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Tool Talk => Cheap and Cheerful (or otherwise!) => Topic started by: Lynn LeFey on March 19, 2018, 10:22:53 PM

Title: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Lynn LeFey on March 19, 2018, 10:22:53 PM
One of the first things I have to do to virtually every cheap MT I get is sharpen the blade. I swear that sometimes people sell tools just because a blade has gone dull from normal use. No nicks, or damage to the blade. It just needs to be sharpened.

I realized that in all my test threads on inexpensive MTs, I talk about sharpening the blades, but it seems a bit ridiculous to talk about how i brought a $5 tool's blade back using $30 worth of sharpening supplies. So I wanted to go as low budget as I could, and see what would work.

I legitimately want to get down to a particular river bed I know, and try picking up some river polished stones to use for sharpening, but haven't had the chance yet. Because, honestly, knife sharpening is just the very precise use of a stone or some hard and abrasive object to scrape against steel.

Putting the idea of rocks aside, what else could be had?

How about a basic handheld knife sharpener? The one in this picture cost just over a dollar from ebay, with a few week's wait as it shipped from China. I assume it's carbide. I don't know. I tested it on my 10' kitchen knife. Before sharpening, the knife would not cut paper at all. After sharpening, it would cut regular paper, and very hesitantly cut thin receipt paper.

(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/785/39097238960_94a4c6f6a7_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/22yTz1U)

I then used the unglazed portion of the bottom of a coffee cup, and got the knife sharp enough to fairly cleanly cut the receipt paper. I then sharpened the knife on the glazed portion, and got a very clean cut on the receipt paper.

There are a number of videos where people try to sharpen a knife blade on unfinished ceramic and it doesn't work. That, I THINK, is because unglazed ceramic should really only be used for touching up, or fine sharpening, not beginning the job. Finer even than the unglazed portion is the fused glass finish of industrial glazing. This WILL sharpen, but EXTREMELY slowly, and should be used only for finishing.

You can usually find coffee mugs for well under a dollar at yardsales, flea markets, and resale shops. So, for about $2, you can get a blade from not sharp (but not dead blunt) to receipt paper cutting sharp.

I am 100% convinced that a well tumbled granite river stone would be as good as a lansky sharpening stone (or about 300 grit sharpening stone) for more course work, but just because I'm convinced of it doesn't mean it actually WILL work.

I tried, and didn't have any real luck with trying cardboard for stropping. I've had a little luck stropping on the rough side of a leather belt, but I DID have some great results when I added Flitz polish to a piece of cardboard and stropped on that.

Setting aside the cardboard, river stone, and even ceramic mug, the basic sharpener for just over a dollar would give at least a basically sharpened edge. Please note here that this is really just sharpening, not grinding out nicks. That would require starting with a much courser stone, I think.

I'd be happy to hear of other very inexpensive methods.

And yes, I've heard of using the edge of car windows as well. That just seems really impractical.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: eamo on March 19, 2018, 10:31:33 PM
 :like: :popcorn:
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Mechanickal on March 19, 2018, 10:32:19 PM
A dirt cheap honing steel I have does an amazing job in getting blunt knives sharp again.
A touch up against a mug or cheap free hand diamond sharpener gets it wicked sharp.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Sparky415 on March 20, 2018, 09:09:26 AM

Can you find a piece of Slate? Do you have slate in America Lynn?  :think:  :think:
It's sad that I don't know the answer to this  :(
I need coffee....
 
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Vidar on March 20, 2018, 11:13:03 AM
Finding a suitable stone in nature makes sense - I guess many might do a decent job. It should even be possible to find a great one as historically grinding stones came from natural deposits.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: microbe on March 20, 2018, 11:57:37 AM
It does not even have to be a stone you find in nature. In many constructions, stones are used. I recall my dad used a stone window sill on our house to touch up his knife before he left.
A few years ago, I was visiting a castle ruin in a mountain village. I noticed an ancient dilapidated water collector. that showed signs of years of use as a sharpening stone on one of it's flat sides. I told my wife what the marks where, pulled out my pocket knife, and sharpened it where it was done hundreds of years ago.  :cheers:
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Lynn LeFey on March 20, 2018, 04:25:38 PM

Can you find a piece of Slate? Do you have slate in America Lynn?  :think:  :think:
It's sad that I don't know the answer to this  :(
I need coffee....

Yes, we have slate in the U.S.

Here's the wiki article on the slate industry in North America...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slate_industry#Slate_industry_in_North_America

I don't think it's sad that you don't know this. It seems like a pretty esoteric bit of information to know.

In regard to the other comments, now you guys make me want to go get a selection of stones from our local landscaping place and test them.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: ThePeacent on March 20, 2018, 06:05:24 PM
sandpaper,
my answer is sandpaper, in different grits,  :tu:
sheets of different grain size, they're cheap, and even better they have other uses   :salute:
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Lynn LeFey on March 20, 2018, 06:57:00 PM
sandpaper,
my answer is sandpaper, in different grits,  :tu:
sheets of different grain size, they're cheap, and even better they have other uses   :salute:

Interesting. I recently watched a video of a chef sharpening knives with expensive whet stones versus super-fine sandpaper.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ge-rvSe0f6w

I only keep 600 and 2000 grit wet/dry sandpaper on hand for removing rust from MTs. I've never tested them for sharpening blades.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Sparky415 on March 20, 2018, 08:03:38 PM

They will work Lynn  :tu:


That's 150 grit for doing coarse work, re-profiling
 
(https://i.imgur.com/1ioOoWv.jpg)

That was something like1500 grit wrapped around a diamond stone

(https://i.imgur.com/b4jyT1g.jpg)
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Lynn LeFey on March 20, 2018, 11:36:14 PM
Nice.  :tu:

Folks, I very much appreciate the feedback. Please keep it coming.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Sparky415 on March 21, 2018, 04:19:39 AM

Theres a few more pictures of that knife here,
reply 200
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,29267.200.html
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Aloha on March 21, 2018, 01:54:12 PM
Sand paper is a great option. 

There are some pretty inexpensive whetstones available.
https://www.amazon.com/Whetstone-Cutlery-20-10960-Sharpening-Stone-Sharpener/dp/B0055B2RGO/ref=sr_1_4?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1521613293&sr=1-4&keywords=whetstone



Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: SteveC on March 21, 2018, 02:05:45 PM
My local dollar store sells a two sided whetstone for you guessed it  a $1
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Grathr on March 21, 2018, 02:18:19 PM
My local dollar store sells a two sided whetstone for you guessed it  a $1

You can even get some for less than $1 incl shipping on ebay.  :D
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Lynn LeFey on March 21, 2018, 08:00:31 PM
My local dollar store sells a two sided whetstone for you guessed it  a $1

You can even get some for less than $1 incl shipping on ebay.  :D

i seem to recall this coming up in another thread. I should probably go check my local dollar store.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Aloha on March 21, 2018, 09:37:57 PM
I've seen those at my local dollar store as well.  I've seen someone use a glass bottle as well.  I'll try to find the info and post here when/if I do. 
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: gerleatherberman on March 22, 2018, 05:01:51 AM
I use sandpaper on my beater knives, but I haven't had a lot of luck with it on blades I want to look clean. It tends to score more than a fine hone would, even at the same grit (in this case, the lansky stone is 1000 grit and the paper I used is 800 grit, because that is the finest I use at work).
First pic is a Kershaw I sharpened with 800 grit sandpaper. The second pic is the $40 Lansky kit(used on valuable blades), and the last two pics are ones done on the Lansky kit. While $40 seems like a lot, cheap sharpening methods tend to ruin blade geometry and can damage the blade finish irreparably. I always think a guided sharpening system is key to sharpening something you want to look nice, retain value (ex. Multitool blades), and function well for years.
Now, if you know the knife won't be resold, or generally don't care what they blade looks like, sandpaper (as mentioned by ThePeacant) is cheap, FAST (very fast), and effective. On my work knives, I just nail the papers I'll be using onto a 2"x4" and try to keep a 20 degree angle as best I can by eye.
I have been leaning towards using the guided system more and more recently as I have found the polished edge with perfect geometry to hold up better in the long run.

Edit: I'd like to add that I am only bringing this up, because I really don't want anyone to start sharpening knives on rocks and car windows if they can avoid doing so(I know y'all know better, but I can't help but think someone is going outside right now and using 120 grit sandpaper to sharpen their knife and honing it on their neighbor's car window edge). It is very time consuming to reprofile and get a good geometry back on a blade after scraping it on uneven/rough surfaces. I learned the hard way (didn't know about sharpening for years and ruined many blades with cheap stones and cheap draw-sharpers).
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Grathr on March 23, 2018, 10:43:05 AM
These guys use a brick and belt as a strop.
I have no personal experience with it.


https://youtu.be/j5ax4Of5Pv8

Ps. They are a bit silly :D
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Noa Isumi on March 23, 2018, 03:46:04 PM
For serrations an old bootlace slicked with a little sand-mud works well
The sand gets into the threads and you end up with a flexable abrasive that conforms to the tooth
Just tie one end off a pull tight, always stroke away from the edge to not cut the cord.

I have used this and card board to touch up blades for years....
I first heard about cardboard stropping in a mid90s Blade interview with the head of Blackjack. It isnt good for a dull blade but for a finish or quick touchup it can work.
One company I used to work for had box knives that took odd blades that were never in stock. People were always wanting to bum blades so I would trade for the dull ones and strop them back sharp.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Lynn LeFey on March 23, 2018, 04:49:49 PM
I have used this and card board to touch up blades for years....
I first heard about cardboard stropping in a mid90s Blade interview with the head of Blackjack. It isnt good for a dull blade but for a finish or quick touchup it can work.
One company I used to work for had box knives that took odd blades that were never in stock. People were always wanting to bum blades so I would trade for the dull ones and strop them back sharp.

Did you use corrugated cardboard of solid? And did you put any kind of abrasive on the cardboard?

I have had no luck with corrugated, and only with solid cardboard when I added Flitz polish.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Lynn LeFey on March 23, 2018, 04:51:46 PM
These guys use a brick and belt as a strop.
I have no personal experience with it.
...
Ps. They are a bit silly :D

"$1000 knife, $500 knife, $500 knife..." Loved that bit. :rofl:
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Noa Isumi on March 23, 2018, 10:03:15 PM
I use corrugated, across the ridges not with. As I said it's just a touch up or polishing not an actual sharpening.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: ironraven on March 24, 2018, 11:02:05 PM
I just wanted to make a comment about how this thread appears in the main forum list. It is truncated to "Least expensive meth..."

Uhm....

Yeah. Been afraid to even LOOK in this forum.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: zoidberg on March 24, 2018, 11:05:47 PM
 :)
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: ThePeacent on March 25, 2018, 02:04:00 PM
I just wanted to make a comment about how this thread appears in the main forum list. It is truncated to "Least expensive meth..."

Uhm....

Yeah. Been afraid to even LOOK in this forum.

I don't know about cheap but that would certainly make one Cheerful   :D
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: NetsNJ on April 02, 2018, 05:37:25 PM
I think I am just really bad at sharpening, but the only time I've ever had any success is using this (https://www.amazon.com/Lansky-Deluxe-5-Stone-Sharpening-System/dp/B000B8IEA4/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1522683271&sr=8-3&keywords=lansky+knife+sharpener&dpID=51bOx2%252B0Z3L&preST=_SX300_QL70_&dpSrc=srch).  I've tried cheaper stuff (rods, stones, those v-shaped hand sharpeners), can never get a good edge.  I don't think I am good at keeping a constant angle and just make the edges worse.  I probably also press to hard, I don't know.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: ChopperCharles on June 26, 2018, 10:34:05 AM
Holy crap, thank you! That lansky system is exactly what I'm looking for. I've got the universal kit (for the serrated cutter) and an extra fine block on order right now!

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000B8L6M2

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000B8L6MC

With this setup I'm essentially trading the extra coarse block for the serrated block, and saving $3 over the Deluxe kit.


Charles.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Sparky415 on June 26, 2018, 06:27:04 PM

I like the Lansky system  :tu:
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Sparky415 on June 26, 2018, 06:51:49 PM

Oh and for Lynn when you get a min  ;)

https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,76719.0.html

 :cheers:
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: gerleatherberman on June 27, 2018, 01:45:01 AM
Holy crap, thank you! That lansky system is exactly what I'm looking for. I've got the universal kit (for the serrated cutter) and an extra fine block on order right now!

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000B8L6M2

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000B8L6MC

With this setup I'm essentially trading the extra coarse block for the serrated block, and saving $3 over the Deluxe kit.


Charles.
:tu:
Hard to beat the Lansky for the money. The only thing I would recommend for new Lansky users is to practice on a "junk knife" to figure out the blade mounting system, angles, guide fit, and grit steps.
There are some good videos on youtube about it as well.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: ChopperCharles on June 27, 2018, 08:18:26 AM
Fortunately I have several that qualify as junk!  Hrm, where did I put that pakistan copy of a buck lockback I've had since I was 14...

Charles.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: ChopperCharles on July 02, 2018, 06:33:25 PM
Should I be using honing oil with the ceramic stone?

Charles.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: gerleatherberman on July 02, 2018, 08:44:28 PM
Should I be using honing oil with the ceramic stone?

Charles.
The oil in the kit I bought is what I use, but basic honing oil should be fine. :cheers:

You do need to oil the stones though, or you won't be able to clean them and they'll become useless. In a pinch, sewing machine oil works well too. Clean the stones frequently and take your time. It does take some getting used to.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: ChopperCharles on July 02, 2018, 09:04:27 PM
I know to use honing oil on the actual stones, but the question was about the white ceramic stone. The final step in the process.

So far I've sharpened the blade of a cheap Coast multi-tool. It didn't really have an edge on it to begin with. I put a 30 degree edge on it, just to see what can be done, and it worked nicely. Cuts receipt paper now. I couldn't really tell what "edge" was already on it, and I figured for such a cheap tool i'd give it 30 degrees. Also I didn't know any better and was just practicing with a throw-away tool.

Charles.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: gerleatherberman on July 02, 2018, 10:36:57 PM
I see. Sorry about my misunderstanding! Yes, use honing oil on the 1K stone like you would the lower grit stones. :cheers:
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Mini on July 29, 2018, 11:15:11 PM
Used the bottom of a mug  2 or 3 times, but it was because there was nothing else that could help me, and the knife was very dull. Of course it was not the best sharpening results, but it cut better then before did it. Was with a kitchen knife, not mine.
In my kitchen I have a Lansky blade medic, and I think it do a great job for the price it costs.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Butch on October 17, 2018, 05:52:48 PM
I have used concrete from demolition sites that had slick surface floors, just pick up a smaller (4 or 5 inches ) and use the slick surface side then strop on a piece of scrap wood from said site. Pine or fir 2 x4 works best.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Captain Hook on November 27, 2018, 08:14:26 AM
Ace hardware sells sharpening stones for around $5-$10 in various grits and sizes. Been using one for all my blades! Couldn't tell you the grit. Coarse and fine I guess lol. I also finish up on a ceramic rod or bottom of a mug. And then strop on a leather belt. :tu: I use a diamond rod for serrations
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: ChopperCharles on December 14, 2018, 11:06:24 PM
Okay, so we have the least expensive method. But how about the easiest? My girlfriend doesn't have the patience and mechanical aptitude for knife sharpening using my Lansky. She has this horrible electric sharpening thing from Bed Bath and Beyond, which I am loathe to use on any knife. What can I get her that she will use, so it's not consistently my responsibility to sharpen all the knives?  Something she can use to quickly restore an edge to cut a tomato or something.

Charles.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Poncho65 on December 15, 2018, 01:29:46 AM
If cost doesn't matter then I would recommend the Spyderco Sharpmaker :tu: it comes with a DVD to show how to use it but once that is watched the actual use of it very easy  :cheers:
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: cody6268 on December 15, 2018, 03:24:52 AM
I know steels (I have an $15 Victorinox one) aren't really meant for regular sharpening, but I haven't found anything that will sharpen the cheap Chicago Cutlery steak knives (which my grandmother uses for everything; including cooking and garden work) quicker. Steels are really better for knives with soft steel; like the Chicago knives.
Title: Re: Least expensive method of basic knife sharpening
Post by: Sparky415 on December 15, 2018, 08:41:31 AM
Charles, I would 100% get her a steel!
So for example you will sharpen her knives every few months then day to day or weekly she would run them over a steel as needed

Watch this Guy and do everything he says, he nails everything about using a steel  :salute:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CzoJtzQV2s8

Oh and don't get her a diamond coated one just a normal steel


And it takes practice to get the hang of it, it will take a while just to get the feel of it sharpening (you will understand what I mean when it happens  :tu: )
 :cheers: