job/location/circumstances it's the better choice despite the many failings and deficiencies
Post by: Monrogue on September 02, 2014, 07:18:03 PM
I have claimed in the past that OHO is very convenient for me, and it is, but it hasn't really proven to be necessary. I do enjoy the flicky pliers though, and I can see how they'd be handy should I find myself in a situation requiring that feature. Much the same with a knife blade. Still, I rarely find a need for OHO. You won't find me high up on any ladder or anything like that :ahhh However, I don't heavily use my MTs, so if someone does, I could see how OHO may be more of a factor for them.
I view MTs as being a convenient little set of various tools to have on me should I need them. I'm no handyman, so I don't get too in depth with what I need to do with them. The idea is to save the hassle of having to go find a specific tool. I don't need to be able to deploy a driver one handed in .2 seconds to find it worth carrying. If it saves me the trouble of going to the other room to find a dedicated tool, or even better, serves as the tool when there is no dedicated one available, then it is definitely worth it to me to carry a MT like the Rebar, Supertool, etc.
Everyone's uses/needs are different though, and that's part of what makes this place so interesting :D
Post by: Kampfer on September 02, 2014, 07:20:08 PM
:tu:
I view MTs as being a convenient little set of various tools to have on me should I need them. I'm no handyman, so I don't get too in depth with what I need to do with them. The idea is to save the hassle of having to go find a specific tool. I don't need to be able to deploy a driver one handed in .2 seconds to find it worth carrying. If it saves me the trouble of going to the other room to find a dedicated tool, or even better, serves as the tool when there is no dedicated one available, then it is definitely worth it to me to carry a MT like the Rebar, Supertool, etc.
Post by: Monrogue on September 02, 2014, 07:24:26 PM
I stay to my opinion - oho makes a MT a Multi-TOOL, cause now you can use it with a certain usefullness. Before that MTs were for me more Multi-TOYs, not even worth to carry their weight.
I have to take issue with this!
Of all the MTs I've owned or tried,the only one that's had the tools I regularly use available as oho was the LM OHT...pity it had locking blades( making it more or less illegal to carry in the UK) and lacked scissors.
The only tools I've had which have offered truly useful tool sets as outside opening options have been the Victorinox ones...funny enough,they're practically illegal too!
As to the flicky Plier Gerbers,and butterfly opening LMs? The number of times I've needed an oho tool have been very limited( only one springs to mind,and funnily enough,I needed the pliers,and was carrying my MP425, and it ended up failing..)
For you,sir,they may have been Multi-toys,but for me they have been,and continue to be valuable assets in the retail enviroment I work in,and have been,and continue to be valuable assets in my hobby pursuits,which include my shooting!
:salute:
Beauty is very much in the eye of the beholder, and I constantly find it enlightening to see what challenges other people find in their daily lives and what tools offer best solution. That's one of the many great things about this place.
JA's reviews are a great insight into how a tool performs in his environment, but he faces a great many challenges that I never do. Expand that across the full membership here, and a tool which is pathetic and useless to one person, is 100% perfect for another. I love the Spirit, and find it to be an excellent tool - for Mr Whippy it's next to useless. Kirky and JA had great results with the OHT in two completely different spheres of life, but for me it's sorely lacking in some respects and "wastes space" with tools I'll never need. I heard Cupboard and Gareth raving over one of the smaller drivers on one of the older tools at the UK Meet, as it was so good for electrical connections .... a job I'd very rarely face ... but when I fitted a light in a friends kitchen a week ago, I found my tool carry at the time completely ineffective and ended up using a Vic Manager to do the job as it was the only thing that was anywhere near suitable. If I'd carried the tool the guys were raving about (I think it was the Sideclip) or something else with a similar driver, I'd have had the job done in a fraction of the time
Whilst I'm as bad as the next man for slating a tool that somone else loves (eg Juice :P), we do need to bear in mind that we all have different requirements, and there will be times when the tool we hate and love to decry, will perform many times better than the tool we rave about and carry daily. At times I do actually carry the tools I loathe (eg Juice :rant:) because for the job/location/circumstances it's the better choice despite the many failings and deficiencies
Very well put :salute:
Post by: Breezy12 on September 03, 2014, 02:40:52 AM
Also if it is of MUT design and the carabiner has the bottle opener how does it have a can opener. If they added one then it would have two bottle openers.
typically these patent applications aren't a full description of the tool loadout; they're just describing what tools might be included.
I'm very interested to see how this plays out. I sent LM a very detailed description of an idea I had for a Surge-based survival/bushcraft tool a couple years ago. I agree that this one sounds like it's based on the MUT, but I'm curious to see if there are any similarities. :)
Post by: BIG-TARGET on September 03, 2014, 03:59:18 AM
I stay to my opinion - oho makes a MT a Multi-TOOL, cause now you can use it with a certain usefullness. Before that MTs were for me more Multi-TOYs, not even worth to carry their weight.
I have to take issue with this!
Of all the MTs I've owned or tried,the only one that's had the tools I regularly use available as oho was the LM OHT...pity it had locking blades( making it more or less illegal to carry in the UK) and lacked scissors.
The only tools I've had which have offered truly useful tool sets as outside opening options have been the Victorinox ones...funny enough,they're practically illegal too!
As to the flicky Plier Gerbers,and butterfly opening LMs? The number of times I've needed an oho tool have been very limited( only one springs to mind,and funnily enough,I needed the pliers,and was carrying my MP425, and it ended up failing..)
For you,sir,they may have been Multi-toys,but for me they have been,and continue to be valuable assets in the retail enviroment I work in,and have been,and continue to be valuable assets in my hobby pursuits,which include my shooting!
:salute:
Beauty is very much in the eye of the beholder, and I constantly find it enlightening to see what challenges other people find in their daily lives and what tools offer best solution. That's one of the many great things about this place.
JA's reviews are a great insight into how a tool performs in his environment, but he faces a great many challenges that I never do. Expand that across the full membership here, and a tool which is pathetic and useless to one person, is 100% perfect for another. I love the Spirit, and find it to be an excellent tool - for Mr Whippy it's next to useless. Kirky and JA had great results with the OHT in two completely different spheres of life, but for me it's sorely lacking in some respects and "wastes space" with tools I'll never need. I heard Cupboard and Gareth raving over one of the smaller drivers on one of the older tools at the UK Meet, as it was so good for electrical connections .... a job I'd very rarely face ... but when I fitted a light in a friends kitchen a week ago, I found my tool carry at the time completely ineffective and ended up using a Vic Manager to do the job as it was the only thing that was anywhere near suitable. If I'd carried the tool the guys were raving about (I think it was the Sideclip) or something else with a similar driver, I'd have had the job done in a fraction of the time
Whilst I'm as bad as the next man for slating a tool that somone else loves (eg Juice :P), we do need to bear in mind that we all have different requirements, and there will be times when the tool we hate and love to decry, will perform many times better than the tool we rave about and carry daily. At times I do actually carry the tools I loathe (eg Juice :rant:) because for the job/location/circumstances it's the better choice despite the many failings and deficiencies
Very well put :salute:
OR! :think:
They(LM) use the c33"Crater" design and makes their own version of the Swiss Champ :whistle:
Post by: JAfromMn on September 03, 2014, 04:50:06 AM
Finally after all the garbage survival tools that have came out lately
Leatherman makes us a really superb survival tool that someone could actually trust taking with them when going into the woods .
If it's MUT based it's got a lot going for it already.
All that and a whistle :whistle:
I'm excited. I hope we don't have to wait to long before we get to see it.
Post by: Lichtbote on September 03, 2014, 10:58:57 AM
At work i usually have my fully loaded toolcart 2-5m around me, so i have generally no MT with me then. I carry my MTs with me the rest of my time, esspecially when i do things around the house - to have a selection of not as good as real but easily available tools at me, so i can fix little problems without getting the "real" tools first. But as i´m a tool-junkie (sort of) even at home a toolcart, or at least a portable tool-box is never more than 20-30m away.
Now, when i´ve crawled into a tigh corner, or i´m under the ceiling of my garage or the shed in my garden, to fix/modify or install let´s say a hose for my air pressure system ........ then most of the time i only have one hand free cause the other holds the hose, or holding me to prevent me from falling (not always room to place the ladder where it should be, often hanging sideways like a monkey :think:). Then i have to choose - can i use the MT with one hand and get the job done? Sure, i could do the job also after i took a safe stand, opened the tool. But then it would be no immediate fix, then i would not need a MT cause in that time i probably would be able to get me the tool from the tool-cart, too. ;) I´m not under time constraints then, just to lazy. :rofl:
Granted - that effects mostly first the blades and second the pliers, the other tools are rarely used.
Another side effect is i can circumvent the laws regarding oho and locking knives (they are forbidden, as long as you have no accepted reason). If the blades are big enough to be usefull and still oho i don´t need to carry a seperate knife any longer. It´s much easier to argue with the LEOs that you need a tool than a single blade. And as i can dump the knife, it´s less weight to carry with me. :D
Post by: geekdadrepair on September 03, 2014, 10:14:13 PM
:multi: survival mode anytime. Peanut lighter , light, tweezers , 120 db whistle, firesteel and hack Rebar :drool:Woah! Do you have a thread on how you added that wingman/sidekick pocket clip to the rebar? I would love the rebar so much more with a pocket clip
Sent from my SPH-L720T using Tapatalk
Post by: Dem on September 04, 2014, 03:03:03 AM
That said, about two seconds of foresight gets rid of the need for OHO-anything, IMO.
Dem
Post by: ducttapetech on September 04, 2014, 03:20:26 AM
Your right, fixed blades. :)
That said, about two seconds of foresight gets rid of the need for OHO-anything, IMO.
Dem
Nate
Post by: detron on September 04, 2014, 03:54:58 AM
Just wanted to point out, you can OHO pretty much any MT I've ever seen. Even standard LM pliers are good at flicking open once you get the hang of how to do it.
That said, about two seconds of foresight gets rid of the need for OHO-anything, IMO.
Dem
well, then I should ALWAYS have OHO.
at best I have twosight, (half of Foresight :D )
Post by: zoidberg on September 04, 2014, 03:59:58 AM
Just wanted to point out, you can OHO pretty much any MT I've ever seen. Even standard LM pliers are good at flicking open once you get the hang of how to do it.
That said, about two seconds of foresight gets rid of the need for OHO-anything, IMO.
Dem
well, then I should ALWAYS have OHO.
at best I have twosight, (half of Foresight :D )
:facepalm:
Post by: Dem on September 04, 2014, 04:42:36 AM
Your right, fixed blades. :)
That said, about two seconds of foresight gets rid of the need for OHO-anything, IMO.
Dem
Nate
Honestly, I only carry folding knives because carrying a fixed blade gets you dirty looks and makes people nervous in Canada. Otherwise I'd just use my Helle Futura. Nothing beats a full tang.
Dem
Post by: JAfromMn on September 04, 2014, 04:46:18 AM
Post by: detron on September 04, 2014, 05:15:53 AM
Just wanted to point out, you can OHO pretty much any MT I've ever seen. Even standard LM pliers are good at flicking open once you get the hang of how to do it.
That said, about two seconds of foresight gets rid of the need for OHO-anything, IMO.
Dem
well, then I should ALWAYS have OHO.
at best I have twosight, (half of Foresight :D )
:facepalm:
did you expect impressive pontifications from me? I hope not
:rofl:
Post by: zoidberg on September 04, 2014, 05:34:20 AM
Just wanted to point out, you can OHO pretty much any MT I've ever seen. Even standard LM pliers are good at flicking open once you get the hang of how to do it.
That said, about two seconds of foresight gets rid of the need for OHO-anything, IMO.
Dem
well, then I should ALWAYS have OHO.
at best I have twosight, (half of Foresight :D )
:facepalm:
did you expect impressive pontifications from me? I hope not
:rofl:
Using big words will always impress me. :D
Post by: detron on September 04, 2014, 05:35:54 AM
Just wanted to point out, you can OHO pretty much any MT I've ever seen. Even standard LM pliers are good at flicking open once you get the hang of how to do it.
That said, about two seconds of foresight gets rid of the need for OHO-anything, IMO.
Dem
well, then I should ALWAYS have OHO.
at best I have twosight, (half of Foresight :D )
:facepalm:
did you expect impressive pontifications from me? I hope not
:rofl:
Using big words will always impress me. :D
THAT I CAN DO <--big words :D
Post by: zoidberg on September 04, 2014, 05:38:46 AM
Just wanted to point out, you can OHO pretty much any MT I've ever seen. Even standard LM pliers are good at flicking open once you get the hang of how to do it.
That said, about two seconds of foresight gets rid of the need for OHO-anything, IMO.
Dem
well, then I should ALWAYS have OHO.
at best I have twosight, (half of Foresight :D )
:facepalm:
did you expect impressive pontifications from me? I hope not
:rofl:
Using big words will always impress me. :D
THAT I CAN DO <--big words :D
32. Is there anything you can't do? ;)
Post by: tosh on September 04, 2014, 09:15:53 PM
I'm guessing production dates (if it makes it that far) are probably years away :whistle:
Really hope its sooner. I'm more intrigued they've actually patented a new design.
Post by: enki_ck on September 04, 2014, 09:19:06 PM
Back on topic..
I'm guessing production dates (if it makes it that far) are probably years away :whistle:
Really hope its sooner. I'm more intrigued they've actually patented a new design.
Production probably this time next year, but we should get to see a preview of it at Shot Show, January 2015. Hopefully we'll have someone there this year.
Post by: Kampfer on September 04, 2014, 10:47:11 PM
Post by: enki_ck on September 04, 2014, 11:45:02 PM
Post by: JAfromMn on September 19, 2014, 07:23:07 PM
Post by: kirk13 on September 19, 2014, 07:35:35 PM
Any new news about the signal
-. ---, ... --- .-. .-. -.-- .--- --- . -.-
Post by: rescue4500 on September 19, 2014, 08:07:18 PM
Post by: enki_ck on September 19, 2014, 09:11:46 PM
Any new news about the signal
-. ---, ... --- .-. .-. -.-- .--- --- . -.-
.- .-. . / .-- . / --. --- -. -. .- / ... - .- .-. - / ..- ... .. -. --. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. . / -. --- .-- ..--..
.-- . / .-- .. .-.. .-.. / .... .- ...- . / - --- / .-- .- .. - / - .. .-.. .-.. / .--- .- -. ..- .- .-. -.-- / .- -. -.. / ... .... --- - / ... .... --- .-- / ..-. --- .-. / -- --- .-. . / .. -. ..-. ---
Post by: rescue4500 on September 19, 2014, 09:13:20 PM
Someone wake me up when there's a PST3 :whistle:
SADLY I DOUBT WELL EVER SEE A PST 3
Post by: JBW1 on September 20, 2014, 12:26:48 AM
Post by: Nhoj on September 20, 2014, 02:12:05 AM
I think the rebar is in some ways a pst3. The supertool was originally a big pst. Then it got updated, then shrunk down to the rebar. But sadly it's still not a pst. The pulse is close to an updated pst though?Someone wake me up when there's a PST3 :whistle:
SADLY I DOUBT WELL EVER SEE A PST 3
Post by: bdAmmo on September 20, 2014, 10:56:30 AM
Removable Ceramic sharpening stick? That sounds like a good addition, has LM ever offered a any kind of sharpening device in the past, Ive used the removable file of the surge to sharpen, but I don't know if it was marketed as specifically a sharpening tool for the knife
Yes, but not on any of their multitools. A couple of the large hunting knives Leatherman produced came with their own sharpening rods. The Nehalem and the Klamath are a couple that I know of that had the sharpeners.
Post by: JBW1 on September 21, 2014, 04:14:47 AM
Hmmm, that's cool, Ive never come across or looked for a leatherman hunting knife????, now I know they exist I'm gonna look for one. Its good that they are getting some fresh ideas, if they actually keep the sharpener after its on the market. Ive been trying to figure out how to add a rat tail file onto my surge for sharpening my chainsaw. So a removable rod sharpener may just get replaced and hacked ! :D
Post by: JBW1 on September 21, 2014, 04:35:55 AM
Seriously? These are cool arse knifes! Ive never really liked folders for gutting or field dressing, too much clean up with all the bits and pieces that make their way into the crevices, but these are awesome!!!, I'm seein colors I've never seen before haha .
http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/content/Item/51/74/52/i517452snUS.jpg
Post by: JBW1 on September 21, 2014, 04:39:43 AM
Post by: rescue4500 on September 22, 2014, 04:13:35 PM
I think the rebar is in some ways a pst3. The supertool was originally a big pst. Then it got updated, then shrunk down to the rebar. But sadly it's still not a pst. The pulse is close to an updated pst though?Someone wake me up when there's a PST3 :whistle:
SADLY I DOUBT WELL EVER SEE A PST 3
I would agree that the rebar is in a way a pst3
Post by: av8r1 on September 22, 2014, 08:50:00 PM
Post by: babola on September 22, 2014, 09:46:10 PM
I think I would call the Rebar the PST4. I think I would call the Fuse or Blast the PST3.
I would tend to agree with this observation. :tu:
Post by: scattergun13 on September 23, 2014, 05:53:40 AM
Relax! NOBODY assumes that... :pok:No I know, it's all speculation and that is half the fun. I wasn't quoting you on it just trying to add another look at the situation. Sorry
no harm, just did not want you to assume I was intelligent
Post by: captain spaulding on September 23, 2014, 06:13:40 AM
Relax! NOBODY assumes that... :pok:No I know, it's all speculation and that is half the fun. I wasn't quoting you on it just trying to add another look at the situation. Sorry
no harm, just did not want you to assume I was intelligent
:-X
Post by: zoidberg on September 23, 2014, 06:35:04 AM
Relax! NOBODY assumes that... :pok:No I know, it's all speculation and that is half the fun. I wasn't quoting you on it just trying to add another look at the situation. Sorry
no harm, just did not want you to assume I was intelligent
:-X
:rofl: :oops: :D
Post by: JAfromMn on November 04, 2014, 02:23:53 AM
Any news on the signal.
Post by: babola on November 04, 2014, 04:48:53 AM
Bump
Any news on the signal.
Not sure about 'Signal' as the name but I heard (don't ask me who from, please) two new LM full size tools will be displayed during Jan 2015 Shot Show.
Post by: JAfromMn on November 04, 2014, 04:57:14 AM
Post by: captain spaulding on November 04, 2014, 05:11:40 AM
Bump
Any news on the signal.
Not sure about 'Signal' as the name but I heard (don't ask me who from, please) two new LM full size tools will be displayed during Jan 2015 Shot Show.
Exciting!
Post by: Monrogue on November 04, 2014, 05:16:21 AM
Post by: rdub934 on November 04, 2014, 05:26:02 PM
Lol
Post by: JAfromMn on November 04, 2014, 06:37:03 PM
:rofl:
Post by: tosh on November 06, 2014, 01:19:11 PM
Removable Ceramic sharpening stick? That sounds like a good addition, has LM ever offered a any kind of sharpening device in the past, Ive used the removable file of the surge to sharpen, but I don't know if it was marketed as specifically a sharpening tool for the knife
LM issued a sharpener as standard with the LM Genus.
Post by: Yalius on November 07, 2014, 10:40:41 PM
Removable Ceramic sharpening stick? That sounds like a good addition, has LM ever offered a any kind of sharpening device in the past, Ive used the removable file of the surge to sharpen, but I don't know if it was marketed as specifically a sharpening tool for the knife
LM issued a sharpener as standard with the LM Genus.
With several of their hunting knives, as well. (Klamath, Steens, Ukiah and Nehalem)
Post by: JAfromMn on November 07, 2014, 10:51:05 PM
Post by: gadgetman7 on November 08, 2014, 02:20:19 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: AimlessWanderer on November 09, 2014, 12:00:13 AM
Only time will tell!
Post by: JAfromMn on November 09, 2014, 01:27:16 AM
I'm expecting to be either :facepalm: or :rofl:
Only time will tell!
If it's junk I'm going to be really disappointed.
Hurry up stupid time
Post by: babola on November 09, 2014, 02:25:21 AM
I'm expecting to be either :facepalm: or :rofl:
Only time will tell!
If it's junk I'm going to be really disappointed.
Hurry up stupid time
When did LM release a full size multi tool that was junk?
Relax man, should be all good ;)
Post by: derekmac on November 09, 2014, 02:32:04 AM
I'm curious. Hope it's a bigger/different version of the skeletol/MUT family.I'd like to see a civilian MUT.
Sent from Tracy Island
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: bmot on November 11, 2014, 12:35:01 AM
I'm curious. Hope it's a bigger/different version of the skeletol/MUT family.I'd like to see a civilian MUT.
Sent from Tracy Island
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Nah, that would be called the CUT :P
Post by: glorn on November 13, 2014, 11:10:38 AM
I'm curious. Hope it's a bigger/different version of the skeletol/MUT family.I'd like to see a civilian MUT.
Sent from Tracy Island
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Nah, that would be called the CUT :P
I heard they are including a compass..
Civilian Utility Navigation Tool
Post by: JBW1 on November 13, 2014, 01:53:45 PM
I'm curious. Hope it's a bigger/different version of the skeletol/MUT family.I'd like to see a civilian MUT.
Sent from Tracy Island
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Nah, that would be called the CUT :P
I heard they are including a compass..
Civilian Utility Navigation Tool
Don't go there :pok:
Post by: TheDude on November 14, 2014, 04:17:28 PM
I'm curious. Hope it's a bigger/different version of the skeletol/MUT family.I'd like to see a civilian MUT.
Sent from Tracy Island
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Nah, that would be called the CUT :P
I heard they are including a compass..
Civilian Utility Navigation Tool
I sure would love to get my hands on one of those.
Post by: Kampfer on November 14, 2014, 05:54:22 PM
Those are lots fun to play with, help me release my stress, highly recommended :tu:.I'm curious. Hope it's a bigger/different version of the skeletol/MUT family.I'd like to see a civilian MUT.
Sent from Tracy Island
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Nah, that would be called the CUT :P
I heard they are including a compass..
Civilian Utility Navigation Tool
I sure would love to get my hands on one of those.
Especially the NIB un-used ones. ;)
Post by: glorn on November 14, 2014, 06:29:25 PM
Post by: Kampfer on November 14, 2014, 06:31:17 PM
Post by: glorn on November 14, 2014, 06:35:29 PM
Yea, when i was a young man I use to collect them. Now I can only look at them and lick my lips.
Licking your lips when you look at them might be the problem. :think: ;)
Post by: Kampfer on November 14, 2014, 06:36:25 PM
Of course, when no one is watching.Yea, when i was a young man I use to collect them. Now I can only look at them and lick my lips.
Licking your lips when you look at them might be the problem. :think: ;)
Post by: JAfromMn on November 14, 2014, 06:53:47 PM
I'm really interested in this tool.
I plan on getting one as soon as it come out.
Post by: Chako on November 14, 2014, 08:40:47 PM
Come to think of it...it would be just grand if they made it like a Schrade Navitool. Now that would be swell. :rofl:
Yes, I am going to hell.
Post by: babola on November 14, 2014, 09:00:29 PM
...it would be just grand if they made it like a Schrade Navitool. Now that would be swell. :rofl:
I had to look it up, it's one cool looking tool for sure, but too large and bulky for my taste.
And scissors on a supposedly dedicated outdoor tool, really ?! :td:
Post by: babola on November 14, 2014, 09:07:05 PM
They look like a step up from the Wingman scissors and very close to ones found on 91mm VSA tools. :think:
(http://images.knifecenter.com/knifecenter/schrade/images/SCHST175.jpg)
Post by: Higgins617 on November 14, 2014, 09:26:59 PM
Post by: kalans on November 14, 2014, 10:17:06 PM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on November 15, 2014, 01:08:11 AM
I don't know if I should wait before getting a new surge..
I've not been enthralled by any of LM's latest tools, but thought the tweaks they mde to the Surge were well thought out. If a Surge is what floats your boat, I'd say go for it.
I don't hold out much hope for the upcoming LM tools ... but I have been wrong before ... more than once :P
Post by: Chako on November 15, 2014, 01:11:46 AM
Post by: Toolslinger on November 15, 2014, 01:13:27 AM
I don't know if I should wait before getting a new surge..
I have 1 in SS and 1 in BO. They are great tools. If you are hesitating, :pok: don't. They are great.
Post by: JAfromMn on November 15, 2014, 09:31:09 PM
I don't know if I should wait before getting a new surge..
The Surge is a beast of his own .
(http://i1211.photobucket.com/albums/cc421/JAfromMn/Mobile%20Uploads/2014-11-13200925_zps51b00a9a.jpg) (http://s1211.photobucket.com/user/JAfromMn/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2014-11-13200925_zps51b00a9a.jpg.html)
I think it's going to be a long time before we can buy the leatherman survival tool.
Post by: BIG-TARGET on November 16, 2014, 03:25:36 AM
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.435408046498369.92975.122239001148610&type=3
Post by: Syph007 on November 16, 2014, 03:37:11 PM
(http://www.rc-machines.com/media/images/org/Bild%202686_85042.jpg)
Post by: BIG-TARGET on November 16, 2014, 03:49:53 PM
Touring the Leatherman Plant and Building a Custom Tool (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3PjggboPiU#ws)
Post by: Mercury on November 16, 2014, 07:20:59 PM
I don't know if I should wait before getting a new surge..
I've not been enthralled by any of LM's latest tools, but thought the tweaks they mde to the Surge were well thought out. If a Surge is what floats your boat, I'd say go for it.
I don't hold out much hope for the upcoming LM tools ... but I have been wrong before ... more than once :P
I just have to say, I'm sure the Surge SINKS more boats than it floats.... :rofl:
Post by: JAfromMn on November 17, 2014, 12:14:50 AM
I don't know if I should wait before getting a new surge..
I've not been enthralled by any of LM's latest tools, but thought the tweaks they mde to the Surge were well thought out. If a Surge is what floats your boat, I'd say go for it.
I don't hold out much hope for the upcoming LM tools ... but I have been wrong before ... more than once :P
I just have to say, I'm sure the Surge SINKS more boats than it floats.... :rofl:
Maybe
it is like carrying a boat anchor until I use it
:rofl:
Post by: zirconeo on November 17, 2014, 01:52:01 PM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on November 18, 2014, 12:21:07 AM
I don't know if I should wait before getting a new surge..
I've not been enthralled by any of LM's latest tools, but thought the tweaks they mde to the Surge were well thought out. If a Surge is what floats your boat, I'd say go for it.
I don't hold out much hope for the upcoming LM tools ... but I have been wrong before ... more than once :P
I just have to say, I'm sure the Surge SINKS more boats than it floats.... :rofl:
:D :D :D
Post by: cool123 on November 26, 2014, 08:07:18 AM
Post by: Gavin S. on November 26, 2014, 04:27:44 PM
Here's a Youtube of the PATHFINDER SRT
Touring the Leatherman Plant and Building a Custom Tool (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3PjggboPiU#ws)
Post by: JAfromMn on November 26, 2014, 06:32:16 PM
Leatherman . Utility. Survival. Tool.
The L.U.S.T.
Post by: zoidberg on November 26, 2014, 11:23:28 PM
I'm going to email leatherman and ask them about this tool and if there's any way I could get my hands on one to review asap.
Leatherman . Utility. Survival. Tool.
The L.U.S.T.
Ask for two of them. :pok: Tell em they'll get some real feedback.
Post by: Syncop8r on November 26, 2014, 11:35:25 PM
I think that Leatherman are good at making multitools which can be used for multiple applications which includes self defence as well.True, if I hit someone with my Surge THEY'RE GOING DOWN!
Post by: TheDude on November 27, 2014, 06:57:38 AM
Post by: BIG-TARGET on November 28, 2014, 01:59:14 AM
Man, nothing like being able to tour a factory and get you stuff custom ground. That's a knife fanatics wildest wet dream.Gives a new meaning to the term:"The customer comes first" :whistle:Here's a Youtube of the PATHFINDER SRT
Touring the Leatherman Plant and Building a Custom Tool (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3PjggboPiU#ws)
Post by: JAfromMn on November 28, 2014, 02:14:07 AM
I'm going to email leatherman and ask them about this tool and if there's any way I could get my hands on one to review asap.
Leatherman . Utility. Survival. Tool.
The L.U.S.T.
Ask for two of them. :pok: Tell em they'll get some real feedback.
I should ask for 6. They can get some global real world testing.
I'm going to just try getting one first.
Mine >:D
Post by: BIG-TARGET on November 29, 2014, 05:36:44 PM
https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10204407561525852
Post by: AimlessWanderer on November 29, 2014, 05:50:30 PM
Any LM should do the job, if you call THIS survival :whistle:
https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10204407561525852
I don't do Facebook ... what is it?
Post by: Syncop8r on December 01, 2014, 03:23:57 AM
I'm going to email leatherman and ask them about this tool and if there's any way I could get my hands on one to review asap.
Leatherman . Utility. Survival. Tool.
The L.U.S.T.
What about Revolutionary Utility Survival Tool? ;)
Post by: rdub934 on December 26, 2014, 05:30:36 AM
Status Update! On Tuesday, December 23, 2014, status on the SIGNAL trademark changed to PUBLISHED FOR OPPOSITION.
http://www.trademarkia.com/signal-86337513.html
I think we will know what this is come mid-January
Post by: JAfromMn on December 26, 2014, 06:33:25 AM
Post by: JBW1 on December 26, 2014, 05:23:13 PM
Post by: Higgins617 on December 26, 2014, 05:32:34 PM
Post by: sawman on December 26, 2014, 05:46:07 PM
Post by: Higgins617 on December 26, 2014, 05:55:55 PM
Sigh... no pics ::)
As long as it isn't a brother to the REV we should be celebrating!
Post by: sawman on December 26, 2014, 05:57:03 PM
Post by: Higgins617 on December 26, 2014, 06:20:27 PM
Post by: Monrogue on December 26, 2014, 06:25:22 PM
I just like when anything new gets announced, it gets us all riled up here. It's a good time! I'm looking forward to SHOT to see what they've cooked up.+1
Sent from my XT901 using Tapatalk
Post by: JAfromMn on December 26, 2014, 06:27:27 PM
I haven't been this excited for a tool to come out in a long time.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on December 26, 2014, 06:28:37 PM
I just like when anything new gets announced, it gets us all riled up here. It's a good time! I'm looking forward to SHOT to see what they've cooked up.
I agree it's always nice to see new stuff coming to market, but based on previous experience, I'll be waiting for detailed pics AND unbiased feedback from someone on the forum before I consider buying any new stuff from them
Post by: JAfromMn on December 26, 2014, 06:34:20 PM
I just like when anything new gets announced, it gets us all riled up here. It's a good time! I'm looking forward to SHOT to see what they've cooked up.
I agree it's always nice to see new stuff coming to market, but based on previous experience, I'll be waiting for detailed pics AND unbiased feedback from someone on the forum before I consider buying any new stuff from them
That's no way to be.
Life's a gamble. I enjoy it.
Post by: Ryo Saeba on December 26, 2014, 07:12:38 PM
Post by: babola on December 26, 2014, 07:15:03 PM
Going from the carabiner and hammer bits I guess it's going to be MUTlike.
And that's a good thing, right? :tu:
Skeletonized tool design all the way 8)
Post by: AimlessWanderer on December 26, 2014, 08:01:34 PM
I just like when anything new gets announced, it gets us all riled up here. It's a good time! I'm looking forward to SHOT to see what they've cooked up.
I agree it's always nice to see new stuff coming to market, but based on previous experience, I'll be waiting for detailed pics AND unbiased feedback from someone on the forum before I consider buying any new stuff from them
That's no way to be.
Life's a gamble. I enjoy it.
I agree, but after a while you tend to get a feel for which gambles are more likely to bring happiness, and which are more likely to piss you off. So like I said, I'll hold off on this for pics and unbiased feedback ;)
Post by: sawman on December 26, 2014, 08:05:54 PM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on December 26, 2014, 08:35:31 PM
IMO they set the bar pretty high with the Wave and Skeletool - two perfect tools. I've felt a little let down with many of their other tools.
Totally agree on the Wave, but totally disagree on the Skele :salute:
... and yes, I've been let down by several others too
Post by: Kampfer on December 26, 2014, 09:04:58 PM
Post by: babola on December 26, 2014, 09:18:29 PM
:facepalm:
But you knew that already, right?
No surprises there...
Post by: Kampfer on December 26, 2014, 09:22:21 PM
Post by: Syncop8r on December 26, 2014, 09:51:10 PM
Post by: NKlamerus on December 27, 2014, 01:16:19 AM
It's like getting a knife with a compass in the scale. Most of the time it won't work, or it doesn't spin. Lot of good that does!
Post by: JBW1 on December 27, 2014, 02:05:25 AM
Someone has to be the statistic, and guinea pig. And if it sucks well a one arm signal might be cool haha. I'm real wanting to see how they incorporate the sharpening rod? Maybe like the Klamath?I just like when anything new gets announced, it gets us all riled up here. It's a good time! I'm looking forward to SHOT to see what they've cooked up.
I agree it's always nice to see new stuff coming to market, but based on previous experience, I'll be waiting for detailed pics AND unbiased feedback from someone on the forum before I consider buying any new stuff from them
That's no way to be.
Life's a gamble. I enjoy it.
I agree, but after a while you tend to get a feel for which gambles are more likely to bring happiness, and which are more likely to piss you off. So like I said, I'll hold off on this for pics and unbiased feedback ;)
Post by: babola on December 27, 2014, 10:37:16 AM
Someone has to be the statistic, and guinea pig. And if it sucks well a one arm signal might be cool haha. I'm real wanting to see how they incorporate the sharpening rod? Maybe like the Klamath?
I thought about that too, but since everything so far points to a Skeletool/MUT design both the sharpening and firestarter rods could be incorporated instead of the long-size removable screwdriver bits on the MUT for example. They sit in their own 'cavity' and are easily accessible by 2-way push button.
Both the sharpening and firestarter rods should be removable too so should fit this theory well.
Who knows... 8)
Post by: TheDude on January 01, 2015, 12:50:06 PM
Post by: rdub934 on January 01, 2015, 04:24:51 PM
Post by: comis on January 01, 2015, 06:15:33 PM
Someone has to be the statistic, and guinea pig. And if it sucks well a one arm signal might be cool haha. I'm real wanting to see how they incorporate the sharpening rod? Maybe like the Klamath?
I thought about that too, but since everything so far points to a Skeletool/MUT design both the sharpening and firestarter rods could be incorporated instead of the long-size removable screwdriver bits on the MUT for example. They sit in their own 'cavity' and are easily accessible by 2-way push button.
Both the sharpening and firestarter rods should be removable too so should fit this theory well.
Who knows... 8)
Please please please keep it:
-super light weight(skeletal to cut weight) and smallish medium size
-OHO spear-point beefy blade with scandi grind (note: not scandi-convex, real scandi grind, spear-point for making bow drill divot)
-hollow scales/scale hole to store needle and threads(think blisters)
-storage space for replaceable ferro rod or even ceramic rod(for sharpening)
-chisel and awl
-needle piler with replaceable cutter
Get rid of
-serrated blade
-bit adapters (or if necessary, just use one)
-4 outer slots for tools, only need the knife to be OHO, maybe the saw. But file could be kept inside, and serrated blade could be eliminated.
Post by: gadgetman7 on January 01, 2015, 07:11:09 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Syncop8r on January 01, 2015, 09:04:45 PM
- Pliers
- Bit Drivers
???
Post by: babola on January 01, 2015, 09:10:52 PM
Get rid of
-serrated blade
-bit adapters (or if necessary, just use one)
-4 outer slots for tools, only need the knife to be OHO, maybe the saw. But file could be kept inside, and serrated blade could be eliminated.
Serrated blade will most likely stay. LM still believes in its practicality and usability for the outdoors environments. Also many others, myself included, find comfort in having secondary blade available on a tool, the one that cuts thru rope, flax foliage, canvas and other textiles with lesser effort than PE blade normally would.
I agree on 4 bits being unnecessary. MUT needed this simply by being a designated rifle maintenance tool. A single dual Phillips+Flat head bit should suffice for an Outdoor tool.
I prefer OHO, not just on home/garage tools but outdoor too. That's why I prefer Wave, Surge and MUT when out there tramping, camping and bushcrafting. There's still many other ways LM could design a storage on a skeleton-type tool for the the ferro and sharpener rods.
Chisel or a medium-sized scraper of sort would be good, let's hope it will see its light this time around. LM has been shy on this for a long time now ;)
Post by: babola on January 01, 2015, 09:13:52 PM
OK, I'm going to upset some people here, but for survival why would you need:
- Pliers
- Bit Drivers
???
So you can use it on other tools, devices, contraptions while outdoors or simply on your MTB adventures and/or when you get home, etc.
Also, LM would never drop pliers from their full sized tool 8)
Post by: Syncop8r on January 01, 2015, 09:26:24 PM
OK, I'm going to upset some people here, but for survival why would you need:
- Pliers
- Bit Drivers
???
So you can use it on other tools, devices, contraptions while outdoors or simply on your MTB adventures and/or when you get home, etc.
Also, LM would never drop pliers from their full sized tool 8)
In reality they will be used for all that, but is this a SURVIVAL tool or just an outdoor tool?
Post by: Breezy12 on January 01, 2015, 10:04:29 PM
OK, I'm going to upset some people here, but for survival why would you need:
- Pliers
- Bit Drivers
???
So you can use it on other tools, devices, contraptions while outdoors or simply on your MTB adventures and/or when you get home, etc.
Also, LM would never drop pliers from their full sized tool 8)
In reality they will be used for all that, but is this a SURVIVAL tool or just an outdoor tool?
think of it this way... if you really are in a SURVIVAL situation, is it really going to hurt anything to have pliers on your MT? I'm sure I'd be able to come up with uses for them... I'd rather have them than not! ;)
Post by: babola on January 01, 2015, 10:21:07 PM
OK, I'm going to upset some people here, but for survival why would you need:
- Pliers
- Bit Drivers
???
So you can use it on other tools, devices, contraptions while outdoors or simply on your MTB adventures and/or when you get home, etc.
Also, LM would never drop pliers from their full sized tool 8)
In reality they will be used for all that, but is this a SURVIVAL tool or just an outdoor tool?
MUT is a gun maintenance tool, but it comes with a knife, saw, bottle opener, strap cutter and a carabiner.
Leatherman NEVER EVER made an MT with its tool load dedicated for single environment or use.
Post by: Lichtbote on January 01, 2015, 10:37:21 PM
And don´t waste resources for any "fancy" steels, keep it simple. Use a 420/440C.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 01, 2015, 10:56:02 PM
OK, I'm going to upset some people here, but for survival why would you need:
- Pliers
- Bit Drivers
???
So you can use it on other tools, devices, contraptions while outdoors or simply on your MTB adventures and/or when you get home, etc.
Also, LM would never drop pliers from their full sized tool 8)
In reality they will be used for all that, but is this a SURVIVAL tool or just an outdoor tool?
Survival is just the marketting buzzword for woodland based improvised camping. Of course if it's true survival you'll have no idea what you are going to be working with, what you are going to need, what the hazards and risks are, and so on. Remember, Leatherman are NOT trying to produce a premium woods based tool, nor are they trying to make an anywhere survival tool, they ARE trying to make a popular high profit tool. This is a profit based design, not a function/survival based design. For example, what the hell use is a ceramic rod going to be if your blade has chipped out. Fine for touching up a blade thats doing regular work in a safe environment, but it's not going to repair damage from serious hard use in hostile conditions with a tired, disoriented and half panic riden user who is far from thinking straight.
If I was to make a prediction, it would be as close to a standard MUT as possible, therefore minimising stock inventory and eliminating the need for new dies/patterns/programming. Unfortunately this will likely mean that the tool will be too heavy for most people to carry on a regular basis, and will therefore not likely to be on their person in a survival scenario. Note, only packing it in a bag when going out for a camping trip in the woods is not survival, it's just additional weight that could have been used for a Bacho Laplander, fixed blade knife, and SAK. It will also most likely have (unfortunately again) the trademark Leatherman overly splayed grip which renders the tool grossly inefficient for anyone with a less than XXL hand size. No surprises there then ...
If we assure that this tool is based on MUT tools, the patent lists the following components, which will probably identical to those offered on the existing tool:
Pliers
Wire Cutters
CE blade locking knife
Carabiner
Hammer
Saw
Bottle Opener
Screwdriver Bit Driver
Pocket Clip
That is the vast bulk of a standard MUT. So what elements are they losing from the MUT and what other features are they introducing instead:
OUT:
Strap Cutter ??
Disassembly Punch
Bronze Carbon Scraper
IN:
Firestarter
Removable Ceramic Sharpening Steel
Can Opener
Whistle
Awl
If they replace the dissembly punch with the ceramic rod, and carbon scraper for the awl, they still have a whistle, can opener, and firestarter to add in place of a strap cutter ... unless they're using the space where the bit storage used to be, or making the tool even larger and heavier ... and so even less likely to be carried ... and even more awkward to use with normal sized hands too. Unlikely, as I suspect they'll want to retain as much of the MUT handle components as necessary, but it may happen.
Note also that the sharpening steel says removable, but the firestarter does not ... so maybe the firesteel is an integral part of the body, or a separate item altogether? Maybe the awl and can opener replace the two MUT tools, and some Bear Grylls type multipurpose sheath incorporates the whistle, and firestarter and holds the removable sharpening steel ...?
Of course the die-hard Leatherman fans will still love it, and might even buy it too if it isn't ridiculously expensive. Those with large hands will say it's a great tool, and might even incorporate it into their daily lives as their standard multitool. Anyone who has smaller hands, is tool-weight conscious, or isn't instantly convinced it must be good because of the branding, might just take a little more convincing ... so from that perspective, nothing has changed.
The sad thing is that without even seeing this tool, there's a good chance we could draw up a list of those who'll like/dislike this tool. Not sure if that's more a reflection on Leatherman or on us ....
Post by: Syncop8r on January 01, 2015, 11:02:15 PM
MUT is a gun maintenance tool, but it comes with a knife, saw, bottle opener, strap cutter and a carabiner.True. Although I would say it the other way around: the MUT is a multitool with gun-maintenance extras.
Leatherman NEVER EVER made an MT with its tool load dedicated for single environment or use.
Post by: babola on January 01, 2015, 11:04:43 PM
MUT is a gun maintenance tool, but it comes with a knife, saw, bottle opener, strap cutter and a carabiner.True. Although I would say it the other way around: the MUT is a multitool with gun-maintenance extras.
Leatherman NEVER EVER made an MT with its tool load dedicated for single environment or use.
So will be the Signal.
See my point?
Post by: gadgetman7 on January 01, 2015, 11:06:39 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Syncop8r on January 01, 2015, 11:21:01 PM
MUT is a gun maintenance tool, but it comes with a knife, saw, bottle opener, strap cutter and a carabiner.True. Although I would say it the other way around: the MUT is a multitool with gun-maintenance extras.
Leatherman NEVER EVER made an MT with its tool load dedicated for single environment or use.
So will be the Signal.
See my point?
Yes, and I agree with you. It's just not what I would have for "survival" though (I would have a SAK rather than a plier-based MT). But as Al says this is about how LM can tweak a design to sell a new product.
Post by: Syncop8r on January 01, 2015, 11:28:02 PM
It will also most likely have (unfortunately again) the trademark Leatherman overly splayed grip which renders the tool grossly inefficient for anyone with a less than XXL hand size. No surprises there then ...
... and even more awkward to use with normal sized hands too.
This is a form of selection; in a survival situation only those with big hands will prosper with their LM Signal (or in my case Wenger Ranger) and we will finally rid the world of those inferior small-handed people. >:D
Post by: Monrogue on January 01, 2015, 11:28:15 PM
Sent from my XT901 using Tapatalk
Post by: babola on January 01, 2015, 11:47:41 PM
I agree with pretty much everything you said Al.It will also most likely have (unfortunately again) the trademark Leatherman overly splayed grip which renders the tool grossly inefficient for anyone with a less than XXL hand size. No surprises there then ...
... and even more awkward to use with normal sized hands too.
This is a form of selection; in a survival situation only those with big hands will prosper with their LM Signal (or in my case Wenger Ranger) and we will finally rid the world of those inferior small-handed people. >:D
You bad boy, you scared Monrogue with your comment already :D
Post by: Syncop8r on January 01, 2015, 11:52:32 PM
Didn't Leatherman say a while back that they were working on a civilian version of the MUT?
Given what Harley said about how few MUTs he has seen in the field, I wonder how many troops have it compared to civilian owners. Maybe the MUT already is a civilian tool (though not by design).
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 01, 2015, 11:56:23 PM
I agree with pretty much everything you said Al.It will also most likely have (unfortunately again) the trademark Leatherman overly splayed grip which renders the tool grossly inefficient for anyone with a less than XXL hand size. No surprises there then ...
... and even more awkward to use with normal sized hands too.
This is a form of selection; in a survival situation only those with big hands will prosper with their LM Signal (or in my case Wenger Ranger) and we will finally rid the world of those inferior small-handed people. >:D
:D Despite having average sized hands, the tool I would be measuring this against (from my own personal perspective of what is useful for outdoor pursuits) would be my Rangergrip 90 ... still a handful due to the fat arse Wenger scales, but that's only because I've not had the heart to rip those scales off and make slimmer micarta ones yet :P
Post by: Lichtbote on January 02, 2015, 12:17:07 AM
On the other hand i don´t think any relevant numbers of owners will ever face a real survival situation. :D
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 02, 2015, 12:29:02 AM
I´m no gun-nut and no survival nut, so i will probably not own any MUT variant.
On the other hand i don´t think any relevant numbers of owners will ever face a real survival situation. :D
Agreed! :tu:
Post by: Syncop8r on January 02, 2015, 12:35:51 AM
I´m no gun-nut and no survival nut, so i will probably not own any MUT variant.
On the other hand i don´t think any relevant numbers of owners will ever face a real survival situation. :D
Agreed! :tu:
+1. Can we call it something like an "outdoor adventure multi" instead of survival multi then?
... still a handful due to the fat arse Wenger scales, but that's only because I've not had the heart to rip those scales off and make slimmer micarta ones yet :P
I'm thinking wooden, maybe with a slot for a ferro rod. >:D
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 02, 2015, 12:43:59 AM
... still a handful due to the fat arse Wenger scales, but that's only because I've not had the heart to rip those scales off and make slimmer micarta ones yet :P
I'm thinking wooden, maybe with a slot for a ferro rod. >:D
:D I thought micarta because it has more strength than wood in a thinner slice. To do wood, I think I'd have to make the scales too fat all over to get any benefit, plus I'd lose the hi-vis appearance ;) A nice grippy G10 would probably be perfect actually
Post by: gadgetman7 on January 02, 2015, 12:54:57 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Syncop8r on January 02, 2015, 01:00:33 AM
I doubt I'd notice any real advantage over a Charge or a Wave. I've used both for Search and Rescue they work great.
I would be interested to know which particular tools on them you use the most.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 02, 2015, 01:04:09 AM
I´m no gun-nut and no survival nut, so i will probably not own any MUT variant.
On the other hand i don´t think any relevant numbers of owners will ever face a real survival situation. :D
Agreed! :tu:
+1. Can we call it something like an "outdoor adventure multi" instead of survival multi then?
If the marketting departments weren't all pandering to the enduring "survival" craze, that would make a lot more sense, and it would be more inclusive of the guys that use 4x4s or boats or other mechanical equipment in their outdoor pursuits rather than just the "I just survived a night camping in the woods with several hundred quids worth of camping equipment" crowd
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 02, 2015, 01:04:33 AM
I doubt I'd notice any real advantage over a Charge or a Wave. I've used both for Search and Rescue they work great.
I would be interested to know which particular tools on them you use the most.
Yeah, same here :cheers:
Post by: babola on January 02, 2015, 01:21:28 AM
I doubt I'd notice any real advantage over a Charge or a Wave. I've used both for Search and Rescue they work great. I'd love something lighter but I'll probably get one anyway. I'm weak that way, but not a true collector like Chako.
Sent from Tracy Island
Hand on heart, just about any mid and full size multi-tool designed in the last 10 years, would do.
It's this place and its patrons who tend to venture a little further in various MT discussions, some of merit and some of pure phylosophical nature.
Guilty as charged. :whistle:
Post by: gadgetman7 on January 02, 2015, 02:22:40 AM
I doubt I'd notice any real advantage over a Charge or a Wave. I've used both for Search and Rescue they work great.
I would be interested to know which particular tools on them you use the most.
I use the plain edge knife to cut different things - most rather mundane like paracord, MRE and boxes. Occasionally I've had to cut dogs out of tangled ropes or whittle a branch to poke things.
I use the screwdrivers and pliers to adjust different kinds of gear and to open battery compartments among other things.
I rarely use the saw but have sawed branches with it. (See above.
I never really been lost for any length of time, so over several days I may have found a use for other things. So, I'd likely not use it for survival but a lighter weight tool with good knife steel would be nice.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: JAfromMn on January 04, 2015, 05:44:43 AM
multi-function hand tool including two or more of the following tool elements--pliers, wire cutter, crimper, carabiner, hammer, knife, saw, file, scraper, bit driver with interchangeable bits, punch, screwdriver, awl, can opener, bottle opener, scissors, and leather and fabric sheath
Singal
Multi-function hand tools comprised of any combination of pliers, wire cutters, combo edge knife blade with a liner lock, wood saw, screwdriver bit driver, bottle opener, can opener, awl, fire starter, whistle, hammer, carabiner, pocket clip, lanyard hole, and removable ceramic sharpening stick.
Hmm
------------------------------------------------------------
One more thought
this thing is going to be a brick but if I don't carry all the stuff that the tool has it should just about equil out weight wise.
Post by: parnass on January 04, 2015, 06:52:31 AM
Mut
multi-function hand tool including two or more of the following tool elements...
Singal
Multi-function hand tools comprised of any combination of ...
The wording in the Signal is "tools" vs. "tool." Maybe this refers to a modular tool of separate pieces which the owner could configure together depending on his/her needs.
Post by: JBW1 on January 04, 2015, 06:11:04 PM
Maybe it can be called a DWARF, cuz you can whistle while you work
Post by: kmanct3 on January 04, 2015, 06:16:30 PM
Post by: sawman on January 04, 2015, 06:24:35 PM
I NEED PICS !!!!!!!+1 I'm beginning to think LM just likes to torture us.
Post by: kmanct3 on January 04, 2015, 06:25:59 PM
Post by: TheDude on January 05, 2015, 02:24:54 PM
Post by: enki_ck on January 05, 2015, 02:32:05 PM
Post by: NKlamerus on January 12, 2015, 05:20:55 PM
Post by: Higgins617 on January 12, 2015, 06:28:00 PM
Thank you higgins!
Gottcha buddy :rofl:
Post by: JAfromMn on January 13, 2015, 12:44:10 AM
Post by: genevabuck on January 13, 2015, 01:19:09 AM
I'm thinking it's getting about time for me to write leatherman a very nice letter humbly asking if I can get a single for mto to look at/test.
Never waste a perfectly good stamp.
Post by: babola on January 13, 2015, 02:04:01 AM
I'm thinking it's getting about time for me to write leatherman a very nice letter humbly asking if I can get a single for mto to look at/test.
Never waste a perfectly good stamp.
:twak:
Post by: TheDude on January 13, 2015, 11:52:42 AM
What am I talking about. We are a bunch of addicts. :facepalm:
:rant: SHOW US THE PICS!!! Lie to us. Anything. Please. A picture of McGyver with a rusty pair of vicegrips, fixing a toilet on a cruise ship... ANYTHING!!! :ahhh
Post by: Lichtbote on January 13, 2015, 12:17:50 PM
So i can relax and just sit and wait until it´s release.
Then i can stay calm and wait until a few others have tested it.
And then i might think about if i want to buy one. :D
It´s not that bad to not be addicted. :rofl:
Post by: JAfromMn on January 13, 2015, 06:39:04 PM
I'm thinking it's getting about time for me to write leatherman a very nice letter humbly asking if I can get a single for mto to look at/test.
Email sent
Post by: derekmac on January 13, 2015, 07:34:30 PM
:tu: Hope you're able to get one.I'm thinking it's getting about time for me to write leatherman a very nice letter humbly asking if I can get a single for mto to look at/test.
Email sent
Post by: JAfromMn on January 13, 2015, 07:37:36 PM
:tu: Hope you're able to get one.I'm thinking it's getting about time for me to write leatherman a very nice letter humbly asking if I can get a single for mto to look at/test.
Email sent
Thanks. :cheers:
The worst thing that they can say is no.
IL buy one when it comes out if I need to.
Who am I kidding il be buying one no matter what happens lol
Post by: hugos on January 13, 2015, 07:58:52 PM
So, Leatherman adds a post to Facebook under the heading : Something wearable coming the 21st of January.
I make the comment on the LM Wrist watch, the Signal and the Rev. Next moment my posts are removed and i am being blocked from making any comments on the page!
I wonder why (sarcastic) ?
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
Post by: derekmac on January 13, 2015, 08:00:20 PM
So, Leatherman adds a post to Facebook under the heading : Something wearable coming the 21st of January.I was going to post something too, but decided against it.
I make the comment on the LM Wrist watch, the Signal and the Rev. Next moment my posts are removed and i am being blocked from making any comments on the page!
I wonder why (sarcastic) ?
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
Post by: babola on January 13, 2015, 08:34:22 PM
Apologies, i am not a new subscriber/member, but this is my first post.
So, Leatherman adds a post to Facebook under the heading : Something wearable coming the 21st of January.
I make the comment on the LM Wrist watch, the Signal and the Rev. Next moment my posts are removed and i am being blocked from making any comments on the page!
I wonder why (sarcastic) ?
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
To be honest if I was in Leathreman's shoes I'd probably do the same.
You simply poked too deep and too close for their comfort.
They're about to announce few tools to the public in about a week on SHOT show, your comments simply stole their thunder and was received as something 'uncool'.
Post by: Etherealicer on January 13, 2015, 09:15:29 PM
Well we have seen "Something wearable" from LM and the word uncool seems to be fitting >:DApologies, i am not a new subscriber/member, but this is my first post.
So, Leatherman adds a post to Facebook under the heading : Something wearable coming the 21st of January.
I make the comment on the LM Wrist watch, the Signal and the Rev. Next moment my posts are removed and i am being blocked from making any comments on the page!
I wonder why (sarcastic) ?
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
To be honest if I was in Leathreman's shoes I'd probably do the same.
You simply poked too deep and too close for their comfort.
They're about to announce few tools to the public in about a week on SHOT show, your comments simply stole their thunder and was received as something 'uncool'.
Post by: babola on January 13, 2015, 09:21:28 PM
Well we have seen "Something wearable" from LM and the word uncool seems to be fitting >:DApologies, i am not a new subscriber/member, but this is my first post.
So, Leatherman adds a post to Facebook under the heading : Something wearable coming the 21st of January.
I make the comment on the LM Wrist watch, the Signal and the Rev. Next moment my posts are removed and i am being blocked from making any comments on the page!
I wonder why (sarcastic) ?
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
To be honest if I was in Leathreman's shoes I'd probably do the same.
You simply poked too deep and too close for their comfort.
They're about to announce few tools to the public in about a week on SHOT show, your comments simply stole their thunder and was received as something 'uncool'.
That 'contraption' we saw surpassed a meaning of the word 'uncool', by a long shot ::)
Hope that was just a rough and raw prototype which they refined in the end, but not holding my hopes high on that one. :(
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 13, 2015, 09:33:14 PM
That 'contraption' we saw surpassed a meaning of the word 'uncool', by a long shot ::)
Hope that was just a rough and raw prototype which they refined in the end, but not holding my hopes high on that one. :(
+1 .... on all counts
There somtimes seems to be a desperation in the Leathernan camp when it comes to bringing out new stuff. They have brought some of the biggest market leaders out in the past, yet it appears some of the stuff really doesn't express the fact they have 30 years experience in producing these products. I can fully appreciate wanting to bring something out for kids, just as I can wanting to exploit the one-piece market and offer budget tools such as the Wingman and Sidekick. They just don't seem to have given these as much thought somehow though. It's not just that the tools seem cheap, but they are starting to pick up the visual and ergonomic aspects of the real yucky cheapo offbrand crap, almost as if it's more important to get something new out by X date, than it is to refine it and get it looking iconic and working well for a wide range of users
Post by: Etherealicer on January 13, 2015, 09:48:21 PM
I think LM would do better if they expanded on what is working. E.g. bring a Wave for lefties or a blade-less variation, outside scissors, rescue blade, different plier head etc. I also think they could expand the market if they would add some color (same applies for the Spirits) and not just special runs.That 'contraption' we saw surpassed a meaning of the word 'uncool', by a long shot ::)
Hope that was just a rough and raw prototype which they refined in the end, but not holding my hopes high on that one. :(
+1 .... on all counts
There somtimes seems to be a desperation in the Leathernan camp when it comes to bringing out new stuff. They have brought some of the biggest market leaders out in the past, yet it appears some of the stuff really doesn't express the fact they have 30 years experience in producing these products. I can fully appreciate wanting to bring something out for kids, just as I can wanting to exploit the one-piece market and offer budget tools such as the Wingman and Sidekick. They just don't seem to have given these as much thought somehow though. It's not just that the tools seem cheap, but they are starting to pick up the visual and ergonomic aspects of the real yucky cheapo offbrand crap, almost as if it's more important to get something new out by X date, than it is to refine it and get it looking iconic and working well for a wide range of users
Post by: babola on January 13, 2015, 09:52:20 PM
That 'contraption' we saw surpassed a meaning of the word 'uncool', by a long shot ::)
Hope that was just a rough and raw prototype which they refined in the end, but not holding my hopes high on that one. :(
+1 .... on all counts
There somtimes seems to be a desperation in the Leathernan camp when it comes to bringing out new stuff. They have brought some of the biggest market leaders out in the past, yet it appears some of the stuff really doesn't express the fact they have 30 years experience in producing these products. I can fully appreciate wanting to bring something out for kids, just as I can wanting to exploit the one-piece market and offer budget tools such as the Wingman and Sidekick. They just don't seem to have given these as much thought somehow though. It's not just that the tools seem cheap, but they are starting to pick up the visual and ergonomic aspects of the real yucky cheapo offbrand crap, almost as if it's more important to get something new out by X date, than it is to refine it and get it looking iconic and working well for a wide range of users
Agree. For example there's a very little "Leatherman" in the Leap. The tool looks like one of those $4.99 no-name Chinese multi-tools you pick at the supermarket checkout on your way out, just because it's there and its cheap.
I will reserve my comments yet re Rev, Signal and the MT-watch-bracelet thing, until 21st at least.
I really have high hopes for Signal, being NZ-based and spending pretty much every weekend outdoors this tool could come handy for me personally, if executed right. I don't expect to see a major U turn or a brand new tool design, it will most likely be a twist on current Skeletool or MUT models. I find Skeletool great for EDC but somehow on a small side, while MUT is a heavy-duty monster of a tool. Something in between size-wise would be great, a full-sized tool like Wave/Rebar or similar.
IMO, I feel it's time for Wave to move over as a one-tool-fits-all-situations category and we finally see a dedicated outdoor/survival tool. Let it just be any color but BG-orange, please! :-) LOL!
We'll find out soon enough, 21st is just a week away now! :tu:
Post by: JAfromMn on January 13, 2015, 10:42:16 PM
please :bnghd:
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 13, 2015, 10:53:11 PM
Post by: SteveC on January 13, 2015, 11:54:44 PM
Please please please multitool gods smile on us and make the leatherman signal be bad ass and not a piece of crap.
please :bnghd:
:rofl:
Post by: derekmac on January 14, 2015, 12:00:41 AM
Please please please multitool gods smile on us and make the leatherman signal be bad ass and not a piece of crap.We're allowed to dream, eh?
please :bnghd:
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: gadgetman7 on January 14, 2015, 12:14:31 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: tosh on January 14, 2015, 12:55:05 AM
I really can't understand why they don't tap into tradesmans sector.
I think "one tool to rule all" is exactly as it sounds......ridiculous!!
They should consider releasing speSmurfpillst tools designed specifically for different trades.
The mainframe could be standard but the tool layout altered for each specific trade.
Post by: gadgetman7 on January 14, 2015, 02:07:23 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: NeitherExtreme on January 14, 2015, 02:48:17 AM
I've often thought leatherman lost their way once Tim stepped away from the driving seat.
I really can't understand why they don't tap into tradesmans sector.
I think "one tool to rule all" is exactly as it sounds......ridiculous!!
They should consider releasing speSmurfpillst tools designed specifically for different trades.
The mainframe could be standard but the tool layout altered for each specific trade.
I agree with this. When I worked construction a number of years back, I was always surprised at how very few guys knew about, much less owned or carried, multitools. I don't think their obvious target markets (tradesmen) is saturated, and they would do great if they could figure out to market and design for tool-using professions.
Post by: hugos on January 14, 2015, 04:27:51 AM
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
Post by: Chako on January 14, 2015, 12:39:18 PM
As for Leatherman banning you, not surprised. They have subtly changed in the last few years into something I don't much care for. They ignored me twice on two separate phone calls once they found out I was one of those pesky Canadians.
Post by: RT1969 on January 14, 2015, 02:22:28 PM
I recvd a mail back from them that i did not adhere to the rules. I sent a mail back asking which rule did i break? After me another Gentlemen also made a similar remark as to the watch and the Signal and i see he is also banned.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
Thank you for keeping us in the loop about that. :tu:
And welcome to MTo!
I wonder what they say concerning "rules" and I hope LM is just a bit panicky because they are in "SHOT-Show is coming, everything is now in top-secret lockdown" mode.
Post by: hugos on January 14, 2015, 08:35:30 PM
I recvd a mail back from them that i did not adhere to the rules. I sent a mail back asking which rule did i break? After me another Gentlemen also made a similar remark as to the watch and the Signal and i see he is also banned.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
Thank you for keeping us in the loop about that. :tu:
And welcome to MTo!
I wonder what they say concerning "rules" and I hope LM is just a bit panicky because they are in "SHOT-Show is coming, everything is now in top-secret lockdown" mode.
Lm did reply back. I used the following words describing the LM watch : " fugly, if you ask me!".
According to them the word Fugly is not allowed, and i got banned for using that word.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
Post by: NKlamerus on January 14, 2015, 08:39:25 PM
I do really like the recomendation of a "Adam Savage" Sheath.
Post by: hugos on January 14, 2015, 08:50:45 PM
Reading the comments on that post is Hilarious.
I do really like the recomendation of a "Adam Savage" Sheath.
Yes, actually it is. But the people that were all very accurate with thier predictions, got thier posts removed!
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
Post by: SteveC on January 14, 2015, 09:29:59 PM
Reading the comments on that post is Hilarious.
I do really like the recomendation of a "Adam Savage" Sheath.
Yes, actually it is. But the people that were all very accurate with thier predictions, got thier posts removed!
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
Posts removed from where ?
Post by: NKlamerus on January 14, 2015, 09:33:38 PM
On a recent Facebook post, leatherman posted a photo and said that big things were coming and they wanted people to guess.Reading the comments on that post is Hilarious.
I do really like the recomendation of a "Adam Savage" Sheath.
Yes, actually it is. But the people that were all very accurate with thier predictions, got thier posts removed!
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
Posts removed from where ?
Well, the people that posted a correction guess got in trouble!
Post by: SteveC on January 14, 2015, 09:52:04 PM
Post by: JAfromMn on January 15, 2015, 01:27:53 AM
I'm thinking it's getting about time for me to write leatherman a very nice letter humbly asking if I can get a single for mto to look at/test.
Email sent
I got a very nice reply from Leatherman.
Quote
Hi there, and thanks for contacting Leatherman Tool Group.
Your request will be sent on to our PR department for response. Meanwhile, to see what our fans and critics alike are saying about Leatherman and LED LENSER, check out www.facebook.com/leathermanusa (http://www.facebook.com/leathermanusa) and www.facebook.com/LEDLenserUSA (http://www.facebook.com/LEDLenserUSA). Our PR department will be in contact with you as soon as we can evaluate your request.
Thanks for contacting Leatherman Tool Group, and have a great week!
Regards,
Cameron Hansing
Customer Service
Leatherman Tool Group, Inc.
800-847-8665
Leatherman / LED LENSER
cameron.hansing@leatherman.com
I'm Hopeful.
We may be one of the first to see a signal.
Post by: captain spaulding on January 15, 2015, 01:52:08 AM
I'm thinking it's getting about time for me to write leatherman a very nice letter humbly asking if I can get a single for mto to look at/test.
Email sent
I got a very nice reply from Leatherman.QuoteHi there, and thanks for contacting Leatherman Tool Group.
Your request will be sent on to our PR department for response. Meanwhile, to see what our fans and critics alike are saying about Leatherman and LED LENSER, check out www.facebook.com/leathermanusa (http://www.facebook.com/leathermanusa) and www.facebook.com/LEDLenserUSA (http://www.facebook.com/LEDLenserUSA). Our PR department will be in contact with you as soon as we can evaluate your request.
Thanks for contacting Leatherman Tool Group, and have a great week!
Regards,
Cameron Hansing
Customer Service
Leatherman Tool Group, Inc.
800-847-8665
Leatherman / LED LENSER
cameron.hansing@leatherman.com
I'm Hopeful.
We may be one of the first to see a signal.
That would be awesome if they did that for us. If it went well it might even open up a rapport for future releases.
Post by: gadgetman7 on January 15, 2015, 02:52:32 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: captain spaulding on January 15, 2015, 02:53:25 AM
Kind of seems like a canned response to me...
Sent from Tracy Island
It definitely is and I doubt they will send one for review, but its worth a shot.
Post by: JAfromMn on January 15, 2015, 07:22:26 PM
I'm thinking it's getting about time for me to write leatherman a very nice letter humbly asking if I can get a single for mto to look at/test.
Email sent
I got a very nice reply from Leatherman.QuoteHi there, and thanks for contacting Leatherman Tool Group.
Your request will be sent on to our PR department for response. Meanwhile, to see what our fans and critics alike are saying about Leatherman and LED LENSER, check out www.facebook.com/leathermanusa (http://www.facebook.com/leathermanusa) and www.facebook.com/LEDLenserUSA (http://www.facebook.com/LEDLenserUSA). Our PR department will be in contact with you as soon as we can evaluate your request.
Thanks for contacting Leatherman Tool Group, and have a great week!
Regards,
Cameron Hansing
Customer Service
Leatherman Tool Group, Inc.
800-847-8665
Leatherman / LED LENSER
cameron.hansing@leatherman.com
I'm Hopeful.
We may be one of the first to see a signal.
Hi Joel,
Thanks for reaching out to us with your interest. We value the relationship we have with our fans and followers, and feedback on our new products is important. The Leatherman Signal won’t be launched until January 20th, during SHOT Show in Las Vegas. During that time, we’ll be sharing more information on the tool, release dates, and have samples at the show for our distributors and attendees of SHOT Show. We’ll also be active on social media, launching the same information to our fans and followers. However, we won’t have samples for Media, PR or other projects until we reach closer to the release date.
Thank you again, for your kind email and interest in our products. We hope you like what you see on January 20th!
Post by: rdub934 on January 15, 2015, 08:14:39 PM
Post by: NKlamerus on January 15, 2015, 08:54:35 PM
Post by: NKlamerus on January 15, 2015, 08:58:24 PM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 15, 2015, 09:22:18 PM
Anyone else scanned the comments yet? There is like 5 people mentioning it, wonder what LM will do
What comments? If they're on some Facebook type crap then I won't see then. Do they say anything interesting?
Post by: Higgins617 on January 15, 2015, 09:22:57 PM
Behold the Leatherman Signal... ;)
Ahhhh, looks like it might actually be a real tool!!
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 15, 2015, 09:27:39 PM
Behold the Leatherman Signal... ;)
Ahhhh, looks like it might actually be a real tool!!
Well ... something exists, whether it is a survival aid, tool, toy, or joke remains to be seen :salute:
Post by: Higgins617 on January 15, 2015, 09:30:18 PM
Behold the Leatherman Signal... ;)
Ahhhh, looks like it might actually be a real tool!!
Well ... something exists, whether it is a survival aid, tool, toy, or joke remains to be seen :salute:
The frame looks like a typical Leatherman type plier based design no?
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 15, 2015, 09:37:06 PM
Behold the Leatherman Signal... ;)
Ahhhh, looks like it might actually be a real tool!!
Well ... something exists, whether it is a survival aid, tool, toy, or joke remains to be seen :salute:
The frame looks like a typical Leatherman type plier based design no?
Just as they planned, I really can't discern much from that pic. You can't even tell if that's the "tool end" (in which case it's not MUT shaped), or if it's the pliers end. Doesn't really tell us much IMHO :think:
Post by: Chako on January 15, 2015, 09:42:21 PM
Post by: rdub934 on January 15, 2015, 09:49:45 PM
Behold the Leatherman Signal... ;)
Ahhhh, looks like it might actually be a real tool!!
Well ... something exists, whether it is a survival aid, tool, toy, or joke remains to be seen :salute:
The frame looks like a typical Leatherman type plier based design no?
Just as they planned, I really can't discern much from that pic. You can't even tell if that's the "tool end" (in which case it's not MUT shaped), or if it's the pliers end. Doesn't really tell us much IMHO :think:
We are looking at the plier-end of the tool in that picture. It appears the blade, or possibly saw is deployed and that is what the striker is being stricken (? lol) on. It is an outside access tool that is deployed. It sort of looks like the striker "assembly" is a whistle, perhaps. Also, their is something on top of the handle, just under the hand-model's pointer finger.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 15, 2015, 09:58:17 PM
We are looking at the plier-end of the tool in that picture. It appears the blade, or possibly saw is deployed and that is what the striker is being stricken (? lol) on. It is an outside access tool that is deployed. It sort of looks like the striker "assembly" is a whistle, perhaps. Also, their is something on top of the handle, just under the hand-model's pointer finger.
Firesteel on a whistle means bits of magnesium in the mouth ... so let's hope that's not the case :facepalm:
The something on the handle kind of looks like a flicky plier release button ... so how sure are we that's not the tool end of a OHT style tool?
Post by: Higgins617 on January 15, 2015, 10:31:10 PM
It tells nothing...which is why it easy to ignore.
Shhhhh, let me pretend Chakooooo!
Post by: rdub934 on January 15, 2015, 11:06:25 PM
We are looking at the plier-end of the tool in that picture. It appears the blade, or possibly saw is deployed and that is what the striker is being stricken (? lol) on. It is an outside access tool that is deployed. It sort of looks like the striker "assembly" is a whistle, perhaps. Also, their is something on top of the handle, just under the hand-model's pointer finger.
Firesteel on a whistle means bits of magnesium in the mouth ... so let's hope that's not the case :facepalm:
The something on the handle kind of looks like a flicky plier release button ... so how sure are we that's not the tool end of a OHT style tool?
You can see the "ramps" on the bottom of the plier head facing out of the end of the tool in this picture. Maybe the striker isn't a whistle - was the signal supposed to have a light? Maybe is a light or the compass. You are right, though - I wouldn't want magnesium all over something I was going to put my mouth on. Lol
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 15, 2015, 11:08:09 PM
We are looking at the plier-end of the tool in that picture. It appears the blade, or possibly saw is deployed and that is what the striker is being stricken (? lol) on. It is an outside access tool that is deployed. It sort of looks like the striker "assembly" is a whistle, perhaps. Also, their is something on top of the handle, just under the hand-model's pointer finger.
Firesteel on a whistle means bits of magnesium in the mouth ... so let's hope that's not the case :facepalm:
The something on the handle kind of looks like a flicky plier release button ... so how sure are we that's not the tool end of a OHT style tool?
You can see the "ramps" on the bottom of the plier head facing out of the end of the tool in this picture. Maybe the striker isn't a whistle - was the signal supposed to have a light? Maybe is a light or the compass. You are right, though - I wouldn't want magnesium all over something I was going to put my mouth on. Lol
Ah, yes - I see it now :salute:
Post by: NKlamerus on January 15, 2015, 11:08:26 PM
Post by: rdub934 on January 15, 2015, 11:18:34 PM
Post by: rdub934 on January 15, 2015, 11:20:53 PM
We are looking at the plier-end of the tool in that picture. It appears the blade, or possibly saw is deployed and that is what the striker is being stricken (? lol) on. It is an outside access tool that is deployed. It sort of looks like the striker "assembly" is a whistle, perhaps. Also, their is something on top of the handle, just under the hand-model's pointer finger.
Firesteel on a whistle means bits of magnesium in the mouth ... so let's hope that's not the case :facepalm:
The something on the handle kind of looks like a flicky plier release button ... so how sure are we that's not the tool end of a OHT style tool?
You can see the "ramps" on the bottom of the plier head facing out of the end of the tool in this picture. Maybe the striker isn't a whistle - was the signal supposed to have a light? Maybe is a light or the compass. You are right, though - I wouldn't want magnesium all over something I was going to put my mouth on. Lol
Ah, yes - I see it now :salute:
Also, black chassis. Silver knife. Silver plier-head. This thing is practically screaming MUT. Lol
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 15, 2015, 11:25:50 PM
We are looking at the plier-end of the tool in that picture. It appears the blade, or possibly saw is deployed and that is what the striker is being stricken (? lol) on. It is an outside access tool that is deployed. It sort of looks like the striker "assembly" is a whistle, perhaps. Also, their is something on top of the handle, just under the hand-model's pointer finger.
Firesteel on a whistle means bits of magnesium in the mouth ... so let's hope that's not the case :facepalm:
The something on the handle kind of looks like a flicky plier release button ... so how sure are we that's not the tool end of a OHT style tool?
You can see the "ramps" on the bottom of the plier head facing out of the end of the tool in this picture. Maybe the striker isn't a whistle - was the signal supposed to have a light? Maybe is a light or the compass. You are right, though - I wouldn't want magnesium all over something I was going to put my mouth on. Lol
Ah, yes - I see it now :salute:
Also, black chassis. Silver knife. Silver plier-head. This thing is practically screaming MUT. Lol
I was worried that might be the case
Post by: Higgins617 on January 15, 2015, 11:29:53 PM
We are looking at the plier-end of the tool in that picture. It appears the blade, or possibly saw is deployed and that is what the striker is being stricken (? lol) on. It is an outside access tool that is deployed. It sort of looks like the striker "assembly" is a whistle, perhaps. Also, their is something on top of the handle, just under the hand-model's pointer finger.
Firesteel on a whistle means bits of magnesium in the mouth ... so let's hope that's not the case :facepalm:
The something on the handle kind of looks like a flicky plier release button ... so how sure are we that's not the tool end of a OHT style tool?
You can see the "ramps" on the bottom of the plier head facing out of the end of the tool in this picture. Maybe the striker isn't a whistle - was the signal supposed to have a light? Maybe is a light or the compass. You are right, though - I wouldn't want magnesium all over something I was going to put my mouth on. Lol
Ah, yes - I see it now :salute:
Also, black chassis. Silver knife. Silver plier-head. This thing is practically screaming MUT. Lol
I was worried that might be the case
Why? It can help with hunting! Throw it at a deer and it'll be pinned under the weight!
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 15, 2015, 11:43:48 PM
Post by: Higgins617 on January 15, 2015, 11:48:37 PM
If they're going to make something that big as a survival aid, it should have fold out wheels and an engine so you can ride home
I'd buy that!
Post by: Syncop8r on January 16, 2015, 12:17:13 AM
Firesteel on a whistle means bits of magnesium in the mouth ... so let's hope that's not the case :facepalm:
You are right, though - I wouldn't want magnesium all over something I was going to put my mouth on. Lol
How else are we to get our essential trace elements such as magnesium? :D
Post by: captain spaulding on January 16, 2015, 01:00:25 AM
This thing is gonna show up and we are ALL simeoutaniously say "why didn't I think of that"
I doubt that very much. More like. "Why the heck did Leatherman think that was a good idea." I truly hope i'm wrong though.
Post by: JAfromMn on January 16, 2015, 01:17:57 AM
This thing is gonna show up and we are ALL simeoutaniously say "why didn't I think of that"
I doubt that very much. More like. "Why the heck did Leatherman think that was a good idea." I truly hope i'm wrong though.
Me Too.
I don't like the looks of the fire starter thing. Looks small and plastic. Plastic breaks up here when its cold.
Another Thought.
That yellow plastic makes me think of a yellow surfboard thing
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 16, 2015, 01:31:16 AM
This thing is gonna show up and we are ALL simeoutaniously say "why didn't I think of that"
I doubt that very much. More like. "Why the heck did Leatherman think that was a good idea." I truly hope i'm wrong though.
Me Too.
I don't like the looks of the fire starter thing. Looks small and plastic. Plastic breaks up here when its cold.
Another Thought.
That yellow plastic makes me think of a yellow surfboard thing
I'm expecting it being 1/3 praiseworthy and 2/3 mockworthy
Post by: genevabuck on January 16, 2015, 01:34:07 AM
Post by: rdub934 on January 16, 2015, 01:58:13 AM
Post by: JAfromMn on January 16, 2015, 01:59:06 AM
I'm looking forward to seeing what they make.
I definitely have a spot in my collection for a Leatherman survival tool.
isn't that what the PST was? Personal (or Pocket) Survival Tool?
True.
Pst = Pocket Survival Tool .
Wtf does s.i.g.n.a.l. mean. Lol
Post by: detron on January 16, 2015, 02:02:00 AM
I'm looking forward to seeing what they make.
I definitely have a spot in my collection for a Leatherman survival tool.
isn't that what the PST was? Personal (or Pocket) Survival Tool?
True.
Pst = Pocket Survival Tool .
Wtf does s.i.g.n.a.l. mean. Lol
S.I.G.N.A.L. Should I Get Newly Advertised Leatherman = SIGNAL
Post by: JAfromMn on January 16, 2015, 02:06:09 AM
Awesome
:rofl:
Post by: tosh on January 16, 2015, 05:37:20 AM
Is it code??
Backwards.....(best I can figure) :think:
Leatherman
Are
Not
Grasping
Innovation
Seriously
:facepalm:
Post by: hellsing on January 16, 2015, 10:13:34 AM
Post by: hiraethus on January 16, 2015, 11:03:40 AM
S.I.G.N.A.L. Should I Get Newly Advertised Leatherman = SIGNAL
:tu:
Post by: Etherealicer on January 16, 2015, 11:10:40 AM
Lets hope its a good one and it bring something new. Please have no bit holder...
Post by: Tsquare on January 17, 2015, 04:19:42 PM
I m
G onna
N eed
A nother
L eatherman
Post by: JBW1 on January 17, 2015, 11:07:24 PM
Post by: BIG-TARGET on January 18, 2015, 09:01:10 PM
I think it may just be that....a SignalI smell the dark hand of CONSPIRACY :ahhh
Is it code??
Backwards.....(best I can figure) :think:
Leatherman
Are
Not
Grasping
Innovation
Seriously
:facepalm:
Post by: NKlamerus on January 18, 2015, 09:08:50 PM
ILLUMINATII think it may just be that....a SignalI smell the dark hand of CONSPIRACY :ahhh
Is it code??
Backwards.....(best I can figure) :think:
Leatherman
Are
Not
Grasping
Innovation
Seriously
:facepalm:
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 18, 2015, 10:00:07 PM
If anyone thinks they're actually going to be picking up a serious survival tool, then ....
Some
Idiot's
Gonna
Nab
A
Lemon
"Survival" in the current marketting craze is basically "bushcrafting" but with a higher profit margin. Rather than being about primative crafts with cheap/repurposed/or improvised tools, it's primative crafts with as much commercial gain as possible. From Leatherman's perspective ...
Survival
Is
Gonna
Nurture
Another
Lineup
Once the tool is announced and we see some pictures, I'll start making my assessment of what I think the tool would yield based on my own tool needs and expectations. So far though it appears the tool is going to be so huge that many potential users will find it unwieldy, uncomfortable, and too heavy to be carried for "just in case". In a real survival situation, this tool is likely to be sat at home having only ever been played with in controlled conditions. You can't take it on a plane, you can't belt carry it in many areas, you're not going to want to carry this bloody great lump round with you at all times in case of fire, flood, quake, stampede ....
Size
Is
Gonna
Negate
All
Logic
For me personally, it's looking like possibly a regurgitated version of a tool which is too big, with poor ergos,and which I cannt carry with any regularity to therefore have it on my person when the SHTF
So
I'm
Gaining
Nothing
Again
Lads
The SIGNAL will sell,
The SIGNAL will be popular,
The SIGNAL will please the faithful followers,
The SIGNAL will secure jobs at the factory for a while,
The SIGNAL will probably NOT be used or be present in a survival situation.
Potentially the biggest benefitter of a tool of this ilk might be such as Scouts, for whom it may act as a training aid. However, modelled after the MUT it will likely be priced such that those who may benefit from it are unlikely to have the funds to pay for it. From that perspective, it kind of reminds me of the hellishly expensive trauma shears that is/was the Raptor
Same
Ideas
Going
Nowhere
Again
Leatherman
Post by: Higgins617 on January 18, 2015, 10:06:00 PM
I am (unsurprisingly) not expecting this to be much more than a toy for playing around with in the backyard. I have no doubt it will be a very popular toy, but we need to be honest that Leatherman are just jumping on a marketing craze.
If anyone thinks they're actually going to be picking up a serious survival tool, then ....
Some
Idiot's
Gonna
Nab
A
Lemon
"Survival" in the current marketting craze is basically "bushcrafting" but with a higher profit margin. Rather than being about primative crafts with cheap/repurposed/or improvised tools, it's primative crafts with as much commercial gain as possible. From Leatherman's perspective ...
Survival
Is
Gonna
Nurture
Another
Lineup
Once the tool is announced and we see some pictures, I'll start making my assessment of what I think the tool would yield based on my own tool needs and expectations. So far though it appears the tool is going to be so huge that many potential users will find it unwieldy, uncomfortable, and too heavy to be carried for "just in case". In a real survival situation, this tool is likely to be sat at home having only ever been played with in controlled conditions. You can't take it on a plane, you can't belt carry it in many areas, you're not going to want to carry this bloody great lump round with you at all times in case of fire, flood, quake, stampede ....
Size
Is
Gonna
Negate
All
Logic
For me personally, it's looking like possibly a regurgitated version of a tool which is too big, with poor ergos,and which I cannt carry with any regularity to therefore have it on my person when the SHTF
So
I'm
Gaining
Nothing
Again
Lads
The SIGNAL will sell,
The SIGNAL will be popular,
The SIGNAL will please the faithful followers,
The SIGNAL will secure jobs at the factory for a while,
The SIGNAL will probably NOT be used or be present in a survival situation.
Potentially the biggest benefitter of a tool of this ilk might be such as Scouts, for whom it may act as a training aid. However, modelled after the MUT it will likely be priced such that those who may benefit from it are unlikely to have the funds to pay for it. From that perspective, it kind of reminds me of the hellishly expensive trauma shears that is/was the Raptor
Same
Ideas
Going
Nowhere
Again
Leatherman
You crack me up :rofl:
Post by: Syncop8r on January 18, 2015, 11:19:28 PM
You crack me up :rofl:
+1
"Survival" in the current marketting craze is basically "bushcrafting" but with a higher profit margin.:tu:
Post by: JAfromMn on January 19, 2015, 12:02:35 AM
You crack me up :rofl:
+1"Survival" in the current marketting craze is basically "bushcrafting" but with a higher profit margin.:tu:
:rofl:
I don't plan on trying to survive with it. I just hope it's the basic stuff i always try to keep on me while still being functional all wrapped up in one tool. + A :whistle:
Post by: babola on January 19, 2015, 12:22:44 AM
I am (unsurprisingly) not expecting this to be much more than a toy for playing around with in the backyard. I have no doubt it will be a very popular toy, but we need to be honest that Leatherman are just jumping on a marketing craze.
If anyone thinks they're actually going to be picking up a serious survival tool, then ....
Some
Idiot's
Gonna
Nab
A
Lemon
"Survival" in the current marketting craze is basically "bushcrafting" but with a higher profit margin. Rather than being about primative crafts with cheap/repurposed/or improvised tools, it's primative crafts with as much commercial gain as possible. From Leatherman's perspective ...
Survival
Is
Gonna
Nurture
Another
Lineup
Once the tool is announced and we see some pictures, I'll start making my assessment of what I think the tool would yield based on my own tool needs and expectations. So far though it appears the tool is going to be so huge that many potential users will find it unwieldy, uncomfortable, and too heavy to be carried for "just in case". In a real survival situation, this tool is likely to be sat at home having only ever been played with in controlled conditions. You can't take it on a plane, you can't belt carry it in many areas, you're not going to want to carry this bloody great lump round with you at all times in case of fire, flood, quake, stampede ....
Size
Is
Gonna
Negate
All
Logic
For me personally, it's looking like possibly a regurgitated version of a tool which is too big, with poor ergos,and which I cannt carry with any regularity to therefore have it on my person when the SHTF
So
I'm
Gaining
Nothing
Again
Lads
The SIGNAL will sell,
The SIGNAL will be popular,
The SIGNAL will please the faithful followers,
The SIGNAL will secure jobs at the factory for a while,
The SIGNAL will probably NOT be used or be present in a survival situation.
Potentially the biggest benefitter of a tool of this ilk might be such as Scouts, for whom it may act as a training aid. However, modelled after the MUT it will likely be priced such that those who may benefit from it are unlikely to have the funds to pay for it. From that perspective, it kind of reminds me of the hellishly expensive trauma shears that is/was the Raptor
Same
Ideas
Going
Nowhere
Again
Leatherman
Haha...and all in a lunch break, eh?!
I want that stuff your're on at the moment :D
Great write-up!
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 19, 2015, 01:02:35 AM
Haha...and all in a lunch break, eh?!
I want that stuff your're on at the moment :D
Great write-up!
That was at 9pm - before I started drinking :P
You crack me up :rofl:
Leatherman did the hard work. I just summarised :D
Post by: BIG-TARGET on January 19, 2015, 01:05:48 AM
And since it's on Facebook, it must be true!! :whistle:
Post by: Outback in Idaho on January 19, 2015, 02:52:36 AM
Post by: JAfromMn on January 19, 2015, 03:57:30 AM
Post by: JBW1 on January 19, 2015, 04:10:32 AM
Is it like this here whenever you hear something new is coming out?
I guess oblivion really is bliss :drink:
Post by: Higgins617 on January 19, 2015, 04:31:20 AM
Less than 2 days, then I can get on with my life....
Is it like this here whenever you hear something new is coming out?
I guess oblivion really is bliss :drink:
Yes, yes it is. Probably a week or so after the show too to discuss it all too :D
Post by: Outback in Idaho on January 19, 2015, 05:09:21 AM
Quote from: Jackaroo Jim
So I got o thinking... #Leatherman ought to get together with Dave Cantebury, and develop a book on Basic Survival Skills so others that may not know about Vaseline & drier lint, using the can opener for a striker or using it to pop a bottle cap or even as an emergency awl, and other factors that could be carried in the car or ER kit and referred to upon times of need. Then this book could be given with a quality Leatherman multitool for gifts, graduation, etc.
It was liked by 5 people:
Infrequent Bushcrafter
Dux Dux
Jason Sautter
Ralph Freitag
Dave Canterbury (Pathfinder)
So, it had me wondering since I remember Dave configuring a Leartherman Charge with the extra goodies, and how it didn't quite seem to all fit together without lots of grinding. Of course if they would of looked at MTO most of those issues would not of occurred. But still... I wonder if Dave had some input on the Signal.
Now am in a holding pattern as to get a Rebar, start carrying that heavy Surge again, or wait on the Signal.
Post by: Jand3rson86 on January 19, 2015, 06:08:07 AM
Post by: JAfromMn on January 19, 2015, 06:15:49 AM
I just don't want it to be anything like Les stroud or bear grills crap
Post by: JAfromMn on January 19, 2015, 06:17:10 AM
Just a couple more days, fellas. Trust me, you're gonna like it...
:ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh
Post by: bdAmmo on January 19, 2015, 06:23:51 AM
Just a couple more days, fellas. Trust me, you're gonna like it...
...as long as it's NOT BASED ON THE JUICE LINE, then most likely I will :D
Post by: JAfromMn on January 19, 2015, 06:29:43 AM
Just a couple more days, fellas. Trust me, you're gonna like it...
Ok i trust you man. I bet the signal is awesome.
But
I'm still going to freak out until I see it.
:ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh
Post by: Monrogue on January 19, 2015, 06:44:52 AM
Just a couple more days, fellas. Trust me, you're gonna like it...Have you seen it?
Sent from my XT901 using Tapatalk
Post by: Outback in Idaho on January 19, 2015, 07:13:13 AM
Sure hope leatherman doesn't delay production on it to Late Summer or Fall. :twak:
Post by: JBW1 on January 19, 2015, 07:18:47 AM
Klamath meets Surge, with titanium scales and the weight of a Charge?
Sure hope leatherman doesn't delay production on it to Late Summer or Fall. :twak:
Like my imagination wasn't already running wild...Thanks for bringing up Klamath! Ohhhh a gut hook that comes outa the frame and fits over the blade :drool:... Or wait... Dark Wood handles with brushed nickle ends.... Or GIANT gift tin haha
Post by: Outback in Idaho on January 19, 2015, 07:25:55 AM
Klamath meets Surge, with titanium scales and the weight of a Charge?
Sure hope leatherman doesn't delay production on it to Late Summer or Fall. :twak:
Like my imagination wasn't already running wild...Thanks for bringing up Klamath! Ohhhh a gut hook that comes outa the frame and fits over the blade :drool:... Or wait... Dark Wood handles with brushed nickle ends.... Or GIANT gift tin haha
(http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab66/Xelkos/Xemoticon/inlove_zps4d411bb1.gif) Rosewood handles, or perhaps Hickory for longevity. (http://i850.photobucket.com/albums/ab66/Xelkos/Xemoticon/heart.gif)
Post by: babola on January 20, 2015, 06:00:28 AM
Dr. Kkokkolis would have a field day with some of the punters who replied. I thought we are crazy about multi-tools here on MT.O but I believe we found a match there :D
Check the guy with Leatherman logo tattooed (literally!) on his forearm - crazy stuff! ::) (Hope he isn't a member here, LOL!)
It's worth a read, for fun at least: https://www.facebook.com/leathermanusa/photos/a.141866342519209.13330.122239001148610/839749832730853/?type=1&theater
Post by: NewEnglandOutdoorsman on January 20, 2015, 06:18:37 AM
Post by: BIG-TARGET on January 20, 2015, 06:38:57 AM
Confirmed! http://www.leatherman.com/on/demandware.store/Sites-leatherman-Site/en_US/Blog-ShowPost/?p=703Welcome NEO and thanks! :tu:
This baby looks like they crossbred a MUT with a Wave :think:
Post by: Crow on January 20, 2015, 06:41:10 AM
Post by: bdAmmo on January 20, 2015, 07:14:06 AM
Post by: hellsing on January 20, 2015, 07:28:05 AM
I hope there is something to sharpen the serrated knife included. Not a big fan of half serrated knife. But at least there is a file
Post by: tosh on January 20, 2015, 07:29:32 AM
It also looks expensive too for us in the UK
The MUT here is around £180
The WAVE £70+
So this is definitely gonna be in 3 figures for us Brits.
Looks like I'll be buying from overseas!! :D
Post by: hrvstmn31 on January 20, 2015, 08:35:28 AM
Post by: Mike, Lord of the Spammers! on January 20, 2015, 08:41:12 AM
There's a few more tools that would make better pocket survival tools than that would IMO. Why leave out the file which would be genuinely useful when crafting wooden tools?
Post by: Etherealicer on January 20, 2015, 08:41:57 AM
Anyway, you all know how I feel about can-openers... I think I will sit this one out at least until we have some more detailed photographs by Chako :D
Post by: Etherealicer on January 20, 2015, 08:43:12 AM
Kinda underwhelming :(
There's a few more tools that would make better pocket survival tools than that would IMO. Why leave out the file which would be genuinely useful when crafting wooden tools?
Quote from: Leatherman
The Signal also comes complete with traditional Leatherman features like pliers, can opener, saw, awl, and removable pocket clip. In addition, it includes popular features like a hammer, replaceable wire cutters, diamond-coated file, and bit driver.
It's apparent LM and I have not the same idea what survival means.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 20, 2015, 09:04:58 AM
Initial thoughts ...
- The hammer looks a bit delicate in a couple of places, and the hex certainly doesn't look 6mm ... though this being a pre-production mock-up, that might change.
- Knife and saw look reasonable. Can't forsee any problems there
- It does indeed look like the firestarter is on the whistle, so expect contamination of magnesium shavings and therefore magnesium oxide ... TASTY!!! ... I hope they've gotten themselves third party verification for any toxicology risks there :pok:
- This probably means the diamond file mentioned is the "removable sharpener" mentioned previously, and stored in the opposite handle. I'd imagine this is likely to be a flat file, rather than a tri-square for sharpening the saw too.
- I hope this has a sheath in case those handle mounted accesories come away prematurely
Overall .... not something I'm going to get excited about, but it's better than I envisioned. The Leatherman fans will HATE me for saying this, but on first impression I actually prefer the BG Strata over this. "Warmer" grip for cold wet hands, torch, proper drivers including flat driver for prying, scissors .... and at about 50% to 60% of the price I'd imagine
Post by: Griffster on January 20, 2015, 09:30:30 AM
Does anyone else notice that in the first photo, the hammer around the 1/4 Hex hole seems to be broken? It looks to me like its snapped across the hole and the broken part has been placed back next to the hammer for the photo. ???
Having spent the past couple of years with just my TTi for work duties, along with a Squirt PS4, then adding a MUT just under a year ago, and finally getting a Surge (I LOVE the Surge!) and a OHT within a week of each other, I must admit that I find the "MUT format" a bit lacking in tools (it IS a firearms tool afterall, and I don't have an AR15! ). And so I can see from the press release for the Signal that it doesn't exactly appear to be festooned with tools. I too would like to have seen a regular file. Or perhaps a Surge-style blade exchanger? It just seems a bit thin on the ground for what will be a premium-priced product.
Yep, I'm still going to buy it anyway! :gimme:
Post by: hiraethus on January 20, 2015, 09:32:31 AM
If it is Wave sized (and I think you're right Al - certainly looks more like Rebar pliers head than a Surge) then Leatherman would seem to be a step closer to putting the Rebar head on other tools.
Post by: babola on January 20, 2015, 09:48:24 AM
At first it looked extremely light on tool implements but than again this is as they say a survivalist type of tool, so no need for every type of flat head screwdriver etc. We still haven't seen the other side of the tool, though.
Yes, it looks like the hammer is broken on the fist photo...what an oversight from the marketing department... :twak:
It appears to be a MUT/Skeletool/Wave hybrid, which isn't necessarily a bad thing 8) BO version will be a stunner :)
Post by: Syncop8r on January 20, 2015, 09:53:15 AM
Post by: babola on January 20, 2015, 09:56:12 AM
The real question is, how can it be modded? >:D
It took me about 5 seconds to find the first thing to mod on it...the awl! That misshapen thing begs to be re-profiled and modded to something actually more usable and attractive looking. 8)
(http://i1242.photobucket.com/albums/gg535/facebook1983/Signal3_zpsa11f888f.jpg)
Post by: Breezy12 on January 20, 2015, 09:57:41 AM
The real question is, how can it be modded? >:D
It took me about 5 seconds to find the first thing to mod on it...the awl! That misshapen thing begs to be re-profiled and modded to something actually more usable and attractive looking. 8)
the first thing I did was look at the pivot area on the blade to see if it can be easily swapped with one of the current 154CM or S30V Charge blades. :D
Post by: hiraethus on January 20, 2015, 09:59:13 AM
Post by: babola on January 20, 2015, 10:00:57 AM
The real question is, how can it be modded? >:D
It took me about 5 seconds to find the first thing to mod on it...the awl! That misshapen thing begs to be re-profiled and modded to something actually more usable and attractive looking. 8)
the first thing I did was look at the pivot area on the blade to see if it can be easily swapped with one of the current 154CM or S30V Charge blades. :D
That should be a drop-in swap, I believe. Let's hope :) If it is, TTC will run out of spare parts stock pretty fast :D
Post by: Breezy12 on January 20, 2015, 10:01:31 AM
The real question is, how can it be modded? >:D
It took me about 5 seconds to find the first thing to mod on it...the awl! That misshapen thing begs to be re-profiled and modded to something actually more usable and attractive looking. 8)
the first thing I did was look at the pivot area on the blade to see if it can be easily swapped with one of the current 154CM or S30V Charge blades. :D
That should be a drop-in swap, I believe. Let's hope :) If it is TTC will run out of spare parts stock pretty fast :D
I had the same thought. ;)
Post by: Kampfer on January 20, 2015, 10:04:50 AM
Post by: Syncop8r on January 20, 2015, 10:13:52 AM
I can't agree with having a bit driver on an outdoor tool.
Otherwise, although it's not quite what I would want in a "survival tool", I am looking forward to seeing it in all it's glory...
Post by: Etherealicer on January 20, 2015, 10:19:50 AM
There is too much plierhead: Pliers might be useful in the wilderness but I would rather go with something smaller, similar to fishing pliers.
Bit-Holder: Considering they have integrated whistle / fire-starter etc. so you don't have to carry anything else. In that light a bit-holder makes no sense.
Can opener: NOOOOOOOOOOO
Serrations: Serrated blades are great, but more difficult to sharpen. I think if the diamond-file is intended for sharpening a non-serrated blade would have been a better combination.
In a survival tool, I would like to see at least some thought about first-aid. Scissors? Rescue Blade?
I think its too much focused on screws (bit holder / pliers), rather than more primitive building with rope / string. Marlin Spike? Extreme needle-nose pliers?
Post by: Kampfer on January 20, 2015, 10:22:31 AM
+
Two bottle openers
Post by: JPS_ on January 20, 2015, 11:47:37 AM
(http://i.imgur.com/mTuIFHH.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/GHJUozT.jpg)
Post by: DazMechanical on January 20, 2015, 12:09:11 PM
Only two outside tools, kinda like sidekick's setup.
+
Two bottle openers
Yep, that's the first thing I thought! A New Sidekick :facepalm:
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 20, 2015, 12:20:49 PM
Only two outside tools, kinda like sidekick's setup.
+
Two bottle openers
:facepalm: Never spotted that
Quick thought ... this SHOULD be a fair bit cheaper than a Wave:
Half the number of outside blades.
Few inside tools (and simple ones at that).
Less assembly time
On the flip side - extra costs:
A minimalistic (much thinner and less surface area plastic mounted) diamond file
A metallic tasting ::) plastic whistle
That carabiner/hammer farce
What do you reckon? 70-80% of a Wave in terms of cost?
Post by: BIG-TARGET on January 20, 2015, 12:38:35 PM
On the positive, I'm happy about the can openner!! Since there have been times, in the woods, I would have killed for a can opener!!! :drink:
Post by: hellsing on January 20, 2015, 01:30:05 PM
Post by: Lichtbote on January 20, 2015, 01:51:03 PM
I´m just a strong fan of some of the LM tools (Surge/OHT/Skeletool), and only a liker of less of the Gerber tools - but under the line i base my decision on each tool on it´s own, not on the brand. Most tools of both brands i don´t like (for my personal use, i´m no collector), esspecially the MUT is a complete NoGo for me.
While i like the look of the Signal, i probably will not buy one. From what we know now, i don´t think it´s a bad tool, it´s just that i don´t think its capable of anything i might need that my existing tools don´t (I ignore the firestarter/whistle thing). I don´t really believe in "survival needs MTs", and for outdoor activities i would use my slighly modded OHT, as i would prefer it´s 2 single serrated/plain edges over having just one partial serrated.
While i like the carbine of the Signal, i see no real use for such a tiny and brittle hammer and the included nut. Give it a massive hammer that can drive a good sized nail in wood ..... or leave it.
Tool load always depends on your activity - so i see the pliers differ on their useability from person to person. Going out on a light hiking you maybe only need a small plier head to fix small things on your fishing gear, or for pulling fishbones out of your catched trout. But if you are going out to trap some animals you might have a use for the slighly bigger pliers to fix stuff on your traps or cut wire for traps.
Can opener - something i don´t need on my "tool" MTs (those i use to fix stuff, like my Surge), but i would want it on a dedicated outdoor MT, as there are enough cans without a opening system build in.
Screwdrivers - while i love the bitholder on my "tool-MTs", i would be afraid of loosing the bits outdoor. So i would prefer them to be fixed for an outdoor MT.
File - i don´t see the need for fine woodworking outdoor, so no woodfile is needed, the knife is good enough for any needed shapes. But a diamond coated file is good for (re-)sharpening any knife or axe, so i call that usefull.
I´m no big awl-user, but this seems stubby and wide. On the other hand nothing a light reshape can´t handle.
Altogether i call it (with todays knowledge) a good outdoor MT, which can be better with some mods to each persons own needs. I still prefer my OHT, but if i would be MT-less and start looking for one for outdoor activity, i would consider the Signal a capable one.
It would depend on the price, and the quality of the feel and handling.
Thanks for everyone that reads all my long blablabla up to the end. ;)
Post by: Chako on January 20, 2015, 02:40:39 PM
:facepalm:
Post by: TheDude on January 20, 2015, 02:43:40 PM
And Oh! S.I.G.N.A.L.
http://youtu.be/dmK6CjaVFKs
Post by: NKlamerus on January 20, 2015, 03:17:43 PM
Post by: glorn on January 20, 2015, 03:38:21 PM
:think:
:rofl:
Post by: JAfromMn on January 20, 2015, 03:43:02 PM
I like it.
My first thought is I wish it was more mut based.
I don't know. It reminds me of a wingman for some reason.
Post by: sawman on January 20, 2015, 03:46:55 PM
Post by: NKlamerus on January 20, 2015, 03:47:56 PM
Post by: Crow on January 20, 2015, 03:50:20 PM
Fire Whistle!
:think:
:rofl:
Yea. You blow it, and it spits sparks...
Post by: glorn on January 20, 2015, 03:51:14 PM
Quote
The Signal also comes complete with traditional Leatherman features like pliers, can opener, saw, awl, and removable pocket clip. In addition, it includes popular features like a hammer, replaceable wire cutters, diamond-coated file, and bit driver.
Sounds like there is one.
Post by: glorn on January 20, 2015, 03:52:11 PM
Fire Whistle!
:think:
:rofl:
Yea. You blow it, and it spits sparks...
Or.. you strike it and it blows the flame out.
:rofl:
Post by: Crow on January 20, 2015, 03:54:33 PM
Fire Whistle!
:think:
:rofl:
Yea. You blow it, and it spits sparks...
Or.. you strike it and it blows the flame out.
:rofl:
Maybe striking it, it whistles signal to the air.
Post by: glorn on January 20, 2015, 03:57:35 PM
Fire Whistle!
:think:
:rofl:
Yea. You blow it, and it spits sparks...
Or.. you strike it and it blows the flame out.
:rofl:
Maybe striking it, it whistles signal to the air.
Ha! A warning!
"Stand back, folks! Man making fire here!"
Post by: metasyntax on January 20, 2015, 04:40:13 PM
I think Leatherman is stretching, but I guess that's what happens when you are pressured to "innovate" when your products don't really need to change, except a little slow evolution (everybody wants a Wave w/ replaceable wire cutters). I think about Casio with their fashion focus, Victorinox too: they're making the same products they always did, but they need that other part of their business to keep them going. If Casio only made tough watches, I don't know if they'd still be around. If Victorinox never made luggage or Wenger never sold their brand to be slapped on whatever, I'm not sure they would have survived. I think that's what Leatherman is doing, trying to branch out and doing weirder things (my point will be proven 1000 times over if the watch is real) to stay relevant. But all we really need are incremental improvements to the already good products. Can a company even survive just doing one thing well anymore?
Seems like you used to hear more about somebody who made a good product and just kept making it that way for 20, 40, 80 years. I guess in the global market, maybe it's not possible. Inevitably, most of those companies are now just brands owned by some international mega-conglomerate making crap and slapping the old name on them.
Sorry, I got kinda negative there. I think it's a novelty, nothing more.
Post by: sawman on January 20, 2015, 04:47:21 PM
This doesn't seem practical to me at all. If you're doing something where you might need these tools, like backcountry hiking, you're going to be carrying lighter and more effective versions of them on your person already. I'm thinking I can do better with a Storm Whistle around my neck, and a Light My Fire ferrocerium rod and Vic Fieldmaster in my pocket; and it would certainly weigh less. And since they're on my body, and not in my pack - where I carry a full size multitool - they're not as likely to get lost. I guess in the situation of "I carry this with me every day for normal usage and something awful happened where I got stranded in the middle of nowhere with no way to get out for a few days" it would work, but doesn't make sense to me as an outdoor tool. I'd rather carry a Freestyle for weight, since probably the only thing I need it for is pliers.Interesting point about Casio and Victorinox but I don't see the LM Signal as 'branching off' at all. LM makes tools and this is just another tool. I think it looks promising.
I think Leatherman is stretching, but I guess that's what happens when you are pressured to "innovate" when your products don't really need to change, except a little slow evolution (everybody wants a Wave w/ replaceable wire cutters). I think about Casio with their fashion focus, Victorinox too: they're making the same products they always did, but they need that other part of their business to keep them going. If Casio only made tough watches, I don't know if they'd still be around. If Victorinox never made luggage or Wenger never sold their brand to be slapped on whatever, I'm not sure they would have survived. I think that's what Leatherman is doing, trying to branch out and doing weirder things (my point will be proven 1000 times over if the watch is real) to stay relevant. But all we really need are incremental improvements to the already good products. Can a company even survive just doing one thing well anymore?
Seems like you used to hear more about somebody who made a good product and just kept making it that way for 20, 40, 80 years. I guess in the global market, maybe it's not possible. Inevitably, most of those companies are now just brands owned by some international mega-conglomerate making crap and slapping the old name on them.
Sorry, I got kinda negative there. I think it's a novelty, nothing more.
Post by: metasyntax on January 20, 2015, 05:00:56 PM
This doesn't seem practical to me at all. If you're doing something where you might need these tools, like backcountry hiking, you're going to be carrying lighter and more effective versions of them on your person already. I'm thinking I can do better with a Storm Whistle around my neck, and a Light My Fire ferrocerium rod and Vic Fieldmaster in my pocket; and it would certainly weigh less. And since they're on my body, and not in my pack - where I carry a full size multitool - they're not as likely to get lost. I guess in the situation of "I carry this with me every day for normal usage and something awful happened where I got stranded in the middle of nowhere with no way to get out for a few days" it would work, but doesn't make sense to me as an outdoor tool. I'd rather carry a Freestyle for weight, since probably the only thing I need it for is pliers.Interesting point about Casio and Victorinox but I don't see the LM Signal as 'branching off' at all. LM makes tools and this is just another tool. I think it looks promising.
I think Leatherman is stretching, but I guess that's what happens when you are pressured to "innovate" when your products don't really need to change, except a little slow evolution (everybody wants a Wave w/ replaceable wire cutters). I think about Casio with their fashion focus, Victorinox too: they're making the same products they always did, but they need that other part of their business to keep them going. If Casio only made tough watches, I don't know if they'd still be around. If Victorinox never made luggage or Wenger never sold their brand to be slapped on whatever, I'm not sure they would have survived. I think that's what Leatherman is doing, trying to branch out and doing weirder things (my point will be proven 1000 times over if the watch is real) to stay relevant. But all we really need are incremental improvements to the already good products. Can a company even survive just doing one thing well anymore?
Seems like you used to hear more about somebody who made a good product and just kept making it that way for 20, 40, 80 years. I guess in the global market, maybe it's not possible. Inevitably, most of those companies are now just brands owned by some international mega-conglomerate making crap and slapping the old name on them.
Sorry, I got kinda negative there. I think it's a novelty, nothing more.
I just think the Signal is embracing the stylish fad of survival, like all the Bear Grylls stuff from Gerber. Sure, it's still a tool - Casio's "garish gold" watches are still watches - but I see it more as a way to make money than as a way to make a good product better, because I think it will suffer functionally compared to what people are already doing carrying dedicated whistles and ferro rods, etc. Maybe I'll be wrong about that.
I'm also in a very "get off my lawn, I miss the good old days" mood this morning. :-)
Post by: Lichtbote on January 20, 2015, 05:14:29 PM
This doesn't seem practical to me at all. If you're doing something where you might need these tools, like backcountry hiking, you're going to be carrying lighter and more effective versions of them on your person already. I'm thinking I can do better with a Storm Whistle around my neck, and a Light My Fire ferrocerium rod and Vic Fieldmaster in my pocket;
- but I see it more as a way to make money than as a way to make a good product better, because I think it will suffer functionally compared to what people are already doing carrying dedicated whistles and ferro rods, etc.
Thinking that really to an end would lead to the point where each Multitool becomes redundant, as each function has a better working equivalent in the dedicated tool sector. :D
Post by: JBW1 on January 20, 2015, 05:14:58 PM
Anyone see if it has a pocket clip anywhere?Says REMOVABLE POCKET CLiP. Hopefully the same as wave, etc.
So.....Thanks Leatherman for the canvas, now how can WE make into a good tool. :D
How About an alx gut hook/ strap cutter on the blade?
I foresee the next candidate for a BABOLA "single wing" mod. haha
Post by: NKlamerus on January 20, 2015, 05:18:42 PM
I agree.Anyone see if it has a pocket clip anywhere?Says REMOVABLE POCKET CLiP. Hopefully the same as wave, etc.
So.....Thanks Leatherman for the canvas, now how can WE make into a good tool. :D
I wouldn't not classify it as a survival tool, but I still think it's a near perfect idea.
Little more than a skeletool, little less than a mut. I think it will be a perfect balance!
Post by: enki_ck on January 20, 2015, 06:28:13 PM
Anyone see if it has a pocket clip anywhere?Says REMOVABLE POCKET CLiP. Hopefully the same as wave, etc.
Most likely. As the Wave/Charge clip is removable and sits on the inside tools lock it seems only fitting. (no pun intended ;) ) I'd call that a good thing. :tu:
So.....Thanks Leatherman for the canvas, now how can WE make into a good tool. :D
...
My first thoughts too. >:D
I actually quite like it. It's much more of a tool than what we got in the last few years. If you drop the whistle/fero rod and replace the blade with a PE one it would be a nice tool. Depending on the price point, that is. Probably about 75% of the Wave price.
Post by: tosh on January 20, 2015, 06:32:58 PM
The very first thing that came to mind was "what's the point". Seriously I'm trying not to be negative as I'd love to get a new MT :drool:
But, it seems sparten to say the least. The wave in comparison still looks to be a better tool. Why not incorporate the whistle into newly designed handles for another take on the Wave, using materials used for the leap (that would have allowed the use of bright colours) and at the same time swapping the Wave head for the Rebar.
It would have totally transformed the Wave into a different tool and thus taken it into a different direction but still using a proven loadout. I think it would have worked having 2 versions of the Wave.
Post by: NKlamerus on January 20, 2015, 06:33:07 PM
Meaning that; you won't have other single purpose tools with you. Obviously if it was a planned trip you would have a dedicated knife, saw, fire starter, etc....
Although I do see many a boyscouts carrying one of these in the future.
Post by: enki_ck on January 20, 2015, 06:47:56 PM
I'm home now, so managed to take my time and scrutinize the SIGNAL.
The very first thing that came to mind was "what's the point". Seriously I'm trying not to be negative as I'd love to get a new MT :drool:
But, it seems sparten to say the least. The wave in comparison still looks to be a better tool. Why not incorporate the whistle into newly designed handles for another take on the Wave, using materials used for the leap (that would have allowed the use of bright colours) and at the same time swapping the Wave head for the Rebar.
It would have totally transformed the Wave into a different tool and thus taken it into a different direction but still using a proven loadout. I think it would have worked having 2 versions of the Wave.
I think they are standardizing their pliers so they only use the Rebar type for new builds to minimize production costs. We'll probably see a Wave MK3 soonish too with them, maybe even next year.
Post by: Kampfer on January 20, 2015, 07:07:51 PM
Wave's clip I would call it "optional" or "detachable".
Post by: ryan1835 on January 20, 2015, 07:25:22 PM
Post by: Kampfer on January 20, 2015, 07:26:28 PM
http://www.leatherman.com/on/demandware.store/Sites-leatherman-Site/en_US/Blog-ShowPost/?p=703 more info?Same info :twak:
Post by: babola on January 20, 2015, 07:35:53 PM
http://www.leatherman.com/on/demandware.store/Sites-leatherman-Site/en_US/Blog-ShowPost/?p=703 more info?Same info :twak:
I'm hoping for a youtube video from Leatherman's SHOT show stand in a few hours 8)
I remember when they posted the OHT announcement video from their stand 2 years ago, I watched it about half a dozen times in quick succession to get all the details :D
Post by: JAfromMn on January 20, 2015, 07:42:52 PM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 20, 2015, 07:47:10 PM
Post by: JAfromMn on January 20, 2015, 07:51:20 PM
On the opposite handle to the semi melted whistle that tastes powdery and metallic
I'm going to try looking for it again. I didn't see it.
Post by: JAfromMn on January 20, 2015, 07:53:15 PM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 20, 2015, 07:55:19 PM
On the opposite handle to the semi melted whistle that tastes powdery and metallic
I'm going to try looking for it again. I didn't see it.
I was actually just looking for another opportunity to take the piss out of the ridiculous whistle design ... but if you look through the OHO hole on the knife, there's a strip of silver ... I'm suspecting that's it :whistle:
(http://i1242.photobucket.com/albums/gg535/facebook1983/Signal3_zpsa11f888f.jpg)
Post by: rescue4500 on January 20, 2015, 07:57:11 PM
Post by: Yadda on January 20, 2015, 08:08:54 PM
Post by: babola on January 20, 2015, 08:14:48 PM
Sort of a gussied up Skeletool with a saw, firestarter and a whistle?
Add to that an awl, mini-hammer, can opener, file, full size pliers...there's actually very little "skeletool" in this tool, IMO.
Post by: kirk13 on January 20, 2015, 08:25:22 PM
Tool light,£ heavy,no use to me...come on Leatherman :facepalm:
Post by: Breezy12 on January 20, 2015, 08:27:24 PM
I actually quite like it. It's much more of a tool than what we got in the last few years. If you drop the whistle/fero rod and replace the blade with a PE one it would be a nice tool. Depending on the price point, that is. Probably about 75% of the Wave price.
this was my thought as well... much better to see something like this than a new set of snowboarding or surfing OPMTs. ::)
I'm excited for this one. I certainly don't think it's perfect, and it's not going to replace my ReCharge (or even a stock Wave/Charge) anytime soon. But I really like the engineering and innovation that went into this design. We've been talking about a civilian version of the MUT around here, and I think this is a decent shot at it. the hammer doesn't look as sturdy as the one on the MUT, but that comes with the (much more pocketable) Wave-size frame.
first thing I'll do is replace the CE blade with a PE blade, and work on reshaping a flat driver to replace the can opener.
Post by: Kampfer on January 20, 2015, 08:45:51 PM
It is more Wave than Skeletool, other than the one handle has fold out tools while the other has cararbiner.Sort of a gussied up Skeletool with a saw, firestarter and a whistle?
Add to that an awl, mini-hammer, can opener, file, full size pliers...there's actually very little "skeletool" in this tool, IMO.
Post by: Breezy12 on January 20, 2015, 09:09:00 PM
the handle with the blade is going to be thicker than a regular Wave handle to accommodate the bit driver + can opener + awl on the inside. (keep in mind a regular Wave only has bit driver + can opener in the same handle.) this leads me to believe (and hope) that the file is on the other handle opposite from the saw.
I really, really hope that the handles aren't uneven like they were on a few of the Juice models... :-\
Post by: Monrogue on January 20, 2015, 09:15:36 PM
one other thing I realized...
the handle with the blade is going to be thicker than a regular Wave handle to accommodate the bit driver + can opener + awl on the inside. (keep in mind a regular Wave only has bit driver + can opener in the same handle.) this leads me to believe (and hope) that the file is on the other handle opposite from the saw.
I really, really hope that the handles aren't uneven like they were on a few of the Juice models... :-\
That would be rather annoying, so I hope that's not the case. I am not able to view the info/pics of it here at work, so I will have more of an opinion on it tonight.
Post by: Kampfer on January 20, 2015, 09:15:52 PM
the handles aren't uneven like they were on a few of the Juice models... :-\:twak: I HATE THAT. :twak:
Post by: JPS_ on January 20, 2015, 09:16:57 PM
Post by: Kampfer on January 20, 2015, 09:22:42 PM
Post by: Kampfer on January 20, 2015, 09:51:23 PM
There won't be any tools in the handle with hammer, see attached photo.
The red dash line is estimated outline of whistle, it is going to take up some space in handle.
Normally the front photos of Leatherman tools would have all the implements fanned out. In this case, diamond file is the only one that is not visible. :think: Maybe it is part of the handle, externally like Skeletool SX?
Post by: dan.mandiel on January 20, 2015, 09:56:43 PM
Post by: Kampfer on January 20, 2015, 09:57:41 PM
the big question is, does it have scissors? :facepalm:I bet it doesn't.
Many people (including me) consider scissors are a convenient feature, but not essential.
Post by: JPS_ on January 20, 2015, 09:58:24 PM
Based on my observation:
There won't be any tools in the handle with hammer, see attached photo.
But then theres this image, something is fixed to the pivot point of the saw on the other side, maybe thats the file or the scissors?
Post by: Kampfer on January 20, 2015, 10:00:51 PM
I can't tell. Let's see.Based on my observation:
There won't be any tools in the handle with hammer, see attached photo.
But then theres this image, something is fixed to the pivot point of the saw on the other side, maybe thats the file or the scissors?
Pocket clip maybe? Seen like a good place to clip.
Post by: NKlamerus on January 20, 2015, 10:04:41 PM
I thought about replacing my trusty Wave with a skeletool to save some weight, but it was to small for my taste. Then I wanted to replace it with a MUT (because I just love how it looks) but its far too big and too heavy for my front pocket. Now if theres a black oxide version of the Signal I will happily throw money at leatherman and remove the yellow packing insert before giving the Signal a new home in my front pocket ...X2.
I'm excited for a new product, I'm even more excited to see all the MTO mods and coatings.
Post by: NKlamerus on January 20, 2015, 10:13:10 PM
There is no scissors.Based on my observation:
There won't be any tools in the handle with hammer, see attached photo.
But then theres this image, something is fixed to the pivot point of the saw on the other side, maybe thats the file or the scissors?
From the leatherman site "features like pliers, can opener, saw, awl and removable pocket clip. In addition it includes features like a Hammer, replacable wire cutters, diamond coated file and but driver"
I think they would have included scissors on the "traditional" list.
As for; "where is the file"
I think it's here? But not sure (http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/01/20/c68bb6d812f9f4e109ebc2bd31e530e7.jpg)
(The Silver peice withing the handle opposite of the hammer/caribeaner side)
Post by: Jfowler1 on January 20, 2015, 10:17:02 PM
Post by: NKlamerus on January 20, 2015, 10:18:37 PM
Post by: JBW1 on January 20, 2015, 10:20:10 PM
I'll just wait for that one, unless I decide to jump on the possible class action lawsuit of ingesting magnesium shavings in my lungs after trying to start a fire, then blowing the whistle. J/k but really, I can see LM having many problems with that idea. :think:I'm home now, so managed to take my time and scrutinize the SIGNAL.
The very first thing that came to mind was "what's the point". Seriously I'm trying not to be negative as I'd love to get a new MT :drool:
But, it seems sparten to say the least. The wave in comparison still looks to be a better tool. Why not incorporate the whistle into newly designed handles for another take on the Wave, using materials used for the leap (that would have allowed the use of bright colours) and at the same time swapping the Wave head for the Rebar.
It would have totally transformed the Wave into a different tool and thus taken it into a different direction but still using a proven loadout. I think it would have worked having 2 versions of the Wave.
I think they are standardizing their pliers so they only use the Rebar type for new builds to minimize production costs.We'll probably see a Wave MK3 soonish too with them, maybe even next year.
oKAY, enough picking that one apart, let's see the next let down..... Where is the WATCH??
Post by: rescue4500 on January 20, 2015, 10:22:40 PM
Post by: Kampfer on January 20, 2015, 10:29:01 PM
Edit, after staring at every image released so far. I see that the tools are locking, meaning the file most likely is on the opposite side of the Saw. But same handle. If you notice the saw in the closed position, it sits below flush. If the file does the same there is no chance of us seeing it with the current photos.If the file is a fold out implement, why it is NOT shown in the fanned out photo? :think:
I am guess it is mounted externally as part of the handle.
Post by: Breezy12 on January 20, 2015, 10:31:00 PM
the handles aren't uneven like they were on a few of the Juice models... :-\:twak: I HATE THAT. :twak:
me too!! it's one of several reasons that I've never really taken a liking to the Juice line.
Post by: NKlamerus on January 20, 2015, 10:31:15 PM
True true.Edit, after staring at every image released so far. I see that the tools are locking, meaning the file most likely is on the opposite side of the Saw. But same handle. If you notice the saw in the closed position, it sits below flush. If the file does the same there is no chance of us seeing it with the current photos.If the file is a fold out implement, why it is NOT shown in the fanned out photo? :think:
I am guess it is mounted externally as part of the handle.
Compare to the all other leatherman stock photos they usually show everything that folds.
Has anyone seen any mention of that he is striking the ferro rod with? The blade?
Post by: Kampfer on January 20, 2015, 10:32:45 PM
Pretty such he was using the spine of saw, tip of that tool is blunt, not pointy.True true.Edit, after staring at every image released so far. I see that the tools are locking, meaning the file most likely is on the opposite side of the Saw. But same handle. If you notice the saw in the closed position, it sits below flush. If the file does the same there is no chance of us seeing it with the current photos.If the file is a fold out implement, why it is NOT shown in the fanned out photo? :think:
I am guess it is mounted externally as part of the handle.
Compare to the all other leatherman stock photos they usually show everything that folds.
Has anyone seen any mention of that he is striking the ferro rod with? The blade?
Post by: Top-Gear-24 on January 20, 2015, 10:37:03 PM
On the other hand, in the past I said I would never buy an OHT, and what did I buy a month or two ago ... ::)
Post by: gadgetman7 on January 20, 2015, 11:01:40 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Kampfer on January 20, 2015, 11:06:07 PM
How does the bit driver work when extended? Do you have to use it like the Skeletool. If so, that might be a deal breaker.Good point, I think that is the case, just like MUT and Skeletool.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 20, 2015, 11:07:12 PM
How does the bit driver work when extended? Do you have to use it like the Skeletool. If so, that might be a deal breaker.
Sent from Tracy Island
Looks like it, otherwise it will be obscured by the carabiner. Same deal with the awl and can opener too. A lot more awkward than with the Wave
Post by: Kampfer on January 20, 2015, 11:08:40 PM
I can use the driver on Skeletool, (tested by many during the challenge), but using awl in such way is very bad.
Post by: Etherealicer on January 20, 2015, 11:09:13 PM
I pretty much agree on the scissors. However, as a complete outdoors tool it should also have the tools for an emergency / accident. In that case you want/need something to cut clothing and while it could be done with the primary blade, I would prefer something like a rescue blade or scissors.the big question is, does it have scissors? :facepalm:I bet it doesn't.
Many people (including me) consider scissors are a convenient feature, but not essential.
Post by: Kampfer on January 20, 2015, 11:11:31 PM
I prefer to have an EMT do it, better yet, I prefer no one get hurt at all. :DI pretty much agree on the scissors. However, as a complete outdoors tool it should also have the tools for an emergency / accident. In that case you want/need something to cut clothing and while it could be done with the primary blade, I would prefer something like a rescue blade or scissors.the big question is, does it have scissors? :facepalm:I bet it doesn't.
Many people (including me) consider scissors are a convenient feature, but not essential.
Post by: Etherealicer on January 20, 2015, 11:11:53 PM
That is actually true. It appears all the inside tools can only be used in "pliers mode".How does the bit driver work when extended? Do you have to use it like the Skeletool. If so, that might be a deal breaker.
Sent from Tracy Island
Looks like it, otherwise it will be obscured by the carabiner. Same deal with the awl and can opener too. A lot more awkward than with the Wave
Post by: Etherealicer on January 20, 2015, 11:13:18 PM
Ideally yes :tu:, but isn't that exactly the point of "survival" preparedness? I mean accidents can happen at any time.I prefer to have an EMT do it, better yet, I prefer no one get hurt at all. :DI pretty much agree on the scissors. However, as a complete outdoors tool it should also have the tools for an emergency / accident. In that case you want/need something to cut clothing and while it could be done with the primary blade, I would prefer something like a rescue blade or scissors.the big question is, does it have scissors? :facepalm:I bet it doesn't.
Many people (including me) consider scissors are a convenient feature, but not essential.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 20, 2015, 11:19:59 PM
Cut it off!
I can use the driver on Skeletool, (tested by many during the challenge), but using awl in such way is very bad.
The carabiner or the bit driver/awl/opener? :think:
Wave is better than BG Strata. BG Strata is better than Signal (IMHO) ... but ...
If you're going to cut the hammer section off, you might as well get a Wave and have a better tool set :shrug:
Add a small AAA torch on one side of the sheath and a firesteel on the other, clip a Fox 40 micro whistle on the lanyard loop, and you're good to go with a tool that beats both Strata and Signal :tu:
Post by: SteveC on January 20, 2015, 11:25:06 PM
Reminds me of the old saying " Jack of all trades, master of none "
Post by: Kampfer on January 20, 2015, 11:35:37 PM
We all agree Wave is an excellent MT, it is hard to beat.Cut it off!
I can use the driver on Skeletool, (tested by many during the challenge), but using awl in such way is very bad.
The carabiner or the bit driver/awl/opener? :think:
Wave is better than BG Strata. BG Strata is better than Signal (IMHO) ... but ...
If you're going to cut the hammer section off, you might as well get a Wave and have a better tool set :shrug:
Add a small AAA torch on one side of the sheath and a firesteel on the other, clip a Fox 40 micro whistle on the lanyard loop, and you're good to go with a tool that beats both Strata and Signal :tu:
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 20, 2015, 11:37:29 PM
Reminds me of the old saying " Jack of all trades, master of none "
Yeah, the tool doesn't do a lot for me, but I'm sure it will still be popular.
It's very easy for us to pick spots off tools though, because of the immense collective wisdom here about so many other tools that are/were on the market, plus the mods that our members put together. We make far more comparisons than other people, and see improvements that others wouldn't necessarily consider.
I think from a purely commercial perspective, Leatherman have pitched this well for "non-members of MTO" who will generally go on what the internet tells them they need. This is a classic "designed by committee" product, and will be snatched up my the myriad of followers of such stuff on the internet, thinking that sitting on their arse discussing survival stuff, but never so much as stepping on a twig makes them unique and strong and independent and prepared :P :D :D Joking aside, this product WILL be lapped up by many people. It's FAR stronger as a marketable product than it is as a survival aid ;)
Post by: Etherealicer on January 20, 2015, 11:37:41 PM
umm... :whistle:We all agree Wave is an excellent MT, it is hard to beat.Cut it off!
I can use the driver on Skeletool, (tested by many during the challenge), but using awl in such way is very bad.
The carabiner or the bit driver/awl/opener? :think:
Wave is better than BG Strata. BG Strata is better than Signal (IMHO) ... but ...
If you're going to cut the hammer section off, you might as well get a Wave and have a better tool set :shrug:
Add a small AAA torch on one side of the sheath and a firesteel on the other, clip a Fox 40 micro whistle on the lanyard loop, and you're good to go with a tool that beats both Strata and Signal :tu:
Charge >> Simple Stone >> Wave
:rofl:
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 20, 2015, 11:39:07 PM
Post by: tosh on January 20, 2015, 11:40:23 PM
The Signal, supposedly a tool to survive with??
Is this the best that leatherman can do?
Can't believe its missing scissors and full serrated blade.
Like previously stated, they should've based this on a proven formulae...the WAVE!! A legend amongst MT's, it's that good we all just take it for granted nowadays.
But its a classic..like the VW Beetle its timeless!
Definitely one for the mall ninjas and collectors.
Of course I'll buy one.....I like gadgets! :D
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 20, 2015, 11:52:33 PM
The more I think about it, the more bizzare it seems.
The Signal, supposedly a tool to survive with??
Is this the best that leatherman can do?
Can't believe its missing scissors and full serrated blade.
Like I previously said, they should've based this on a proven formulae...the WAVE!! A legend amongst MT's, it's that good we all just take it for granted.
Definitely one for the mall ninjas and collectors.
Of course I'll buy it.......I like gadgets!
Sales are all that matter to them :D The "business" took over from the "dream" a long long time ago. Leatherman first and foremost are driven to produce stuff that sells.
The masses will buy them - KA-CHING! (sound of the till)
The collectors will buy them - KA-CHING!
The gadget freaks will buy them - KA-CHING!
The modders - KA-CHING!
The people buying for "the guy who has everything" - KA-CHING!
...... KA-CHING! - KA-CHING! - KA-CHING!
This might aid maybe ... what ... three (?) people in a genuine survival situation over the next 10 years, but it will bring in a massive ammount of revenue for them. Mission accomplished! Not knocking them for it in the slightest, because that's who/what they are now, but we can't fool ourselves they're doing it for passion, principle, or to produce "the best tool" anymore. Those days are loooong gone :D
Post by: enki_ck on January 20, 2015, 11:53:12 PM
The more I think about it, the more bizzare it seems.Truth be told, they didn't say survival. It was my guess when I started this thread many months ago. ;) Although it does aim at outdoorsy types. :)
The Signal, supposedly a tool to survive with??
Is this the best that leatherman can do?
Can't believe its missing scissors and full serrated blade.
Like I previously said, they should've based this on a proven formulae...the WAVE!! A legend amongst MT's, it's that good we all just take it for granted.
Definitely one for the mall ninjas and collectors.
Of course I'll buy it.......I like gadgets!
Post by: enki_ck on January 20, 2015, 11:54:30 PM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 20, 2015, 11:56:44 PM
The more I think about it, the more bizzare it seems.Truth be told, they didn't say survival. It was my guess when I started this thread many months ago. ;) Although it does aim at outdoorsy types. :)
The Signal, supposedly a tool to survive with??
Is this the best that leatherman can do?
Can't believe its missing scissors and full serrated blade.
Like I previously said, they should've based this on a proven formulae...the WAVE!! A legend amongst MT's, it's that good we all just take it for granted.
Definitely one for the mall ninjas and collectors.
Of course I'll buy it.......I like gadgets!
In fairness I think the hype machine says they consulted survival experts (or something else insinuating more than just a plaything). I think they've softened off a bit on the hype on this one so far actually. They must be reading this forum even more than we thought :rofl:
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 20, 2015, 11:57:08 PM
As for the file, ideally it would be removable so you could use it as a sharpener. That would explain why they didn't fan it out. :think:
My thoughts too Nik :tu:
Didn't the original trademark bid suggest something like that? :think:
Post by: ducttapetech on January 20, 2015, 11:57:29 PM
Nate
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 20, 2015, 11:58:27 PM
I like it.
Nate
You would, you're wierd :pok: :pok: :rofl:
Post by: ducttapetech on January 20, 2015, 11:59:57 PM
Takes one to know one...........lol!I like it.
Nate
You would, you're wierdok:
Nate
Post by: Monrogue on January 21, 2015, 12:12:36 AM
Sent from my XT901 using Tapatalk
Post by: rdub934 on January 21, 2015, 12:30:32 AM
Last page has an article of the new offerings from Leatherman. Sounds like the "wearable tool" is a Bracelet in addition the Watch. Also, the Signal has a knife sharpener, not a dedicated file. No pics that I saw, though.
Post by: TheDude on January 21, 2015, 12:33:55 AM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 21, 2015, 12:39:10 AM
The style of handle cutouts reminds me of MUT.
I have been sooooo tempted to quip that it was trying to look like a Gerber Suspension ... :P :D
Post by: enki_ck on January 21, 2015, 12:43:23 AM
As for the file, ideally it would be removable so you could use it as a sharpener. That would explain why they didn't fan it out. :think:
My thoughts too Nik :tu:
Didn't the original trademark bid suggest something like that? :think:
Here it is:
Quote
Multi-function hand tools comprised of any combination of pliers, wire cutters, combo edge knife blade with a liner lock, wood saw, screwdriver bit driver, bottle opener, can opener, awl, fire starter, signal whistle, hammer, carabiner, pocket clip, lanyard hole, and removable ceramic sharpening stick
No mention of a file in the patent application. :think:
Post by: NKlamerus on January 21, 2015, 12:43:45 AM
Post by: tosh on January 21, 2015, 12:49:36 AM
Hope Chako's got deep pockets
" bracelet and watch between $150 - $600 depending on model with extra links available between $25 - $30 each!! Ouch!! :ahhh :ahhh
I think its fair to say I probably won't be getting one :facepalm:
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 21, 2015, 12:50:12 AM
120 BUCKS FOR THE SIGNAL?!?!? Really? That's stupid priced.
Where did that come from? I must have missed that :think:
Post by: captain spaulding on January 21, 2015, 12:50:39 AM
Post by: NKlamerus on January 21, 2015, 12:52:47 AM
This link. Last page120 BUCKS FOR THE SIGNAL?!?!? Really? That's stupid priced.
Where did that come from? I must have missed that :think:
http://issuu.com/shotbusiness/docs/shot_da1_4-nssf (http://issuu.com/shotbusiness/docs/shot_da1_4-nssf)
Last page has an article of the new offerings from Leatherman. Sounds like the "wearable tool" is a Bracelet in addition the Watch. Also, the Signal has a knife sharpener, not a dedicated file. No pics that I saw, though.
Post by: enki_ck on January 21, 2015, 12:59:06 AM
This link. Last page120 BUCKS FOR THE SIGNAL?!?!? Really? That's stupid priced.
Where did that come from? I must have missed that :think:http://issuu.com/shotbusiness/docs/shot_da1_4-nssf
Last page has an article of the new offerings from Leatherman. Sounds like the "wearable tool" is a Bracelet in addition the Watch. Also, the Signal has a knife sharpener, not a dedicated file. No pics that I saw, though.
It's the MSRP so it'll be 60-70% of it once it hits the online sellers, so around $75.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 21, 2015, 12:59:44 AM
EDIT: Cheers for the snippet mate :cheers:
Post by: NKlamerus on January 21, 2015, 01:00:20 AM
Where did you find that percentage?This link. Last page120 BUCKS FOR THE SIGNAL?!?!? Really? That's stupid priced.
Where did that come from? I must have missed that :think:http://issuu.com/shotbusiness/docs/shot_da1_4-nssf (http://issuu.com/shotbusiness/docs/shot_da1_4-nssf)
Last page has an article of the new offerings from Leatherman. Sounds like the "wearable tool" is a Bracelet in addition the Watch. Also, the Signal has a knife sharpener, not a dedicated file. No pics that I saw, though.
It's the MSRP so it'll be 60-70% of it once it hits the online sellers, so around $75.
Post by: Gareth on January 21, 2015, 01:01:55 AM
I thought about replacing my trusty Wave with a skeletool to save some weight, but it was to small for my taste. Then I wanted to replace it with a MUT (because I just love how it looks) but its far too big and too heavy for my front pocket. Now if theres a black oxide version of the Signal I will happily throw money at leatherman and remove the yellow packing insert before giving the Signal a new home in my front pocket ...
That's a point I was going to make as well. I like the Wave well enough, but if the Signal is significantly lighter then I'd see that as a bonus. :)
Post by: enki_ck on January 21, 2015, 01:02:24 AM
Bah, that's link's not working well on my PC. I guess I'll have to wait to see what really happens :whistle:
Check my last post. There's a screen cap of the article regarding pricing. ;)
Where did you find that percentage?
It's the MSRP so it'll be 60-70% of it once it hits the online sellers, so around $75.
Experience. :D It's the game the manufacturers and dealers play.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 21, 2015, 01:03:09 AM
Post by: tosh on January 21, 2015, 01:04:16 AM
Post by: enki_ck on January 21, 2015, 01:04:54 AM
What's SRP? I'm familiar with RRP and MAP, but my brain won't connect with what SRP is ::)
MSRP = Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price
So ... SRP = Suggested Retail Price
Post by: Kampfer on January 21, 2015, 01:09:57 AM
Post by: bounding star on January 21, 2015, 01:10:42 AM
Edit: Boring
Post by: genevabuck on January 21, 2015, 01:12:50 AM
Post by: tosh on January 21, 2015, 01:14:31 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTuHnXbep5w
Cheers Kampfer
:tu:
Must say it looks massive!!
Post by: enki_ck on January 21, 2015, 01:15:01 AM
Whoa, whooah, holdy the horsies, whats this.... Leatherman Rev?http://forum.multitool.org/index.php?topic=51868.0
Post by: Kampfer on January 21, 2015, 01:15:12 AM
I need to know its weight. I hope it has 3" blade.
Post by: NKlamerus on January 21, 2015, 01:15:31 AM
So the File is fold out, the sharpener is pop-out.
My main question, who are the people requesting this? She mentioned this was requested??
Post by: captain spaulding on January 21, 2015, 01:15:45 AM
Post by: NKlamerus on January 21, 2015, 01:16:06 AM
Post by: captain spaulding on January 21, 2015, 01:16:27 AM
Wow. The forum is ALIVE tonight!
So the File is fold out, the sharpener is pop-out.
My main question, who are the people requesting this? She mentioned this was requested??
I believe they talked with outdoor survival guides for this one. ::)
Post by: Kampfer on January 21, 2015, 01:16:57 AM
???
So the File is fold out,
Post by: NKlamerus on January 21, 2015, 01:17:06 AM
I'm still semi okay with it.
IMAGINE ALL THE ROOM WE CAN PLAY WITH WHEN THE WHISTLE AND SHARPENER ARE REMOVED.
Post by: enki_ck on January 21, 2015, 01:18:18 AM
But the Rev MSRP is 18? So it'll be 10 buck?Nope Msrp is $37.
Post by: Gareth on January 21, 2015, 01:22:36 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTuHnXbep5w
Cheers Kampfer
:tu:
Must say it looks massive!!
I just watched the REV video as well and, assuming it's the same size as a Wingman, I think the woman has really small hands. Makes it had to work out how big this actually is I think. I know I'm hoping it's a 4" frame rather than anything bigger.
Post by: Kampfer on January 21, 2015, 01:22:49 AM
Post by: genevabuck on January 21, 2015, 01:23:06 AM
Wow. The forum is ALIVE tonight!
So the File is fold out, the sharpener is pop-out.
My main question, who are the people requesting this? She mentioned this was requested??
Survivalists. This set up has been wanted bad by many. If I didn't own so many Leathermans I would jump.
Post by: NKlamerus on January 21, 2015, 01:24:19 AM
I promise from here on forth that if I ever work for leatherman.....this forum will be one of the best places for inspiration, atleast in a few tools.
Post by: enki_ck on January 21, 2015, 01:28:35 AM
This is a good mockup I think.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTuHnXbep5w (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTuHnXbep5w)
Cheers Kampfer
:tu:
Must say it looks massive!!
I just watched the REV video as well and, assuming it's the same size as a Wingman, I think the woman has really small hands. Makes it had to work out how big this actually is I think. I know I'm hoping it's a 4" frame rather than anything bigger.
Size comparison:
(http://i.imgur.com/mTuIFHH.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/GHJUozT.jpg)
Post by: tosh on January 21, 2015, 01:29:03 AM
Post by: NKlamerus on January 21, 2015, 01:31:10 AM
Post by: Kampfer on January 21, 2015, 01:32:14 AM
Based on my observation:I was right, the whistle took most space in the handle.
There won't be any tools in the handle with hammer, see attached photo.
The red dash line is estimated outline of whistle, it is going to take up some space in handle.
Normally the front photos of Leatherman tools would have all the implements fanned out. In this case, diamond file is the only one that is not visible. :think: Maybe it is part of the handle, externally like Skeletool SX?
I was right about the pocket clip as well.
Me so smart. :D
(http://forum.multitool.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=54342.0;attach=138964;image)
(http://forum.multitool.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=54342.0;attach=138986;image)
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 21, 2015, 01:35:39 AM
That looks like a WIERD profile for a diamond sharpening rod. Why the crest? It doesn't fit any blade/saw profile. The ferro rod looks like it could be lost from the whistle (insecure), and of course there is the issue of the shavings contaminating the mouthpiece. Good commercial move/product, distinctly average tool. Good to hear it has a sheath to "catch" the bits that are liable to fall of while you're out and about. Pocket clip looks quite high riding though.
Overall .... meh ..... I expect a lot of enthusiasm on here and elsewhere, but the substance is moderate and this should sell in the stores for less than a Wave otherwise it's a ripoff. The having to extend the arm to use the driver/awl/opener is a deal breaker even if I liked the rest of it.
Great to see a new product which will market well for them, but a shame it's not something I can get on board with
Post by: Kampfer on January 21, 2015, 01:40:02 AM
Post by: Kampfer on January 21, 2015, 01:42:20 AM
Post by: Chako on January 21, 2015, 01:45:12 AM
Ah well, I guess I will have to get one. From what I see...not excited about it at all. Mind you, I will have to get one for the collection anyhow. Maybe by then, I will be able to buy one and not pester some good American friends to ask as a go between.
Post by: genevabuck on January 21, 2015, 01:46:27 AM
MSRP for Signal is $120, that is be about the same with a BO Surge. :-\
I would guess that eBay prices would rival the OHT or close.
Post by: Kampfer on January 21, 2015, 01:49:20 AM
Ah well, I guess I will have to get one. From what I see...not excited about it at all. Mind you, I will have to get one for the collection anyhow. Maybe by then, I will be able to buy one and not pester some good American friends to ask as a go between.Would you consider that as part of the Skeletool family?
Post by: Jand3rson86 on January 21, 2015, 01:52:53 AM
Post by: Chako on January 21, 2015, 01:54:07 AM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 21, 2015, 01:54:32 AM
Man, I'm gonna be spending some money at the Factory Store when this and tomorrow's announcement are finally released...
Do you get special discount for working there?
EDIT: I'm not angling for "favours" BTW, just wondered if you got looked after for being an employee :cheers:
Post by: NKlamerus on January 21, 2015, 02:01:04 AM
Post by: gadgetman7 on January 21, 2015, 02:34:35 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: JBW1 on January 21, 2015, 02:58:28 AM
Post by: gadgetman7 on January 21, 2015, 03:15:48 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: aussieman on January 21, 2015, 03:18:14 AM
(http://i.imgur.com/l4moF7r.jpg)
Post by: rdub934 on January 21, 2015, 03:25:30 AM
Post by: gadgetman7 on January 21, 2015, 03:26:05 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: babola on January 21, 2015, 03:36:18 AM
Beef up the frame on the flip side with a file and dedicated SE blade, change the existing CE blade to PE one, remove the sharpener, whistle and ferro rod, populate the current empty handle with standard Wave-like tool implements like flat screwdrivers and mini-scissors and voila. Not hard at all.
And you even get to keep the mini-hammer. :tu:
Post by: babola on January 21, 2015, 03:38:50 AM
Is it just me or is the knife blade considerably thicker/more robust than the Wave/Charge?
(http://i.imgur.com/l4moF7r.jpg)
I like the beefy look of that blade. It's true it looks very much like a smaller MUT blade, but from that frame capture it appears to be even thicker.
Post by: Yadda on January 21, 2015, 04:56:55 AM
Post by: Kampfer on January 21, 2015, 06:04:29 AM
Does anyone else notice that in the first photo, the hammer around the 1/4 Hex hole seems to be broken? It looks to me like its snapped across the hole and the broken part has been placed back next to the hammer for the photo. ???Not broken, it is a "step".
Post by: DazMechanical on January 21, 2015, 06:10:37 AM
Post by: captain spaulding on January 21, 2015, 06:35:25 AM
I was looking forward to this but now I've seen the pics and video I have no intention of buying one, they should have stuck with the MUT and tweaked it for bushcraft/ survival IMO. The whistle with built in Ferro rod and the sharpening stone just look stupid and cheap. I was hoping for a bit more...
My thoughts exactly.
Post by: Outback in Idaho on January 21, 2015, 07:27:18 AM
Have mixed feeling about this and it's weight seems to be just slightly lighter than the Surge. As my father always told me, "For every ounce you carry it will feel like a pound at the end of the day."
Dunno. $120, too steep for limited features. An Exotac nanoStriker (http://www.exotac.com/nanoSTRIKER) could be carried easily. The file, can see a weak spot already.
Post by: DazMechanical on January 21, 2015, 08:36:30 AM
Post by: hellsing on January 21, 2015, 08:49:05 AM
No pry bar?! I love them when I do camping.
Well I guess I will buy it, but was wondering something mut based.
Post by: babola on January 21, 2015, 09:42:22 AM
No pry bar?! I love them when I do camping.
If I ever do get one, a modified pry bar will be one of my first mods on it. The unused and barren other side of the frame is a godsend for adding custom implements ;)
The only limit will be your imagination. Leatherman has given us a half-arsed, half finished tool which could, but didn't...so let's add our own touch to it and finish it off for them! :salute:
Post by: hiraethus on January 21, 2015, 09:46:51 AM
Post by: Lichtbote on January 21, 2015, 10:58:19 AM
Reminds me of the old saying " Jack of all trades, master of none "
Well, that suits for all MTs.
Dedicated tools are always better. MTs are always more or less a pure compromise.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 21, 2015, 11:24:08 AM
No pry bar?! I love them when I do camping.
If I ever do get one, a modified pry bar will be one of my first mods on it. The unused and barren other side of the frame is a godsend for adding custom implements ;)
The only limit will be your imagination. Leatherman has given us a half-arsed, half finished tool which could, but didn't...so let's add our own touch to it and finish it off for them! :salute:
That means paying them for the tool as it stands ... :think: Nah, I'm out :D
Post by: derekmac on January 21, 2015, 12:28:08 PM
I hope somebody at Leatherman is reading this... But probably not...If they are, they're probably thinking "What do these guys know anyways?" :facepalm:
I REALLY wanted to see a civilian MUT, and this is close, but they shouldn't have added the whistle/fero rod, or at least not in the way that they did.
Post by: Chako on January 21, 2015, 12:41:06 PM
Pros:
- Based on the Skeletool platform
- If that knife blade is that thick, are they thinking about it being used for batoning?
- Does carry over the hammer function, which is always nice.
- Inclusion of removable diamond sharpener is kind of cool. This is needed if you plan to use it on your tool's knife blade.
- Removable whistle is also kind of cool.
- Ferro rod rotates...that is a neat little attention to detail.
Cons:
- Appears to have a limited set of tools.
- Inclusion of whistle with ferro rod a very bad idea. Yes, you can scrape at the rod, but is there enough of the whistle projecting past the rod that if you do a full stroke, you risk cutting into your whistle mouth piece? Not to mention I don't like the taste of ferro rod with my whistle.
- location of ferro rod in middle of the tool a bad idea, as it makes it harder to use the rod while it is still attached to the tool.
- No small compartment that would contain a small fishing kit and first aid...much like those Rambo knives, would be very nice.
- No inclusion of a small button compass.
- What ever happened to that neat hook groove found in the PSTII? Why is there non on that diamond file?
- Removable bits can always be lost. Build that whistle into the tool is a better solution than having it slide in or out, even though it will probably lock in.
Now all of this is open to conjecture and preliminary personal opinion, as I don't have an actual tool...obviously. I am basing this just on photos and a video.
Post by: BIG-TARGET on January 21, 2015, 12:52:20 PM
1- When will it be for sale?
2- How much?
3- Will it be sold at the Marlton NJ REI?
I will not deny the fact. I would like to get one and spend a few days in the Jersey Pine Barrens with it :gimme: :tu:
Post by: DazMechanical on January 21, 2015, 12:56:49 PM
Post by: Higgins617 on January 21, 2015, 01:05:21 PM
Well from what I have seen this is my opinion.
Pros:
- Based on the Skeletool platform
- If that knife blade is that thick, are they thinking about it being used for batoning?
- Does carry over the hammer function, which is always nice.
- Inclusion of removable diamond sharpener is kind of cool. This is needed if you plan to use it on your tool's knife blade.
- Removable whistle is also kind of cool.
- Ferro rod rotates...that is a neat little attention to detail.
Cons:
- Appears to have a limited set of tools.
- Inclusion of whistle with ferro rod a very bad idea. Yes, you can scrape at the rod, but is there enough of the whistle projecting past the rod that if you do a full stroke, you risk cutting into your whistle mouth piece? Not to mention I don't like the taste of ferro rod with my whistle.
- location of ferro rod in middle of the tool a bad idea, as it makes it harder to use the rod while it is still attached to the tool.
- No small compartment that would contain a small fishing kit and first aid...much like those Rambo knives, would be very nice.
- No inclusion of a small button compass.
- What ever happened to that neat hook groove found in the PSTII? Why is there non on that diamond file?
- Removable bits can always be lost. Build that whistle into the tool is a better solution than having it slide in or out, even though it will probably lock in.
Now all of this is open to conjecture and preliminary personal opinion, as I don't have an actual tool...obviously. I am basing this just on photos and a video.
Have we seen the file off the tool yet? Could the other side possibly be flat and have the hook groove?
Post by: hellsing on January 21, 2015, 01:38:45 PM
Post by: gadgetman7 on January 21, 2015, 01:44:31 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: gadgetman7 on January 21, 2015, 01:59:29 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: rescue4500 on January 21, 2015, 02:48:30 PM
Post by: @beergrylls on January 21, 2015, 03:47:50 PM
Post by: JAfromMn on January 21, 2015, 03:54:34 PM
:(
I was hoping it would be under 100.00
Post by: Metropolicity on January 21, 2015, 04:22:32 PM
Post by: derekmac on January 21, 2015, 04:43:16 PM
Looking forward to see more of this. The potential is high!!!See, all we need is modders like you to make it the way it should have been made in the first place! :tu:
Post by: Metropolicity on January 21, 2015, 04:50:34 PM
Looking forward to see more of this. The potential is high!!!See, all we need is modders like you to make it the way it should have been made in the first place! :tu:
I was sticking stuff on the sides of multis a long time ago, bout time they did something.
I think it'll be a great spot for some T&T action.
Post by: rescue4500 on January 21, 2015, 05:15:21 PM
Post by: Breezy12 on January 21, 2015, 05:55:01 PM
Looking forward to see more of this. The potential is high!!!See, all we need is modders like you to make it the way it should have been made in the first place! :tu:
I was sticking stuff on the sides of multis a long time ago, bout time they did something.
I think it'll be a great spot for some T&T action.
can't wait to see what you come up with! :cheers:
Post by: Crow on January 21, 2015, 07:54:37 PM
Some good info on release, and new pic.
Post by: Kampfer on January 21, 2015, 07:57:14 PM
http://toolguyd.com/leatherman-signal-multi-tool/(http://toolguyd.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Leatherman-Signal-Multi-Tool-Closed.jpg)
Some good info on release, and new pic.
Post by: Kampfer on January 21, 2015, 10:11:47 PM
(http://www.alloutdoor.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/n12Izgr6g8zqd034-660x451.jpg)
(http://www.alloutdoor.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/I1o58t85bAX7Q1EJ-495x660.jpg)
(http://www.alloutdoor.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/8529kf6bDrR3u2mG-495x660.jpg)
Post by: Kampfer on January 21, 2015, 10:14:42 PM
(http://www.worldwidesurvival.com/attachment.php?s=6388b244ffc310face50da8d6b7ef1d7&attachmentid=243&d=1421792309)
(http://www.worldwidesurvival.com/attachment.php?s=6388b244ffc310face50da8d6b7ef1d7&attachmentid=244&d=1421792312)
(http://www.worldwidesurvival.com/attachment.php?s=6388b244ffc310face50da8d6b7ef1d7&attachmentid=246&d=1421792322)
Post by: Etherealicer on January 21, 2015, 10:15:57 PM
Post by: rescue4500 on January 21, 2015, 10:26:13 PM
Post by: lxbatty on January 21, 2015, 11:04:52 PM
I would like to see the tools out. Hope there are soon some more detailed photos soon.
some higher resolution pics here:
http://leathermanlibrary.com/thumbnails.php?album=186
Post by: Grant Lamontagne on January 21, 2015, 11:14:31 PM
So.... $120 and it comes with a 420 steel blade, which is something they thought about and did so that people could sharpen it easily in the field. Ok, that makes sense, after all, who carries a diamond file into the woods?
Oh wait, it comes with that too?
Sounds like they had two different departments working on this one, and the two were never allowed to communicate.
(http://leathermanlibrary.com/albums/userpics/10001/Signal_Ad_1%7E0.png)
It seems safe to assume this is the size of the MUT, which seems like an awful lot of tool to drag along and not have everything you might need. I hope street price is well below the $120 MSRP, but then that shouldn't be a problem as the MUT and Charge TTi MSRP are both in that neighborhood and beyond.
I'm looking forward to giving it a shot though. So far I'm not optimistic, but I have been wrong before.
Def
Post by: JAfromMn on January 21, 2015, 11:47:38 PM
Quote from: Grant Lamontagne link
=topic=54342.msg1028182#msg1028182 date=1421878471
=topic=54342.msg1028182#msg1028182 date=1421878471
This is why there really needs to be multitool people at SHOT.... :twak: :twak: :twak:
So.... $120 and it comes with a 420 steel blade, which is something they thought about and did so that people could sharpen it easily in the field. Ok, that makes sense, after all, who carries a diamond file into the woods?
Oh wait, it comes with that too?
Sounds like they had two different departments working on this one, and the two were never allowed to communicate.
(http://leathermanlibrary.com/albums/userpics/10001/Signal_Ad_1%7E0.png)
It seems safe to assume this is the size of the MUT, which seems like an awful lot of tool to drag along and not have everything you might need. I hope street price is well below the $120 MSRP, but then that shouldn't be a problem as the MUT and Charge TTi MSRP are both in that neighborhood and beyond.
I'm looking forward to giving it a shot though. So far I'm not optimistic, but I have been wrong before.
Def
I'm trying to talk my Mrs into going to the blade show in Atlanta this June.
Post by: genevabuck on January 22, 2015, 12:30:33 AM
1. Leatherman does watch and listen to this forum.
2. A survival tool with these features was requested by posters here for years.
3. Your average Leatherman buyer isn't a collector.
4. Leatherman, like any company, needs to sell to a mass audience and sell lots of tools.
5. If Leatherman only catered to the micro needs of this forum they would be out of business.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 22, 2015, 12:45:47 AM
A lot of complaints here. But:
1. Leatherman does watch and listen to this forum.
2. A survival tool with these features was requested by posters here for years.
3. Your average Leatherman buyer isn't a collector.
4. Leatherman, like any company, needs to sell to a mass audience and sell lots of tools.
5. If Leatherman only catered to the micro needs of this forum they would be out of business.
100% agree on all points :tu:
Post by: aussieman on January 22, 2015, 12:52:06 AM
Ideally weight with and without the sharpener and whistle/striker. :D
Post by: Griffster on January 22, 2015, 12:52:55 AM
Does anyone else notice that in the first photo, the hammer around the 1/4 Hex hole seems to be broken? It looks to me like its snapped across the hole and the broken part has been placed back next to the hammer for the photo. ???Not broken, it is a "step".
Thanks. Yep. I saw that too. I think it's stepped on one side and plain on the other, which could lead one to think it might've been broken in that photo. :)
I do like it, both as a tool and a concept. Except for one thing. The tool count seems to be low for something with that price tag. To echo others, why not carry your fave MT - Wave, Charge, Surge etc, and a decent whistle plus a fire steel? Ok, the sharpener is cool.
Post by: Gareth on January 22, 2015, 12:53:56 AM
Post by: Griffster on January 22, 2015, 12:56:28 AM
Post by: genevabuck on January 22, 2015, 12:59:01 AM
It's worth noting that the mouthpiece of the whistle isn't where a lot of us have been assuming it is. :whistle:
Where is it?
Post by: JAfromMn on January 22, 2015, 12:59:32 AM
I think I still want one though. :multi:Smurf yeah
I still want one too.
Post by: Gareth on January 22, 2015, 01:03:52 AM
It's worth noting that the mouthpiece of the whistle isn't where a lot of us have been assuming it is. :whistle:
Where is it?
Have a look at the picture library and you can see the mouthpiece is at the 'fat' end of the plastic rather than the 'thin'. Seems odd, but it does at least mean you'll be striking sparks away from the part where your lips go. :)
I would like to see the tools out. Hope there are soon some more detailed photos soon.
some higher resolution pics here:
http://leathermanlibrary.com/thumbnails.php?album=186
Post by: genevabuck on January 22, 2015, 01:10:53 AM
It's worth noting that the mouthpiece of the whistle isn't where a lot of us have been assuming it is. :whistle:
Where is it?
Have a look at the picture library and you can see the mouthpiece is at the 'fat' end of the plastic rather than the 'thin'. Seems odd, but it does at least mean you'll be striking sparks away from the part where your lips go. :)
''I would like to see the tools out. Hope there are soon some more detailed photos soon.
some higher resolution pics here:
http://leathermanlibrary.com/thumbnails.php?album=186
Weird. Leatherman usually does a better job at detailing these SHOT videos. They need Juli back.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 22, 2015, 01:14:44 AM
Post by: Gareth on January 22, 2015, 01:19:20 AM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 22, 2015, 01:22:56 AM
Post by: Higgins617 on January 22, 2015, 01:24:39 AM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 22, 2015, 01:36:04 AM
Whistle is more like a fell off the trail and broke my leg please find me sort of thing right?
Yep :tu: so if you ever do need one, you might be using it for hours or even days depending on where you are and who's around
Post by: Kampfer on January 22, 2015, 02:00:24 AM
.... but that's a good thing isn't it ... :PWe are glad you never needed one.:tu:
If it it is light like feather, might be a good idea to have around just in case.
Post by: JAfromMn on January 22, 2015, 03:21:50 AM
It looks small. Hard to hold. Hard to use maybe.
I wonder how it fits the combo edge.
It looks kinds course.
Post by: JAfromMn on January 22, 2015, 04:48:32 AM
File pic.
Post by: BASguy on January 22, 2015, 05:04:59 AM
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: Kampfer on January 22, 2015, 05:27:38 AM
Post by: captain spaulding on January 22, 2015, 05:39:48 AM
Post by: DazMechanical on January 22, 2015, 06:23:06 AM
The more I see it the more I dislike it. I assume for some it might be great, but for 80% of the market they could care less about the cheap looking whistle, striker, and file for sharpening. Those things alone ruin the tool for me completely and I would personally never buy one. Just my opinion though.
+1 :tu:
Post by: JAfromMn on January 22, 2015, 06:38:39 AM
I'm not sold on the removable tools . There not very useful to me I normally have them on me. :think: but if I think of them as back ups they should work for me if I ever need them.
Post by: dks on January 22, 2015, 09:11:37 AM
Post by: gadgetman7 on January 22, 2015, 11:31:54 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Mr Biriyani on January 22, 2015, 11:46:03 AM
I was against usining plastic on the fuse line but now afterwards it turned out to hold up very well. Maybe it´s the same kind of plastic.(eventhough not using plastic is optimal in my book)
I'm just thinking about this and I honestly can't think of a time I've ever needed to blow an emergency whistle, and I've been enjoying the great outdoors for more than 25 years.I actually had to use one ones while mountainbiking and if that whistle would have tasted a little from the ferro rod I would not have mind. I was glad I had one. It´s just that. You use it ones or hopefully never. If you use a whistle a lot of some reason I guess you have one dedicated around your neck. Using the side to place some extra tools seems like a good idea.
My concern now that I saw the latest video is that i steals to much space.It takes up the full space in one handle where there could be other tools. I realize it´s on the hammer side which complicates it.(don´t have a MUT to compare to)
I´m sure they could have solved it in better way. Maybe in the pouch as someone suggested. But I see their point of having it all in the tool.
Also like the hammer I´v hold my Surge many times thinking "It´s heavy enough to use a small hammer device" but not finding any side of it I´m willing to bash up.
It´s not perfect but I see it can fit a role for me. I will get it eventually as the new models of Leatherman usually are quite expensive over here.
Post by: GPDB on January 22, 2015, 02:31:09 PM
Post by: TheDude on January 22, 2015, 03:07:19 PM
Post by: RT1969 on January 22, 2015, 03:35:22 PM
First a thank you to all the posters that keep us up to date here! :tu:
My thoughts so far:
The Good:
- Beefy Blade (I am not quite sure if it is intended for batoning, but I think a HC Steel might be better for this than powdermetallurgic steel (154cm / S35V LM uses otherwise) - I think LM intended the blade to be rather ductile than brittle, to avoid shattering/outbreaks. More so, that edge retention is a no-issue due to the file)
- Wood saw (I saw no complains on that! :D )
- Pliers This seems to be the new standard plier head, no complains here
- Removable Tools (I like the idea of the integrated sharpener/file. And also the addition of the firestarter rod. As this needs a handle anyway, I quite like the inclusion of the emergency whistle. Better to have and not need... comes to mind.)
- Hammer Head (I think this will be useful for a lot of tasks, I like it)
Indifferent:
- The carabiner. Meh, I don't need it. Bottle opner is nice, though.
- Pocket clip.
The Bad:
- Bit holder: I don't get it. There aren't a lot of screws in the woods, and if it would have been a fixed flathead, you could at least pry with it. Good look prying with a bit...
-The inside tools. Why? Why include tools, that you are barely able to use? Who wants to turn a screw with the pliers folded out? Or use the underwhelming awl? This features seem to collide with the hammer bit. I am unsure how to solve this dilemma.
- the yellow Plastic parts. I am not sure, how robust they turn out to be. also how long the firesteel will rotate before breaking free.
- The hexhole in the hammer. There is already a freacking bit driver on the tool! Why weaken the part expecting the most impact? I don't see any use for it on this tool!
- CE Main Blade. Ughh.. PE would have been so much better. The way it is, forget effective batoning, detailed work, easy sharpening... :facepalm:
What I would improve:
- Make the Blade Plain Edge
- Widen the tool, so that there can be 2 large tools analogue to knife and saw on the other side.
* The PE Knife counterpart will be a combination rescue cutter/guthook and Serrated edge blade, like on the Eickhorn RTI: http://www.eickhorn-solingen.de/epages/62631327.sf/de_DE/?ObjectPath=/Shops/62631327/Products/820106 (I hope you can access this from outside Germany without hassle)
* on the saw side: A large marlin spike, kinda like the Victorinox alox one. Nearly the same as they did on the MUT EOT with the C4 Punch. I would rate this much more useful than the little awl w Sewing eye.
- I am not sure how, but make the handle tools usable with the handles folded together. Maybe let them rotate 45°more, so that the hammer will lock them when closed? I hope this 'drawing' helps:
_________/c ___
_______/can opener// ]
_handle__________// ]
_other_handle__Hammer_]
What are your thoughts on my rambling?
Thanks for reading so far! :salute:
Post by: Etherealicer on January 22, 2015, 03:54:36 PM
Its pretty much my thoughts. I always find bit-holders for the outdoors weird (the same goes for a can opener).
Another concern of mine is the plastic holding the firestarter rod. I mean every spark hitting the plastic will damage it. But I also have to admit, I'm starting to like the idea of the tool. There are flaws and it would need modding, but I can see potential. Also I think its looking quite good.
Post by: TheDude on January 22, 2015, 03:55:48 PM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 22, 2015, 04:28:02 PM
Is it 100% made in the USA?
Is any Leatherman these days?
@RT ... personally I wouldn't make it fatter and would find the serrated blade and gut hook superfluous. Just one example of how we all have different perceptions, and therefore how the manufacturers can't please everyone. No matter what they produce, there'll always be people complaining it's got X instead of Y, wrons size/wrong shape etc ....
From a purely commercial perspective, I do think Leatherman have approached this product well. It's not my ideal tool, but I'd imagine it will sell very well indeed and will catch the imagination of a lot of people. It could be argued that the bit driver might help effect a repair of a vehicle or equipment which prevents the "survival situation" from taking place at all. Prevention is better than cure, and not everyone enjoys the outdoors purely on foot.
Post by: rescue4500 on January 22, 2015, 04:43:11 PM
Post by: Aloha on January 22, 2015, 04:49:03 PM
Post by: Lichtbote on January 22, 2015, 05:29:37 PM
And funnily around 90% of the complaining people seem to use tools i would consider mostly useless or bad. That shows how different peoples pov can be, depending on their own needs and uses. :think:
Of course i base the worth of a tool on my needs, and there is no need for any small tools, esspecially not for those that are small and cramped with a lot of tiny fuzzy tools. I prefer less but bigger tools over a lot but tiny ..... every day.
Without being at the point i´m now, with my Surge for mechanical tasks and the OHT for light outdoor tasks ...... so without having those and being a MT-beginner, i would buy it (not for 120, but you get what i mean).
With some slighly modding to ones personal preferencies i can imagine it as a good allrounder. Maybe not for the overeducated MT-crowd here ;) , but for the general consumer out there.
But granted - the 120 bucks pricetag is hard to swallow - i don´t want to now what price they will ask for it here.
Post by: GPDB on January 22, 2015, 05:40:51 PM
Post by: lowtech on January 22, 2015, 06:22:06 PM
@lowtech: get well soon. :drink: *cough medicine*
This one made me :think: although my son had a fever for the last 3 days. I´ll extend your wishes his way.
I am indifferent about the signal and will wait until we see pics and read hands on reviews here.
Post by: Etherealicer on January 22, 2015, 06:35:36 PM
:whistle:@RT: get well soon. :drink: *cough medicine*
This one made me :think: although my son had a fever for the last 3 days. I´ll extend your wishes his way.
I am indifferent about the signal and will wait until we see pics and read hands on reviews here.
Post by: tosh on January 22, 2015, 07:11:25 PM
But, I do think that a vast majority here will probably buy this. LM, are I'm sure aware that this model isn't without flaws. But releasing now gives us all a taster and at the same time allows LM to recoup some of their investment and take the Signal to the next level (but not for at least 2-3yrs :whistle:), where once again we'll all mump and moan....but still buy it. :facepalm:
I'm beginning to think I'm a mug!! I'm going to buy something that I don't really want, don't really like and will never use, but don't want to be left out either.
Clever Leatherman.... :clap: :clap: :clap:
Post by: comis on January 22, 2015, 07:25:02 PM
Only few more wishes, please consider and answer:
1) Plain edge. Serrated edge may take longer time to sharpen, also for advertising sake, look at all these 'survival personalities' on TV, I don't ever remember seeing one use a serrated blade)
2) Please consider anodized the whole thing in bright orange or even just plain silver, yellow/black color scheme is sincerely awesome, but who wants to look for a black survival tool in the dark?
3) Can we lose the carabiner since it's extra weight and it won't take much force as a 'hammer' anyway? What's the chance to put in a led light there instead?
4) Please do be so kind to look into what kind of coarseness is best for outdoor sharpening. Too fine may take longer, but too coarse is impossible to hone.
5) Much lighter weight and shorter dimension (probably too late now...but maybe Christmas or 2016?)
Leatherman, thank you for making this tool. I see the cutouts to lighten the weight, removable ferro rod/sharpener, while keeping at least 1 tool adapter to cover the MT ground...it is a great effort, and I look forward to this tool!
Post by: Kampfer on January 22, 2015, 07:34:46 PM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 22, 2015, 07:44:36 PM
Despite all the complains, I think this is still a good attempt, at least it looks better suited for outdoor survival than the Les Stroud survival tool or BG stuff.
Only few more wishes, please consider and answer:
1) Plain edge. Serrated edge may take longer time to sharpen, also for advertising sake, look at all these 'survival personalities' on TV, I don't ever remember seeing one use a serrated blade)
2) Please consider anodized the whole thing in bright orange or even just plain silver, yellow/black color scheme is sincerely awesome, but who wants to look for a black survival tool in the dark?
3) Can we lose the carabiner since it's extra weight and it won't take much force as a 'hammer' anyway? What's the chance to put in a led light there instead?
4) Please do be so kind to look into what kind of coarseness is best for outdoor sharpening. Too fine may take longer, but too coarse is impossible to hone.
5) Much lighter weight and shorter dimension (probably too late now...but maybe Christmas or 2016?)
Leatherman, thank you for making this tool. I see the cutouts to lighten the weight, removable ferro rod/sharpener, while keeping at least 1 tool adapter to cover the MT ground...it is a great effort, and I look forward to this tool!
Working through your comments, comis ...
I'd agree this is massiveley better than the Les Stroud/Camillus offering ... but then so is a damp tissue, although I'm not sure I agree on the BG Strata ... Suspension, Yes - Strata kit, possibly not (personal opinion)
Plain edged knife. I would like to think that anyone who has enough knowledge skills and forethough to take this (or any multitool) out into the big outdoors for just in case, has also got a fixed blade knife. If they've not got an outdoors insight, what do they expect this tool to achieve for them? Batonning and other heavy tasks aren't really ideal for folders anyway, so a fixed bladed knife (at the least) should be at the top of eveyone's packing list. As such having this multitool with (partial) serrations comfortably handles all the fibrous tasks which plain edge knives aren't as good as
Tool visibility. I can't argue with that at all. I also think the whistle should have a lanyard attachment point
Hammer. They've done this because people have been harping on about wanting a MUT style hammer on a Wave sized tool ever since the MUT first appeared. Now they give us one, we complain that it makes the drivers and other tools awkward :D A case of "Be careful what you wish for" ;)
Sharpener coarseness. Hmmm ... again, it depends what you are cutting. This blade steel is less likely to chip (if handled correctly) than other more brittle steels, which means you can get away with a finer sharpening grit. However, if we consider this as the "partner" to a plain edged fixed blade, the toothy bite a coarser sharpener will give could be very useful
Weight/Size. Too late, plus you risk shortening the blade and saw below a sensible length. I wish they'd reduce the handle splay (on everything they make), but I think they made the right choice for the knife and saw.
Post by: babola on January 22, 2015, 07:47:03 PM
Carabiner is fine especially for quick attachment to packs and such. I have no problem with the whistle or the fire striker and really dig the hammer aspect.
Same thoughts here, Aloha. :) Although I'd like to see that sharpener having a more rigid type attachment to the frame, looking at one of those videos it appears it only requires a slight push to release.
But, I do think that a vast majority here will probably buy this.
Agree. I most likely will, too. I did the same with the Skeletool, didn't know what to think of it until I bought one - and ended up loving it :)
If nothing then I'll get the Signal for the fiddle and curiosity factor and if it doesn't do it for me it will end up on our local auction site. LM tools sell well in NZ and Australia (especially in Australia, which is according to LM their largest export market).
Strange - the more i read the complains in this thread ........ the more this tool grows on me. :D That i like the overall look surely helps.
Again, agree. We need to accept this tool not as a MacGyver 'one-tool-for-all' type of tool like Wave, for example. This tool is built on the idea less-is-more, as a dedicated outdoor/survival tool, not a 'toolbox in your pack', so to speak. It's tool load is minimal and focused on the tasks and situations you may find yourself in while out and about. And as such, it meets the intended designation IMO, at least on paper so far. I will again draw a parallel with the Skeletool, a dedicated simple, lightweight EDC tool.
Time will show though, how usable the fire striker, sharpener and the poxy little plastic whistle are in the real 'survival' situation.
In an actually survival situation this tool would be very handy.. The saw knife and pliers are a no brainer obviously.. as far as the awl ive used the one on my rebar a few times as a stricker for flint it works very well.. I see the can opener as more of a camper tool but once again ive used it many times before while hiking for different tasks.. and I like the bit driver so you can have two separate screwdrivers.. plus if you have the extension and leatherman bit kit you've just added another 20 or so tools to it.. As far as the hammer goes it would be great for tent stakes or even busting acorns to eat if you were surviving... all in all I like this tool and can not wait to purchase one... this is just my opinion! :multi:
Well said. I also don't see much use in that crippled awl, but as a striker for the ferrorod I'd rather use it than the saw Leatherman uses in their video. I intend to mod the awl into something usable anyway, so time will tell. Can opener - many have expressed their disgust again but I want it on my tool out there - granted, use of canned food these days when pretty much all food you'd take with you outdoors is foil packed is debatable but I still want it and the wire stripper at the base can be used for cutting other things if needed.
Yes, I do want the bit extender. As Al already mentioned - not all outdoor trips are on foot and many people use mechanical devices out there which come with screws. A single phillips and/or flat tip is pretty much all you need, and LM has included it. Good on them.
The 1/4 hex bit hole in the hammer is for people who carry standard 1/4 bits and don't own LM 2.5D bit set.
Post by: rdub934 on January 22, 2015, 07:48:23 PM
I suppose you all are more excited for the Tread and Rev, right, and can't spare anymore praise for the Signal?
Post by: babola on January 22, 2015, 07:51:00 PM
Wow, a lot of negative reaction to this thing...
Not at all. At least not all of us.
I for one take it for what it is, and I'm quite fond of it actually. 8)
Post by: Kampfer on January 22, 2015, 08:00:04 PM
Post by: rdub934 on January 22, 2015, 08:05:01 PM
Wow, a lot of negative reaction to this thing...
Not at all. At least not all of us.
I for one take it for what it is, and I'm quite fond of it actually. 8)
Agree. I think it looks amaze-balls. Just surprised to see so many people picking it apart already. Seems like a great minimalistic tool, in the same vain as the Skeletool and MUT, with a slant towards the outdoor enthusiast. People complaining about only one handle having fold out tools - no room, the hammer is on the other side. People complaining about a combo blade - combo blades serve MULTIple purposes = more utility. People complaining about it only having two outside access tools - adding outside tools to the other side will make the thing FATTER and heavier meaning less friendly for backpackers. People don't like the whistle being on the fero-rod - it's an EMERGENCY whistle (meaning life or limb) and even state this in the video; it's not a toy. People don't like the bit driver - the bit driver eliminates the need for a dedicated philips, a dedicated medium flat, a dedicated small flat, etc.... They can't please everyone, so they are trying to please as many as they can.
GIVE IT A CHANCE PEOPLE, lol
Post by: babola on January 22, 2015, 08:05:39 PM
I am seeing Signal as downsized MUT (remove all the firearm related stuff and one size smaller pliers head), or a beefed up Skeletool (longer blade, add saw, hammer and awl), as long as it weight less than Wave, I would like it.
The only major downside for me is the price. It's way higher than the tool of this designation and complexity should be priced at, IMO. Wave for example should cost more than this tool, IMO. :think:
Even discounted pricing will hurt for quite a while from its release date. I bought a brand new Wave for $50 few weeks back, I don't see Signal falling to those or similar levels any time soon.
Post by: eamo on January 22, 2015, 08:15:17 PM
Post by: JPS_ on January 22, 2015, 08:51:40 PM
Post by: Etherealicer on January 22, 2015, 09:11:30 PM
[...]I totally agree with the first part. However, I personally feel that the bit-extender exactly tries to achieve this and by that compromises its primary goal as a dedicated outdoor/survival tool.
Again, agree. We need to accept this tool not as a MacGyver 'one-tool-for-all' type of tool like Wave, for example. This tool is built on the idea less-is-more, as a dedicated outdoor/survival tool, not a 'toolbox in your pack', so to speak.
[...]
Yes, I do want the bit extender. As Al already mentioned - not all outdoor trips are on foot and many people use mechanical devices out there which come with screws. A single phillips and/or flat tip is pretty much all you need, and LM has included it. Good on them.
The 1/4 hex bit hole in the hammer is for people who carry standard 1/4 bits and don't own LM 2.5D bit set.
Post by: babola on January 22, 2015, 09:57:50 PM
However, I personally feel that the bit-extender exactly tries to achieve this and by that compromises its primary goal as a dedicated outdoor/survival tool.
Hmm, I don't see it like that, sorry 8)
Post by: aussieman on January 22, 2015, 10:49:07 PM
If the Wave was perfect for everyone, and the only tool sold by Leatherman, the world would be a lot duller.
You can't find the perfect multitool for every situation, and that is part of the fun. It is fun to think of how you would improve this or that, or how could I possibly mod this into that. Creative people are going to be amazing modding this Signal.
I love thinking about design, and I love how you simply cannot have it all, without costs or compromises.
Most days are Charge TTi days. Some days are Skeletool days. Some days are even Gerber Dime days.
Outdoors, I can imagine lot of fun with this Signal. Beefier blade, and Stop.... Hammertime. :whistle:
Post by: RT1969 on January 22, 2015, 10:55:29 PM
:whistle:@RT: get well soon. :drink: *cough medicine*
This one made me :think: although my son had a fever for the last 3 days. I´ll extend your wishes his way.
I am indifferent about the signal and will wait until we see pics and read hands on reviews here.
Germans, eh? They all look the same. :whistle: :rofl:
Thank you none the less! :tu:
From what i can see, the missing portion of the hammer head is for letting the bit holder extend with the tool closed.
Now that would be really cool, Didn't think about the design this way.
Post by: Top-Gear-24 on January 22, 2015, 11:03:27 PM
With what I've seen so far, I think I'm going to pass on this one. The fire steel/whistle is not what I hoped it would be, I prefer a PE blade, I don't like the fact that it doesn't have scissors (I know that most of the time I'll have a SAK on me, but I wanted this one to be a tool that I could carry without carrying any other knife). I expected "the hammer" to be more like the one on the MUT, ...
On the other hand, in the past I said I would never buy an OHT, and what did I buy a month or two ago ... ::)
Oh who am I trying to fool ... ::)
Two days later and I'm already pretty sure that I'm going to fold the first time I see it at the local shop ...
Post by: rdub934 on January 22, 2015, 11:46:38 PM
From what i can see, the missing portion of the hammer head is for letting the bit holder extend with the tool closed.
From what i can see, the missing portion of the hammer head is for letting the bit holder extend with the tool closed.
I don't see a missing portion that would allow the use of the bit driver while the tool was closed. Can you explain what you mean?
Post by: JAfromMn on January 22, 2015, 11:59:05 PM
Now the hard part.
What to sell to fund my signal.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 23, 2015, 12:16:25 AM
Ok I'm sold.
Now the hard part.
What to sell to fund my signal.
Not the Fat Bike!!!! :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh
Post by: gadgetman7 on January 23, 2015, 01:31:43 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: BASguy on January 23, 2015, 03:12:56 AM
Bit holders suck.... Seriously. Removable parts in the intended environment of this tool is a bad idea. If your bringing in quads, etc. your packing a few real tools anyway, or you shouldn't be bringing that kind of equipment with you.
That awl bites..... Someone else mentioned the Victorinox marlin spike... +1 on that.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: BASguy on January 23, 2015, 03:28:16 AM
I just mention this understanding that YMMV based on your needs, and I find it hard to understand why Leatherman isn't offering more options for Tradesman instead of Snow Boarders...? How about a tool version with a few customizable options? People will pay a premium and wait for a "factory customized" configuration. I see a lot people seeing MT's as not the best tool for any application..... That attitude is not representative of a someone in the trades. The best tool is the one that resolves your issue properly and quickly. A customized MT can be the best tool every time some days. If Leatherman is never gonna go this route..... So be it. If that's the case, then maybe they should offer more options.
I personally retired my Wave as it is intended to be passed on to my grandson. I'm now carrying a Swiss Army knife..... Because Leatherman has nothing that really fits my needs......bummer.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: glorn on January 23, 2015, 05:48:36 AM
-shrug-
I think the "fire whistle" is ridiculous, but in terms of a "survival tool" (whatever the hell that is) it does make sense to have signaling and fire making capabilities integrated. All in all it seems to be a reasonable approach to a vague but trendy concept. As good as any really.
A true outdoorsperson would likely carry a smaller and more lightweight multi as well as a real fire kit and signaling gear. Probably a fixed blade as well.
Therefore, this is not for the person who spends a lot of time in the wild. And that is not "survival" anyway. I don't go survivaling on weekends. I do hike and camp though.
For an outdoor emergency kit..
As a "what if" daypack item..
This is where this makes sense.
As a daily carry tool? Meh.. Professionals maybe. Perhaps if you are in the search and rescue biz, are a wilderness park ranger, a bush pilot, etc. Those folks might use something like this as part of a basic kit or vehicle kit.
Me? I want to fiddle with it. Probably put it in my daypack lightweight kit.
Or.. I can pair it with an Explorer and feel really cool. I'll be a surviving explorer. And that sounds cool, right?
Post by: balvenie on January 23, 2015, 08:23:46 AM
Post by: GPDB on January 23, 2015, 10:01:15 AM
I don't see a missing portion that would allow the use of the bit driver while the tool was closed. Can you explain what you mean?
See attachment... The hammer head is not complete, it's shaped for letting the bit holder extend when closed (I think so...).
Post by: gadgetman7 on January 23, 2015, 11:24:06 AM
I don't see a missing portion that would allow the use of the bit driver while the tool was closed. Can you explain what you mean?
See attachment... The hammer head is not complete, it's shaped for letting the bit holder extend when closed (I think so...).
If it is it seems that you'd need the bit extender or the long bits to make it work properly. Otherwise, you'd have almost no reach.
I guess the thought is that you'd rarely use the screwdriver anyway.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: symphonyincminor on January 23, 2015, 03:06:28 PM
It looks like a well thought-out and quality tool, just not something your average multi-tool buyer would go for (Leatherman already has those bases covered with their current line-up). It's nice to see something new to the market, even if it doesn't appeal to me personally.
I'd feel more comfortable with a Core or Rebar or Surge if I was out in the woods, but that's just me.
Post by: Aloha on January 23, 2015, 03:45:09 PM
I'd also hope the retention of the file is very good it does seem very easily removed.
Comis you are so right about it being in a brighter color. I would not want to drop this tool and spend hours looking for it. I know we can tie a lanyard on it but a brightly colored tool would be a nice touch.
I don't have a problem with the minimalist tool set per se however I also feel this tool can be improved on with some customer feed back.
Leatherman I'd be happy to take on the challenge :pok:
Post by: Aloha on January 23, 2015, 03:59:10 PM
:pok: Leatherman IS listening MTO.
Post by: sawman on January 23, 2015, 05:33:24 PM
Post by: hellsing on January 23, 2015, 05:44:56 PM
The more pics I see of this thing the more I want one. Although, I'll probably wait a few months once it hits the shelves to make sure they get all the bugs worked out.As it come out in august, it not gonna be yours until next Christmas. Perfect gift!
I hope we can put a charge blade inside, the CE is not for me.
Post by: dan.mandiel on January 23, 2015, 08:07:06 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqxElE8pcTM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqxElE8pcTM)I didn't quite hear what they said that tey were listening to us..
:pok: Leatherman IS listening MTO.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: JAfromMn on January 23, 2015, 08:41:02 PM
it's beginning to dawn on me if I want the perfect leatherman tool. I'm going to have to make it.
kinda like my FrankenGerber.
Leatherman C.U.T.
Civilian. Utility. Tool.
Post by: English333 on January 23, 2015, 09:29:45 PM
Post by: Etherealicer on January 23, 2015, 09:30:16 PM
So before we get over-agitated about the serration we should remember this is not the final product and maybe hope we get PE (or why not both ::)).
Hope for a PE blade, maybe some change on the internal tools too :D
Post by: JAfromMn on January 23, 2015, 09:42:56 PM
Post by: Aloha on January 23, 2015, 09:58:21 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqxElE8pcTM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqxElE8pcTM)I didn't quite hear what they said that tey were listening to us..
:pok: Leatherman IS listening MTO.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
At about 5:00 to 5:06
Post by: hellsing on January 23, 2015, 10:10:45 PM
they are listening customers (like most company) not us in particular. And some customers want survival multitool. So here is the signal. Et voila!http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqxElE8pcTM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqxElE8pcTM)I didn't quite hear what they said that tey were listening to us..
:pok: Leatherman IS listening MTO.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
At about 5:00 to 5:06
Post by: Outback in Idaho on January 23, 2015, 11:40:57 PM
Would like to appeal to Leatherman on the main blade, keep it at 154CM and not 420/30 stainless steel. With that sharpening stone there are going to be lots of returns from people that don't know how to sharpen a knife or (like me) who are sharpening-challenged without something like a Crock Stick (http://www.amazon.com/Lansky-Sharpeners-LCKEY-Pocket-Sharpener/dp/B0001WP336) or Spyderco Tri-Angle SharpMaker (http://www.amazon.com/Spyderco-Tri-Angle-Sharpmaker/dp/B004HIZKHE).
Have seen how bad some knives get from poor sharpening skills with that basic stainless steel. Least with 154CM it's going to hold an edge longer, resist rust & the elements better, and will take a beating where 420/30 stainless won't last.
Can imagine the returns coming in on knife blades whittled down to mere pickle pokers, or worse. People will be breaking those worn blades just to get it replaced for free.
The rest of the tool looks okay from what I've seen. Would be curious on their choice of sheath, and whether the pocket clip can be reversed to keep the pliers on the bottom end.
Kitra said in this video the Signals it weighs 7 oz. : NEW Leatherman Signal SURVIVAL / Bushcraft Multi-Tool - SHOT Show 2015 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-o9d2O-1Gqs#ws)
Post by: Etherealicer on January 24, 2015, 12:24:16 AM
Post by: JAfromMn on January 24, 2015, 01:29:31 AM
Hmmm... in the latest video MSRP is down to 100$
Maybe they are watching. :tu:
Post by: JAfromMn on January 24, 2015, 01:38:40 AM
blade thoughts.
The more I see the blade the more I like it . It should be in a better steel.
I also like combo edge. It doesn't work well with small knives but the signal blade is big enough for it to cut like a beast.
I do prefer fully serrated or just plane edge but if it works good I like it.
Post by: genevabuck on January 24, 2015, 02:14:27 AM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 24, 2015, 02:31:29 AM
I can fart louder than that whistle. Buy a wave, a better sharpener, and a better fire steel and save $50. Plus have more tools.
:D :D
It's lighter than a couple of tins of beans though :P :whistle:
Post by: gadgetman7 on January 24, 2015, 03:06:18 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: rdub934 on January 24, 2015, 03:46:28 AM
I don't see a missing portion that would allow the use of the bit driver while the tool was closed. Can you explain what you mean?
See attachment... The hammer head is not complete, it's shaped for letting the bit holder extend when closed (I think so...).
Hate to be the "bear" of bad news, but that bit-driver has to be used like the Skeletool bit-driver - with the whole tool opened up. See attachment.
Post by: babola on January 24, 2015, 04:08:15 AM
Hate to be the "bear" of bad news, but that bit-driver has to be used like the Skeletool bit-driver - with the whole tool opened up. See attachment.
Yup, correct. I looked at this yesterday when many posted how the 'stepped' hammer tip is for bit driver to be used in closed position.
There's no way you can physically extend the driver holder past the hammer tip when closed. No cigar. :salute:
Post by: Inky on January 24, 2015, 09:23:51 AM
Post by: Cupboard on January 24, 2015, 11:05:25 AM
Hate to be the "bear" of bad news, but that bit-driver has to be used like the Skeletool bit-driver - with the whole tool opened up. See attachment.
Yup, correct. I looked at this yesterday when many posted how the 'stepped' hammer tip is for bit driver to be used in closed position.
There's no way you can physically extend the driver holder past the hammer tip when closed. No cigar. :salute:
I use MT screwdrivers a lot. I very, very rarely use them with the handles closed, it's just so much easier with them "long" and it's one thing I really don't like about slidey head MTs.
The pliers are obviously from the Rebar, but does the saw look like the Wave's to anyone else? I'm thinking it might be easy enough to fit the Wave file in there. I'd like a lighter Wave with a hammer and better screwdriver options.
Bit holder, small flat and an awl in the handle with a bit holder where the whistle goes and a MUT long bit for the reach. That would be like my Wave, but with a hammer and without the serrated blade. I've already removed the saw so I have a storage slot for the MUT bit.
Post by: Demel on January 24, 2015, 03:40:56 PM
Don't mean to add to the piling on, I'm just disappointed to see Leatherman continue to go after a specialty crowd while not concentrating on a core base of business..... The professional laborer. I work a technical service job and have had a Leatherman on my hip for all of my 20 years in the field, the last 15 years being the original Wave because they've not brought a better design to market, IMO. The OGW had real drivers and one of them was a tech size flat head.... Brilliant design. I work in mechanical rooms, rooftops, etc. removable bit drivers are beyond frustrating to a guy with grease, grime, etc on his fingers. Dropping and losing them sucks.
I just mention this understanding that YMMV based on your needs, and I find it hard to understand why Leatherman isn't offering more options for Tradesman instead of Snow Boarders...? How about a tool version with a few customizable options? People will pay a premium and wait for a "factory customized" configuration. I see a lot people seeing MT's as not the best tool for any application..... That attitude is not representative of a someone in the trades. The best tool is the one that resolves your issue properly and quickly. A customized MT can be the best tool every time some days. If Leatherman is never gonna go this route..... So be it. If that's the case, then maybe they should offer more options.
I personally retired my Wave as it is intended to be passed on to my grandson. I'm now carrying a Swiss Army knife..... Because Leatherman has nothing that really fits my needs......bummer.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Agreed. I work in a factory. And every tool is almost perfect except...so i agree a tool with swappable items that could be factory installed would be great. I'd pay a premium for that
Post by: Demel on January 24, 2015, 03:43:52 PM
Post by: BASguy on January 24, 2015, 05:04:29 PM
I'd be shocked to find out that wasn't the case for a lot of their customers. You can get a nice mod from Texas Toolcrafters if you want to mortgage your home for a multi tool. You can certainly get some nice mod work done by the fellas here. Breezy12 did a fantastic job for me on a hybrid wave/rebar. Excellent job on his work, but it ended up the tool just wasn't as comfortable as my OGW. I'm now carrying a Victorinox tool.Don't mean to add to the piling on, I'm just disappointed to see Leatherman continue to go after a specialty crowd while not concentrating on a core base of business..... The professional laborer. I work a technical service job and have had a Leatherman on my hip for all of my 20 years in the field, the last 15 years being the original Wave because they've not brought a better design to market, IMO. The OGW had real drivers and one of them was a tech size flat head.... Brilliant design. I work in mechanical rooms, rooftops, etc. removable bit drivers are beyond frustrating to a guy with grease, grime, etc on his fingers. Dropping and losing them sucks.
I just mention this understanding that YMMV based on your needs, and I find it hard to understand why Leatherman isn't offering more options for Tradesman instead of Snow Boarders...? How about a tool version with a few customizable options? People will pay a premium and wait for a "factory customized" configuration. I see a lot people seeing MT's as not the best tool for any application..... That attitude is not representative of a someone in the trades. The best tool is the one that resolves your issue properly and quickly. A customized MT can be the best tool every time some days. If Leatherman is never gonna go this route..... So be it. If that's the case, then maybe they should offer more options.
I personally retired my Wave as it is intended to be passed on to my grandson. I'm now carrying a Swiss Army knife..... Because Leatherman has nothing that really fits my needs......bummer.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Agreed. I work in a factory. And every tool is almost perfect except...so i agree a tool with swappable items that could be factory installed would be great. I'd pay a premium for that
I love Leatherman, and they are an American icon...... Just not loving their engineers and decision makers right now.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: Demel on January 24, 2015, 08:00:34 PM
Post by: ba-ta on January 24, 2015, 11:36:43 PM
Anyone else think that leatherman might do the same thing that they have done with the skeletool and freestyle series, ie offering both plain edge and combo edge at different price points? Just my thoughts.
Post by: genevabuck on January 25, 2015, 01:32:47 AM
Post by: BIG-TARGET on January 25, 2015, 02:25:31 AM
I wonder if it will come in black oxide?I would like to see it "darwinism proofed" by making them blaze orange or flourecent lemon/roadcrew yellow. So if you drop it, you can find it again.
And if you do loose it. Oh well! Darwinism in Action! :whistle:
Post by: Breezy12 on January 25, 2015, 07:45:32 AM
I'd be shocked to find out that wasn't the case for a lot of their customers. You can get a nice mod from Texas Toolcrafters if you want to mortgage your home for a multi tool. You can certainly get some nice mod work done by the fellas here. Breezy12 did a fantastic job for me on a hybrid wave/rebar. Excellent job on his work, but it ended up the tool just wasn't as comfortable as my OGW. I'm now carrying a Victorinox tool.Don't mean to add to the piling on, I'm just disappointed to see Leatherman continue to go after a specialty crowd while not concentrating on a core base of business..... The professional laborer. I work a technical service job and have had a Leatherman on my hip for all of my 20 years in the field, the last 15 years being the original Wave because they've not brought a better design to market, IMO. The OGW had real drivers and one of them was a tech size flat head.... Brilliant design. I work in mechanical rooms, rooftops, etc. removable bit drivers are beyond frustrating to a guy with grease, grime, etc on his fingers. Dropping and losing them sucks.Agreed. I work in a factory. And every tool is almost perfect except...so i agree a tool with swappable items that could be factory installed would be great. I'd pay a premium for that
I just mention this understanding that YMMV based on your needs, and I find it hard to understand why Leatherman isn't offering more options for Tradesman instead of Snow Boarders...? How about a tool version with a few customizable options? People will pay a premium and wait for a "factory customized" configuration. I see a lot people seeing MT's as not the best tool for any application..... That attitude is not representative of a someone in the trades. The best tool is the one that resolves your issue properly and quickly. A customized MT can be the best tool every time some days. If Leatherman is never gonna go this route..... So be it. If that's the case, then maybe they should offer more options.
I personally retired my Wave as it is intended to be passed on to my grandson. I'm now carrying a Swiss Army knife..... Because Leatherman has nothing that really fits my needs......bummer.
I love Leatherman, and they are an American icon...... Just not loving their engineers and decision makers right now.
really sorry to hear that the modded Wave isn't working out as well as you'd hoped, but glad to hear that you're a fan of my work. :) thanks for the positive feedback! :tu:
Post by: rdub934 on January 25, 2015, 04:16:24 PM
I wonder if it will come in black oxide?I would like to see it "darwinism proofed" by making them blaze orange or flourecent lemon/roadcrew yellow. So if you drop it, you can find it again.
And if you do loose it. Oh well! Darwinism in Action! :whistle:
That is really the only thing I think they dropped the ball on with this tool, lol. Even if it just had more yellow on it, to keep the Leatherman team color motif going it would go a long way towards helping to find it in a back pack in the middle of the night, or on the hardwood forest floor in October, or... any number of scenarios where you put your tool down for a quick sec and then cannot find it again!!!
Hell, I almost lost my blaze orange Outdoor Edge Grip-Hook this past deer season in the middle of gutting a deer! A black tool would have bee nthat much tougher to find.
Post by: BIG-TARGET on January 26, 2015, 01:21:57 AM
THAT's the spirit!!!! :tu:I wonder if it will come in black oxide?I would like to see it "darwinism proofed" by making them blaze orange or flourecent lemon/roadcrew yellow. So if you drop it, you can find it again.
And if you do loose it. Oh well! Darwinism in Action! :whistle:
That is really the only thing I think they dropped the ball on with this tool, lol. Even if it just had more yellow on it, to keep the Leatherman team color motif going it would go a long way towards helping to find it in a back pack in the middle of the night, or on the hardwood forest floor in October, or... any number of scenarios where you put your tool down for a quick sec and then cannot find it again!!!
Hell, I almost lost my blaze orange Outdoor Edge Grip-Hook this past deer season in the middle of gutting a deer! A black tool would have bee nthat much tougher to find.
Post by: BASguy on January 26, 2015, 02:24:27 AM
Couldn't have been happier with the work. Absolutely excellent results, it's just that darn bulky new Wave design just didn't work for me...... Just couldn't get comfortable with it. I've got some other mod ideas I'll pm you on later.....I'd be shocked to find out that wasn't the case for a lot of their customers. You can get a nice mod from Texas Toolcrafters if you want to mortgage your home for a multi tool. You can certainly get some nice mod work done by the fellas here. Breezy12 did a fantastic job for me on a hybrid wave/rebar. Excellent job on his work, but it ended up the tool just wasn't as comfortable as my OGW. I'm now carrying a Victorinox tool.Don't mean to add to the piling on, I'm just disappointed to see Leatherman continue to go after a specialty crowd while not concentrating on a core base of business..... The professional laborer. I work a technical service job and have had a Leatherman on my hip for all of my 20 years in the field, the last 15 years being the original Wave because they've not brought a better design to market, IMO. The OGW had real drivers and one of them was a tech size flat head.... Brilliant design. I work in mechanical rooms, rooftops, etc. removable bit drivers are beyond frustrating to a guy with grease, grime, etc on his fingers. Dropping and losing them sucks.Agreed. I work in a factory. And every tool is almost perfect except...so i agree a tool with swappable items that could be factory installed would be great. I'd pay a premium for that
I just mention this understanding that YMMV based on your needs, and I find it hard to understand why Leatherman isn't offering more options for Tradesman instead of Snow Boarders...? How about a tool version with a few customizable options? People will pay a premium and wait for a "factory customized" configuration. I see a lot people seeing MT's as not the best tool for any application..... That attitude is not representative of a someone in the trades. The best tool is the one that resolves your issue properly and quickly. A customized MT can be the best tool every time some days. If Leatherman is never gonna go this route..... So be it. If that's the case, then maybe they should offer more options.
I personally retired my Wave as it is intended to be passed on to my grandson. I'm now carrying a Swiss Army knife..... Because Leatherman has nothing that really fits my needs......bummer.
I love Leatherman, and they are an American icon...... Just not loving their engineers and decision makers right now.
really sorry to hear that the modded Wave isn't working out as well as you'd hoped, but glad to hear that you're a fan of my work. :) thanks for the positive feedback! :tu:
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: Breezy12 on January 26, 2015, 07:19:15 AM
Couldn't have been happier with the work. Absolutely excellent results, it's just that darn bulky new Wave design just didn't work for me...... Just couldn't get comfortable with it. I've got some other mod ideas I'll pm you on later.....I'd be shocked to find out that wasn't the case for a lot of their customers. You can get a nice mod from Texas Toolcrafters if you want to mortgage your home for a multi tool. You can certainly get some nice mod work done by the fellas here. Breezy12 did a fantastic job for me on a hybrid wave/rebar. Excellent job on his work, but it ended up the tool just wasn't as comfortable as my OGW. I'm now carrying a Victorinox tool.Don't mean to add to the piling on, I'm just disappointed to see Leatherman continue to go after a specialty crowd while not concentrating on a core base of business..... The professional laborer. I work a technical service job and have had a Leatherman on my hip for all of my 20 years in the field, the last 15 years being the original Wave because they've not brought a better design to market, IMO. The OGW had real drivers and one of them was a tech size flat head.... Brilliant design. I work in mechanical rooms, rooftops, etc. removable bit drivers are beyond frustrating to a guy with grease, grime, etc on his fingers. Dropping and losing them sucks.Agreed. I work in a factory. And every tool is almost perfect except...so i agree a tool with swappable items that could be factory installed would be great. I'd pay a premium for that
I just mention this understanding that YMMV based on your needs, and I find it hard to understand why Leatherman isn't offering more options for Tradesman instead of Snow Boarders...? How about a tool version with a few customizable options? People will pay a premium and wait for a "factory customized" configuration. I see a lot people seeing MT's as not the best tool for any application..... That attitude is not representative of a someone in the trades. The best tool is the one that resolves your issue properly and quickly. A customized MT can be the best tool every time some days. If Leatherman is never gonna go this route..... So be it. If that's the case, then maybe they should offer more options.
I personally retired my Wave as it is intended to be passed on to my grandson. I'm now carrying a Swiss Army knife..... Because Leatherman has nothing that really fits my needs......bummer.
I love Leatherman, and they are an American icon...... Just not loving their engineers and decision makers right now.
really sorry to hear that the modded Wave isn't working out as well as you'd hoped, but glad to hear that you're a fan of my work. :) thanks for the positive feedback! :tu:
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
thanks again. :) and I'm always up for new mod ideas... :D
Post by: Lynn LeFey on January 26, 2015, 08:11:29 PM
I'm no fan of semi-serraed blades. Enough on that.
Saw, good. The new replaceable cutters, good. Can opener, believe it or not, is a good thing. The hawk-bill shaped can openers are excellent general scraping tools.
Ferro rod insert. Mmmm... I'm not thrilled with pieces that can be lost. But there's really no other way to do it, if the tool itself is the striker.
Whistle. Nope. Pointless.
Overall, I think it looks like a great tool, if a bit focussed in an specific area. However, the driver bit holder allows a good degree of versatility outside the survival arena. For that, I wouldn't fault it. However, I can't help feeling that it's missing anything like a useful pry tool, which in a survival setting would trump a flip bit. So... replace the flip bit with the standard flathead.
And, what? No fish scaler? :D
Post by: Yadda on January 26, 2015, 08:15:40 PM
And, what? No fish scaler? :D
:rofl:
Post by: JAfromMn on January 26, 2015, 09:56:45 PM
And, what? No fish scaler? :D
:rofl:
How will we survive .
:rofl:
Post by: Kampfer on January 26, 2015, 10:29:57 PM
Post by: BASguy on January 27, 2015, 02:05:01 AM
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: TheDude on January 27, 2015, 04:32:02 AM
Post by: Lynn LeFey on January 27, 2015, 05:21:10 AM
I have a Fox 40 micro, and it is PAINFULLY loud. I think jetscreams are about the same, but other than those two, I've never seen a plastic whistle worth diddly. I had an ap that said the whistle with the Les Stroud tool was 103db, but it sounded pathetic to me.The Fox 40 is listed at 110db, which I believe. Just below damagingly loud.
Don't expect anything from the LM version.
As for removable parts... how do you expect to strike a ferro rod or use a sharpener on the blades of the tool unless they're removable? I don't like bits that can be lost, but there isn't much of an option in these cases.
Some time back, somebody asked about the best MT to take on a survival TV series. This one would be it. As a 'One thing' survival kit, it's pretty complete. Blade (and a way to keep it sharp), saw, firestarter. After that, its starts becoming gravy.
EDIT: Let's say that this tool impresses me a great deal more than some, ahem... OTHER survival MT I have experience with.
Post by: Breezy12 on January 27, 2015, 09:56:58 AM
As for removable parts... how do you expect to strike a ferro rod or use a sharpener on the blades of the tool unless they're removable? I don't like bits that can be lost, but there isn't much of an option in these cases.
a couple years ago, I sent LM a detailed idea for a "survival" tool based on the Surge platform. my idea had the ferro rod as a screw-in insert in one of the handles (so that you could replace it with a new one when it wore out), and you could use the removable saw or file from the blade exchanger as a striker. (I even had the measurements for the ferro rod insert and everything.)
but to be honest... I like what LM came up with better. :)
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 27, 2015, 10:08:38 AM
My bet will be that the whistle isn't very loud.
I have a Fox 40 micro, and it is PAINFULLY loud. I think jetscreams are about the same, but other than those two, I've never seen a plastic whistle worth diddly. I had an ap that said the whistle with the Les Stroud tool was 103db, but it sounded pathetic to me.The Fox 40 is listed at 110db, which I believe. Just below damagingly loud.
Don't expect anything from the LM version.
As for removable parts... how do you expect to strike a ferro rod or use a sharpener on the blades of the tool unless they're removable? I don't like bits that can be lost, but there isn't much of an option in these cases.
Some time back, somebody asked about the best MT to take on a survival TV series. This one would be it. As a 'One thing' survival kit, it's pretty complete. Blade (and a way to keep it sharp), saw, firestarter. After that, its starts becoming gravy.
EDIT: Let's say that this tool impresses me a great deal more than some, ahem... OTHER survival MT I have experience with.
The decibel scale is wierd. An increase of 3db is effectively double, so 110db is over 4 times as loud as 103db
Post by: hellsing on January 27, 2015, 10:21:59 AM
Post by: dks on January 27, 2015, 11:44:05 AM
The discussion with logarithmic scales, like the dB scale (capital B, from the name Bell) reminds me of some news presenters a few years ago when a mild earthquake occurred in, I think, Greece..
they were telling/scaring people that if the earthquake was ONLY 2 or 3 Richter units higher the area would have been in trouble, like this can easily happen, forgetting that the scale is logarithmic and an increase in 1 or 2 units means a huge increase in the actual amplitude-ferocity of the earthquake.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 27, 2015, 11:53:58 AM
Post by: TheDude on January 27, 2015, 12:02:46 PM
Post by: dks on January 27, 2015, 12:30:08 PM
The Richter magnitude scale (also Richter scale) assigns a magnitude number to quantify the energy released by an earthquake. The Richter scale is a base-10 logarithmic scale, which defines magnitude as the logarithm of the ratio of the amplitude of the seismic waves to an arbitrary, minor amplitude.
As measured with a seismometer, an earthquake that registers 5.0 on the Richter scale has a shaking amplitude 10 times that of an earthquake that registered 4.0, and thus corresponds to a release of energy 31.6 times that released by the lesser earthquake.
and
A change in power by a factor of 10 corresponds to a 10 dB change in level. A change in power by a factor of two approximately corresponds to a 3 dB change. A change in voltage by a factor of 10 results in a change in power by a factor of 100 and corresponds to a 20 dB change. A change in voltage ratio by a factor of two approximately corresponds to a 6 dB change.
A lot will depend on what you are actually measuring. The effect, the amplitude, the power and so on..
..but a small increase, in both units, brings a much larger increase in the result observed
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 27, 2015, 12:43:48 PM
:P
Post by: dks on January 27, 2015, 12:53:09 PM
Post by: BASguy on January 28, 2015, 02:18:11 AM
Post by: BASguy on January 28, 2015, 02:21:18 AM
As for removable parts... how do you expect to strike a ferro rod or use a sharpener on the blades of the tool unless they're removable? I don't like bits that can be lost, but there isn't much of an option in these cases.
I don't expect cheap little toys to be part of a $120 multi tool. Breezy mentioned a screw on type replaceable rod..... OK. Not sure it's necessary on a $120 tool, but OK. Point being, if you're prepared enough to be out in the bush with a multi tool, I want that tool to be as useful as possible as a tool. I've got a holder for my $3 whistle and ferro rod. I call it a pocket....... I'm OK with this novelty nonsense at $40.... not $120..... nope. Disappointed in this......
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: Outback in Idaho on January 28, 2015, 03:32:48 AM
Wonder what sheaths will be offered? Hopefully not another one of them short stubby bucket-type sheaths where the tool could come loose with rugged handling.
Still not liking that awl. Hopefully Leatherman will change that to something that could be used for sewing & hole making. Perhaps Leatherman should send me a bus ticket/taxi service so I can personally go over and show them how real mean use awls? Not these urban cowboys posing as adventurists.
Post by: glorn on January 28, 2015, 05:31:38 AM
Some people are better at blowing than others...
Man, ain't that the truth. I knew this one gal..
Eh.. Maybe this isn't the place for that story.
Post by: Etherealicer on January 28, 2015, 08:55:10 AM
Since Leatherman is putting the Signal off for later in the year, wonder if they'll end up with choice options of a Partially Serrated Blade & or Straight Edge like they had with the Skeletool? Would seem more practical.In one of the videos the lady shows the scratches on the plier head and states that this is a prototype and that there is still a lot of work to be done, so I wouldn't be surprised if there would be some changes still.
Wonder what sheaths will be offered? Hopefully not another one of them short stubby bucket-type sheaths where the tool could come loose with rugged handling.
Still not liking that awl. Hopefully Leatherman will change that to something that could be used for sewing & hole making. Perhaps Leatherman should send me a bus ticket/taxi service so I can personally go over and show them how real mean use awls? Not these urban cowboys posing as adventurists.
Although its already on the Website. But this could be Marketing vs. Development.
Post by: babola on January 28, 2015, 09:08:09 AM
In one of the videos the lady shows the scratches on the plier head ...
You'd think their manufacturing dept. learned a lesson from scratched pliers on Waves and Surges, wouldn't you? :think:
How long has it been now...like 11 years or so?
:td:
Post by: Etherealicer on January 28, 2015, 09:14:49 AM
I don't understand your comment. She especially showed the scratches to put emphasis that the tool still needs work.In one of the videos the lady shows the scratches on the plier head ...
You'd think their manufacturing dept. learned a lesson from scratched pliers on Waves and Surges, wouldn't you? :think:
How long has it been now...like 11 years or so?
:td:
Wait, am I defending Leatherman :think: :ahhh it's all junk, junk I say :viking: :rofl:
And that was it for my daily smiley quota.
Post by: babola on January 28, 2015, 09:30:06 AM
I don't understand your comment...
I didn't think that was that hard to understand, sorry.
Open your Wave or Surge. Have a look at the pliers surface where handles close over on folding. If there are no marks, then consider yourself a minority ;)
It's been like that since 2004. Brand new tools marred on first opening of the handles. Most of us don't care and have learnt to live with it, although it shouldn't be that hard of a fix at the factory.
Post by: enki_ck on January 28, 2015, 02:44:53 PM
I don't understand your comment...
I didn't think that was that hard to understand, sorry.
Open your Wave or Surge. Have a look at the pliers surface where handles close over on folding. If there are no marks, then consider yourself a minority ;)
It's been like that since 2004. Brand new tools marred on first opening of the handles. Most of us don't care and have learnt to live with it, although it shouldn't be that hard of a fix at the factory.
And yet people complain that the Spirit doesn't lay flat on the table closed. :whistle:
>:D
Post by: Kampfer on January 28, 2015, 05:35:00 PM
Post by: BASguy on January 29, 2015, 03:14:45 AM
Who?
Go to that thread..... Lot's of static about it
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Noa Isumi on January 29, 2015, 08:46:31 AM
I'll take my ST300 and a "smiths pocket pal x2" any day over the signal and spend the 40$ I saved on other gear that's actually useful.
I have more tool, better tools and money to spare than some gimmicky toy that's playing catch up in an already saturated "survival bushcraft" market.
That combo will do everything the signal is supposed to do and more. All while doing a better job at it too.
Post by: Crow on January 29, 2015, 09:15:10 AM
Who?
Go to that thread..... Lot's of static about it
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
:rofl:
Post by: enki_ck on January 29, 2015, 11:05:24 AM
Kampfer forgot to add a ;) to the post. He got the reference. :DWho?
Go to that thread..... Lot's of static about it
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: hellsing on January 29, 2015, 11:22:12 AM
Sorry leatherman buy you failed miserably ...again.
I'll take my ST300 and a "smiths pocket pal x2" any day over the signal and spend the 40$ I saved on other gear that's actually useful.
I have more tool, better tools and money to spare than some gimmicky toy that's playing catch up in an already saturated "survival bushcraft" market.
That combo will do everything the signal is supposed to do and more. All while doing a better job at it too.
If you have a ST300 they didn't fail so miserably. They managed to sell you one tool.
and the signal is a new product, even on the saturated market it will sell.
And yes we can have better for less. But it have a hammer !
Post by: Noa Isumi on January 29, 2015, 12:10:22 PM
Their current "big new" offerings have all fallen flat. I'm not talking core product. I'm talking about niche' specialties. They have been groping around with ways to expand to more specialty markets, which I can respect. But they seam to be hit and miss with more failures in their big premiers and more successes in their backbenchers. Their SKU attrition just sees to be higher than normal lately.
I have great respect for any company that gets out their and really tries. Unfortunately they look to be in a new product slump at the moment. It happens to everyone at some point. They'll snap out of it and wow us again.
Post by: rdub934 on January 29, 2015, 06:21:00 PM
I am impressed with the Signal and can't wait to get one. The only thing I think it could use is a place to keep a fish hook, some line, a needle, some tweezers, etc... But I am willing to bet the sheath will have space for something like that.
Post by: Kampfer on January 29, 2015, 09:13:20 PM
;)Kampfer forgot to add a ;) to the post. He got the reference. :DWho?
Go to that thread..... Lot's of static about it
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Jfowler1 on January 29, 2015, 10:39:22 PM
I have great respect for any company that gets out their and really tries. Unfortunately they look to be in a new product slump at the moment. It happens to everyone at some point. They'll snap out of it and wow us again.
This post inspired me to look at the tool timeline on leathermans website.
2004 was really a banner year with the introduction of New Wave/Charge as well as the Blast family. 2005 launched the large versions of those tools with the Surge and Core.
2006 introduced the TTi (my fave) and the AL/ALX. There was a small draught before Skele appeared in 2008. Then it got spotty. MUT was interesting but alienating, but the last really good launch was 2012 with OHT and Rebar. 2012 was the year I got started on this obsession, so you can imagine my disappointment over the last three years watching YouTube videos of one crummy SHOT show after another. Last year's Surge was nice, but it wasn't much more than a clean up of the original.
Count my vote as underwhelmed.
Post by: babola on January 30, 2015, 03:13:18 AM
... There was a small draught before Skele appeared in 2008. Then it got spotty. MUT was interesting but alienating, but the last really good launch was 2012 with OHT and Rebar. ...
You missed probably one of the most notable ones of the recent LM era, the venerable ST300. There's simply nothing like it in its heavy-duty, inner-tool design range, bar Swisstool and it was the model that got me back into LM collecting. It fixed some issues I had with ST200 and Core had, too. I own 3 of those, S/S, BO and EOD, love them both to bits 8)
Post by: Aloha on January 30, 2015, 06:25:26 AM
... There was a small draught before Skele appeared in 2008. Then it got spotty. MUT was interesting but alienating, but the last really good launch was 2012 with OHT and Rebar. ...
You missed probably one of the most notable ones of the recent LM era, the venerable ST300. There's simply nothing like it in its heavy-duty, inner-tool design range, bar Swisstool and it was the model that got me back into LM collecting. It fixed some issues I had with ST200 and Core had, too. I own 3 of those, S/S, BO and EOD, love them both to bits 8)
I'd agree the ST300 is an outstanding tool. I thought I would never leave my Surge behind but after getting my ST300 I find myself enjoying it more and more.
Post by: captain spaulding on January 30, 2015, 06:32:10 AM
Post by: babola on January 30, 2015, 09:32:43 AM
I'd also like to see the Wave V3 but I don't expect it before 2016 at least, the problem with existing model is that it's just close to perfect an MT can be. Very few points you can fail it on. But we're a finicky crowd indeed, we always want that next best thing in MTs ;)
Post by: Jfowler1 on January 30, 2015, 01:33:34 PM
... There was a small draught before Skele appeared in 2008. Then it got spotty. MUT was interesting but alienating, but the last really good launch was 2012 with OHT and Rebar. ...
You missed probably one of the most notable ones of the recent LM era, the venerable ST300.
Oh man... How did I forget the ST300?
I have owned 2 in the past, but I found it was not the right tool for me. In my line of work (manufacturing/distribution), sheath carry is not appropriate. I found it too big for pocket carry, so I used to keep it in my computer bag - which did me no good when I left my office to go into the warehouse.
In my situation, it was like the perfect tool for a kitchen drawer, but that would mean it spent most of its time collecting dust, so I sold them off.
But I agree, it has a fantastic tool load, and it should get extra credit for introducing the replaceable wire cutters to the leatherman line.
Post by: Breezy12 on January 30, 2015, 07:24:17 PM
Agree...and what a great fiddle factor those would bring, too :D
I'd also like to see the Wave V3 but I don't expect it before 2016 at least, the problem with existing model is that it's just close to perfect an MT can be. Very few points you can fail it on. But we're a finicky crowd indeed, we always want that next best thing in MTs ;)
not to mention that as soon as they release the 3rd gen Wave with the new plier head, Rebar sales will likely see a sharp decrease. ;)
Post by: Kampfer on January 30, 2015, 07:31:12 PM
Post by: babola on January 30, 2015, 07:40:53 PM
I gifted out 4 Rebars since I got my V3 Wave from B12. ;)
Rebar hoarder!
Post by: balvenie on January 30, 2015, 08:29:35 PM
Post by: Breezy12 on January 30, 2015, 08:30:51 PM
I gifted out 4 Rebars since I got my V3 Wave from B12. ;)
very generous of you! :cheers:
and I like that nickname... I might have to start signing my PMs that way. ;)
Post by: Kampfer on January 30, 2015, 08:34:17 PM
I am currently Rebarless, will pick up some more later.I gifted out 4 Rebars since I got my V3 Wave from B12. ;)
Rebar hoarder!
I think it is a wonderful little tool box.
Post by: Kampfer on January 30, 2015, 08:34:38 PM
Post by: Breezy12 on January 30, 2015, 08:45:31 PM
I am currently Rebarless, will pick up some more later.I gifted out 4 Rebars since I got my V3 Wave from B12. ;)
Rebar hoarder!
I think it is a wonderful little tool box.
I pick up a couple anytime I see them on sale for less than $40. ;)
Post by: Breezy12 on January 30, 2015, 08:46:22 PM
:waving: Hi B12.:D
Post by: Syncop8r on January 30, 2015, 08:58:05 PM
Post by: babola on January 30, 2015, 08:59:31 PM
Agree...and what a great fiddle factor those would bring, too :D
I'd also like to see the Wave V3 but I don't expect it before 2016 at least, the problem with existing model is that it's just close to perfect an MT can be. Very few points you can fail it on. But we're a finicky crowd indeed, we always want that next best thing in MTs ;)
not to mention that as soon as they release the 3rd gen Wave with the new plier head, Rebar sales will likely see a sharp decrease. ;)
Haha...yup!
Post by: sir_mike on January 30, 2015, 10:13:37 PM
Post by: Demel on January 30, 2015, 10:14:22 PM
Do you really think that Leatherman would replace the Wave plier's with the Rebar style? Why would they want to their sales of the Rebar to fall off? Unless they figure they would make a pile of money with the Wave v3!! :)
Post by: Breezy12 on January 30, 2015, 11:04:24 PM
Do you really think that Leatherman would replace the Wave plier's with the Rebar style? Why would they want to their sales of the Rebar to fall off? Unless they figure they would make a pile of money with the Wave v3!! :)
I present to you Exhibit A: the new Surge (http://www.leatherman.com/3.html#start=2).
they waited a few years after the ST300 was released, then updated the Surge to include the new pliers. my guess is that they waited until ST300 sales started to tail off, then made the move. I'd bet big money that the same thing will happen with the Wave/Charge either next year or the year after.
besides, it's cheaper for LM to only manufacture one style of plier head for their full-size tools. look at the full-size lineup from a few years ago: Charge, Wave, Blast, Kick, Fuse -- all used the same plier head.
Post by: Mr Biriyani on January 31, 2015, 01:30:41 AM
We need some more tools in the Juice size. I think a mini Wave or mini Rebar the same size as a Juice CS4 would be amazing. I was surprised to see they did not adopt the Rebar head into the Wave this year. :think:That is also what I´m been thinking. A mini Rebar or a bigger Micra in ss no complicated design just well build sturdy small tool.
Sweet. :drool:
Post by: sir_mike on January 31, 2015, 01:55:05 AM
Do you really think that Leatherman would replace the Wave plier's with the Rebar style? Why would they want to their sales of the Rebar to fall off? Unless they figure they would make a pile of money with the Wave v3!! :)
I present to you Exhibit A: the new Surge (http://www.leatherman.com/3.html#start=2).
they waited a few years after the ST300 was released, then updated the Surge to include the new pliers. my guess is that they waited until ST300 sales started to tail off, then made the move. I'd bet big money that the same thing will happen with the Wave/Charge either next year or the year after.
besides, it's cheaper for LM to only manufacture one style of plier head for their full-size tools. look at the full-size lineup from a few years ago: Charge, Wave, Blast, Kick, Fuse -- all used the same plier head.
Yeah, I was thinking about it that way too. I also was thinking that by doing the Wave and Rebar, you get great plier's heads with the option of outside tools or inside tools. Just like the Surge and ST300 example! :)
Post by: captain spaulding on January 31, 2015, 02:06:49 AM
We need some more tools in the Juice size. I think a mini Wave or mini Rebar the same size as a Juice CS4 would be amazing. I was surprised to see they did not adopt the Rebar head into the Wave this year. :think:That is also what I´m been thinking. A mini Rebar or a bigger Micra in ss no complicated design just well build sturdy small tool.
Sweet. :drool:
A large Micra would be amazing!
Post by: AimlessWanderer on January 31, 2015, 06:17:40 AM
Maybe i'm one of the few guys which likes rebar so and so.....i found the handles very painful when i start to squeeze it. I consider the Rebar a tool For occasionally use. Its lite with good load of tools, but painfull when you start to use it regulary. I consider more useful For my needs the Sidekick; it is as painful as the Rebar, maybe more, but its OHO, Spring loaded and the tigh selection of tool considering the price.
I'm with you on the Rebar. OK for occasional/emergency use, but lacks the comfort factor for regular use
Post by: Outback in Idaho on February 04, 2015, 03:55:54 AM
Been wearing my Surge lately though it's still hefty to lunk around and use - much prefer a Charge. Been having issues with the blade exchanger (v1.0) lately. Doesn't swap out as well as the first one.
The Charge TTi though... really want normal pliers nose, get right of that stupid cap crimper, and swap out either the flat edge or small screw for an awl. Rebar is a good choice save no diamond coated file. Charge seems favored, so does the Surge, so why not combine the two and make a Sarge?
Post by: Kampfer on February 04, 2015, 05:02:45 AM
A Charge sized Surge would be bonza! Less weight, all the goodies, small foot print. Never owned a MUT type tool, so don't know how it compares to a Charge & Surge.I think I have an answer for that, talk to B12. ;)
Been wearing my Surge lately though it's still hefty to lunk around and use - much prefer a Charge. Been having issues with the blade exchanger (v1.0) lately. Doesn't swap out as well as the first one.
The Charge TTi though... really want normal pliers nose, get right of that stupid cap crimper, and swap out either the flat edge or small screw for an awl. Rebar is a good choice save no diamond coated file. Charge seems favored, so does the Surge, so why not combine the two and make a Sarge?
Post by: Syncop8r on February 04, 2015, 05:09:41 AM
...why not combine the two and make a Sarge?
I like the name. :tu:
Post by: Jand3rson86 on February 04, 2015, 05:40:55 AM
Post by: TheDude on February 04, 2015, 06:47:06 AM
Post by: Kampfer on February 04, 2015, 09:22:28 AM
I was able to handle a finished Signal today for a few minutes, and quite like it. It's not overly large, it's about Charge-sized, and sits very well in the pocket with the included clip. It really didn't feel any bulkier in my pocket than my Skeletool, and is not overly heavy.I can't wait to have one. :wait:
Post by: JAfromMn on February 04, 2015, 05:13:23 PM
I'm still going to get one but I'm less excited about it after seeing it.
I think it's the yellow plastic that turns me off
Post by: captain spaulding on February 04, 2015, 10:00:30 PM
I got a mut after seeing the signal.
I'm still going to get one but I'm less excited about it after seeing it.
I think it's the yellow plastic that turns me off
Same here.
Post by: gadgetman7 on February 04, 2015, 10:12:05 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Kampfer on February 04, 2015, 10:27:15 PM
Post by: rdub934 on February 04, 2015, 10:56:49 PM
I think Leatherman should offer alternative pieces to replace the whistle at least. A bit holder would be nice for the less survival minded.
Sent from Tracy Island
They really should. It would be easy to have a little storage bin for little this and thats in place of the whistle. I would kind of prefer to have a little place for fishing line and a hook.
Post by: ducttapetech on February 04, 2015, 11:03:43 PM
Nate
Post by: GPDB on February 05, 2015, 12:38:36 AM
I think Leatherman should offer alternative pieces to replace the whistle at least. A bit holder would be nice for the less survival minded.
Agreed!
Post by: BASguy on February 06, 2015, 02:59:11 AM
I got a mut after seeing the signal.
I'm still going to get one but I'm less excited about it after seeing it.
I think it's the yellow plastic that turns me off
LOL..... What the hell were they thinking? Then again maybe it's just because I'm so down on the gimmicky toy tools that I'm not able to really appreciate a $120 plastic whistle.....
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: Etherealicer on February 06, 2015, 09:53:42 AM
Users: Buy a tool, break it, have it warranty replaced, repeat (good for advertisement, bad for business). They are mostly happy with what is already there and they don't like radical change. As a fact, if you want to sell them more tools you have to make small improvements over a long time (do it too fast and they get scared).
Collectors: Buy one, put it on a shelf (good for advertisement), for those there are the over-priced limited editions.
Both are limited / difficult markets. So, in order to stay in the game, they need to expand into new markets. And the best market is people who don't use the tool too hard (no warranty replacement) and preferably have lots of money.
Think about how many weekend warriors and mall ninjas will buy a signal for one of their kits, which they will never use.
Parents will buy the signal for their kits when they join the boy-scouts.
Maybe even some outdoors guys that usually don't carry a MT outdoors might consider this.
Yes, I think LM has done the right move. I think the Signal is what a lot of people want, many of them might not have a LM yet.
Post by: TheDude on February 06, 2015, 01:39:11 PM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 07, 2015, 02:32:53 AM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 07, 2015, 02:40:19 AM
Post by: Syncop8r on February 07, 2015, 09:43:04 AM
I got a mut after seeing the signal.
I'm still going to get one but I'm less excited about it after seeing it.
I think it's the yellow plastic that turns me off
Same here.
The yellow plastic turns me on. I like it.
Post by: Gareth on February 07, 2015, 10:37:55 AM
Post by: gadgetman7 on February 07, 2015, 05:39:11 PM
I agree but my issue is more with the part serrated blade and choice of steel. It looks like an excellent platform for several variations. I just wish they would put out options like better steel and bit holders. More of a concern is quality control. Leatherman seems to have gotten better recently, I just hope they continue to improve. Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: AimlessWanderer on February 07, 2015, 07:28:48 PM
A semi serrated blade might make more sense for the masses, who might not have knife sharpening amongst their skill set. Their production is likely geared around the many clueless users, rather than the few enlightened ones
Post by: Syncop8r on February 07, 2015, 09:08:35 PM
A semi serrated blade might make more sense for the masses, who might not have knife sharpening amongst their skill set.
Maybe, but then why include a sharpener? :pok:
Post by: enki_ck on February 07, 2015, 09:10:28 PM
For a "survival" multitool, the choice of steel is perfect! A steel which might lose it edge and distort a bit if abused is far better than one which will chip/crack/snap.
Agreed. For sharpening on the go, a simpler steel is king. Better if you can do it with a sharpening stone or some sandpaper and not some fancy sharpening system.
A semi serrated blade might make more sense for the masses, who might not have knife sharpening amongst their skill set. Their production is likely geared around the many clueless users, rather than the few enlightened ones
A few years back one of Benchmade representatives explained this in one of the SHOT Show videos. Although most of us here prefer the plain edged blade, sales of combo edged blades by far surpass the sales of PE blades for most knife manufacturers so of course they're going to make blades that sell better. We might not like it but it's a simple busyness practice. Make what sells. And most makers do so. LM offers both varieties on their full size tools but opt for combo if only one knife is in the setup in the recent years, starting with the Skele. Now Gerber MPs mostly come with combo blades too.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on February 07, 2015, 09:31:06 PM
A semi serrated blade might make more sense for the masses, who might not have knife sharpening amongst their skill set.
Maybe, but then why include a sharpener? :pok:
Because it will help sell them ;)
Post by: Mercury on February 07, 2015, 09:54:32 PM
A semi serrated blade might make more sense for the masses, who might not have knife sharpening amongst their skill set.
Maybe, but then why include a sharpener? :pok:
Because it will help sell them ;)
Exactly.
Post by: JAfromMn on February 08, 2015, 01:36:46 AM
Post by: gadgetman7 on February 08, 2015, 04:44:36 AM
As far as blade steel goes, if you have a diamond sharpener on the tool you should be able to sharpen a tool with better edge retention. I'm not talking about M390 or Elmax but maybe BD 1 or S35v. Either one of those should sharpen fine with a diamond sharpener. I've sharpened a Paramilitary with S30v on a river rock and it worked okay.
Also, if you're worried about sharpening a knife, serrations are almost impossible to sharpen without either a file or a dedicated system of some sort. Granted serrations hold a working edge longer but when they get dull they can only tear, and tear badly.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: babola on February 08, 2015, 05:17:00 AM
I like a combo edge blade .
+1
Post by: Lichtbote on February 08, 2015, 02:41:00 PM
I also prefer those standard steels on knifes that are tools. Fancy steels are ok for me on specialized blades like cooking knives, but they are a stupid choice for me on workblades.
But i assume a lot of those knives with "better" steels are more pampered collector pieces than hard working tools. Used to fiddle them, sharpen them to show friends how awsome and capable they are, and then they are stored safely to don´t get scratched. :D
Post by: gadgetman7 on February 08, 2015, 04:36:07 PM
I actually just want a choice like the Skeletool offers. Then we would both be happy.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: BASguy on February 08, 2015, 04:42:52 PM
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: JAfromMn on February 08, 2015, 09:48:38 PM
I still can't wait to get my hands on one of these.
I think it's got a lot going for it. Little mini mut.
Post by: zoidberg on February 08, 2015, 10:07:39 PM
Post by: JAfromMn on February 08, 2015, 10:22:47 PM
Plain edge and better steels for me. :whistle:
A choice of steels and grinds would be the best.
We all are picky about our knives.
Post by: kirk13 on February 09, 2015, 11:43:58 AM
I'm not quite a fan of the Signal, but I am a little surprised by the negativity here. Remember, what we are seeing is a late stage prototype, not the final item. Also remember that plastics come in many levels of quality, from cheap and nasty to the truly excellent. Kind of reminds me of the heated debates the Zytel liners on the Blast kicked off, everyone hated the idea of plastic on a Leatherman back then as well. Somehow the Blast family still managed to do OK. ;)
Good point about the Zytel models Gareth. But compared to the PST they had a short life,and to my mind,where replaced by two model lines that have been steps in the wrong direction.
The Wingman/Sidekick arn't as good as the Kick or Fuse,and the Rebar suffers from cost cutting to my mind.
I can't see me wanting a Signal...then,I did say that about the OHT,and I rate that very highly now :shrug:
Post by: GPDB on February 09, 2015, 03:29:16 PM
I like a combo edge blade .
+1
+1
Post by: zimchaz on February 09, 2015, 03:58:41 PM
My opinion for the peanuts it's worth is this.
At first glance would I buy this multi tool for its intended purpose ie:survival? No!
But my reasoning is this I already carry a Surge in BO with the blade exchanger and diamond coated file. To add a jetscream or equivalent type whistle and a cheap ferro rod would cost an extra £10 roughly.
And there is an old saying relating to eggs and baskets that springs to mind.
Being in the military has given me a somewhat different view on "survival" kits in general, In that I carry my survival items dotted around my body. A survival tin doesn't make sense to me because if you lose one item you lose it all.
People may say "be careful and aware of where your kit is" and I agree, but say you slip and roll down a hill and your LM signal "ejects" itself into the great unknown.Your survival capability is gone.
That's the only reason I wouldn't buy one, only because I don't buy into the "survival kit" mentality.
That being said everything is an evolution and this being a prototype, what we see might not be what we get.As always, ymmv but some people will love this and wonder why it wasn't produced sooner.
Post by: rdub934 on February 09, 2015, 08:57:46 PM
Post by: ba-ta on February 09, 2015, 10:39:09 PM
Post by: kkokkolis on February 09, 2015, 10:53:47 PM
Post by: Kampfer on February 09, 2015, 11:00:52 PM
City boy has no idea where to find food. ???
Post by: BASguy on February 10, 2015, 02:42:48 AM
I also prefer both serrated and plane edge blades but if I only get one I like it to be combo edge.
I still can't wait to get my hands on one of these.
I think it's got a lot going for it. Little mini mut.
From watching your posts I can see you are using your EDC tools on as frequent a daily basis as I do, albeit different trades. I'm curious as to if you think this particular tool merits the $120 price point? Gotta be honest, I see this as a $30 dollar tool.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: rdub934 on February 10, 2015, 02:46:57 AM
I am pretty sure I won't able to survive in in wildness with this MT and without a full case of MRE.
City boy has no idea where to find food. ???
Check inside the nearest animal - filled with steaks, chops, burgers, bacon, and wings ;)
Tie Signal to the end of long stick with knife deployed and poke until animal stops moving, lol
Post by: Kampfer on February 10, 2015, 03:25:36 AM
Even I have a rifle I still don't know how to track animals down.I am pretty sure I won't able to survive in in wildness with this MT and without a full case of MRE.Check inside the nearest animal - filled with steaks, chops, burgers, bacon, and wings ;)
City boy has no idea where to find food. ???
Tie Signal to the end of long stick with knife deployed and poke until animal stops moving, lol
based on the skill I already have, hunting human is easier.
Post by: Higgins617 on February 10, 2015, 03:32:02 AM
Even I have a rifle I still don't know how to track animals down.I am pretty sure I won't able to survive in in wildness with this MT and without a full case of MRE.Check inside the nearest animal - filled with steaks, chops, burgers, bacon, and wings ;)
City boy has no idea where to find food. ???
Tie Signal to the end of long stick with knife deployed and poke until animal stops moving, lol
based on the skill I already have, hunting human is easier.
Meat's pretty bland though. Take some barbeque sauce
Post by: Kampfer on February 10, 2015, 03:34:04 AM
Even I have a rifle I still don't know how to track animals down.I am pretty sure I won't able to survive in in wildness with this MT and without a full case of MRE.Check inside the nearest animal - filled with steaks, chops, burgers, bacon, and wings ;)
City boy has no idea where to find food. ???
Tie Signal to the end of long stick with knife deployed and poke until animal stops moving, lol
based on the skill I already have, hunting human is easier.
Meat's pretty bland though. Take some barbeque sauce
:o hell no! I just want their MRE.
Post by: Higgins617 on February 10, 2015, 03:35:48 AM
Even I have a rifle I still don't know how to track animals down.I am pretty sure I won't able to survive in in wildness with this MT and without a full case of MRE.Check inside the nearest animal - filled with steaks, chops, burgers, bacon, and wings ;)
City boy has no idea where to find food. ???
Tie Signal to the end of long stick with knife deployed and poke until animal stops moving, lol
based on the skill I already have, hunting human is easier.
Meat's pretty bland though. Take some barbeque sauce
:o hell no! I just want their MRE.
I don't know Kam, I've heard some things about you :ahhh
Post by: zoidberg on February 10, 2015, 03:36:52 AM
Even I have a rifle I still don't know how to track animals down.I am pretty sure I won't able to survive in in wildness with this MT and without a full case of MRE.Check inside the nearest animal - filled with steaks, chops, burgers, bacon, and wings ;)
City boy has no idea where to find food. ???
Tie Signal to the end of long stick with knife deployed and poke until animal stops moving, lol
based on the skill I already have, hunting human is easier.
Meat's pretty bland though. Take some barbeque sauce
:o hell no! I just want their MRE.
I don't know Kam, I've heard some things about you :ahhh
:rofl:
Post by: Kampfer on February 10, 2015, 03:40:02 AM
Post by: Higgins617 on February 10, 2015, 03:53:06 AM
:twak::D :D
Post by: Lichtbote on February 10, 2015, 01:37:52 PM
Gotta be honest, I see this as a $30 dollar tool.
Sorry, but that´s ridicuolous.
Post by: BASguy on February 10, 2015, 02:04:27 PM
It's ridiculous that you'd consider it ridiculous.Gotta be honest, I see this as a $30 dollar tool.
Sorry, but that´s ridicuolous.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: ducttapetech on February 10, 2015, 02:44:25 PM
Nate
Post by: hellsing on February 10, 2015, 03:23:32 PM
The blade and pliers head alone puts it around $30. A $120 dollar tool, no. More around $80, yeah.
Nate
Something like that. Basically its a wave with less tool but new supply chain. I dunno how much is the wave in USA, but the signal shouldn't be more expensive.
Post by: ducttapetech on February 10, 2015, 03:43:29 PM
Nate
Post by: enki_ck on February 10, 2015, 08:28:14 PM
The blade and pliers head alone puts it around $30. A $120 dollar tool, no. More around $80, yeah.
Nate
As I said before I'm guessing the $75 to $80 will prbably be the actual street/eBay price. 65-70% of the $120 MSRP.
Post by: BASguy on February 11, 2015, 04:55:53 AM
Perhaps a better way to phrase it is ......"it's a $30 tool to me"
Post by: Higgins617 on February 11, 2015, 04:59:32 AM
The Tractor Supply near me recently had Wave's for $40. Not sure if they still do...? In any case, if the Wave is a $40-50 tool..... I stand by my statement that this is a $30 range tool. Just don't see it as a better tool than Rebar. Different yes, but at the huge premium suggested..... Well, not to me anyway.
Perhaps a better way to phrase it is ......"it's a $30 tool to me"
30 to you is a better way to get your point across, but the Wave isn't really a 40-50 dollar tool, that's just an outstanding deal for an 80ish dollar tool.
Post by: Kampfer on February 11, 2015, 06:59:50 AM
+1The Tractor Supply near me recently had Wave's for $40. Not sure if they still do...? In any case, if the Wave is a $40-50 tool..... I stand by my statement that this is a $30 range tool. Just don't see it as a better tool than Rebar. Different yes, but at the huge premium suggested..... Well, not to me anyway.
Perhaps a better way to phrase it is ......"it's a $30 tool to me"
30 to you is a better way to get your point across, but the Wave isn't really a 40-50 dollar tool, that's just an outstanding deal for an 80ish dollar tool.
Post by: Lichtbote on February 11, 2015, 11:07:56 AM
You will not find a Wave here for under 80-90€, generally more in the 100-120€ range.
I ordered a Wingman last year, paid 35€, had a look on it - and sent it back immediatly as it wasnt worth that money for me. A 30$ Signal would be in the slighly over 20€ range, cheaper than a Wingman.
Post by: JNieporte on February 11, 2015, 01:26:53 PM
Post by: sawman on February 11, 2015, 03:33:53 PM
Post by: Breezy12 on February 11, 2015, 06:52:19 PM
So, will there be lots of people returning the Signal to Leatherman for warranty when they wear out the ferro rod? :facepalm:
my guess is that they'll sell replacement ferro rods separately, similar to some of the other parts (replacement bits, replacement wire cutters, etc.)
Post by: babola on February 11, 2015, 07:05:24 PM
So, will there be lots of people returning the Signal to Leatherman for warranty when they wear out the ferro rod? :facepalm:
my guess is that they'll sell replacement ferro rods separately, similar to some of the other parts (replacement bits, replacement wire cutters, etc.)
Yup, the lady at the SHOT Leatherman stand said the same in the Signal video posted on youtube.
Post by: Aloha on February 11, 2015, 07:18:59 PM
The tool is a neat concept but IMO lacks complete thought and execution. The MUT platform would have been a great starting point IMO.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 11, 2015, 09:07:33 PM
Post by: BASguy on February 12, 2015, 02:55:14 AM
The Tractor Supply near me recently had Wave's for $40. Not sure if they still do...? In any case, if the Wave is a $40-50 tool..... I stand by my statement that this is a $30 range tool. Just don't see it as a better tool than Rebar. Different yes, but at the huge premium suggested..... Well, not to me anyway.
Perhaps a better way to phrase it is ......"it's a $30 tool to me"
30 to you is a better way to get your point across, but the Wave isn't really a 40-50 dollar tool, that's just an outstanding deal for an 80ish dollar tool.
$80 is a bit on the high side as you can score NIB on the bay all the time in the $65 range..... But at that, the point is that the Signal is coming in at a price point substantially greater than the wave...paying a 40% premium over a Wave just doesn't add up.
Now keep in mind, I use my tools for work so I'm not exactly dialed into the concept of a survival/outdoor tool. I'm thinking VIc Hercules when I consider that market.....
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 12, 2015, 03:17:52 AM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 12, 2015, 03:56:51 AM
Post by: Kampfer on February 12, 2015, 04:33:58 AM
I am willing give up my beloved can opener for them.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 12, 2015, 04:58:56 AM
Post by: Breezy12 on February 12, 2015, 06:09:07 AM
The Tractor Supply near me recently had Wave's for $40. Not sure if they still do...? In any case, if the Wave is a $40-50 tool..... I stand by my statement that this is a $30 range tool. Just don't see it as a better tool than Rebar. Different yes, but at the huge premium suggested..... Well, not to me anyway.
Perhaps a better way to phrase it is ......"it's a $30 tool to me"
30 to you is a better way to get your point across, but the Wave isn't really a 40-50 dollar tool, that's just an outstanding deal for an 80ish dollar tool.
$80 is a bit on the high side as you can score NIB on the bay all the time in the $65 range..... But at that, the point is that the Signal is coming in at a price point substantially greater than the wave...paying a 40% premium over a Wave just doesn't add up.
Now keep in mind, I use my tools for work so I'm not exactly dialed into the concept of a survival/outdoor tool. I'm thinking VIc Hercules when I consider that market.....
another thing to consider is the age of the tool. the Wave has been out for awhile now, so yes, it's fairly easy to score good deals on amazon or ebay or whatever. but when it was first released, there's no way anyone scored a NIB Wave for $65. if a tool is popular when it is first released, it will have no problem selling at or near full MSRP. (for example, I paid full MSRP for my original Skeletool CX when it was first released.)
over time, the prices drop, and as plenty have pointed out, there are plenty of good deals to be found on Waves, Surges, Skeletools, Rebars, etc. I'm sure the price of the Signal will drop over time as well.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 12, 2015, 06:25:33 AM
Post by: Lichtbote on February 12, 2015, 12:17:58 PM
40% more but only have one knife and no scissors.. WAVE ALL THE WAY.. just carry your firesteel and whistle still cheaper
The mini-scissor is not really a reason to buy a wave.
Post by: enki_ck on February 12, 2015, 05:50:39 PM
40% more but only have one knife and no scissors.. WAVE ALL THE WAY.. just carry your firesteel and whistle still cheaper
The mini-scissor is not really a reason to buy a wave.
Yup, can't actually remember them being that much useful. I always preferred the ALX's double bit drivers.
Post by: JAfromMn on February 12, 2015, 05:59:05 PM
Although
It is much better than caring nothing.
Maybe they are going after a new group who don't have there edc together and are just starting out.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 12, 2015, 06:52:50 PM
40% more but only have one knife and no scissors.. WAVE ALL THE WAY.. just carry your firesteel and whistle still cheaper
The mini-scissor is not really a reason to buy a wave.
if i want a hammer , fire steel , whistle , awl.. i bring this :rofl:
Post by: rdub934 on February 12, 2015, 06:57:30 PM
40% more but only have one knife and no scissors.. WAVE ALL THE WAY.. just carry your firesteel and whistle still cheaper
The mini-scissor is not really a reason to buy a wave.
if i want a hammer , fire steel , whistle , awl.. i bring this :rofl:
And how much less does all that weigh than say... the Signal?
I'll wait....
Post by: sawman on February 12, 2015, 06:58:46 PM
In summary, unless LM can pull their act together and offer a quality tool at a reasonable price, I'm steering way clear of them.
Post by: Gareth on February 12, 2015, 07:43:59 PM
That's one heck of a big ferro rod! Got a link?40% more but only have one knife and no scissors.. WAVE ALL THE WAY.. just carry your firesteel and whistle still cheaper
The mini-scissor is not really a reason to buy a wave.
if i want a hammer , fire steel , whistle , awl.. i bring this :rofl:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 12, 2015, 07:53:39 PM
That's one heck of a big ferro rod! Got a link?40% more but only have one knife and no scissors.. WAVE ALL THE WAY.. just carry your firesteel and whistle still cheaper
The mini-scissor is not really a reason to buy a wave.
if i want a hammer , fire steel , whistle , awl.. i bring this :rofl:
http://survivorfirestarters.com/home/
Post by: Gareth on February 12, 2015, 07:57:50 PM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 12, 2015, 08:00:50 PM
Post by: Etherealicer on February 12, 2015, 09:54:16 PM
:facepalm:12/14 has been done many times (e.g. Wenger), maybe new to LM82 new feature for :multi: :rofl: .. number8, 12, 14, 15,16,17, 18,19 :twak: :rofl: :multi: :facepalm:
8 is not new, the mut has it and this baby:
(http://img.geocoinshop.de/rsHammerMultiTool_solo.jpg)
15: Done by Wenger and done by LM before
17: Done both by Victorinox and Wenger
18: Done by Victorninox
Technically 19 is already available in the Surge ;)
Post by: Aloha on February 12, 2015, 10:08:58 PM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 12, 2015, 10:13:06 PM
:facepalm:12/14 has been done many times (e.g. Wenger), maybe new to LM82 new feature for :multi: :rofl: .. number8, 12, 14, 15,16,17, 18,19 :twak: :rofl: :multi: :facepalm:
8 is not new, the mut has it and this baby:
(http://img.geocoinshop.de/rsHammerMultiTool_solo.jpg)
15: Done by Wenger and done by LM before
17: Done both by Victorinox and Wenger
18: Done by Victorninox
Technically 19 is already available in the Surge ;)
Can you Dig That ??
Post by: hellsing on February 13, 2015, 10:06:55 AM
Édit: box wrench they said on their website. In USA maybe , that's not metric wrench...
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 13, 2015, 07:35:33 PM
3 fonctions on the hex bit driver? I see the main one, but not the 2 other.
Édit: box wrench they said on their website. In USA maybe , that's not metric wrench...
why are you need those in survival mode?? they should put scissors , extra knife ,good file .. survival rules with one knife .. TWO IS ONE AND ONE IS NONE..
Post by: BASguy on February 13, 2015, 08:47:18 PM
That's part of my annoyance with this tool. I can see things being brought along on a camping trip where you would find a use for drivers, etc., but if you're going so minimalist that you carry your whistle and fire starter in this thing then it doesn't add up that you would need interchangeable bit drivers :think:3 fonctions on the hex bit driver? I see the main one, but not the 2 other.
Édit: box wrench they said on their website. In USA maybe , that's not metric wrench...
why are you need those in survival mode?? they should put scissors , extra knife ,good file .. survival rules with one knife .. TWO IS ONE AND ONE IS NONE..
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 13, 2015, 09:08:56 PM
Post by: Lichtbote on February 13, 2015, 09:28:58 PM
For outdoor activities I would go for the Signal before buying the Wave (if both had the same pricepoint). The Wave is really nice for tinkering small stuff, but not very close to the top on my MT-list for outdoor.
Post by: ducttapetech on February 13, 2015, 09:33:58 PM
Nate
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 13, 2015, 09:43:34 PM
It´s OK that you like your Wave, but that´s only your opinion.
For outdoor activities I would go for the Signal before buying the Wave (if both had the same pricepoint). The Wave is really nice for tinkering small stuff, but not very close to the top on my MT-list for outdoor.
:rofl: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0H3rdfI28s0
Post by: Lichtbote on February 13, 2015, 09:44:24 PM
It´s to flimsy for me. If i couldn´t use my Surge, i would go for the OHT.
And after that now probably the Signal ... throw away the whistle and such, and mod it to my wishes. It looks like a capable basis.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 13, 2015, 09:48:37 PM
Had a Wave, thought about it, gifted it to a friend.
It´s to flimsy for me. If i couldn´t use my Surge, i would go for the OHT.
And after that now probably the Signal ... throw away the whistle and such, and mod it to my wishes. It looks like a capable basis.
Flimsy?? hahaha i put 2x s30v on it .. will own that surge..
Post by: Lichtbote on February 13, 2015, 09:53:50 PM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 13, 2015, 09:59:57 PM
Aye, to flimsy.
Wave is Flimsy so you get Signal with plastic toy.. you so strong...
Post by: zoidberg on February 13, 2015, 10:13:09 PM
Had a Wave, thought about it, gifted it to a friend.
It´s to flimsy for me. If i couldn´t use my Surge, i would go for the OHT.
And after that now probably the Signal ... throw away the whistle and such, and mod it to my wishes. It looks like a capable basis.
Flimsy?? hahaha i put 2x s30v on it .. will own that surge..
Did you? I can't see them. :think:
Post by: eamo on February 13, 2015, 10:15:59 PM
In this sense, I think the Signal is a good tool that encompasses everything you need in one package but I would also have redundancy built into my kit. Either using the signal as my primary tool and having backup tools (SAK, Wave, box of matches, whatever) or vice versa, have the signal in my bag to complement my other kit.
Redundancy adds weight yes, but even so.
just my €0.02 . . .
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 13, 2015, 10:16:44 PM
Had a Wave, thought about it, gifted it to a friend.
It´s to flimsy for me. If i couldn´t use my Surge, i would go for the OHT.
And after that now probably the Signal ... throw away the whistle and such, and mod it to my wishes. It looks like a capable basis.
Flimsy?? hahaha i put 2x s30v on it .. will own that surge..
Did you? I can't see them. :think:
see what? wave with 2x s30v own surge ?.. haha
Post by: zoidberg on February 13, 2015, 10:20:48 PM
Had a Wave, thought about it, gifted it to a friend.
It´s to flimsy for me. If i couldn´t use my Surge, i would go for the OHT.
And after that now probably the Signal ... throw away the whistle and such, and mod it to my wishes. It looks like a capable basis.
Flimsy?? hahaha i put 2x s30v on it .. will own that surge..
Did you? I can't see them. :think:
see what? wave with 2x s30v own surge ?.. haha
I haven't seen your Wave with 2 x S30V blades. :pok:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 13, 2015, 10:24:10 PM
Had a Wave, thought about it, gifted it to a friend.
It´s to flimsy for me. If i couldn´t use my Surge, i would go for the OHT.
And after that now probably the Signal ... throw away the whistle and such, and mod it to my wishes. It looks like a capable basis.
Flimsy?? hahaha i put 2x s30v on it .. will own that surge..
Did you? I can't see them. :think:
see what? wave with 2x s30v own surge ?.. haha
I haven't seen your Wave with 2 x S30V blades. :pok:
I got 10 s30v on my table.. i can put in anytime i want.. if in city gut hook . if in the wood two s30v
Post by: AimlessWanderer on February 13, 2015, 10:30:36 PM
In a situation where your wellbeing is at stake, then i think whatever gear you have needs to be redundant - eg, Signal has a firestarter but if I were camping I would have a second method of starting a fire.
In this sense, I think the Signal is a good tool that encompasses everything you need in one package but I would also have redundancy built into my kit. Either using the signal as my primary tool and having backup tools (SAK, Wave, box of matches, whatever) or vice versa, have the signal in my bag to complement my other kit.
Redundancy adds weight yes, but even so.
just my €0.02 . . .
If you are in a genuine survival situation, then one of two things has happened.
A) you have been caught completely unaware by car crash, flood, huricane, volcano, plane crash, tidal wave, or some other devastating event ... or,
B) you have gone into a known hazardous situation unprepared for the reality of the situation.
For the vast majority of people (including me probably) either one of those two events would mean you'd not have the luxury of kit duplication, clear thinking, food and water reserves, a calm situation in which to think and act, a wealth of natural resources at your disposal ... lets not fall into the media trap of confusing survival with camping ;)
Post by: eamo on February 13, 2015, 10:38:47 PM
In a situation where your wellbeing is at stake, then i think whatever gear you have needs to be redundant - eg, Signal has a firestarter but if I were camping I would have a second method of starting a fire.
In this sense, I think the Signal is a good tool that encompasses everything you need in one package but I would also have redundancy built into my kit. Either using the signal as my primary tool and having backup tools (SAK, Wave, box of matches, whatever) or vice versa, have the signal in my bag to complement my other kit.
Redundancy adds weight yes, but even so.
just my €0.02 . . .
If you are in a genuine survival situation, then one of two things has happened.
A) you have been caught completely unaware by car crash, flood, huricane, volcano, plane crash, tidal wave, or some other devastating event ... or,
B) you have gone into a known hazardous situation unprepared for the reality of the situation.
For the vast majority of people (including me probably) either one of those two events would mean you'd not have the luxury of kit duplication, clear thinking, food and water reserves, a calm situation in which to think and act, a wealth of natural resources at your disposal ... lets not fall into the media trap of confusing survival with camping ;)
all true, but then whats the chances of having a signal as well ? but yeah, i get your point re camping v survival
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 13, 2015, 10:39:35 PM
In a situation where your wellbeing is at stake, then i think whatever gear you have needs to be redundant - eg, Signal has a firestarter but if I were camping I would have a second method of starting a fire.
In this sense, I think the Signal is a good tool that encompasses everything you need in one package but I would also have redundancy built into my kit. Either using the signal as my primary tool and having backup tools (SAK, Wave, box of matches, whatever) or vice versa, have the signal in my bag to complement my other kit.
Redundancy adds weight yes, but even so.
just my €0.02 . . .
If you are in a genuine survival situation, then one of two things has happened.
A) you have been caught completely unaware by car crash, flood, huricane, volcano, plane crash, tidal wave, or some other devastating event ... or,
B) you have gone into a known hazardous situation unprepared for the reality of the situation.
For the vast majority of people (including me probably) either one of those two events would mean you'd not have the luxury of kit duplication, clear thinking, food and water reserves, a calm situation in which to think and act, a wealth of natural resources at your disposal ... lets not fall into the media trap of confusing survival with camping ;)
he right ..
Post by: Lichtbote on February 13, 2015, 10:44:18 PM
Mods, is there a way to block seeing postings of a certain member? When i want to see such childish replies, i can argue with my 9 year old niece. :D
Post by: Syncop8r on February 13, 2015, 10:47:39 PM
Post by: zoidberg on February 13, 2015, 10:48:24 PM
Obi, may i ask how old you are? Your behaviour reminds me on that of young teenagers.
Mods, is there a way to block seeing postings of a certain member? When i want to see such childish replies, i can argue with my 9 year old niece. :D
I asked the same question when you arrived. :P
Post by: Lichtbote on February 13, 2015, 10:52:15 PM
It seems a ignore button wouldn´t be completely useless. :whistle:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 13, 2015, 10:54:42 PM
Obi, may i ask how old you are? Your behaviour reminds me on that of young teenagers.
Mods, is there a way to block seeing postings of a certain member? When i want to see such childish replies, i can argue with my 9 year old niece. :D
:rofl: im childish ?? TRY HARDER ..
Post by: Mercury on February 14, 2015, 12:02:20 AM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on February 14, 2015, 12:08:42 AM
The Signal is an Outdoor Multitool, not a Survival one, correct?Yes, but the conversation keeps swaying round to a survivalist nature :)
Post by: Lichtbote on February 14, 2015, 12:32:25 AM
That's enough gentlemen, agree to disagree. This is a civil place, if you can't be civil then don't post.
I have no problem with different opinions, as long as it´s an adult discussion.
Post by: Kampfer on February 14, 2015, 12:51:27 AM
For the vast majority of people (including me probably) either one of those two events would mean you'd not have the luxury of kit duplication, clear thinking, food and water reserves, a calm situation in which to think and act, a wealth of natural resources at your disposal ... lets not fall into the media trap of confusing survival with camping ;)^
^
^
^
^
To survive in the wildness, I want a case of MRE hidden inside one of its handles, and a case of water in the other.
I am willing give up my beloved can opener for them.
Post by: Syncop8r on February 14, 2015, 01:15:44 AM
The Signal is an Outdoor Multitool, not a Survival one, correct?Yes, but the conversation keeps swaying round to a survivalist nature :)
Probably because it's in the title of the thread. :facepalm:
So I think the answer is... "no". :D
Post by: Gareth on February 14, 2015, 01:45:41 AM
That's enough gentlemen, agree to disagree. This is a civil place, if you can't be civil then don't post.
I couldn't agree more. Keep it friendly folks. :police:
Post by: Aloha on February 14, 2015, 01:59:00 AM
Is the Signal a Survival tool? Was this Leathermans Intent?
From the interview with (Kitry?) that The Late Boy Scout did she calls it a Survival/Outdoor friendly MT, so the answer is YES.
As and outdoor tool we know that any number of MTs fall into this role without there needing to be a specifically designed tool. Heck some of you all modded yours to meet your needs perfectly fine, whatever platform you used.
As a Survival tool we are having a hard time grasping this concept and design. There are some hits and misses on this tool.
I'd say the tool definitely needs some more work in the role of a one tool Survival MT. I know they say its based off the MUT ( or at least inspired ) and this is where I feel they could have done a better job.
I think price will always play a role in what we feel a tool is worth but if it was a well designed Survival MT then I dont see many having an issue at $100 bucks.
Did I miss something?
Post by: Syncop8r on February 14, 2015, 02:17:28 AM
Ok lets get back to the OP question.
Is the Signal a Survival tool? Was this Leathermans Intent?
From the interview with (Kitry?) that The Late Boy Scout did she calls it a Survival/Outdoor friendly MT, so the answer is YES.
That may be their intent, but the more sarcastic folks here might suggest that NO, they are not making a survival multi. ;)
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 14, 2015, 02:26:13 AM
Ok lets get back to the OP question.
Is the Signal a Survival tool? Was this Leathermans Intent?
From the interview with (Kitry?) that The Late Boy Scout did she calls it a Survival/Outdoor friendly MT, so the answer is YES.
As and outdoor tool we know that any number of MTs fall into this role without there needing to be a specifically designed tool. Heck some of you all modded yours to meet your needs perfectly fine, whatever platform you used.
As a Survival tool we are having a hard time grasping this concept and design. There are some hits and misses on this tool.
I'd say the tool definitely needs some more work in the role of a one tool Survival MT. I know they say its based off the MUT ( or at least inspired ) and this is where I feel they could have done a better job.
I think price will always play a role in what we feel a tool is worth but if it was a well designed Survival MT then I dont see many having an issue at $100 bucks.
Did I miss something?
:tu:
Post by: zimchaz on February 14, 2015, 09:51:51 AM
Leatherman also have a marketing angle on products and if they define it solely as a survival tool, the market narrows to people caught up in the survival wave and collectors.Marketing is clever wording to make every tool seem like an option to everybody.Sometimes they get it wrong and people pick it up...such as the Rev...It is being marketed as a budget tool that they don't seem excited about...
Signal = survival= not for me.
Post by: gadgetman7 on February 14, 2015, 05:11:57 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Aloha on February 14, 2015, 05:55:16 PM
Why is the weight only 1 oz less than the Wave? Is it the hammer? Hmm...
Sent from Tracy Island
You would think with the skeleton scales it would be lighter. :think:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 14, 2015, 06:15:29 PM
The whole 'survival' tag IMHO comes from exactly what it is! I believe any outdoor enthusiast would not choose this tool over a dedicated fixed blade, ferro rod, sharpening stone etc but would carry it in addition as a 'back up' or redundant item, to use in a situation where other tools have failed, or in an extreme situation as a last ditch option ie: survival. I don't for one second believe that a woodsman would ditch his dedicated gear to replace it with this.
Leatherman also have a marketing angle on products and if they define it solely as a survival tool, the market narrows to people caught up in the survival wave and collectors.Marketing is clever wording to make every tool seem like an option to everybody.Sometimes they get it wrong and people pick it up...such as the Rev...It is being marketed as a budget tool that they don't seem excited about...
Signal = survival= not for me.
:tu: :salute:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 14, 2015, 06:25:34 PM
Double s30v bladeHad a Wave, thought about it, gifted it to a friend.
It´s to flimsy for me. If i couldn´t use my Surge, i would go for the OHT.
And after that now probably the Signal ... throw away the whistle and such, and mod it to my wishes. It looks like a capable basis.
Flimsy?? hahaha i put 2x s30v on it .. will own that surge..
Did you? I can't see them. :think:
Post by: BASguy on February 14, 2015, 06:49:50 PM
Post by: zimchaz on February 14, 2015, 06:54:06 PM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 14, 2015, 07:01:39 PM
^this!
Post by: Demel on February 14, 2015, 07:30:09 PM
Post by: BASguy on February 14, 2015, 08:04:41 PM
So I was watching Castaway and the whole time I was thinking, "He could really use the signal!" I know it's just a movie, but if he had a Signal on him when everything went down he would have been in a MUCH better situation. Unfortunately he had a sak in the beginning of the movie and left it with his girl :facepalm:
I doubt the TSA would let him carry on a Signal.... nor the FedEx regs for that matter :whistle:
Post by: gadgetman7 on February 14, 2015, 08:13:49 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: BASguy on February 15, 2015, 05:19:52 PM
I guess the "tradesman" crowd is not very vocal on wanting new options and based on sales, seem to be satisfied with current offerings.
Makes me wonder as it seems that about every 3rd person who even knows what a multi tool is, comments that the Wave needs replaceable cutters
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: zoidberg on February 15, 2015, 08:23:24 PM
I met up with a buddy this week, whose sister works at Leatherman in Portland. As one who has been very critical of Leatherman re: the Signal, I am somewhat humbled by his feedback. It appears that they have had great demand coming in for a "survival" tool. The marketing research indicated this was the biggest demand that offered the highest potential for sales. The whole Doomsday Prepper crowd is a built in customer base. As a business, they must follow consumer trends to achieve growth. Marketing research seemingly has indicated that the snowboard/surfboard/Prepper crowds have had great buyer potential for them. He also stated that "target" audiences are willing to pay premiums, hence the inflated pricing.
I guess the "tradesman" crowd is not very vocal on wanting new options and based on sales, seem to be satisfied with current offerings.
Makes me wonder as it seems that about every 3rd person who even knows what a multi tool is, comments that the Wave needs replaceable cutters
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Sounds about right, they made the Tread after one guy was embarrassed getting into a fun park. ::)
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 15, 2015, 08:49:02 PM
:twak:I met up with a buddy this week, whose sister works at Leatherman in Portland. As one who has been very critical of Leatherman re: the Signal, I am somewhat humbled by his feedback. It appears that they have had great demand coming in for a "survival" tool. The marketing research indicated this was the biggest demand that offered the highest potential for sales. The whole Doomsday Prepper crowd is a built in customer base. As a business, they must follow consumer trends to achieve growth. Marketing research seemingly has indicated that the snowboard/surfboard/Prepper crowds have had great buyer potential for them. He also stated that "target" audiences are willing to pay premiums, hence the inflated pricing.
I guess the "tradesman" crowd is not very vocal on wanting new options and based on sales, seem to be satisfied with current offerings.
Makes me wonder as it seems that about every 3rd person who even knows what a multi tool is, comments that the Wave needs replaceable cutters
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Sounds about right, they made the Tread after one guy was embarrassed getting into a fun park. ::)
Post by: BASguy on February 15, 2015, 09:53:54 PM
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: gadgetman7 on February 16, 2015, 12:32:15 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Mercury on February 16, 2015, 01:13:20 AM
I work around tradesmen, none of them carry any of the newer Leatherman tools, but there are 5 or 6 PST's on belts around my shop. Thats not to say the newer tools arent good tools, I carry a Rebar daily, but if i had to choose between a PST or rev/sidekick/wingman, i would choose that PST every time.
Post by: BASguy on February 16, 2015, 01:36:33 AM
Post by: Aloha on February 16, 2015, 06:29:22 AM
I can understand the company putting out a "outdoor tool" but IMO they need to be focused on just that with the tool. They seem to want both feet on both sides and sadly missing the mark on each end.
They make knives so why not a LM fixed blade? They could have easily partnered with another company that does well in this space to bring a terrific tool to their base user.
I tend to think the blue collar person that uses their tool in what ever line of work is also the same person that on the weekends or days off likes to do outdoorsy type stuff. This same person and not the collector would snap up a focused outdoor tool gladly because it is a Leatherman.
While I have many Leatherman tools I use the ones that seem to have evolved they way a blue collar guy like myself would expect. Wave, Surge, and Super Tool 300 have all IMO been tweaked making a good tool better each time.
I guess for me I hope this tool is Leatherman stretching their legs so to speak and not a direction of "one hit wonder" hopefuls. We've seen in their past some neat tools, Mini, Flair, and the Sideclip so I'm hopeful this is LM being creative more than them pandering to so called out doors men.
Post by: Etherealicer on February 16, 2015, 07:57:59 AM
It's no secret that I love LM and use mine daily at work. I wouldn't be caught without my LM and its the Wave or Surge that typically get the nod but my ST300 has made a good showing as well.Since what BMSguy wrote is pretty much a repetition of what I speculated, I have to disagree with you.
I can understand the company putting out a "outdoor tool" but IMO they need to be focused on just that with the tool. They seem to want both feet on both sides and sadly missing the mark on each end.
They make knives so why not a LM fixed blade? They could have easily partnered with another company that does well in this space to bring a terrific tool to their base user.
I tend to think the blue collar person that uses their tool in what ever line of work is also the same person that on the weekends or days off likes to do outdoorsy type stuff. This same person and not the collector would snap up a focused outdoor tool gladly because it is a Leatherman.
While I have many Leatherman tools I use the ones that seem to have evolved they way a blue collar guy like myself would expect. Wave, Surge, and Super Tool 300 have all IMO been tweaked making a good tool better each time.
I guess for me I hope this tool is Leatherman stretching their legs so to speak and not a direction of "one hit wonder" hopefuls. We've seen in their past some neat tools, Mini, Flair, and the Sideclip so I'm hopeful this is LM being creative more than them pandering to so called out doors men.
People who already have a Wave or similar are not willing to pay premium for another tool that is so similar.
No, this one is for the city-folks who like the idea of having an outdoor/survival tool but never really go outdoors (city folks also have a workshop, they never use). Having BOBs and all kind of kits is growing really popular, making a premium brand tool at a premium price for those kits will be a huge seller.
Of course they will have to make a blade-less version for the city-kids who go to summer camp in the WILD.
Post by: rdub934 on February 16, 2015, 07:48:34 PM
Post by: BASguy on February 16, 2015, 08:18:02 PM
Not liking a tool is not at all the same thing as hatin' on the company.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Aloha on February 16, 2015, 08:43:07 PM
Ok let me make it simple,
I have ZERO issues with the intended market and concept of this tool.
I like the idea as in the past with other neat well designed tools from LM, examples Flaire, Mini, Sideclip, MUT, Crunch, etc.
I feel this tool needs to be more MORE focused rather than pieces and parts with added "outdoorsy" add ons.
Their core buyers will have more than one tool, they will tend to have several since a Wave in my case is a smaller lighter duty tool vs my Surge or ST300 so I could see this same buyer buy a FOCUSED outdoor tool IMO.
There have been complaints that LM has become stagnant or too focused on niche markets ( I am not one of those voices ) so I applaud this tool with exceptions. I would hope LM would be staying the course even if this flops. What it would tell me is they intend on "getting it right" instead of a ONE HIT WONDER hopeful.
I may not be the intended buyer of this variant and while I do agree the "intended" market is the person who will not be venturing outdoors I just wish they wouldn't forget they guys who buy their tools to use.
So I agree with Bmsguy and most who have raised questions. I understand they need to attract new fans to LM. The prepper, EDC fanatic, the guy who likes putting together BOBs and such are a good market for them I guess.
With over a hundred tools ( 90% LM ) I am far from a hater in fact I am their core user/buyer.
Post by: gadgetman7 on February 16, 2015, 09:03:08 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: tosh on February 16, 2015, 09:37:27 PM
If they were really serious for tradesmen then both bluntnosed and side cutters would have made an appearance years ago. Regardless of the so-called technicalities involved........aren't multitools supposed to be their speciality :facepalm:
Like others have mentioned, it really looks as though the no-nonsense approach that made leatherman such a force to be reckoned went when Tim stepped aside.
Their recent releases are verging on Gadgets in my view.
But obviously Gadget-Guy will buy anything at any price or so it seems.
Post by: Mercury on February 16, 2015, 11:43:58 PM
I applaud Leatherman for taking a chance. I am looking forward to hearing what people have to say about this tool AFTER THEY HAVE ACTUALLY GIVEN IT A TRY.
Leatherman takes a chance with every tool they introduce into the market. This is not any different, nor is it groundbreaking. They are pandering to Market research data and projections. I would applaud them if they took a chance on something useful, not something popular. I don't think I would have a problem with this tool if they stopped marketing it for "survival". Take out the Firestarter, replace the sawblade with some monster scissors, and call it what it is, a civilian MUT. It has plenty of potential.
Post by: captain spaulding on February 17, 2015, 01:43:14 AM
I applaud Leatherman for taking a chance. I am looking forward to hearing what people have to say about this tool AFTER THEY HAVE ACTUALLY GIVEN IT A TRY.
Leatherman takes a chance with every tool they introduce into the market. This is not any different, nor is it groundbreaking. They are pandering to Market research data and projections. I would applaud them if they took a chance on something useful, not something popular. I don't think I would have a problem with this tool if they stopped marketing it for "survival". Take out the Firestarter, replace the sawblade with some monster scissors, and call it what it is, a civilian MUT. It has plenty of potential.
Agreed. If they took out all the plastic crap and replaced the saw for huge scissors I would be all over it! :drool:
Post by: Mercury on February 17, 2015, 01:59:56 AM
I applaud Leatherman for taking a chance. I am looking forward to hearing what people have to say about this tool AFTER THEY HAVE ACTUALLY GIVEN IT A TRY.
Leatherman takes a chance with every tool they introduce into the market. This is not any different, nor is it groundbreaking. They are pandering to Market research data and projections. I would applaud them if they took a chance on something useful, not something popular. I don't think I would have a problem with this tool if they stopped marketing it for "survival". Take out the Firestarter, replace the sawblade with some monster scissors, and call it what it is, a civilian MUT. It has plenty of potential.
Agreed. If they took out all the plastic crap and replaced the saw for huge scissors I would be all over it! :drool:
:tu:
Post by: rdub934 on February 17, 2015, 03:24:22 AM
It seems to me having read most of the comments on this thread that we are basically all united in our frustration with Leatherman's recent offerings in that we all strongly believe the company could be so much more.
If they were really serious for tradesmen then both bluntnosed and side cutters would have made an appearance years ago. Regardless of the so-called technicalities involved........aren't multitools supposed to be their speciality :facepalm:
Like others have mentioned, it really looks as though the no-nonsense approach that made leatherman such a force to be reckoned went when Tim stepped aside.
Their recent releases are verging on Gadgets in my view.
But obviously Gadget-Guy will buy anything at any price or so it seems.
Same could be said for every MT company. Gerber continues to prefer to release gimmicky tools instead of refining the few good designs they have. SOG with the PowerDuo? Still with all tools inside the handles. With minor refining, SOG could own the MT business. Vic is still doing the same thing they have for decades. Multitasker still only makes the AR specific multitool.
I applaud Leatherman for taking a chance. I am looking forward to hearing what people have to say about this tool AFTER THEY HAVE ACTUALLY GIVEN IT A TRY.
Leatherman takes a chance with every tool they introduce into the market. This is not any different, nor is it groundbreaking. They are pandering to Market research data and projections. I would applaud them if they took a chance on something useful, not something popular. I don't think I would have a problem with this tool if they stopped marketing it for "survival". Take out the Firestarter, replace the sawblade with some monster scissors, and call it what it is, a civilian MUT. It has plenty of potential.
They aren't marketing it for survival. Product description on the LM site says it's for the outdoors. Also, much to everyone's dismay, this will be a useful tool. It can replace several dedicated (heavier) items from a back pack. And it's lighter than a Wave.
Post by: captain spaulding on February 17, 2015, 05:44:57 AM
It seems to me having read most of the comments on this thread that we are basically all united in our frustration with Leatherman's recent offerings in that we all strongly believe the company could be so much more.
If they were really serious for tradesmen then both bluntnosed and side cutters would have made an appearance years ago. Regardless of the so-called technicalities involved........aren't multitools supposed to be their speciality :facepalm:
Like others have mentioned, it really looks as though the no-nonsense approach that made leatherman such a force to be reckoned went when Tim stepped aside.
Their recent releases are verging on Gadgets in my view.
But obviously Gadget-Guy will buy anything at any price or so it seems.
Same could be said for every MT company. Gerber continues to prefer to release gimmicky tools instead of refining the few good designs they have. SOG with the PowerDuo? Still with all tools inside the handles. With minor refining, SOG could own the MT business. Vic is still doing the same thing they have for decades. Multitasker still only makes the AR specific multitool.I applaud Leatherman for taking a chance. I am looking forward to hearing what people have to say about this tool AFTER THEY HAVE ACTUALLY GIVEN IT A TRY.
Leatherman takes a chance with every tool they introduce into the market. This is not any different, nor is it groundbreaking. They are pandering to Market research data and projections. I would applaud them if they took a chance on something useful, not something popular. I don't think I would have a problem with this tool if they stopped marketing it for "survival". Take out the Firestarter, replace the sawblade with some monster scissors, and call it what it is, a civilian MUT. It has plenty of potential.
They aren't marketing it for survival. Product description on the LM site says it's for the outdoors. Also, much to everyone's dismay, this will be a useful tool. It can replace several dedicated (heavier) items from a back pack. And it's lighter than a Wave.
What, a ferro rod and small sharpener. :think: Problem is if i'm going in the sticks I would never rely on the rod and sharpener they provide with the tool. I would carry a backup of each either way.
Post by: Aloha on February 17, 2015, 06:17:14 AM
FYI, I took my Surge camping and it wasn't all that needed nor handy. I tend to be a fixed blade and hatchet kind of guy however this won't stop me from bringing a MT simply because I love them and rather have one an not need it than the other way around.
Funny enough a couple years ago life was so simple, back when I was pocket carrying a CnC ( cheap and cheerful ) MT and happy as a clam. Now I'm scrutinizing LM and second guessing their newest release :rofl:. God I love this place!!!!!!
Post by: Syncop8r on February 17, 2015, 07:27:10 AM
Get a Wave then!
Don't want ferro rod, sharpener, whistle etc but think it should have all the things a Wave has?
Get a Wave!
Also, those saying they already carry a separate firesteel, sharpener etc - perhaps this tool is not meant for you, it's meant for those who don't already have those things. That's the idea of a multitool - why buy all these separate things when you can have them all in one?
Post by: captain spaulding on February 17, 2015, 07:43:28 AM
Post by: Mercury on February 17, 2015, 09:40:44 AM
It seems to me having read most of the comments on this thread that we are basically all united in our frustration with Leatherman's recent offerings in that we all strongly believe the company could be so much more.
If they were really serious for tradesmen then both bluntnosed and side cutters would have made an appearance years ago. Regardless of the so-called technicalities involved........aren't multitools supposed to be their speciality :facepalm:
Like others have mentioned, it really looks as though the no-nonsense approach that made leatherman such a force to be reckoned went when Tim stepped aside.
Their recent releases are verging on Gadgets in my view.
But obviously Gadget-Guy will buy anything at any price or so it seems.
Same could be said for every MT company. Gerber continues to prefer to release gimmicky tools instead of refining the few good designs they have. SOG with the PowerDuo? Still with all tools inside the handles. With minor refining, SOG could own the MT business. Vic is still doing the same thing they have for decades. Multitasker still only makes the AR specific multitool.I applaud Leatherman for taking a chance. I am looking forward to hearing what people have to say about this tool AFTER THEY HAVE ACTUALLY GIVEN IT A TRY.
Leatherman takes a chance with every tool they introduce into the market. This is not any different, nor is it groundbreaking. They are pandering to Market research data and projections. I would applaud them if they took a chance on something useful, not something popular. I don't think I would have a problem with this tool if they stopped marketing it for "survival". Take out the Firestarter, replace the sawblade with some monster scissors, and call it what it is, a civilian MUT. It has plenty of potential.
They aren't marketing it for survival. Product description on the LM site says it's for the outdoors. Also, much to everyone's dismay, this will be a useful tool. It can replace several dedicated (heavier) items from a back pack. And it's lighter than a Wave.
What, a ferro rod and small sharpener. :think: Problem is if i'm going in the sticks I would never rely on the rod and sharpener they provide with the tool. I would carry a backup of each either way.
Exactly. I tend to carry a dedicated tool for everything if I'm camping or hiking. I actually leave my LM in the car. Last hike I took, I carried a gerber folding saw, ferro rod with some kindling, my favorite smiths diamond stone, my gerber fixed blade, a SAK(explorer or Swisschamp I think), some paracord, water, FAK and a few other items. I like those items and they work great in the woods. I do not like my LM's in the woods. That might be shocking considering what a multitool fanatic I am, but I just don't like carrying one on hikes. Camping, I'd probably carry my Rebar in a pack somewhere, just in case some equipment failed, but I already have firestarters, saws, and sharpeners.
Post by: hellsing on February 17, 2015, 10:31:42 AM
Actually I have a og wave in my backpack but never use the plier. I use the knife, the saw (a lot), the file as prybar and the bit driver. And what I miss is secateur for bushes.
So mostly my next multitool will be a hybrid or genus.
Post by: GPDB on February 17, 2015, 10:59:19 AM
I don't understand why they didn't use the tools release button for locking the sharpener in place, it would be a more secure option...
Post by: rdub934 on February 17, 2015, 04:33:54 PM
It seems to me having read most of the comments on this thread that we are basically all united in our frustration with Leatherman's recent offerings in that we all strongly believe the company could be so much more.
If they were really serious for tradesmen then both bluntnosed and side cutters would have made an appearance years ago. Regardless of the so-called technicalities involved........aren't multitools supposed to be their speciality :facepalm:
Like others have mentioned, it really looks as though the no-nonsense approach that made leatherman such a force to be reckoned went when Tim stepped aside.
Their recent releases are verging on Gadgets in my view.
But obviously Gadget-Guy will buy anything at any price or so it seems.
Same could be said for every MT company. Gerber continues to prefer to release gimmicky tools instead of refining the few good designs they have. SOG with the PowerDuo? Still with all tools inside the handles. With minor refining, SOG could own the MT business. Vic is still doing the same thing they have for decades. Multitasker still only makes the AR specific multitool.I applaud Leatherman for taking a chance. I am looking forward to hearing what people have to say about this tool AFTER THEY HAVE ACTUALLY GIVEN IT A TRY.
Leatherman takes a chance with every tool they introduce into the market. This is not any different, nor is it groundbreaking. They are pandering to Market research data and projections. I would applaud them if they took a chance on something useful, not something popular. I don't think I would have a problem with this tool if they stopped marketing it for "survival". Take out the Firestarter, replace the sawblade with some monster scissors, and call it what it is, a civilian MUT. It has plenty of potential.
They aren't marketing it for survival. Product description on the LM site says it's for the outdoors. Also, much to everyone's dismay, this will be a useful tool. It can replace several dedicated (heavier) items from a back pack. And it's lighter than a Wave.
What, a ferro rod and small sharpener. :think: Problem is if i'm going in the sticks I would never rely on the rod and sharpener they provide with the tool. I would carry a backup of each either way.
And a mallet for tent stakes, a knife, a saw, plus it has pliers, driver bits, and an awl. Those last three may not be super necessary in "the sticks" but I bet you carry some other LM/Gerber/Vic with you when you go camping and this would replace that.
This entire tool is lighter than a mallet or hammer.
I agree that I would have another means of producing fire, but I don't have any worries that I could sharpen the blade with the included sharpener.
Post by: rdub934 on February 17, 2015, 04:45:50 PM
It seems to me having read most of the comments on this thread that we are basically all united in our frustration with Leatherman's recent offerings in that we all strongly believe the company could be so much more.
If they were really serious for tradesmen then both bluntnosed and side cutters would have made an appearance years ago. Regardless of the so-called technicalities involved........aren't multitools supposed to be their speciality :facepalm:
Like others have mentioned, it really looks as though the no-nonsense approach that made leatherman such a force to be reckoned went when Tim stepped aside.
Their recent releases are verging on Gadgets in my view.
But obviously Gadget-Guy will buy anything at any price or so it seems.
Same could be said for every MT company. Gerber continues to prefer to release gimmicky tools instead of refining the few good designs they have. SOG with the PowerDuo? Still with all tools inside the handles. With minor refining, SOG could own the MT business. Vic is still doing the same thing they have for decades. Multitasker still only makes the AR specific multitool.I applaud Leatherman for taking a chance. I am looking forward to hearing what people have to say about this tool AFTER THEY HAVE ACTUALLY GIVEN IT A TRY.
Leatherman takes a chance with every tool they introduce into the market. This is not any different, nor is it groundbreaking. They are pandering to Market research data and projections. I would applaud them if they took a chance on something useful, not something popular. I don't think I would have a problem with this tool if they stopped marketing it for "survival". Take out the Firestarter, replace the sawblade with some monster scissors, and call it what it is, a civilian MUT. It has plenty of potential.
They aren't marketing it for survival. Product description on the LM site says it's for the outdoors. Also, much to everyone's dismay, this will be a useful tool. It can replace several dedicated (heavier) items from a back pack. And it's lighter than a Wave.
What, a ferro rod and small sharpener. :think: Problem is if i'm going in the sticks I would never rely on the rod and sharpener they provide with the tool. I would carry a backup of each either way.
Exactly. I tend to carry a dedicated tool for everything if I'm camping or hiking. I actually leave my LM in the car. Last hike I took, I carried a gerber folding saw, ferro rod with some kindling, my favorite smiths diamond stone, my gerber fixed blade, a SAK(explorer or Swisschamp I think), some paracord, water, FAK and a few other items. I like those items and they work great in the woods. I do not like my LM's in the woods. That might be shocking considering what a multitool fanatic I am, but I just don't like carrying one on hikes. Camping, I'd probably carry my Rebar in a pack somewhere, just in case some equipment failed, but I already have firestarters, saws, and sharpeners.
:o So you hike and camp with a multitool - the Signal could replace those MTs in your loadout. Wear the Signal on your belt so that if your pack gets snatched by a Great Golden Eagle or a cougar (either human or feline) you have something with you that can save your life, lol
Post by: BASguy on February 17, 2015, 05:00:23 PM
It seems to me having read most of the comments on this thread that we are basically all united in our frustration with Leatherman's recent offerings in that we all strongly believe the company could be so much more.
If they were really serious for tradesmen then both bluntnosed and side cutters would have made an appearance years ago. Regardless of the so-called technicalities involved........aren't multitools supposed to be their speciality :facepalm:
Like others have mentioned, it really looks as though the no-nonsense approach that made leatherman such a force to be reckoned went when Tim stepped aside.
Their recent releases are verging on Gadgets in my view.
But obviously Gadget-Guy will buy anything at any price or so it seems.
Same could be said for every MT company. Gerber continues to prefer to release gimmicky tools instead of refining the few good designs they have. SOG with the PowerDuo? Still with all tools inside the handles. With minor refining, SOG could own the MT business. Vic is still doing the same thing they have for decades. Multitasker still only makes the AR specific multitool.I applaud Leatherman for taking a chance. I am looking forward to hearing what people have to say about this tool AFTER THEY HAVE ACTUALLY GIVEN IT A TRY.
Leatherman takes a chance with every tool they introduce into the market. This is not any different, nor is it groundbreaking. They are pandering to Market research data and projections. I would applaud them if they took a chance on something useful, not something popular. I don't think I would have a problem with this tool if they stopped marketing it for "survival". Take out the Firestarter, replace the sawblade with some monster scissors, and call it what it is, a civilian MUT. It has plenty of potential.
They aren't marketing it for survival. Product description on the LM site says it's for the outdoors. Also, much to everyone's dismay, this will be a useful tool. It can replace several dedicated (heavier) items from a back pack. And it's lighter than a Wave.
It was presented that marketing research showed that the "survival" gear buyer is the target market. How they advertise, I'm sure, is also driven by marketing analysis. Perhaps "outdoors"/"bushcraft" etc are more buyer friendly terms, but that doesn't change the target market.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Goatlord666 on February 21, 2015, 01:26:27 AM
Post by: BASguy on February 21, 2015, 01:58:06 AM
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: Tulku on February 21, 2015, 07:12:20 PM
No I know, it's all speculation and that is half the fun. I wasn't quoting you on it just trying to add another look at the situation. Sorry
no harm, just did not want you to assume I was intelligent
Thats funny!
Post by: JAfromMn on February 21, 2015, 07:40:23 PM
I'm still planning on getting a single . It should be a good fit for my off work needs.
Lots of mod potential.
Post by: BASguy on February 21, 2015, 08:00:51 PM
It's not one of these. (http://i1211.photobucket.com/albums/cc421/JAfromMn/2015-02-20%2017.59.37_zps68xgpdur.jpg) (http://s1211.photobucket.com/user/JAfromMn/media/2015-02-20%2017.59.37_zps68xgpdur.jpg.html)
I'm still planning on getting a single . It should be a good fit for my off work needs.
Lots of mod potential.
OK, it makes sense to me only as a mod. It's a hefty price to pay and then drop more coin into the mod, however if you end up with a seriously usable tool then I guess it all works out. That MUT looks like a seriously good work option. I'd almost consider it if Vic wasn't so damn excellent at his job.
Post by: Mercury on February 25, 2015, 10:52:32 AM
It seems to me having read most of the comments on this thread that we are basically all united in our frustration with Leatherman's recent offerings in that we all strongly believe the company could be so much more.
If they were really serious for tradesmen then both bluntnosed and side cutters would have made an appearance years ago. Regardless of the so-called technicalities involved........aren't multitools supposed to be their speciality :facepalm:
Like others have mentioned, it really looks as though the no-nonsense approach that made leatherman such a force to be reckoned went when Tim stepped aside.
Their recent releases are verging on Gadgets in my view.
But obviously Gadget-Guy will buy anything at any price or so it seems.
Same could be said for every MT company. Gerber continues to prefer to release gimmicky tools instead of refining the few good designs they have. SOG with the PowerDuo? Still with all tools inside the handles. With minor refining, SOG could own the MT business. Vic is still doing the same thing they have for decades. Multitasker still only makes the AR specific multitool.I applaud Leatherman for taking a chance. I am looking forward to hearing what people have to say about this tool AFTER THEY HAVE ACTUALLY GIVEN IT A TRY.
Leatherman takes a chance with every tool they introduce into the market. This is not any different, nor is it groundbreaking. They are pandering to Market research data and projections. I would applaud them if they took a chance on something useful, not something popular. I don't think I would have a problem with this tool if they stopped marketing it for "survival". Take out the Firestarter, replace the sawblade with some monster scissors, and call it what it is, a civilian MUT. It has plenty of potential.
They aren't marketing it for survival. Product description on the LM site says it's for the outdoors. Also, much to everyone's dismay, this will be a useful tool. It can replace several dedicated (heavier) items from a back pack. And it's lighter than a Wave.
What, a ferro rod and small sharpener. :think: Problem is if i'm going in the sticks I would never rely on the rod and sharpener they provide with the tool. I would carry a backup of each either way.
Exactly. I tend to carry a dedicated tool for everything if I'm camping or hiking. I actually leave my LM in the car. Last hike I took, I carried a gerber folding saw, ferro rod with some kindling, my favorite smiths diamond stone, my gerber fixed blade, a SAK(explorer or Swisschamp I think), some paracord, water, FAK and a few other items. I like those items and they work great in the woods. I do not like my LM's in the woods. That might be shocking considering what a multitool fanatic I am, but I just don't like carrying one on hikes. Camping, I'd probably carry my Rebar in a pack somewhere, just in case some equipment failed, but I already have firestarters, saws, and sharpeners.
:o So you hike and camp with a multitool - the Signal could replace those MTs in your loadout. Wear the Signal on your belt so that if your pack gets snatched by a Great Golden Eagle or a cougar (either human or feline) you have something with you that can save your life, lol
I said I don't hike with a multi, I carry a SAK and that's it, and I only take a Multi camping because it's useful to have a tool that has pliers, drivers, and a file just in case equipment breaks down. Like I've said, I have a firestarter and a sharpener that both probably work ten times better than that dinky thing on the Signal and they weigh practically nothing.
I don't see a reason to replace my rebar with the Signal just for the sake of doing so. That's my problem, LM wants me to do just that, because it's there.
The Signal looks like an awesome tool if they changed the loadout. A scissor comparable to a Vic 93mm scissor would be awesome in place of the saw. And instead of a ferro rod they could use that space for bit storage. I might buy one for work because it has an appealing loadout as it is for what I do, but I would never need a firestarter/sharpener on it. It's a gimmick. I can't stand the new "Leatherman Sport" thing. It seems like wishful thinking and I don't see it lasting long.
Post by: sjdep97 on February 25, 2015, 04:15:23 PM
Post by: sawman on February 25, 2015, 04:41:33 PM
Post by: Mercury on February 25, 2015, 05:10:16 PM
Anyone contemplating throwing your money away on one of these just know you can buy a brand new Swiss Champ for just $51 :pok: here (http://www.ebay.com/itm/111551185464?_trksid=p2059210.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT)
Damn good knife.
Post by: Kampfer on February 25, 2015, 06:17:10 PM
Surge, Skeletool and now Signal. 2.6" seen like is the magic number for LM's blades.
I am pretty sure there is room for a 3" blade on Signal.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on February 25, 2015, 06:22:28 PM
I am disappointed how LM usually put a short blade in the tool when there is plenty of room inside for a longer blade.:facepalm: signal
Surge, Skeletool and now Signal. 2.6" seen like is the magic number for LM's blades.
I am pretty sure there is room for a 3" blade on Signal.
Post by: ducttapetech on February 25, 2015, 09:25:53 PM
I am disappointed how LM usually put a short blade in the tool when there is plenty of room inside for a longer blade.My Surge has a 3 inch blades.
Surge, Skeletool and now Signal. 2.6" seen like is the magic number for LM's blades.
I am pretty sure there is room for a 3" blade on Signal.
Nate
Post by: Lichtbote on February 25, 2015, 10:10:28 PM
My Surge has a 3 inch blades.
Nate
You´re not alone, mine too.
That´s one of the reasons i stopped carrying a seperate folder. With something like the flimsier Wave i still would carry a additional folder.
Post by: Syncop8r on February 25, 2015, 10:23:24 PM
The Signal looks like an awesome tool if they changed the loadout. A scissor comparable to a Vic 93mm scissor would be awesome in place of the saw.
I think a saw is essential on an outdoor/"survival" tool. Although scissors would be nice as well, I wouldn't want them at the expense of the saw.
Post by: Ariena on February 25, 2015, 10:25:03 PM
I am disappointed how LM usually put a short blade in the tool when there is plenty of room inside for a longer blade.My Surge has a 3 inch blades.
Surge, Skeletool and now Signal. 2.6" seen like is the magic number for LM's blades.
I am pretty sure there is room for a 3" blade on Signal.
Nate
Mine too!
Post by: rdub934 on February 25, 2015, 10:28:05 PM
I said I don't hike with a multi, I carry a SAK and that's it, and I only take a Multi camping because it's useful to have a tool that has pliers, drivers, and a file just in case equipment breaks down. Like I've said, I have a firestarter and a sharpener that both probably work ten times better than that dinky thing on the Signal and they weigh practically nothing.
I don't see a reason to replace my rebar with the Signal just for the sake of doing so. That's my problem, LM wants me to do just that, because it's there.
The Signal looks like an awesome tool if they changed the loadout. A scissor comparable to a Vic 93mm scissor would be awesome in place of the saw. And instead of a ferro rod they could use that space for bit storage. I might buy one for work because it has an appealing loadout as it is for what I do, but I would never need a firestarter/sharpener on it. It's a gimmick. I can't stand the new "Leatherman Sport" thing. It seems like wishful thinking and I don't see it lasting long.
I was just teasing - a SAK and a multitool are basically the same thing (although I do differentiate, just like most on MTO). So when you say you don't hike with a MT, but you have a SAK :think:
:rofl:
The Signal is definitely a polarizing tool, and it seems a lot of people aren't going to get one just based on principle, be it LM catering to consumer demand or what have you. But I do think it's going to be a good performer and quite handy.
Post by: Aloha on February 25, 2015, 11:12:21 PM
Post by: Mercury on February 26, 2015, 01:25:22 AM
The Signal looks like an awesome tool if they changed the loadout. A scissor comparable to a Vic 93mm scissor would be awesome in place of the saw.
I think a saw is essential on an outdoor/"survival" tool. Although scissors would be nice as well, I wouldn't want them at the expense of the saw.
I agree that the Saw is essential for Outdoor use, maybe LM could come up with an EDC version with scissors.
I said I don't hike with a multi, I carry a SAK and that's it, and I only take a Multi camping because it's useful to have a tool that has pliers, drivers, and a file just in case equipment breaks down. Like I've said, I have a firestarter and a sharpener that both probably work ten times better than that dinky thing on the Signal and they weigh practically nothing.
I don't see a reason to replace my rebar with the Signal just for the sake of doing so. That's my problem, LM wants me to do just that, because it's there.
The Signal looks like an awesome tool if they changed the loadout. A scissor comparable to a Vic 93mm scissor would be awesome in place of the saw. And instead of a ferro rod they could use that space for bit storage. I might buy one for work because it has an appealing loadout as it is for what I do, but I would never need a firestarter/sharpener on it. It's a gimmick. I can't stand the new "Leatherman Sport" thing. It seems like wishful thinking and I don't see it lasting long.
I was just teasing - a SAK and a multitool are basically the same thing (although I do differentiate, just like most on MTO). So when you say you don't hike with a MT, but you have a SAK :think:
:rofl:
The Signal is definitely a polarizing tool, and it seems a lot of people aren't going to get one just based on principle, be it LM catering to consumer demand or what have you. But I do think it's going to be a good performer and quite handy.
Now we're splitting hairs lol. I don't carry a pliers based Multi when hiking due to weight. I've never needed pliers while hiking, that's not to say I wouldn't ever, but in my experience the weight isn't necessary. I usually carry a swisschamp or some other SAK with a Saw. Now that I think about it, I don't really even need that. A good fixed blade coupled with my folding gerber Saw is all I really need. I guess I carry the SAK more out of habit.
I do think the Signal looks cool, and I could use it at work. I use the saw on my rebar for cutting PVC all the time, and the bit driver is perfect for what I do. The only thing I don't like is the outdoor marketing and associated price hike. It's not worth that much, it's not even worth $80 to me when I can get a Wave for around $65 all day long and the Wave comes with a file and scissors!
Post by: Syncop8r on February 26, 2015, 01:45:22 AM
I don't carry a pliers based Multi when hiking due to weight. I've never needed pliers while hiking, that's not to say I wouldn't ever, but in my experience the weight isn't necessary. I usually carry a swisschamp or some other SAK with a Saw.
Same here (except Ranger for me - massive saw :) )
Post by: Kampfer on February 26, 2015, 03:04:24 AM
There is room for a blade longer than 3.1" on a 4.5" toolI am disappointed how LM usually put a short blade in the tool when there is plenty of room inside for a longer blade.My Surge has a 3 inch blades.
Surge, Skeletool and now Signal. 2.6" seen like is the magic number for LM's blades.
I am pretty sure there is room for a 3" blade on Signal.
Nate
Post by: Kampfer on February 26, 2015, 03:13:25 AM
Post by: Syncop8r on February 26, 2015, 03:22:16 AM
<- I bet someone here is going to replace the saw with a Surge scissors.
Well, I hope they have fun cutting up branches with those scissors. ;)
Why would anyone dismantle a Surge?
Post by: Gareth on February 26, 2015, 10:21:23 AM
<- I bet someone here is going to replace the saw with a Surge scissors.
Well, I hope they have fun cutting up branches with those scissors. ;)
Why would anyone dismantle a Surge?
Lighten the load due to back problems? :whistle:
Post by: Lichtbote on February 26, 2015, 11:17:20 AM
There is room for a blade longer than 3.1" on a 4.5" tool
On a Surge .... a little bit, but not that much.
Free space between tip and those Endpieces around the pivot (measured just with a ruler, to lazy to go and pick the digi caliper):
2-3 mm on the serrated blade, 5 mm on the plain edge. Then metal would scratch on metal, so less free space in real. For around real 5 mm more the endpieces would need to be hollowed out, and maybe the pivots slimmed down. Not sure if additional 5 mm would be worth to weaken the construction.
On the other hand - the skeletool would be greatly improved with some mm bigger blade.
Post by: zoidberg on February 26, 2015, 11:39:10 AM
<- I bet someone here is going to replace the saw with a Surge scissors.
Well, I hope they have fun cutting up branches with those scissors. ;)
Why would anyone dismantle a Surge?
Sorry, what was the question? :pok:
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7348/15906674533_06241dc3c5.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/qeBSac)
Post by: BASguy on February 27, 2015, 12:23:17 AM
The Signal looks like an awesome tool if they changed the loadout. A scissor comparable to a Vic 93mm scissor would be awesome in place of the saw.
I think a saw is essential on an outdoor/"survival" tool. Although scissors would be nice as well, I wouldn't want them at the expense of the saw.
I agree that the Saw is essential for Outdoor use, maybe LM could come up with an EDC version with scissors.
I said I don't hike with a multi, I carry a SAK and that's it, and I only take a Multi camping because it's useful to have a tool that has pliers, drivers, and a file just in case equipment breaks down. Like I've said, I have a firestarter and a sharpener that both probably work ten times better than that dinky thing on the Signal and they weigh practically nothing.
I don't see a reason to replace my rebar with the Signal just for the sake of doing so. That's my problem, LM wants me to do just that, because it's there.
The Signal looks like an awesome tool if they changed the loadout. A scissor comparable to a Vic 93mm scissor would be awesome in place of the saw. And instead of a ferro rod they could use that space for bit storage. I might buy one for work because it has an appealing loadout as it is for what I do, but I would never need a firestarter/sharpener on it. It's a gimmick. I can't stand the new "Leatherman Sport" thing. It seems like wishful thinking and I don't see it lasting long.
I was just teasing - a SAK and a multitool are basically the same thing (although I do differentiate, just like most on MTO). So when you say you don't hike with a MT, but you have a SAK :think:
:rofl:
The Signal is definitely a polarizing tool, and it seems a lot of people aren't going to get one just based on principle, be it LM catering to consumer demand or what have you. But I do think it's going to be a good performer and quite handy.
Now we're splitting hairs lol. I don't carry a pliers based Multi when hiking due to weight. I've never needed pliers while hiking, that's not to say I wouldn't ever, but in my experience the weight isn't necessary. I usually carry a swisschamp or some other SAK with a Saw. Now that I think about it, I don't really even need that. A good fixed blade coupled with my folding gerber Saw is all I really need. I guess I carry the SAK more out of habit.
I do think the Signal looks cool, and I could use it at work. I use the saw on my rebar for cutting PVC all the time, and the bit driver is perfect for what I do. The only thing I don't like is the outdoor marketing and associated price hike. It's not worth that much, it's not even worth $80 to me when I can get a Wave for around $65 all day long and the Wave comes with a file and scissors!
I think it's pretty clear they jumped on this initial price point believing the survival/prepper crowd will carry the bulk of the sales initially. I'd certainly think the price will drop significantly, but who knows :shrug: I'm sure there will be plenty of people sucked into dropping $120 on this thing.
If marketing research says there is money to be made, it's kinda dumb not to go after it. I just wish they'd concentrate some of their resources on real tradesman tools, or even upgrades to existing lines (replaceable cutters on the Wave ring a bell?). It would be great to see them doing something in this area in conjunction with all this other skateboard/snowboard/survival/jewelry nonsense.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Syncop8r on February 27, 2015, 01:27:47 AM
<- I bet someone here is going to replace the saw with a Surge scissors.
Well, I hope they have fun cutting up branches with those scissors. ;)
Why would anyone dismantle a Surge?
Sorry, what was the question? :pok:
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7348/15906674533_06241dc3c5.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/qeBSac)
I mean as a donor for other MTs. Dismantling a Surge to improve it is perfectly acceptable.
Anyway, that could be anyone in that photo. :shrug:
Smartarse
Post by: Mercury on February 27, 2015, 04:17:13 AM
The Signal looks like an awesome tool if they changed the loadout. A scissor comparable to a Vic 93mm scissor would be awesome in place of the saw.
I think a saw is essential on an outdoor/"survival" tool. Although scissors would be nice as well, I wouldn't want them at the expense of the saw.
I agree that the Saw is essential for Outdoor use, maybe LM could come up with an EDC version with scissors.
I said I don't hike with a multi, I carry a SAK and that's it, and I only take a Multi camping because it's useful to have a tool that has pliers, drivers, and a file just in case equipment breaks down. Like I've said, I have a firestarter and a sharpener that both probably work ten times better than that dinky thing on the Signal and they weigh practically nothing.
I don't see a reason to replace my rebar with the Signal just for the sake of doing so. That's my problem, LM wants me to do just that, because it's there.
The Signal looks like an awesome tool if they changed the loadout. A scissor comparable to a Vic 93mm scissor would be awesome in place of the saw. And instead of a ferro rod they could use that space for bit storage. I might buy one for work because it has an appealing loadout as it is for what I do, but I would never need a firestarter/sharpener on it. It's a gimmick. I can't stand the new "Leatherman Sport" thing. It seems like wishful thinking and I don't see it lasting long.
I was just teasing - a SAK and a multitool are basically the same thing (although I do differentiate, just like most on MTO). So when you say you don't hike with a MT, but you have a SAK :think:
:rofl:
The Signal is definitely a polarizing tool, and it seems a lot of people aren't going to get one just based on principle, be it LM catering to consumer demand or what have you. But I do think it's going to be a good performer and quite handy.
Now we're splitting hairs lol. I don't carry a pliers based Multi when hiking due to weight. I've never needed pliers while hiking, that's not to say I wouldn't ever, but in my experience the weight isn't necessary. I usually carry a swisschamp or some other SAK with a Saw. Now that I think about it, I don't really even need that. A good fixed blade coupled with my folding gerber Saw is all I really need. I guess I carry the SAK more out of habit.
I do think the Signal looks cool, and I could use it at work. I use the saw on my rebar for cutting PVC all the time, and the bit driver is perfect for what I do. The only thing I don't like is the outdoor marketing and associated price hike. It's not worth that much, it's not even worth $80 to me when I can get a Wave for around $65 all day long and the Wave comes with a file and scissors!
I think it's pretty clear they jumped on this initial price point believing the survival/prepper crowd will carry the bulk of the sales initially. I'd certainly think the price will drop significantly, but who knows :shrug: I'm sure there will be plenty of people sucked into dropping $120 on this thing.
If marketing research says there is money to be made, it's kinda dumb not to go after it. I just wish they'd concentrate some of their resources on real tradesman tools, or even upgrades to existing lines (replaceable cutters on the Wave ring a bell?). It would be great to see them doing something in this area in conjunction with all this other skateboard/snowboard/survival/jewelry nonsense.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
This.
Post by: BASguy on March 01, 2015, 03:26:40 PM
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: NKlamerus on March 11, 2015, 01:13:44 AM
Plus a 3d printer could be REALLY interesting if someone wanted to make something for the rod and sharpening peices.
Post by: Higgins617 on March 11, 2015, 01:16:48 AM
I'm still excited. I think this will replace my Skelly as an edc.
Plus a 3d printer could be REALLY interesting if someone wanted to make something for the rod and sharpening peices.
So you'll be our test mule!?!?!?!
Post by: NKlamerus on March 11, 2015, 01:17:49 AM
SureI'm still excited. I think this will replace my Skelly as an edc.
Plus a 3d printer could be REALLY interesting if someone wanted to make something for the rod and sharpening peices.
So you'll be our test mule!?!?!?!
On another note, I have REALLY BEEN considering making a new blade for my skeletool. As well as making it with a flip trigger.
Post by: zoidberg on March 11, 2015, 02:30:09 AM
SureI'm still excited. I think this will replace my Skelly as an edc.
Plus a 3d printer could be REALLY interesting if someone wanted to make something for the rod and sharpening peices.
So you'll be our test mule!?!?!?!
On another note, I have REALLY BEEN considering making a new blade for my skeletool. As well as making it with a flip trigger.
A what now? :think:
Post by: NKlamerus on March 11, 2015, 02:31:49 AM
One of them fancy finger flippers? My ZT566 has one and I love it.SureI'm still excited. I think this will replace my Skelly as an edc.
Plus a 3d printer could be REALLY interesting if someone wanted to make something for the rod and sharpening peices.
So you'll be our test mule!?!?!?!
On another note, I have REALLY BEEN considering making a new blade for my skeletool. As well as making it with a flip trigger.
A what now? :think:
I'll do a thread on it as well as my EDC binder bag.
Post by: zoidberg on March 11, 2015, 02:36:23 AM
One of them fancy finger flippers? My ZT566 has one and I love it.SureI'm still excited. I think this will replace my Skelly as an edc.
Plus a 3d printer could be REALLY interesting if someone wanted to make something for the rod and sharpening peices.
So you'll be our test mule!?!?!?!
On another note, I have REALLY BEEN considering making a new blade for my skeletool. As well as making it with a flip trigger.
A what now? :think:
I'll do a thread on it as well as my EDC binder bag.
Isn't the second handle in the way?
Post by: NKlamerus on March 11, 2015, 02:40:02 AM
Yeah but this won't be on the "bottom" cutting edge.One of them fancy finger flippers? My ZT566 has one and I love it.SureI'm still excited. I think this will replace my Skelly as an edc.
Plus a 3d printer could be REALLY interesting if someone wanted to make something for the rod and sharpening peices.
So you'll be our test mule!?!?!?!
On another note, I have REALLY BEEN considering making a new blade for my skeletool. As well as making it with a flip trigger.
A what now? :think:
I'll do a thread on it as well as my EDC binder bag.
Isn't the second handle in the way?
It will technically be a low thumbstud
Post by: zoidberg on March 11, 2015, 02:46:23 AM
Yeah but this won't be on the "bottom" cutting edge.One of them fancy finger flippers? My ZT566 has one and I love it.SureI'm still excited. I think this will replace my Skelly as an edc.
Plus a 3d printer could be REALLY interesting if someone wanted to make something for the rod and sharpening peices.
So you'll be our test mule!?!?!?!
On another note, I have REALLY BEEN considering making a new blade for my skeletool. As well as making it with a flip trigger.
A what now? :think:
I'll do a thread on it as well as my EDC binder bag.
Isn't the second handle in the way?
It will technically be a low thumbstud
:popcorn:
Post by: sergemaster on March 11, 2015, 02:51:43 AM
Dittos!!....
Cheers,
Serge
Post by: JAfromMn on March 11, 2015, 03:30:47 AM
:tu:
Post by: rescue4500 on March 11, 2015, 06:15:28 PM
Post by: Kampfer on March 11, 2015, 06:21:05 PM
My wife asked me what I wanted for my birthday so I said the leatherman signal but my birthday is june 8th. and the signal wont be out till after that :(Then it is good time to ask permission for a trip to strip club. >:D
Post by: Obi1shinobee on March 12, 2015, 05:42:21 AM
>:D :rofl: :gimme:My wife asked me what I wanted for my birthday so I said the leatherman signal but my birthday is june 8th. and the signal wont be out till after that :(Then it is good time to ask permission for a trip to strip club. >:D
Post by: ducttapetech on March 12, 2015, 01:12:48 PM
Good solid plan.>:D :rofl: :gimme:My wife asked me what I wanted for my birthday so I said the leatherman signal but my birthday is june 8th. and the signal wont be out till after that :(Then it is good time to ask permission for a trip to strip club. >:D
Nate
Post by: rescue4500 on March 12, 2015, 02:50:40 PM
Post by: Demel on March 12, 2015, 03:42:20 PM
haha nah I only have eyes for her
:salute: :salute: :salute:
Post by: Mercury on March 12, 2015, 08:26:01 PM
Amici,
Dittos!!....
Cheers,
Serge
Great to see you again Sergemaster!!!!! :cheers: :cheers:
Post by: Kampfer on March 12, 2015, 09:42:50 PM
(http://s3images.coroflot.com/user_files/individual_files/243671_jwlegfsopinzbkamccapmafuc.jpg)
(http://s3images.coroflot.com/user_files/individual_files/243671_usqqhrfytgi80rxfdpo9jupfb.jpg)
(http://s3images.coroflot.com/user_files/individual_files/243671_qidzxba8zzwkhlk4yyzy0wadz.jpg)
Post by: Obi1shinobee on March 12, 2015, 09:44:52 PM
Post by: Kampfer on March 12, 2015, 09:46:32 PM
Red whistle look Vicious :drool: :drool: :drool: :gimme:No whistle is better
Post by: Kampfer on March 12, 2015, 09:47:48 PM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on March 12, 2015, 09:49:14 PM
Who is Jason Carpenter?
Zoid real name?? :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Post by: BASguy on March 13, 2015, 12:59:07 AM
Who is Jason Carpenter?The first sucker milked out of $120?
(http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/03/12/24a4d439256d10e073881ddea6c24365.jpg)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Obi1shinobee on March 13, 2015, 01:11:13 AM
:rofl:Who is Jason Carpenter?The first sucker milked out of $120?
(http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/03/12/24a4d439256d10e073881ddea6c24365.jpg)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Metropolicity on March 15, 2015, 12:43:02 AM
Post by: gadgetman7 on March 15, 2015, 01:47:54 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Obi1shinobee on March 15, 2015, 02:48:10 AM
If I can find a good replacement plain edge blade with good steel I'll have to get one of these. But...I'll definitely wait for the price to go down.
Sent from Tracy Island
i wait for price go down 60-75 $
Post by: Jand3rson86 on March 16, 2015, 03:35:14 AM
And those drawings are GORGEOUS.
Post by: Kampfer on March 16, 2015, 05:01:53 AM
Jason Carpenter is one of the head tool designer/engineers at Leatherman.:hatsoff:
Post by: BASguy on March 21, 2015, 03:35:36 AM
Jason Carpenter is one of the head tool designer/engineers at Leatherman.:hatsoff:
I'd think a facemask and :hat on: would be appropriate after owning up to this thing..... Yikes
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: Kampfer on March 24, 2015, 11:09:51 PM
Post by: Kampfer on March 24, 2015, 11:13:13 PM
Post by: babola on March 24, 2015, 11:35:04 PM
The awl kinda share the same layer with the main blade.
It appears so from the video, although they will be at a sligth offset from each other.
Have you noticed that aggressive bevel on the awl? Most likely done so that the knife tip has enough clearance on folding.
The bevel on that awl is so massive you can almost sharpen the edge of it and use it as a small auxiliary knife.
Post by: Demel on March 24, 2015, 11:42:54 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWStTb-NMwY
good review, he just talked really really fast. Nice to see a size comparison.
Post by: Kampfer on March 25, 2015, 12:08:45 AM
My thoughts the same :tu:The awl kinda share the same layer with the main blade.
It appears so from the video, although they will be at a sligth offset from each other.
Have you noticed that aggressive bevel on the awl? Most likely done so that the knife tip has enough clearance on folding.
The bevel on that awl is so massive you can almost sharpen the edge of it and use it as a small auxiliary knife.
Post by: sawman on March 25, 2015, 12:21:39 AM
Post by: rdub934 on March 25, 2015, 01:46:47 AM
Finally, why does this guy get to review it and not us? This is MULTITOOL.ORG, the #1 source for multitool reviews, information, and discussion on the web - and they send their latest offering to this guy. Really, Leatherman? Really?
Post by: Kampfer on March 25, 2015, 02:23:09 AM
Post by: derekmac on March 25, 2015, 03:48:08 AM
Because he has youtube channel, the place where most people look first before buying somethingThat is very true.
Megan, fix that!!! :pok: :D
Post by: Gareth on March 25, 2015, 09:13:01 AM
I'd be disappointed if those are the plastics we see on the final product, they really do look to be cheap and nasty.
Post by: Grant Lamontagne on March 25, 2015, 01:57:39 PM
Because he has youtube channel, the place where most people look first before buying somethingThat is very true.
Megan, fix that!!! :pok: :D
We actually do have a Youtube Channel:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmt03RC_rBR7tmz3eJVUPIQ
It is on the list of things to fix up, and I am certain you will be seeing a lot more there in the future.
Def
Post by: sawman on March 25, 2015, 03:27:59 PM
A lot of little innovations on the Signal that I am excited about. I have to say, though, I am a little concerned with the plastics pieces after watching that video. I believe that plastics are very versatile, but just judging from appearance in the video, it looks like very cheap plastic on the whistle and sharpener. I don't see a reason that the whistle couldn't be made of stainless steel - it would probably help with loudness even. I think the abrasive side of the sharpener needs to be covered in some way, as he mentioned in the video.Well said :tu: ALL very good points :salute:
Finally, why does this guy get to review it and not us? This is MULTITOOL.ORG, the #1 source for multitool reviews, information, and discussion on the web - and they send their latest offering to this guy. Really, Leatherman? Really?
Post by: Etherealicer on March 25, 2015, 03:59:09 PM
Finally, why does this guy get to review it and not us? This is MULTITOOL.ORG, the #1 source for multitool reviews, information, and discussion on the web - and they send their latest offering to this guy. Really, Leatherman? Really?Well, they wanted a positive review and the Signal got a lot of heat here. Beside, just going off the name "Urban Prepper", this sounds like the exact target audience.
Post by: Aloha on March 25, 2015, 06:44:43 PM
Finally, why does this guy get to review it and not us? This is MULTITOOL.ORG, the #1 source for multitool reviews, information, and discussion on the web - and they send their latest offering to this guy. Really, Leatherman? Really?Well, they wanted a positive review and the Signal got a lot of heat here. Beside, just going off the name "Urban Prepper", this sounds like the exact target audience.
I like the urban prepper but seriously that tool should have landed in the hands of a MTO member. I know some here have given this tool crap but I think with a few hands on the tool a well thought out review would have surfaced.
Hope to see the MTO you tube up and running very soon.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on March 25, 2015, 07:53:36 PM
Finally, why does this guy get to review it and not us? This is MULTITOOL.ORG, the #1 source for multitool reviews, information, and discussion on the web - and they send their latest offering to this guy. Really, Leatherman? Really?Well, they wanted a positive review and the Signal got a lot of heat here. Beside, just going off the name "Urban Prepper", this sounds like the exact target audience.
I like the urban prepper but seriously that tool should have landed in the hands of a MTO member. I know some here have given this tool crap but I think with a few hands on the tool a well thought out review would have surfaced.
Hope to see the MTO you tube up and running very soon.
YOU RIGHT ON THAT :salute:
Post by: Etherealicer on March 25, 2015, 08:11:16 PM
Hope we get to see the production ready thing soon. :popcorn:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on March 25, 2015, 08:16:52 PM
So, finally got a chance to watch the video. Since its still the prototype (with the whistle looking to be broken) there is still no good way to assess how the useful the final product will be. What the video shows is that LM still has to do a lot of work until this can live up to the LM quality standards.
Hope we get to see the production ready thing soon. :popcorn:
Leatherman gonna stay like that.. :facepalm:
Post by: Aloha on March 25, 2015, 08:33:15 PM
So, finally got a chance to watch the video. Since its still the prototype (with the whistle looking to be broken) there is still no good way to assess how the useful the final product will be. What the video shows is that LM still has to do a lot of work until this can live up to the LM quality standards.
Hope we get to see the production ready thing soon. :popcorn:
I understand it's a protoype but still we have such knowledgeable members and several with great photo skills that could better IMO discuss this tool.
This guy ( no offense ) isnt the type that would buy this tool anyway. URBAN prep. Put it in the hands of a casual or real outdoorsman. Heck what do I know LM managed to build an empire without my help, edit I have 100 LM tools so I did help some :rofl:
Post by: Etherealicer on March 25, 2015, 08:56:34 PM
I agree, he missed on testing the sharpener and the ferro rod (2 of the 4 new tools, ok, so the hammer is not entierly new).So, finally got a chance to watch the video. Since its still the prototype (with the whistle looking to be broken) there is still no good way to assess how the useful the final product will be. What the video shows is that LM still has to do a lot of work until this can live up to the LM quality standards.
Hope we get to see the production ready thing soon. :popcorn:
I understand it's a protoype but still we have such knowledgeable members and several with great photo skills that could better IMO discuss this tool.
This guy ( no offense ) isnt the type that would buy this tool anyway. URBAN prep. Put it in the hands of a casual or real outdoorsman. Heck what do I know LM managed to build an empire without my help, edit I have 100 LM tools so I did help some :rofl:
He did however raise some valid points and the video quality is good. I like his idea of engraving some signaling basics, like the Morse code. So, I like that he did the review giving a different perspective.
Also his audience is more likely going to buy this tool than outdoorsmen.
Post by: Aloha on March 25, 2015, 09:07:08 PM
I agree, he missed on testing the sharpener and the ferro rod (2 of the 4 new tools, ok, so the hammer is not entierly new).So, finally got a chance to watch the video. Since its still the prototype (with the whistle looking to be broken) there is still no good way to assess how the useful the final product will be. What the video shows is that LM still has to do a lot of work until this can live up to the LM quality standards.
Hope we get to see the production ready thing soon. :popcorn:
I understand it's a protoype but still we have such knowledgeable members and several with great photo skills that could better IMO discuss this tool.
This guy ( no offense ) isnt the type that would buy this tool anyway. URBAN prep. Put it in the hands of a casual or real outdoorsman. Heck what do I know LM managed to build an empire without my help, edit I have 100 LM tools so I did help some :rofl:
He did however raise some valid points and the video quality is good. I like his idea of engraving some signaling basics, like the Morse code. So, I like that he did the review giving a different perspective.
Also his audience is more likely going to buy this tool than outdoorsmen.
He does a great job. I agree that the target is his audience as well. I guess I would like to see an outdoorsman take on it. I'd also like to see a regular MT users take. He has a very good channel and is known for being detailed. I like the dude and have watched a fair amount of his videos. He does bring up a some nice points from a Urban view which is valid no question.
I just would have loved to see it in the hands of one of own. Grathr, Ductapetech, Syncop8er, Comis, hiraethus are some good ones to start with. Then in the hands of average joes who get out one in a while then guys who just want a cool tool. I know too much to ask. One can hope tho so LM if you are reading this send that tool to one of the fellas I mentioned.
Post by: Kampfer on March 25, 2015, 09:11:09 PM
Post by: BASguy on March 26, 2015, 04:37:30 AM
What I did think was good is the video really showed the size well. This tool body is a win in my opinion. If they release other tradesman style versions with this general frame, I could see that being a real win for them. I'm definitely not wild about this tool, but I gotta say they are seemingly onto something here. It will be interesting to see where it leads.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Aloha on March 26, 2015, 05:09:48 AM
Reviewing a prototype seems to highlight the current deficiencies. That seems to be less than ideal given the ridiculously high price point this tool is sporting. It also doesn't seem to help in the QC dept where Leatherman has taken a hit in recent years.
What I did think was good is the video really showed the size well. This tool body is a win in my opinion. If they release other tradesman style versions with this general frame, I could see that being a real win for them. I'm definitely not wild about this tool, but I gotta say they are seemingly onto something here. It will be interesting to see where it leads.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Could they be sending it out looking for actual honest feedback rather than a bunch of monkey raving about how cool it is to get a better direction?
I also thought the size was good and the concept is not bad at all just some tweaks and refinements to what the tool is supposed to be not what its trying to be.
Post by: Higgins617 on March 26, 2015, 05:38:34 AM
Post by: Kampfer on March 26, 2015, 06:21:20 PM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on March 26, 2015, 06:26:07 PM
If the finished product is fatter than Wave would be a deal breaker for me.
Look like it.. :facepalm:
Post by: Kampfer on March 26, 2015, 06:35:59 PM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on March 26, 2015, 09:12:44 PM
Post by: captain spaulding on March 26, 2015, 09:36:29 PM
i will buy when go down 50 bucks :gimme:
Looks like your never going to get one then. :D
Post by: Obi1shinobee on March 26, 2015, 09:37:06 PM
i will buy when go down 50 bucks :gimme:
Looks like your never going to get one then. :D
Never say never :viking:
Post by: BASguy on March 26, 2015, 11:04:44 PM
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Obi1shinobee on March 27, 2015, 12:24:50 AM
I have a feeling that TEOTWAWKI crowd is gonna eat this thing up.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
:rofl:
Post by: zoidberg on March 27, 2015, 06:02:54 AM
I have a feeling that TEOTWAWKI crowd is gonna eat this thing up.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I do hope they have a good digestive system. :P
Post by: BASguy on March 27, 2015, 11:11:24 PM
I have a feeling that TEOTWAWKI crowd is gonna eat this thing up.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I do hope they have a good digestive system. :P
LOL
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: Demel on April 21, 2015, 10:23:10 PM
Post by: Mr. Whippy on April 22, 2015, 05:23:12 PM
After reviewing the Signal on Leatherman's site, here are my thoughts:
1. Ditch the can opener. In a pinch, I can use the awl.
2. Put that awesome diamond coat file in the slot freed up
3. Ditch the whistle and add more on board bit storage. OR...
3a. Add a detachable alligator wrench. 8)
4. I'm fine with keeping the detachable sharpener. That's cool. 8)
The overall frame of the Signal is great. I will almost certainly end up with one at some point.
Post by: Mr. Whippy on April 22, 2015, 05:31:57 PM
Post by: leathermon on May 14, 2015, 07:20:07 AM
Post by: gadgetman7 on May 15, 2015, 01:54:13 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Kampfer on May 26, 2015, 07:17:23 PM
Once I got I would start hacking it, the plan is install S35V blade and wingman scissors on its outside, convert the whistler to but storage and dye it black.
Post by: rishardh on May 26, 2015, 07:21:49 PM
I am still waiting for its release.
Once I got I would start hacking it, the plan is install S35V blade and wingman scissors on its outside, convert the whistler to but storage and dye it black.
... and what are going to call it?
Post by: BASguy on May 26, 2015, 07:39:22 PM
The Paycheck BreakerI am still waiting for its release.
Once I got I would start hacking it, the plan is install S35V blade and wingman scissors on its outside, convert the whistler to but storage and dye it black.
... and what are going to call it?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Kampfer on May 26, 2015, 10:03:23 PM
My paycheck is a lot bigger than it can break. :DThe Paycheck BreakerI am still waiting for its release.
Once I got I would start hacking it, the plan is install S35V blade and wingman scissors on its outside, convert the whistler to but storage and dye it black.
... and what are going to call it?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: BASguy on May 27, 2015, 03:01:53 AM
Congratulations on your wealth and successMy paycheck is a lot bigger than it can break. :DThe Paycheck BreakerI am still waiting for its release.
Once I got I would start hacking it, the plan is install S35V blade and wingman scissors on its outside, convert the whistler to but storage and dye it black.
... and what are going to call it?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: babola on May 28, 2015, 02:42:34 AM
... wingman scissors on its outside...
Let us know how that goes ;)
Post by: Kampfer on June 21, 2015, 09:38:24 AM
Post by: Etherealicer on June 21, 2015, 09:49:14 AM
Found two new photos on Facebook, I was told many improvements were made since the UP's video review.I see change in the hammer/clip design.
Post by: gadgetman7 on June 21, 2015, 03:39:33 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Jand3rson86 on June 22, 2015, 05:11:26 AM
Post by: GPDB on June 22, 2015, 08:13:48 PM
Post by: BASguy on June 23, 2015, 03:35:52 AM
I wonder how easy it would be to design a bit carrier to get rid of the silly whistle/fire starter insert. They could probably include one for less than 50¢.That would be great option for this. It would actually give the tool far more practical purpose, instead of such a limited target market.
Sent from Tracy Island
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: babola on June 23, 2015, 11:21:56 AM
Found two new photos on Facebook, I was told many improvements were made since the UP's video review.
That is a very different tool from the prototype we've seen so far, indeed.
Hammer has changed, scales are ever so slightly slimlined and brushed/polished instead of matte black, clip is now shiny S/S and has (unfortunately) remained the same design even though they said the final clip will be different. Plastic bits (whistle and ferro rod holder) are now different design too.
Pivot screws are huge and out of aesthetic proportions, it appears they borrowed now these from the MUT. Some smaller srews on scales are replaced with pins/studs.
Dunno, I'm eager to see the first review, though :-\
Post by: enki_ck on June 24, 2015, 11:07:13 PM
I still like the tool in general though. ;)
Post by: Kampfer on June 24, 2015, 11:13:23 PM
Is it just me or would this be a much better tool without the whistle and sharpener bits? Cheaper too. More compact and slimmer. I know you can remove those but you'll be paying for those bits and their R&D non the less.:imws:
I still like the tool in general though. ;)
Post by: Syncop8r on June 25, 2015, 01:00:03 AM
Is it just me or would this be a much better tool without the whistle and sharpener bits? Cheaper too. More compact and slimmer. I know you can remove those but you'll be paying for those bits and their R&D non the less.
I still like the tool in general though. ;)
If you take away some of the things that make it a 'unique' outdoor multitool then you're left with something more generic like a Wave.
Post by: sawman on June 25, 2015, 01:03:10 AM
Post by: Kampfer on June 25, 2015, 01:27:10 AM
Quote
Main ones are improved fire starter housing and whistle, the sharpener has been made stronger and now clips in behind the internal tool release. Now comes with a cerokote rather than dlc.....looks and feels pretty sound
Post by: babola on June 25, 2015, 03:10:00 AM
QuoteMain ones are improved fire starter housing and whistle, the sharpener has been made stronger and now clips in behind the internal tool release. Now comes with a cerokote rather than dlc.....looks and feels pretty sound
Sounds like 'product in development'...V2 with new tweaks and design changes may follow soon after initial release.
I'm sitting this one out for the time being. :-\
Post by: gadgetman7 on June 25, 2015, 02:16:28 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: sawman on June 25, 2015, 03:13:53 PM
I'd like to handle one but not at $120.That's an arrogant price alright :td:
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Aloha on June 25, 2015, 04:39:01 PM
Post by: dks on June 25, 2015, 04:41:47 PM
Post by: Etherealicer on June 25, 2015, 04:46:27 PM
If they take aways the whistle can they still call it "SIGNAL" :think:
Yes!
This comes without whitle and is called signal too and according to the slogan its also for survival "protecting your family":
(http://www.auravita.com/OriginalImages/lefa/lefa10264_4_OI.jpg)
Post by: gadgetman7 on June 25, 2015, 06:41:45 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Syncop8r on June 26, 2015, 03:28:09 AM
If they take aways the whistle can they still call it "SIGNAL" :think:
Yes!
This comes without whitle and is called signal too and according to the slogan its also for survival "protecting your family":
(http://www.auravita.com/OriginalImages/lefa/lefa10264_4_OI.jpg)
Perhaps after using this your teeth are so clean they whistle?
Post by: in_sympathy on June 26, 2015, 06:45:01 AM
I pretty sure they wouldn't take it away but they could add a bit carrier in the package go a minimal amount. I just wish they would replace the saw with a blade exchanger like the Surge.
Sent from Tracy Island
Can't be done from design perspective - has to be a single unit since it is a survival item. Imagine loosing all those replaceable files and saws during some catastrophe
Dream. Wish. Leave nothing undone. Repeat.
Post by: Rossko07 on June 26, 2015, 09:40:10 AM
I'd like to handle one but not at $120.That's an arrogant price alright :td:
Sent from Tracy Island
Listed as $262.00 on Leatherman Australia!
Post by: in_sympathy on June 26, 2015, 10:01:53 AM
I'd like to handle one but not at $120.That's an arrogant price alright :td:
Sent from Tracy Island
Listed as $262.00 on Leatherman Australia!
Holy Molly, that's too much even in Australian dollars
Dream. Wish. Leave nothing undone. Repeat.
Post by: gadgetman7 on June 26, 2015, 09:32:19 PM
I pretty sure they wouldn't take it away but they could add a bit carrier in the package go a minimal amount. I just wish they would replace the saw with a blade exchanger like the Surge.
Sent from Tracy Island
Can't be done from design perspective - has to be a single unit since it is a survival item. Imagine loosing all those replaceable files and saws during some catastrophe
Dream. Wish. Leave nothing undone. Repeat.
Hmm...you have a point, have to find a way to somehow attach them too.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: babola on June 26, 2015, 09:42:49 PM
I'd like to handle one but not at $120.That's an arrogant price alright :td:
Sent from Tracy Island
Listed as $262.00 on Leatherman Australia!
LOL...this will mean we'll be hit with a NZ$300 retail here in New Zealandstan.
Post by: enki_ck on June 27, 2015, 12:34:07 AM
Better save your money for the trip home. ;) Still counting on those :cheers: this summer. :drink:I'd like to handle one but not at $120.That's an arrogant price alright :td:
Sent from Tracy Island
Listed as $262.00 on Leatherman Australia!
LOL...this will mean we'll be hit with a NZ$300 retail here in New Zealandstan.
:D
Post by: Syncop8r on June 27, 2015, 02:25:40 AM
I'd like to handle one but not at $120.That's an arrogant price alright :td:
Sent from Tracy Island
Listed as $262.00 on Leatherman Australia!
LOL...this will mean we'll be hit with a NZ$300 retail here in New Zealandstan.
Yeah but none of us actually buy them locally do we?
We buy on the interweb and pay 1/3 the local price. :P
Post by: babola on June 27, 2015, 02:41:46 AM
I'd like to handle one but not at $120.That's an arrogant price alright :td:
Sent from Tracy Island
Listed as $262.00 on Leatherman Australia!
LOL...this will mean we'll be hit with a NZ$300 retail here in New Zealandstan.
Yeah but none of us actually buy them locally do we?
We buy on the interweb and pay 1/3 the local price. :P
None of us does but the general public is gullible.
;-)
Post by: babola on June 27, 2015, 02:44:52 AM
Better save your money for the trip home. ;) Still counting on those :cheers: this summer. :drink:I'd like to handle one but not at $120.That's an arrogant price alright :td:
Sent from Tracy Island
Listed as $262.00 on Leatherman Australia!
LOL...this will mean we'll be hit with a NZ$300 retail here in New Zealandstan.
:D
Haha, thanks Nik...leaving next Wednesday but will be mostly based in Dalmatia, you're welcome to join me for a beer or few!
Cheers!
Post by: zoidberg on June 27, 2015, 02:45:56 AM
Better save your money for the trip home. ;) Still counting on those :cheers: this summer. :drink:I'd like to handle one but not at $120.That's an arrogant price alright :td:
Sent from Tracy Island
Listed as $262.00 on Leatherman Australia!
LOL...this will mean we'll be hit with a NZ$300 retail here in New Zealandstan.
:D
Haha, thanks Nik...leaving next Wednesday but will be mostly based in Dalmatia, you're welcome to join me for a beer or few!
Cheers!
One way or return trip?
Post by: babola on June 27, 2015, 03:25:00 AM
Better save your money for the trip home. ;) Still counting on those :cheers: this summer. :drink:I'd like to handle one but not at $120.That's an arrogant price alright :td:
Sent from Tracy Island
Listed as $262.00 on Leatherman Australia!
LOL...this will mean we'll be hit with a NZ$300 retail here in New Zealandstan.
:D
Haha, thanks Nik...leaving next Wednesday but will be mostly based in Dalmatia, you're welcome to join me for a beer or few!
Cheers!
One way or return trip?
6 weeks only, you won't get rid of me that easy haha!
Post by: zoidberg on June 27, 2015, 03:58:30 AM
Better save your money for the trip home. ;) Still counting on those :cheers: this summer. :drink:I'd like to handle one but not at $120.That's an arrogant price alright :td:
Sent from Tracy Island
Listed as $262.00 on Leatherman Australia!
LOL...this will mean we'll be hit with a NZ$300 retail here in New Zealandstan.
:D
Haha, thanks Nik...leaving next Wednesday but will be mostly based in Dalmatia, you're welcome to join me for a beer or few!
Cheers!
One way or return trip?
6 weeks only, you won't get rid of me that easy haha!
Well that's a relief, would hate to lose you. Have a good trip mate. :tu:
Post by: babola on June 27, 2015, 04:53:24 AM
Well that's a relief, would hate to lose you. Have a good trip mate. :tu:
:) Thanks for your kind words, mate.
Post by: babola on June 27, 2015, 04:56:51 AM
(http://forum.multitool.org/media/avatar_7688_1434019021.png)
You had to show that guy to the World, hadn't you... ::)
Now everybody knows what a tool our Prime Minister is... ;)
Post by: Syncop8r on June 27, 2015, 07:38:00 AM
Post by: rdub934 on June 27, 2015, 05:32:57 PM
Post by: Jand3rson86 on June 28, 2015, 12:48:19 AM
Leatherman Utility / Survival Tool?
If it is based on a MUT frame, I'll really be looking forward to it.
It isn't really based on a MUT frame, per se, but more of a MUT-inspired tool. I've gotten to play with what's very close to being the finished tool, and it's VERY cool. I really think people are going to love it.
Post by: Kampfer on June 28, 2015, 12:58:22 AM
Post by: Rossko07 on June 28, 2015, 02:41:04 AM
Post by: sawman on June 28, 2015, 03:00:22 AM
Post by: Demel on June 28, 2015, 04:10:01 AM
I just don't see them selling for that much when you can get a Rebar for $40/50 which has everything. I bet the Rebar is one of their top sellers.Everything but the :whistle: the Rebar is a sweet deal. unless you NEED a mt oho blades, the rebar is awsome. It's lighter and more compact than the wave without losing capability.
Post by: Kampfer on June 28, 2015, 05:27:18 AM
What size are the blades? Wave or surge length?2.7", Skeletool sidekick wingman size
Post by: Rossko07 on June 28, 2015, 05:59:08 AM
What size are the blades? Wave or surge length?2.7", Skeletool sidekick wingman size
That's a joke right?
Post by: Kampfer on June 28, 2015, 07:12:41 AM
I wish it was a joke.What size are the blades? Wave or surge length?2.7", Skeletool sidekick wingman size
That's a joke right?
Post by: tommywp on June 28, 2015, 01:08:31 PM
Post by: TheDude on June 28, 2015, 04:27:19 PM
I just don't see them selling for that much when you can get a Rebar for $40/50 which has everything. I bet the Rebar is one of their top sellers.Everything but the :whistle: the Rebar is a sweet deal. unless you NEED a mt oho blades, the rebar is awsome. It's lighter and more compact than the wave without losing capability.
Well, some rebars have everything.
Post by: gadgetman7 on July 24, 2015, 09:43:59 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Kampfer on July 24, 2015, 09:51:53 PM
Post by: rescue4500 on July 24, 2015, 10:06:40 PM
Post by: sawman on July 24, 2015, 10:25:14 PM
This tool seems to offer too little for the space it takes up - if that makes sense - kinda like the Skeletool.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on July 24, 2015, 10:29:09 PM
I just don't see them selling for that much when you can get a Rebar for $40/50 which has everything. I bet the Rebar is one of their top sellers.Everything but the :whistle: the Rebar is a sweet deal. unless you NEED a mt oho blades, the rebar is awsome. It's lighter and more compact than the wave without losing capability.
Well, some rebars have everything.
Cute :gimme:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on July 24, 2015, 11:25:14 PM
Post by: Sea Monster on July 24, 2015, 11:40:15 PM
I do not hate it.
As always, price point is a big factor, but this is kinda neat, just little things let it down.
(I did not watch the whole UP review, but got through a few minutes to get a good look at the beastie)
Yeah yeah, plain blade would be nice, but it is the whistle and sharpener that get me.
Is that thing going to do much? I have not had much joy with those sorts of small "survival" sharpeners. I carry a stone, and it does me well enough (and can do my axe in a pinch). I guess a sharpener is better than no sharpener, so if for some mysterious reason the ONLY survival item you have is the Signal, then sure. But how likely is that? If you are the sort of person who plans, and buys tools, you should know better.
Whistle is much the same to me, and that space could have something far more utilitarian in it.
I like the ferrorod, and why not? but spacewise on a multi, I suppose I would rather it on a lanyard / keychain or something, but It is probably the least offensive of the removable features.
I like the lightweight handles, and the MUT-ish clip/gentle persuader device, so that is a win.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on July 25, 2015, 04:32:25 AM
Post by: AlephZero on July 25, 2015, 10:54:59 AM
Besides, I know it's going to be a great tool and I would have gotten one anyways...
:cheers:
Post by: cody6268 on July 25, 2015, 05:32:20 PM
I have an $20 Super Tool and an $16 PST II I can choose from. A whistle is a buck or less (more for a good one). A fire striker is a couple dollars at most stores. All in total, I can make my own version, putting the other items in an $5 sheath for about $25--much less than the Signal's $120 price tag.
If it were half the price or so, I'd buy it.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on July 25, 2015, 06:31:40 PM
Post by: AlephZero on July 25, 2015, 07:54:10 PM
Plastic frame and limited toolset coupled with the high price means I'll pass. Based on the plastic frame, I'll probably be redeeming the warranty the first week.
I have an $20 Super Tool and an $16 PST II I can choose from. A whistle is a buck or less (more for a good one). A fire striker is a couple dollars at most stores. All in total, I can make my own version, putting the other items in an $5 sheath for about $25--much less than the Signal's $120 price tag.
If it were half the price or so, I'd buy it.
What is this plastic frame you talk about? Plastic scales like in so many other tools? *sighs*
Post by: rishardh on July 25, 2015, 08:21:00 PM
Remember the movie 127 Hours... if he had this he would have been able to sharpen the knife to self amputate his hand. The knock off Leatherman he had was blunt to begin with. He said he bought a real Leatherman after he survived and carries it with him on his adventures. I can see taking this on day hikes if you can carry the weight.
Post by: Kampfer on July 27, 2015, 08:08:07 PM
Luckily they just received one as sale floor sample, not suppose to show it yet but since I ask for it straight up, they brought it out to show me.
In my hand, first thing I noticed was how light it is given its size, it is a thin tool because it only has two outside tool slot instead of 4 like Wave. The knife blade is thick and could be longer IMO. The awl has weird shape and it is not sharp. The handle is steel with DLC coating. Handle lock is integrated in hammer head, easy to lock and unlock. Overall feel like a nice tool up to leatherman's standard, but doesn't feel as nice in hand as Skeletool.
That is all based on the few minutes I got to play with it.
(http://forum.multitool.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=51718.0;attach=198644;image)
Post by: babola on July 27, 2015, 09:25:24 PM
When I arrived at leatherman's retail store last week, first thing I asked for was the Signal.
Luckily they just received one as sale floor sample, not suppose to show it yet but since I ask for it straight up, they brought it out to show me.
In my hand, first thing I noticed was how light it is given its size, it is a thin tool because it only has two outside tool slot instead of 4 like Wave. The knife blade is thick and could be longer IMO. The awl has weird shape and it is not sharp. The handle is steel with DLC coating. Handle lock is integrated in hammer head, easy to lock and unlock. Overall feel like a nice tool up to leatherman's standard, but doesn't feel as nice in hand as Skeletool.
That is all based on the few minutes I got to play with it.
(http://forum.multitool.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=51718.0;attach=198644;image)
That handle lock looks like an afterthought fix for an unfortunate design oversight. Real frankenstein.
I wonder what the V2 will look like in few months.
Post by: Kampfer on July 27, 2015, 09:32:06 PM
Post by: captain spaulding on July 27, 2015, 10:33:41 PM
Post by: sawman on July 27, 2015, 10:44:40 PM
If they make different attachments that are useful to me I would consider a Signal, but as it sits I would never buy one.Twice the price of a Rebar yet half the tool. No thanks :td:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on July 27, 2015, 10:46:03 PM
If they make different attachments that are useful to me I would consider a Signal, but as it sits I would never buy one.Twice the price of a Rebar yet half the tool. No thanks :td:
hahahhaa :facepalm: :rofl:
Post by: captain spaulding on July 27, 2015, 10:50:08 PM
If they make different attachments that are useful to me I would consider a Signal, but as it sits I would never buy one.Twice the price of a Rebar yet half the tool. No thanks :td:
I forgot to mention the price has to be right as well. I would not spend over $50 for one in my desired configuration.
Post by: sawman on July 27, 2015, 10:50:43 PM
While I applaud LM for cranking out something new, I don't see many of these selling.If they make different attachments that are useful to me I would consider a Signal, but as it sits I would never buy one.Twice the price of a Rebar yet half the tool. No thanks :td:
hahahhaa :facepalm: :rofl:
Place your bets!
Post by: captain spaulding on July 27, 2015, 10:54:53 PM
While I applaud LM for cranking out something new, I don't see many of these selling.If they make different attachments that are useful to me I would consider a Signal, but as it sits I would never buy one.Twice the price of a Rebar yet half the tool. No thanks :td:
hahahhaa :facepalm: :rofl:
Place your bets!
I think they will do alright on them. They will sell more than the Skeletool SX, Juice SX, and Tread. I still can't believe the Skeletool SX and Juice SX. There is literally one or two people (that I know of) on the forum with the Skeletool SX and one or two with the Juice SX. I have never seen ANYONE else with wither of those tools. Like I said I think the Signal will do decent as (for some reason I do not understand) people like plastic gimmicky crap on their multitools and its on the MUT's platform which people like.
Post by: Kampfer on July 27, 2015, 10:57:41 PM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on July 27, 2015, 10:58:01 PM
Post by: Kampfer on July 27, 2015, 10:59:35 PM
Post by: captain spaulding on July 27, 2015, 11:00:17 PM
LM posts lots Skeletool SX pictures on their fackbook page, really trying to push it.
I don't have FB so I would not know, but it shows how desperate they are to move some product. They have been on the market for a year or two now if I remember correctly. They have probably sold a total of 12 of them worldwide. :D
Post by: Kampfer on July 27, 2015, 11:00:37 PM
Post by: captain spaulding on July 27, 2015, 11:02:00 PM
BTW, I feel Signal is a Mini-MUT, not a large Skeletool.
Same as I mentioned the MUT owners will like it as its the same platform but smaller. I only mentioned the Skeletool as the SX version is a flop.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on July 27, 2015, 11:07:31 PM
If i could fit a 3" blade and external scissors on it, and reshape its awl, ditch the yellow gadgets, it might be my idle EDC tool.
:twak:
Post by: Sea Monster on July 27, 2015, 11:17:05 PM
If anyone else gets close to one, could we get a profile shot to see the slimness?
Quote
Twice the price of a Rebar yet half the tool. No thanks
And there is the rub, and why most people§ carry Waves/Blasts/Rebars than anything else in the lineup.
§Normal people. not you lot.
Post by: sawman on July 27, 2015, 11:19:44 PM
I'd MUCH rather have an actual MUT and have the long drivers :tu: :tu:BTW, I feel Signal is a Mini-MUT, not a large Skeletool.
Same as I mentioned the MUT owners will like it as its the same platform but smaller. I only mentioned the Skeletool as the SX version is a flop.
Post by: babola on July 27, 2015, 11:21:28 PM
Release day would be in Sept, so what I played would be the final version.
It's too late for any changes now, my guess is few tweaks to it around Christmas time.
The more I look at it the more reasons I find against acquiring one. Maybe some day in the future.
Post by: babola on July 27, 2015, 11:28:36 PM
I'd MUCH rather have an actual MUT and have the long drivers :tu: :tu:BTW, I feel Signal is a Mini-MUT, not a large Skeletool.
Same as I mentioned the MUT owners will like it as its the same platform but smaller. I only mentioned the Skeletool as the SX version is a flop.
Agree. I personally place MUT in a whole different category. That's a real tool with full sized implements.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on July 28, 2015, 01:17:56 AM
BTW, I feel Signal is a Mini-MUT, not a large Skeletool.
I know Kampferman will buy two Signal . Send me one please :rofl: :gimme: :drool:
Post by: captain spaulding on July 28, 2015, 01:34:39 AM
I'd MUCH rather have an actual MUT and have the long drivers :tu: :tu:BTW, I feel Signal is a Mini-MUT, not a large Skeletool.
Same as I mentioned the MUT owners will like it as its the same platform but smaller. I only mentioned the Skeletool as the SX version is a flop.
I agree with the long drivers, but I rather have a Skeletool. I don't like the MUT very much.
Post by: Kampfer on July 28, 2015, 02:02:34 AM
That is what I do, for Mini-Surge or Skulltool.
Post by: Etherealicer on July 28, 2015, 10:02:23 AM
Why?
Show content
It's the perfect tool, to put into a survival pouch!
Show content
The place it on your make-up table and you are ready!
Show content
Ready for anything!
Show content
Anything like a "Walking Dead"-marathon!
Post by: captain spaulding on July 28, 2015, 10:14:34 AM
I think the Signal will do very well!
Why?Show contentIt's the perfect tool, to put into a survival pouch!Show contentThe place it on your make-up table and you are ready!Show contentReady for anything!Show contentAnything like a "Walking Dead"-marathon!
Could you imagine if Leatherman paid for a commercial spot during The Walking Dead and made a Leatherman Signal/ zombie commercial! They would probably sell 10,000 tools the first week to people who wouldn't even use them. Even better would be if they did the commercial and then got the tool used (close up) on the show and have Rick say something like "If I didn't have my Leatherman we would of been screwed". :D
Post by: Kampfer on July 28, 2015, 10:19:37 AM
I love the show but at some point it getting unreasonable, they could crush zombies skulls with pretty much ANYTHING! Even with plastic container.
Post by: captain spaulding on July 28, 2015, 10:26:07 AM
Great idea Cap!
I love the show but at some point it getting unreasonable, they could crush zombies skulls with pretty much ANYTHING! Even with plastic container.
There is a method to the madness (at least that is what I am telling myself).
They have mentioned decomposition of zombies and how easily they can be killed. I would like to think this is why some are much easier to kill than others. Watch carefully on the "age" of the zombie and how easy they are to kill.
Post by: Kampfer on July 28, 2015, 10:27:35 AM
Post by: Etherealicer on July 28, 2015, 10:31:48 AM
How quick does bone discompost? Not that quick!No, but everything else does, so basically the Zombies should fall into pieces when they try to move :rofl:
Post by: captain spaulding on July 28, 2015, 10:52:53 AM
How quick does bone discompost? Not that quick!No, but everything else does, so basically the Zombies should fall into pieces when they try to move :rofl:
They have had zombies like that on the show.
Post by: Etherealicer on July 28, 2015, 10:53:05 AM
Exactly.I think the Signal will do very well!
Why?Show contentIt's the perfect tool, to put into a survival pouch!Show contentThe place it on your make-up table and you are ready!Show contentReady for anything!Show contentAnything like a "Walking Dead"-marathon!
Could you imagine if Leatherman paid for a commercial spot during The Walking Dead and made a Leatherman Signal/ zombie commercial! They would probably sell 10,000 tools the first week to people who wouldn't even use them. Even better would be if they did the commercial and then got the tool used (close up) on the show and have Rick say something like "If I didn't have my Leatherman we would of been screwed". :D
And you know what is even better when you sell a tool to people that don't use it?
You can skip quality control and you still won't have any warranty claims.
Now turning cynicism off...
Like with their sports gear, they are venturing into a "new" market, the yuppie preppers. And why not, the urban population has money, they like shiny things, they like to be though, they like tools (makes them more manly, something that gets a bit lost in the big city) and they like to think of themselves as handy do-it-yourselfers. Maybe that even works for the Tread, although it should probably be fitted with an iWatch.
The price also fits the more urban crowd because they strongly believe in more expensive equals better.
Post by: captain spaulding on July 28, 2015, 10:53:51 AM
How quick does bone discompost? Not that quick!
The "virus" could affect bone density and make it very weak. That's not out of the realm of possibility.
Post by: Etherealicer on July 28, 2015, 11:01:32 AM
Zombies have no blood flow.How quick does bone discompost? Not that quick!
The "virus" could affect bone density and make it very weak. That's not out of the realm of possibility.
No blood flow means acid would accumulate in the muscle (lactic acid).
The acid dissolves the calcium in the bone making the bone soft and rubbery but also even more like a sponge.
Liquid (water) goes into the sponge-like bones.
In winter or particularly cold nights the liquid freezes and produces micro-fractures (kinda like stone to sand in deserts).
Voila, ultra-weak bones explained.
Post by: captain spaulding on July 28, 2015, 11:11:45 AM
Zombies have no blood flow.How quick does bone discompost? Not that quick!
The "virus" could affect bone density and make it very weak. That's not out of the realm of possibility.
No blood flow means acid would accumulate in the muscle (lactic acid).
The acid dissolves the calcium in the bone making the bone soft and rubbery but also even more like a sponge.
Liquid (water) goes into the sponge-like bones.
In winter or particularly cold nights the liquid freezes and produces micro-fractures (kinda like stone to sand in deserts).
Voila, ultra-weak bones explained.
:imws:
Post by: Etherealicer on July 28, 2015, 11:15:00 AM
Hey, what else did you think my pompous title in biology is good for?Zombies have no blood flow.How quick does bone discompost? Not that quick!
The "virus" could affect bone density and make it very weak. That's not out of the realm of possibility.
No blood flow means acid would accumulate in the muscle (lactic acid).
The acid dissolves the calcium in the bone making the bone soft and rubbery but also even more like a sponge.
Liquid (water) goes into the sponge-like bones.
In winter or particularly cold nights the liquid freezes and produces micro-fractures (kinda like stone to sand in deserts).
Voila, ultra-weak bones explained.
:imws:
And just to be clear, those are all scientific FACTS!
Post by: gadgetman7 on July 28, 2015, 11:18:22 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: TheDude on July 28, 2015, 12:42:30 PM
I sent Leatherman an email about availability. They just replied that they will start shipping in August. I still wonder whether they can be easily modded. In fact, it would be interesting to incorporate the long bits into the whistle area. I wonder if they'd fit.
Sent from Tracy Island
A mate of mine did a fitter and turner apprenticeship and he had a saying...
"If it doesn't fit. force it."
Post by: Kampfer on July 28, 2015, 06:35:40 PM
What a load of smurf. :facepalm:Hey, what else did you think my pompous title in biology is good for?:facepalm:Zombies have no blood flow.How quick does bone discompost? Not that quick!
The "virus" could affect bone density and make it very weak. That's not out of the realm of possibility.
No blood flow means acid would accumulate in the muscle (lactic acid).
The acid dissolves the calcium in the bone making the bone soft and rubbery but also even more like a sponge.
Liquid (water) goes into the sponge-like bones.
In winter or particularly cold nights the liquid freezes and produces micro-fractures (kinda like stone to sand in deserts).
Voila, ultra-weak bones explained.
:imws:
And just to be clear, those are all scientific FACTS!
Post by: Etherealicer on July 28, 2015, 06:59:15 PM
You are just jealouse, that you didn't think of that :rofl:What a load of smurf. :facepalm:Hey, what else did you think my pompous title in biology is good for?:facepalm:Zombies have no blood flow.How quick does bone discompost? Not that quick!
The "virus" could affect bone density and make it very weak. That's not out of the realm of possibility.
No blood flow means acid would accumulate in the muscle (lactic acid).
The acid dissolves the calcium in the bone making the bone soft and rubbery but also even more like a sponge.
Liquid (water) goes into the sponge-like bones.
In winter or particularly cold nights the liquid freezes and produces micro-fractures (kinda like stone to sand in deserts).
Voila, ultra-weak bones explained.
:imws:
And just to be clear, those are all scientific FACTS!
Post by: rescue4500 on August 03, 2015, 02:28:53 AM
Post by: rishardh on August 03, 2015, 06:41:12 AM
I actually think I'll skip on this one.. As bad as I want one it's way out of my price range and I've got all it has in my hiking pack
How about a hammer?
Post by: rescue4500 on August 03, 2015, 02:13:23 PM
ok... everything but a hammer!I actually think I'll skip on this one.. As bad as I want one it's way out of my price range and I've got all it has in my hiking pack
How about a hammer?
Post by: Etherealicer on August 03, 2015, 02:52:21 PM
:rofl:ok... everything but a hammer!I actually think I'll skip on this one.. As bad as I want one it's way out of my price range and I've got all it has in my hiking pack
How about a hammer?
Personally, I feel the hammer is a very intriguing addition, but like the MUT, the rest does not fit my needs. So, I'm kinda torn, which probably means I won't get one.
Post by: zoidberg on August 03, 2015, 03:12:41 PM
:rofl:ok... everything but a hammer!I actually think I'll skip on this one.. As bad as I want one it's way out of my price range and I've got all it has in my hiking pack
How about a hammer?
Personally, I feel the hammer is a very intriguing addition, but like the MUT, the rest does not fit my needs. So, I'm kinda torn, which probably means I won't get one.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8AggJ3_Xf0
Post by: TheDude on August 03, 2015, 05:02:20 PM
Post by: rishardh on August 04, 2015, 05:56:44 AM
:rofl:ok... everything but a hammer!I actually think I'll skip on this one.. As bad as I want one it's way out of my price range and I've got all it has in my hiking pack
How about a hammer?
Personally, I feel the hammer is a very intriguing addition, but like the MUT, the rest does not fit my needs. So, I'm kinda torn, which probably means I won't get one.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8AggJ3_Xf0
lol, loved it, especially air guitar :rofl:
Post by: rishardh on August 04, 2015, 07:09:54 AM
As a backpacker this tool really interests me. Almost everyone I have met at camps carry a basic SAK in their pockets and other gear in their bag. Very rarely I see a LM. Size and weight wise the Juices are sort of similar but to be honest Juices will never feel the same once sands gets in the scale so it's never carried again. Even though it still functions once you hear that crunchy/grinding noise you don't trust it any more.
I guess most of us will pay top $$$ for dependable, simple to use and lightweight gear if it's highly recommended by others on the trail or by store reps who also are into the same activities and will not mislead you. I guess that's going to be the key to this tool's success. Will first time users give a thumbs up or down?
Most of the time products created by market research are total failures. Remember the Pontiac Aztek :)
Post by: leatherman-shop.de on August 04, 2015, 02:13:26 PM
As a backpacker this tool really interests me. Almost everyone I have met at camps carry a basic SAK in their pockets and other gear in their bag. Very rarely I see a LM. Size and weight wise the Juices are sort of similar but to be honest Juices will never feel the same once sands gets in the scale so it's never carried again. Even though it still functions once you hear that crunchy/grinding noise you don't trust it any more.
I guess most of us will pay top $$$ for dependable, simple to use and lightweight gear if it's highly recommended by others on the trail or by store reps who also are into the same activities and will not mislead you. I guess that's going to be the key to this tool's success. Will first time users give a thumbs up or down?
Most of the time products created by market research are total failures. Remember the Pontiac Aztek :)
But the Signal doesn't look as bad as this "car" ::)
I am curious about the Look&Feel of th Signal
Post by: Jand3rson86 on August 09, 2015, 12:53:30 AM
Most of the time products created by market research are total failures. Remember the Pontiac Aztek :)
Walter White seemed to get pretty good use out of his.
Post by: Kampfer on August 12, 2015, 11:39:10 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=COm6Wmnv10s
Post by: Kampfer on August 12, 2015, 11:43:50 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Os40LfvfOgY
Post by: Obi1shinobee on August 13, 2015, 12:48:57 AM
Another new video, this one shows the Hammer can be use as bit holder.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Os40LfvfOgY
whistle and fire steel kinda cheap :facepalm:
Post by: Kampfer on August 13, 2015, 01:12:17 AM
Post by: Zephon on August 13, 2015, 01:33:31 AM
I'm probably better off with a Rebar that's *almost* half the price and (mostly) gets the job done.
Would be a good "starter" kit (?) for someone who still hasn't bought a knife sharpener, fero rod or whistle.
Post by: NKlamerus on August 21, 2015, 07:00:52 AM
Cabela's says shipping date would be 1~2 weeks ...They have updated it to 0-1 weeks
Post by: Gareth on August 21, 2015, 01:50:01 PM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on August 21, 2015, 03:11:14 PM
Post by: NKlamerus on August 21, 2015, 05:09:03 PM
Question is: who'll be the first to get one?I wish.
I'm actually pretty excited, not for the Signal itself. But for all the mods we will be making to it.
It has so much space for home made, 3D printed, and fabricated parts!!!
Post by: sawman on August 21, 2015, 05:28:11 PM
Post by: Kampfer on August 21, 2015, 06:18:49 PM
He is right.Question is: who'll be the first to get one?I wish.
I'm actually pretty excited, not for the Signal itself. But for all the mods we will be making to it.
It has so much space for home made, 3D printed, and fabricated parts!!!
Post by: Obi1shinobee on August 21, 2015, 07:18:00 PM
Post by: SAK Guy on August 21, 2015, 07:29:56 PM
Post by: Aloha on August 21, 2015, 08:41:14 PM
Post by: SteveC on August 21, 2015, 10:31:57 PM
:cheers:
Post by: Kampfer on August 21, 2015, 10:38:43 PM
Just carry a lighter man.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on August 21, 2015, 10:40:38 PM
Where you going to keep the bit? ???
Just carry a lighter man.
bit for what ?? got LM Ps4 on other pocket :rofl:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on August 21, 2015, 11:09:57 PM
Where you going to keep the bit? ???
Just carry a lighter man.
someone talking about bit .. strongest magnet in the world will take care of that :drool:
Post by: SAK Guy on August 21, 2015, 11:26:25 PM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on August 21, 2015, 11:30:17 PM
Very cool bit holder!!!!! :cheers:
picking up a chair with that Magnet :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Post by: kirk13 on August 21, 2015, 11:37:09 PM
Heinnies have them listed for pre-order at a mere £112!
:facepalm:
MP600 anyone?
Post by: SAK Guy on August 21, 2015, 11:39:59 PM
Very cool bit holder!!!!! :cheers:
picking up a chair with that Magnet :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
:ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :cheers: :rofl:
Wow!!!!
Post by: AimlessWanderer on August 21, 2015, 11:43:33 PM
Good news!
Heinnies have them listed for pre-order at a mere £112!
:facepalm:
MP600 anyone?
:D
£112 covers the hotel, evening meal, and bar bill so you don't have to sleep outside in the first place :rofl:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on August 22, 2015, 07:30:06 PM
Survival Blast!!!!! :D
:mail:
Post by: rdub934 on August 22, 2015, 08:44:00 PM
Where you going to keep the bit? ???
Just carry a lighter man.
someone talking about bit .. strongest magnet in the world will take care of that :drool:
That's great! :) You know, I can see a strong magnet as actually being a good inclusion in a MT. It would definitely take some considerations from a design stand point, but still...
Post by: NKlamerus on August 24, 2015, 05:54:48 AM
Post by: gadgetman7 on August 24, 2015, 03:14:40 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Aloha on August 24, 2015, 07:03:05 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWStTb-NMwY
Some time has passed since my last thoughts on this tool and while I still think there could be a different approach to the functionality it's actually growing on me. Here's why and some other thoughts,
1. The ferro should be seen as a back up. I personally would not go into any situation with out at least a handful of ways to start fire first of which is a lighter. Many of us use the one is none and 2 is one so why not a ferro rod? We have seen paracord bracelets with ferro rods, tins with tiny ferro rods, and any number of small BACK UP ferro rods so I'm ok with this tool having one. I dont mind it being plastic but orange would be a good choice IMO as well.
2. I like the idea of a tool to sharpen my blade however I'm not so sure about the execution of this one. Obi might be onto to something with his approach. I would like to see a larger option that like the bit on the MUT could slide into the frame.
3. Is there a way to make the frame a brighter color or color options? I'm sure this has been addressed already but worth noting again.
I do have some other thoughts but the more I'm seeing this tool the more I see a practical tool as either a backup/companion tool/fun tool/etc.
Post by: babola on September 01, 2015, 04:35:43 AM
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 01, 2015, 05:02:14 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Kampfer on September 01, 2015, 05:25:48 AM
Yeah, they were supposed to be out in August....Sept, as I was told in July.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: ba-ta on September 01, 2015, 06:29:41 AM
Yeah, they were supposed to be out in August....Sept, as I was told in July.
Sent from Tracy Island
Don't know if anyone here uses warriors and wonders but they have signals listed in Canadian $$$ and as in stock.
Post by: babola on September 01, 2015, 07:37:50 AM
Yeah, they were supposed to be out in August....Sept, as I was told in July.
Sent from Tracy Island
I also heard late August. :shrug:
Post by: babola on September 01, 2015, 07:40:57 AM
Don't know if anyone here uses warriors and wonders but they have signals listed in Canadian $$$ and as in stock.
Canadians must have some secret deal with Leatherman going on... ;)
Post by: Aloha on September 01, 2015, 07:11:09 PM
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 01, 2015, 08:03:56 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: leatherman-shop.de on September 04, 2015, 08:46:26 AM
Post by: babola on September 06, 2015, 08:58:14 AM
Just contacted Leatherman. They have shipped some to Canada but not the U.S. Yet due to packaging delays. Looks like the Canadians get first shot at this one.
Sent from Tracy Island
So any Canadians here to report in on their Signal acquisition or is all that just a myth...?
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 06, 2015, 04:25:08 PM
It's shown in stock and should be here by the end of the week. BTW it looks like the boxed version is shipping. That falls in line with the comment by Leatherman. I just hope I can get past the plastic parts.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Aloha on September 06, 2015, 04:33:25 PM
Post by: Gareth on September 08, 2015, 05:49:32 PM
Post by: SteveC on September 08, 2015, 06:33:39 PM
Hinnie Haynes (http://www.heinnie.com/leatherman-signal) have just listed the Signal as in stock. Unsurprisingly it's not cheap though.
That's close to $180 isn't it ? :ahhh
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 08, 2015, 06:36:38 PM
MUT, Signal and Skeletool
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 08, 2015, 06:44:07 PM
The Signal is definitely in between the MUT and the Skeletool in much the same way that the Rebar is in between the Supertool and the Juice series though the Signal has more in common with the MUT.
When I first took it out of the box the knife was not sharp. A few minutes on the Spyderco Sharpmaker fixed that problem. I also tried to use the attached file with little success. It's too short to effectively sharpen the blade and quite honestly it seems a little flimsy. The serrations are mediocre at best. Perhaps Leatherman should take a visit to Spyderco. The serrations did sharpen well on the Sharpmaker however, and in fact included file does fit the serrations.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 08, 2015, 06:47:43 PM
The tools in the handle do not seem quite as sturdy as the tools on the Rebar or on the Supertool however, I just checked and the can opener and bit driver seem to be the same as the wave. The awl in particular seems a little flimsy although the point was adequate unlike the juice. There's one bit included that has Phillips on one end and a flathead screwdriver on the other. The can opener seem small but did work on the can I tried it on. They lock in place with no play and in fact would probably be perfectly fine. Notice how the pliers head fits on top of the bit driver.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Kampfer on September 08, 2015, 06:51:19 PM
Can I see the driver in use with pliers head rest in hammer side handle?
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 08, 2015, 06:52:31 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: SteveC on September 08, 2015, 06:54:49 PM
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 08, 2015, 07:02:48 PM
On the plus side it is thinner than the Wave and does feel good in the hand. At this point I would say this is at best a $60 tool. It's not better than the Rebar or Wave IMO. Odd for me to say that since I love Leatherman. I think this one is too many flaws at he moment.
If Leatherman changed the steel to S35VN and changed out the gimmickry plastic parts and changed the saw to a blade exchanger, I'd probably say it's a good deal even with the carabiner pinching. As is, I don't believe it's worth the $100 street price.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 08, 2015, 07:12:49 PM
:tu:
Can I see the driver in use with pliers head rest in hammer side handle?
Here ya' go.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Kampfer on September 08, 2015, 07:14:27 PM
Does it feel a little better this way?:tu:
Can I see the driver in use with pliers head rest in hammer side handle?
Here ya' go.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 08, 2015, 07:15:35 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 08, 2015, 07:17:19 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Kampfer on September 08, 2015, 07:17:30 PM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 08, 2015, 08:02:18 PM
You might just have saved a lot of people a lot of money there :tu:
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 08, 2015, 08:10:13 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 08, 2015, 08:16:56 PM
Post by: sawman on September 08, 2015, 08:28:28 PM
Obviously, they have much room for improvement as I suspected. I'll stick with my Rebar :salute:
Post by: Gareth on September 08, 2015, 08:32:38 PM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 08, 2015, 08:34:42 PM
Just working on what gadgetman here has shown us:
Leatherman's trademark ruined main gripping area (impeding wire cutters)
Leatherman's trademark overly splayed handles (wider angle than MUT)
Leatherman's trademark "too fat to do anything useful" awl
Leatherman's trademark SkeleFool weak driver configuration
Leatherman's trademark bit driver that makes you buy a whole Leatherman bit set just for one bit
Elevated prices
Multiple ergonomic failures
All finished off with crappy accessories, a poor sharpening job, and a cast hammer with thin section in critical places and that looks to me like it's going to be a cause for a lot of warranty returns
Casting + impact + thin section = :facepalm:
Well done Leatherman, you've excelled even my expectations in your ability to disappoint :clap: :clap: :clap:
Post by: sawman on September 08, 2015, 08:38:38 PM
He's much better at explaining these things than I am >:D
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 08, 2015, 09:32:13 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Demel on September 08, 2015, 10:11:59 PM
Post by: Walter2 on September 09, 2015, 12:04:19 AM
Post by: babola on September 09, 2015, 01:26:20 AM
The rest of us 'grownups' will stick with our existing tools complemented by a proper fire rod and either 2-finger whistle or a physical, keychain one.
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 09, 2015, 02:16:57 AM
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/08/982eaa10eba70b845df6772bfa619c06.jpg)
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/08/375e387505287dce41c2cfc67a6e005b.jpg)(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/08/ae07f46bc4f971b2685e2341795d756b.jpg)
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Aloha on September 09, 2015, 02:40:08 AM
Who will be next to get one now?
Post by: captain spaulding on September 09, 2015, 03:12:45 AM
To me it goes much deeper than just making a tool. Its more a slap in the face time after time of all these tools no one wants. Take a page from other companies and actual interact with your customers and base your products on their opinions like other HUGE knife companies.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 09, 2015, 03:16:15 AM
I think you all know my thoughts about the Signal even before it was released and this first look at one in the wild just confirms everything I thought and said originally. :td:
To me it goes much deeper than just making a tool. Its more a slap in the face time after time of all these tools no one wants. Take a page from other companies and actual interact with your customers and base your products on their opinions like other HUGE knife companies.
:salute: Agree with Captain :salute:
Post by: babola on September 09, 2015, 03:21:46 AM
...To me it goes much deeper than just making a tool. Its more a slap in the face time after time of all these tools no one wants...
You mean like that big multi-tool company which starts with 'G' ? :P
Post by: captain spaulding on September 09, 2015, 03:25:08 AM
...To me it goes much deeper than just making a tool. Its more a slap in the face time after time of all these tools no one wants...
You mean like that big multi-tool company which starts with 'G' ? :P
No. I was referring to Kershaw and Spyderco in reference to their folding knives. They truly listen to customers and are very present in the forums to get a idea of what the majority wants in their knives and they actually produce knives with these suggestions. Big surprise........ they sell very well. :D
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 09, 2015, 03:27:08 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: captain spaulding on September 09, 2015, 03:31:13 AM
I think several people had concerns about this one - myself included. It is well made but has some design flaws IMO. To be fair, we are a small minority of the users and are likely much more picky than the average consumer. I want to keep using it for a while and see how I like it later. I was pleasantly surprised by the saw and the edge the knife took so there may still be hope.
Sent from Tracy Island
I know we are a minority here, but to be honest since youtube and knife reviewers the numbers of people who actually care about the various minor things and design of knives and multitools is growing. Either way if the majority of the people will not know any difference then why not please the people who will notice?
I will love to hear what you think after some use and time. I commonly change my opinions on things after the first few months. Keep us updated. :tu:
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 09, 2015, 04:22:24 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: tommywp on September 09, 2015, 04:57:24 AM
Post by: BASguy on September 10, 2015, 04:24:51 AM
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: sawman on September 10, 2015, 05:58:02 PM
Well, I got to see one in the wild today because one of the welders on my crew got his. What a joke..... He offered it, and $20, to me for my OG Wave. What an absolute piece of crap. This thing is overpriced by at least $70You'da gotten ripped off! As others have said in here, LM is just not listening to their customer base. I know not every product can be a great success, but this isn't their first major folly recently. They screwed up the Juice, failed to update their Wave with the newer pliers, and could have done much better with their Wingman/Sidekick series had they just put a little more effort into them.
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
I'm sure you'll agree, the price point on the Signal is a blatant insult, a hard slap in our faces. If I had an extra $100 laying around, I would put it toward another Victorinox product to be perfectly honest. I seem to get much more hassle-free enjoyment from their stuff anyhow ::)
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 10, 2015, 06:07:37 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 10, 2015, 10:46:55 PM
While I think the price is high I still think this could be a good tool. The issues I have with it are mostly design related. After using it for a few days I can say that it's well made but the ergonomics are off for me. The plastic parts stay in place but I still don't like them and the file isn't very useful. In fact I've thought about trying to replace with a 3D printed bit holder. I'm not sure what's going on with Leatherman but it does seem that they aren't doing some obvious things like adding the Rebar head to the Wave series. I had to do that myself.
Sent from Tracy Island
Sorry, I'm getting mixed messages here. You say it could still be a good tool, but you've got issues with the design aspects, some functions don't work very well, the ergonomics are off, and the price is too high. That kind of doesn't leave a lot to be enthusiastic about.
I'm not having a go at you, I'm just a bit confused as to how your various comments balance out and what the nett result is
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 11, 2015, 04:22:02 AM
I would not recommend the Signal as it currently is but with some design changes it could be a good tool.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 11, 2015, 08:58:28 AM
Post by: BASguy on September 13, 2015, 03:31:56 AM
Understandable. I think the design of tool, as is, doesn't work well for me, but the tool itself seems to be well made. I simply think the design is off. Perhaps I should have said it differently. The fit and finish is good overall - except for the plastic bits. I think with a few design changes it could be a good tool. I'm not enthusiastic about the tool but a few comments that were made both here, and PMs to me, either explicitly or implicitly said that the tool appeared to be poorly made. To me there are two things at play, the design, which IMO, is flawed and the build quality which appears to be good. Then there's the price for the package which is too high.
I would not recommend the Signal as it currently is but with some design changes it could be a good tool.
Sent from Tracy Island
I think Gadgetman is spot on here. This "could" be a good tool. Get rid of crappy plastic gimmick stuff and drop the price by at least 60% and they'd be in the ballpark for what this thing is worth.
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: Demel on September 13, 2015, 03:34:11 AM
If you drop the plastic piece, thinking of the wistle, what would you fill that space with? The file sits on the outside so that is easily removeable. I'm not into bushcraft so this tool has no interest to me, just want to know your thoughts.Understandable. I think the design of tool, as is, doesn't work well for me, but the tool itself seems to be well made. I simply think the design is off. Perhaps I should have said it differently. The fit and finish is good overall - except for the plastic bits. I think with a few design changes it could be a good tool. I'm not enthusiastic about the tool but a few comments that were made both here, and PMs to me, either explicitly or implicitly said that the tool appeared to be poorly made. To me there are two things at play, the design, which IMO, is flawed and the build quality which appears to be good. Then there's the price for the package which is too high.
I would not recommend the Signal as it currently is but with some design changes it could be a good tool.
Sent from Tracy Island
I think Gadgetman is spot on here. This "could" be a good tool. Get rid of crappy plastic gimmick stuff and drop the price by at least 60% and they'd be in the ballpark for what this thing is worth.
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 13, 2015, 04:29:48 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: BASguy on September 13, 2015, 04:15:34 PM
Good question, because obviously some re-design would have to go into this. The comment about bush crafting actually got me thinking a bit more that perhaps they build on this concept and use this template as the basis for a true tradesman tool and push this gimmicky nonsense for the prepper crowd that will spend money for things they will never use anyway. A tradesman tool has to be functional and price point serious.If you drop the plastic piece, thinking of the wistle, what would you fill that space with? The file sits on the outside so that is easily removeable. I'm not into bushcraft so this tool has no interest to me, just want to know your thoughts.Understandable. I think the design of tool, as is, doesn't work well for me, but the tool itself seems to be well made. I simply think the design is off. Perhaps I should have said it differently. The fit and finish is good overall - except for the plastic bits. I think with a few design changes it could be a good tool. I'm not enthusiastic about the tool but a few comments that were made both here, and PMs to me, either explicitly or implicitly said that the tool appeared to be poorly made. To me there are two things at play, the design, which IMO, is flawed and the build quality which appears to be good. Then there's the price for the package which is too high.
I would not recommend the Signal as it currently is but with some design changes it could be a good tool.
Sent from Tracy Island
I think Gadgetman is spot on here. This "could" be a good tool. Get rid of crappy plastic gimmick stuff and drop the price by at least 60% and they'd be in the ballpark for what this thing is worth.
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: Demel on September 13, 2015, 04:24:29 PM
How about this: keep the size frame, add a blunt nose option for the pliers, have an option for surge scissors, saw, or file for secondary tool, drop the can opener for a large flat driver, and lose the plastic whistle piece for a long bit holder for mut bits.Good question, because obviously some re-design would have to go into this. The comment about bush crafting actually got me thinking a bit more that perhaps they build on this concept and use this template as the basis for a true tradesman tool and push this gimmicky nonsense for the prepper crowd that will spend money for things they will never use anyway. A tradesman tool has to be functional and price point serious.If you drop the plastic piece, thinking of the wistle, what would you fill that space with? The file sits on the outside so that is easily removeable. I'm not into bushcraft so this tool has no interest to me, just want to know your thoughts.Understandable. I think the design of tool, as is, doesn't work well for me, but the tool itself seems to be well made. I simply think the design is off. Perhaps I should have said it differently. The fit and finish is good overall - except for the plastic bits. I think with a few design changes it could be a good tool. I'm not enthusiastic about the tool but a few comments that were made both here, and PMs to me, either explicitly or implicitly said that the tool appeared to be poorly made. To me there are two things at play, the design, which IMO, is flawed and the build quality which appears to be good. Then there's the price for the package which is too high.
I would not recommend the Signal as it currently is but with some design changes it could be a good tool.
Sent from Tracy Island
I think Gadgetman is spot on here. This "could" be a good tool. Get rid of crappy plastic gimmick stuff and drop the price by at least 60% and they'd be in the ballpark for what this thing is worth.
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: BASguy on September 13, 2015, 04:28:22 PM
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 13, 2015, 05:51:13 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: sawman on September 13, 2015, 05:53:41 PM
I think it would work with a bit holder and the blade exchange system from the Surge but they need to rethink the gate on the carabiner. I've been carrying the tool for a few days and the pinching is an annoyance but that may be my hand size. Also they need to get rid of the serrations and upgrade the steel on the knife.That's one thing I like very much about the Wave and Rebar are the separate serrated and plain blades. IMO, it's well worth the added tool slot to include both.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Demel on September 13, 2015, 08:47:20 PM
I like both. It depends on what type of work I'm doing. Usually I'm cutting a lot of cardboard. If I only have one blade I want it to be combo, but if I can get two blades, then having a dedicated serrated blade is great. It all depends on the work you do with it.I think it would work with a bit holder and the blade exchange system from the Surge but they need to rethink the gate on the carabiner. I've been carrying the tool for a few days and the pinching is an annoyance but that may be my hand size. Also they need to get rid of the serrations and upgrade the steel on the knife.That's one thing I like very much about the Wave and Rebar are the separate serrated and plain blades. IMO, it's well worth the added tool slot to include both.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: babola on September 13, 2015, 11:13:03 PM
I like both...I think it would work with a bit holder and the blade exchange system from the Surge but they need to rethink the gate on the carabiner. I've been carrying the tool for a few days and the pinching is an annoyance but that may be my hand size. Also they need to get rid of the serrations and upgrade the steel on the knife.That's one thing I like very much about the Wave and Rebar are the separate serrated and plain blades. IMO, it's well worth the added tool slot to include both.
Sent from Tracy Island
Me too. And as you pointed out it depends on the situation and the need.
Cheers!
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 14, 2015, 12:25:43 AM
I frequently carry a separate folder, which means I don't need a plain edged blade on my multitool. Instead I want something that's going to compliment that blade, such as a serrated blade or a combo edged blade, or even (as is often the case with me) a modified knifeless tool with some other function added in place of the knife blade.
I would imagine that a large percentage of multitool users already carry a separate blade. It makes sense for those people to maximise the functions available on their pocket tool rather than just duplicate functions they already have.
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 14, 2015, 03:46:32 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Kampfer on September 14, 2015, 06:14:07 PM
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 15, 2015, 02:42:58 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Kampfer on September 15, 2015, 02:57:58 AM
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 15, 2015, 03:54:57 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: basilio on September 17, 2015, 11:16:33 AM
The package arrived this morning completely sealed.
I can't believe a crap like this passed any kind of quality control.
Now I'm going to return it.
I know that I will have the tool replaced, but, in my opinion, this is something that should not happen.
Post by: babola on September 17, 2015, 11:20:55 AM
Post by: dks on September 17, 2015, 11:21:28 AM
Post by: SteveC on September 17, 2015, 03:20:51 PM
Post by: sawman on September 17, 2015, 04:31:41 PM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 17, 2015, 06:18:14 PM
A) been allowed to clear the casting stage
B) been passed through the pivot riveting stage
C) been passed through the pliers grinding stage
D) been passed through the assembly stage
E) been passed though final inspection
I think that speaks volumes personally ::)
Post by: Kampfer on September 17, 2015, 07:10:57 PM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 17, 2015, 07:33:15 PM
Post by: enki_ck on September 17, 2015, 07:48:35 PM
Looks like a casting sprue, so evidently the teeth on the pliers are cast in :think: So far as I'm aware, Leatherman don't do their own investment casting (never heard mention of it from tour reports and such), so this defect has....
A) been allowed to clear the casting stage
B) been passed through the pivot riveting stage
C) been passed through the pliers grinding stage
D) been passed through the assembly stage
E) been passed though final inspection
I think that speaks volumes personally ::)
The pliers are cast somewhere in Mexico.
My brother was a chemical engineer for the casting company that made the Leatherman plier heads. There was a push, push, push to make them cheaper. The company set up a modern casting plant in Mexico (My brother was in charge of bringing it online on time and on budget). The casting process is state of the art with the same high quality alloy. Cost savings came in the form of cheaper labor and much greater efficiency of a modern plant.
A year or so later, my brother moved to another casting company. The process is mostly automated for consistent, defect free castings. BTW, they cast much more than Leatherman pliers heads there. A lot of high RPM castings (like in turbocharger parts and such).
...
Post by: dks on September 17, 2015, 08:00:01 PM
hopefully it will be an one-off :salute:
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 17, 2015, 08:02:24 PM
F) Passed the casting company's QC
G) Passed through LM's incoming inspection (Goods Inwards Dept)
So far that's seven opportunities in the process route to prevent this from happening....
Post by: sawman on September 17, 2015, 09:07:05 PM
Post by: captain spaulding on September 17, 2015, 11:04:28 PM
Post by: SAKnight on September 17, 2015, 11:35:25 PM
I think leatherman had a sweet spot in the late 90s, early 2000s where they had modernized production combined with old school quality. The original super tool- super tool 200 era, for me.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 17, 2015, 11:45:23 PM
Oh Leatherman, you keep up the consistent disappointment. I would say I am surprised, but sadly it is expected now. Once you get a bad reputation it is quite hard to lose it and the way they are going its only going to get worse.
When I first arrived at this forum, I was one of the few people here who had recurring disappointment with Leatherman and had the audacity to speak out amongst the hoardes of loyal fans. Since then, Leatherman's continued efforts to cheapen their offerings and cut corners in quality has taken a lot of pressure off me in that respect.
Thank you Leatherman, for supporting me in my criticisms of your products, and for granting me public support in my views. I'd prefer it if you upped your quality, stopped cocking up the main gripping area of your pliers, and spent some time learning about ergonomics, but I'll take the ego boost as a consolation prize till you get your act together :salute:
Your determined efforts to jeapordise your global reputation to justify an over opinionated bloke off the internet in a foreign country have not gone unnoticed :cheers:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 18, 2015, 12:23:43 AM
Post by: Demel on September 18, 2015, 01:22:34 AM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 18, 2015, 01:24:40 AM
20 years from now, Leatherman will be the new Gerber. :rofl:
If they hired Bear gylls there will be Gerberland soon :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Post by: SAKnight on September 18, 2015, 01:27:03 AM
20 years from now, Leatherman will be the new Gerber. :rofl:
:rofl:
Though at this rate, it won't even be 20 :facepalm:
At least Gerber has a fair pricing model
Post by: BASguy on September 18, 2015, 04:59:18 AM
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: comis on September 18, 2015, 09:23:32 AM
That's why whenever I buy a new LM product, I have to buy in person, make sure it is not rusted, no uneven tightness, even grind, etc. Even the local seller told me they have noticed how often buyers have refused the products before purchase, due to NIB defects.
Post by: Gerhard Gerber on September 18, 2015, 10:08:59 AM
Quote
Drop all of your products except the Rebar, Wave, and SuperTool.
Quote
Even the local seller told me they have noticed how often buyers have refused the products before purchase, due to NIB defects.
If I can be perfectly honest, another reason why I gave away my Rebar was the fact that it was just a little off in alignment.
Post by: sawman on September 18, 2015, 01:36:13 PM
WAIT INTO SIGNAL GO DOWN $50 :rofl: FOR NOW BLAST-OFF ALL THE WAY :drool:That, I'd like to see - for what kind of mod you plan for it >:D
I think your work is awesome, I'm sure it'd be very cool :tu:
Post by: RT1969 on September 18, 2015, 02:17:35 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eAb-o0VkJ9s
Some of my thoughts:
-The awl can be used with the tool closed
-Doesn't the canopener work better in the other direction?
-In the event that I would need the whistle, I would not be able to perform the delicate movements necessary to use it. Cold hands, high adrenaline, tired, hungry - any of those circumstances, and you rather drop it than use it, imo
-Shouldn't there been some kindling between the tinder and the sticks if you'd try to built a fire?
-The music screams lumbersexual, not survivalist ot bushcraft to me... - I guess that is the expected customer base?
All in all I am not happy with the outcome. I think Leatherman wasted a lot of potential.
Post by: Aloha on September 18, 2015, 04:59:54 PM
Oh Leatherman.......................... :think:
Post by: rdub934 on September 18, 2015, 05:51:17 PM
It's funny that it is a survival tool, as it is killing Leatherman's reputation.
Thank you. Thank you. Be sure to tip your waitress. :wait:
Post by: sawman on September 18, 2015, 08:29:48 PM
Victorinox
:climber:
Post by: dks on September 18, 2015, 08:32:07 PM
WENGER !!!
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 19, 2015, 03:51:23 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: rdub934 on September 19, 2015, 07:07:54 AM
I think it's happening to most of the companies. I sent two Vic Spirits back for bad locks, I've had a Leatherman Juice with misaligned pliers, a SOG Switchplier that was completely unusable and a Gerber MP 600 that has too many issues to mention. QC as a whole has been slipping IMHO.
Sent from Tracy Island
Personally, I blame Kirky :D
Post by: kirk13 on September 19, 2015, 11:42:32 PM
lumbersexual
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
I have one word for you:
Victorinox
:climber:
:tu:
Post by: Kampfer on September 22, 2015, 06:25:58 AM
Post by: babola on September 22, 2015, 07:26:54 AM
it is available on LM site now.
It took a while, eh?
Like if there's something not quite right with it, or something. :angel:
:P
Post by: Kampfer on September 22, 2015, 08:09:17 AM
Post by: babola on September 22, 2015, 11:04:08 AM
Ordered one :P
(http://www.sharegif.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/tumblr_mvzvxnKypg1sf9hauo1_.gif)
Post by: Kampfer on September 22, 2015, 09:05:25 PM
Post by: sawman on September 22, 2015, 09:12:33 PM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 22, 2015, 09:19:37 PM
Ordered one :P
(http://www.sharegif.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/tumblr_mvzvxnKypg1sf9hauo1_.gif)
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Post by: Kampfer on September 22, 2015, 09:22:08 PM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 22, 2015, 09:30:50 PM
Post by: tommywp on September 22, 2015, 10:57:25 PM
Ordered one :P
Nice. Are you going to try to put scissors and a bit holder on this thing right off the bat, or are you going to let it be for a bit?
Post by: Kampfer on September 22, 2015, 11:04:17 PM
I am going to hack it.Ordered one :P
Nice. Are you going to try to put scissors and a bit holder on this thing right off the bat, or are you going to let it be for a bit?
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 22, 2015, 11:07:37 PM
I am going to hack it.Ordered one :P
Nice. Are you going to try to put scissors and a bit holder on this thing right off the bat, or are you going to let it be for a bit?
:popcorn:
Post by: BASguy on September 23, 2015, 04:07:08 AM
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: Kampfer on September 23, 2015, 04:32:18 AM
I see the price is a little cheaper than rumored..... Still about $70 to expensiveYup, that is what say about those Alox
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: Kampfer on September 23, 2015, 04:35:26 AM
If my plan work out it would be my dream Skeletool (with 3" blade, scissors, awl and hammer)Ordered one :P
Nice. Are you going to try to put scissors and a bit holder on this thing right off the bat, or are you going to let it be for a bit?
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 23, 2015, 04:43:57 AM
If my plan work out it would be my dream Skeletool (with 3" blade, scissors, awl and hammer)Ordered one :P
Nice. Are you going to try to put scissors and a bit holder on this thing right off the bat, or are you going to let it be for a bit?
:woohoo:
Post by: David on September 23, 2015, 11:10:41 AM
Post by: babola on September 23, 2015, 11:26:15 AM
Since it has an awl might have to try one. :D
Referring to that mini implement as an awl could be a little stretch, though ;)
Post by: zoidberg on September 23, 2015, 12:21:13 PM
Post by: sawman on September 23, 2015, 02:24:25 PM
I see the price is a little cheaper than rumored..... Still about $70 to expensive+1 it's a watered-down Wave with half the tools :td:
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 23, 2015, 07:13:13 PM
I see the price is a little cheaper than rumored..... Still about $70 to expensive+1 it's a watered-down Wave with half the tools :td:
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :tu:
Post by: David on September 23, 2015, 07:19:18 PM
Since it has an awl might have to try one. :D
Referring to that mini implement as an awl could be a little stretch, though ;)
Awl right. But its better than no awl at awl! :D :D
Post by: Yadda on September 23, 2015, 11:39:42 PM
Since it has an awl might have to try one. :D
Referring to that mini implement as an awl could be a little stretch, though ;)
Awl right. But its better than no awl at awl! :D :D
Awlful pun..... :facepalm:
Post by: babola on September 24, 2015, 12:15:26 AM
I am going to hack it.Ordered one :P
Nice. Are you going to try to put scissors and a bit holder on this thing right off the bat, or are you going to let it be for a bit?
Hack it you should, young Jedi.
A half-decent tool then you may own.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 24, 2015, 12:19:39 AM
I am going to hack it.Ordered one :P
Nice. Are you going to try to put scissors and a bit holder on this thing right off the bat, or are you going to let it be for a bit?
Hack it you should, young Jedi.
A half-decent tool then you may own.
Start by cutting off the hammer/clip thingy, so the screwdriver actually works while closed >:D
Post by: Kampfer on September 24, 2015, 12:20:39 AM
:megaslap:I am going to hack it.Ordered one :P
Nice. Are you going to try to put scissors and a bit holder on this thing right off the bat, or are you going to let it be for a bit?
Hack it you should, young Jedi.
A half-decent tool then you may own.
Start by cutting off the hammer/clip thingy, so the screwdriver actually works while closed >:D
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 24, 2015, 12:28:59 AM
I am going to hack it.Ordered one :P
Nice. Are you going to try to put scissors and a bit holder on this thing right off the bat, or are you going to let it be for a bit?
Hack it you should, young Jedi.
A half-decent tool then you may own.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Post by: rishardh on September 24, 2015, 05:12:17 AM
Since it has an awl might have to try one. :D
Referring to that mini implement as an awl could be a little stretch, though ;)
Awl right. But its better than no awl at awl! :D :D
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Post by: comis on September 24, 2015, 06:10:06 AM
Start by cutting off the hammer/clip thingy, so the screwdriver actually works while closed >:D
>:D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5-sfG8BV8wU
Post by: WiseDuck on September 24, 2015, 11:32:24 AM
I mean, the extras on the Signal supposedly WORK. But the firesteel is sunk into the plastic and it looks like it'll be unusable after a little while. The whistle looks cheap and the diamond sharpener looks hard to use. For emergency use it's better than nothing. But how do you get stuck out in the woods with just your Signal anyways?
Post by: NKlamerus on September 24, 2015, 05:29:04 PM
Post by: babola on September 24, 2015, 11:17:37 PM
You think someone could take apart a Nitecore Tube and retrofit a peice so it fits in the signal?
Nitecore Tube you say...hmm.
Star Trek fans - rejoice! :P
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 24, 2015, 11:58:54 PM
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 25, 2015, 02:36:09 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 25, 2015, 03:46:51 AM
Actually, I've tried the Schrade. IMO the tool isn't nearly as well made and the knife is actually worse. The ergonomics didn't work for me as well. I think the competitor is more likely either the Wave or Swisstool. YMMV
Sent from Tracy Island
you must be talking about cheap Schrade .. This tool must sharper then Wave .. got more stuff.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 25, 2015, 03:49:40 AM
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 25, 2015, 04:24:38 AM
Back on topic. I lent my signal to a friend who manages some hunting plantations here. He told me today that he really liked the feel of it. Neither the carabiner "bite" nor the fire steel bothered him. He's not a knife person so he said the blade works well for him so far. I touched it up a little for him but it had a surprisingly good edge left. He's got it for a weekend hunting trip. I'm curious as to how well it does.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Kampfer on September 25, 2015, 10:34:01 PM
It was shipped on 22nd and I was provided with a tracking number, but according to UPS, they haven't even pick up the package From Leatherman yet. :rant:
it was shipped Expedited, so I expect it get here in a day or two, so far I been working from home waiting by the mail box like an idiot. :rant:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 25, 2015, 10:35:30 PM
I am a little biased off, how many days does a package take ship from OR to CA?
It was shipped on 22nd and I was provided with a tracking number, but according to the tracking the package haven't even left Leatherman yet. :rant:
:rofl: maybe take a month
Post by: babola on September 25, 2015, 10:39:15 PM
I am a little p155ed off, how many days does a package take ship from OR to CA?
It was shipped on 22nd and I was provided with a tracking number, but according to UPS, they haven't even pick up the package From Leatherman yet. :rant:
Remember LM reportedly stated some issues with the Signal packaging few weeks ago, it may still be something they're struggling with at the moment.
Post by: Kampfer on September 25, 2015, 10:46:50 PM
Location Date Local Time Activity (What's This?)
09/22/2015 2:01 P.M. Shipment information received by UPS Mail Innovations
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 25, 2015, 10:53:05 PM
I was sure it is UPS, Leatherman shipped it and sent me tracking # within 24 hrs after I ordered, the messed up part is the UPS tracking # doesn't provide me any information at all other than:
Location Date Local Time Activity (What's This?)
09/22/2015 2:01 P.M. Shipment information received by UPS Mail Innovations
UPS :facepalm: :facepalm:
Post by: Aloha on September 26, 2015, 12:53:13 AM
Post by: Kampfer on September 26, 2015, 03:42:34 AM
Called UPS, they said LM never gave them the package.
Called USPS, they said they haven't got the package from UPS.
I believe the UPS Mail Innovations is screwing everything up, the package is in fact moving, just lack of entry to the tracking system.
Post by: sawman on September 26, 2015, 03:57:46 AM
Called LM, they said they shipped it.UNACCEPTABLE :td:
Called UPS, they said LM never gave them the package.
Called USPS, they said they haven't got the package from UPS.
I believe the UPS Mail Innovations is screwing everything up, the package is in fact moving, just lack of entry to the tracking system.
Post by: Top-Gear-24 on September 26, 2015, 10:41:53 AM
I mean, yes, it has limited functions (but same goes for the other tools in that family, like the MUT/Skeletool/Style CS), but it looked well made, and it felt quite good in my opinion. And I know that my "light my fire" firesteel will last a lot longer than the firesteel on the Signal, but isn't a multitool always a bit of a compromise compaired to the dedicated version of the same tool ... :think:.
Anyway, I'm going to give this a bit of thought before I make a decision ;).
Post by: Demel on September 26, 2015, 03:38:49 PM
I mean, yes, it has limited functions (but same goes for the other tools in that family, like the MUT/Skeletool/Style CS), but it looked well made, and it felt quite good in my opinion. And I know that my "light my fire" firesteel will last a lot longer than the firesteel on the Signal, but isn't a multitool always a bit of a compromise compaired to the dedicated version of the same tool ... :think:.Your right it is always a compromise, but I think what has people not excited about it (correct me if I am wrong) is the whistle and ferro rod can be gotten cheaply and inexpensive. They are already small implements so to limit their function even more at a steep price makes it undesirable. If the signals price point was closer to $60, I think the reactions would be more welcoming. For $120 you would expect all the bells and whistles
you don't get that with this tool. I could be wrong but from what I've been reading that seems to be the problem.
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 26, 2015, 03:54:13 PM
I agree but would add that the file and whistle/fire starter take up space that could have been much better utilized. Further, the file can actually rub your hand. There's still a lot of potential here though the carabiner pinch really bothers me.
Post by: Top-Gear-24 on September 26, 2015, 04:02:35 PM
It's maybe better that I don't mention how much the Signal costs at our local dealers, I fear some of you might have a heart attack ... ::)
Post by: Demel on September 26, 2015, 04:57:49 PM
I see your point ;).Now I want to know. How much?
It's maybe better that I don't mention how much the Signal costs at our local dealers, I fear some of you might have a heart attack ... ::)
Post by: Tixx on September 26, 2015, 05:01:44 PM
You think someone could take apart a Nitecore Tube and retrofit a peice so it fits in the signal?
I like that. Definitely missing a light!
Post by: Kampfer on September 26, 2015, 06:50:02 PM
I see your point ;).We are less than 700 miles away from LM and we don't have a single Singal in store yet. :think:
It's maybe better that I don't mention how much the Signal costs at our local dealers, I fear some of you might have a heart attack ... ::)
Post by: comis on September 26, 2015, 08:18:38 PM
It's undergoing saw tests with many peers right now, right now finished round 3, and the result for signal is not too promising(considering this model is dedicated to outdoor, it's definitely not comfortable to use the saw)
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 26, 2015, 08:45:18 PM
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/09/26/c78f3884ef114add8c715a320078b822.jpg)
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Kampfer on September 26, 2015, 09:32:26 PM
First thing I noticed, even the pliers head appears to be a rebar head, but signal handles spread wider than other LM tools, very uncomfortable to girp. That would be the first thing to hack.
Post by: sawman on September 26, 2015, 09:39:49 PM
Signal is here :mail:I'll leave it in your capable hands to hack it into a respectable tool :salute:
First thing I noticed, even the pliers head appears to be a rebar head, but signal handles spread wider than other LM tools, very uncomfortable to girp. That would be the first thing to hack.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 26, 2015, 10:00:25 PM
Signal is here :mail:
First thing I noticed, even the pliers head appears to be a rebar head, but signal handles spread wider than other LM tools, very uncomfortable to girp. That would be the first thing to hack.
Good luck with that Kam :tu:
There's an alarmingly high amount of negative feedback on the ergonomics so far, considering it's not something long time Leatherman fans tend to voice on here. It was an aspect that came through on their budget offerings too. I know they supposedly do visit here, but they don't seem to be paying attention :pok:
Comis, interesting teaser there, I look forward to seeing the finished video :tu:
Post by: Top-Gear-24 on September 26, 2015, 11:24:40 PM
I see your point ;).Now I want to know. How much?
It's maybe better that I don't mention how much the Signal costs at our local dealers, I fear some of you might have a heart attack ... ::)
Over here they retail at 180 € (about $202 ) ::).
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 26, 2015, 11:25:29 PM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 26, 2015, 11:27:14 PM
I see your point ;).Now I want to know. How much?
It's maybe better that I don't mention how much the Signal costs at our local dealers, I fear some of you might have a heart attack ... ::)
Over here they retail at 180 € (about $202 ) ::).
For That ?? No thank , I build my own better :twak:
Post by: Demel on September 26, 2015, 11:41:32 PM
I am so very sorry to hear that. :facepalm:I see your point ;).Now I want to know. How much?
It's maybe better that I don't mention how much the Signal costs at our local dealers, I fear some of you might have a heart attack ... ::)
Over here they retail at 180 € (about $202 ) ::).
Post by: babola on September 26, 2015, 11:51:15 PM
I see your point ;).Now I want to know. How much?
It's maybe better that I don't mention how much the Signal costs at our local dealers, I fear some of you might have a heart attack ... ::)
Over here they retail at 180 € (about $202 ) ::).
Not surprised at all. Called NZ distributor to inquire about the local RRP, just for the heck of it. I was told in the vicinity of NZ$300, which is around US$200 mark, so similar to eye-gouging Euro pricing. :td:
Post by: babola on September 26, 2015, 11:55:24 PM
There's an alarmingly high amount of negative feedback on the ergonomics so far, considering it's not something long time Leatherman fans tend to voice on here...
Yet the faithful and unsuspecting (shall I say uneducated) LM Facebook and Twitter followers are all salivating over this tool. LM campaigns are becoming more of a 'sale by powers of social media and Internet' kind of campaigns than usual ones.
Post by: Top-Gear-24 on September 27, 2015, 12:21:30 AM
I am so very sorry to hear that. :facepalm:I see your point ;).Now I want to know. How much?
It's maybe better that I don't mention how much the Signal costs at our local dealers, I fear some of you might have a heart attack ... ::)
Over here they retail at 180 € (about $202 ) ::).
Well, it does make it easier to just "let this one pass" ... I've been doing some thinking these last 24 hours and I guess you guys are right, I can buy myself a Surge (from a Dutch online store, not at the local shops), along with a Light my Fire "Army" fire steel, and a "no brand" whistle, and still save like 50 € in the end ::).
This option would give me a much more capable multitool (which also has a file that can be used to sharpen its own blade in case of emergency), a much more capable firesteel, and a whistle that is much easier to get to in case of emergency. And yes, I already own a Surge, but that's the BO version, and I would like to own a stainless version also ... :whistle:.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 27, 2015, 12:25:45 AM
I am so very sorry to hear that. :facepalm:I see your point ;).Now I want to know. How much?
It's maybe better that I don't mention how much the Signal costs at our local dealers, I fear some of you might have a heart attack ... ::)
Over here they retail at 180 € (about $202 ) ::).
Well, it does make it easier to just "let his one pass" ... I've been doing some thinking these last 24 hours and I guess you guys are right, I can buy myself a Surge (from a Dutch online store, not at the local shops), along with a Light my Fire "Army" fire steel, and a "no brand" whistle, and still save like 50 € in the end ::).
This option would give me a much more capable multitool (which also has a file that can be used to sharpen its own blade in case of emergency), a much more capable firesteel, and a whistle that is much easier to get to in case of emergency. And yes, I already own a Surge, but that's the BO version, and I would like to own a stainless version also ... :whistle:.
Or get Rebar add firesteel sharpen , whistle .. still cheaper or go BLAST-OFF
Post by: Top-Gear-24 on September 27, 2015, 12:34:56 AM
I am so very sorry to hear that. :facepalm:I see your point ;).Now I want to know. How much?
It's maybe better that I don't mention how much the Signal costs at our local dealers, I fear some of you might have a heart attack ... ::)
Over here they retail at 180 € (about $202 ) ::).
Well, it does make it easier to just "let his one pass" ... I've been doing some thinking these last 24 hours and I guess you guys are right, I can buy myself a Surge (from a Dutch online store, not at the local shops), along with a Light my Fire "Army" fire steel, and a "no brand" whistle, and still save like 50 € in the end ::).
This option would give me a much more capable multitool (which also has a file that can be used to sharpen its own blade in case of emergency), a much more capable firesteel, and a whistle that is much easier to get to in case of emergency. And yes, I already own a Surge, but that's the BO version, and I would like to own a stainless version also ... :whistle:.
Or get Rebar add firesteel sharpen , whistle .. still cheaper or go BLAST-OFF
I already own a BO and a stainless Rebar, and I do like a "large" OHO knife on my "outdoor tool" ;).
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 27, 2015, 12:36:42 AM
I am so very sorry to hear that. :facepalm:I see your point ;).Now I want to know. How much?
It's maybe better that I don't mention how much the Signal costs at our local dealers, I fear some of you might have a heart attack ... ::)
Over here they retail at 180 € (about $202 ) ::).
Well, it does make it easier to just "let his one pass" ... I've been doing some thinking these last 24 hours and I guess you guys are right, I can buy myself a Surge (from a Dutch online store, not at the local shops), along with a Light my Fire "Army" fire steel, and a "no brand" whistle, and still save like 50 € in the end ::).
This option would give me a much more capable multitool (which also has a file that can be used to sharpen its own blade in case of emergency), a much more capable firesteel, and a whistle that is much easier to get to in case of emergency. And yes, I already own a Surge, but that's the BO version, and I would like to own a stainless version also ... :whistle:.
Or get Rebar add firesteel sharpen , whistle .. still cheaper or go BLAST-OFF
I already own a BO and a stainless Rebar, and I do like a "large" OHO knife on my "outdoor tool" ;).
Surge way to go
Post by: Kampfer on September 27, 2015, 12:37:08 AM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 27, 2015, 12:38:34 AM
Shut up with the blast already, this is about singal
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :megaslap:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 27, 2015, 01:00:25 AM
Shut up with the blast already, this is about singal
It that November Challenges?
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 27, 2015, 01:04:17 AM
There's an alarmingly high amount of negative feedback on the ergonomics so far, considering it's not something long time Leatherman fans tend to voice on here...
Yet the faithful and unsuspecting (shall I say uneducated) LM Facebook and Twitter followers are all salivating over this tool. LM campaigns are becoming more of a 'sale by powers of social media and Internet' kind of campaigns than usual ones.
Oh, that doesn't surprise me in the slightest! LM's greatest ever product is their PR machine, and there will be many thousands of people ready to lap this up purely because of the branding, and they'll make their you tube videos showing how amazing it is (because of the name that's on the side and whatever it says on the packaging), and they'll think they're the coolest kid on the block because they've got the latest piece of overhyped, overpriced crap, with absolutely no practical comprehension of how it compares to anything else on the market. The priorities of the devout followers probably lie in how many times you tube views and facebook likes they get, not whether it's actually capable of doing what it's claimed in a safe, reliable manner, or will cause hand fatigue, or snag hazards, or is robust enough, or......
Post by: Kampfer on September 27, 2015, 01:25:06 AM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 27, 2015, 01:30:09 AM
I am the coolest kid in this block, what are you saying?
That's cos you're a member of MTO (but only the No 1 coolest if you're the only MTO member on the block >:D) whose prepared to try and fix what Leatherman couldn't get right in the first place, not one of the mindless minions that buy crap just because hoardes of other mindless minions on the internet do too ;)
Post by: Kampfer on September 27, 2015, 01:32:08 AM
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 27, 2015, 01:34:38 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: sawman on September 27, 2015, 02:27:47 AM
Post by: Kampfer on September 27, 2015, 02:30:16 AM
Post by: Kampfer on September 27, 2015, 02:36:52 AM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 27, 2015, 02:46:37 AM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 27, 2015, 02:49:49 AM
Post by: Kampfer on September 27, 2015, 03:02:38 AM
The hammer side handle is sloppy, moves freely because there is no room on that handle for a retention "fork". To make thing worst, the hammer prevent you from using screw driver from cloves position. Very bad.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 27, 2015, 03:17:48 AM
It isn't too bad when the tool is closed (using knife, saw, awl or hammer), but in pliers mode the handles spread too wide for me, that is a deal breaker for me. If i ditch the rod and file and file down the handle a little, maybe I could bring the handles closer together, but I have to think about that before I do.
The hammer side handle is sloppy, moves freely because there is no room on that handle for a retention "fork" .
So the hammer handle doesn't "lock out", and just relies on friction? ::)
If you ditched the whistle, which seems to be the part that projects from the handle the furthest, that's a lot of real estate freed up on that handle. Would some slotted rigid foam seated inside allow for additional bit storage maybe? I'm thinking something like the holder on the Wenger Mini Grip.... :think:
Doesn't look like there's as much to gain from ditching the file, and you'd still have the "peg" it locates on, unless that can be discarded too with no other adverse effect.
Post by: Kampfer on September 27, 2015, 03:27:00 AM
Yeah, I think there are things we can hack to make this a better tool, but I don't think it would really worth the trouble especially we have Wave to compare it to.
signal is definitely not MT of the year.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 27, 2015, 03:28:31 AM
The hammer handle moves freely until right before clicking into the fully open position in pliers mode, that is why LM added a slide lock late in design process to lock the entire tool in closed mode.
Yeah, I think there are things we can hack to make this a better tool, but I don't think it would really worth the trouble especially we have Wave to compare it to.
signal is definitely not MT of the year.
:surrender:
Post by: babola on September 27, 2015, 03:49:12 AM
Just installed Mini-Surge's wingman scissors on Signal, they worked, I will have another pair made for Singal for perfect fit.
Have you tried fitting Wave/Surge straight edge blade into it as originally planned? How was the fit?
Cheers.
Post by: Kampfer on September 27, 2015, 04:01:39 AM
Thought about it but didn't try.Just installed Mini-Surge's wingman scissors on Signal, they worked, I will have another pair made for Singal for perfect fit.
Have you tried fitting Wave/Surge straight edge blade into it as originally planned? How was the fit?
Cheers.
The signal blade is decent and robust, not much shorter than Wave blade and there isn't much room on Signal for a longer blade.
Post by: babola on September 27, 2015, 04:28:58 AM
Thought about it but didn't try.Just installed Mini-Surge's wingman scissors on Signal, they worked, I will have another pair made for Singal for perfect fit.
Have you tried fitting Wave/Surge straight edge blade into it as originally planned? How was the fit?
Cheers.
The signal blade is decent and robust, not much shorter than Wave blade and there isn't much room on Signal for a longer blade.
Thanks. After checking out few Signal photos I was under impression there's quite a bit of empty space between the tip of the blade and the bottom of the cavity it folds into.
Post by: comis on September 27, 2015, 08:13:43 AM
Looking at those pics, I can also understand comis' comments about discomfort with the pliers closed due to those two plastic welts on the outside. They really didn't think this through did they ::)
Just to let you guys in, after 3 rounds of sawing, Signal didn't perform that well in comparison to the other LMs. The saw is pretty much the same as Wave, but the hammer/clip configuration makes it shorter to grip onto, and all the protruding parts are annoying.
Personally not a big fan of the hammer(other than pounding tent stakes, what survival priority or outdoor purpose does it really serve anyway?) and don't like the idea of my tool dangling around with just a clip.
Post by: Kampfer on September 27, 2015, 08:24:38 AM
Tent stakes can be hammered by pretty much any MT without any problem.
Post by: dks on September 27, 2015, 09:28:30 AM
Post by: Aloha on September 27, 2015, 04:36:28 PM
Or another pole or a rock.
^^This. With all the videos on batoning I'd think there'd be one to pound a tent stake in.
Post by: BASguy on September 27, 2015, 06:33:58 PM
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: sawman on September 27, 2015, 06:46:03 PM
What an absolutely unbelievable piece of crap. +$100 is insane for this kind of garbage. Spending that kind of money to try to mod it into something sort of useful is mystifying to me. Leatherman, please go back to making just the Wave, ST, and Rebar. You seriously suck when you lose focus+1
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Can't the government fine them or something for selling the people unsafe garbage? ???
Post by: comis on September 27, 2015, 07:10:35 PM
Here are some of my thoughts:
1) Blade can be plain edge. Just look at all the 'bushcraft' craze lately, and the more traditional outdoor blades, like Mora...almost all of them are plain edge and for a good reason, easy to maintain
2) I really much rather to have the traditional Wave configuration, and the outer tools with Blade(consider carbon steel)/ removable Saw/removable diamond file(sharpening)/scissors
3) I would trade in the hammer/clip for a removable threaded ferro rod + interchangeable tiny led light or whistle inside the handle. Or just a spark-lite fire starter inside handle would be cool.
4) Really smooth out the handle, it's too busy right now...and if I were to use the saw or blade for extended period of time, it will not be comfortable after a long while. The clip gate does hurt little finger, considering the saw is working on a pull stroke.
Post by: Kampfer on September 27, 2015, 08:32:08 PM
What are your thoughts on using screwdriver and pliers?
I find these two fictions are difficult to use on Signal.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 27, 2015, 09:03:25 PM
What an absolutely unbelievable piece of crap. +$100 is insane for this kind of garbage. Spending that kind of money to try to mod it into something sort of useful is mystifying to me. Leatherman, please go back to making just the Wave, ST, and Rebar. You seriously suck when you lose focus
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
:tu:
Post by: comis on September 27, 2015, 09:51:38 PM
Hey Comis
What are your thoughts on using screwdriver and pliers?
I find these two fictions are difficult to use on Signal.
Kampfer,
In comparison to a Wave, the Signal pliers opens slightly less wide, and the pilers head is slightly shorter as well. The good news is the wire cutter is longer. Due to all the gadgets resting on the scale, as previously pointed out, the handle spread is also a little wider. Like most LM, the pliers head come in stiff, so I actually do welcome the wider spread, so I could easily put my middle finger in between the handles to facilitate the opening/closing of the handles.
In terms of using the screwdriver/awl/can opener, don't even get me started--that's probably the reason why I dislike the hammer so much...not only I don't find that many outdoor related tasks which need hammering, the hammer will not allow the handles to close when I am using either the screwdriver/awl/can opener. :facepalm:
I'm so used to closing the handles when I am using the screwdriver, so I could 'rotate' the entire unit like a screwdriver...now I have to always keep the hammer side open all the way to use it. The worst is the awl, I could close the handles, but it will practically reduce the length of awl to only half.
The good news about the hammer is, since that handle is longer and heavier towards the end, I could use momentum to flick open the pliers one-handed easily. But most pliers based MT can do that, given enough break in time or readjustment.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 27, 2015, 11:04:46 PM
Post by: babola on September 27, 2015, 11:53:26 PM
...screwdriver and pliers?
I find these two fictions are difficult to use on Signal.
Fiction is a very fitting term in this case, indeed 8)
Post by: BASguy on September 28, 2015, 02:00:52 AM
To LM defense, Signal may not be a classic hit like Wave/Charge/SuperTool, but as I have said earlier in this thread, I still do appreciate their effort at least trying to make or cater to certain market segment(specialized tool). Looking at all the hollow-outs for trying to cut weight, and the ferro rod on a flimsy whistle, they did put in a some thought to it, maybe just not at the level that we all expecting them to.
Here are some of my thoughts:
1) Blade can be plain edge. Just look at all the 'bushcraft' craze lately, and the more traditional outdoor blades, like Mora...almost all of them are plain edge and for a good reason, easy to maintain
2) I really much rather to have the traditional Wave configuration, and the outer tools with Blade(consider carbon steel)/ removable Saw/removable diamond file(sharpening)/scissors
3) I would trade in the hammer/clip for a removable threaded ferro rod + interchangeable tiny led light or whistle inside the handle. Or just a spark-lite fire starter inside handle would be cool.
4) Really smooth out the handle, it's too busy right now...and if I were to use the saw or blade for extended period of time, it will not be comfortable after a long while. The clip gate does hurt little finger, considering the saw is working on a pull stroke.
Giving them credit for "attempting" innovation is fine. However, they need to be called out for bringing this piece of crap to market and putting it at an insane price point. I can only believe their marketing dept must have been salivating thinking "these prepper idiots will buy anything" so it justified having a first year mechanical engineer design this junk and pump it out on the assembly line in a clear attempt sell crap on hype alone. Wow....seriously.
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 28, 2015, 02:14:35 AM
To LM defense, Signal may not be a classic hit like Wave/Charge/SuperTool, but as I have said earlier in this thread, I still do appreciate their effort at least trying to make or cater to certain market segment(specialized tool). Looking at all the hollow-outs for trying to cut weight, and the ferro rod on a flimsy whistle, they did put in a some thought to it, maybe just not at the level that we all expecting them to.
Here are some of my thoughts:
1) Blade can be plain edge. Just look at all the 'bushcraft' craze lately, and the more traditional outdoor blades, like Mora...almost all of them are plain edge and for a good reason, easy to maintain
2) I really much rather to have the traditional Wave configuration, and the outer tools with Blade(consider carbon steel)/ removable Saw/removable diamond file(sharpening)/scissors
3) I would trade in the hammer/clip for a removable threaded ferro rod + interchangeable tiny led light or whistle inside the handle. Or just a spark-lite fire starter inside handle would be cool.
4) Really smooth out the handle, it's too busy right now...and if I were to use the saw or blade for extended period of time, it will not be comfortable after a long while. The clip gate does hurt little finger, considering the saw is working on a pull stroke.
Giving them credit for "attempting" innovation is fine. However, they need to be called out for bringing this piece of crap to market and putting it at an insane price point. I can only believe their marketing dept must have been salivating thinking "these prepper idiots will buy anything" so it justified having a first year mechanical engineer design this junk and pump it out on the assembly line in a clear attempt sell crap on hype alone. Wow....seriously.
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Leatherman need hired couples people in MTO do design and set up.. I can can name 5 people :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :gimme:
Post by: SAK Guy on September 28, 2015, 02:21:01 AM
I'm constantly amazed when I read these threads!! :cheers:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 28, 2015, 02:31:47 AM
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 28, 2015, 01:28:28 PM
I think a lot of time and effort went in to the design of the tool to get all of the "survival" bases covered without much thought to consistent use. This was designed for people who build bug out bags without using the tools in them very often. People like us tend to use our tools every day and understand the ergonomics and what works on these tools and what doesn't. I don't think Leatherman did any long term testing with this tool in a realistic every day use scenario and I don't think that's what they intended for the tool. The problem is that if you truly have to survive with it the problems that we've noted will hinder its usefulness.
I admit I don't post much but I do read the forum every day and the wealth of knowledge here is amazing. But, I have noticed something in this thread that's a little bothersome. It seems that a few people seem to be reveling in the issues with this tool. I personally don't want any of the manufacturers to put out bad products and don't wish any of them bad luck. When a major manufacturer fails it hurts the community as a whole. Constructive criticism and some exasperation is normal and helpful to the community and companies but delight in failure isn't. Just my thoughts.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Syncop8r on September 28, 2015, 01:38:08 PM
This was designed for people who build bug out bags without using the tools in them very often. People like us tend to use our tools every day and understand the ergonomics and what works on these tools and what doesn't.
I think some MTO members may be in the first camp.
After checking out few Signal photos I was under impression there's quite a bit of empty space between the tip of the blade and the bottom of the cavity it folds into.
How about between the ears of product design at Leatherman? Much space there?
Post by: Mextreme on September 28, 2015, 02:15:50 PM
AWLFAIL to Signal :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
That awl looks like they took the blade from the new Juice and made a hole in it :D :
(http://i57.tinypic.com/2lnwsgz.jpg)
Post by: SteveC on September 28, 2015, 02:22:04 PM
I got mine back from my plantation manager/guide friend yesterday. He's not a a big multitool guy so his opinion was interesting. He liked the saw but thought it was too short for anything but very small branches. Also, the serrated blade annoyed him when he was trying to make very controlled cuts on wood. (I tried that last night and couldn't do it well either.) Jim also said that the awl, can opener and screwdrivers were too awkward to use and he wanted it to take regular bits. When I told him the price he just laughed.
I think a lot of time and effort went in to the design of the tool to get all of the "survival" bases covered without much thought to consistent use. This was designed for people who build bug out bags without using the tools in them very often. People like us tend to use our tools every day and understand the ergonomics and what works on these tools and what doesn't. I don't think Leatherman did any long term testing with this tool in a realistic every day use scenario and I don't think that's what they intended for the tool. The problem is that if you truly have to survive with it the problems that we've noted will hinder its usefulness.
I admit I don't post much but I do read the forum every day and the wealth of knowledge here is amazing. But, I have noticed something in this thread that's a little bothersome. It seems that a few people seem to be reveling in the issues with this tool. I personally don't want any of the manufacturers to put out bad products and don't wish any of them bad luck. When a major manufacturer fails it hurts the community as a whole. Constructive criticism and some exasperation is normal and helpful to the community and companies but delight in failure isn't. Just my thoughts.
Sent from Tracy Island
Well said :cheers:
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 28, 2015, 03:09:46 PM
I got mine back from my plantation manager/guide friend yesterday. He's not a a big multitool guy so his opinion was interesting. He liked the saw but thought it was too short for anything but very small branches. Also, the serrated blade annoyed him when he was trying to make very controlled cuts on wood. (I tried that last night and couldn't do it well either.) Jim also said that the awl, can opener and screwdrivers were too awkward to use and he wanted it to take regular bits. When I told him the price he just laughed.
I think a lot of time and effort went in to the design of the tool to get all of the "survival" bases covered without much thought to consistent use. This was designed for people who build bug out bags without using the tools in them very often. People like us tend to use our tools every day and understand the ergonomics and what works on these tools and what doesn't. I don't think Leatherman did any long term testing with this tool in a realistic every day use scenario and I don't think that's what they intended for the tool. The problem is that if you truly have to survive with it the problems that we've noted will hinder its usefulness.
I admit I don't post much but I do read the forum every day and the wealth of knowledge here is amazing. But, I have noticed something in this thread that's a little bothersome. It seems that a few people seem to be reveling in the issues with this tool. I personally don't want any of the manufacturers to put out bad products and don't wish any of them bad luck. When a major manufacturer fails it hurts the community as a whole. Constructive criticism and some exasperation is normal and helpful to the community and companies but delight in failure isn't. Just my thoughts.
Sent from Tracy Island
Nice to get an insight from someone looking at it with a fresh pair of eyes :tu: it's easy for use to lose perspective of how a tool may be perceived by someone less familiar with the multitool scene than we are. Interesting also to see that his enthusiasm for it pretty much parallels ours.
I agree with Syncop8r that we have a mix of people at MTO. We have the BOB builders who might not use them daily, as well as those who are using their multitools day in, day out. Your second paragraph reads like you're suggesting that the tool was designed to not be used, or at least designed to fulfil a theoretical concept rather than be a reliable working tool. I would agree with that, and it's a sad day when tool makers are selling things to stash in case of emergency and not focussing on how well they work should an emergency occur.
As to your final point, I think on this specific tool, Leatherman have truly earned all ridicule that has been forthcoming on this thread. From my own perspective, this isn't a one-off shambles, but one they've been systematically working towards. They appear to have walked away (to some extent) from toolmaking, and got into merely selling gadgets designed around social media trends. Whether it's budget tools, one piece tools, tools for kids, survival tools, recently it seems less about the viability and quality of the tool, and more about making something profitable with a catchy marketting angle, irrespective of whether it works or not.
As far as I'm concerned, they've taken several poor concepts and rolled them all together to make it even worse. If they want to be taken seriously, they should go back to basics and look at how to make the best tool for the job instead of some "gadget of the month" offering. When a company continues to make the same errors time and time again, but with worse and worse errors, and with growing prices, they deserve to be ridiculed.
There are lots of constructive criticism in this thread too. There is also lots and lots of constructive criticism around the site from before this was released which would have guided the designers away from making such a carbunkle. Info and feedback on ergonomics, what makes a good awl and a bad awl, what people want from a woods based tool system.... or indeed any emergency use tool... and it appears to have been duly ignored along with various basic design principles and common sense. Taking one specific aspect as an example, the hammer. It's a casting, it's thin in section in several places, some of those thin areas are near abrupt sectional changes, and they expect you to use it as a hammer.
We've tried constructive criticism several times in the past on other offerings, but it obviously hasn't worked. Maybe public humiliation and mockery may help get the message across that we're serious in our disappointment and frustration about the decline in both design and manufacturing standards :shrug:
Post by: Gerhard Gerber on September 28, 2015, 03:38:02 PM
I admit I don't post much but I do read the forum every day and the wealth of knowledge here is amazing. But, I have noticed something in this thread that's a little bothersome. It seems that a few people seem to be reveling in the issues with this tool. I personally don't want any of the manufacturers to put out bad products and don't wish any of them bad luck. When a major manufacturer fails it hurts the community as a whole. Constructive criticism and some exasperation is normal and helpful to the community and companies but delight in failure isn't. Just my thoughts.
Noticed that as well, but maybe it's the high price and gimmicky nature turning hardcore supporters sour......?
The first time I saw a Leatherman being used full-out was a Wave Gen 1, don't recall my comment but my friend's reply was something along the lines of "this whole tool is a hammer" 8)
Four years later the pliers' head broke and he paid up next to nothing for a Gen 2.
That made me a LM fan forever, and Signal I'll never buy.....
Post by: sawman on September 28, 2015, 03:59:38 PM
Leatherman Signal. ALL SIZZLE BUT NO STEAK.. :facepalm: :facepalm: :rofl::rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Post by: Kampfer on September 28, 2015, 06:05:36 PM
Post by: comis on September 28, 2015, 06:34:17 PM
I got mine back from my plantation manager/guide friend yesterday. He's not a a big multitool guy so his opinion was interesting. He liked the saw but thought it was too short for anything but very small branches. Also, the serrated blade annoyed him when he was trying to make very controlled cuts on wood. (I tried that last night and couldn't do it well either.) Jim also said that the awl, can opener and screwdrivers were too awkward to use and he wanted it to take regular bits. When I told him the price he just laughed.
I think a lot of time and effort went in to the design of the tool to get all of the "survival" bases covered without much thought to consistent use. This was designed for people who build bug out bags without using the tools in them very often. People like us tend to use our tools every day and understand the ergonomics and what works on these tools and what doesn't. I don't think Leatherman did any long term testing with this tool in a realistic every day use scenario and I don't think that's what they intended for the tool. The problem is that if you truly have to survive with it the problems that we've noted will hinder its usefulness.
I admit I don't post much but I do read the forum every day and the wealth of knowledge here is amazing. But, I have noticed something in this thread that's a little bothersome. It seems that a few people seem to be reveling in the issues with this tool. I personally don't want any of the manufacturers to put out bad products and don't wish any of them bad luck. When a major manufacturer fails it hurts the community as a whole. Constructive criticism and some exasperation is normal and helpful to the community and companies but delight in failure isn't. Just my thoughts.
Sent from Tracy Island
Definitely appreciate this prospective, and always good to read thoughts from different direction.
There is no doubt some Armageddon preppers may take interest in this, just on the novelty idea. But in all seriousness, I think LM might have originally wanted to target the outdoor community and make it some kind of 'specialized' tool for them to use. The question is what may motivate the bushcraft/outdoor crowd to buy this tool:
Cost:
Signal 120usd
vs
Laplander (~20usd) + Light my fire knife w/ ferro rod (~27usd) + Storm whistle (~7usd) + LM Rebar (~55usd) = 109usd
I would probably choose Combo 1, since I get two blades, two saws, and some of the tools are full size and more efficient. Trading the 'hammer' on Signal for a 'file' on Rebar.
Weight:
Signal (214g)
vs
Rebar (190g, 55usd) + Light my fire Scount model Ferro rod/scrapper/whistle (25g, 20usd) = 215g
Combo 2 is 1g more, but almost half the cost. Again, missing the hammer and OHO blade.
Weight and Dimension:
Signal
vs
Rebar + Nitecore NSW10 whistle + Exotac nanoSTRIKER Refill Kit
Combo 3 still cost a lot less, and approximately the same weight and dimension as Signal.
I consider myself a tool collector, so I probably will buy whatever I come across as novelty/interesting/different. But for the real MT users and seasonal outdoorsmen/women :shrug:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 28, 2015, 07:40:49 PM
I got mine back from my plantation manager/guide friend yesterday. He's not a a big multitool guy so his opinion was interesting. He liked the saw but thought it was too short for anything but very small branches. Also, the serrated blade annoyed him when he was trying to make very controlled cuts on wood. (I tried that last night and couldn't do it well either.) Jim also said that the awl, can opener and screwdrivers were too awkward to use and he wanted it to take regular bits. When I told him the price he just laughed.
I think a lot of time and effort went in to the design of the tool to get all of the "survival" bases covered without much thought to consistent use. This was designed for people who build bug out bags without using the tools in them very often. People like us tend to use our tools every day and understand the ergonomics and what works on these tools and what doesn't. I don't think Leatherman did any long term testing with this tool in a realistic every day use scenario and I don't think that's what they intended for the tool. The problem is that if you truly have to survive with it the problems that we've noted will hinder its usefulness.
I admit I don't post much but I do read the forum every day and the wealth of knowledge here is amazing. But, I have noticed something in this thread that's a little bothersome. It seems that a few people seem to be reveling in the issues with this tool. I personally don't want any of the manufacturers to put out bad products and don't wish any of them bad luck. When a major manufacturer fails it hurts the community as a whole. Constructive criticism and some exasperation is normal and helpful to the community and companies but delight in failure isn't. Just my thoughts.
Sent from Tracy Island
Definitely appreciate this prospective, and always good to read thoughts from different direction.
There is no doubt some Armageddon preppers may take interest in this, just on the novelty idea. But in all seriousness, I think LM might have originally wanted to target the outdoor community and make it some kind of 'specialized' tool for them to use. The question is what may motivate the bushcraft/outdoor crowd to buy this tool:
Cost:
Signal 120usd
vs
Laplander (~20usd) + Light my fire knife w/ ferro rod (~27usd) + Storm whistle (~7usd) + LM Rebar (~55usd) = 109usd
I would probably choose Combo 1, since I get two blades, two saws, and some of the tools are full size and more efficient. Trading the 'hammer' on Signal for a 'file' on Rebar.
Weight:
Signal (214g)
vs
Rebar (190g, 55usd) + Light my fire Scount model Ferro rod/scrapper/whistle (25g, 20usd) = 215g
Combo 2 is 1g more, but almost half the cost. Again, missing the hammer and OHO blade.
Weight and Dimension:
Signal
vs
Rebar + Nitecore NSW10 whistle + Exotac nanoSTRIKER Refill Kit
Combo 3 still cost a lot less, and approximately the same weight and dimension as Signal.
I consider myself a tool collector, so I probably will buy whatever I come across as novelty/interesting/different. But for the real MT users and seasonal outdoorsmen/women :shrug:
THIS WILL OWNED SIGNAL ANYTIME/ANYWHERE/ANYDAY AND STILL THREE TIMES CHEAPERS.. :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :multi:
Post by: SAKnight on September 28, 2015, 08:40:37 PM
It's just gone more and more commercial from there :facepalm:
It's about what they can put out to make money, whose attention they can attract to buy a product of theirs- not improving designs or building tools for their longtime customer base. It saddens me to think it could be the end of an era.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 28, 2015, 08:42:26 PM
I feel like it all started with the OHT. Right before I took a break from this site, the rebar had just dropped to tremendous love (despite some noted shortcomings, I feel overall most saw it as a great value, especially with the new plier head). Then around the time i left the OHT was either just coming out or was almost out. Lots of hype, but it didn't live up to expectation with the short tools, and large size. However, it was a solid, unique tool, and the price really wasn't that bad.
It's just gone more and more commercial from there :facepalm:
It's about what they can put out to make money, whose attention they can attract to buy a product of theirs- not improving designs or building tools for their longtime customer base. It saddens me to think it could be the end of an era.
LEATHERMAN NEED SEND limousine GET ME .. SO I CAN DESIGN THEY NEXT TOOLS :twak: :rofl:
Post by: Kampfer on September 28, 2015, 08:48:15 PM
Quote from: Leatherman Tool Group, Inc.
(http://forum.multitool.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=54342.0;attach=244308;image)Quote from: KampferHey there,
I just received the new Signal yesterday and I find the handles are spread too wide for me to have good grip when using its pliers.
Attached is a photo of Signal comparing with a Wave.
Is this the intent of its design?
I am considering returning this tool as it is not useable to me.
Thanks
Hello,
Thank you for contacting Leatherman Tool Group, Inc.
Unfortunately that is the design of the Signal, we did need to keep enough room for the handles not to touch (around the sharpener and ferro rod).
Regards,
Cameron Hansing
Customer Service
Post by: sawman on September 28, 2015, 09:10:33 PM
I feel like it all started with the OHT. Right before I took a break from this site, the rebar had just dropped to tremendous love (despite some noted shortcomings, I feel overall most saw it as a great value, especially with the new plier head). Then around the time i left the OHT was either just coming out or was almost out. Lots of hype, but it didn't live up to expectation with the short tools, and large size. However, it was a solid, unique tool, and the price really wasn't that bad.I wonder who's running things these days at LM ???
It's just gone more and more commercial from there :facepalm:
It's about what they can put out to make money, whose attention they can attract to buy a product of theirs- not improving designs or building tools for their longtime customer base. It saddens me to think it could be the end of an era.
Post by: Kampfer on September 28, 2015, 09:16:58 PM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 28, 2015, 09:18:18 PM
I did not like their recent offerings, OHT, Leap, Rev, Tread and now Signal.
I smell GERBERLAND :pok:
Post by: sawman on September 28, 2015, 09:24:08 PM
VICTORINOX :viking:I did not like their recent offerings, OHT, Leap, Rev, Tread and now Signal.
I smell GERBERLAND :pok:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 28, 2015, 09:43:59 PM
:cheers: :salute: :tu:VICTORINOX :viking:I did not like their recent offerings, OHT, Leap, Rev, Tread and now Signal.
I smell GERBERLAND :pok:
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 28, 2015, 10:13:41 PM
I got mine back from my plantation manager/guide friend yesterday. He's not a a big multitool guy so his opinion was interesting. He liked the saw but thought it was too short for anything but very small branches. Also, the serrated blade annoyed him when he was trying to make very controlled cuts on wood. (I tried that last night and couldn't do it well either.) Jim also said that the awl, can opener and screwdrivers were too awkward to use and he wanted it to take regular bits. When I told him the price he just laughed.
I think a lot of time and effort went in to the design of the tool to get all of the "survival" bases covered without much thought to consistent use. This was designed for people who build bug out bags without using the tools in them very often. People like us tend to use our tools every day and understand the ergonomics and what works on these tools and what doesn't. I don't think Leatherman did any long term testing with this tool in a realistic every day use scenario and I don't think that's what they intended for the tool. The problem is that if you truly have to survive with it the problems that we've noted will hinder its usefulness.
I admit I don't post much but I do read the forum every day and the wealth of knowledge here is amazing. But, I have noticed something in this thread that's a little bothersome. It seems that a few people seem to be reveling in the issues with this tool. I personally don't want any of the manufacturers to put out bad products and don't wish any of them bad luck. When a major manufacturer fails it hurts the community as a whole. Constructive criticism and some exasperation is normal and helpful to the community and companies but delight in failure isn't. Just my thoughts.
Sent from Tracy Island
There is no doubt some Armageddon preppers may take interest in this, just on the novelty idea. But in all seriousness, I think LM might have originally wanted to target the outdoor community and make it some kind of 'specialized' tool for them to use. The question is what may motivate the bushcraft/outdoor crowd to buy this tool:
Good point.
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Kampfer on September 28, 2015, 10:31:34 PM
I amn't no mall ninja. :mn:
Post by: firiki on September 28, 2015, 10:45:20 PM
What an absolutely unbelievable piece of crap. +$100 is insane for this kind of garbage. Spending that kind of money to try to mod it into something sort of useful is mystifying to me. Leatherman, please go back to making just the Wave, ST, and Rebar. You seriously suck when you lose focus+1
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Can't the government fine them or something for selling the people unsafe garbage? ???
That would be state interventionism ::)
Post by: babola on September 28, 2015, 10:51:35 PM
ok, I got the RMA#, returning it.
Good on ya', mate.
If more people decide to do the same that may actually make LM design team to sit down and rethink this one.
"Unfit for purpose"...that certainly smells like a product recall to me.
Post by: Kampfer on September 28, 2015, 11:02:04 PM
I don't blame the design team, I blame the executive's marketing direction.ok, I got the RMA#, returning it.
Good on ya', mate.
If more people decide to do the same that may actually make LM design team to sit down and rethink this one.
"Unfit for purpose"...that certainly smells like a product recall to me.
In recent years, seen like Leatherman been focusing the special interest groups like military, paramedic, snowboarder, skateboarder, surfers, kids now survivalist. To me, a multitool should be general purpose and multipurpose.
They are really on the wrong track.
Keep refining the Wave & PST platforms then you are golden.
Post by: firiki on September 28, 2015, 11:10:41 PM
I don't blame the design team, I blame the executive's marketing direction.
In recent years, seen like Leatherman been focusing the special interest groups like military, paramedic, snowboarder, skateboarder, surfers, kids now survivalist. To me, a multitool should be general purpose and multipurpose.
They are really on the wrong track.
Keep refining the Wave & PST platforms then you are golden.
That's how I think of a multi-tool as well. I guess the problem Leatherman has to overcome is how not to become boring, in a way. That and the fact that they can try to address the needs of different target groups. How they are going to succed in that is not my concern. I'm here to say what I think from a user's point of view.
I got mine back from my plantation manager/guide friend yesterday. He's not a a big multitool guy so his opinion was interesting. He liked the saw but thought it was too short for anything but very small branches. Also, the serrated blade annoyed him when he was trying to make very controlled cuts on wood. (I tried that last night and couldn't do it well either.) Jim also said that the awl, can opener and screwdrivers were too awkward to use and he wanted it to take regular bits. When I told him the price he just laughed.
I think a lot of time and effort went in to the design of the tool to get all of the "survival" bases covered without much thought to consistent use. This was designed for people who build bug out bags without using the tools in them very often. People like us tend to use our tools every day and understand the ergonomics and what works on these tools and what doesn't. I don't think Leatherman did any long term testing with this tool in a realistic every day use scenario and I don't think that's what they intended for the tool. The problem is that if you truly have to survive with it the problems that we've noted will hinder its usefulness.
I admit I don't post much but I do read the forum every day and the wealth of knowledge here is amazing. But, I have noticed something in this thread that's a little bothersome. It seems that a few people seem to be reveling in the issues with this tool. I personally don't want any of the manufacturers to put out bad products and don't wish any of them bad luck. When a major manufacturer fails it hurts the community as a whole. Constructive criticism and some exasperation is normal and helpful to the community and companies but delight in failure isn't. Just my thoughts.
Sent from Tracy Island
Nice to get an insight from someone looking at it with a fresh pair of eyes :tu: it's easy for use to lose perspective of how a tool may be perceived by someone less familiar with the multitool scene than we are. Interesting also to see that his enthusiasm for it pretty much parallels ours.
I agree with Syncop8r that we have a mix of people at MTO. We have the BOB builders who might not use them daily, as well as those who are using their multitools day in, day out. Your second paragraph reads like you're suggesting that the tool was designed to not be used, or at least designed to fulfil a theoretical concept rather than be a reliable working tool. I would agree with that, and it's a sad day when tool makers are selling things to stash in case of emergency and not focussing on how well they work should an emergency occur.
As to your final point, I think on this specific tool, Leatherman have truly earned all ridicule that has been forthcoming on this thread. From my own perspective, this isn't a one-off shambles, but one they've been systematically working towards. They appear to have walked away (to some extent) from toolmaking, and got into merely selling gadgets designed around social media trends. Whether it's budget tools, one piece tools, tools for kids, survival tools, recently it seems less about the viability and quality of the tool, and more about making something profitable with a catchy marketting angle, irrespective of whether it works or not.
As far as I'm concerned, they've taken several poor concepts and rolled them all together to make it even worse. If they want to be taken seriously, they should go back to basics and look at how to make the best tool for the job instead of some "gadget of the month" offering. When a company continues to make the same errors time and time again, but with worse and worse errors, and with growing prices, they deserve to be ridiculed.
There are lots of constructive criticism in this thread too. There is also lots and lots of constructive criticism around the site from before this was released which would have guided the designers away from making such a carbunkle. Info and feedback on ergonomics, what makes a good awl and a bad awl, what people want from a woods based tool system.... or indeed any emergency use tool... and it appears to have been duly ignored along with various basic design principles and common sense. Taking one specific aspect as an example, the hammer. It's a casting, it's thin in section in several places, some of those thin areas are near abrupt sectional changes, and they expect you to use it as a hammer.
We've tried constructive criticism several times in the past on other offerings, but it obviously hasn't worked. Maybe public humiliation and mockery may help get the message across that we're serious in our disappointment and frustration about the decline in both design and manufacturing standards :shrug:
I'm afraid 50ft speaks the awful truth in this fine post. I wouldn't be proud to have designed the Signal if I were the designing team. Having followed the exec's instuctions is another fing.
:facepalm:
Post by: Kampfer on September 28, 2015, 11:28:42 PM
The prepared and the unprepared.
The prepared group would want to have nice MT on person or at least nearby, the seriousness of the MT would base on how prepared the individual wants to be and what their needs would be .
The unprepared, there is nothing anyone can do about that.
Post by: firiki on September 28, 2015, 11:41:18 PM
The unprepared, there is nothing anyone can do about that.
Well, if the unprepared can choose their MT from a selection of decent quality, functional tools then they have less excuses ;)
That way it's easier for people to change their mentality.
@Leatherman :poke:
Post by: Kampfer on September 28, 2015, 11:43:29 PM
They do have Sidekick / Wingman for them, converted me. :tu:The unprepared, there is nothing anyone can do about that.
Well, if the unprepared can choose their MT from a selection of decent quality, functional tools then they have less excuses ;)
That way it's easier for people to change their mentality.
@Leatherman :poke:
Post by: sawman on September 29, 2015, 12:17:58 AM
Wingman :tu: :salute:They do have Sidekick / Wingman for them, converted me. :tu:The unprepared, there is nothing anyone can do about that.
Well, if the unprepared can choose their MT from a selection of decent quality, functional tools then they have less excuses ;)
That way it's easier for people to change their mentality.
@Leatherman :poke:
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 29, 2015, 12:35:50 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: SAKnight on September 29, 2015, 12:45:27 AM
One thing it seems we all agree on is that the tool needs to be redesigned. I wonder if Leatherman is even reading this thread......
Sent from Tracy Island
Probably laughing at it with money falling out of their pockets... :facepalm:
Glad I haven't bought a leatherman new for some time.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on September 29, 2015, 01:00:54 AM
I did not like their recent offerings, OHT, Leap, Rev, Tread and now Signal.
I smell GERBERLAND :pok:
Nothing wrong with Gerber. In my personal opinion....
Balance > S2 Juice
Diesel > Rebar
Suspension > Wingman/Sidekick
MP400 > Kick
MP600 > OHT
.... but I appreciate that not everyone agrees :)
One thing it seems we all agree on is that the tool needs to be redesigned. I wonder if Leatherman is even reading this thread......
Sent from Tracy Island
Probably laughing at it with money falling out of their pockets... :facepalm:
Glad I haven't bought a leatherman new for some time.
Quite possibly....
I think there's still more than enough residual group psychology at play for the gullible masses to be swept along by the hype, though I don't know how many more lemons they'll tolerate before they start questioning if You Tube and Facebook has led them astray
Post by: sawman on September 29, 2015, 01:03:51 AM
Post by: BASguy on September 29, 2015, 01:56:18 AM
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 29, 2015, 02:02:39 AM
Post by: Gareth on September 29, 2015, 02:05:06 AM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 29, 2015, 02:07:13 AM
While this thread does make for pretty depressing reading it did spur me to pick up my Pulse, just to remind myself that LM really could make an excellent MT. :)
:tu:
Post by: sawman on September 29, 2015, 02:11:46 AM
While this thread does make for pretty depressing reading it did spur me to pick up my Pulse, just to remind myself that LM really could make an excellent MT. :)As super soured as I am with LM right now I still love my Wave, Wingman and Rebar. I do hope they haven't wasted too much money on the production of the OHT and SIGNAL. Two terrible, terrible tools. What gets me also are the higher than Victorinox prices but WITHOUT the Vic QC :td:
Post by: Zephon on September 29, 2015, 02:11:53 AM
"We'll sell it to those people who are looking for a one-stop-shop piece of gear to keep in their cars or bags for worst case scenarios. They won't actually use it but rather they'll just take comfort in the fact that there's something like this in their car or bag. Oh, and if all heck breaks loose, there's always FEMA or homeland security to take care of us."
Seeing the price of the tool, it'll probably cost double when it shows up in local stores. With a "preparedness mentality" trending here these days due to earthquakes happening all over the globe (except here), I'm sure there will be people here who'll buy the Spirit based on tool load-out alone. The tragedy of it all is that this'll just encourage more tools like this.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 29, 2015, 03:13:51 AM
Post by: rishardh on September 29, 2015, 05:20:56 AM
WAVE , SURGE , SUPERTOOL , BLAST > ALL NEW LEATHERBOY :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
I see what you did there :D
Post by: Obi1shinobee on September 29, 2015, 05:37:42 AM
WAVE , SURGE , SUPERTOOL , BLAST > ALL NEW LEATHERBOY :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
I see what you did there :D
IM YOUR HUCKLEBERRY !!
Post by: dks on September 29, 2015, 09:02:12 AM
-99.9% of the people who buy multiools buy them as gadgets that will never be used either to show to their friends once a year, impressing them with all its functions, or to give as present to a husband/father/wife etc, who will never use it.
-Most people actually using pliers based multitools use cheap Chinese ones, maybe with car name on them, given free etc. - A lot more of those are sold everyday.
-A LM, SOG, Gerber etc, especially with the price they have in most of the world (i.e. not the US) are just expensive gadgets/presents, rather than cheap gadgets/presents
-I know a few people that actually do have them - none use them. A few are firemen, but just use a cheap Chinese multiool, since they do not want to damage their expensive LM (according to them).
-Most people that actually need tools will have proper tools and no real need to compromise, with a multitool.
-The only multittol you will see people use regularly will be a SAK, usually a classic or a thin 91/85mm model
-The people that actually analyse and discuss and test multitools, like we do here, are a very small minority, which can not even make a dent in the multiool makers sales - We have been complaining about the SOG Powerduo since it was first made -guess what? it is still being made, exactly the same, with the same stellar quality, and is probably selling well...
-The LM signal looks pretty, has a lot of functions and it will be bought by many people who will give it as an expensive present to family members who will never use it.
-Most companies also make more serious multitools, for those that want to buy them and use them.
Post by: Mextreme on September 29, 2015, 09:41:07 AM
I said it before, but:
-99.9% of the people who buy multiools buy them as gadgets that will never be used either to show to their friends once a year, impressing them with all its functions, or to give as present to a husband/father/wife etc, who will never use it.
-Most people actually using pliers based multitools use cheap Chinese ones, maybe with car name on them, given free etc. - A lot more of those are sold everyday.
-A LM, SOG, Gerber etc, especially with the price they have in most of the world (i.e. not the US) are just expensive gadgets/presents, rather than cheap gadgets/presents
-I know a few people that actually do have them - none use them. A few are firemen, but just use a cheap Chinese multiool, since they do not want to damage their expensive LM (according to them).
-Most people that actually need tools will have proper tools and no real need to compromise, with a multitool.
-The only multittol you will see people use regularly will be a SAK, usually a classic or a thin 91/85mm model
-The people that actually analyse and discuss and test multitools, like we do here, are a very small minority, which can not even make a dent in the multiool makers sales - We have been complaining about the SOG Powerduo since it was first made -guess what? it is still being made, exactly the same, with the same stellar quality, and is probably selling well...
-The LM signal looks pretty, has a lot of functions and it will be bought by many people who will give it as an expensive present to family members who will never use it.
-Most companies also make more serious multitools, for those that want to buy them and use them.
That is sadly so true.
However I still think these companies should listen carefully. A lot of video reviews posted by the "freaks" that are multi tool connesiurs reach far beyond the "choire". Also there are a lot of free engineering advice from really knowledgeable people to take advantage of.
Post by: comis on September 29, 2015, 09:53:18 AM
I said it before, but:
-99.9% of the people who buy multiools buy them as gadgets that will never be used either to show to their friends once a year, impressing them with all its functions, or to give as present to a husband/father/wife etc, who will never use it.
-Most people actually using pliers based multitools use cheap Chinese ones, maybe with car name on them, given free etc. - A lot more of those are sold everyday.
-A LM, SOG, Gerber etc, especially with the price they have in most of the world (i.e. not the US) are just expensive gadgets/presents, rather than cheap gadgets/presents
-I know a few people that actually do have them - none use them. A few are firemen, but just use a cheap Chinese multiool, since they do not want to damage their expensive LM (according to them).
-Most people that actually need tools will have proper tools and no real need to compromise, with a multitool.
-The only multittol you will see people use regularly will be a SAK, usually a classic or a thin 91/85mm model
-The people that actually analyse and discuss and test multitools, like we do here, are a very small minority, which can not even make a dent in the multiool makers sales - We have been complaining about the SOG Powerduo since it was first made -guess what? it is still being made, exactly the same, with the same stellar quality, and is probably selling well...
-The LM signal looks pretty, has a lot of functions and it will be bought by many people who will give it as an expensive present to family members who will never use it.
-Most companies also make more serious multitools, for those that want to buy them and use them.
That is sadly so true.
However I still think these companies should listen carefully. A lot of video reviews posted by the "freaks" that are multi tool connesiurs reach far beyond the "choire". Also there are a lot of free engineering advice from really knowledgeable people to take advantage of.
+1
I remembered just reading one of us commenting about the same thing in blades forum, that most tradesman do not use MT, but only tools they have for jobs. As for knife, cheap cutter is still the prefer choice, since the cost/effort to maintain it sharp is minimum(just swap out dull blades).
Post by: Demel on September 29, 2015, 12:15:35 PM
I remembered just reading one of us commenting about the same thing in blades forum, that most tradesman do not use MT, but only tools they have for jobs. As for knife, cheap cutter is still the prefer choice, since the cost/effort to maintain it sharp is minimum(just swap out dull blades).
That's what I want. A multi with the main blade as a utility blade. I do factory work and with all the cardboard I cut I much rather have the utility blade.
Post by: BASguy on October 02, 2015, 03:38:42 AM
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 02, 2015, 03:47:40 AM
I can't speak for what other's experience is, but I would disagree that 99% of people don't use their multitools. I work in the mechanical trades and for the last 20+ years most people I see on a daily basis have a multitool on their hip. Very few of them are multi tool aficionados, they just carry one because they use it...a lot. I can't remember the last time seeing a tradesman using a Chinese knockoff. That pretty much never happens. Leatherman is the choice of 90% of the users. I can attest that the older guys that have bought replacement Leatherman's in the last several years, by and large gripe about the quality downturn. Younger guys by them because "Leatherman" is the standard and they don't know any better on what quality once was. Perhaps this is why Leatherman can now produce inferior crap, because they have the name recognition to get away with it.
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
My Ps4 owned signal cuz i dont have Signal hahaha . :rofl: http://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,62258.0.html
Post by: Tixx on October 02, 2015, 03:48:27 AM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 02, 2015, 03:59:38 AM
Unfortunately I sent my back for a refund. My waves or a TTis with a firesteel, whistle and a rock will do much better since I always have that stuff with me when hiking around. I do like the replaceable wire cutters though. :)
Get cheap rebar and add Pliers replaceable cutters to waves or a TTis under 25 bucks.. OWNED SIGNAL ANYDAY :rofl:
Post by: Kampfer on October 02, 2015, 05:07:15 AM
Post by: dks on October 02, 2015, 07:52:47 AM
I can't speak for what other's experience is, but I would disagree that 99% of people don't use their multitools. I work in the mechanical trades and for the last 20+ years most people I see on a daily basis have a multitool on their hip. Very few of them are multi tool aficionados, they just carry one because they use it...a lot. I can't remember the last time seeing a tradesman using a Chinese knockoff. That pretty much never happens. Leatherman is the choice of 90% of the users. I can attest that the older guys that have bought replacement Leatherman's in the last several years, by and large gripe about the quality downturn. Younger guys by them because "Leatherman" is the standard and they don't know any better on what quality once was. Perhaps this is why Leatherman can now produce inferior crap, because they have the name recognition to get away with it.
I have never seen a mechanic or builder or any other tradesman with any type of multitool (around Europe)- Last time anybody showed me one (army guy) was 2 years ago, a Ganzo, which he just used to cut a cake. :D and went on about how fantastic it was, before hiding it so that it would not get damaged. I do spent a lot of time with mechanics, builders, engineers etc.
I have given people multitools as presents, and they just do not have any use for them.... but they like them.
The multiool is a lot more part of the US culture than the European culture. Most tradesmen or just men/women here will just have a knife or SAK on them, rather than a pliers based multitool (and proper tools).
Only during the past few years have multitools become more common with lower cost (25Euro or more) branded offerings from Bahco, B&D, Stanley, Lidl, but still they are not being used - just bought as a gadget.
LM etc. are just too expensive for people to use. I actually was at the main LM and Gerber dealer a few days ago and his display seemed the same as it was 5 years ago - not many sales. The cheapest proper multitool, the wingman, was 65 Euro. The prices in outdoor/hunting/fishing shops are the same, if not higher. 160 euro gets you a Surge..
As for the guarantee, you needed to pay about 25Euro (possibly more nowadays) to have any item fixed under guarantee here.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 02, 2015, 08:23:07 AM
Unfortunately I sent my back for a refund. My waves or a TTis with a firesteel, whistle and a rock will do much better since I always have that stuff with me when hiking around. I do like the replaceable wire cutters though. :)
I am sending mine back tomorrow, I hope they will get the "Signal"..
It will be interesting to see how many people follow suit.
When I hear negative reviews on a tool, I sometimes feel there may have been unrealistic expectations of the tool, and folk therefore are disappointed they didn't get "more" rather than just not liking what the tool actually does offer. I think I did the same the first time I tried a Sideclip and a Rebar, and didn't connect with what the tool actually did offer (I later tried both again, and changed my mind on one but not the other).
On this occasion though (bearing in mind I haven't handled one of these personally) I don't feel that people are being hasty in returning them. Without repeating everything that has already been said, I don't think this tool should have been released in it's current format at this price point. These guys ought to know more about making comfortable quality tools than they appear to demonstrate with this offering.
Leatherman really do need to go "back to basics" if they wish to be taken seriously in the future. They need to spend more time considering how the tools should function and how they should feel rather than just how many marketting points they can score. They need to do this on every new product before bringing any more "gadget of the month" offerings to the market, otherwise that loyal fanbase they spent so long beguiling, is going to start to see through the hype
Post by: gadgetman7 on October 02, 2015, 04:54:29 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 02, 2015, 09:36:09 PM
True. It shouldn't have been released with these design issues, and the price is high for the tool. I don't have a Facebook account. How are they being received there?
Sent from Tracy Island
I think the mail man brings it just like with everyone else.....
:P
Post by: babola on October 02, 2015, 10:43:00 PM
True. It shouldn't have been released with these design issues, and the price is high for the tool. I don't have a Facebook account. How are they being received there?
Sent from Tracy Island
You don't need facebook acct to read LM posts on their public f/b page. It's a fun read...it shows how much of a gap is between those clueless on LM f/b + twitter and the ones in the know... 8)
Post by: Kampfer on October 02, 2015, 11:33:40 PM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 02, 2015, 11:56:56 PM
Mine is enroute to LM, I want my money back.
FINALLY :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :tu:
Post by: captain spaulding on October 03, 2015, 12:55:06 AM
I am sending mine back tomorrow, I hope they will get the "Signal"..
:rofl:
So I have been lacking on reading this thread. Can I get a run down of the Signals shortcomings and why you are sending yours back?
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 03, 2015, 01:03:13 AM
I am sending mine back tomorrow, I hope they will get the "Signal"..
:rofl:
So I have been lacking on reading this thread. Can I get a run down of the Signals shortcomings and why you are sending yours back?
He need money buy his kids stuff :rofl:
Post by: BASguy on October 03, 2015, 05:28:02 AM
I am sending mine back tomorrow, I hope they will get the "Signal"..
:rofl:
So I have been lacking on reading this thread. Can I get a run down of the Signals shortcomings and why you are sending yours back?
Summary: it sucks
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: captain spaulding on October 03, 2015, 05:45:22 AM
I am sending mine back tomorrow, I hope they will get the "Signal"..
:rofl:
So I have been lacking on reading this thread. Can I get a run down of the Signals shortcomings and why you are sending yours back?
Summary: it sucks
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Tell me something I don't know. I have been saying that for 6 months before the tool was even released. :D
Post by: Kampfer on October 03, 2015, 06:32:35 AM
Post by: Kampfer on October 03, 2015, 06:33:13 AM
Cap, did you read my review on Signal?I am sending mine back tomorrow, I hope they will get the "Signal"..
:rofl:
So I have been lacking on reading this thread. Can I get a run down of the Signals shortcomings and why you are sending yours back?
Post by: captain spaulding on October 03, 2015, 07:14:21 AM
Cap, did you read my review on Signal?I am sending mine back tomorrow, I hope they will get the "Signal"..
:rofl:
So I have been lacking on reading this thread. Can I get a run down of the Signals shortcomings and why you are sending yours back?
I do not believe I did. I was just wondering why you had not done a review as I figured you would definitely have done one. I will go find it now.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 06, 2015, 05:42:25 AM
Post by: comis on October 06, 2015, 10:54:18 AM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 06, 2015, 02:50:54 PM
>:D
Post by: gadgetman7 on October 06, 2015, 08:58:30 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 06, 2015, 09:33:00 PM
I was just browsing on LM homepage, and was thinking maybe one of us should comment/review Signal on their product page.
I post on the site earlier but they wont let me post :twak: :twak: :multi: :rant: :facepalm:
Post by: Kampfer on October 06, 2015, 09:54:36 PM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 06, 2015, 09:57:39 PM
I told them what I think of it when I request for a RMA#
Lord Vader Rise !!! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Post by: comis on October 07, 2015, 03:24:52 AM
I was just browsing on LM homepage, and was thinking maybe one of us should comment/review Signal on their product page.
I post on the site earlier but they wont let me post :twak: :twak: :multi: :rant: :facepalm:
Err...why is that? Maybe they need some product number or registration to post?
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 07, 2015, 03:26:41 AM
I was just browsing on LM homepage, and was thinking maybe one of us should comment/review Signal on their product page.
I post on the site earlier but they wont let me post :twak: :twak: :multi: :rant: :facepalm:
Err...why is that? Maybe they need some product number or registration to post?
Maybe cuz i give them 1 star and say useless MT.. :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Post by: babola on October 07, 2015, 03:33:59 AM
I was just browsing on LM homepage, and was thinking maybe one of us should comment/review Signal on their product page.
I post on the site earlier but they wont let me post :twak: :twak: :multi: :rant: :facepalm:
Err...why is that? Maybe they need some product number or registration to post?
Maybe cuz i give them 1 star and say useless MT.. :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Feedback is reviewed for appropriate content and profanity before posted publicly by LM on their product pages...just what sort of words did you use Obi? :angel:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 07, 2015, 03:37:09 AM
I was just browsing on LM homepage, and was thinking maybe one of us should comment/review Signal on their product page.
I post on the site earlier but they wont let me post :twak: :twak: :multi: :rant: :facepalm:
Err...why is that? Maybe they need some product number or registration to post?
Maybe cuz i give them 1 star and say useless MT.. :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Feedback is reviewed for appropriate content and profanity before posted publicly by LM on their product pages...just what sort of words did you use Obi? :angel:
I say go with Wave/Charge/Surge/Supertool 300.. Signal is useless :rofl:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 07, 2015, 03:46:26 AM
I was just browsing on LM homepage, and was thinking maybe one of us should comment/review Signal on their product page.
I post on the site earlier but they wont let me post :twak: :twak: :multi: :rant: :facepalm:
Err...why is that? Maybe they need some product number or registration to post?
Maybe cuz i give them 1 star and say useless MT.. :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Feedback is reviewed for appropriate content and profanity before posted publicly by LM on their product pages...just what sort of words did you use Obi? :angel:
Leatherman Juice XE6 with those still Owned Signal and cheaper :rofl:
Post by: comis on October 07, 2015, 05:27:17 AM
I was just browsing on LM homepage, and was thinking maybe one of us should comment/review Signal on their product page.
I post on the site earlier but they wont let me post :twak: :twak: :multi: :rant: :facepalm:
Err...why is that? Maybe they need some product number or registration to post?
Maybe cuz i give them 1 star and say useless MT.. :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Feedback is reviewed for appropriate content and profanity before posted publicly by LM on their product pages...just what sort of words did you use Obi? :angel:
I say go with Wave/Charge/Surge/Supertool 300.. Signal is useless :rofl:
I am surprised by this. I just looked at the reviews of Rebar, which I consider to be a good offering from LM. And some of the reviews are actually one star and 'do not recommend to friends'. So kudos to LM for being impartial and fair to their reviews.
Are they worry that negative review right from the start which will affect the sales of Signal?
Post by: rishardh on October 07, 2015, 02:23:14 PM
Was on the LM site today, sorted their MTs by bestsellers and guess what came up on top.... the Signal. Followed by the Wave and Wingman to make the top 3. I wonder what sort of algorithm is used for this.
Post by: Etherealicer on October 07, 2015, 02:53:31 PM
Or what time-frame... It's probably the bestseller for the last week/month.
Was on the LM site today, sorted their MTs by bestsellers and guess what came up on top.... the Signal. Followed by the Wave and Wingman to make the top 3. I wonder what sort of algorithm is used for this.
Post by: rishardh on October 07, 2015, 03:16:31 PM
Or what time-frame... It's probably the bestseller for the last week/month.
Was on the LM site today, sorted their MTs by bestsellers and guess what came up on top.... the Signal. Followed by the Wave and Wingman to make the top 3. I wonder what sort of algorithm is used for this.
Isn't the Wingman their top selling MT now? If this is true then the Wingman should be #2 no? Maybe it's all time sales divided by sales days(age).
Post by: Etherealicer on October 07, 2015, 03:59:07 PM
I doubt it's that complicated... I bet its just top selling in the last week/month.Or what time-frame... It's probably the bestseller for the last week/month.
Was on the LM site today, sorted their MTs by bestsellers and guess what came up on top.... the Signal. Followed by the Wave and Wingman to make the top 3. I wonder what sort of algorithm is used for this.
Isn't the Wingman their top selling MT now? If this is true then the Wingman should be #2 no? Maybe it's all time sales divided by sales days(age).
You know all it takes is a larger order of Waves from a re-seller. Check back in two weeks...
Post by: rishardh on October 07, 2015, 05:45:26 PM
I doubt it's that complicated... I bet its just top selling in the last week/month.Or what time-frame... It's probably the bestseller for the last week/month.
Was on the LM site today, sorted their MTs by bestsellers and guess what came up on top.... the Signal. Followed by the Wave and Wingman to make the top 3. I wonder what sort of algorithm is used for this.
Isn't the Wingman their top selling MT now? If this is true then the Wingman should be #2 no? Maybe it's all time sales divided by sales days(age).
You know all it takes is a larger order of Waves from a re-seller. Check back in two weeks...
Good point, I assumed they would go by sales on the LM web site alone.
Post by: gadgetman7 on October 07, 2015, 08:03:26 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: gadgetman7 on October 07, 2015, 08:04:58 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: babola on October 07, 2015, 10:22:18 PM
Are they worry that negative review right from the start which will affect the sales of Signal?
Correct. Their Signal is currently selling like hot cakes and reviews like Obi's wouldn't help their bottom line at the moment.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 07, 2015, 10:25:34 PM
Are they worry that negative review right from the start which will affect the sales of Signal?
Correct. Their Signal is currently selling like hot cakes and reviews like Obi's wouldn't help their bottom line at the moment.
Time will make them go :twak: :multi: :rant:
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 07, 2015, 11:25:39 PM
Are they worry that negative review right from the start which will affect the sales of Signal?
Correct. Their Signal is currently selling like hot cakes and reviews like Obi's wouldn't help their bottom line at the moment.
Well they should go back to making tools that get good reviews then :D seems like pretty simple logic to me, but maybe there's something I've missed out on :shrug:
Post by: babola on October 07, 2015, 11:50:18 PM
Are they worry that negative review right from the start which will affect the sales of Signal?
Correct. Their Signal is currently selling like hot cakes and reviews like Obi's wouldn't help their bottom line at the moment.
Well they should go back to making tools that get good reviews then :D seems like pretty simple logic to me, but maybe there's something I've missed out on :shrug:
What you missed was the fact they don't really care much about people like you, me, Kampfer, Obi etc...to them you're more of a fly in the ointment, one of the select few...opinionated and knowledgeable. What you think of their products isn't worth their attention. That stuff unfortunately don't seem to matter to the Gerbers, Leathermans, SOGs etc of this world these days any more.
Post by: kirk13 on October 07, 2015, 11:50:36 PM
Are they worry that negative review right from the start which will affect the sales of Signal?
Correct. Their Signal is currently selling like hot cakes and reviews like Obi's wouldn't help their bottom line at the moment.
Well they should go back to making tools that get good reviews then :D seems like pretty simple logic to me, but maybe there's something I've missed out on :shrug:
There's better margins in making lower grade tools and selling them to people who don't know better.
Mind you,you knew that ;)
Post by: gadgetman7 on October 08, 2015, 03:22:49 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: BASguy on October 08, 2015, 03:33:23 AM
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 08, 2015, 03:56:10 AM
Post by: Kampfer on October 08, 2015, 04:07:24 AM
Post by: NKlamerus on October 08, 2015, 06:41:45 AM
It seen like well received on MTo's Facebook page.Definetly a different POV on the Facebook feed.
Much more photo and looks oriented, than use and constriction IMO
Post by: sawman on October 08, 2015, 12:56:22 PM
Post by: colt 1911 on October 16, 2015, 03:58:46 AM
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/15/d250d0b15522e2a3282b0cfed01db545.jpg)
Sak's rule !
Post by: babola on October 16, 2015, 06:35:10 AM
I rather like it, ditch the plastic crap and change the blade it's pretty decent.
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/15/d250d0b15522e2a3282b0cfed01db545.jpg)
Sak's rule !
LOL!
Or just get a Wave with a lot more tools for a lot less... :pok:
Post by: ducttapetech on October 16, 2015, 01:17:21 PM
That's us mobile.
Nate
Post by: colt 1911 on October 16, 2015, 01:55:46 PM
I rather like it, ditch the plastic crap and change the blade it's pretty decent.
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/15/d250d0b15522e2a3282b0cfed01db545.jpg)
Sak's rule !
LOL!
Or just get a Wave with a lot more tools for a lot less... :pok:
True but the hammer is where it's at for me.
Sak's rule !
Post by: colt 1911 on October 16, 2015, 01:56:15 PM
That is sweet looking Colt!
That's us mobile.
Nate
Sak's rule !
Post by: babola on October 16, 2015, 08:05:54 PM
I rather like it, ditch the plastic crap and change the blade it's pretty decent.
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/15/d250d0b15522e2a3282b0cfed01db545.jpg)
Sak's rule !
LOL!
Or just get a Wave with a lot more tools for a lot less... :pok:
True but the hammer is where it's at for me.
Sak's rule !
I wouldn't call that a hammer ;)
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 17, 2015, 12:03:51 AM
I rather like it, ditch the plastic crap and change the blade it's pretty decent.
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/15/d250d0b15522e2a3282b0cfed01db545.jpg)
Sak's rule !
Just looking at that pic, the peg thingy where the sharpener locates looks extremely uncomfortable in knife/saw mode. Is it really better with that exposed than with the sharpener in position?
Post by: derekmac on October 17, 2015, 12:59:08 AM
I rather like it, ditch the plastic crap and change the blade it's pretty decent.Nice buddy! :tu: What blade did you use?
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/15/d250d0b15522e2a3282b0cfed01db545.jpg)
Sak's rule !
Post by: Kampfer on October 17, 2015, 01:27:37 AM
It is not, the tool is less comfortable with those stuff removed.I rather like it, ditch the plastic crap and change the blade it's pretty decent.
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/15/d250d0b15522e2a3282b0cfed01db545.jpg)
Sak's rule !
Just looking at that pic, the peg thingy where the sharpener locates looks extremely uncomfortable in knife/saw mode. Is it really better with that exposed than with the sharpener in position?
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 17, 2015, 02:40:05 AM
It is not, the tool is less comfortable with those stuff removed.I rather like it, ditch the plastic crap and change the blade it's pretty decent.
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/15/d250d0b15522e2a3282b0cfed01db545.jpg)
Sak's rule !
Just looking at that pic, the peg thingy where the sharpener locates looks extremely uncomfortable in knife/saw mode. Is it really better with that exposed than with the sharpener in position?
The whistle/firesteel too?
Post by: Kampfer on October 17, 2015, 05:01:28 AM
Post by: colt 1911 on October 17, 2015, 06:55:33 AM
I rather like it, ditch the plastic crap and change the blade it's pretty decent.Nice buddy! :tu: What blade did you use?
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/15/d250d0b15522e2a3282b0cfed01db545.jpg)
Sak's rule !
Thanks man, took the blade out of a wave.
Sak's rule !
Post by: colt 1911 on October 17, 2015, 07:01:42 AM
It is not, the tool is less comfortable with those stuff removed.I rather like it, ditch the plastic crap and change the blade it's pretty decent.
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/15/d250d0b15522e2a3282b0cfed01db545.jpg)
Sak's rule !
Just looking at that pic, the peg thingy where the sharpener locates looks extremely uncomfortable in knife/saw mode. Is it really better with that exposed than with the sharpener in position?
The whistle/firesteel too?
Personally I like it better with out the accessories. The peg doesn't bother me. I'm not sure why everyone's knocking it so bad,
Sak's rule !
Post by: colt 1911 on October 17, 2015, 07:04:12 AM
It is not, the tool is less comfortable with those stuff removed.I rather like it, ditch the plastic crap and change the blade it's pretty decent.
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/15/d250d0b15522e2a3282b0cfed01db545.jpg)
Sak's rule !
Just looking at that pic, the peg thingy where the sharpener locates looks extremely uncomfortable in knife/saw mode. Is it really better with that exposed than with the sharpener in position?
The whistle/firesteel too?
Personally I like it better with out the accessories. The peg doesn't bother me. I'm not sure why everyone's knocking it so bad,
Sak's rule !
Sak's rule !
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 17, 2015, 09:49:16 AM
Post by: Kampfer on October 17, 2015, 11:33:40 AM
Post by: Kampfer on October 17, 2015, 11:38:14 AM
Emergency blanket
Cell phone charger
WiFi booster
A full case of MRE
Half case of H2O
:whistle:
Post by: sawman on October 17, 2015, 01:54:40 PM
I wrote to Leatherman told them if they really want to make a MT can help me survive in wildness for 72 hours, they must find a way to fit in the following features:Kampfer buddy, that multitool already exists...
Emergency blanket
Cell phone charger
WiFi booster
A full case of MRE
Half case of H2O
:whistle:
It's the NAVITOOL!!!!
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Post by: colt 1911 on October 17, 2015, 04:07:16 PM
I wrote to Leatherman told them if they really want to make a MT can help me survive in wildness for 72 hours, they must find a way to fit in the following features:
Emergency blanket
Cell phone charger
WiFi booster
A full case of MRE
Half case of H2O
:whistle:
Sak's rule !
Post by: Kampfer on October 17, 2015, 06:08:45 PM
Post by: dks on October 17, 2015, 09:17:13 PM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 17, 2015, 09:33:33 PM
I wrote to Leatherman told them if they really want to make a MT can help me survive in wildness for 72 hours, they must find a way to fit in the following features:Kampfer buddy, that multitool already exists...
Emergency blanket
Cell phone charger
WiFi booster
A full case of MRE
Half case of H2O
:whistle:
It's the NAVITOOL!!!!
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
sawman https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_IlNbsILLE NAVITOOL > SIGNAL http://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,62288.0.html :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Post by: Syncop8r on October 17, 2015, 10:11:51 PM
Good things to have on a "survival" multi I would think.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 17, 2015, 10:14:07 PM
Do people here dislike that it has a whistle and firesteel, or dislike how these have been made?
Good things to have on a "survival" multi I would think.
Im gonna buy Leatherman Signal .. NAVITOOL VS SIGNAL.. You will see NAVITOOL Tell LM Signal GO MAKE ME SANDWICH... :twak: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 17, 2015, 11:01:40 PM
NAVITOOL = ::) SIGNAL= PLIERS
NAVITOOL = SCISSOR SIGNAL = :ahhh
NAVITOOL = FLAT/PHILLIP DRIVER SIGNAL= FLAT/PHILLIP DRIVER
NAVITOOL = SAW SIGNAL = SAW
NAVITOOL = CAN OPENER/Bottle opener SIGNAL= CAN OPENER/ Bottle Opener
NAVITOOL = >:( SIGNAL = AWL
NAVITOOL = WHISTLE 120db Super Loud SIGNAL = WHISTLE
NAVITOOL = Bic LIGHER / Firesteel SIGNAL = LITTLE FIRE STEEL
NAVITOOL = BIG BOX SIGNAL = SHARPENER
NAVITOOL = In the wood alot Rock SIGNAL = HAMMER
NAVITOOL = LIGHT SIGNAL= :-[
NAVITOOL= COMPASS SIGNAL= >:(
NAVITOOL= CORKSCREW SIGNAL = ?? COCKSCREW ???
NAVITOOL= SIGNAL MIRROR SIGNAL= :rant:
NAVITOOL= Clock (stopwatch, alarm, backlight)
* Barometer (thermometer, standard and metric)
* Altimeter (to 29,500ft)
SIGNAL= :bnghd:
NAVITOOL = store fishing kits SIGNAL= :sa:
NAVITOOL= good luck find some bolt in the woods SIGNAL=1/4” Hex Bit Driver, 1/4" Box Wrench, Carabiner,3/16" Box Wrench
NAVITOOL= $15 ON EBAY :gimme: SIGNAL = $120 AT REI :surrender: :surrender: :surrender:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 17, 2015, 11:18:58 PM
Do people here dislike that it has a whistle and firesteel, or dislike how these have been made?
Good things to have on a "survival" multi I would think.
I dislike the hammer, the pinchy carabiner clip, the indexable cutter pliers, the fact you can't use the screwdriver with the tool closed, the lack of scissors, the handle splay, and the fact the "survival goodies" are mounted on the handles. Lets face it, I don't like the ergonomics in general. I also don't like the awl as it's too rounded. A good awl should have a slower taper like the Victorinox awls tend to have. I don't like the fact the firesteel is on the whistle, and the mouthpiece is potentially going to have bits of firesteel on it as well as potential contamination from my hands from using the tool, or even from dropping the tool of having to set it down while working. I certainly don't like the price of the tool either, and consider that a Wave would be a better purchase from them.
If that all sounds too negative, I do at least like the colour :tu: :D
(although a higher visibility colour scheme would have made a lot more sense to me :whistle:)
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 17, 2015, 11:38:06 PM
The Signal chose to include a whistle, firesteel and sharpener
I can't fault the addition of any of those items
For me the BG Strata has a superior sheath, and keeps the peripherals off the tool. I would expect the Signal to feel significantly more rugged than the Strata which does flex and even creak a bit in hand. I have however put the Strata to work and it did everything I asked of it.
For me the Strata wins on ergonomics (particularly when fatigued already and with cold/wet hands), scissors, file (albeit small, it might be enough to clean off some electrical terminals or suchlike), driver assortment, best can opener I've found on any pliers based tool (and actually I'd prefer that as an awl to the dedicated one on the Signal), visibility of tool if dropped, and once again - price!
The Signal looks like it would be superior on knife blade, saw, hard wire cutting if you had to poach some fencing wire to improvise a shelter or tool of some sort... assuming the ergonomics don't impede that.
I know the BG Strata gets a lot of flak round these parts, but mine will be going in the glovebox of my car, and I'll not be "investing" in a Signal, as from what I can see it would offer me less (on balance) in respect of capability (bearing in mind my emergency may not be woods oriented should I need it), and will cost significantly more for the privilege of getting less capability and poorer ergos
Post by: Kampfer on October 17, 2015, 11:39:55 PM
Post by: SAK Guy on October 17, 2015, 11:58:48 PM
NAVITOOL = KNIFE SIGNAL =KNIFE (SERRATED)
NAVITOOL = ::) SIGNAL= PLIERS
NAVITOOL = SCISSOR SIGNAL = :ahhh
NAVITOOL = FLAT/PHILLIP DRIVER SIGNAL= FLAT/PHILLIP DRIVER
NAVITOOL = SAW SIGNAL = SAW
NAVITOOL = CAN OPENER/Bottle opener SIGNAL= CAN OPENER/ Bottle Opener
NAVITOOL = >:( SIGNAL = AWL
NAVITOOL = WHISTLE SIGNAL = WHISTLE
NAVITOOL = Bic LIGHER SIGNAL = LITTLE FIRE STEEL
NAVITOOL = BIG BOX SIGNAL = SHARPENER
NAVITOOL = In the wood alot Rock SIGNAL = HAMMER
NAVITOOL = LIGHT SIGNAL= :-[
NAVITOOL= COMPASS SIGNAL= >:(
NAVITOOL= CORKSCREW SIGNAL = ?? COCKSCREW ???
NAVITOOL= SIGNAL MIRROR SIGNAL= :rant:
NAVITOOL= Clock (stopwatch, alarm, backlight)
* Barometer (thermometer, standard and metric)
* Altimeter (to 29,500ft)
SIGNAL= :bnghd:
NAVITOOL = store fishing kits SIGNAL= :sa:
NAVITOOL= good luck find some bolt in the woods SIGNAL=1/4” Hex Bit Driver, 1/4" Box Wrench, Carabiner,3/16" Box Wrench
NAVITOOL= $15 ON EBAY :gimme: SIGNAL = $120 AT REI :surrender: :surrender: :surrender:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Wow, thorough breakdown of features!!!! :tu:
Post by: Syncop8r on October 18, 2015, 12:20:45 AM
NAVITOOL= CORKSCREW SIGNAL = ?? COCKSCREW ???
Haven't seen one of those but it sounds painful.
Post by: Syncop8r on October 18, 2015, 12:26:12 AM
I really wanted to like Signal, but the handles spread so wide to the point I can not use it, all bets are off then.
I wouldn't want pliers full stop.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 18, 2015, 12:38:22 AM
I really wanted to like Signal, but the handles spread so wide to the point I can not use it, all bets are off then.
I wouldn't want pliers full stop.
I'd like to challenge that thought for a moment if I may. A true survival situation occurs through either unforeseen events or bad planning. Lets work on unforeseen events :) In advance of things going wrong, you don't know where you'll be, what the significant problems are, what will be around you to work with, or what you'll need to have to have to deal with/work with your circumstances and surroundings. I want as many options on me as possible :D
Even pulling thorns from soles of shoes, or handling unpleasant things are going to be easier with pliers. You might not have to tighten a bolt or do a rewiring job, but you might need to "harvest" wire for use as cordage, to fashion a hook, or to reach something through a narrow gap.
Honestly, I can't think of anything I'm confident I'll not want if the SHTF other than illness, injury or bad company :D you just never know what trials you're going to face
Post by: Syncop8r on October 18, 2015, 01:14:26 AM
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 18, 2015, 01:25:40 AM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 18, 2015, 01:43:26 AM
NAVITOOL = KNIFE SIGNAL =KNIFE (SERRATED)
NAVITOOL = ::) SIGNAL= PLIERS
NAVITOOL = SCISSOR SIGNAL = :ahhh
NAVITOOL = FLAT/PHILLIP DRIVER SIGNAL= FLAT/PHILLIP DRIVER
NAVITOOL = SAW SIGNAL = SAW
NAVITOOL = CAN OPENER/Bottle opener SIGNAL= CAN OPENER/ Bottle Opener
NAVITOOL = >:( SIGNAL = AWL
NAVITOOL = WHISTLE SIGNAL = WHISTLE
NAVITOOL = Bic LIGHER SIGNAL = LITTLE FIRE STEEL
NAVITOOL = BIG BOX SIGNAL = SHARPENER
NAVITOOL = In the wood alot Rock SIGNAL = HAMMER
NAVITOOL = LIGHT SIGNAL= :-[
NAVITOOL= COMPASS SIGNAL= >:(
NAVITOOL= CORKSCREW SIGNAL = ?? COCKSCREW ???
NAVITOOL= SIGNAL MIRROR SIGNAL= :rant:
NAVITOOL= Clock (stopwatch, alarm, backlight)
* Barometer (thermometer, standard and metric)
* Altimeter (to 29,500ft)
SIGNAL= :bnghd:
NAVITOOL = store fishing kits SIGNAL= :sa:
NAVITOOL= good luck find some bolt in the woods SIGNAL=1/4” Hex Bit Driver, 1/4" Box Wrench, Carabiner,3/16" Box Wrench
NAVITOOL= $15 ON EBAY :gimme: SIGNAL = $120 AT REI :surrender: :surrender: :surrender:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Wow, thorough breakdown of features!!!! :tu:
:cheers: :cheers:
Post by: Jand3rson86 on October 18, 2015, 03:55:07 AM
I really wanted to like Signal, but the handles spread so wide to the point I can not use it, all bets are off then.
This one I really, REALLY do not get. We're talking less than 1/4" per side on the handle legs wider than a Wave.
Post by: Kampfer on October 18, 2015, 04:02:38 AM
Besed on the measure I did, Wave handles are 13* apart while Signal is 21*.I really wanted to like Signal, but the handles spread so wide to the point I can not use it, all bets are off then.
This one I really, REALLY do not get. We're talking less than 1/4" per side on the handle legs wider than a Wave.
http://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,62239.msg1159263.html#msg1159263
Post by: Jand3rson86 on October 18, 2015, 05:07:26 AM
Post by: rishardh on October 18, 2015, 05:38:45 AM
I know what you mean, but I've come to the conclusion I want pliers in that situation too, even if it does mean carrying more weight. Again, same reason unknown factors - pulling thorns, handling hot objects (pots and lids) round a fire, pulling a needle through thick fabric for a coat or pack repair.... it just seems like too much of a potential hardship for the sake of a couple of ounces
Interesting argument. On a backpacking outing every oz counts. I would like to add that I too would like pliers but Skeletool like pliers would have been a better choice. You do not need heavy duty pliers on this.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 18, 2015, 10:53:23 AM
I know what you mean, but I've come to the conclusion I want pliers in that situation too, even if it does mean carrying more weight. Again, same reason unknown factors - pulling thorns, handling hot objects (pots and lids) round a fire, pulling a needle through thick fabric for a coat or pack repair.... it just seems like too much of a potential hardship for the sake of a couple of ounces
Interesting argument. On a backpacking outing every oz counts. I would like to add that I too would like pliers but Skeletool like pliers would have been a better choice. You do not need heavy duty pliers on this.
I agree there's a balancing act between weight and function :tu: and yes, I think on a hiking trip I'd probably be willing to go to a Juice or Sideclip in terms of strength/duty level, but not much less.
For that arena I quite like the idea of the Wenger Rangergrip 90. Very capable knife and saw, mid weight pliers, small file and a can opener and awl. Those overly thick scales just take my grip beyond efficient though
Post by: Syncop8r on October 18, 2015, 11:58:30 AM
For that arena I quite like the idea of the Wenger Rangergrip 90. Very capable knife and saw, mid weight pliers, small file and a can opener and awl. Those overly thick scales just take my grip beyond efficient though
Haha, that's why I take a Wenger Ranger without pliers on hiking trips. ;)
(http://i529.photobucket.com/albums/dd338/syncop8r/Abel%20Tasman%20Inland%20Track%2003-10-2015/10%20Abel%20Tasman%20Inland%20Track%20058.jpg) (http://s529.photobucket.com/user/syncop8r/media/Abel%20Tasman%20Inland%20Track%2003-10-2015/10%20Abel%20Tasman%20Inland%20Track%20058.jpg.html)
Post by: Lynn LeFey on October 18, 2015, 05:21:08 PM
I mean, I know I'm going WAY out on a limb of creativity here but...
Why not just put a Wave in this sheath with a AAA flashlight in one sheath loop and a ferro rod in the OTHER sheath loop, then jam some Tinder-Quiks into the bit card holder?
Cheaper solution that the Signal, and a better tool, it seems. Plus, the tool is more useful outside a survival situation.
I know, I know... not a 'one tool solution'.
::)
When i heard about the idea, i thought it sounded neat. Upon seeing the end result, I don't think I'd ever get one of these, even if it were half the cost.
Post by: comis on October 18, 2015, 06:16:00 PM
After reading all this, and particularly the comparison to the Bear Grylls Survival Tool Pack (or Bear Grylls 'Strata')...
I mean, I know I'm going WAY out on a limb of creativity here but...
Why not just put a Wave in this sheath with a AAA flashlight in one sheath loop and a ferro rod in the OTHER sheath loop, then jam some Tinder-Quiks into the bit card holder?
Cheaper solution that the Signal, and a better tool, it seems. Plus, the tool is more useful outside a survival situation.
I know, I know... not a 'one tool solution'.
::)
When i heard about the idea, i thought it sounded neat. Upon seeing the end result, I don't think I'd ever get one of these, even if it were half the cost.
Like you said, the interesting thing is--they could have simply build upon Wave success, anodize it orange or yellow, make some cutouts to reduce weight, and combo it with a mini survival kit(like a dual sheath similar to Vic Swisschamp SOS kit).
Post by: colt 1911 on October 18, 2015, 06:54:32 PM
Sak's rule !
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 18, 2015, 08:03:28 PM
I've been pretty specific about the elements that really screw this design up in my mind. Any chance you can share with us what makes this a winner for you? Spell it out for us :tu:
Post by: colt 1911 on October 18, 2015, 10:16:52 PM
The hammer, how many times have you beat on something with your multi tool and cringed every time you did it.
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/18/c481a846c0c5a4f34eddebebf7adbe6c.jpg)
Length, more handle for big hands or gloves.
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/18/f43a49baf63562e13d29c11d5c26970e.jpg)
Let's not forget the pocket clip
(http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/18/3c2b3d3a478f47bc61a5d6a5af9677fc.jpg)
I'll have some more positive tomorrow
Sak's rule !
Post by: derekmac on October 18, 2015, 11:18:58 PM
Post by: Lynn LeFey on October 19, 2015, 12:08:58 AM
Longer handle for blade use... SHORTER handle for saw use.
I DO like the hammer, I'm just not sure it's worth giving up the tools required to have it. I do also like the hex hole in the hammer's handle. That gives some added versatility.
Understand, unlike some folks, I'm not saying the Signal is worthless, or anything LIKE that. I just think that for the price there are other options that could be done using existing Leatherman Tools to get a better set-up. :shrug:
I have to be honest here... I think maybe the price on these is eventually going to come down a fair bit. Maybe the price is where it currently is because they CAN demand this much for it. And when the initial demand dies down, it'll drop to where the price (at least in my mind) SHOULD be. It's currently $20 more than the Wave (on Amazon). I think that gap will shrink, possibly disappear completely rather soon.
Also, does it normally COME with a sheath? the one on amazon does, and that seems a bit odd for a toon that has a built in clip. Meh, what do I know?
Is it just me or does the Signal use the exact same blade as the Wave?
Post by: sawman on October 19, 2015, 12:24:56 AM
You can get a pocket clip for the Wave, and it's a pretty nice one.Lynn, the Signal has a different blade, he just swapped a Wave blade on to his.
Longer handle for blade use... SHORTER handle for saw use.
I DO like the hammer, I'm just not sure it's worth giving up the tools required to have it. I do also like the hex hole in the hammer's handle. That gives some added versatility.
Understand, unlike some folks, I'm not saying the Signal is worthless, or anything LIKE that. I just think that for the price there are other options that could be done using existing Leatherman Tools to get a better set-up. :shrug:
I have to be honest here... I think maybe the price on these is eventually going to come down a fair bit. Maybe the price is where it currently is because they CAN demand this much for it. And when the initial demand dies down, it'll drop to where the price (at least in my mind) SHOULD be. It's currently $20 more than the Wave (on Amazon). I think that gap will shrink, possibly disappear completely rather soon.
Also, does it normally COME with a sheath? the one on amazon does, and that seems a bit odd for a toon that has a built in clip. Meh, what do I know?
Is it just me or does the Signal use the exact same blade as the Wave?
Post by: Lynn LeFey on October 19, 2015, 12:27:56 AM
Post by: Jand3rson86 on October 19, 2015, 03:15:36 AM
Post by: colt 1911 on October 19, 2015, 03:59:18 AM
It's sold with or without a sheath. I bought mine with, just to have another as a spare, but it rides shotgun in my front pocket since day one. I love the design of the clip. I've been carrying it every day since I got it about 2 weeks ago, and I LOVE it. As someone mentioned before, how many times have you used your current MT or god knows whatever else as a hammer? That alone is one of the major selling points to me. I also love that they finally put the replaceable wire cutters on a smaller tool besides the Rebar, and left the swappable bit carrier. I keep a bit driver extender and both paddles of bits in the L size MOLLE sheath in my backpack. And mostly, besides the MUT (which the Signal is a direct descendant of), the Signal is the best looking tool Leatherman has right now.
Ahhh thank you ! I'm right with you, I dig this tool.
Sak's rule !
Post by: babola on October 19, 2015, 05:20:06 AM
Nikola?
Post by: Kampfer on October 19, 2015, 07:21:32 PM
Regardless... still confused.
You and me both then, I never have such problem with any leathermans until REV & Signal.
Post by: Kampfer on October 19, 2015, 07:33:41 PM
Post by: toolguy on October 19, 2015, 08:33:38 PM
cutlery shoppe has it for $72 shipped.
Correct,as long as you use the right free shipping code.
That makes the Signal only $7.20 more than the Wave.
http://www.cutleryshoppe.com/leathermanwave-4closed-17tools-blackleatherpremiumsheath.aspx
Post by: babola on October 20, 2015, 01:12:48 AM
That makes the Signal only $7.20 more than the Wave.
You make it sound like it's a good thing :pok:
Post by: Higgins617 on October 20, 2015, 01:47:50 AM
Post by: Lynn LeFey on October 20, 2015, 03:42:17 AM
Post by: leatherman-shop.de on October 20, 2015, 10:19:32 AM
cutlery shoppe has it for $72 shipped.
Correct,as long as you use the right free shipping code.
That makes the Signal only $7.20 more than the Wave.
http://www.cutleryshoppe.com/leathermanwave-4closed-17tools-blackleatherpremiumsheath.aspx
I am a bit jealous - in Europe it is more pricey - but i still like the look of the Signal.
Post by: toolguy on October 20, 2015, 09:36:31 PM
That makes the Signal only $7.20 more than the Wave.
You make it sound like it's a good thing :pok:
It's a statement of fact and you can interpret it in any manner you wish.
You could do worse by spending that much money in one night of partying and drinking and have nothing but a hangover to show for your expense.LOL.
I just ordered one and several olive colored Alox cadets for my family.
Post by: sawman on October 20, 2015, 09:40:07 PM
I like your point there :tu: :D
That makes the Signal only $7.20 more than the Wave.
You make it sound like it's a good thing :pok:
It's a statement of fact and you can interpret it in any manner you wish.
You could do worse by spending that much money in one night of partying and drinking and have nothing but a hangover to show for your expense.LOL.
I just ordered one and several olive colored Alox cadets for my family.
Post by: babola on October 20, 2015, 09:45:23 PM
That makes the Signal only $7.20 more than the Wave.
You make it sound like it's a good thing :pok:
It's a statement of fact and you can interpret it in any manner you wish.
You could do worse by spending that much money in one night of partying and drinking and have nothing but a hangover to show for your expense.LOL.
I just ordered one and several olive colored Alox cadets for my family.
Good for you, bud.
Do let us know your thoughts on it once it arrives.Cheers.
Post by: Etherealicer on October 20, 2015, 10:39:56 PM
Post by: sawman on October 20, 2015, 10:41:37 PM
I kinda want one too... Although It would need a PE blade and the bit holder has to be replaced with something more outdoorsy...I much prefer the adapter to Phillips setup when provided with an honest to goodness 3d Phillips driver. I've become turned off to the bit holder recently. :td:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 20, 2015, 11:19:27 PM
Post by: zoidberg on October 20, 2015, 11:45:15 PM
SOMEBOBY GONNA GET OWNED BY NAVITOOL + Squirt P4 :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: http://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,62288.210.html#lastPost
Would it be possible for you to review it on it's own merits rather than trying to beat it into the ground? :pok:
Post by: Kampfer on October 20, 2015, 11:52:17 PM
Do it :pok:SOMEBOBY GONNA GET OWNED BY NAVITOOL + Squirt P4 :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: http://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,62288.210.html#lastPost
Would it be possible for you to review it on it's own merits rather than trying to beat it into the ground? :pok:
Post by: zoidberg on October 20, 2015, 11:56:01 PM
Post by: babola on October 21, 2015, 02:31:22 AM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 21, 2015, 02:36:53 AM
Yeah, do it Obi...speak up now or forever hold your peace 8)
http://forum.multitool.org/index.php?topic=62288.210 .. OMG HAHAHHAA TOTAL DOMINATION. BY NAVITOOL+P4 :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: Leatherman Signal for Survival tools ??? What a jokes
Post by: babola on October 21, 2015, 02:57:09 AM
Yeah, do it Obi...speak up now or forever hold your peace 8)
http://forum.multitool.org/index.php?topic=62288.210 .. OMG HAHAHHAA TOTAL DOMINATION. BY NAVITOOL+P4 :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: Leatherman Signal for Survival tools ??? What a jokes
Does Signal get any points on size, portability, looks, weight and steel quality department to name the few? No? :shrug:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 21, 2015, 02:58:04 AM
Yeah, do it Obi...speak up now or forever hold your peace 8)
http://forum.multitool.org/index.php?topic=62288.210 .. OMG HAHAHHAA TOTAL DOMINATION. BY NAVITOOL+P4 :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: Leatherman Signal for Survival tools ??? What a jokes
Does Signal get any points on size, portability, looks, weight and steel quality department to name the few? No? :shrug:
HAHAHA :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 21, 2015, 03:02:34 AM
Post by: zoidberg on October 21, 2015, 03:03:38 AM
WHO DESIGN THIS CRAP.. OMG IM LAUGH SO HARD.. IM RETURN ON MONDAY.. TOMORROW BLAST-OFF STREAM ROLL OVER THIS THING.. :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
So no objective review then. :(
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 21, 2015, 03:05:29 AM
WHO DESIGN THIS CRAP.. OMG IM LAUGH SO HARD.. IM RETURN ON MONDAY.. TOMORROW BLAST-OFF STREAM ROLL OVER THIS THING.. :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
So no objective review then. :(
Only thing i say .. DO NOT GET THIS GARBAGE.. $120 NO THANK YOU.. LEATHERMAN WAVE 100X BETTER ..
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 21, 2015, 03:15:06 AM
Post by: babola on October 21, 2015, 03:55:49 AM
Post by: gadgetman7 on October 21, 2015, 01:09:09 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: zoidberg on October 21, 2015, 01:21:12 PM
No objective review coming from him......
Sent from Tracy Island
colt and toolguy will hook us up. :tu:
Post by: gadgetman7 on October 21, 2015, 01:59:30 PM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: zoidberg on October 21, 2015, 02:05:38 PM
I've using mine off and on since I originally posted. I've not done a full review, maybe I'll take a shot too. It's not a horrible tool and definitely has possibilities.
Sent from Tracy Island
I'm interested to hear what you think now that it's seen some use. :tu:
Post by: derekmac on October 21, 2015, 03:04:30 PM
I'll look forward to reading those. I do think it is way over priced though. I'd like to hold one just to see what it is actually like.No objective review coming from him......
Sent from Tracy Island
colt and toolguy will hook us up. :tu:
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Kampfer on October 21, 2015, 06:49:13 PM
Post by: sawman on October 21, 2015, 07:22:44 PM
I hope you use that hammer a lot, because you gave up a whole lot for it. :whistle:Coulda bought a lot of hammers for $120 :facepalm:
Post by: Etherealicer on October 21, 2015, 07:48:57 PM
I hope you use that hammer a lot, because you gave up a whole lot for it. :whistle:Well, of the small tool in LM's offering (Wave/Charge frame) I like the bit holder... I'm actually having trouble what to put into my Charge. Trading those tiny scissors, can opener and eye-glass screwdriver for a smallish hammer seems like a pretty good deal for me.
Which is why I probably should get a MUT... put in a blade-exchanger, maybe the scissors from the Surge. But what to do with those, for non gun owners useless scarper thingies :think:
Post by: Kampfer on October 21, 2015, 08:03:03 PM
Not just that, the hammer also make the tool very awkward to use.I hope you use that hammer a lot, because you gave up a whole lot for it. :whistle:Trading those tiny scissors, can opener and eye-glass screwdriver for a smallish hammer seems like a pretty good deal for me.
Post by: colt 1911 on October 21, 2015, 08:38:22 PM
Sak's rule !
Post by: Kampfer on October 21, 2015, 08:40:31 PM
I'll try to put together a mini review in the next day or two.:salute:
Sak's rule !
Post by: zoidberg on October 21, 2015, 09:41:25 PM
I'll try to put together a mini review in the next day or two.
Sak's rule !
:popcorn:
Post by: Mercury on October 22, 2015, 12:32:27 AM
It looks interesting, getting to see it in production form is cool. I detest the "survival" bits, but other than that I dig the frame and layout. Mini-mut is actually a cool concept and I use my multi as a hammer all the freaking time. The price is ridiculous though, I'm gonna have to wait until it drops a tad. Maybe after Christmas.
Post by: colt 1911 on October 22, 2015, 12:49:32 AM
I'm tempted to pick one of these up just so I can get a good feel for what it's all about. Too much whining about the hammer in this thread.
It looks interesting, getting to see it in production form is cool. I detest the "survival" bits, but other than that I dig the frame and layout. Mini-mut is actually a cool concept and I use my multi as a hammer all the freaking time. The price is ridiculous though, I'm gonna have to wait until it drops a tad. Maybe after Christmas.
Sak's rule !
Post by: Kampfer on October 22, 2015, 01:00:13 AM
I'm tempted to pick one of these up just so I can get a good feel for what it's all about. Too much whining about the hammer in this thread.That was me three weeks ago.
It looks interesting, getting to see it in production form is cool. I detest the "survival" bits, but other than that I dig the frame and layout. Mini-mut is actually a cool concept and I use my multi as a hammer all the freaking time. The price is ridiculous though,
Post by: derekmac on October 22, 2015, 01:17:41 AM
I'm tempted to pick one of these up just so I can get a good feel for what it's all about. Too much whining about the hammer in this thread.I feel the same. I love my MUT, and as some of you know, I've been saying for a LONG time that LM needed to make a civilian version. They didn't hit the nail on the head with the Signal, but they did graze it. ;)
It looks interesting, getting to see it in production form is cool. I detest the "survival" bits, but other than that I dig the frame and layout. Mini-mut is actually a cool concept and I use my multi as a hammer all the freaking time. The price is ridiculous though, I'm gonna have to wait until it drops a tad. Maybe after Christmas.
Maybe they'll be smart, and make a couple of useful variations of it.
Post by: babola on October 22, 2015, 01:31:02 AM
I feel the same. I love my MUT, and as some of you know, I've been saying for a LONG time that LM needed to make a civilian version. They didn't hit the nail on the head with the Signal, but they did graze it. ;)
Maybe they'll be smart, and make a couple of useful variations of it.
Yup, same here too. I simply love my MUT and was longing for a civilian/outdoor version of it for some time now.
The MUT has got so much potential for becoming a new "Signal" it's not funny. The size, the construction, tool implements etc. Swap the punch with a removable fire-steel, insert lightweight aluminum whistle into the modified side-slot where the small screwdriver bit used to sit before you inserted it into the bit holder at the bottom of the handle. Turn that carbon scraper into a serious awl. And no need for miniature sharpener, at least not for me.
Signal tried, but delivered in-the-middle of the road, kind of a boy scout tool.
We now need more serious and thought-out Signal version for grownups.
Post by: colt 1911 on October 22, 2015, 02:41:15 AM
I feel the same. I love my MUT, and as some of you know, I've been saying for a LONG time that LM needed to make a civilian version. They didn't hit the nail on the head with the Signal, but they did graze it. ;)
Maybe they'll be smart, and make a couple of useful variations of it.
Yup, same here too. I simply love my MUT and was longing for a civilian/outdoor version of it for some time now.
The MUT has got so much potential for becoming a new "Signal" it's not funny. The size, the construction, tool implements etc. Swap the punch with a removable fire-steel, insert lightweight aluminum whistle into the modified side-slot where the small screwdriver bit used to sit before you inserted it into the bit holder at the bottom of the handle. Turn that carbon scraper into a serious awl. And no need for miniature sharpener, at least not for me.
Signal tried, but delivered in-the-middle of the road, kind of a boy scout tool.
We now need more serious and thought-out Signal version for grownups.
Sak's rule !
Post by: ducttapetech on October 22, 2015, 03:24:39 AM
I feel the same. I love my MUT, and as some of you know, I've been saying for a LONG time that LM needed to make a civilian version. They didn't hit the nail on the head with the Signal, but they did graze it. ;)
Maybe they'll be smart, and make a couple of useful variations of it.
Yup, same here too. I simply love my MUT and was longing for a civilian/outdoor version of it for some time now.
The MUT has got so much potential for becoming a new "Signal" it's not funny. The size, the construction, tool implements etc. Swap the punch with a removable fire-steel, insert lightweight aluminum whistle into the modified side-slot where the small screwdriver bit used to sit before you inserted it into the bit holder at the bottom of the handle. Turn that carbon scraper into a serious awl. And no need for miniature sharpener, at least not for me.
Signal tried, but delivered in-the-middle of the road, kind of a boy scout tool.
We now need more serious and thought-out Signal version for grownups.
Sak's rule !
That's us mobile.
Nate
Post by: Syncop8r on October 22, 2015, 08:00:48 AM
The MUT has got so much potential for becoming a new "Signal" it's not funny. The size, the construction, tool implements etc. Swap the punch with a removable fire-steel, insert lightweight aluminum whistle into the modified side-slot where the small screwdriver bit used to sit before you inserted it into the bit holder at the bottom of the handle. Turn that carbon scraper into a serious awl. And no need for miniature sharpener, at least not for me.
Sounds like you better get modding then... :pok: :popcorn:
Post by: babola on October 22, 2015, 10:51:46 AM
And I don't mean a Wave G3 which is long overdue (and rumored to be released in 2016), but something down the Skeletool/MUT/Signal line.
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 22, 2015, 10:24:18 PM
I'll wait it out this time. Still have hope in LM coming out with something a little better than Signal in not so distant future.
And I don't mean a Wave G3 which is long overdue (and rumored to be released in 2016), but something down the Skeletool/MUT/Signal line.
SIGNAL WHO?? :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Post by: rishardh on October 22, 2015, 11:41:05 PM
Any Back to the Future fans here? Marty McFly and Dr. Emmett Brown travels from Oct 26 1985 to Oct 21 2015. Assuming one of them owned a PST (probably the Doc), what would have they thought seeing the Signal?
Post by: babola on October 23, 2015, 12:08:41 AM
Any Back to the Future fans here? Marty McFly and Dr. Emmett Brown travels from Oct 26 1985 to Oct 21 2015. Assuming one of them owned a PST (probably the Doc), what would have they thought seeing the Signal?
Go back to '85 ASAP...?
:dwts:
Post by: enki_ck on October 23, 2015, 01:46:41 AM
I'll wait it out this time. Still have hope in LM coming out with something a little better than Signal in not so distant future.I'm guessing we'll see the mk3 Wave at the next Shot Show. LM hasn't made any new tools this year and no patents were filed.
And I don't mean a Wave G3 which is long overdue (and rumored to be released in 2016), but something down the Skeletool/MUT/Signal line.
So most likely the will do a rehaul on the older models. The Wave seems like a good candidate as they already upgraded the Surge. Also the Knifeless Rebar and Skele RX, I don't believe the typo thing. ;)
The Signal will either get scrapped after a year or so or if it becomes a halfway decent seller, they might do a variation or two in 3-4 years.
Post by: babola on October 23, 2015, 02:14:02 AM
I'll wait it out this time. Still have hope in LM coming out with something a little better than Signal in not so distant future.I'm guessing we'll see the mk3 Wave at the next Shot Show. LM hasn't made any new tools this year and no patents were filed.
And I don't mean a Wave G3 which is long overdue (and rumored to be released in 2016), but something down the Skeletool/MUT/Signal line.
So most likely the will do a rehaul on the older models. The Wave seems like a good candidate as they already upgraded the Surge. Also the Knifeless Rebar and Skele RX, I don't believe the typo thing. ;)
The Signal will either get scrapped after a year or so or if it becomes a halfway decent seller, they might do a variation or two in 3-4 years.
I agree, Niko. Don't believe Wave will bring anything revolutionary to the mix except maybe Rebar-like pliers, skeletonized handles for lighter overall package and beefed up scissors. Everything else even if it stays untouched is good in my books, I'm happy with the things they are at the moment, anyway. I would like to see the new Wave G3 handles finished in black DLC like Signal, though ;)
Also keen to understand what, if it does at all, the new "Skele RX" brings to the table. :popcorn:
Post by: rishardh on October 23, 2015, 02:46:58 AM
I'll wait it out this time. Still have hope in LM coming out with something a little better than Signal in not so distant future.I'm guessing we'll see the mk3 Wave at the next Shot Show. LM hasn't made any new tools this year and no patents were filed.
And I don't mean a Wave G3 which is long overdue (and rumored to be released in 2016), but something down the Skeletool/MUT/Signal line.
So most likely the will do a rehaul on the older models. The Wave seems like a good candidate as they already upgraded the Surge. Also the Knifeless Rebar and Skele RX, I don't believe the typo thing. ;)
The Signal will either get scrapped after a year or so or if it becomes a halfway decent seller, they might do a variation or two in 3-4 years.
I agree, Niko. Don't believe Wave will bring anything revolutionary to the mix except maybe Rebar-like pliers, skeletonized handles for lighter overall package and beefed up scissors. Everything else even if it stays untouched is good in my books, I'm happy with the things they are at the moment. anyway. I would like to see the new Wave G3 handles finished in black DLC like Signal, though ;)
Also keen to understand what, if it does at all, the new "Skele RX" brings to the table. :popcorn:
Yes, a Wave3 withe upgrades mentioned will be nice. Traditionally LM has released the Heavy Duty version a few years after a new tool is released. PST>>>Super Tool, Pulse>>>ST 200, Wave>>>Surge. It seems like now it's done in reverse. ST 300>>>Rebar, MUT>>>Signal. This means we will very likely see a smaller New Surge soon. Hoping... :angel: :angel: :angel:
Post by: rishardh on October 23, 2015, 02:58:45 AM
Any Back to the Future fans here? Marty McFly and Dr. Emmett Brown travels from Oct 26 1985 to Oct 21 2015. Assuming one of them owned a PST (probably the Doc), what would have they thought seeing the Signal?
Go back to '85 ASAP...?
:dwts:
Haha... The 80's... mixed tapes and crazy hair-do's.
Post by: Metropolicity on October 23, 2015, 04:56:03 PM
Yes, a Wave3 withe upgrades mentioned will be nice. Traditionally LM has released the Heavy Duty version a few years after a new tool is released. PST>>>Super Tool, Pulse>>>ST 200, Wave>>>Surge. It seems like now it's done in reverse. ST 300>>>Rebar, MUT>>>Signal. This means we will very likely see a smaller New Surge soon. Hoping... :angel: :angel: :angel:
Didn't they kind of do that with the Rev/Wingman/etc
Post by: rishardh on October 23, 2015, 10:49:11 PM
Yes, a Wave3 withe upgrades mentioned will be nice. Traditionally LM has released the Heavy Duty version a few years after a new tool is released. PST>>>Super Tool, Pulse>>>ST 200, Wave>>>Surge. It seems like now it's done in reverse. ST 300>>>Rebar, MUT>>>Signal. This means we will very likely see a smaller New Surge soon. Hoping... :angel: :angel: :angel:
Didn't they kind of do that with the Rev/Wingman/etc
What, really? .... that's it? How rude... u hurt my feeling LM. I hope this is not true.
Post by: BASguy on October 24, 2015, 04:31:15 AM
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: sLaughterMed on October 24, 2015, 08:22:13 AM
Hopefully they do a quality refresh for the Gen3 Wave. Getting rid of that awful bit driver would be a good starter.I agree, I realy feel like having bits on their smaller tools really defeats the purpose of them. They 4" tools are easly pocketable (ok, Wave is pushing it, but it is done!), and carrying a bit card seems a bit much for pocket tools. Now on a sheath.carry tool (surge/st300), bits make more sense, especialy wt thebit extender.
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Id like to se some updated scissors on a Gen 3 wave, gut hook, awl, actual screwdrivers, rather than bits, and updated scissors, or even a move back to the old pst ii style scissors. It would be neat to have two blade exchangers, so I can swap out files, different saws, gut hook, pe and serrated blades etc.
Post by: Kampfer on October 24, 2015, 08:31:47 AM
And use large flathead screw on one or two pivots for user to exchange file/ saw/ scissors.
( they can sell file / wood saw / metal saw/ scissors as accessories)
The rest the tool can be locked by security screws if they like.
Post by: BASguy on October 25, 2015, 02:03:22 AM
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: sawman on October 25, 2015, 02:14:11 AM
The OG Wave has always been the near perfect load out for me. Real drivers including the marvelous tech screwdriver. Never had a need for locking inside tools and adding the weight for that was a waste IMO. Ruined the benefits of a lightweight medium duty tool. Maybe keep that platform for a Surge light and get back to something closer to the original for Gen3.While I do have some love for the OG Wave, I consider the latest version to be nearly perfect except for a few little hiccups. What's my favorite feature of the Wave? - that would definitely have to be the blades; I really dig the main blade and the sheep's foot blade. If you've followed their revisions over the years, they've made terrific strides improving the tool in little ways that add up to what's available today.
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
That said, I know I crap on LM for some of their tools (SIGNAL, Juice) but they do still make some very good stuff :tu:
Post by: BASguy on October 25, 2015, 02:21:25 AM
Sent from 9 miles from the face of the sun
Post by: Demel on October 25, 2015, 02:43:07 AM
Post by: sawman on October 25, 2015, 02:46:12 AM
To me there are two things to do to perfect the wave: loosen the plier pivot and replace the mini driver with an awl. Very easy for them to do. Then I would consider paying $90 for that tool.I've come to like the mini driver but what if we lost the can opener instead.
Post by: Demel on October 25, 2015, 02:43:10 AM
I would be willing to accept that. The combo opener has more practical use for me than the mini driver.To me there are two things to do to perfect the wave: loosen the plier pivot and replace the mini driver with an awl. Very easy for them to do. Then I would consider paying $90 for that tool.I've come to like the mini driver but what if we lost the can opener instead.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 25, 2015, 05:45:01 AM
I would be willing to accept that. The combo opener has more practical use for me than the mini driver.To me there are two things to do to perfect the wave: loosen the plier pivot and replace the mini driver with an awl. Very easy for them to do. Then I would consider paying $90 for that tool.I've come to like the mini driver but what if we lost the can opener instead.
As Leatherman's awls don't tend to have a slow enough taper for my liking, I don't see much improvement in their awls over using the can opener as an awl. At least the Wave's "awl" can open cans and bottles too. I don't think Leatherman have ever produced what I'd consider a good awl :think: They got close with the Juice but omitted the sharpening process
Post by: TheDude on October 26, 2015, 01:33:42 AM
Post by: sawman on October 26, 2015, 01:36:12 AM
Post by: TheDude on October 26, 2015, 01:58:23 AM
Post by: babola on October 26, 2015, 02:13:23 AM
Could we get back to regular programming now, please :)
Post by: comis on October 26, 2015, 08:21:40 AM
I'll wait it out this time. Still have hope in LM coming out with something a little better than Signal in not so distant future.I'm guessing we'll see the mk3 Wave at the next Shot Show. LM hasn't made any new tools this year and no patents were filed.
And I don't mean a Wave G3 which is long overdue (and rumored to be released in 2016), but something down the Skeletool/MUT/Signal line.
So most likely the will do a rehaul on the older models. The Wave seems like a good candidate as they already upgraded the Surge. Also the Knifeless Rebar and Skele RX, I don't believe the typo thing. ;)
The Signal will either get scrapped after a year or so or if it becomes a halfway decent seller, they might do a variation or two in 3-4 years.
I sure hope this is going to happen in upcoming year, I like Wave and it'd be great to keep the fire going.
About regular program, I'd summit a full review with many pix to Megan last week, and hope it will be on site soon. I think it is an interesting idea to explore the possibility of mini-MUT, but having it on Signal may not be the best idea.
Post by: Etherealicer on October 26, 2015, 08:29:41 AM
I know I've complained LM still hasn't put the new pliers in their Wave yet but I've come to not even want those anymore. I realized that I love the Wave just as it is and hope they don't change it much if at all...:rofl:
I think they could make two models with the different pliers head (with/without replaceable wire-cutters, blunt nose, needle nose). I actually think that LM should do more what they did with the Charge in a fashion. Take an existing, successful frame and offer it with different tool combination.
Post by: TheDude on October 27, 2015, 09:34:40 AM
How about :think: "Wave G3 EOD" with interchangeable pliers and a replaceable C4 punch?
If were going to send our boys out there again. The least we can do is give them a Wave.
Post by: enki_ck on October 29, 2015, 11:55:42 PM
We seem to have gotten sidetracked from Signal discussion into 'anything Wave G3'...I feel partly responsible for mentioning the G3 above, sorry for that guys :-[
Could we get back to regular programming now, please :)
Like staying on topic for longer that 5 replies in a row has ever been a thing on MTO. :P
We'll probably soon drift back onto the Signal train of posts. :D
And I personally am looking forward to seeing an impartial, honest review of the thing. The ones we saw until now were ... lacking. >:D
Honestly, we would have gotten better reviews about $2 gas station multies. I refuse to believe the Signal is so bad. I understand that a lot of the guys here were expecting more, or less, depends how you look at it. ;) Heck, I started this thread over a year ago with just a short summary of the tools and great hopes.
Signal might not have fulfilled some wishes people had of it, and yes, the MSRP is quite high. But I feel it still deserves an honest review MTO is famous for. One that shows what the tool is capable of. Not one that tries hard to show that if you use it in a way it wasn't designed to be used, it fails in some tasks. ;)
Post by: derekmac on October 30, 2015, 12:02:05 AM
Post by: Monrogue on October 30, 2015, 01:32:31 AM
Sent from my SM-G920R4 using Tapatalk
Post by: zoidberg on October 30, 2015, 01:41:37 AM
Well fellas, add me to the short list of potential reviews ;) I decided to go on a bit of a spree for early Christmas gifts. The Signal was one of those gifts....
Sent from my SM-G920R4 using Tapatalk
Better be a quick review so you can send in time to get it here by christmas. :pok:
Post by: derekmac on October 30, 2015, 01:45:03 AM
Well fellas, add me to the short list of potential reviews ;) I decided to go on a bit of a spree for early Christmas gifts. The Signal was one of those gifts....:woohoo:
Sent from my SM-G920R4 using Tapatalk
Post by: Monrogue on October 30, 2015, 01:45:29 AM
;DWell fellas, add me to the short list of potential reviews ;) I decided to go on a bit of a spree for early Christmas gifts. The Signal was one of those gifts....
Sent from my SM-G920R4 using Tapatalk
Better be a quick review so you can send in time to get it here by christmas.
Sent from my SM-G920R4 using Tapatalk
Post by: WoodsDuck on October 30, 2015, 02:15:19 AM
Post by: gadgetman7 on October 30, 2015, 02:21:00 AM
Sent from Tracy Island
Post by: rishardh on October 30, 2015, 03:40:02 AM
Now I like where this is going. I'll be anxiously awaiting those reviews :tu:
+1 :tu:
Post by: Top-Gear-24 on October 30, 2015, 08:37:04 AM
Well fellas, add me to the short list of potential reviews ;) I decided to go on a bit of a spree for early Christmas gifts. The Signal was one of those gifts....
Sent from my SM-G920R4 using Tapatalk
Good on you mate, can't wait to read the review :tu:.
When I first saw the Signal at the local shop I almost bought it right away, but I decided to think it over (and most of the time I would return the next day to buy it anyway ... ::)). But back home I started reading the topics about the Signal here and I got the feeling that the Signal had to be about the worst tool ever made, since I had never seen such negativity about a tool here in the past.
So, I changed my mind and bought a stainless Surge (I already owned the BO one, and I like to have BO and Stainless versions of my Leatherman tools ::)). I thought the Surge combined with my Light my Fire firesteel (which has a whistle on it) would make a better combination than the Signal, since the Surge also has a diamond coated file that you could use to sharpen the knife in times of need. And the Surge with the firesteel would still be about 45 Euros cheaper than buying a Signal over here.
Since then I've been carrying my Surge to work (it replaced the Spirit that I had been carrying since ... euh ... forever) and even though I really, really like it, I still feel bad that I changed my mind about the Signal after reading about it here. I've not taken a single pic of my new Surge, or even mentioned it here until now, and I've had it for about 3 or 4 weeks now ...
So, long story short, the Signal is back on my wishlist, but it will have to wait for now, since I already bought the Stainless Surge, and I'm saving money to get a new tattoo now (which had been on my wishlist ever since I got my first one about 7 years ago ... ::)).
Choices ... :poh:
Post by: babola on October 30, 2015, 09:50:15 AM
And what better excuse to show some pics of your new Surge, alongside :multi:
Post by: Corwyn on October 30, 2015, 09:55:12 AM
I'm saving money to get a new tattoo now (which had been on my wishlist ever since I got my first one about 7 years ago
(http://www.hahastop.com/pictures/Free_Tattoo_Removal.jpg)
Post by: Top-Gear-24 on October 30, 2015, 10:06:38 AM
Show us some of those tattoos...come on!
And what better excuse to show some pics of your new Surge, alongside :multi:
I only have one (so far ...) it's a nautical compass with the names of my boys next to it. Since I got that one I knew I wanted another one, but you're talking to someone who needs 15 minutes to decide what he's going to eat on his sandwich, so deciding which tattoo I'm going to get is hell for me ...
Oh, and I've got a couple of days of next week, so I'll try to get some pics of my new Surge ;).
Post by: Etherealicer on October 30, 2015, 10:12:56 AM
How about tattooing your favorite sandwich combo... it's a win win.Show us some of those tattoos...come on!
And what better excuse to show some pics of your new Surge, alongside :multi:
I only have one (so far ...) it's a nautical compass with the names of my boys next to it. Since I got that one I knew I wanted another one, but you're talking to someone who needs 15 minutes to decide what he's going to eat on his sandwich, so deciding which tattoo I'm going to get is hell for me ...
Oh, and I've got a couple of days of next week, so I'll try to get some pics of my new Surge ;).
You get a new tattoo AND you know what to put on your sandwich :tu:
Post by: Gerhard Gerber on October 30, 2015, 10:41:34 AM
Post by: Mercury on October 30, 2015, 11:17:42 AM
Post by: derekmac on October 30, 2015, 11:29:47 AM
I want another tattoo.Me too.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Top-Gear-24 on October 30, 2015, 11:39:08 AM
I want another tattoo.Me too.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Maybe we should make a topic "Who wants another tattoo" or "Pics of your tattoo outside" ... :pok:
:D
Post by: WoodsDuck on October 30, 2015, 11:56:14 AM
Post by: comis on October 30, 2015, 12:13:37 PM
Just posted my review of Signal, after fondling and testing it for sawing for a while:
http://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,62841.0.html
Hope you'd like it!
Post by: derekmac on October 30, 2015, 12:39:34 PM
Hey, folks.Great review buddy!! :tu:
Just posted my review of Signal, after fondling and testing it for sawing for a while:
http://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,62841.0.html
Hope you'd like it!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: hellsing on October 30, 2015, 01:38:20 PM
Hey, folks.
Just posted my review of Signal, after fondling and testing it for sawing for a while:
http://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,62841.0.html
Hope you'd like it!
:ahhh :ahhh :ahhh
Thanks dude!
Post by: comis on October 30, 2015, 02:17:32 PM
Post by: Top-Gear-24 on November 03, 2015, 11:10:13 PM
So, until the price on the Signal drops, I guess I'll have to use my "Signal replacement". A couple of weeks ago I almost bought myself a Signal, but at the last minute, I changed my mind and went for a Stainless Surge, when I combine this with my brand new Light my Fire Army firesteel (with whistle) I still saved myself about 45 to 50 Euro compaired to the Signal. I would really like to give the Signal a try, but until it drops in price, that's not going to happen ...
Here's my Signal for the moment, Stainless Surge (which, as you all know, comes with a diamond coated file, just like the Signal ;)) and a brand new Light my Fire Army firesteel, I've used this kind of firesteel before, and it works great in my opinion.
Edit: notice the whistle on the "scraper" of the firesteel ;).
(http://i739.photobucket.com/albums/xx39/Rikske77/Leatherman%20Surge%20Stainless%20at%20Kesselhei/100_zps8mkkmn09.jpg) (http://s739.photobucket.com/user/Rikske77/media/Leatherman%20Surge%20Stainless%20at%20Kesselhei/100_zps8mkkmn09.jpg.html)
Post by: Obi1shinobee on November 03, 2015, 11:11:48 PM
The Signal just showed up on the Dutch site were I buy most of my Leatherman Tools since they are less expensive there than at the local shops in Belgium, but instead of the 179,95 Euro they retail at the local shops, they sell it for 199,90 Euro ... :ahhh
So, until the price on the Signal drops, I guess I'll have to use my "Signal replacement". A couple of weeks ago I almost bought myself a Signal, but at the last minute, I changed my mind and went for a Stainless Surge, when I combine this with my brand new Light my Fire Army firesteel (with whistle) I still saved myself about 45 to 50 Euro compaired to the Signal. I would really like to give the Signal a try, but until it drops in price, that's not going to happen ...
Here's my Signal for the moment, Stainless Surge (which, as you all know, comes with a diamond coated file, just like the Signal ;)) and a brand new Light my Fire Army firesteel, I've used this kind of firesteel before, and it works great in my opinion.
(http://i739.photobucket.com/albums/xx39/Rikske77/Leatherman%20Surge%20Stainless%20at%20Kesselhei/100_zps8mkkmn09.jpg) (http://s739.photobucket.com/user/Rikske77/media/Leatherman%20Surge%20Stainless%20at%20Kesselhei/100_zps8mkkmn09.jpg.html)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_IlNbsILLE :salute:
Post by: Gerber Suspension on November 03, 2015, 11:32:14 PM
That fits perfectly!
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Post by: Top-Gear-24 on November 03, 2015, 11:38:52 PM
(http://i739.photobucket.com/albums/xx39/Rikske77/Leatherman%20Surge%20Stainless%20at%20Kesselhei/096_zpswcbdlzhw.jpg) (http://s739.photobucket.com/user/Rikske77/media/Leatherman%20Surge%20Stainless%20at%20Kesselhei/096_zpswcbdlzhw.jpg.html)
Post by: Obi1shinobee on November 03, 2015, 11:53:58 PM
Oh, and it comes with a watch, just like the Tread (okay, maybe not as accurate as the one on the Tread, but it does come with a better tool loadout ;)).
(http://i739.photobucket.com/albums/xx39/Rikske77/Leatherman%20Surge%20Stainless%20at%20Kesselhei/096_zpswcbdlzhw.jpg) (http://s739.photobucket.com/user/Rikske77/media/Leatherman%20Surge%20Stainless%20at%20Kesselhei/096_zpswcbdlzhw.jpg.html)
Dont forget next month is Dropped Pants Surge challenge .. :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
Post by: zoidberg on November 04, 2015, 12:55:59 AM
Post by: Obi1shinobee on November 04, 2015, 01:02:51 AM
I might have to get in on that one, I likedropping my pantsthe Surge.
:rofl:
Post by: Fortytwo on November 23, 2015, 11:20:50 PM
I'd really like it to be a good tool but I see a bunch of problems with it right now.
- The price, do however note that the recommended price has already dropped to 99$ from 120, that's something...
- There would have to be some modding done; the awl is ridiculous and I have no use whatsoever of a saw.
- There seems to be a lot of complaints about ergonomics. This is perhaps the worst part, buying it online would cost me less than anything leatherman bought around here, tools can be swapped, but you're stuck with the ergonomics.
- Those cheap plastic parts, on the positive side they mean there's plenty of space for alternative pieces.
Now, this topic has had it's fair share of negative so I'll point out some good sides:
- Sometimes less is more, I have the Gerber Suspension and that thing is clumsy and heavy, with plenty of tools that see little or no use to me (e.g. saw, serrated blade, those chubby scissors). Same kinda goes for most of the other leatherman tools: two blades, a saw, a file and scissors.
- Accessible tools, right now I'm carrying a PST and lets just say that while it's truly a great tool those screwdrivers are not exactly simple to get to. This also seems relevant as an answer to the "buy this other tool instead and get lots of more tools for your money" argument. Sure thing but unused tools take up space, weight and make the tools you want to reach for harder to get to.
In the end I can't say that I believe in the signal as a good survival tool. However removing/replacing those plastic pieces and regrind the awl and saw (just a small prying edge on the tip) and you have a toolset that could solve most everyday problems in my life. I might have to get one if the price drops.
PS. for anyone who still has theirs, how feasible does it seem to make a bit holder instead of the whistle? Could anyone take a picture with a bit next to the whistle?
Post by: ThundahBeagle on August 26, 2017, 10:01:33 PM
So has anyone yet taken this thing out on a section hike or camping trip to really run each aspect of the tool through the paces, not just focusing on the saw?
If not, send me one. In the next few weeks I am planning a three day hike through Bond Cliff and along the "Pemi-Loop." There are more arduous hikes for sure, but if we can't test it well there, I would be surprised.
Post by: ThundahBeagle on August 26, 2017, 10:20:53 PM
Like another poster here, I have a stainless Surge (07), and carry a Ferro rod in my pack. I want to like this tool, but I have an aversion to any multi tool where the tools created for its main purpose are detachable and can be lost.
I don't like to jump to conclusions, but sometimes just seeing something tells you what kind of trouble to expect. Example: I don't need to drive a Renault Robin before I know that it is unstable at any corner. Likewise I know that a little plastic removable whistle is likely to get lost or broken before you really need it. It should be built through the chassis of the tool. There should be NOTHING "removable" on a survival tool - not bit drivers, whistles, or ferro. If anything, an internal surface can be Ferro. You can open and strike it with a rock. Or, have a detachable ferro that is drilled and cabled to the chassis.
Plus, I think the whole thing should be highly polished stainless, in case needed as a signaling mirror.
Hammer should face the other way and not interfere with other tools.
Yes, I do have ideas about this, but am happy to run an actual hike and camp test of one and give an honest review.
Anyone? Bueller?
Post by: zoidberg on August 26, 2017, 10:42:27 PM
Post by: Top-Gear-24 on August 26, 2017, 11:06:43 PM
Or, maybe the jury has already decided on this tool?
Like another poster here, I have a stainless Surge (07), and carry a Ferro rod in my pack. I want to like this tool, but I have an aversion to any multi tool where the tools created for its main purpose are detachable and can be lost.
I don't like to jump to conclusions, but sometimes just seeing something tells you what kind of trouble to expect. Example: I don't need to drive a Renault Robin before I know that it is unstable at any corner. Likewise I know that a little plastic removable whistle is likely to get lost or broken before you really need it. It should be built through the chassis of the tool. There should be NOTHING "removable" on a survival tool - not bit drivers, whistles, or ferro. If anything, an internal surface can be Ferro. You can open and strike it with a rock. Or, have a detachable ferro that is drilled and cabled to the chassis.
Plus, I think the whole thing should be highly polished stainless, in case needed as a signaling mirror.
Hammer should face the other way and not interfere with other tools.
Yes, I do have ideas about this, but am happy to run an actual hike and camp test of one and give an honest review.
Anyone? Bueller?
That other poster bought a Signal about three weeks ago ... :whistle:
And I must say, I kinda like it so far :tu:.
And even though I only have had it for three weeks, I think the chances of the file or ferro rod/whistle getting lost (by accidentally being "unlocked") are pretty slim. Getting lost after the user took it of and forgot where he put it, okay ... but that could happen with a regular firesteel, tool or knife also .
(http://i.imgur.com/Lo3X2xo.jpg)
Post by: zoidberg on August 26, 2017, 11:24:55 PM
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4162/34541028121_3b48f9ae24_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/UCgNgB)
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4163/34630806026_02937f7d07_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/ULcW7w)
Post by: zoidberg on August 26, 2017, 11:26:10 PM
Post by: SteveC on August 26, 2017, 11:38:35 PM
Post by: Top-Gear-24 on August 27, 2017, 12:02:52 AM
Nice pics Z and TG :like: :cheers: :tu:
Thanks mate :salute:.
Edit: I go to Austria for seven days, seven days to enjoy that beautiful landscape ... and lobsterboy just has to rub it in that he lives in such a place ... :viking:
Edit number 2: Great pics Zoidberg, as always ... :drool:. Please, PLEASE keep posting them :pok:.
Note to myself: Check out possibilty for vacation to New Zealand sometime in the future ... (I already completed the Visiting Driver Training Programme. I'm now better prepared for driving in New Zealand :woohoo:).
Post by: ThundahBeagle on August 27, 2017, 03:37:32 AM
Lol, sounds like you've already jumped to a conclusion.
Y-yikes! Well, I said I didn't LIKE to jump to conclusions. It still happens sometimes. Take the Renault Robin example...I STILL prefer 4 wheels on a car, and I stand by my opinion that the whistle could and should be integral. The ONE drawback to my old model Surge is that a spring went loose and I lost the bit. I just prefer a multitool to be all in one piece. There is no way you could possibly be missing anything that came with it when the smurf hits the fan.
Post by: theonew on August 27, 2017, 03:38:42 AM
Nice pics Z and TG :like: :cheers: :tu:
Thanks mate :salute:.
Edit: I go to Austria for seven days, seven days to enjoy that beautiful landscape ... and lobsterboy just has to rub it in that he lives in such a place ... :viking:
Edit number 2: Great pics Zoidberg, as always ... :drool:. Please, PLEASE keep posting them :pok:.
Note to myself: Check out possibilty for vacation to New Zealand sometime in the future ... (I already completed the Visiting Driver Training Programme. I'm now better prepared for driving in New Zealand :woohoo:).
Is that a requirement or a recommendation to drive in NZ?
Post by: ThundahBeagle on August 27, 2017, 03:46:19 AM
You guys live in such beautiful landscape!. Where do I sign up? I'll do six months in one country, six months in the other for the rest of my days
Post by: ThundahBeagle on August 27, 2017, 03:56:29 AM
Or, maybe the jury has already decided on this tool?
Like another poster here, I have a stainless Surge (07), and carry a Ferro rod in my pack. I want to like this tool, but I have an aversion to any multi tool where the tools created for its main purpose are detachable and can be lost.
I don't like to jump to conclusions, but sometimes just seeing something tells you what kind of trouble to expect. Example: I don't need to drive a Renault Robin before I know that it is unstable at any corner. Likewise I know that a little plastic removable whistle is likely to get lost or broken before you really need it. It should be built through the chassis of the tool. There should be NOTHING "removable" on a survival tool - not bit drivers, whistles, or ferro. If anything, an internal surface can be Ferro. You can open and strike it with a rock. Or, have a detachable ferro that is drilled and cabled to the chassis.
Plus, I think the whole thing should be highly polished stainless, in case needed as a signaling mirror.
Hammer should face the other way and not interfere with other tools.
Yes, I do have ideas about this, but am happy to run an actual hike and camp test of one and give an honest review.
Anyone? Bueller?
That other poster bought a Signal about three weeks ago ... :whistle:
And I must say, I kinda like it so far :tu:.
And even though I only have had it for three weeks, I think the chances of the file or ferro rod/whistle getting lost (by accidentally being "unlocked") are pretty slim. Getting lost after the user took it of and forgot where he put it, okay ... but that could happen with a regular firesteel, tool or knife also .
(http://i.imgur.com/Lo3X2xo.jpg)
Glad to know that they don't seem to get lost easy. I suppose in a tough situation it is possible to become confused. I just think the more integral the components, the less likely to be lost.
So you have had it some weeks...that's great!
Did I miss a write-up from you or Zoidberg in all those pages. If so please let me know where. Seems like you are both using it. Is it worth the $100?
I'd love to know
Post by: Syncop8r on August 27, 2017, 05:00:08 AM
Oh my God, Top Gear! Jesus H. Smurf, Zoid!
You guys live in such beautiful landscape!. Where do I sign up? I'll do six months in one country, six months in the other for the rest of my days
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,56704.msg1016604.html#msg1016604
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,68481.msg1347010.html#msg1347010 :whistle:
Post by: Poncho65 on August 30, 2017, 11:52:18 AM
Oh my God, Top Gear! Jesus H. Smurf, Zoid!
You guys live in such beautiful landscape!. Where do I sign up? I'll do six months in one country, six months in the other for the rest of my days
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,56704.msg1016604.html#msg1016604
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,68481.msg1347010.html#msg1347010 :whistle:
Awesome links and I don't think I have saw either :dd: :like:
Post by: Syncop8r on August 30, 2017, 12:07:36 PM
Post by: ThundahBeagle on October 09, 2017, 01:45:17 AM
The REI exclusive Leatherman Signal was there in blister pack. Not only are the scales a luscious deep forest green, but the blade is black (don't think it is black oxide) with topographical map elevation bars and hights on it. $110 USD. Staring me right in the face.
I don't know why, but I wanted it.
Luckily, I did manage to escape with only the SAK Huntsman, but I am shuddering with confusion. I'm supposed to be form follows function. This seems too pretty.
I'm afraid to go back
Post by: pietervn on October 09, 2017, 10:19:20 AM
Pete
Post by: Etherealicer on October 09, 2017, 11:14:14 AM
They are the best looking Signal out there at the moment. I love mine!!!Do you know where that place on the map is?
Pete
Gorgeous, and if it were not a semi-serrated blade, I would come over to the US, just to get one :P
Post by: zoidberg on October 09, 2017, 11:31:50 AM
They are the best looking Signal out there at the moment. I love mine!!!Do you know where that place on the map is?
Pete
Gorgeous, and if it were not a semi-serrated blade, I would come over to the US, just to get one :P
Probably 45°N 122°W.
Post by: pietervn on October 09, 2017, 11:56:36 AM
Do you know where that place on the map is?
That is somewhere in the 'States. I don't know if the contour lines reflect that particular place in the forest. The maps on Google does show some green, in fact a lot of green, but I cannot get a contour reference for it.
Gorgeous, and if it were not a semi-serrated blade, I would come over to the US, just to get one :P
The blade is not bad at all. I think you should make the trip. ;)
Pete
Post by: Etherealicer on October 09, 2017, 12:05:13 PM
:salute:Probably 45°N 122°W.They are the best looking Signal out there at the moment. I love mine!!!Do you know where that place on the map is?
Pete
Gorgeous, and if it were not a semi-serrated blade, I would come over to the US, just to get one :P
Post by: Syncop8r on October 09, 2017, 12:50:58 PM
Do you know where that place on the map is?
That is somewhere in the 'States. I don't know if the contour lines reflect that particular place in the forest. The maps on Google does show some green, in fact a lot of green, but I cannot get a contour reference for it.
I used to be able to view contours on Google Maps... not anymore.
Those coordinates are just meant to be (near enough) for the Leatherman factory though aren't they?
Post by: ThundahBeagle on October 09, 2017, 03:49:45 PM
Post by: ThundahBeagle on October 09, 2017, 03:52:12 PM
I still have all my same reservations, but it sure seemed sweet.
Post by: Aloha on October 09, 2017, 05:31:54 PM
So, after reading this entire thread, is it OK to like the Signal now?
I still have all my same reservations, but it sure seemed sweet.
I say yes. When it was first announced the tool polarized many including myself. Once in hand I can see the merit in this tool. This tool can also be a great platform as well. The fiddly bits really are a non issue in hand and while they don't make the tool the certainly doesnt take away from the tool IMO. The Green tool Pieter showed is spectacular and while we don't all like combo edges this one is still the best Signal color combination yet.
Post by: airballrad on October 09, 2017, 07:17:28 PM
I did have the plastic break on the whistle/firestarter so that it no longer stays where it ought. The failure causes it to fall INTO the tool so it is not loose unless the pliers are opened, but still not ideal. I replaced that part and bought a spare besides, but then again if I wander into the woods with less than three forms of firemaking on me, shame on me.
The other Scout leaders rolled their eyes at me when I used my Leatherman to light the camp stove last weekend, but they still used it to cook dinner. :rofl:
Post by: pietervn on October 09, 2017, 10:30:53 PM
So, after reading this entire thread, is it OK to like the Signal now?
Absolutely. It is a fine tool, quite a few of us love them and have done the 30 Day Challenge.
I still have all my same reservations, but it sure seemed sweet.
Try one, you may be surprised how easy EDC it can be. It is quite a capable tool, in spite of the plastic bits.
Pete
Post by: Top-Gear-24 on October 09, 2017, 10:36:02 PM
So, after reading this entire thread, is it OK to like the Signal now?
I still have all my same reservations, but it sure seemed sweet.
I say yes. When it was first announced the tool polarized many including myself. Once in hand I can see the merit in this tool. This tool can also be a great platform as well. The fiddly bits really are a non issue in hand and while they don't make the tool the certainly doesnt take away from the tool IMO. The Green tool Pieter showed is spectacular and while we don't all like combo edges this one is still the best Signal color combination yet.
+1
At first I thought the Signal was a big waste of space and money, but when I saw one in real life for the first time (and after they dropped in price over here, from 180 Euro to 145 Euro) I started to like it more and more, and now I own two ... ;).
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 09, 2017, 10:53:20 PM
Probably the only thing I like about it is the "Wave" woodsaw, but I'd MUCH rather take the whole Wave over the Signal. Even after handling one, I really do not see the appeal of this.
Post by: Outback in Idaho on October 09, 2017, 11:06:37 PM
Heard the whistle on a YouTube video and was so not impressed. Blow a Fox40 next to it and know what a real attention getting whistle sounds like.
Been carrying an Exotac NanoStriker but have had more rods break from actual use that it becomes frustrating. read somewhere one needs a minimum of 1/4" of ferrocerium rod to be sturdy enough for use, but 1/2" or larger was better. So the Leatherman ferrocerium rod is more of a backup or light use thing. The whistle ... meh. And the diamond coated file ... :think: Okay... Least they didn't put a V sharpener in its place. Would of much rather had a Surge tool swap mechanism of Saw & File there. Oops! (Puts cat back in the bag.) Don't want to suggest people carry a spare Surge file in the back slot. :angel:
One thing that makes me wonder, who uses the 1/4" & 3/16" that far recessed in the Hammer/Carabiner tool anyhow? And what do you use it for in the first place?!? have needed a 3/8" far more times to remove/tighten battery terminals. One would of thought that someone out there would of created a Battery Tool Kit that could be carried inside most cars, attaching the case to a battery lead itself with some sort of self-locking mechanism. Then when they got stuck somewhere, they could remove the corrosion, clean the terminals & cable connectors, and have a non-conductive tool there to loosen/tighten the connectors from the terminals for the battery type they are using.
It's bad when you go and fix someone's car issues cause the car won't start, and you whip out your Leatherman to save the day. And they are carrying a Gerber and not once thought of using the darn thing. Oh, wait, my mistake, they would get it and their hands dirty. (!)
But really, why a 3/16" & 1/4" recessed hex wrench?!? :think: Must be because they can put them there. ::)
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 09, 2017, 11:21:09 PM
I think the 3/16" is there predominantly to stop a 1/4" bit pushing through
Post by: Syncop8r on October 10, 2017, 12:25:11 AM
- ferro rod
- whistle
- sharpener
- hammer
- hex bit driver
Anything else?
The ferro rod and whistle are written off as rubbish even by many who like the Signal overall, despite them being things that help make it an outdoors tool. I have more ovaries than the amount of times I have needed a hex bit driver out in the bush. The sharpener may be useful but doesn't really 'make' the tool.
So that just leaves the hammer which doesn't really grab me.
What am I missing?
read somewhere one needs a minimum of 1/4" of ferrocerium rod to be sturdy enough for use, but 1/2" or larger was better. So the Leatherman ferrocerium rod is more of a backup or light use thing.I think the Signal's ferro rod being mounted in the plastic would make it less likely to break?
Post by: Aloha on October 10, 2017, 12:35:48 AM
Replaceable cutters.
Bit driver.
Aesthetics.
OHO.
HAMMER.
Post by: Syncop8r on October 10, 2017, 12:41:02 AM
Post by: Outback in Idaho on October 10, 2017, 12:57:02 AM
What's the point of difference with the Signal? My observations:
- ferro rod
- whistle
- sharpener
- hammer
- hex bit driver
Anything else?
The ferro rod and whistle are written off as rubbish even by many who like the Signal overall, despite them being things that help make it an outdoors tool. I have more ovaries than the amount of times I have needed a hex bit driver out in the bush. The sharpener may be useful but doesn't really 'make' the tool.
So that just leaves the hammer which doesn't really grab me.
What am I missing?
Think it's a glorified MUT trying to make it a civilian tool. The Hammer section is dominant and no tools there except the whistle/ferro-rod thing. Seems like such a waste of space there. And there's no real file with any length to do anything with.
read somewhere one needs a minimum of 1/4" of ferrocerium rod to be sturdy enough for use, but 1/2" or larger was better. So the Leatherman ferrocerium rod is more of a backup or light use thing.I think the Signal's ferro rod being mounted in the plastic would make it less likely to break?
[/quote]
Anything that is glued in and come off at the worst possible of times. Maybe it's molded in there too. What one ought to do is remove the larger end of the whistle and stuff treated cloth & a cotton ball in there to help at least make one or two fires even in wet conditions.
Post by: Syncop8r on October 10, 2017, 01:23:20 AM
Think it's a glorified MUT trying to make it a civilian tool. The Hammer section is dominant and no tools there except the whistle/ferro-rod thing. Seems like such a waste of space there. And there's no real file with any length to do anything with.That's my thinking as well.
Post by: Spartan19 on October 10, 2017, 01:54:56 AM
Post by: Etherealicer on October 10, 2017, 07:40:11 AM
Yes they are features but I''m talking about things that set it apart from other MTs.Frame wise, it has a small inside tool opposite of the large outside tool increasing tool density. So it is a further step in the "Wave-Frame" evolution
Post by: Syncop8r on October 10, 2017, 08:48:06 AM
Surge, Wave, Charge, Wingman etc have been doing this for years. How is this a further step?Yes they are features but I''m talking about things that set it apart from other MTs.Frame wise, it has a small inside tool opposite of the large outside tool increasing tool density. So it is a further step in the "Wave-Frame" evolution
Post by: Etherealicer on October 10, 2017, 09:06:18 AM
Um, not my Wave/Charge or Surge... none of them have a small tool in the slot of the large outside tool.Surge, Wave, Charge, Wingman etc have been doing this for years. How is this a further step?Yes they are features but I''m talking about things that set it apart from other MTs.Frame wise, it has a small inside tool opposite of the large outside tool increasing tool density. So it is a further step in the "Wave-Frame" evolution
Check out the awl position here (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,70088.msg1405310.html#msg1405310)
Post by: Syncop8r on October 10, 2017, 10:11:18 AM
I didn't know they are like that.
Post by: Etherealicer on October 10, 2017, 12:30:08 PM
Sorry, I didn't realise you meant in the same slot. :salute:No problem, that's why I linked the picture... sometimes words are inadequate.
I didn't know they are like that.
Post by: Etherealicer on October 10, 2017, 12:34:05 PM
So, after reading this entire thread, is it OK to like the Signal now?Its always OK to like any tool... its OK to dislike them too. What is not OK is to hate a tool without ever giving it a spin ;)
I still have all my same reservations, but it sure seemed sweet.
Post by: Etherealicer on October 10, 2017, 12:37:31 PM
Think it's a glorified MUT trying to make it a civilian tool. The Hammer section is dominant and no tools there except the whistle/ferro-rod thing. Seems like such a waste of space there. And there's no real file with any length to do anything with.Except, if you double it up with 4 outside tools, you will only loose "one small inside tool" but you would gain a hammer. Personally, I feel that the hammer is awesome and pretty handy.
Post by: Outback in Idaho on October 10, 2017, 09:48:19 PM
Think it's a glorified MUT trying to make it a civilian tool. The Hammer section is dominant and no tools there except the whistle/ferro-rod thing. Seems like such a waste of space there. And there's no real file with any length to do anything with.Except, if you double it up with 4 outside tools, you will only loose "one small inside tool" but you would gain a hammer. Personally, I feel that the hammer is awesome and pretty handy.
Umm... 4 outside tools?? Main Blade which combined Serrated & Straight edges, a Saw. No full length File, no Cut Hook anywhere. While you might be able to use the ferrocerium rod on the outside, you'd have to take the dinky file off in order to be used - while accessible it has to be detached to be of any use. - Oh, the Hammer. That's really 3: Blade, Saw, Hammer.
So you're losing a Full-Length File for a small gimicky thing. :ahhh Not a good compromise. Signal Owners ought to buy extra files for the Surge and pack them in the slot in the back. Doesn't look there's a way to add a metal saw blade and/or adapter in there, which is unfortunate.
Leatherman should of added a feature to attach a metal blade to the tool. A Sawsall blade really comes in handy for emergency repairs, but no place to put one of them on a Signal either. While it's cute and has attractive features, it doesn't cover all the necessities for survival.
And the sheath... have you ever used the horizontal portion on these Chinese made sheaths? The horizontal straps pull through and you could lose your multitool in the forest and never know it. Been there. Anything nylon should at least have a melted barrier -before- it is ever stitched together. Otherwise fraying occurs and leads to malfunction.
This is why I've stayed with leather sheaths. Even the famed Charge Badged case that the emo's whine about that the oval badge burned their skin. Really?!? :twak: ID10Ts should not own tools. But that's another topic... >:D
Leather sheaths last YEARS. The elastic on my Charge sheath is not faring the best, although these sheaths are nearly impossible (if not impossible) to find. Leather sheaths can be repaired. :) Am considering making leather side panels to replace the elastic ones. It's a time on hand issue that I don't have much of working two jobs. Yet leather sheaths have never failed me. Numerous nylon sheaths have. And leather doesn't melt either. Although a nylon sheath could probably be used for fire starter if nothing else. :P
Will wait for the next incarnation of the MUT chassis. It needs a full-length file.
Post by: Etherealicer on October 11, 2017, 10:48:04 AM
I think you missunderstood...Think it's a glorified MUT trying to make it a civilian tool. The Hammer section is dominant and no tools there except the whistle/ferro-rod thing. Seems like such a waste of space there. And there's no real file with any length to do anything with.Except, if you double it up with 4 outside tools, you will only loose "one small inside tool" but you would gain a hammer. Personally, I feel that the hammer is awesome and pretty handy.
Umm... 4 outside tools?? Main Blade which combined Serrated & Straight edges, a Saw. No full length File, no Cut Hook anywhere. While you might be able to use the ferrocerium rod on the outside, you'd have to take the dinky file off in order to be used - while accessible it has to be detached to be of any use. - Oh, the Hammer. That's really 3: Blade, Saw, Hammer.
So you're losing a Full-Length File for a small gimicky thing. :ahhh Not a good compromise. Signal Owners ought to buy extra files for the Surge and pack them in the slot in the back. Doesn't look there's a way to add a metal saw blade and/or adapter in there, which is unfortunate.
Leatherman should of added a feature to attach a metal blade to the tool. A Sawsall blade really comes in handy for emergency repairs, but no place to put one of them on a Signal either. While it's cute and has attractive features, it doesn't cover all the necessities for survival.
And the sheath... have you ever used the horizontal portion on these Chinese made sheaths? The horizontal straps pull through and you could lose your multitool in the forest and never know it. Been there. Anything nylon should at least have a melted barrier -before- it is ever stitched together. Otherwise fraying occurs and leads to malfunction.
This is why I've stayed with leather sheaths. Even the famed Charge Badged case that the emo's whine about that the oval badge burned their skin. Really?!? :twak: ID10Ts should not own tools. But that's another topic... >:D
Leather sheaths last YEARS. The elastic on my Charge sheath is not faring the best, although these sheaths are nearly impossible (if not impossible) to find. Leather sheaths can be repaired. :) Am considering making leather side panels to replace the elastic ones. It's a time on hand issue that I don't have much of working two jobs. Yet leather sheaths have never failed me. Numerous nylon sheaths have. And leather doesn't melt either. Although a nylon sheath could probably be used for fire starter if nothing else. :P
Will wait for the next incarnation of the MUT chassis. It needs a full-length file.
Signal has 2 outside tools and 4 slots for inside tools + hammer
Wave has 4 outside tools and 6 slots for inside tools (the bit holder takes up 2 slots)
So the Wave has two more outside tools, two more inside tools one less hammer and is thicker. If you would make the Signal as thick as the Wave you would end up with
4 outside tools, 5 inside tools + hammer
So, basically you would trade one small inside tool for the hammer! I would not call that waste of space!
Btw, that is what I wish from LM, make a Signalwave :ahhh
Post by: Obi1shinobee on October 11, 2017, 07:18:54 PM
I think you missunderstood...Think it's a glorified MUT trying to make it a civilian tool. The Hammer section is dominant and no tools there except the whistle/ferro-rod thing. Seems like such a waste of space there. And there's no real file with any length to do anything with.Except, if you double it up with 4 outside tools, you will only loose "one small inside tool" but you would gain a hammer. Personally, I feel that the hammer is awesome and pretty handy.
Umm... 4 outside tools?? Main Blade which combined Serrated & Straight edges, a Saw. No full length File, no Cut Hook anywhere. While you might be able to use the ferrocerium rod on the outside, you'd have to take the dinky file off in order to be used - while accessible it has to be detached to be of any use. - Oh, the Hammer. That's really 3: Blade, Saw, Hammer.
So you're losing a Full-Length File for a small gimicky thing. :ahhh Not a good compromise. Signal Owners ought to buy extra files for the Surge and pack them in the slot in the back. Doesn't look there's a way to add a metal saw blade and/or adapter in there, which is unfortunate.
Leatherman should of added a feature to attach a metal blade to the tool. A Sawsall blade really comes in handy for emergency repairs, but no place to put one of them on a Signal either. While it's cute and has attractive features, it doesn't cover all the necessities for survival.
And the sheath... have you ever used the horizontal portion on these Chinese made sheaths? The horizontal straps pull through and you could lose your multitool in the forest and never know it. Been there. Anything nylon should at least have a melted barrier -before- it is ever stitched together. Otherwise fraying occurs and leads to malfunction.
This is why I've stayed with leather sheaths. Even the famed Charge Badged case that the emo's whine about that the oval badge burned their skin. Really?!? :twak: ID10Ts should not own tools. But that's another topic... >:D
Leather sheaths last YEARS. The elastic on my Charge sheath is not faring the best, although these sheaths are nearly impossible (if not impossible) to find. Leather sheaths can be repaired. :) Am considering making leather side panels to replace the elastic ones. It's a time on hand issue that I don't have much of working two jobs. Yet leather sheaths have never failed me. Numerous nylon sheaths have. And leather doesn't melt either. Although a nylon sheath could probably be used for fire starter if nothing else. :P
Will wait for the next incarnation of the MUT chassis. It needs a full-length file.
Signal has 2 outside tools and 4 slots for inside tools + hammer
Wave has 4 outside tools and 6 slots for inside tools (the bit holder takes up 2 slots)
So the Wave has two more outside tools, two more inside tools one less hammer and is thicker. If you would make the Signal as thick as the Wave you would end up with
4 outside tools, 5 inside tools + hammer
So, basically you would trade one small inside tool for the hammer! I would not call that waste of space!
Btw, that is what I wish from LM, make a Signalwave :ahhh
Im gonna mods that hammer adapter like this guy , already ask him permission He say GO FOR IT :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh
hahahah forget SignalWave , BLAVE keep add on :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xn5YGGsx3gg&t=98s
Post by: Outback in Idaho on October 11, 2017, 09:43:55 PM
Now about that hammer add-on ... interesting but would require a custom case for sure.
Only thing about these hammers is if you miss ... OUCH! Would not want to be the hand that misses. Used the back flat space on the Scourge (Kukri) to pound stakes in. The heft of the blade worked wonders. Although a Kukri isn't something one can easily carry around like a Signal/MUT, although a back sling would be more impressive. :viking:
But still ... don't miss or that hammer might be the instigator to an injury waiting to happen. Although I doubt it was intended to be used to put tent stakes in. probably more to pound or tap in stubborn firearm pins and other fittings
Was almost ready to buy the signal when I realized there was no real file there. Why didn't Leatherman use the Saw / File blade exchanger from the Surge?
Post by: Breezy12 on October 11, 2017, 10:20:19 PM
Why didn't Leatherman use the Saw / File blade exchanger from the Surge?
funny you should mention it... that's at the top of my list of mod ideas for the Signal. :D
I have the parts ready; just need to find some spare time to work on it... :-[
Post by: Syncop8r on October 11, 2017, 10:59:36 PM
Only thing about these hammers is if you miss ... OUCH! Would not want to be the hand that misses.+1
I would love to see a "Make your own alternative SIgnal" thread.... :dd:
Post by: Aloha on October 11, 2017, 11:04:49 PM
Post by: Syncop8r on October 11, 2017, 11:14:20 PM
I don't think a bit driver makes sense given it's intended use.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 11, 2017, 11:46:26 PM
True, a fixed saw for an outdoor tool makes much more sense. I think ferro rod, removable sharpener and whistle also make sense given the SIgnal's intended use.
I don't think a bit driver makes sense given it's intended use.
Depends how you got there I suppose - on foot, bike, car, boat .... besides which, some stoves and other outdoors gear have screws in.
Post by: Syncop8r on October 11, 2017, 11:51:42 PM
It's not having drivers I don't agree with, it's having (loseable) bits.True, a fixed saw for an outdoor tool makes much more sense. I think ferro rod, removable sharpener and whistle also make sense given the SIgnal's intended use.
I don't think a bit driver makes sense given it's intended use.
Depends how you got there I suppose - on foot, bike, car, boat .... besides which, some stoves and other outdoors gear have screws in.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 12, 2017, 12:05:33 AM
If the fasteners are torx or hex, it's that or a whole other set of tools. My "survival tool" is my Fuse-ilier mod, which has the full Phillips and flats - but I do tend to carry it with the adapter that fits on the phillips, and the small array of LM flat bits that it comes with. I've not needed them yet, but I've not needed my first aid kit often either, and still take that with me :) My issue with it on the Signal, is not being ablt to use the tool closed - at least the Wave lets me do thatIt's not having drivers I don't agree with, it's having (loseable) bits.True, a fixed saw for an outdoor tool makes much more sense. I think ferro rod, removable sharpener and whistle also make sense given the SIgnal's intended use.
I don't think a bit driver makes sense given it's intended use.
Depends how you got there I suppose - on foot, bike, car, boat .... besides which, some stoves and other outdoors gear have screws in.
Post by: Aloha on October 12, 2017, 12:09:34 AM
It's not having drivers I don't agree with, it's having (loseable) bits.True, a fixed saw for an outdoor tool makes much more sense. I think ferro rod, removable sharpener and whistle also make sense given the SIgnal's intended use.
I don't think a bit driver makes sense given it's intended use.
Depends how you got there I suppose - on foot, bike, car, boat .... besides which, some stoves and other outdoors gear have screws in.
It would be neat for all LM tools with bit drivers to be like the Skeletool, locking the bit in. I can say that I've never lost a bit and I keep the bit driver extended when I use the tool. Especially when I know I'll be using the driver soon rather than later. Keeping a few bits on hand wouldn't hurt not take a terrible amount of space.
Post by: Aloha on October 12, 2017, 12:26:59 AM
If the fasteners are torx or hex, it's that or a whole other set of tools. My "survival tool" is my Fuse-ilier mod, which has the full Phillips and flats - but I do tend to carry it with the adapter that fits on the phillips, and the small array of LM flat bits that it comes with. I've not needed them yet, but I've not needed my first aid kit often either, and still take that with me :) My issue with it on the Signal, is not being ablt to use the tool closed - at least the Wave lets me do thatIt's not having drivers I don't agree with, it's having (loseable) bits.True, a fixed saw for an outdoor tool makes much more sense. I think ferro rod, removable sharpener and whistle also make sense given the SIgnal's intended use.
I don't think a bit driver makes sense given it's intended use.
Depends how you got there I suppose - on foot, bike, car, boat .... besides which, some stoves and other outdoors gear have screws in.
While I can appreciate your views 50ft, its a non issue for how I can use the tool. Heres why, when I open the tool to engage the inner tools, awl, bit driver, or can opener I must open that side of the tool. Then I open the individual implement and while the tool is open I can, 1. use the tool in a L configuration which give me great control and leverage 2. use the tool inline which actually for me is comfortable. The tool "acts" like a standard tool in that configuration. Its not the ideal way inline however its not like it doesnt work. Again I can appreciate how others use their tools and certainly there is no wrong way. I'm just saying that not being able to close the tool when using the inside implements when theres a work around should be stated. Lastly when the tool is opened to engage the inside tools closing the tool may not alway make sense for some. There are many ways to look at this.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 12, 2017, 12:40:52 AM
If the fasteners are torx or hex, it's that or a whole other set of tools. My "survival tool" is my Fuse-ilier mod, which has the full Phillips and flats - but I do tend to carry it with the adapter that fits on the phillips, and the small array of LM flat bits that it comes with. I've not needed them yet, but I've not needed my first aid kit often either, and still take that with me :) My issue with it on the Signal, is not being ablt to use the tool closed - at least the Wave lets me do thatIt's not having drivers I don't agree with, it's having (loseable) bits.True, a fixed saw for an outdoor tool makes much more sense. I think ferro rod, removable sharpener and whistle also make sense given the SIgnal's intended use.
I don't think a bit driver makes sense given it's intended use.
Depends how you got there I suppose - on foot, bike, car, boat .... besides which, some stoves and other outdoors gear have screws in.
While I can appreciate your views 50ft, its a non issue for how I can use the tool. Heres why, when I open the tool to engage the inner tools, awl, bit driver, or can opener I must open that side of the tool. Then I open the individual implement and while the tool is open I can, 1. use the tool in a L configuration which give me great control and leverage 2. use the tool inline which actually for me is comfortable. The tool "acts" like a standard tool in that configuration. Its not the ideal way inline however its not like it doesnt work. Again I can appreciate how others use their tools and certainly there is no wrong way. I'm just saying that not being able to close the tool when using the inside implements when theres a work around should be stated. Lastly when the tool is opened to engage the inside tools closing the tool may not alway make sense for some. There are many ways to look at this.
Oh, there's certainly plenty of different perspectives and preferences :tu:
Open but inline, and the "L" configuration aren't to my taste, but that's not to say they aren't to others. :cheers: Personally I don't like the driving force being transmitted through the plier head to get from me to the bit, and I don't like the ergonomics either. If others choose to do so, or find it works better for them, all well and good. Just not for me, that's all :salute:
Post by: King_Gorilla on October 12, 2017, 10:41:53 PM
...
So, basically you would trade one small inside tool for the hammer! I would not call that waste of space!
Btw, that is what I wish from LM, make a Signalwave :ahhh
I carry a Signal almost every day. I too would LOVE a "Signalwave" as you put it. :cheers:
Just give me the same big blade that is on the Signal now, but plain edge, then give me a file and a dedicated serrated blade. maybe that cool one with the hook??? :whistle:
I'll deal with the extra weight.
Post by: Etherealicer on October 12, 2017, 10:48:34 PM
Exactly, and I predict that this is something we will get... and once it is big, why not go all the way? Make a Signalsurge, I would love that.
...
So, basically you would trade one small inside tool for the hammer! I would not call that waste of space!
Btw, that is what I wish from LM, make a Signalwave :ahhh
I carry a Signal almost every day. I too would LOVE a "Signalwave" as you put it. :cheers:
Just give me the same big blade that is on the Signal now, but plain edge, then give me a file and a dedicated serrated blade. maybe that cool one with the hook??? :whistle:
I'll deal with the extra weight.
Post by: King_Gorilla on October 13, 2017, 06:42:03 PM
Im gonna mods that hammer adapter like this guy , already ask him permission He say GO FOR IT :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh
hahahah forget SignalWave , BLAVE keep add on :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xn5YGGsx3gg&t=98s
That is really cool how he made that hammer mod with the sharpener and ferro rod attached. I still think I would rather wait for them to make a Signal with a file and separate serrated blade.
The Signal is about 1 ounce lighter than the Wave. That hammer mod probably adds at least 1.5 ounces of additional weight. (just guessing) Even if you added another layer of outside tools to the Signal, I doubt it will be much more than 8.5 ounces total.
And I really like the Carabiner/hook/bottle opener design that you get with the Signal/Skeletool/Mut tools. :)
Post by: magentus on October 16, 2017, 10:30:48 AM
Post by: Aloha on October 16, 2017, 05:41:49 PM
Handy to have a hammer for small jobs. :cheers:
I think so too. To me the Signals hammer as well as the MUTs is not so obtrusive as to warrant not having it. I've certainly used my MT as a hammer on several occasions :whistle:. I'm certainly not taking driving nails or anything of that nature.
Post by: Syncop8r on October 16, 2017, 10:50:49 PM
Post by: Aloha on October 16, 2017, 11:02:20 PM
How about the hammer's usefulness out in the wilderness? And before anyone says tent pegs, if it's a survival situation you may not have a tent. And I would rather use a rock anyway.
There are certainly other options to pounding a tent peg in. To me I don't see the Signal as a "survival tool" any more than a Wave or MP400. I'd say the hammer aspect is great for general camping. I could just as easily use my hatchet or a rock. Where the Signal really gets the piss taken from it is the marketing. I've not been a fan of how they marketed this MT from day one. Out door tool? Like I say its really no more effective that a Wave or MP400. Its really a shame they add ferro rod and claim it as such. I think were many see the tool as a good tool is thinking beyond what LM wanted to market this tool as. Seeing past the ferro rod is key when looking at this tool.
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 16, 2017, 11:06:05 PM
How about the hammer's usefulness out in the wilderness? And before anyone says tent pegs, if it's a survival situation you may not have a tent. And I would rather use a rock anyway.
Nuts. Shellfish. Breaking off a piece of natural flint. Driving a wedge to split a branch.
Unlike Aloha, I think it does compromise the usage of the other tools, but I can see how a whacking bat, even a small one, could be potentially useful. Whether it would be more useful than a rock or baton is debateable.
Post by: Syncop8r on October 16, 2017, 11:57:02 PM
I guess the term "survival tool" is a bit silly - shall we call it a camping tool then? Doesn't sound as sexy though. But perhaps more in line with what it will actually be used for.
Did Leatherman really get it so wrong if this is one of their best sellers? At the end of the day their goal is to make money, not create the perfect product.
Post by: ThundahBeagle on October 17, 2017, 12:12:28 AM
Synco, is the Signal really one of Leatherman' s best sellers? I admit that astounds me. I have been interested in it when standing in front of it in REI, but so far, not enough to abandon other choices over it.
Maybe Aloha is right. Survival tool seems a bit ambitious. Perhaps just Hiker' s Friend or Wilderness tool. But Survival means hard core. To me, that means a proper Ferro and a proper file along with what is already there that's good. Maybe a shiny surface to be used for flashing. If you call it the signal, it ought to be able to help you make fire, smoke signals, reflective light signals, and audio signals, each very well. It seems to only be meh in the department for which it was named.
Maybe the hammer if for Morse Code as well as tent stakes and tree nuts?
I'm going off of what I see of the tool, and other people's reviews and comments, of course, but that is only because Leatherman has not made this one good enough at what it is supposed to do so as to be glaringly obvious to me that I need to override a Rebar, ST300, or Surge purchase in favor of the Signal.
Post by: Syncop8r on October 17, 2017, 12:26:29 AM
Synco, is the Signal really one of Leatherman' s best sellers? I admit that astounds me. I have been interested in it when standing in front of it in REI, but so far, not enough to abandon other choices over it.I don't know for sure, just that Leatherman says it is one of their best sellers on their homepage (along with the Wave and Surge).
I'm interested in it too, but...
Post by: Aloha on October 17, 2017, 02:01:20 AM
Post by: Syncop8r on October 17, 2017, 02:19:19 AM
I'd certainly like to see a Signal 2.0Let's design one :pok:
Post by: AimlessWanderer on October 17, 2017, 03:14:57 AM
LM was enthusiastic in their marketing. Its much like how they count tools on a MT. Plier have many uses so shall we say there are 5 or 10 plus features in pliers or agree there are many uses. The ferro rod IMO is the only item on the tool that can directly be related to outdoor/survival/camping etc. I guess one can argue the whistle but shall we then say the wood saw? When I got one in hand the tool made sense to me. I've had several come thru my hands and each time I see the tool for what it is aside from the ferro rod and what LM tells me it is. It may not work for everyone but what tool does? How many variations of the Swiss Army knives are there? Hell 2 major companies survived selling similar products as a result of not one tool will satisfy us all. The pure evolution of the SAK to me demonstrates we dictate what the tool is to be used for. How many people use a huntsman for hunting? A soldier in a military scenario? Looking at what features you like and what you'd like is how many of us come to purchasing a new tool. I'd certainly like to see a Signal 2.0
I think marketing it so heavily as a survival tool was just an answer to the pestering they had received from their fan base. I agree all multitools are open to interpretation as to how they are best utilised. The limit to it's usefulness is the extent of your imagination.
Over there you have "crate opener" tools. The part hammer, part axe, part prybar ones. Over here, they usually sell as roofing tools. Personally it is what I would want more than a big knife or pack axe as a survival tool (in the common impromptu camping sense) as I could improvise more solutions with that than with a big knife or axe, and yet still use it for firewood processing and food prep.
If you're going to redesign one, put a hex bit driver in the heel of the hammer so it can be used inline, with a blanking piece for hammer use, and use that handle for bit storage. Wave plier head instead of the Rebar one with the poor cutting geometry, increased splay, and "gripping with cutters" issue. Then.... you still have the issue of not being able to use the other handle tools inline.... crap! :think: Removable hammer head, which sits both in the inline full 1/4" hex driver and rests against the end of the other handle, so the 1/4" shank isn't taking all the force. (and replaceable hammer heads available if damaged or lost) :tu: Offer bladed and knifeless options. Make a proper slow tapered awl instead of the smurfwitted half round thing. Lose the 'biner - it just gets under your hand/grip when using the external tools. How many people use it anyway?
Post by: Syncop8r on October 17, 2017, 03:42:39 AM
If you're going to redesign one, put a hex bit driver in the heel of the hammer so it can be used inline, with a blanking piece for hammer useNope, no need for hex drivers. I'm tempted to lose the hammer too.
Wave plier head instead of the Rebar one with the poor cutting geometry, increased splay, and "gripping with cutters" issueOK, I don't want to carry replacement cutter anyway.
Also tempted to ditch the pliers altogether...
Offer bladed and knifeless options.Nope. No deal.
Make a proper slow tapered awl instead of the smurfwitted half round thing.Agree.
Lose the 'biner - it just gets under your hand/grip when using the external tools. How many people use it anyway?Agree. I know lots of people love the carabiners, but I can't think of anything worse than a lump of metal swinging around on one.
How do you think we are progressing? :rofl:
Post by: Etherealicer on October 17, 2017, 08:55:57 AM
I agree all multitools are open to interpretation as to how they are best utilised. The limit to it's usefulness is the extent of your imagination.I'm probably going to make that my new tagline :D
I don't really see MTs as survival tools other than that they offer a saw and a blade. Maybe I should design a survival tool :D
In nature you will easily find something to hammer (rock, a thick branch etc...), but I found the small hammer around the house and office rather useful (I mean the external HDD makes a really poor hammer and so does the coffee mug, a large stapler works though). I think the hammer, is what makes the Signal stand out from the crowd. While basically every other MT offers exactly the same tool-selection, the Signal (and Mut) offers something new.
Post by: King_Gorilla on October 18, 2017, 01:03:45 AM
reading all those suggestions was stressing me out, I might be traumatized! :D
Obviously, all this stuff is subjective, but nearly all the stuff you said (except for the Awl part) are all things that I would definitely not want them to do. I like the big hefty rebar plier head, I haven't done a lot of wire cutting with it but it seems to work well for me. I LOVE the hammer and carabiner. It's true that you could use a rock in the woods but the hammer is nice. I talked on another thread about some weird stuff you can use them for in a more normal urban setting.
I would totally agree that the ferro rod is small and there are things they could do to improve on the design like add two more outside tools etc. BUT over-all, If I was to pick one LM product to have in my pocket when I mysteriously woke up in the middle of the woods, It would be a Signal. I mean, SURE, you can say that the ferro rod, whistle, sharpener, and awl could be improved or made bigger. Or you could say that something like: "When I go camping, I always have a ___, that makes the stuff on the signal pointless" But those same kinds of arguments could be said about any kind of multi tool in any situation. It's always better to have a tool that is designed for a particular function rather than a MT. But you dont always have them on you. The Signal has 4 or 5 things that would be very useful and possibly live-saving if you had nothing else. I think that's was their thinking when they designed certain parts of the tool. imho :)
Post by: Outback in Idaho on October 18, 2017, 01:59:24 AM
Okay, so maybe you need to carry both. :whistle:
Post by: Barry Rowland on October 19, 2017, 02:30:27 AM
Post by: WiSAKfan on October 19, 2017, 03:19:19 PM
I broke my skeletool and wanted something in a similar form factor that had beefier pliers so the Signal was an obvious choice and it fills that role exceptionally well.
How does the Signal do out camping and in survival situations? I have no idea. I put the plastic parts back in the packaging the first day I got it and haven't put them back on since nor have I gone camping with it.
Again back to my opinions but I think the marketing of this tool and those plastic bits may have limited people's perceived role this tool is capable of. The Signal platform's usefulness goes way beyond camping/survival...and sorta ironically there are probably other tools I'd take in those situations over the Signal.
Clipped to my work pants every day in a role as a larger skeletool is where the Signal shows it's prowess. To me anyway.
Post by: Aloha on October 19, 2017, 03:26:32 PM
Post by: Rfehling on May 17, 2018, 04:43:24 PM