Post by: ZapWizard on May 08, 2019, 05:32:26 PM
Howdy Folks,
I will be developing several new mods and other projects related to the Leatherman Free P4.
I make these designs because I want them for myself. However, since I use professional 3D printing on the final product, most of these will become available to purchase from my shop (Link in signature)
I will be posting progress on each project here.
Here is my list of planned projects/mods:
- Form fit holster, similar to my Wave/Charge/Surge designs
- Thumb tabs to make opening the tools easier
- Bit holder to replace the Phillips and Flat-head
- Laser-etched ruler along inside of scales
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on May 08, 2019, 05:47:10 PM
Post by: RF52 on May 08, 2019, 05:50:34 PM
Sent fra min FRD-L09 via Tapatalk
Post by: Wspeed on May 08, 2019, 05:52:34 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on May 08, 2019, 06:04:48 PM
That sounds very interesting Zap... especially that bit holder. Is that going to fit the LM specific flat bits?No, the plan is to make a part that replaces the two tools in the stack. I have thought about making one that fits the screw driver, but I figure Leatherman will eventually make one. I also would rather have it integrated.
Edit: I misread your question: Yes it would fit the flat bits. There isn’t room for a regular hex holder.
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(https://i.imgur.com/xA2sFKt.jpg)
The first day I got my Free ($140) P4 I took it apart.
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(https://i.imgur.com/fu6rSar.jpg)
I then used a tele-macro-lens setup to take detailed photos of each and every part.
(The contrast is intentionally very high in the shot)
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(https://i.imgur.com/YodXBko.jpg)
Using the images, along with measurements using calipers, I created a very detailed 3D model of tool. I tried to spare no detail on this one.
I am a product design engineer by trade, so this stuff is what I do. I also get access to amazing 3D tools such as Solid Edge and Keyshot.
The image at the top of the thread is a 3D rendering of the completed model.
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(https://i.imgur.com/cyaptni.jpg)
This image shows the end of day #3.
The red/blue objects are my first design for the thumb-tabs (more on those later)
The green object is me mocking up the latching mechanism I plan on using on the holster. At first I thought I would have to engage with the springs on both sides of the tool, but it turned out one side works great.
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(https://i.imgur.com/8rSHPGq.jpg)
This is rev 7 of my holster design. Each revision is 3D printed on a FDM machine to test fit and work out any issues.
You may notice the P4 looks odd in the image, that is because there are four orientations on top of each other.
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(https://i.imgur.com/M8eveMd.png)
Here is a short history of the revision stages:
- Rev 1: Basic form and fit 3D print to test that the spring catches will work on when only-one side of the tool. This prototype showed you need to remove the lanyard clip (Mute point now that the P4 has a belt clip instead)
- Rev 2: Tweaked fit of catch mechanism. Tested Tek-Lok compatible hole spacing. Added supports near top to better grip the tool. Large base finger opening
- Rev 3: Tried adding some top catches, to fit into cutouts near pliers. (didn't work well) Realized I can open the middle of the holster for a cooler look..
- Rev 4: Added top-spring catches, allowing the tool to fit in any which way. . Having issues because there is only a blade on one side of the tool, so the other side can twist outwards, making the holster feel loose
- Rev 5: Added two small supports to the front to hold tool in better, prevent twisting.They worked great. Added lots of side geometry to make sides as stiff as possible
- Rev 6: Realized the top spring stops are redundant. Strengthened front tabs,].
- Rev 7: (Currently on the 3D printer) Thickened front tabs. tweaked catch strength to try to balance top/bottom catch force
Post by: comis on May 08, 2019, 06:12:55 PM
:popcorn:
Post by: SteveC on May 08, 2019, 06:20:47 PM
Post by: Wspeed on May 08, 2019, 06:25:23 PM
Post by: Vjeko Posavac on May 08, 2019, 10:04:41 PM
:tu: :popcorn:
Post by: Poncho65 on May 08, 2019, 11:26:53 PM
Very cool and thanks for signing up for the fabricator membership !
:iagree: :like:
Very nice designs can’t wait to see more :popcorn:
Also :iagree: :like:
Post by: aussieman on May 09, 2019, 07:56:51 AM
a) :drool:
b) :salute:
c) :popcorn:
d) how possible is it to have the belt clip central? (don't like the tool carrying too low)
This is amazing though, love the pics and the insight into the process.
Post by: gerleatherberman on May 09, 2019, 08:03:13 AM
Thank you for all of your efforts so far, ZapWizard. :salute:
Post by: ZapWizard on May 09, 2019, 02:14:34 PM
d) how possible is it to have the belt clip central? (don't like the tool carrying too low)
The belt clip holes are #2-56 drilled and tapped holes in the scales. Drill and tape your own holes to put the clip anywhere you want. Just provide some protection to prevent the shaving from getting on the magnet. Or take it apart beforehand.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on May 10, 2019, 07:26:05 PM
Cheers,
HG
Post by: ZapWizard on May 10, 2019, 11:38:57 PM
Post by: Douglas on May 11, 2019, 12:38:51 AM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on May 11, 2019, 01:00:54 AM
Note: I am not designing for the P2 at this time, just the P4 that I own. The P2 is a bit pricey. I can't afford to purchase every single possible tool.
I believe the p2 has the same space and frame so it should accept any bit exchanger u design for it as well. That is what I was referring to.
Post by: Sam Lim on May 11, 2019, 02:01:35 AM
I must as a question unrelated to your VERY IMPRESSIVE work here. The Chicago screws that are used as the pivot for the tools look to be 4 mm in your photo. Is this actually the case? I have a project that I can't seem to get off the ground because I can't seem to find a 4 mm pivot.
The screw post are smaller than 3mm. It's the same size LM uses for the rivets on the juice series. 4mm? Spirit? :like:
Post by: Douglas on May 11, 2019, 02:28:24 AM
The screw post are smaller than 3mm. It's the same size LM uses for the rivets on the juice series. 4mm? Spirit? :like:
:tu: YOU guessed IT. :salute:
Post by: tommywp on May 11, 2019, 02:29:40 AM
:multi:
Post by: Sam Lim on May 11, 2019, 04:17:02 AM
:tu: YOU guessed IT. :salute:
:D I also have problem sourcing for that. Buying them standalone will be difficult. At least for where I am. I have realise alot of non mainstream brands, those made in China uses metric size pivots. Very common are 5mm and 4mm. And they are often cheaper than buying just the screws. Strip them for their parts.
Sorry for hijacking the thread! :salute:
Post by: munecito on May 11, 2019, 04:35:05 AM
Post by: ZapWizard on May 11, 2019, 05:04:28 AM
The Chicago screws that are used as the pivot for the tools look to be 4 mm in your photo. Is this actually the case?
It was quite hard to determine some of the parts, as Leatherman uses a mix of Imperial and Metric measurements. I used thread guages and calipers to determine the screw sizes.
The chicago screw tool pivots near the pliers are #6-40 threaded posts, with a diameter of 3/16" (4.76mm), and 5/8" (15.84mm).
(https://i.imgur.com/C0kpqQa.jpg)
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The chicago screws at the blade end are #2-56. 3.1mm diameter, and 16.7mm long.
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I believe the p2 has the same space and frame so it should accept any bit exchanger u design for it as well. That is what I was referring to.Gotcha, yes that should be the same.
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(https://i.imgur.com/bTmh5Mi.jpg)
Here is an early image of the design for a bit holder.
It would be made from 3d printed steel. It would keep the can opener (as long as prototypes show it has a strong enough hold on the tool) It also would gain a 1/4" hex opening were the opener is.
The bit would be held in by a magnet.
Fitting the flat leatherman bit into the space left in the P4 was tricky. What I ended up having to do was offset the bit holder by five degrees. But that would make it off axis when open. I then realized I could offset the open lock by the same angle, and make it straight when open.
This one will require quite a bit of time to develop as the 3D printed steel can shrink sort of like a casting, and I also have to get the locking mechanism to work just right.
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(https://i.imgur.com/SPxakiu.jpg?1)
This is the final rendering for the P4 holster with normal belt loop. I am still working out a few other attachment loops, clips and methods to suite the various requests I have received in the past.
Post by: Wspeed on May 11, 2019, 12:34:51 PM
Post by: ddogu on May 11, 2019, 01:39:25 PM
Wow...
:popcorn:
:iagree:
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on May 11, 2019, 01:53:22 PM
:like: :drool: :popcorn:
Post by: Jaypeebee on May 11, 2019, 03:08:27 PM
Post by: ReamerPunch on May 11, 2019, 06:06:36 PM
Post by: Wspeed on May 11, 2019, 06:08:38 PM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on May 11, 2019, 10:22:22 PM
:hatsoff: :hatsoff: :hatsoff: :drool: :drool: :drool:
Post by: ZapWizard on May 12, 2019, 12:58:10 AM
I thought I had a good design for the thumb-tabs, and had SLS prototypes in hand last week.
The design was three small tabs held together by a sprue to reduce costs (Shapeways charges per-part)
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(https://i.imgur.com/KwSDQzT.jpg)
In CAD these flat-head screws were supposed to be just a bit bigger than the slot, and they would secure the thumb tabs to the blade without any glue needed.
They are tiny #0-80x1/8L screws. But reality turned out that they fit through the slot, and were nearly impossible to thread into the tiny blind holes.
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(https://i.imgur.com/AKOzkt4.jpg)
The prototypes did show they work pretty well. It makes it easier to open the blade, and easier to keep you thumb on one spot through the whole opening process.
However, I had to redesign them to figure out another securing method besides super glue.
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(https://i.imgur.com/GzdLG91.png)
This is the new design. It uses either #1-72 or M2 set screws. The set screws go almost the full length of the thumb tab. This time the hole they go into is tapered.
The top edge is set to that it should start to thread easily. Then the hole tapers down to the point that the hole is undersized. This along with a split in the back should make it so that the screw clamps the plastic sideways into the slot.
We will see once the second revision arrives.
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(https://i.imgur.com/chCb9x8.png)
The holster, driver, first run prints have all been ordered I didn't pay extra this time for rush processing, so it will be almost a month before I get them in my hands.
Post by: genevabuck on May 12, 2019, 02:22:37 AM
Post by: ZapWizard on May 12, 2019, 03:39:45 AM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on May 12, 2019, 05:45:03 AM
Pricing should work out to be $39 for the holsters (Same as my others), $25 for the bit holder, and $14 for the thumb tabs. Those prices are mostly Shapeways production costs.
OMG that is so reasonable for the bit holder. Any chance of designing a 1/4" hex bit holder for the wave/charge platform? If anyone can, you probably could.
Post by: Poncho65 on May 12, 2019, 06:15:19 AM
Post by: ZapWizard on May 23, 2019, 01:05:21 AM
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/47859765622_94f71931eb_h.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2fVcNUN)
My production holster arrived today!
The good news is no design changes needed. Those seven previous prototypes paid off. The holster works perfectly. The tool snaps in with a satisfying click and is very secure with no rattling. It is slightly less secure when docked upside down due to the spring angle, but still good enough not to fall out if shaken upside down.
I did record a nice video showing off everything. But it turned out to be too blurry and with too much wind noisey. (Dead cat's don't work as well as they should). I will record another video once I get some time later next week.
The new production thumb tabs also arrived, along with the tiny set screws. They also fit perfectly and look great. The expanding set-screw lock worked like a charm.
Both of these are available on my Shapeways store. The link is in my signature.
The swappable bit holder also is here, but will require some drilling and more experimentation which I don't have time for this week. The bad news there is it probably will need to looe the bottle opener, as some Leatherman bits just don't have enough surface area at the back to fully engage with the magnet, and are weakly held right now.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on May 23, 2019, 01:10:04 AM
Post by: zoidberg on May 23, 2019, 01:20:25 AM
And I understand you've designed over/with what was already there but those thumb tabs are over the blade edge.
Having experienced this from some well known knife brands, it's something I choose to move away from.
Post by: ZapWizard on May 23, 2019, 01:49:54 AM
And I understand you've designed over/with what was already there but those thumb tabs are over the blade edge.
Having experienced this from some well known knife brands, it's something I choose to move away from.
(https://i.imgur.com/ro5Ux1H.jpg)
I am not sure what you mean by "over the blade edge". The tabs are all within the profile of the blade. And other than the main blade: They are all just barely larger than the thumb opening they go into. None of them extend more than a fraction of a millimeter past the back of the blade, so they won't interfere with other tools.
If you meant they rise above the scales on the tool. Currently they rise just 0.7mm above the surface. Just enough to grip even with gloves, but not enough to snag on anything.
Post by: zoidberg on May 23, 2019, 01:59:35 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/ro5Ux1H.jpg)
I am not sure what you mean by "over the blade edge". The tabs are all within the profile of the blade. And other than the main blade: They are all just barely larger than the thumb opening they go into. None of them extend more than a fraction of a millimeter past the back of the blade, so they won't interfere with other tools.
If you meant they rise above the scales on the tool. Currently they rise just 0.7mm above the surface. Just enough to grip even with gloves, but not enough to snag on anything.
I mean it interrupts the line between the edge and the back of the blade.
When cutting the thumb tab will snag.
IMO this reduces the effective length of the blade or saw.
Post by: gerleatherberman on May 23, 2019, 02:06:50 AM
In fact, the thumb tabs would make it more comfortable to put your thumb on the spine of the blades. :)
I'm ordering a set of thumb tabs in white this weekend. :woohoo:
Post by: Juan el Boricua on May 23, 2019, 02:09:03 AM
Post by: gerleatherberman on May 23, 2019, 02:11:42 AM
Post by: ZapWizard on May 23, 2019, 02:34:38 AM
I mean it interrupts the line between the edge and the back of the blade.
When cutting the thumb tab will snag.
IMO this reduces the effective length of the blade or saw.
I definitely agree for the saw. And honestly, I didn't even think about it. Other than the saw I have never used the full depth/length of any blade myself.
I'm ordering a set of thumb tabs in white this weekend. :woohoo:FYI: Nylon is an absorbent material. Lighter colors will show dirt quite quickly.
ZapWizard, those are really good -looking, well-designed accessories you made...kudos to you Sir! Will you consider doing the thumb tabs and sheath for the gen2 and 3 Waves? I'll be interested in two sets!It is on my list of projects to tackle someday.
Post by: SirVicaLot on May 23, 2019, 06:03:41 AM
Post by: Poncho65 on May 23, 2019, 12:21:21 PM
This project is awesome, very nice work Sir :tu: :like:
:iagree: :like: :like:
Post by: Wspeed on May 23, 2019, 12:33:54 PM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on May 24, 2019, 08:02:37 AM
Post by: gerleatherberman on May 25, 2019, 08:04:50 AM
After installation, would a few coats of cyanoacrylate do the trick in creating a strong stain resistant barrier?
I know it would keep them from coming out easily for sure. :ahhh
Post by: ZapWizard on May 25, 2019, 12:33:28 PM
The Nylon also has a higher melting point than the softening point of super glue. So if you want to remove them you can try heating the glass surface gently to release the glue. Similar to how folks use CA glue to hold items onto a lathe plate.
Post by: gerleatherberman on May 25, 2019, 01:14:52 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on May 30, 2019, 04:16:20 AM
Okay, I have my prototype bit holder modification. Reminder: This uses a 3D printed piece and a magnet to hold the Leatherman Flat Hex interchangeable bits
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(https://i.imgur.com/43sO5fT.jpg?1)
The good news: The bottle opener works great. :D
The sintered stainless steel material is very strong. It took several minutes of drilling to ream out the 1/4" deep magnet hole to fit the magnet just right. I have no doubt it will hold up to some heavy torque.
The surface is pitted, as a result of the sintering process. But the surface is polished and actually quite low friction. There will be no issues deploying the tool (once the profile is tweaked, more on that later)
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(https://i.imgur.com/xFGMA2T.jpg?1)
The bad news: The bottle opener cutout makes holding a bit straight impossible. >:(
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(https://i.imgur.com/ZBTm0eL.jpg?1)
The magnet inside does a good job of holding the bit in, but not straight. It can easily tilt away. I will have to skip my precious Topo Chico, or find another solution.
The internal magnet also doesn't interact with the tool catch magnet at all, so no worries there. The stainless steel is attractive enough to hold close the same as the other tools.
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(https://i.imgur.com/akxVda4.jpg?1)
I made the prototype as a way to test the tolerances of the material, as well as the general fit and strength.
I did screw up, in that I followed the profile of the blades, and not the other tools. You can see this in the image above, the blade have a more difficult to deploy profile, while the smaller tools have more of a curve to make them easier to deploy.
Right now the open latch effect isn't as solid as I want. So I will have some re-designs and another prototype or two.
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There are a few options to preserve the bottle opener:
-Modify the can-opener tool to work as a bottle opener (Like the Wave does)
-Make a can-opener bit. (I sort of am leaning towards this one)
-Try to figure out some other placement for it on the bit holder (will work on this also)
Post by: ZapWizard on May 30, 2019, 05:20:08 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=06HWSQMVE9A
Post by: Raoul Octav on May 30, 2019, 09:36:49 AM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on May 30, 2019, 02:57:47 PM
My2cents, maybe focus on a bit adapter for the small bits, the ones used by victorinox cibertool
Your referring to 4mm percision bits.
But the Leatherman bits store flat which is really nice. That being said, using 4mm bits would be so so so much cheaper and give the tool access to tons of other proprietary bits. It also opens up a lot more space on the tool because they are smaller than Leatherman bits.
Now that you mention it, I'd probably prefer the 4mm bits overall because of how easy they are to replace. A full set, including a spare driver costs less than 10$.
Post by: ZapWizard on May 30, 2019, 04:08:18 PM
Here is the re-designed non-can opener version. It can probably keep the 1/4" hex opening.
I am not quite happy with it. The flat end doesn't look great, but is needed to keep up the material thickness.
-------------------------------------------
...maybe focus on a bit adapter for the small bits, the ones used by victorinox cibertool
(https://i.imgur.com/ESBN0X5.jpg)
Since this will be a product mostly for tool modders, that is a good idea. I use a set of 4mm precision bits constantly at work. The only catch is they don't have the larger Torx and screw sizes.
Above is a mock-up image, showing a 4mm bit will fit nicely, and won't require the 5 degree tilt. I may even be able to get the can opener back in.
I may be able to develop both at the same time, it would just double my prototyping costs. :-\
Post by: Happy Gilmore on May 30, 2019, 04:15:28 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/Hcw13Vl.jpg)
Here is the re-designed non-can opener version. It can probably keep the 1/4" hex opening.
I am not quite happy with it. The flat end doesn't look great, but is needed to keep up the material thickness.
-------------------------------------------
(https://i.imgur.com/ESBN0X5.jpg)
Since this will be a product mostly for tool modders, that is a good idea. I use a set of 4mm precision bits constantly at work. The only catch is they don't have the larger Torx and screw sizes.
Above is a mock-up image, showing a 4mm bit will fit nicely, and won't require the 5 degree tilt. I may even be able to get the can opener back in.
I may be able to develop both at the same time, it would just double my prototyping costs. :-\
Seriously bro, u are amazing. I was going to hold off on the p2 or p4, but you might be forcing me with how awesome these are. I'd do a poll to see which one is more likely to get bought. Sales from one can help offset the other. I do think the 4mm/ bottle opener might be very enticing. Is the 1/4" hex hole still possible with that setup? If so than the 4mm would be better because it's basically a 3 in 1 tool. I'd definitely buy that. Especially since that means it can use the two most common bit shapes. In modding I use the percision bits over the leatherman ones 90% of the time.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on May 30, 2019, 04:21:40 PM
Post by: Wspeed on May 30, 2019, 05:11:08 PM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on May 30, 2019, 05:25:43 PM
Interesting option to use the 4mm bits :tu:. That combined with a cap lifter and 1/4" hex would be awesome :like:
A 4mm setup would also likely be stronger because of it's shape. This would also benefit a 1/4" hole.
Imagine if you could add a T-shank exchanger instead of serrated blade. That would let u use the surge saw and file setup..now I'm dreaming
Post by: Wspeed on May 30, 2019, 05:57:28 PM
Post by: Poncho65 on May 31, 2019, 02:15:46 AM
Post by: ZapWizard on May 31, 2019, 09:23:16 PM
So I worked last night on the 4mm configuration. I like it enough now that I am ditching the idea of making the flat bit driver, even though I know someone will ask for it eventually.
One thing was getting the bottle opener profile just right. So why not just copy something already known to work? So I copied the Leatherman Brewzer profile. And then tweaked it also work as a 1/4" hex wrench.
There was a bit of dead space in the middle, so I added a horizontal 4mm driver as well.
Finally I went through lots of configurations on the magnets. On my first prototyope the magnets installed via a hole at the bottom of the bit driver pocket. However, that meant every time you install a bit, it would slam into the surface of the magnet. And while magnets looks like solid metal, they aren't. They are nickel plated, sintered powder. And cracking the nickel surface can cause the magnet to break up.
I tried some side-loading magnet ideas, but they were both ugly, and didn't allow you to ream out the hole using a drill bit. (The material tolerances can vary a bit)
So instead the magnets install via a deep hole opposite the main bit opening. There is a 1mm thick wall of metal between the magnet and the bit to ensure the bit never strikes the magnet.
Because the hole is deep, you can stack two magnets to increase the overall holding strength.
Finally, the hole allowed me to add a 4mm bit driver opening that is accessible even if the tool is fully closed.
I am happy with the design, and will work on getting it prototyped soon.
Post by: Wspeed on May 31, 2019, 09:26:33 PM
Post by: Poncho65 on June 01, 2019, 04:23:46 AM
Post by: Wpgwave on June 01, 2019, 06:41:30 PM
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 01, 2019, 09:17:02 PM
Make sure you have a P2 version of the holster and bit holder!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
It should be identical for both. And HOLLY MOLLY that looks incredible! :gimme: :gimme: :gimme:
Post by: ZapWizard on June 02, 2019, 02:40:45 AM
Make sure you have a P2 version of the holster and bit holder!
The P4 holster will not fit the P2. The P2 is thinner, and has some other subtle changes that would make it so I have to design its own (similar) holster. At $120 for the P2, it too much for right now.
The bit holder should work in either model.
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(https://i.imgur.com/GTbUCZQ.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/DLTAJbS.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/qmFAoGX.png)
Here is the renderings of the design. It will take a few prototypes to tweak the tolerances, so it won't be out for a few weeks.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 02, 2019, 04:24:45 AM
The P4 holster will not fit the P2. The P2 is thinner, and has some other subtle changes that would make it so I have to design its own (similar) holster. At $120 for the P2, it too much for right now.
The bit holder should work in either model.
--------------------
(https://i.imgur.com/GTbUCZQ.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/DLTAJbS.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/qmFAoGX.png)
Here is the renderings of the design. It will take a few prototypes to tweak the tolerances, so it won't be out for a few weeks.
Truly incredible..one nitpick though, would it be possible to have some kind of stop for the 4mm hole you have perpendicular to the tool? In other words having it so that the bits didn't go all the way through. Might be too hard with the tool thickness but maybe I'm wrong. Incredible job though.
I think going with the 4mm bits is a really really good idea. It also reduces the likelihood of Leatherman getting really annoyed with it since it doesn't use their flat bit system.
Replacing a single flat bit from Leatherman is a total pain but for $10 you can get something like this:
(https://image.dhgate.com/0x0/f2/albu/g3/M00/60/20/rBVaHVoDD1KANJ1YAAVLiUZs5Vg017.jpg)
the extenders and flexable heads would even be usable with the tool you are making.
We're u still able to keep the 4mm hole open to be used while closed? If so that's uterly brilliant design.
Post by: Wspeed on June 02, 2019, 12:18:26 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on June 02, 2019, 02:20:40 PM
Would it be possible to have some kind of stop for the 4mm hole you have perpendicular to the tool?
We're u still able to keep the 4mm hole open to be used while closed?
(https://i.imgur.com/hOqabwI.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/lRcZkYd.jpg)
Any stop I added to the horizontal wrench would lessen the amount of usable length, or make it usable on one side only. Instead, imagine just putting your finger on the backside, like you might do with a box wrench.
Yes, the deep hole in which you install the magnets into opens up into a second 4mm hex opening at the back.
Post by: aussieman on June 02, 2019, 02:46:31 PM
Before I order, I was thinking of getting the mid mount "Large" size and adding the TheClip.com, Model 661BP
Would that fit ok?
Select "Large" for: Tek Lok compatible hole placement.
..
Can also attach to other mid-mount Chicago screw style products.
Designed to be compatible with the TheClip.com, Model 661BP
Recommend Tandy Leather, Screw Post Model 1296-04
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on June 02, 2019, 03:06:06 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/hOqabwI.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/lRcZkYd.jpg)
Any stop I added to the horizontal wrench would lessen the amount of usable length, or make it usable on one side only. Instead, imagine just putting your finger on the backside, like you might do with a box wrench.
Yes, the deep hole in which you install the magnets into opens up into a second 4mm hex opening at the back.
:like:
Post by: ZapWizard on June 02, 2019, 03:11:35 PM
Before I order, I was thinking of getting the mid mount "Large" size and adding the TheClip.com, Model 661BP
Yes it will mount the metal clip. Rather than fix the chicago screw positions to just Tek-Lok like I did on the Wave, I decided to make it one fixed hole, and one slot. That way more products can be mounted.
There was a small issue on the Tek-Lok version which might have allowed the bottom edge of the clip to catch, but I updated the 3D model just now. One of the great things about 3D printing is instant changes are possible.
Post by: ZapWizard on June 04, 2019, 04:18:20 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/G0XVVZA.jpg?2)
(https://i.imgur.com/Z71vQ5H.png)
I 3D printed a mockup of the bit holder in plastic. I shrunk the 3D model by 3% to emulate the shrinkage that the sintered steel will have.
The plastic mock-up isn't strong enough to actually use, but it lets me get an idea of the general use.
The mockup showed that I am damn close on the latching profile. The tool folds out and locks almost as good as the metal implements. I little tweak to the model will hopefully make it fully solid.
The 1/4" wrench actually works in only one direction, it is sort of ratcheting. I also did a torque test on my earlier steel prototype and the 1/4" opening on it was extremely strong, i may test it to full distruction at some point)
The mock up also helped me realize that I have some space I am wasting due to the springs on each side. So I altered the profile to be a total of 1.3mm wider, every bit helps with an object this small.
Finally, I modified the real hex profile to have a better fit, and ensure the end of the bit wouldn't grind against the chicago screw.
I ordered the bit holder in steel, along with a few other projects I am working on. (Rebar holster)
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 04, 2019, 04:24:16 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/IakyYfY.jpg?2)
(https://i.imgur.com/G0XVVZA.jpg?2)
(https://i.imgur.com/Z71vQ5H.png)
I 3D printed a mockup of the bit holder in plastic. I shrunk the 3D model by 3% to emulate the shrinkage that the sintered steel will have.
The plastic mock-up isn't strong enough to actually use, but it lets me get an idea of the general use.
The mockup showed that I am damn close on the latching profile. The tool folds out and locks almost as good as the metal implements. I little tweak to the model will hopefully make it fully solid.
The 1/4" wrench actually works in only one direction, it is sort of ratcheting. I also did a torque test on my earlier steel prototype and the 1/4" opening on it was extremely strong, i may test it to full distruction at some point)
The mock up also helped me realize that I have some space I am wasting due to the springs on each side. So I altered the profile to be a total of 1.3mm wider, every bit helps with an object this small.
Finally, I modified the real hex profile to have a better fit, and ensure the end of the bit wouldn't grind against the chicago screw.
I ordered the bit holder in steel, along with a few other projects I am working on. (Rebar holster)
Amazing Work, but honestly I would have removed the tools from the other sided and kept the Philips and pry bar. The 4mm bits really cant apply the torque of those two tools. I'd much rather give up the less robust tools that have questionable strength than the ones I can depend on. but to each their own on this.
I can't wait to see how this thing looks at the end.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on June 04, 2019, 08:51:36 AM
@ZapWizard, mind telling us which 3D printer/ plastic (ABS?) you're using? Looks like some neat printing :tu:
Post by: ZapWizard on June 04, 2019, 02:40:21 PM
mind telling us which 3D printer/ plastic (ABS?) you're using?
The mockup was printed on a Ultmaker 2, 0.4mm nozzle, 0.12mm layers, PLA plastic. It makes very clean prints most of the time. It took about fifteen minutes to dig out all the support material from the internal holes, one of the bad things about FDM printers.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on June 04, 2019, 06:13:46 PM
Post by: jorritvS on June 07, 2019, 12:41:01 PM
I like the design of the bottle opener/ bit driver a lot too. But I can't help to think about an idea that might improve it.
At the moment you can us the standard 1/4 inch at the bottle opener position and the 4mm while closed, while open and from the side. My idea is to replace one of those. I don't know if it is possible but maybe you could replace the 4mm hole from the side with a hole that fits the flat leatherman bits. And therefor make the tool accept the 3 I think most used sizes. Again I don't know if it is possible in ways of strength and space but should it be possible I think it can be a real improvement.
I hope I didn't disrespect you in any way. That is not my intention at all.
Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk
Post by: ZapWizard on June 07, 2019, 04:25:14 PM
At the moment you can us the standard 1/4 inch at the bottle opener position and the 4mm while closed, while open and from the side. My idea is to replace one of those. I don't know if it is possible but maybe you could replace the 4mm hole from the side with a hole that fits the flat leatherman bits. And therefor make the tool accept the 3 I think most used sizes. Again I don't know if it is possible in ways of strength and space but should it be possible I think it can be a real improvement.
(https://i.imgur.com/FxdQUeH.jpg)
I could fit a Leatherman bit holder into that space. Mabye even a combination 4mm, flat bit opening. However, someone who picked up a Free P4 without every owning any other Leatherman won't have any bits, or even necessarily know the flat bits exist. I owned a wave for years before I even knew they sold other bits, I just figured I got Phillips and Flathead. Also, the flat bits can be turned in the 1/4" opening. But it isn't ideal, they lock in one direction, and let go easily in the other.
Input and ideas isn't disrespectful at all. This is a two way street, otherwise I would just post to YouTube and ignore all comments.
Post by: jorritvS on June 07, 2019, 04:32:08 PM
The good thing about the flat bits is that they are easy to carry and offer a lot of possibilities.
I understand that not everyone has the leatherman set. But adding the possibility to use can never hurt.
I think a lot of people on the forum have a set for one of the many tools they are designed for. And otherwise can be a good expansion.
But maybe I'm the only one who would like it.
Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 07, 2019, 07:01:24 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/FxdQUeH.jpg)
I could fit a Leatherman bit holder into that space. Mabye even a combination 4mm, flat bit opening. However, someone who picked up a Free P4 without every owning any other Leatherman won't have any bits, or even necessarily know the flat bits exist. I owned a wave for years before I even knew they sold other bits, I just figured I got Phillips and Flathead. Also, the flat bits can be turned in the 1/4" opening. But it isn't ideal, they lock in one direction, and let go easily in the other.
Input and ideas isn't disrespectful at all. This is a two way street, otherwise I would just post to YouTube and ignore all comments.
I think you are really on to something, a Leatherman flat bit slot would actually be better (unless the hole works for both). Using the bit extender would prevent the bits from going straight through. This would let you put a lot more force on a screw. The more I think about it...just go with the Leatherman bits over the 4mm, it will make the slot a lot stronger, and give u access to ALL of the drivers at once. Amazing idea. This basically gives everyone something. I think the Leatherman extender makes that slot so much more usable than if it was 4mm, especially since there are already two 4mm bit insertion points.
Post by: ZapWizard on June 14, 2019, 06:06:39 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/bGdhUNR.jpg)
(https://youtu.be/RrU_kSBGWFc)
https://youtu.be/RrU_kSBGWFc
Today I received the production bit holder, and it is beautiful.
Other than having to ream out the holes a tiny bit, it is perfectly ready to install. (See video) All the bit openings are just right, and the locking action is solid.
I have to think about if I will even add the flat bit driver opening since most people won't have them anyways. I am a bit superstitious about changing a model once something works.
The magnets are strong enough to hold the bit and it won't come out when flicking the holder out, but it isn't as strong as some screwdrivers. If you want it stronger, you can try drilling the 1mm separation to be thinner.
Please help me spread the word on placed like /r/Leatherman, we can show them the product can be improved.
Post by: jorritvS on June 14, 2019, 10:01:23 AM
You definitely should have worked for Leatherman during the design process. It looks better/works better/gives more options then the setup they used. We'll done zapwizard!
Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk
Post by: Poncho65 on June 14, 2019, 12:22:51 PM
Post by: Wspeed on June 14, 2019, 12:47:35 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on June 14, 2019, 04:25:01 PM
Post by: comis on June 14, 2019, 04:43:37 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on June 14, 2019, 04:46:40 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/Tisr1sG.jpg?1)
The bottle opener works.
--------------------------------------------
(https://i.imgur.com/jMm0Af2.jpg?1)
The 4mm bit driver handles plenty of torque. The tool body started to bend when I reached 14 in-lbs (1.6 Nm)
--------------------------------------------
(https://i.imgur.com/LxMkN1h.jpg)
The 1/4" wrench handled more than 30 in-lbs (3.4 Nm).
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on June 14, 2019, 04:51:09 PM
Could I perhaps ask you to consider adding the LM 2D bit slot all the same? Or maybe an alternate model that has this instead of the transversal 4mm hex? I for one have the LM bits, and they make for a reasonably compact carry in the bit card. I'm sure I'm not the only potential buyer that could benefit.
Post by: Poncho65 on June 14, 2019, 05:08:46 PM
Post by: Wspeed on June 14, 2019, 06:06:40 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on June 14, 2019, 07:56:48 PM
Could I perhaps ask you to consider adding the LM 2D bit slot all the same? Or maybe an alternate model that has this instead of the transversal 4mm hex?
It would need to be an alternate model. I tried a few things today in CAD, but it works out to be too thin in critical places if I try to mix both together. I also realized I don't need a mixed horizontal opening, as the 1/4" wrench works well on the flat bits.
I did update the magnet stop to be smaller, this is live on the shop now. I have another batch of things to order, so I will get a new build, this time in a different finish. (The 24K gold plating is pretty, but it flakes off too easy for a tool)
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on June 14, 2019, 10:07:32 PM
It would need to be an alternate model. I tried a few things today in CAD, but it works out to be too thin in critical places if I try to mix both together. I also realized I don't need a mixed horizontal opening, as the 1/4" wrench works well on the flat bits.
I did update the magnet stop to be smaller, this is live on the shop now. I have another batch of things to order, so I will get a new build, this time in a different finish. (The 24K gold plating is pretty, but it flakes off too easy for a tool)
If that's the case, then so much the better. Looking forward to v1.0 :drool: :like:
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 15, 2019, 12:57:40 AM
Cheers,
H.G.
Post by: ZapWizard on June 20, 2019, 06:23:45 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/JyOOQqq.jpg)
Just dropping this here for anyone interested: A person on Reddit asked if they could re-arrange the stack up to ditch the Philips, ruler and can opener. But keep the package opener. Yes it is possible, and doesn't require any extra parts. Just double stack on of the existing washers. You can alternatively keep the Philips instead.
(https://i.imgur.com/ag452HW.jpg)
And here is a dimension ed image showing the stack up for anyone who wants to swap stuff around. As long as your left/right stacks add up to 0.52 inches you can do whatever you want.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 21, 2019, 12:23:02 AM
I should receive my bronze Rev 2 model in the mail in the next few days. I will post images for those interested in that finish. If I didn't already mention it, the gold plating flakes off in areas of contact.
(https://i.imgur.com/JyOOQqq.jpg)
Just dropping this here for anyone interested: A person on Reddit asked if they could re-arrange the stack up to ditch the Philips, ruler and can opener. But keep the package opener. Yes it is possible, and doesn't require any extra parts. Just double stack on of the existing washers. You can alternatively keep the Philips instead.
(https://i.imgur.com/ag452HW.jpg)
And here is a dimension ed image showing the stack up for anyone who wants to swap stuff around. As long as your left/right stacks add up to 0.52 inches you can do whatever you want.
Man, I wish you were in Philly. So many ideas to explore with your skill set, amazing job. This looks awesome! I also think that tool arrangement makes a ton of sense. It would be a shame to lose an awl, file, or the prybar/box cutter.
Post by: SirVicaLot on June 21, 2019, 02:02:29 AM
Hey LM, see what you can do with the p series :pok: That’s what we want, darn it :twak:
Now even I consider buying a P4...once the price drops :D
Post by: ZapWizard on June 25, 2019, 05:58:01 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/1kmXCnO.jpg)
The bronze steel part arrived. This is Rev 2 (And the version anyone who ordered is getting). This one requires less reaming out, and no hammering like you see in the video. The magnets also has a closer to the bit for a better hold on the bit.
Post by: Poncho65 on June 25, 2019, 11:56:24 AM
Post by: ZapWizard on June 25, 2019, 04:47:00 PM
The magnets are now looser inside, so they can fall back towards the hinge, and stick there. Making the bit holding power weaker.
I had to take mine apart and apply some super-glue and push the magnets back to their position behind the bit.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 26, 2019, 08:05:47 PM
Just an FYI for folks who purchased the bit holder:Doesn't seem like major issue but good info.
The magnets are now looser inside, so they can fall back towards the hinge, and stick there. Making the bit holding power weaker.
I had to take mine apart and apply some super-glue and push the magnets back to their position behind the bit.
Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk
Post by: Poncho65 on June 27, 2019, 12:28:01 PM
Doesn't seem like major issue but good info.
Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk
:iagree: :salute:
Post by: Slygrin on June 29, 2019, 07:07:15 PM
(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-htKGFdg/0/86d8bd6d/S/i-htKGFdg-S.jpg)
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 29, 2019, 07:11:31 PM
Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk
Post by: ZapWizard on June 29, 2019, 08:16:41 PM
Got my thumb taps and holster. Very nice. I got the small holster and it works good, but it's pretty snug on my belt.
Hey! That looks great. Belt sizes are a very tricky things. I had to just settle on a few military/government standards and hope from there.
Love it, any chance of a horizontal holster version?
So this has been requested a few times on both the FREE and other holsters. So far I have just told people to purchase the TekLok version which allows for 45 degree and horizontal carry. (But with the added bulk of the TekLok clip).
It's not as straightforward as just hanging like normal. It is much harder to design a 90 degree carry unless it is very specific to your belt size. Making to too wide can make it so the tool tugs on your sideways, as the center of gravity isn't below your belt.
I could try designing a lower profile 90 degree carry. Something that doesn't hang down three inches, but perhaps down enough to keep the center of gravity below the middle of the belt.
And finally the other thing I can think of is that the tool is straight, you belt would have a small amount of curve. So any 90 degree carry would have to try to allow for that.
Post by: Slygrin on June 29, 2019, 08:28:29 PM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on June 30, 2019, 08:03:42 PM
Hey! That looks great. Belt sizes are a very tricky things. I had to just settle on a few military/government standards and hope from there.
So this has been requested a few times on both the FREE and other holsters. So far I have just told people to purchase the TekLok version which allows for 45 degree and horizontal carry. (But with the added bulk of the TekLok clip).
It's not as straightforward as just hanging like normal. It is much harder to design a 90 degree carry unless it is very specific to your belt size. Making to too wide can make it so the tool tugs on your sideways, as the center of gravity isn't below your belt.
I could try designing a lower profile 90 degree carry. Something that doesn't hang down three inches, but perhaps down enough to keep the center of gravity below the middle of the belt.
And finally the other thing I can think of is that the tool is straight, you belt would have a small amount of curve. So any 90 degree carry would have to try to allow for that.
Awl good points. I'd say probably not worth time spent for a niche market. Been using the Readyman belt Sleave and am a little spoiled from how flush MTs sit in it.
Cheers,
HG
Post by: Slygrin on June 30, 2019, 11:57:17 PM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on July 01, 2019, 03:23:26 AM
My bit holder has been shipped! I have some 4mm bits coming too. I'm just wondering if anyone has any good ideas for carrying the bits? I have a small zipper case that I was planning on using, but curious what other options folks are using.
Carry mine in a mini Altoids tin
Post by: aussieman on July 01, 2019, 11:50:34 AM
Thanks for the side view, I was wondering if I were to trim down the holster like this would it still work fine? (Assuming i always put the tool in locks downwards)
Secondly if I get the thumb tabs does it still fit in the holster blades inwards? (blades facing my body)
Post by: ZapWizard on July 01, 2019, 04:54:48 PM
My P4 and P2 have finally arrived, deciding on which...
Thanks for the side view, I was wondering if I were to trim down the holster like this would it still work fine? (Assuming i always put the tool in locks downwards)
Secondly if I get the thumb tabs does it still fit in the holster blades inwards? (blades facing my body)
(https://i.imgur.com/8j2jXaB.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/H7JeoSS.jpg)
Yes, the bottom locks would work fine with that portion removed. See the design above. Since this is for the metal clip, I also added a small ramp to the back that guides the belt into the clip opening.
If you like the design, I can upload it for ordering and provide you a special link to this model.
Yes, the thumb-tabs work facing inwards on the FREE P4 holster, they were designed to fit together.
Post by: aussieman on July 01, 2019, 05:31:43 PM
Let’s do this. I’m ordering.
The very last thing I would ask is a side extension loop to clip a flashlight to. Is that asking too much?
I’m already ecstatic with the last post. You sir are a legend.
Post by: ZapWizard on July 01, 2019, 05:54:17 PM
Ok I have tried to remain calm. But having a talented designer do customer specific mods is like being pampered in heaven.
Let’s do this. I’m ordering.
The very last thing I would ask is a side extension loop to clip a flashlight to. Is that asking too much?
I’m already ecstatic with the last post. You sir are a legend.
(https://i.imgur.com/OhKnJPE.jpg?1)
(https://i.imgur.com/omFrsmx.png)
To hold any flashlight well, I need measurements of the flashlight. A generic loop won't do.
I usually say no to added flashlight addons. The only one I have said yes to was for a customer who provided me very exacting measurements. (He hasn't said how well it worked yet)
I also tried this for my own flashlight, and found I just liked it separately hung next to my multi-tool on its own loop.
(https://www.shapeways.com/product/M2V4F376E/holster-for-olight-i3s-eos-flashlight-mark-3?optionId=63398078) When the two are combined I didn't like how the light offset the center of gravity. I even had a version at one point that had my flashlight on one side, and a Squirt P4 (wire strippers) on the other. It turned out to be very bulky.
Post by: aussieman on July 01, 2019, 06:03:48 PM
Let’s just order their amazing cut down version above. In black. Send me the link.
Bedtime in Oz,,;
Post by: ZapWizard on July 01, 2019, 06:14:49 PM
Let’s just order their amazing cut down version above. In black. Send me the link.
Here is the purchase page. (https://www.shapeways.com/product/HLHE8NHNG/holster-free-p4-mid-mount-metal-clip-cropped) I made it available to anyone who wants it.
(I believe store linking is allowed during July)
Post by: Wessaen on July 02, 2019, 03:09:26 AM
(Sorry if this was asked before.)
-Wes.
Post by: ZapWizard on July 02, 2019, 03:30:23 AM
Any chance you will be designing thumb tabs for the T2/T4? :gimme:
(https://i.imgur.com/5upKAOa.jpg?1)
Someone on Shapeways asked this morning. Here is what I told him:
At $60 the T4 is too expensive to purchase just to validate a design.
If you have access to some calipers, and can measure the opening in the blade, as well as the blade thickness, then I can alter my FREE P5 Thumb tab design to fit.
If the dimensions of the opening work out to: 17.2mm x 3.23mm then the existing Free P4 thumb tabs would fit.
The tab fits a blades 0.10" (2.54mm) thick (Main and Serrated). or 0.07" (1.8mm) thick (Saw)
He was going to measure his, but if you have calipers can can provide the info all the better.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on July 02, 2019, 04:59:50 AM
Post by: aussieman on July 02, 2019, 06:25:31 AM
Here is the purchase page. (https://www.shapeways.com/product/HLHE8NHNG/holster-free-p4-mid-mount-metal-clip-cropped) I made it available to anyone who wants it.
(I believe store linking is allowed during July)
Ordered. :drool: What a spectacular service. I was going to trim it myself and less than 24hrs later I have a custom designed one ordered. Just wow.
Love the ramp you just added, my clips arrived and I was doing a mockup with magnets and that ramp will be a great usability addition.
I love this cut down version because the amount of repositioning my fingers need while pulling it out and going for the main blade is minimal. I can have a better grip on the tool while extracting it, which is good because I am one klutzy koala.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on July 02, 2019, 04:32:54 PM
Ordered. :drool: What a spectacular service. I was going to trim it myself and less than 24hrs later I have a custom designed one ordered. Just wow.
Love the ramp you just added, my clips arrived and I was doing a mockup with magnets and that ramp will be a great usability addition.
I love this cut down version because the amount of repositioning my fingers need while pulling it out and going for the main blade is minimal. I can have a better grip on the tool while extracting it, which is good because I am one klutzy koala.
You just experienced the true future of manufacturing. This is why I am kicking myself that I didn't get a 3D design degree.
Post by: aussieman on July 02, 2019, 05:18:41 PM
You just experienced the true future of manufacturing. This is why I am kicking myself that I didn't get a 3D design degree.
Amen. It’s one thing to imagine it. It’s another to experience it. Zapwizard is spoiling us.
Post by: ZapWizard on July 02, 2019, 05:42:32 PM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on July 03, 2019, 02:46:02 AM
That is the goal behind true on-demand manufacturing. Shapeways is great for this, however it is still frustrating as I now have a dozen different versions of the wave holster, but their website restricts me to five "Sizes" per page instead of letting make as many as I want.
Bastages... :rant: :rant:
Do you think there is any way to create a T-shank exchanger for the P4? That is literally the golden ticket, but I am not sure there is enough space.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on July 03, 2019, 08:20:17 AM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on July 03, 2019, 03:53:32 PM
:iagree: Now THAT is another great idea... space may be an issue though... as I recall the older Surge T-shank holder/file/saw blade exchanger without the extra spring is 3.1 mm thick. One might get away with using the principle applied to the thinner ST300EOD T-shank holder. Where's my calipers?
I just had an epifany. Rather than set it up to fit into the blade slot, why not make it fit in the middle like Zap's bit exchanger? You could reduce the thickness by the width of the file or awl and still be able to fit a two piece exchanger setup. Yes, you would have to carry the t shanks separately, but it would be worth it imo. That means theoretically u can use Zap's exchanger on one side for drivers, and on the other have a t shank exchanger that can fit Leatherman's surge file/saw kit + one thinner tool such as the awl. Having this other option would give ppl a different setup that could contain the original philips and flat drivers if wanted.
Post by: ZapWizard on July 03, 2019, 06:13:14 PM
There is 12mm between the folded-in scissors, and the spacer on the pliers. That spacer is 3.0mm thick.
I was curious if some tool could be added to replace the spacer, my thought was a lanyard loop, but maybe a T-Shank holder could be squeezed in there, but 12mm may not be enough space.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on July 03, 2019, 10:13:56 PM
If you look at the scissors on the P4, they are shorter than they need to be. (Leatherman could have put in Surge sized scissors)
There is 12mm between the folded-in scissors, and the spacer on the pliers. That spacer is 3.0mm thick.
I was curious if some tool could be added to replace the spacer, my thought was a lanyard loop, but maybe a T-Shank holder could be squeezed in there, but 12mm may not be enough space.
12mm width is definitely too small unless you are some master engineering wizard :think:.....oh wait. :woohoo: :woohoo:
However, I would still consider a t-shank exchanger as part of the middle tools.
Post by: Slygrin on July 04, 2019, 04:31:38 AM
(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-8vTzh2f/0/8df5f044/S/i-8vTzh2f-S.jpg)
Post by: Sam Lim on July 04, 2019, 04:46:46 AM
Post by: eymantia on July 04, 2019, 07:51:35 AM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on July 04, 2019, 03:15:27 PM
Hey Zapwizard. Your work is amazing here. :salute: A little suggestion since you are going ahead with the 4mm bits. Perhaps you could consider 3D printing a stack/sleeve/storage similar to the LM 2D bit holders to hold a row of 4mm bits? I think it's pretty sweet.
Hell yes! I would love to not carry 4mm bits in an Altoids tin
Btw I love how the driver and the blade
tabs are similar in color.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on July 04, 2019, 03:28:03 PM
Hey Zap, love the work here. I would be interested in a straight Leatherman bit driver (as someone who has invested in the set, not in 4mm bits) without the bottle opener, as every damn thing in the EDC world has one at this point. I'm thinking just a solid version of your first design. If you could make one, it would be the last thing to finally convince me to buy a P-series tool.
He decided against it for good reason. By using 4mm bits he eliminates liability issues. The bottle opener is a "free" tool. Also the bottle opener can be used to grab standard 1/4 inch hex bits. Really clever function of it imo. Check the third page to see how the opener can hold standard hex bits.
Post by: eymantia on July 04, 2019, 07:05:27 PM
He decided against it for good reason. By using 4mm bits he eliminates liability issues. The bottle opener is a "free" tool. Also the bottle opener can be used to grab standard 1/4 inch hex bits. Really clever function of it imo. Check the third page to see how the opener can hold standard hex bits.
I’m aware of the function of the bottle opener, but it wasn’t exactly a “free tool.” IIRC it interferes with the ability to hold the bits properly.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: ZapWizard on July 04, 2019, 07:46:32 PM
Post by: SteveC on July 04, 2019, 08:43:14 PM
He decided against it for good reason. By using 4mm bits he eliminates liability issues. The bottle opener is a "free" tool. Also the bottle opener can be used to grab standard 1/4 inch hex bits. Really clever function of it imo. Check the third page to see how the opener can hold standard hex bits.
I have had at least a dozen requests for a Leatherman flat bit version. I think I can go ahead and make it now that I know the shrinkage amount and got the locking portion to work correctly. But alas I will be offline for most of this month, so it will have to wait until later.
:like:
See, better to let the man answer himself ;)
Post by: Happy Gilmore on July 04, 2019, 11:25:06 PM
:like:
See, better to let the man answer himself ;)
:facepalm: :facepalm:
True story..never doubt the wizard.
:cheers: HG
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on July 05, 2019, 08:26:42 AM
I have had at least a dozen requests for a Leatherman flat bit version. I think I can go ahead and make it now that I know the shrinkage amount and got the locking portion to work correctly. But alas I will be offline for most of this month, so it will have to wait until later.
:drool: :popcorn: :drool: :popcorn: :drool: :popcorn: :drool: :popcorn: :drool: :popcorn: :drool: :popcorn: :drool: :popcorn: :drool: :popcorn: :gimme:
Post by: vadsoom on July 07, 2019, 01:08:01 AM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on July 08, 2019, 05:54:52 PM
Post by: Michael Callahan on July 09, 2019, 02:56:28 AM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on July 19, 2019, 01:47:38 PM
Post by: gadgetman7 on July 19, 2019, 03:00:10 PM
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Sidewinder on August 07, 2019, 07:52:05 AM
Already ordered a holster for my Charge TTi (open clip version). Can not wait anymore :mail:
Thank you for your outstanding engineering performance :hatsoff:.
Greetings from Austria
Post by: ZapWizard on August 07, 2019, 03:45:41 PM
Zap, do you think there is a way to make a t shank exchanger in the scissor slot? That would sell me on the P2 with both your add-ons right now.I don't think I could do that with 3D printing, it would require both milling and sheet metal parts.
Already ordered a holster for my Charge TTi (open clip version). Can not wait anymore :mail:Thanks.
Thank you for your outstanding engineering performance :hatsoff:.
I am going to be working on the Leatherman Flat bit soon. I am getting lots of requests for it from YouTube and email.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on August 07, 2019, 07:27:22 PM
I don't think I could do that with 3D printing, it would require both milling and sheet metal parts.
Thanks.
I am going to be working on the Leatherman Flat bit soon. I am getting lots of requests for it from YouTube and email.
thats great news! :clap: :clap: :2tu: :2tu:
Post by: ZapWizard on September 03, 2019, 07:47:36 AM
Howdy folks. I have been working on other projects, as well as getting my eyes lasered. I recently got back to working on my tool designs.
Due to popular demand: I ordered a Leatherman FREE P2. I have to say, I don't think the P2 is a good option compared to the P4, only because it isn't that much thinner or lighter. Holding them side by side, you will see the P2 actually had the front scales tilted towards the middle, making it thicker than it appears. It is only a few millimeters thinner than the P4. Both are expensive, so I understand perhaps saving a few bucks to get the P2.
However, folks will still get the P2 and need a holster for it. My design is now complete, and just need to order the prototype in the next week or so. It is very similar to the FREE P4 holster. The only real difference is that you can't put it in four different ways, just two. The tilted front scales prevent flipping it around.
--------------------------
(https://i.imgur.com/ccuaCDX.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/07g4le8.jpg)
I also finally came up with design I like for the Leatherman Flat Bit Holder. The design ditched the magnets, as they just don't work well with the Leatherman double sided bits. Instead I have two arms that will grip the small detents on the side of the bits.
To ensure it can handle lots of torque, the sides wrap around the front to keep this as stiff as possible. Another awesome thing you can do with 3D printing that is impossible using other production methods. It does mean that it will have issues with recessed screws, but that is what the Leatherman Bit Extender is for.
--------------------------
(https://i.imgur.com/fa2qw3x.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/HFHMgaG.jpg)
As with the prototype, it folds into the tool with the bit at an angle, but deploys straight.
It will also have a 1/4" horizontal opening, but no bottle opener.
I would love your folks feedback while I work on a few other designs. Also coming soon: FREE series holsters with 4mm and Flat bit holders on the back side. The SuperTool 300 holster design.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on September 03, 2019, 11:29:32 AM
Just one smaller concern, it seems that there is not a lot that holds the back end of the inserted bit in place against torque and bending apart from the inner side walls (only restrictive sideways, not up/down), so all that holds the bit in particular against torque and up/down bending is the front, curved part of the bit holder. I realise this is probably due in part to the design of the springs, but perhaps one could still add some faces inside that hold the LM-profiled (if that makes sense) part of the back end of the bits? For this, you might need to decrease the spacing between the spring arms and the adjacent fixed faces, but it would be worth it. Or alternatively execute each spring as a bifurcated loop surrounding a central, comparatively rigid hollow holding profile, where the apex of the loop engages the bit's indent (hope this is clear :think:).
Edited for clarification (hopefully)
Post by: ZapWizard on September 03, 2019, 03:48:51 PM
Right now any torque in that direction would push up against the inside surface of the spring, since it would hit the middle of the spring, there would be lots more force here, and the springs wouldn't move much.
The spring arms need to be as long as possible simply due to the fact that the material is quite stiff, as well as to discourage cracking over time. Springs like this are always a bit tricky, I have to prototype the part in the actual material, and then test the feel to ensure they aren't too tight or too loose. With the goal of holding the bit, but allowing it to be removed by just your fingers.
After looking at the cutaway, with non-1am eyes, I realized that since I removed the magnets I have more space behind the bit. I can actually move the entire bit backwards a bit, this would allow the front flat-hex opening to become deeper.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on September 03, 2019, 05:53:36 PM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on September 03, 2019, 11:08:20 PM
Hmm I wonder if this works on a T2...
Post by: Archiver2013 on September 05, 2019, 07:10:51 AM
Post by: ZapWizard on September 05, 2019, 04:48:01 PM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on September 05, 2019, 09:18:40 PM
Looking forward to this (despite my misgivings, which I'll admit may be entirely unfounded :hatsoff:).
Post by: Toolslinger on September 07, 2019, 04:43:19 PM
Looking forward to seeing what you do with the ST300 sheath. I have one in need of an upgrade.
Will you be making it with the LM flat bit holders on the back as well? Mine is modded with a bit driver and I'd love to be able to carry the bits integrated into the sheath.
Post by: ZapWizard on September 07, 2019, 06:10:22 PM
Will you be making it with the LM flat bit holders on the back as well? Mine is modded with a bit driver and I'd love to be able to carry the bits integrated into the sheath.
I will be making the FREE P2 and P4 holsters with bit holder, but not for the SuperTool 300 as it just isn't popularly modded. However, once I release it, you can message me and I can do a custom one-off version.
Post by: ZapWizard on September 19, 2019, 02:58:40 AM
Hey folks, I made a video just for you.
The Flat Bit Driver will work, it just needs some prototyping to get it to turn out accurate from the factory. I had to use a diamond bit on a dremel, and lots of filing to bring the dimensions in line. For some reason this part shrunk more than the hex cutout I put into the 4mm Bit driver.
I also have the prototype for the Leatherman FREE P2, and tested the open clip for myself.
Finally, not in the video: I have completed my designs for the SuperTool 300, and FREE P2 and P4 holsters with bit holders on the back. Adding those bits created 24 new unique configurations!
I will be ordering prototypes of those, along with a tweaked bit driver soon.
(https://i.imgur.com/BIXNzEJ.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/iSarR02.jpg)
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 19, 2019, 03:01:34 AM
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on September 19, 2019, 02:23:14 PM
The question is just whether I should put this into my early P4 with unstamped handles (the absence of time stamps might make these rare-ish?), or invest in a newer one...
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on September 19, 2019, 02:26:42 PM
I will be making the FREE P2 and P4 holsters with bit holder, but not for the SuperTool 300 as it just isn't popularly modded. However, once I release it, you can message me and I can do a custom one-off version.That would interest me too...
The cherry on the topping would be a holster with added space for not only the bit driver and bits, but in addition the Surge type exhangeable saw or file blade (provision for which I have modded into my ST300VX) :D >:D
Post by: ZapWizard on September 27, 2019, 07:07:13 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/WRinB3g.jpg)
Dislaimer: No promises that this will end up working.
You know what the FREE P4 is lacking: A good diamond file, a longer file, and metal cutting blades. Let us fix that with the versatile T-Shank blade holder! :multi:
Okay, so this is something I have had on my list for a while. I have been aware of the T-Shank design that @Tofty did way back in 2013 (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,47167.msg772553.html#msg772553). In fact, his design inspired me to start trying to use 3D printed steel.
Today, a user on Shapeways messaged me asking if I was thinking of a T-Shank blade holder. He thought I could adapt the grip from a Surge, which might be possible with some grinding, but that isn't my style. This got me to head out to Home Depot and get myself some T-Shank blades, and make a detailed 3D model of one. And then spend the next six hours designing something I think may fit the bill.
-------------------------
(https://i.imgur.com/lFZTjMz.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/8GggfJL.jpg)
It will install into a FREE P4 after removing the Saw, File and Spacer Washers from one side. Note: The P2 doesn't use the thin spacers anyways, and it won't really work well with this mod.
If you cut down your blade a bit, you can even keep one in the tool at all times. My plan would be to put in the Leatherman Diamond/Metal file included with the surge. I miss the Diamond File on my wave.
-------------------------
(https://i.imgur.com/HS4zfnn.jpg)
This will be a two-part component, which makes it more expensive than the P2. (Probably around $40)
If the tolerances all work out and the fit works, the two parts will lock together using a dovetail feature. (Shapeways user's idea)
You deploy the main potion (orange) using a thumb tab. If the other portion doesn't come along, a pin actually pushes it out at the 90 degree mark. Both halves will mesh, and then be fully locked by the mechanism in the P4.
Each side as half of the T-Shank grip, allowing for quick changing of blades by only sliding away one only half.
-------------------------
(https://i.imgur.com/7GhnGec.jpg)
The biggest issue is that jig saw blades don't come in just one thickness, I bought a five pack of Bosch blades, and they have three different thickness. (1.0, 1.25 & 1.5mm). The Leatherman File and saw are the thickest at 1.78mm.
Do that end I have included a small "Spring arm" and bump. However, this material isn't terribly springy, it is more bend and stay. It works okay for the Flat bit holder. So a prototype and some testing will be needed. At worst you will end up with the same shim situation that the Surge has now.
-------------------------
I now have a big list of items to prototype and get ready for you folks.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on September 27, 2019, 10:20:00 AM
Post by: gadgetman7 on September 27, 2019, 12:00:45 PM
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: Poncho65 on September 27, 2019, 12:58:31 PM
That is just... awesome! :like: :drool: :drool:
:iagree: :o :like:
Post by: Wspeed on September 27, 2019, 01:26:11 PM
Post by: SteveC on September 27, 2019, 01:48:11 PM
Post by: Rapidray on September 27, 2019, 03:43:46 PM
Post by: ABURABURA on September 30, 2019, 03:03:32 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on October 12, 2019, 04:12:35 PM
Okay, here is a longish video exclusive for your folks showing the T-Shank holder, both before and after grinding it to fit the Leatherman blades.
Skip to 3:00 to see it holding a T-Shank, with only the dovetailing tolerances corrected.
Skip to 6:40 to see it installed in the tool, and holding a T-Shank in-tool, and modified to fit the Leatherman Blades.
Once the tolerances around the dove tail feature were corrected, it works very well on Bosh blades. The biggest issue being accommodating different blade thickness. The little ball on the end of a spring arm works, but not as a spring. This bronze/steel material isn't springy, it acts less like stainless steel, and more like mild steel in this regard. So I need to figure out a better solution for this.
The good news is that I think with some more prototyping this is a viable modification. The other major issue is making it fit Leatherman Surge blades. I think the solution there will be asking folks to grind down the Leatherman T-Shank profile to fit the Bosh profile. After I ground down the tool to hold the Leatherman blade, it was just too loose on the Bosh blades.
-----------
In other news:
I also have in hand my Free P2 second prototype holster, as well as holsters for the FREE series with both 4mm and Flat bit holders on the back. I ordered on of my FREE P4 holsters in this config to make a video, and found my current FREE P4 holster has a very tight grip on the springs, making it difficult to use, so that will need correcting. Ever time I have to make any change to the CAD file I have to export over a dozen different variants to update each unique version and it takes lots of time. I will have videos on that, and the updated Flat bit holder soon.
The ST300 holster prototype also arrived, it works okay, but isn't very snappy. So one more prototype on that also.
Post by: Wspeed on October 12, 2019, 04:43:20 PM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on October 12, 2019, 05:14:00 PM
Post by: vadsoom on October 12, 2019, 05:21:44 PM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on October 12, 2019, 05:36:21 PM
On the topic of making the Surge blades fit, would it be an option to make the shank cavity to the depth of the LM shank, with the exception of a circular nub at the position of the hole in the LM shank that locally restricts the cavity depth to the thickness of a Bosch shank *)? Maybe that is sufficient to hold both types. Possibly in combination with a spring with a larger contact area on the shank...
Just thinking :dunno:
*) Edit: maybe just one of the Bosch thicknesses... 1.25?
Post by: Matpar_McWolfie on October 14, 2019, 03:03:48 AM
Regarding the t-shank thickness issue:
Quote
On the topic of making the Surge blades fit, would it be an option to make the shank cavity to the depth of the LM shank, with the exception of a circular nub at the position of the hole in the LM shank that locally restricts the cavity depth to the thickness of a Bosch shank *)? Maybe that is sufficient to hold both types. Possibly in combination with a spring with a larger contact area on the shank...So that circular nub would go on the orange part, if you refer to Zap's post above? Would make sense to me. It would greatly reduce the thickness needed on the other side's "springy arm".
Hey Zap, on another topic, I was wondering if your blade tabs would be reversible? Let's say I'm a big goofy lefty (which I may or may not actually be), and I decided to switch the serrated and the straight blades so the latter is next to my left thumb when I hold the tool. I noticed that the hole egde is ever so sligthly sharper on one side than on the other. Would you tab fit on both sides of the blade so I can use them with my current configuration?
- The dovetail guy on Shapeways ;)
Post by: SirVicaLot on October 14, 2019, 05:38:07 AM
Post by: Huntsman on October 14, 2019, 12:22:49 PM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on October 14, 2019, 04:35:27 PM
...
Regarding the t-shank thickness issue:So that circular nub would go on the orange part, if you refer to Zap's post above? Would make sense to me. It would greatly reduce the thickness needed on the other side's "springy arm".
...
Yup, that's where it would go, thanks for prompting the clarification :tu:
Post by: ZapWizard on October 18, 2019, 05:27:05 PM
Video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYbHVKSohms
The holster for the FREE P2 is also available:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPiL9JhfnAg
And the FREE P2 and P3 bit-holder holsters are also now available. 4mm, Flat, and Flat with Bit extender options.
(https://i.imgur.com/pmZsNlA.jpg)
Finally, the holster for the ST300 is also ready
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2mSGhriP1ak
Shop link in my signature below.
Post by: Wspeed on October 18, 2019, 06:00:07 PM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on October 18, 2019, 11:25:52 PM
Post by: Outback in Idaho on October 19, 2019, 12:02:30 AM
The flat bit driver is now available to purchase.
Video:
The holster for the FREE P2 is also available:
And the FREE P2 and P3 bit-holder holsters are also now available. 4mm, Flat, and Flat with Bit extender options.
(https://i.imgur.com/pmZsNlA.jpg)
Finally, the holster for the ST300 is also ready
Shop link in my signature below.
So impressed would consider getting one of these series, along with your mods and accessories! Awesome stuff. :o
Post by: Poncho65 on October 21, 2019, 03:37:44 AM
Also welcome to :MTO: Matpar :cheers:
Post by: hbcorpse on October 23, 2019, 06:07:31 PM
Long time lurker, and just registered today!
I have been obsessing over your work, ZapWizard, since this thread was born.
The LM FlatBit system is a must-have for my needs, and I was sad to see the Free P4 did not have it. That left me torn between carrying dad’s old Wave+ and my shiny new P4...I opted for the P4 as my EDC.
Then I discovered your work, and the rest is history.
My FlatBit driver and Thumb Tabs are in processing from ShapeWays, as of last Friday! Anxiously awaiting their arrival!
I know I’m new here, but I have two burning questions that I could no longer resist asking:
1. Have you figured out the torque specs for the Chicago screw pivots that hold the small tools (and soon my ZW FlatBit driver) in place?
- Contact with LM reveals that it’s a proprietary spec, which they wouldn’t share. - I’d really like to get this tool back to factory specs when I’m done installing my mod, even though I know my warranty will be out the window.
2. Do you have any plans for a horizontal version of the holster for the P4?
- I’ll admit, I’m a big ol’ fatty. My love handles make vertical carry uncomfortable.
- I also, however, dabble in the art of leatherwork...And I’ve been mentally designing a horizontal EDC pouch for the P4, a FlatBit caddy, the FlatBit extender, and a small Craftsman ratchet.
Sorry for the short novel here. Just really excited to receive my items, and to be able to communicate with a veritable “god of mod”...and, of course, all the members here!
Also, sorry for lurking so long!
I hope I can bring some value to this forum / thread!
Post by: ZapWizard on October 23, 2019, 06:25:14 PM
Long time lurker, and just registered today!
Thanks for the compliments, and welcome. Don't worry I lurked here for years before I finally made a post.
I have a torque meter at work that I can borrow to measure the existing torque on those screws. My P4 has been taken apart, but I have only messed with one screw on my P2. So In theory, I can use the torque wrench to measure how much it takes before they tighten/loosen to see what the existing torque is. But then to repeat that you need a torque wrench anyways.
In reality you can do this just by hand like I do in my videos. You get a feel for the tension and adjust it looser/tighter.
This has been requested a few times, and I have put some thought into it. It probably would have to be done as an open loop. I may take another crack at the design soon, now that I know the open loop is stronger than I expected.
The catch is it wouldn't hold any bits, as they would be shoved up against the belt. I have been thinking of making a stand-along bit holder for the flat bits, something that could be removed from the belt and used as a handle on the extender.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on October 23, 2019, 06:47:21 PM
Thanks for the compliments, and welcome. Don't worry I lurked here for years before I finally made a post.
I have a torque meter at work that I can borrow to measure the existing torque on those screws. My P4 has been taken apart, but I have only messed with one screw on my P2. So In theory, I can use the torque wrench to measure how much it takes before they tighten/loosen to see what the existing torque is. But then to repeat that you need a torque wrench anyways.
In reality you can do this just by hand like I do in my videos. You get a feel for the tension and adjust it looser/tighter.
This has been requested a few times, and I have put some thought into it. It probably would have to be done as an open loop. I may take another crack at the design soon, now that I know the open loop is stronger than I expected.
The catch is it wouldn't hold any bits, as they would be shoved up against the belt. I have been thinking of making a stand-along bit holder for the flat bits, something that could be removed from the belt and used as a handle on the extender.
Horizontal holster would be my jam as well, your almost my singluar driving reason to consider the P4 at this point lol.
Post by: BePrepared on October 23, 2019, 07:24:45 PM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on October 24, 2019, 12:52:00 AM
I've only seen the video and not listened to it, so haven't followed the comments and I'm not sure whether you covered this:
On the topic of making the Surge blades fit, would it be an option to make the shank cavity to the depth of the LM shank, with the exception of a circular nub at the position of the hole in the LM shank that locally restricts the cavity depth to the thickness of a Bosch shank *)? Maybe that is sufficient to hold both types. Possibly in combination with a spring with a larger contact area on the shank...
Just thinking :dunno:
*) Edit: maybe just one of the Bosch thicknesses... 1.25?
Just curious whether you've had time to consider this Zap?
Post by: ZapWizard on October 24, 2019, 01:29:11 AM
Just curious whether you've had time to consider this Zap?
I guess I missed that post, sorry. There isn't enough room for multiple cutouts. However, I did work on redesigning the t-shank. The first thing I tried was multiple cutouts for multiple thicknesses, and the tolerances are just too small. (0.25mm steps). I then tried to figure out how to get a stainless steel spring into the design. Something like McMaster 9716K360 (https://www.mcmaster.com/9716K360). There was just no way to hold a off the shelf tiny spring, and I am not ready to start making custom springs.
(https://i.imgur.com/oIipgTT.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/XqlVNeL.jpg)
Here is the design I came up with, and ordered prototypes for just earlier today.
It uses a two halves, one of Steel, and the other Nylon. The steel part has the T-Shank cutout, 1mm deep on one side (Sliding side), and 2mm deep on the other side. All of the back and forth cutting torque should end up on the steel part. Some sideways torque might flex the nylon part, but it should spring right back.
(https://i.imgur.com/gvLds26.jpg)
The nylon half has a spring-loaded arm. The arm is set to hold a bit of force on a 1mm blade, but accommodate up to a 2mm blade. The spring arm is hinged on one side, and has a stop on the other side to prevent if from moving too far.
Two dove tailed areas lock the two parts together upon closing, hopefully ensuring the nylon doesn't just bend apart. I have no idea if will work until I get the prototypes.
Post by: fullbreakfast on October 24, 2019, 10:39:41 AM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on October 24, 2019, 06:15:27 PM
@ZapWizard: that looks like it should work. The spring acts to close the lower left dovetail in the pic - nice touch!
BTW, what I was suggesting was not a multiple cutout - just a single one, but with a circular nub protruding from the cutout's bottom, in size and position to fall just inside the hole in the LM T-shank, while other thinner T-shanks (Bosch et al. - these lack holes) lie on top of the nub. The nub might also be sprung, come to think of it.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on October 24, 2019, 09:38:41 PM
Edit: mine has the hole, where the Phillip's head is pointing at... :think:
Post by: ZapWizard on October 24, 2019, 10:28:56 PM
Grinding down the Leatherman to fit the Bosch is easily done, just any hand file will do it, and it is removing just about 0.1mm of material.
Post by: Matpar_McWolfie on October 24, 2019, 10:36:48 PM
That being said, I think the latest iteration of your design allows for more blade thicknesses to fit. If it works, that is one hell of an engineering prowess! Can't wait to see and buy!
Also, I was wondering if you saw that question?
Quote
Hey Zap, on another topic, I was wondering if your blade tabs would be reversible? Let's say I'm a big goofy lefty (which I may or may not actually be), and I decided to switch the serrated and the straight blades so the latter is next to my left thumb when I hold the tool. I noticed that the hole egde is ever so sligthly sharper on one side than on the other. Would you tab fit on both sides of the blade so I can use them with my current configuration?
Post by: Outback in Idaho on October 24, 2019, 11:50:34 PM
Post by: Happy Gilmore on October 25, 2019, 02:59:01 AM
I guess I missed that post, sorry. There isn't enough room for multiple cutouts. However, I did work on redesigning the t-shank. The first thing I tried was multiple cutouts for multiple thicknesses, and the tolerances are just too small. (0.25mm steps). I then tried to figure out how to get a stainless steel spring into the design. Something like McMaster 9716K360 (https://www.mcmaster.com/9716K360). There was just no way to hold a off the shelf tiny spring, and I am not ready to start making custom springs.
(https://i.imgur.com/oIipgTT.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/XqlVNeL.jpg)
Here is the design I came up with, and ordered prototypes for just earlier today.
It uses a two halves, one of Steel, and the other Nylon. The steel part has the T-Shank cutout, 1mm deep on one side (Sliding side), and 2mm deep on the other side. All of the back and forth cutting torque should end up on the steel part. Some sideways torque might flex the nylon part, but it should spring right back.
(https://i.imgur.com/gvLds26.jpg)
The nylon half has a spring-loaded arm. The arm is set to hold a bit of force on a 1mm blade, but accommodate up to a 2mm blade. The spring arm is hinged on one side, and has a stop on the other side to prevent if from moving too far.
Two dove tailed areas lock the two parts together upon closing, hopefully ensuring the nylon doesn't just bend apart. I have no idea if will work until I get the prototypes.
Seriously...we are not worthy!
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on October 30, 2019, 08:18:28 AM
Think Leatherman used t-shank blades with holes to keep them inside their newer blade exchanger using a flat spring iirc. Seems that would keep blade options fairly limited, requiring a hole. Making an exchanger that does not require the hole would keep blade options more open. Ought to break away from their standards, make an exchanger for t-shank tools without the need for holes to hold them inside. :tu:Fair enough... but my idea for the nub is that it should only be able to use the hole in the LM T-shank - whilst the normal (thinner, non-holed) T-shanks on Bosch etc. blades should not be impinged. That is to say: make the nub only as high as needed to provide in-hole support for LM blades, but not so high as to come into conflict with the thinner blades: i.e. the flat upper side of the nub supports any non-holed blades.
I just got myself another set of spare LM blades - these are holed too, seems to be standard now.
Anyway, let's see if ZapWizard's new prototype works. :popcorn:
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on October 30, 2019, 08:21:51 AM
I don't want to rely on the hole being there, since most T-Shanks don't have it. I want to accommodate as many different blades as possible. Even massage balls (https://www.amazon.com/ViiBit-Jigsaw-Massage-Adapter-Compatibility/dp/B07SMFFBHR) :dunno:
Grinding down the Leatherman to fit the Bosch is easily done, just any hand file will do it, and it is removing just about 0.1mm of material.
Fair enough, but see my previous post - the nub is not intended to interfere with thinner Bosch etc. blades and the thicker LM ones now come standard with holes...
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on November 01, 2019, 06:22:42 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on November 01, 2019, 08:06:28 PM
Also, I was wondering if you saw that question?The T-Shank will be reversible. The design is now symmetrical.
Just a question if I may ZapWizard - how thick is the blade holder going to be at the tang? Checking various options on which tools to retain. Thanks :tu:
It will be 0.17in thick at the hinge. The T-Shank holder will only be able to be installed where the saw is now located, along with removal of a single thin implement and the stacking washers. It must have a spring next to it, as I use that tiny extra bit of space to add some material. I removed the file on mine initially, but I think I am going to put that back and remove the bottle opener instead. If you instead decide to remove a 0.060" thick implement (awl or ruler), then you just keep one of the 0.01" thick spacer washers.
My 2nd order is still in production. Shapeways isn't exactly fast. Estimated ship date is Nov 19th, but they usually show up earlier.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on November 01, 2019, 10:32:46 PM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on November 02, 2019, 04:56:14 PM
(...) Shapeways isn't exactly fast. (...)
I hear you... there are a few items waiting for various deliveries to you and me both :D
Post by: Rapidray on November 02, 2019, 10:18:53 PM
I hear you... there are a few items waiting for various deliveries to you and me both :DNice carry set! :like: :cheers:
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on November 03, 2019, 11:10:03 AM
What's missing on the holster for my particular needs is a holder for one of the saw/file blades and the two long MUT bits. But I have a 3D printer and I'm toying with the idea of adding such a holder to the holster in some hopefully non-destructive manner ;) :D
Post by: Rapidray on November 03, 2019, 01:41:55 PM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on November 08, 2019, 05:59:50 PM
Box from Shapeways... :ahhh
I was wrong... the holster only holds three bits since the variant I chose for longevity's sake is the one to which one can fit a metal belt clip (which hasn't arrived yet). No great deal. The bit driver fits like a glove and works well :tu:
Thanks are due to ZapWizard for his designs :cheers:
Post by: hbcorpse on November 08, 2019, 06:34:07 PM
I have a torque meter at work that I can borrow to measure the existing torque on those screws. My P4 has been taken apart, but I have only messed with one screw on my P2. So In theory, I can use the torque wrench to measure how much it takes before they tighten/loosen to see what the existing torque is. But then to repeat that you need a torque wrench anyways.
In reality you can do this just by hand like I do in my videos. You get a feel for the tension and adjust it looser/tighter.
This has been requested a few times, and I have put some thought into it. It probably would have to be done as an open loop. I may take another crack at the design soon, now that I know the open loop is stronger than I expected.
The catch is it wouldn't hold any bits, as they would be shoved up against the belt. I have been thinking of making a stand-along bit holder for the flat bits, something that could be removed from the belt and used as a handle on the extender.
Any luck with the torque meter?
Still haven’t found time to do the install yet, but maybe I’ll take a crack at it today...at the very least, the thumb tabs are going in!
————
As for the horizontal carry...
This might be a stretch of an idea, but...
Picture the holster standing vertically:
- What if you moved the Bit Extender to the left of the main channel, which would put it “on top” of the holster, when mounted on the belt...assuming it’s mounted on someone’s right side.
- Then, take the beautifully designed Bit holder slots and put them to the right of the main channel, which would put them on the “bottom” of the holster...
Removing the Bits from the back face of the holster would provide access to them on a horizontal carry.
Post by: Rapidray on November 08, 2019, 08:59:56 PM
Meanwhile... :mail:I like that compactness :tu:
Box from Shapeways... :ahhh
I was wrong... the holster only holds three bits since the variant I chose for longevity's sake is the one to which one can fit a metal belt clip (which hasn't arrived yet). No great deal. The bit driver fits like a glove and works well :tu:
Thanks are due to ZapWizard for his designs :cheers:
Post by: Poncho65 on November 09, 2019, 02:42:03 AM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on November 09, 2019, 11:16:27 AM
The integrated bit holders are a nice feature for frequently used bits - although the number of three is a bit limited - this is down to my choice for the metal belt clip variant, other variants have 6 or 7 spaces I think. The bit extender holder works well too. The whole thing seems quite solid, but I won't know to which extent until after I start to wear it.
Final verdict on wearability once the belt clip arrives (taking the slow boat from China, it seems).
I have thought of adding some extra holders for saw/file blades and long MUT bits, but can't seem to find anything that integrates well with the holster design while avoiding a haphazard DIY look and thus detracting from its otherwise professional look - also on balance I think I may need to carry at least one LM bit card for flexibility. I'll probably end up assembling some kit in a small extra holster or pouch.
Post by: Poncho65 on November 09, 2019, 12:03:41 PM
:nanadance: :nanadance:
Post by: ZapWizard on November 10, 2019, 10:10:03 PM
Box from Shapeways...Your kit looks great.
Any luck with the torque meter?I don't think the torque meter will help, it is easy to just tweak it until the tools move properly. Because they used chemical thread locker, torque is less a factor in holding the screw in place.
As for the horizontal carry...
I am working on a few ideas for horizontal carry, however it won't include bit holders, as you would only end up with just a few, or an oversized holder. Most who have requested horizontal carry want less bulk above/below the belt line.
Playing around with the holster I conclude it is a very well thought out piece of kit.Thanks for your nice comments.
------------
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yLkw_2uqxo
I also got a box from Shapeways, my 2nd prototype of the T-Shank holder arrived. It shows real promise. I will cycle exchanging the blades a few dozen times to ensure the nylon will hold up, but so far it seems to be close to being ready.
I just need to tweak the profile so it closes/opens a bit better, and tweak a bit of the dimensions to make it work out of the box.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on November 10, 2019, 10:49:51 PM
How much thickness will one have to grind off from a LM shank?
Post by: ZapWizard on November 11, 2019, 06:25:56 AM
How much thickness will one have to grind off from a LM shank?
Just 0.2mm the Bosh is 2.2mm wide, the LM is 2.4mm wide. (and a bit of the actual T portion) It takes a bit of time and care, but easy enough if you test fit it as you go.
The bigger thing I messed up was cutting the file to length. I cut it a bit short, and it can move out when the pliers deploy. I will have to order another file and try with a more exact measurement, and perhaps a template to keep the cut even.
Post by: Poncho65 on November 11, 2019, 12:00:09 PM
Post by: Toolslinger on November 11, 2019, 11:01:02 PM
Really excited for the t-shank adapter. Will it fit in the slot with the scissors or just the saw side? Since I carry a SAK for scissors and openers, it would be nice to ditch the scissors on the P4 and replace with a t-shank holder for the LM file...
Post by: hbcorpse on November 19, 2019, 08:16:54 PM
Wow! What a difference!
I’ll admit there was a small hint of buyer’s remorse / regret for modifying a perfectly fine Free P4...and voiding the warranty...not to mention the analysis paralysis of wondering if it’s the right modification to make, and lose the stock pry-bar/flat head + cross head inserts...
But the more I think about it, the more I’m happy with the mod, and glad I’ll be able to utilize the Flat Bit kit that I always carry.
Thanks Zap, and all those who have contributed / driven this thread, and sparked the innovation and creation of these mods!
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on November 22, 2019, 06:26:45 PM
I have used blind rivets (4mm wide, 8mm long) with washers to fix the clip and this works well enough as well as being very stable, more so than Chicago screws probably. There is a slight binding in the more rarely used locks-up position of the P4, but there is enough flex to get the tool out anyway. I might go for Chicago screws if this ends up bothering me more than it does now. No problem in the locks-down position.
The holster carries well, I've had it on my belt for an hour and soon forgot I was carrying it :D
Post by: ZapWizard on November 22, 2019, 07:24:16 PM
Very good news about the prototype, Zap :tu: :like:Well don't count your chickens until they hatch. There are a few issues with the current T-Shank holder that I am trying to work out.
- The nylon and metal don't have the same shrink ratio. So despite having identical geometry for say opening/locking, it works perfectly on the metal, and it binding on the nylon. Also the nylon thickness expanded compared to the CAD model by 0.2mm. Small, but big enough that it is causing issues with smooth deployment.
- The nylon spring works, but ends up flexing the whole piece a bit, making smooth operation with a thick blade problematic.
- The stainless steel material used is not highly magnetic, so the T-Shank isn't staying docked as well as it should, exasperated by the low amount of contact surface to the magnet.
I am re-designing it yet again, trying to put more metal against he magnet, and working around the various thickness issues. So no promises on when it will be available.
My bit holder for the P4 and custom ST300 sheath arrived and I am super happy with how they turned out.
Really excited for the t-shank adapter. Will it fit in the slot with the scissors or just the saw side? Since I carry a SAK for scissors and openers, it would be nice to ditch the scissors on the P4 and replace with a t-shank holder for the LM file...
Glad you like the bits. I have been using my black bronze steel version a lot lately. Fixing all sorts of stuff around the house.
The current Rev 2 design would have to be where the saw is only due to the built-in thumb tab (And I need that precious amount of extra material that spots allows)
I’ll admit there was a small hint of buyer’s remorse / regret for modifying a perfectly fine Free P4...and voiding the warranty...You can probably re-assemble it back to stock if you ever needed a repair if another implement broke.
The holster carries well, I've had it on my belt for an hour and soon forgot I was carrying it :D
It looks great. You can also use flat-head screws, in combination with the other half of a Chicago screw if you want something even lower profile. You can always sand down the edges of a flat-head to make it not catch/stratch on a belt.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on November 22, 2019, 07:44:10 PM
Post by: Rapidray on November 23, 2019, 02:31:40 AM
:DThat looks great! :like: :cheers:
Post by: Poncho65 on November 23, 2019, 05:07:49 AM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on November 23, 2019, 10:49:29 PM
Post by: carl on November 25, 2019, 02:01:30 AM
You kept the original file and removed the can opener.
1) I wonder if the original short file could be removed and the can opener kept on?
2) Is there a mod where the P4 can be made wider so it can accomodate the new pieces without getting rid of the original ones?
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on November 25, 2019, 09:32:16 AM
1) Can opener is .13" IIRC, file is either .07 or .06". Assuming you refer to the situation with the bit holder taking up all of the central position (between the springs) of the handle it sits in, you'd have to remove the file and something else, e.g. the ruler or awl, to make place for the can opener/Phillips in the opposite handle.
2) Unlikely... the width is dependent on the studs in the plier head that slot into the handles when opened - widening the handles to accommodate more tools requires wider plier head stud placement, i.e. a new plier head. Note these are already different between P2 and P4. There has been speculation about a possible "P6" but this has failed to materialise until now.
Hope this helps.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on November 25, 2019, 06:49:48 PM
..... I'll probably end up assembling some kit in a small extra holster or pouch.
Got me a small Skinth. Modded the bit cards a little bit to make them shorter so they fit in the Skinth's main compartment while the long bits go into the front pocket. The main compartment also hosts the saw and file blade in preparation for the eventual arrival of a T-shank blade holder. These blades will need to be shortened slightly, BTW, to fold inside the tool, I gather. There is more space for saw blades of all kinds, including diamond powder coated ones, if reasonably short or shortened to fit.
Post by: Rapidray on November 25, 2019, 07:04:42 PM
Post by: Poncho65 on November 25, 2019, 08:43:09 PM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on November 26, 2019, 06:46:14 AM
Post by: hbcorpse on November 30, 2019, 05:20:02 AM
Post by: Rapidray on November 30, 2019, 03:29:25 PM
Post by: hbcorpse on November 30, 2019, 07:00:17 PM
Had two great turkey days! :rofl:Ohhhh yeahhhhhhh!
For me, there’s nothing like a cold turkey sandwich the next day.
Plain white bread, lightly buttered with cold butter (something I picked up from my Grandpa), cold turkey slices, some cold gravy, and some cold cranberry sauce.
Hoo-wee!
Post by: schmobodia on December 07, 2019, 09:04:15 PM
I’ve been using a Charge TTi, and I think the P4 will solve my gripes. But, I use the bit extender constantly. I work in IT, so their is a lot of appeal to choose the 4mm bit adapter, but I’d really need some sort of bit extender. Has anyone used a bit extender with this setup? Ideally if it could be stored inside the P4, that would be great. If not, perhaps externally like the leatherman bit extender?
This one looks interesting: https://www.wihatools.com/system-4-extension-blade-for-micro-bits Could he cut to size.
Post by: Matpar_McWolfie on December 08, 2019, 01:34:43 AM
Regarding the "in tool" storage, I've been thinking for weeks for a way to store an extra 4mm bit in the frame since I couldn't find a double headed 4 mm bit on the web. No idea si far, so I doubt you could fit an extender in that puppy.
If anyone has any idea, I'm all ears.
Post by: Poncho65 on December 08, 2019, 05:03:09 AM
Post by: Matpar_McWolfie on December 08, 2019, 05:30:23 AM
Post by: Poncho65 on December 08, 2019, 03:16:44 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on December 08, 2019, 03:24:34 PM
Don't forget about the Leatherman bit extender (https://www.leatherman.com/bit-driver-extender-131.html), it can be combined with my flat bit holder. I now recommend the flat bit holder over the 4mm, just due to the fact that you don't need to install magnets.
I also have a holder for both the P2 and P4 that has a grip for the bit extender built-in, as Dutch_Tooler shows above.
Post by: schmobodia on December 13, 2019, 11:00:49 PM
I got a similar extender at home, waiting for the 4mm bit holder to arrive. I will test and review the setup once I have everything in hand.I may go the flat it route. However, I have an old SwissArmy knife, that was “tech” oriented, and. Has double sided 4mm bits, not sure if you could find those for yourself.
Regarding the "in tool" storage, I've been thinking for weeks for a way to store an extra 4mm bit in the frame since I couldn't find a double headed 4 mm bit on the web. No idea si far, so I doubt you could fit an extender in that puppy.
If anyone has any idea, I'm all ears.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: Matpar_McWolfie on December 18, 2019, 07:46:07 AM
The other problem I had was the fact that the bits were a bit loose in the slot. That was more of a concern but I threw the bit holder in the vice with a bit inserted and squeezed it enough to bend it. The fit is better now. I'm a bit disappointed with Shapeways's consistency in their prints but hey, this is a custom part and I managed to fix the bugs. It also works well with the extender I had laying at home, which I might shorten (the thing is so long right now, see pictures).
I installed the tabs on the straight and the serrated blade with crazy glue, leaving the saw blade as is. I hit the tabs with rub n' buff of two different colors (bronze and silver) just to give the tool some "panache". The metallic look also makes it feel like the tabs are part of the P4, rather than being an add-on. Since there is so much texture on the tabs, it took the rub n' buff so well I'd be a fool to try and remove it.
You might notice I rearranged the tools on the pictures. I switched the straight and serrated blade to better serve the clumsy lefty that I am. Also, I installed the bit holder where the phillips screwdriver and the pry tool were, but I moved the pry tool to the other side and ditched the file and the ruler.
This is now a damn fine tool. I had to send it for repair though, before the mods (obviously). The pliers were binding the minute I was squeezing them ever so slightly. They replaced it and it now works like a charm! If you have the same problem, don't wait until you break in the tool, as I did. They know it's been an issue since release, and will fix it for you in no time.
Post by: Wspeed on December 18, 2019, 01:58:24 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on December 18, 2019, 03:35:36 PM
Received my 4mm bit holder and tabs for my P4 and installed everything. Looking good, although I had some issues with the print.
Glad you were able to get the issues fixed. I have had about four folks get the 4mm with the middle hole filled, even with a special note on my build for their post-processing folks to ensure it is clear.
Tolerances are always a bitch. Some 4mm bits aren't 4mm, sometimes they bake the part a bit longer and it comes out too small. I have to error on the side of a bit too large to ensure people don't get completely unusable parts.
The flat bit holder is just simpler, so it is what I am recommending to folks, but on YouTube the 4mm has about 100x the number of views. But right now its about a 50% split on which one folks chose.
Rub and buff looks good. If you want a high chrome finish the secret is to use a Molotow Liquid Chrome Marker. They work great on the nylon.
Post by: Matpar_McWolfie on December 18, 2019, 06:18:24 PM
Glad you were able to get the issues fixed. I have had about four folks get the 4mm with the middle hole filled, even with a special note on my build for their post-processing folks to ensure it is clear.
Tolerances are always a bitch. Some 4mm bits aren't 4mm, sometimes they bake the part a bit longer and it comes out too small. I have to error on the side of a bit too large to ensure people don't get completely unusable parts.
The flat bit holder is just simpler, so it is what I am recommending to folks, but on YouTube the 4mm has about 100x the number of views. But right now its about a 50% split on which one folks chose.
Rub and buff looks good. If you want a high chrome finish the secret is to use a Molotow Liquid Chrome Marker. They work great on the nylon.
Oh yeah I heard about Molotow. Great stuff. I saw Adam Savage use the refill with an air brush on Youtube. You couldn't tell the difference with polished aluminium.
For the bit holder, the bottle opener kept me from switching to the flat bit version, although it was a close call. But I cut myself way too many times prying out a cap with a lighter and having the whole bottle neck come off completely. Also, the 4mm allows me to have tiny screwdrivers, as the one on the Charge TTI, which I used on a daily basis before buying the P4.
As for the printing issues, I can't really complain. the design is awesome, and the issues I had were in no way major. As you mentionned, 4 mm bits aren't always 4 mm. Mine are sitting at 3.95 mm, where the bit holder had a 4.2 mm opening, "pre-squeezing".
All in all, I have an awesome tool by my side at any time, thanks to you! Can't wait to see your progress on the blade holder.
Post by: Poncho65 on December 18, 2019, 06:46:54 PM
Post by: hbcorpse on December 25, 2019, 08:31:04 AM
Post by: Poncho65 on December 26, 2019, 02:35:48 AM
Post by: Rapidray on December 26, 2019, 03:35:42 AM
:like: :cheers:
Post by: JC on January 01, 2020, 08:56:42 PM
Well don't count your chickens until they hatch. There are a few issues with the current T-Shank holder that I am trying to work out.
- The nylon and metal don't have the same shrink ratio. So despite having identical geometry for say opening/locking, it works perfectly on the metal, and it binding on the nylon. Also the nylon thickness expanded compared to the CAD model by 0.2mm. Small, but big enough that it is causing issues with smooth deployment.
- The nylon spring works, but ends up flexing the whole piece a bit, making smooth operation with a thick blade problematic.
- The stainless steel material used is not highly magnetic, so the T-Shank isn't staying docked as well as it should, exasperated by the low amount of contact surface to the magnet.
I am re-designing it yet again, trying to put more metal against he magnet, and working around the various thickness issues. So no promises on when it will be available
Just wanted to say you do really impressive work and I'm really looking forward to this one. Do you think it would be possible to swap a second one in place of the serrated blade as well so that two could be carried? My thinking would be to have the removable file and a metal saw on board at all times.
Post by: ZapWizard on January 02, 2020, 05:57:39 AM
Do you think it would be possible to swap a second one in place of the serrated blade as well so that two could be carried? My thinking would be to have the removable file and a metal saw on board at all times.If you really wanted to, you might be able do to that, if you also moved around some of the other tools, but you wouldn't be able to have my flat bit holder and the t-shank holder on the same side.
----------------------------------
(https://i.imgur.com/LVGgIes.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/f4skzi9.jpg)
Ya progress finally!!! :woohoo:
I have been cracking at this damn T-Shank holder for a while now. With two physical prototypes, and probably a dozen re-designs from scratch. I tried even to do several designs using more traditional fabrication methods.
-------------
(https://i.imgur.com/tdcql92.jpg)
I am back to a 3D printed, two-half, stainless-steel bronze alloy design. Similar to Rev 1. I decided that set-screws are the way to go. They are reliable and strong. It will also allow for any thickness of blade up to 2mm.
I also figure that most folks, like myself, won't be swapping out the blades very often. I really only want my Diamond file back. I may put some other blades in a tin in the back of the car for just-in-case events.
-------------
(https://i.imgur.com/vPpSO8b.jpg)
Even though you could keep an Allen key with your spare blades; It sucks to not have the tool at hand. So I have a small hex opening at the bottom which could hold a cut-down Allen key. (I don't know if this will be viable yet)
As before: One-half has a recess for the T-Shank blade to sit in. The other half is dove-tailed. It mates in such a way that, even under the pressure of the set-screws, the two halves shouldn't easily be able to separate.
Also, that tiny eye-glass screw driver that comes with the Wave/Charge, and Leatherman Flat-bit kit is also 1.5mm Hex, so it could be stored there also.
-------------
(https://i.imgur.com/jKzvGOg.jpg)
This design also has more metal down near the magnet, (The flat area to the left of the Allen key) so it should hold better when docked.
This design would require two M3x3mm set-screws (https://www.mcmaster.com/92605a097), and an Allen key (https://www.mcmaster.com/7289a11), both are very cheap
I may offer a alternate SKU where for a few bucks extra I will ship out the parts by envelope (US only).
However, it also would not come tapped (https://www.mcmaster.com/8305a12). That would be something folks would have to do after they get the part. I might be able to offer a completed kit on Esty.
I have to study on this design for a bit before I order a prototype. I may add something to make it easier to separate the two halves.
-------------
In other news: I should have the Leatherman Surge thumb-tab, and T2/T4 Thumb-tab final prototypes arriving in the next 7-10 days.
I also had to update the Surge holster design to be compatible with the Thumb-tabs. It is actually quite a chore each time there is a design change to the holsters, as I have so many unique configurations to update and export.
Post by: Poncho65 on January 02, 2020, 12:13:44 PM
Just wanted to say you do really impressive work and I'm really looking forward to this one. Do you think it would be possible to swap a second one in place of the serrated blade as well so that two could be carried? My thinking would be to have the removable file and a metal saw on board at all times.
Welcome to :MTO: :cheers:
Post by: Poncho65 on January 02, 2020, 12:14:09 PM
Post by: Wspeed on January 02, 2020, 01:47:21 PM
Post by: Rapidray on January 02, 2020, 02:19:24 PM
Post by: JC on January 03, 2020, 02:50:51 AM
If you really wanted to, you might be able do to that, if you also moved around some of the other tools, but you wouldn't be able to have my flat bit holder and the t-shank holder on the same side.
Hmm...and two T-Shank holders on the same side wouldn't work because of the thumb notch. Would you consider offering a version that's a mirror to the final T-Shank holder design?
Welcome to :MTO: :cheers:
Thanks! :cheers:
Post by: ZapWizard on January 03, 2020, 04:27:18 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/qMuCLQg.jpg)
Why yes, I can offer a mirrored version. :cheers: Thanks for the awesome idea.
That also made me realize it can be used in the FREE P2.
The default version could replace the Saw or Scissors on the FREE P4. It can also be installed in place of the Main Blade on a FREE P2.
The alternate mirrored version could replace the Serrated or Main blade on a FREE P4, or the scissors on a FREE P2.
A bit of washer/tool swapping around may be on order for those alternate configs.
Post by: Matpar_McWolfie on January 03, 2020, 06:33:03 AM
If you really wanted to, you might be able do to that, if you also moved around some of the other tools, but you wouldn't be able to have my flat bit holder and the t-shank holder on the same side.
----------------------------------
(https://i.imgur.com/LVGgIes.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/f4skzi9.jpg)
Ya progress finally!!! :woohoo:
I have been cracking at this damn T-Shank holder for a while now. With two physical prototypes, and probably a dozen re-designs from scratch. I tried even to do several designs using more traditional fabrication methods.
-------------
(https://i.imgur.com/tdcql92.jpg)
I am back to a 3D printed, two-half, stainless-steel bronze alloy design. Similar to Rev 1. I decided that set-screws are the way to go. They are reliable and strong. It will also allow for any thickness of blade up to 2mm.
I also figure that most folks, like myself, won't be swapping out the blades very often. I really only want my Diamond file back. I may put some other blades in a tin in the back of the car for just-in-case events.
-------------
(https://i.imgur.com/vPpSO8b.jpg)
Even though you could keep an Allen key with your spare blades; It sucks to not have the tool at hand. So I have a small hex opening at the bottom which could hold a cut-down Allen key. (I don't know if this will be viable yet)
As before: One-half has a recess for the T-Shank blade to sit in. The other half is dove-tailed. It mates in such a way that, even under the pressure of the set-screws, the two halves shouldn't easily be able to separate.
Also, that tiny eye-glass screw driver that comes with the Wave/Charge, and Leatherman Flat-bit kit is also 1.5mm Hex, so it could be stored there also.
-------------
(https://i.imgur.com/jKzvGOg.jpg)
This design also has more metal down near the magnet, (The flat area to the left of the Allen key) so it should hold better when docked.
This design would require two M3x3mm set-screws (https://www.mcmaster.com/92605a097), and an Allen key (https://www.mcmaster.com/7289a11), both are very cheap
I may offer a alternate SKU where for a few bucks extra I will ship out the parts by envelope (US only).
However, it also would not come tapped (https://www.mcmaster.com/8305a12). That would be something folks would have to do after they get the part. I might be able to offer a completed kit on Esty.
I have to study on this design for a bit before I order a prototype. I may add something to make it easier to separate the two halves.
-------------
In other news: I should have the Leatherman Surge thumb-tab, and T2/T4 Thumb-tab final prototypes arriving in the next 7-10 days.
I also had to update the Surge holster design to be compatible with the Thumb-tabs. It is actually quite a chore each time there is a design change to the holsters, as I have so many unique configurations to update and export.
This is a solid design. Do you know how thick the blade holder will end up being? I noticed a different set of washers between the tool I bought and the one I received after sending it to warranty. It doesn't fit the rendering you posted with dimensions on june 20 too. So I'm trying to see what configuration I could use to keep all the tools I want while adding the blade holder.
The default version could replace the Saw or Scissors on the FREE P4. It can also be installed in place of the Main Blade on a FREE P2.
The alternate mirrored version could replace the Serrated or Main blade on a FREE P4, or the scissors on a FREE P2.
A bit of washer/tool swapping around may be on order for those alternate configs.
I think you swapped tools in your head. Straight and serrated blade are facing each other, meaning they are in different handles of the pliers. Thus, each would be replaced by either your original design or the mirrored one. Same thing for the scissors and the saw.
In other word, your original design would replace the saw or the straight blade, while the mirrored one would replace the scissors or the serrated blade. Am I right?
Post by: ZapWizard on January 03, 2020, 04:30:06 PM
Do you know how thick the blade holder will end up being? I noticed a different set of washers between the tool I bought and the one I received after sending it to warranty.
I think you swapped tools in your head.
I hope they didn't change any dimensions in production. The T-Shank holder will be 4.5mm thick. (0.177"). And designed to replace the Saw (0.07") + one 0.06" implement, One of the 0.03" washers (but adding built-in 0.02" washer), and all 3x of the 0.01" washers. For a total gap of 0.18".
You are correct about swapping the tools in my head, thanks.
Correction:
The default version can replace the Saw or Main Blade on the FREE P4. It can also be installed in place of the Main Blade on a FREE P2.
The mirrored design can replace the Serrated Blade or Scissors on a FREE P4, or the Scissors on a FREE P2.
Post by: Matpar_McWolfie on January 03, 2020, 05:56:05 PM
I hope they didn't change any dimensions in production. The T-Shank holder will be 4.5mm thick. (0.177"). And designed to replace the Saw (0.07") + one 0.06" implement, One of the 0.03" washers (but adding built-in 0.02" washer), and all 3x of the 0.01" washers. For a total gap of 0.18".
From what I measured, the tools are the same but I only got two 0,01" washers. The file, the awl, the can opener and the ruler are all in contact with each other and the "stack" is sandwiched between the washers and the springs. In any case, I might be short on space to keep everything I want.while maintaining the blade swap to have a lefty friendly tool (see my previous posts) ... either I get back to a straight blade positionned for the right thumb, or I find a way to put the scissors on the other side of the handle while still having them easily accessible (no thumb tab on the opposite side of the scissors spring). This way, I could have the straight blade on left position and the scissors on the same handle. On the other side, I'd put the saw and the blade holder (dropping the serrated blade I don't use)
Any of you guys think I could epoxy a thumb tab onto the scissors? Would it hold?
Post by: ZapWizard on January 03, 2020, 07:37:33 PM
Any of you guys think I could epoxy a thumb tab onto the scissors? Would it hold?
You can't glue anything to that little arm, it is the spring for the scissors to return. It also has a slight bend in it for tension. (Visible from the side)
Epoxy would release from the steel. The best option would be to drill one or two small holes into the space between the arm and the scale. They would need to be closer to the scale, as the spring arm actually moves into to this area when deployed.
If you tapped the holes, you could attach a small thumb tab with some set-screws My P4 thumb-tabs are too big for this, but the upcoming T2/T4 Thumb-tabs may work in that space. I can post a image of what I am thinking if you want.
Post by: JC on January 04, 2020, 04:21:48 AM
Why yes, I can offer a mirrored version. :cheers: Thanks for the awesome idea.
That also made me realize it can be used in the FREE P2.
You are most welcome.
That render looks sweet! :drool:
I noticed the two other tools on the double T-shank side appear to be file and awl. That means max tool space between two T-Shank holders is .130?
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on January 04, 2020, 10:25:52 AM
Looking forward to the test results on the prototype t shank holder :popcorn:
Post by: ZapWizard on January 04, 2020, 03:31:01 PM
I noticed the two other tools on the double T-shank side appear to be file and awl. That means max tool space between two T-Shank holders is .130?Actually 0.12", (I just made that mock-up image quickly). So you would only be able to keep the Awl, and Ruler if you wanted two T-Shanks on the same side.
I actually can't make the T-Shank any thinner, as the material has to be at least 1.2mm at the thinnest areas to be manufactured reliably.
In either case I have ordered my prototype, but it probably won't arrive for a month.
Post by: Matpar_McWolfie on January 06, 2020, 05:43:05 PM
You can't glue anything to that little arm, it is the spring for the scissors to return. It also has a slight bend in it for tension. (Visible from the side)
I don't want to glue it on the little arm. Since I want to move the scissors to the other of the same handle (see picture), that little arm, which act as a thumb pad for opening, would be facing the "interior" and no longer be accessible. That's why I'd glue a thumb pad on the other side of the tool (see picture).
Epoxy would release from the steel.
That's what I was afraid of. Metal is probably too smooth.
The best option would be to drill one or two small holes into the space between the arm and the scale. They would need to be closer to the scale, as the spring arm actually moves into to this area when deployed.
If you tapped the holes, you could attach a small thumb tab with some set-screws My P4 thumb-tabs are too big for this, but the upcoming T2/T4 Thumb-tabs may work in that space. I can post a image of what I am thinking if you want.
I'd rather not temper with the tool to the point I void the warranty.
Post by: Foozebar on January 11, 2020, 01:39:36 AM
When I found this thread I started to dig thru some older Leatherman stuff and found this.
Still works very well.
Post by: Rapidray on January 11, 2020, 03:06:51 AM
First of all. I really like your mods and will probably end up buying a lot of them. Especially looking forward to be able to use the diamond coated file with the P4.Great post and photos! :cheers:
When I found this thread I started to dig thru some older Leatherman stuff and found this.
Still works very well.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on January 11, 2020, 10:43:54 AM
Now for being able to finally lay my hands on a Universal Tool Adapter over here. Rarer than hens' teeth... ::)
Post by: Poncho65 on January 11, 2020, 12:26:02 PM
I also have found it difficult to find the Universal Adapter here in the States as well :ahhh :facepalm: Hopefully we can both find one, DT :tu:
Post by: ZapWizard on January 14, 2020, 07:21:27 AM
https://youtu.be/W7P-kN9QRkA
https://youtu.be/jNVsMlYMpAI
Howdy Folks. It is Shapeways delivery day. :woohoo:
I received the thumb tabs for the FREE T2 & T4, as well as the Surge. Both are products folks have requested here, as well as on YouTube.
I also had to order a new Surge holster as the design needed to be updated to fit the tabs.
All the parts came out great, no changes required.
I recorded a few sets of videos for these, but for some reason they both had no audio. ??? Which sucked as I super-glued the thumb tabs into place. :think:
So this forced me to put up to shut up, and actually go though the super-glue removal processes I recommend but haven't tested on these actual parts.
And then.....my video of the glue removal process was "recorded' during a time where I forgot to actually press the record button. :facepalm:
So tomorrow I will re-record that video tomorrow. The good news is the removal process worked.
Post by: Foozebar on January 14, 2020, 12:04:03 PM
Not my intent to highjack this thread, but I'm not allowed to send PM's yet.
How about an updated version of the removable bit driver..?
Here's the old one flanked by my trusty old workhorse.
A 1:st gen Surge with tools from a Core.
Such an adapter might fit all the Free models (P, T & K) and not void any warranties. :D
Post by: Rapidray on January 14, 2020, 02:12:37 PM
Nice :like:
Howdy Folks. It is Shapeways delivery day. :woohoo:
I received the thumb tabs for the FREE T2 & T4, as well as the Surge. Both are products folks have requested here, as well as on YouTube.
I also had to order a new Surge holster as the design needed to be updated to fit the tabs.
All the parts came out great, no changes required.
I recorded a few sets of videos for these, but for some reason they both had no audio. ??? Which sucked as I super-glued the thumb tabs into place. :think:
So this forced me to put up to shut up, and actually go though the super-glue removal processes I recommend but haven't tested on these actual parts.
And then.....my video of the glue removal process was "recorded' during a time where I forgot to actually press the record button. :facepalm:
So tomorrow I will re-record that video tomorrow. The good news is the removal process worked.
Post by: Rapidray on January 14, 2020, 02:14:25 PM
Hello again.Nice Surge :tu:
Not my intent to highjack this thread, but I'm not allowed to send PM's yet.
How about an updated version of the removable bit driver..?
Here's the old one flanked by my trusty old workhorse.
A 1:st gen Surge with tools from a Core.
Such an adapter might fit all the Free models (P, T & K) and not void any warranties. :D
Post by: ZapWizard on January 14, 2020, 05:20:26 PM
How about an updated version of the removable bit driver..?
Such an adapter might fit all the Free models (P, T & K) and not void any warranties. :D
This was actually my first idea for the FREE series. I even ordered that bit adapter to see if it would work on the FREE Philips driver with an easy mod or shims.
I haven't revisited the idea though, I will take another look. The catch though is that they use a spring clip or a spring-loaded ball (I forget which) as a retainer for the bits. I could use magnets to retain the bits, or some side grips like the flat bit holder.
Post by: hbcorpse on January 14, 2020, 09:41:32 PM
:iagree: :like:
Now for being able to finally lay my hands on a Universal Tool Adapter over here. Rarer than hens' teeth... ::)
Welcome to :MTO: fooze :cheers:
I also have found it difficult to find the Universal Adapter here in the States as well :ahhh :facepalm: Hopefully we can both find one, DT :tu:
I don’t mean to sound condescending, but have y’all checked eBay?
I just popped over to search “Leatherman universal tool adapter” and boom.
Lots of listings.
Some even come with a cool case, a leather holster, and even a Leatherman multitool!!!
The variety is mixed, but I’ve seen some listed with SuperTools, Waves, Rebars, Surges, etc...and some are vintage models!
Anywho...worth a shot!
Many of them seemed to be in the US, but I caught one or two that had €Euros listed as the currency...
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on January 14, 2020, 09:56:59 PM
Post by: Poncho65 on January 15, 2020, 11:52:22 AM
I don’t mean to sound condescending, but have y’all checked eBay?
I just popped over to search “Leatherman universal tool adapter” and boom.
Lots of listings.
Some even come with a cool case, a leather holster, and even a Leatherman multitool!!!
The variety is mixed, but I’ve seen some listed with SuperTools, Waves, Rebars, Surges, etc...and some are vintage models!
Anywho...worth a shot!
Many of them seemed to be in the US, but I caught one or two that had €Euros listed as the currency...
I guess I should correct my statement :whistle: I find it difficult to find one for the price I am willing or able to pay :salute: :D Lots of time they say universal and end up being the standard adapter as well :salute:
Post by: hbcorpse on January 16, 2020, 12:14:29 AM
I guess I should correct my statement :whistle: I find it difficult to find one for the price I am willing or able to pay :salute: :D Lots of time they say universal and end up being the standard adapter as well :salute:Wait...there’s a “standard” adapter, as well as a universal adapter?
I just bought one on eBay...hope it arrives.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200115/10405f0caf5e0a43589bc8931612e614.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200115/3ac4956f994348efad24063cd8a8d8eb.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200115/5180f20acc2542eef0da1b48e275f130.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200115/ec245d0b45c61d231c10aa75b87125ba.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200115/aa0d6920dc674b5c16a4bd82f2d81cf9.jpg)
I also hope, that this is the one that will fit my Free P4...as pictured above!
Post by: Rapidray on January 16, 2020, 01:15:01 AM
Your’s looks great! :cheers:
Post by: SteveC on January 16, 2020, 01:18:36 AM
Wait...there’s a “standard” adapter, as well as a universal adapter?
I just bought one on eBay...hope it arrives.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200115/10405f0caf5e0a43589bc8931612e614.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200115/3ac4956f994348efad24063cd8a8d8eb.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200115/5180f20acc2542eef0da1b48e275f130.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200115/ec245d0b45c61d231c10aa75b87125ba.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200115/aa0d6920dc674b5c16a4bd82f2d81cf9.jpg)
I also hope, that this is the one that will fit my Free P4...as pictured above!
Yours is the original adapter not the universal one.
Post by: ZapWizard on January 16, 2020, 03:14:11 AM
For the third time I recorded a video on how to remove the glued thumb tabs. This time I tested the audio with a test clip, but it still cut out after about a minute. I'll figure out why somehow.
So this is my first crack at trying to narrate, which I hate doing.
The good news is that I have validated three times over that both the acetone and heat-gun methods work at removing super-glued thumb tabs from the blades. Other than a bit of color loss on the acetone method, there is no damage to the actual thumb tabs. If you were fearful of gluing something to your precious multitool, don't worry.
Post by: Poncho65 on January 17, 2020, 04:37:46 AM
Yours is the original adapter not the universal one.
:iagree: The Universal is one that I can never find for a decent price :facepalm: but I have 2 of the Standard one :dunno: :D
Post by: hbcorpse on January 17, 2020, 06:48:09 AM
Yours is the original adapter not the universal one.
:iagree: The Universal is one that I can never find for a decent price :facepalm: but I have 2 of the Standard one :dunno: :DHang on...so what’s the difference, other than in name (obviously)...?
The Universal’s name seems self explanatory...
But what is the Standard?
That’s the one I bought?
I’m guessing it will only fit specific models?
———————————
EDIT:
Ok, I’ve done quite a bit of web-sleuthing since I posted this.
I’ve found that the one I bought on eBay is the Original/Standard.
So...that one Universal model on eBay?
Should be here in the next two weeks.
I couldn’t help myself.
I DID find a good picture of an OG adapter that someone had modified to “work” universally, but did not watch the YouTube video it came from.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200117/50c0b0bff7fbf0b02b859ca8e40fc605.jpg)
So, now, it seems I’ll have one of each.
I’m hoping the Universal one will fit in the caddy of the OG one...I’d really like to carry it in that caddy.
Anyway...just figured I’d edit/update my earlier post (which probably wasn’t even seen by many, if any).
Thanks a lot, to the group.
Y’all have had me spending more money on stuff than I ever planned on!
Post by: hbcorpse on January 17, 2020, 09:18:26 AM
Hello again.
Not my intent to highjack this thread, but I'm not allowed to send PM's yet.
How about an updated version of the removable bit driver..?
Here's the old one flanked by my trusty old workhorse.
A 1:st gen Surge with tools from a Core.
Such an adapter might fit all the Free models (P, T & K) and not void any warranties. :D
This was actually my first idea for the FREE series. I even ordered that bit adapter to see if it would work on the FREE Philips driver with an easy mod or shims.
I haven't revisited the idea though, I will take another look. The catch though is that they use a spring clip or a spring-loaded ball (I forget which) as a retainer for the bits. I could use magnets to retain the bits, or some side grips like the flat bit holder.
I came across this picture...says it’s a 1/4” socket, and is friction fit on there, with the Phillips head and Prybar tools in use.
No further info.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200117/b0735056a61ac6f9c33447e711d3c343.jpg)
Thanks Reddit!
Seems like a good work-around.
Post by: Poncho65 on January 17, 2020, 12:01:39 PM
Hang on...so what’s the difference, other than in name (obviously)...?
The Universal’s name seems self explanatory...
But what is the Standard?
That’s the one I bought?
I’m guessing it will only fit specific models?
———————————
EDIT:
Ok, I’ve done quite a bit of web-sleuthing since I posted this.
I’ve found that the one I bought on eBay is the Original/Standard.
So...that one Universal model on eBay?
Should be here in the next two weeks.
I couldn’t help myself.
I DID find a good picture of an OG adapter that someone had modified to “work” universally, but did not watch the YouTube video it came from.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200117/50c0b0bff7fbf0b02b859ca8e40fc605.jpg)
So, now, it seems I’ll have one of each.
I’m hoping the Universal one will fit in the caddy of the OG one...I’d really like to carry it in that caddy.
Anyway...just figured I’d edit/update my earlier post (which probably wasn’t even seen by many, if any).
Thanks a lot, to the group.
Y’all have had me spending more money on stuff than I ever planned on!
Yep that little tab is about the main difference that I can find with the 2 different models (and I guess those 2 rivets as well :think: ) :salute: Glad we can help
:rofl:
Excited for you that you have a Universal one on the way :like:
Post by: ZapWizard on January 18, 2020, 10:18:27 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/11hYUsi.jpg)
https://youtu.be/_qfIAF48rnY
Well I received prototype #3 for the T-Shank holder. I made a video showing all the things i did to the prototype.
The good news is that when deployed the T-Shank blade is held rock solid. Granted I had to do lots of careful grinding, This was annoying since I used the same "perfect fit" profile as Rev 2.
The set-screws work great to hold the different thicknesses of blades, however they also push the two halves apart. Effectively jamming the T-shank when closed.
The dove-tail feature works to limit the distance, but the small (0.2mm) of tolerance I had between the surfaces, combined with the shrinkage of the sintered part amplifies the effect.
A secondary effect of this is that the blade end up a bit too close to the pliers when closed, so it doesn't close one-handed, you have to push the blade out of the way first.
I am going to live with the prototype for a while, I think I have to figure out how to change from a expansion method, to a clamping method to hold the different blade thicknesses. I have a few ideas on that brewing.
So not ready for prime time yet, but its getting there.
Post by: Poncho65 on January 18, 2020, 10:45:05 PM
Post by: Rapidray on January 18, 2020, 11:13:23 PM
Post by: hbcorpse on January 20, 2020, 04:17:33 AM
I’d rather carry your innovations on my belt, but let’s face it...you’ve given them a HUGE head start in creating their own versions of these mods.
But, then again, who’s to say they didn’t run through their own iterations of these components, and decide against them for some reason(s)?
After all, whether they’re the end-all-be-all of multitools or not, they’ve got a lot of brain power behind the decision(s) to make things the way they do.
In then, as I said, I’d rather carry a ZapWizard modded tool on my belt, as I really believe in your work and your scientific approach to completing these ideas.
Post by: ZapWizard on January 21, 2020, 03:52:20 AM
----------------------
(https://i.imgur.com/84qHJ6n.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/ePSsQcF.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/xElzSaD.jpg)
I have worked out a clamping design. The screws are off to the side, but the whole assembly is so small it hopefully will end up working to hold the T-Shank securely.
The two M2 screws (https://www.mcmaster.com/91290a012), with a tensile strength of 170,000 psi. If I did my math right: That is around 530lbs of tensile strength per screw. :o
The 60% 420SS / 40% Bronze composite has a yield strength of 62 ksi, so it will probably fail before the screws does, but there should be more than enough strength to clamp a blade.
I added four tiny dots to the inside of the clamp, as well as a small arc. These hopefully will increase local pressure on the blade.
You can change thin blades on this without removing the screws entirely, but thick blades will probably require full disassembly.
I will think on this design for a bit before ordering a prototype. I appreciate the input from the folks here.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on January 21, 2020, 07:44:57 AM
Clever idea to use the thumb space for the screws :tu:
I'm a bit of two minds over this: this will work nicely and should be very stable, but it's a pity you need another tool for blade replacement - even if the Allen key (2mm too, right?) is nicely integrated, you might lose it. On a MT it would still be preferable not to have to use separate tools... the dovetail construction on your other variant looked promising but I can imagine that 3D printing will not bring the required precision fit unless you allow for extra material and expect the user to finish the fit.
Post by: hbcorpse on January 23, 2020, 04:52:56 AM
The Standard and Universal Tool Adapters showed up!
As discussed, the Standard does not fit in any of my devices...Surge, Wave+, Free P4...yes that’s all I have! Don’t judge my teensy collection! At least I’ve got more UTA’s than you! Hahaha I’m kidding.
Anywho...I can now start working on designs for my EDC holster.
Plan is to carry:
- Free P4 (modded with ZW flat bit adapter)
- UTA
- bit extender
- flat bit set
- mini Craftsman ratchet
- Streamlight Micro-USB
- firestarter tool
I will keep y’all updated as things (SLOOOWLY) progress...
Oh yeah...I craft leather goods. Forgot I hadn’t mentioned that.
- - - -
Now I’ve got a bug in my ear telling me I need a Crunch...and many reasons why I should have it.
Anyone here have one?
Also, for those of you who have been collecting LM gear the longest...what are the odds they release some new-tangled version of the Crunch, since the Free P4 has sorta launched a new generation of LM multitools...?
I know that’s like trying to guess how many jelly beans are in a jar, but I just figured I wouldn’t want to buy a current generation Crunch, and get an email about the new version tomorrow...
Post by: Rapidray on January 23, 2020, 05:21:56 AM
Wspeed carries a Crunch so he will be chiming in a couple of hours :hatsoff:
Post by: Poncho65 on January 23, 2020, 12:15:18 PM
Can't wait to hear and see what all mods you do, hb :tu: Those are some great tools that you have as well :like:
Also post some pics of the 2 different adapters if you have time :cheers:
Post by: jorritvS on January 23, 2020, 09:36:54 PM
I know that’s like trying to guess how many jelly beans are in a jar, but I just figured I wouldn’t want to buy a current generation Crunch, and get an email about the new version tomorrow...
The crunch is beautifully designed and still does it job how it is supposed to. And it isn't a tool usable for everyone. I would like it a lot but I'm afraid a new crunch won't happen.
You could ask Megan. She is at SHOT show and there should be some people from Leatherman there. Maybe she can get something out of them. (crunch clamped on their fingers and slowly tighten it maybe? Just an idea)
Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk
Post by: hbcorpse on January 24, 2020, 05:42:38 AM
Thank you all for your responses!
I carried a Crunch for years, loved it...gifted it to my son and when I bought him a Signal - his choice - he gifted the Crunch to my grandson!
Wspeed carries a Crunch so he will be chiming in a couple of hours :hatsoff:
So awesome to see LM tools (and tools in general) being passed down through generations!
I’ll keep an eye out for Wspeed’s answer!
I have a Crunch as well :cheers: along with a few others here https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,10261.0.html :whistle: ;)
Can't wait to hear and see what all mods you do, hb :tu: Those are some great tools that you have as well :like:
Also post some pics of the 2 different adapters if you have time :cheers:
As far as mods to my P4, I think I’m all set with the FlatBit addition, as that’s the biggest thing I was missing from using my Wave+.
However, I’m sure ZapWizard is NOT done yet, and I know LM isn’t done making tools yet...so we shall see!
I’ll gets some pics of my holster when I start building it (and along the ways).
And I will get y’all some pictures of the different adapters, side by side!
The crunch is beautifully designed and still does it job how it is supposed to. And it isn't a tool usable for everyone. I would like it a lot but I'm afraid a new crunch won't happen.
You could ask Megan. She is at SHOT show and there should be some people from Leatherman there. Maybe she can get something out of them. (crunch clamped on their fingers and slowly tighten it maybe? Just an idea)
Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk
I figured the Crunch was built about as good as it could ever be...but I just have this small nagging feeling that they might make a newer Free-Gen Crunch...
I guess it doesn’t matter, cuz I’ll likely end up owning the current gen, and I wouldn’t pass up a Free-Gen either!
Who is Megan? I haven’t been here long, so there are many folks I still haven’t seen post.
Thanks again for all the response!
P.S. Sorry if I post/talk a lot. I’m on some other online forums, and I use an app called TapaTalk (it kinda sucks) to manage all my forum interactions in one place...so I’m very active with seeing posts on this thread.
Post by: Poncho65 on January 24, 2020, 11:58:25 AM
Megan is our marketing person for social media amonst other things and also Grant's (our site owner) significant other :tu: She was at SHOT 2020 this year for us as well and we got a great firsthand look at several new things from several companies :like:
Post by: ZapWizard on January 27, 2020, 05:10:23 AM
Horizontal holster would be my jam as well, your almost my singluar driving reason to consider the P4 at this point lol.
As for the horizontal carry...
- I’ll admit, I’m a big ol’ fatty. My love handles make vertical carry uncomfortable.
Love it, any chance of a horizontal holster version?
(https://i.imgur.com/Vp9V46S.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/hrajxVP.jpg)
After another request from a Shapeways customer; I finally designed the horizontal carry option for the FREE P2 and P4.
It doesn't have any extra bit/extender options, as no matter what I did they just didn't fit well. Also only one belt size, as I don't trust an open clip on a larger duty style belt.
Now available in both Left or Right carry.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on January 27, 2020, 09:24:13 AM
Just a few thoughts...
- Would a metal belt clip be an option...?
- ... and would this not make a bit extender slot a possible add-on option too...?
Just asking... :angel:
Post by: hbcorpse on January 27, 2020, 09:52:28 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/Vp9V46S.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/hrajxVP.jpg)
After another request from a Shapeways customer; I finally designed the horizontal carry option for the FREE P2 and P4.
It doesn't have any extra bit/extender options, as no matter what I did they just didn't fit well. Also only one belt size, as I don't trust an open clip on a larger duty style belt.
Now available in both Left or Right carry.
Lordy Lordy, mercy me!
That is beautiful!
Three questions come to mind, immediately, because let’s face it...that’s how we work!
- 1. What size belt did you design this for? My eyes tell me, based on dimensions, that it will fit perfectly on a 1.5” belt. Which is my standard.
——————————————————————
Quote
Now available in both Left or Right carry.- 2. Does this mean I can go spend money right now?!?
——————————————————————
- 3. Now that you’ve “conquered” this “demon” do you think you’ll design this style for the Wave+ and Surge? :selfish:
Thank you, once again, and always!
If I had the brainpower, and/or the means, I still wouldn’t be able to create/design the wonders you’ve bestowed upon us!
I grovel at your throne, Lord ZapWizard!
HUZZAH!
P.S. I may, or may not, have achieved a “Val Kilmer as Doc Holliday in Tombstone circa 1994” level of drunken-ness...
You decide. Don’t be fooled by my literate typing.
]^{]^{£^{7£{7]{|]\{]|
Hahghagjhskgukxgoux
(#*’hgkhsfhghkggljshljsjbkj
Hint...I DID / AM that drunk. I am, indeed, your Huckleberry.
Post by: Poncho65 on January 27, 2020, 12:44:25 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on January 27, 2020, 03:33:01 PM
- Would a metal belt clip be an option...?
- ... and would this not make a bit extender slot a possible add-on option too...?
The metal clips requires Chicago screws, which don't line up with the tool pocket very well. At least not without major modifications.
I did think of putting the bit-extender on the bottom side, I may look at that in CAD. Since the FREE series is symmetrical it should work.
Three questions come to mind, immediately, because let’s face it...that’s how we work!1) I have settled on a "BDU" belt size as my default for the regular loop and plastic clip. This is a military regulation size, and is 1.75" tall. I use this size on the 1.5" leather belt I wear daily.
- 1. What size belt did you design this for? My eyes tell me, based on dimensions, that it will fit perfectly on a 1.5” belt. Which is my standard.
- 2. Does this mean I can go spend money right now?!?
- 3. Now that you’ve “conquered” this “demon” do you think you’ll design this style for the Wave+ and Surge? :selfish:
2) Yes, the link to the shop is in my signature.
3) Probably not for the Wave/Charge/Surge. At least not until I have enough requests that it makes sense to put in the time. Their holsters aren't as nice and symmetrical as the FREE series.Why does that matter: Because I have to make the CAD model highly modular, such that I can boolean add/subtract common components to build up a new configuration. You see I now have several dozen unique configurations, each time I add a new config, if I change anything with a base component the amount of items I have to re-export and update goes up exponentially. For example I had to recently update the Surge holster to accommodate the new Thumb tabs. This meant I had to update 8 different unique combinations. (Also the Surge is quite heavy, and gravity is needed to help hold it in.)
Post by: Rapidray on January 27, 2020, 03:44:52 PM
Post by: Bobrip on January 27, 2020, 11:07:33 PM
Post by: Poncho65 on January 28, 2020, 11:48:48 AM
Post by: asorel on February 24, 2020, 05:56:40 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on February 24, 2020, 06:10:11 PM
By the way, would there be any issue with removing one of those spacers in the middle of the tool to make room for the bit driver?
You can alter the stack-up however you want, but if your referring to the springs, they must be on placed each side of the bit holder, I use the precious extra space they provide. With the springs included, the bit driver takes 0.32" of tool space.
See here for the stackup diagram (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,81481.msg1954150.html#msg1954150).
------------------
Small update:
I ordered the newest T-Shank design, it should arrive in the next week or so. Sometimes Shapeways is very fast, sometimes they take a few weeks.
Post by: Poncho65 on February 24, 2020, 06:27:52 PM
Hoping for the best with the newest revision of the T-shank adapter :salute: :like:
:popcorn:
Post by: asorel on February 24, 2020, 06:42:53 PM
You can alter the stack-up however you want, but if your referring to the springs, they must be on placed each side of the bit holder, I use the precious extra space they provide. With the springs included, the bit driver takes 0.32" of tool space.
See here for the stackup diagram (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,81481.msg1954150.html#msg1954150).
------------------
Small update:
I ordered the newest T-Shank design, it should arrive in the next week or so. Sometimes Shapeways is very fast, sometimes they take a few weeks.
Yeah, looking again at the stack-up diagram, I did mean the springs. I'll keep those in, then, and figure out something else to remove. One more thing, if you wouldn't mind me asking--you mentioned in your OP plans to laser-etch a ruler on the inside of the scales. Obviously, that isn't something you can sell on Shapeways, but how has that project been going? If it's a viable replacement for built-in ruler, I may be willing to eschew that part so that I might fit some of your mods in.
ETA:
Welcome to :MTO: asorel :cheers: Zap is good at what he does for sure :like: Hope you end up with a MT you really enjoy :tu:
Hoping for the best with the newest revision of the T-shank adapter :salute: :like:
:popcorn:
Thanks! MTs are an interesting hobby, but the prospect of modding them really adds a new level of depths to it. Really looking forward to whatever ZapWizard comes up with next.
Post by: asorel on February 24, 2020, 07:14:58 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on February 24, 2020, 08:12:02 PM
you mentioned in your OP plans to laser-etch a ruler on the inside of the scales. Obviously, that isn't something you can sell on Shapeways, but how has that project been going?
I put in the plans as the~1/8" of flat space on each side of the scales seems to be begging for a ruler. You could fit a 7" ruler there if you ignore the ends of the tool, or 8.8" if I include the length to the ends.
So we have a laser-etcher here at work. For it to do metal you have to coat the metal in Cermark, etch that, then wash it. So I would need to take apart the tool, and build a jig to hold the scales in place. My CAD models are accurate enough I can probably 3D print a jig.
I haven't done it yet as I just haven't gotten around to it (https://www.google.com/search?q=a+round+tuit&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS778US778&sxsrf=ALeKk02hZ0jfE-_AiCYzeyx7K8A46sflag:1582571187002&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjE8LqL8ernAhUH-6wKHS20BzQQ_AUoAnoECAwQBA&biw=1570&bih=1429). (Perhaps I should laser-cut one of those.)
Somewhat related to my last question--if you all were to remove the plain edge blade from the Free P4, with what would you replace it with? It's .1" thick rather than .07, so you'd have to use a washer of some sort in order to use one of the tools from the other side.I am not sure what I would put in its place. I use the straight blade a lot
The good news is that the washers just need a somewhat common 1/8" inside diameter, and you can get precision shims to fill in stuff from McMaster.
Post by: asorel on February 24, 2020, 08:24:56 PM
I put in the plans as the~1/8" of flat space on each side of the scales seems to be begging for a ruler. You could fit a 7" ruler there if you ignore the ends of the tool, or 8.8" if I include the length to the ends.
So we have a laser-etcher here at work. For it to do metal you have to coat the metal in Cermark, etch that, then wash it. So I would need to take apart the tool, and build a jig to hold the scales in place. My CAD models are accurate enough I can probably 3D print a jig.
I haven't done it yet as I just haven't gotten around to it (https://www.google.com/search?q=a+round+tuit&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS778US778&sxsrf=ALeKk02hZ0jfE-_AiCYzeyx7K8A46sflag:1582571187002&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjE8LqL8ernAhUH-6wKHS20BzQQ_AUoAnoECAwQBA&biw=1570&bih=1429). (Perhaps I should laser-cut one of those.)
I am not sure what I would put in its place. I use the straight blade a lot
The good news is that the washers just need a somewhat common 1/8" inside diameter, and you can get precision shims to fill in stuff from McMaster.
Gotcha. The disassembly requirement sounds like I couldn't apply it as easily as simply sending my P4 over to a third party laser etching service.
Post by: hbcorpse on February 25, 2020, 07:07:52 AM
Gotcha. The disassembly requirement sounds like I couldn't apply it as easily as simply sending my P4 over to a third party laser etching service.There are ways to do a DIY acid etch, if you can trust yourself and/or your hands to transfer the measurements/markings over properly...maybe stick with a quarter inch scale, so as to have less markings to transfer?
Post by: ddogu on February 25, 2020, 03:10:35 PM
I don’t really have anything to add to this thread other than saying that it’s indescribably awesome and ZapWizard is a legend.
:rofl: :iagree:
Post by: asorel on February 29, 2020, 09:23:22 AM
Post by: ZapWizard on February 29, 2020, 12:55:40 PM
is it possible to move the four "main" tools around to different mounting pointsThe free series is totally symmetrical, and the movement profiles are all the same. You can swap tools around as you want. (as long as your total thickness on each side remains the same)
There are two thick washers that are behind the scales, this is because the scales have that raised shiny portion. You just need to keep those in place. The scissors have two parts, if you move it to the other side you will have a hard time griping it to deploy them.
The springs don't have to be dead center to work, they are offset somewhat on the FREE P2, but evenly spacing those is best.
Post by: SteveC on March 02, 2020, 02:07:05 PM
Post by: philo on March 13, 2020, 03:01:00 AM
Post by: Poncho65 on March 13, 2020, 03:27:13 AM
Post by: Matpar_McWolfie on March 13, 2020, 01:08:47 PM
There are ways to do a DIY acid etch, if you can trust yourself and/or your hands to transfer the measurements/markings over properly...maybe stick with a quarter inch scale, so as to have less markings to transfer?
I'm currently working on a stencil I could make with a vinyl cutting machine so I would have perfect spacing. I'd go the 'electro etch' path instead of acid etch as it is more consistent. Still have to do some test though, the markings are so thin I'm not sure the vinyl cutter will handle it, same thing for the etching process. We'll see.
Post by: hbcorpse on March 14, 2020, 06:31:06 PM
Post by: hbcorpse on March 23, 2020, 08:49:30 AM
Post by: ZapWizard on April 03, 2020, 06:33:34 PM
Do some of the mods such as the bit drivers you have work on the K4?Yes. The 4mm and Flat bits fit the K2 and K4. They actually fit the K2 better as it has the same philips/flathead next to each other just like the FREE P2/P4. The K4 might requires re-positioning the awl.
I'm currently working on a stencil I could make with a vinyl cutting machine so I would have perfect spacing. I'd go the 'electro etch' path instead of acid etch as it is more consistent.Interesting idea using acid etching.
@ZapWizard - Can you please design a cure for the CoronaVirus? I’m sure it would be elegant and efficient!I wish. Life is a bit strange right now. Working mostly from home these days
---------------------
(https://i.imgur.com/JzRF019.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/NhQ1Z5A.jpg)
Regarding Rev 4 of the T-Shank holder: The good news is it works great at holding both 2mm and 1mm blades.
The bad news is that to hold 2mm blades you have to install four tiny washers because otherwise the clamp tilts and jams when the tool closes.
Those tiny washers are a pain to install, you need the hands of a watchmaker to do it without issues every time. Not something folks will want to do on the go.
---------------------
(https://i.imgur.com/osb7p7B.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/X3XxXkn.jpg)
To that end I have designed Revision 5
This one will use an integral clamp. The metal is flexible enough that it should work well on the 2mm and 1.5mm blades. For 1mm blades, you may need to install a 1mm shim. This can easily be made by just trimming another 1mm blade.
It will still require the two M2 screws, and an M2 tap, but hopefully will end up being the most solid option, and no too painful to change blades. The usable blade length also increase a small amount.
The screws both clamp, and hold one side of the T-Shank. You remove the two screws to swap blades. It won't have the built-in 1.5mm allen key, so I am using the 1.5mm flat bit that comes with the Leatherman replacement set, and carrying it on my holster.
I will be a few weeks till this version arrives.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on April 03, 2020, 11:01:23 PM
Looking forward to rev 5 :tu:
Stay safe, all :salute:
Post by: vadsoom on April 04, 2020, 02:03:30 PM
Post by: Poncho65 on April 07, 2020, 12:25:20 PM
Post by: mzh.arizona on April 09, 2020, 04:04:13 AM
I have a different idea for the t-shank - why not just make something that will hold the t-shank and has a flat bit-driver interface - so this would slide into your bit-driver mod and would secure the t-shank blade.
I know it isn't as integrated as many would like, but it would allow the use of full length interchangeable t-shanks.
Just a thought. Thanks for your time and your beautiful fabrication and design work and for answering your customers.
Ron.
Post by: ZapWizard on April 09, 2020, 04:42:06 AM
I have a different idea for the t-shank - why not just make something that will hold the t-shank and has a flat bit-driver interface - so this would slide into your bit-driver mod and would secure the t-shank blade.The catch is that you already have to shorten a t-shank blade, if I made a flat bit holder addon you wouldn't be able to store a blade in the tool. Also, the T-Shank needs to work on the back stroke also, so it has to lock to the tool.
Post by: Poncho65 on April 09, 2020, 03:08:45 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on May 01, 2020, 12:59:52 AM
Rev 5 of the T-Shank is working great. I had the video and product page all ready to go when I realized that I forgot to record how to tap the M2 holes. When I went and did this on the 2nd part (mirrored version) it was quite hard, and I am glad I didn't break the tap. But as always I don't want my customers to end up frustrated or scared to do a step, so I have ordered one more (Rev 6). But due to the pandemic, it will take even longer to arrive. Keep turned in. In the mean time enjoy this teaser image.
Post by: pa_strunk on May 01, 2020, 03:29:01 AM
Post by: Mcfal12 on May 01, 2020, 04:31:47 AM
Looks great!!!
Post by: vadsoom on May 01, 2020, 07:02:08 AM
Can you comment when you will be making them available?
Post by: Wspeed on May 01, 2020, 02:28:12 PM
Would love to see one for the LM Wave :dd:
Post by: ReamerPunch on May 01, 2020, 02:53:35 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/VdKeKOH.jpg)
Rev 5 of the T-Shank is working great. I had the video and product page all ready to go when I realized that I forgot to record how to tap the M2 holes. When I went and did this on the 2nd part (mirrored version) it was quite hard, and I am glad I didn't break the tap. But as always I don't want my customers to end up frustrated or scared to do a step, so I have ordered one more (Rev 6). But due to the pandemic, it will take even longer to arrive. Keep turned in. In the mean time enjoy this teaser image.
That looks amazing. :like:
Post by: hbcorpse on May 12, 2020, 10:06:37 AM
Hope everyone is safe and healthy...
Post by: Rocket surgery on May 25, 2020, 10:19:13 AM
I have been looking high and low for a heavy duty (edit- by heavy duty I mean full size rather than keychain) multitool with the parts I actually use on there. Have worked out a trade with a buddy for his P2 - given it only has one blade on, once the T-shank adapter is out and my PayPal is empty, then I will finally get back to having a decent tool on my side.
I guess what I'm saying is a sincere thankyou, and to let you know that although I'm sure to some it's just a handy add-on to a tool they rarely use, but to others (atleast me) it can mean the world, and give the ability to have a bit of their own personal normality back. :cheers:
Post by: ZapWizard on May 25, 2020, 03:01:52 PM
The final t-shank has arrived, I just need to make a video on it. I hope to have that ready in the next few days.
Post by: pa_strunk on May 25, 2020, 09:26:55 PM
Post by: Poncho65 on May 26, 2020, 12:48:39 AM
So this is my second post to the forum. Based in the UK and used to carry a surge because I had a reasonable need for it. About 2 years ago medical stuff shook my world, and that paired with the medication given to help (opiates) means I can no longer work, drive, and walk slow as heck using a stick. Not only that, but the nock on effect is I can no longer carry my surge ( :cry: )
I have been looking high and low for a heavy duty (edit- by heavy duty I mean full size rather than keychain) multitool with the parts I actually use on there. Have worked out a trade with a buddy for his P2 - given it only has one blade on, once the T-shank adapter is out and my PayPal is empty, then I will finally get back to having a decent tool on my side.
I guess what I'm saying is a sincere thankyou, and to let you know that although I'm sure to some it's just a handy add-on to a tool they rarely use, but to others (atleast me) it can mean the world, and give the ability to have a bit of their own personal normality back. :cheers:
Welcome to :MTO: and I hope that the mod is able to bring some normality back to you :salute: :tu:
Post by: Poncho65 on May 26, 2020, 12:49:12 AM
Can’t wait to see the final version of the T-Shank-inator!
Hope everyone is safe and healthy...
:iagree: with both of those statements :cheers: :tu:
Post by: ZapWizard on May 31, 2020, 01:45:28 AM
https://youtu.be/xw6V0-cCoVI
The T-Shank holder is done!
The produce page is live (store link in my signature)
Coming up: A collaboration with fellow Multitool.org member Metropolicity (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php?action=profile;u=4570)
I shared my Leatherman FREE CAD T-Shank CAD data with him in exchange for his CAD file for his Leatherman Charge Scalpel holder (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,84233.msg2102107.html)
So now I can get cracking on a making one for the FREE series.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on May 31, 2020, 10:35:05 AM
The last emoji stands for "order placed" :D
Post by: Rocket surgery on May 31, 2020, 07:51:25 PM
Post by: Slygrin on May 31, 2020, 08:00:46 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on May 31, 2020, 08:32:48 PM
Is there any jiggery-pokery I can do to get this replacing the main blade on a P2? I have been waiting for this with baited breath! :woohoo:
On the P2: Yes, the main version can replace the main blade on the P2, you have to move the implements around a bit. Or it can re[place the scissors if you get the mirrored version.
I may actually put my wood blade back in and then replace my serrated blade, I use it very rarely.
Post by: Slygrin on May 31, 2020, 08:34:54 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on May 31, 2020, 08:59:47 PM
So, I was sitting here looking at my P4, and contemplating the modes I've done and will do. Trying to think of what would make it the perfect tool for me. The only thing that I came up with is to replace the scissors with decent wire strippers. Thoughts?
I wish, as you will have to remove my original Squirt with Wire Strippers from my cold dead hands.
I don't think the 3D printed material will ever be able to hold an edge like that, it would have to be milled sheet metal.
Post by: Poncho65 on June 01, 2020, 03:16:42 AM
Awesome that you have a collab going with Metro as well :salute: :like:
Post by: Rocket surgery on June 01, 2020, 07:37:15 AM
Post by: Rocket surgery on June 03, 2020, 08:54:21 AM
I should receive my bronze Rev 2 model in the mail in the next few days. I will post images for those interested in that finish. If I didn't already mention it, the gold plating flakes off in areas of contact.
(https://i.imgur.com/JyOOQqq.jpg)
Just dropping this here for anyone interested: A person on Reddit asked if they could re-arrange the stack up to ditch the Philips, ruler and can opener. But keep the package opener. Yes it is possible, and doesn't require any extra parts. Just double stack on of the existing washers. You can alternatively keep the Philips instead.
(https://i.imgur.com/ag452HW.jpg)
And here is a dimension ed image showing the stack up for anyone who wants to swap stuff around. As long as your left/right stacks add up to 0.52 inches you can do whatever you want.
Zapwizzard - on the off chance (given how much work and how many measurements you have done on the P4) might you have a similar dimensional layout for a free P2? I think it's going to be a huge help in swapping tools about to get both a T-shank AND the bit adapter on a P2.
Main thing I'm trying to work out with the P2 is the difference in thickness of the two sides of the handle - the P4 has the same interior tools however the side with 4 thinner tools is 0.03 thicker due to washers. That slack is taken up by the saw being 0.07 rather than the 0.10 used for the blades and scissors. How does the P2 account for the different thicknesses of the tool stacks? Are there extra spacers/washers, are the washers removed, is the frame its self stamped to be 0.03 thinner on one side?
Post by: ZapWizard on June 03, 2020, 03:16:31 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/xGCOtjs.png)
Zapwizzard - on the off chance (given how much work and how many measurements you have done on the P4) might you have a similar dimensional layout for a free P2
Here is the P2 stackup. Everything has been verified using calipers:
The P2 doesn't have any washers between the thin implements. It only has thicker washers on each end of the stack to account for the recesses in each scale.
Post by: Rocket surgery on June 03, 2020, 06:23:42 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/xGCOtjs.png)
Here is the P2 stackup. Everything has been verified using calipers:
The P2 doesn't have any washers between the thin implements. It only has thicker washers on each end of the stack to account for the recesses in each scale.
Amazing, thanks!
So looking at the layout, if it doesn't have washers to take out giving the extra 0.01 of room needed when i remove the file, is there a way to fit the T-shank? Or is there enough wiggle room in the design that 0.01 difference is negligible, and won't really change anything
This is all working on the assumption that my memory is correct and it's 0.18, that could well be a measurement from a previous iteration!
Thankyou again, and thanks to everyone for all the warm welcome messages! :cheers:
Post by: ZapWizard on June 03, 2020, 06:39:45 PM
Ya 0.01 isn't enough to worry about. If you find is loose, then you may need a very thin washer. (McMaster should have either a thin washer or precision shim that fits the bill.
If your replacing the scissors, then you remove the can opener or other thin implement.
If you want to replace the knife instead, you simply swap all the thin tools to the same side as the t-shank holder, and the philips/flathead (or bit adapter) to the side with the scissors.
Post by: Slygrin on June 04, 2020, 01:26:45 AM
(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-ks23Kjw/0/11ce7f14/M/i-ks23Kjw-M.jpg)
Post by: ZapWizard on June 04, 2020, 01:50:33 AM
Post by: Slygrin on June 04, 2020, 01:53:09 AM
The T-shank holder sits up as high as my thumb tabs do, the screws are about the same height (0.2mm shorter). You can always file/grind the surface down flatter.
Thanks for the info!
Post by: Slygrin on June 17, 2020, 02:59:27 AM
Thanks for all the effort you put into making my P4 a mini Surge!
Post by: ZapWizard on June 17, 2020, 03:10:18 AM
I got my T-Shank holder today and installed. Very nice.
Sweet, glad it works for you.
Post by: JBW1 on June 17, 2020, 04:11:16 AM
Too many cool mods!!!
Awesome work !
Post by: Slygrin on June 17, 2020, 04:21:50 AM
(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-TXJd5cW/0/0c00c370/M/i-TXJd5cW-M.jpg)
Post by: JBW1 on June 17, 2020, 07:16:14 AM
My P4 with some of the mods I've done..... Besides the ZapWizars's great products, I also sharpened the awl to make it proper one.
(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-TXJd5cW/0/0c00c370/M/i-TXJd5cW-M.jpg)
:tu: :tu: :tu: :drool:
Post by: Poncho65 on June 17, 2020, 02:57:33 PM
:nanadance: :nanadance:
Post by: Slygrin on June 18, 2020, 02:39:00 AM
(https://photos.smugmug.com/Shared/i-qJpDkJt/0/be7f7e3b/M/20200617_171949-M.jpg)
Post by: Poncho65 on June 18, 2020, 03:17:26 AM
Post by: Slygrin on June 19, 2020, 02:22:05 AM
Post by: ddogu on June 19, 2020, 08:30:50 AM
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49953017683_ccfcbfda44_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2j7bgPz)
https://youtu.be/xw6V0-cCoVI
The T-Shank holder is done!
The produce page is live (store link in my signature)
Coming up: A collaboration with fellow Multitool.org member Metropolicity (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php?action=profile;u=4570)
I shared my Leatherman FREE CAD T-Shank CAD data with him in exchange for his CAD file for his Leatherman Charge Scalpel holder (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,84233.msg2102107.html)
So now I can get cracking on a making one for the FREE series.
Wow. :tu: :tu: :drool: :woohoo: :woohoo:
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on June 19, 2020, 06:17:30 PM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on June 20, 2020, 03:03:54 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on June 20, 2020, 04:41:39 PM
FYI, I am thinking about making a tweezer holder that replaces the pliers side spacer near the scissors. (Nylon piece with a small cutout really).
Post by: Poncho65 on June 20, 2020, 05:15:23 PM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on June 20, 2020, 07:09:20 PM
Good news on the tweezers holder Zap, looking forward to that :tu:
I discovered I need to make a small notch in the file to allow the plier head tooth to engage the handle :whistle:
Post by: ZapWizard on June 20, 2020, 07:38:17 PM
Metropolicity (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php?action=profile;u=4570)sent me the CAD file for his Leatherman Charge Scalpel holder (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,84233.msg2102107.html).
I will defiantly use it for inspiration and dimensional reference, but as it my style I will do my own design from scratch. He has lots of nice details in there though, such as a bump the bends the blade, to cause angled force holding it in place.
He also sent me four different large scalpel blades. For each one: I took a detailed macro photo and created a precise 3D model of each blade.
-----
(https://i.imgur.com/nUTw6cm.jpg)
A Havalon #60A Blade (0.62mm thick)
(https://i.imgur.com/xarHdKm.jpg)
A Wiebe Knives Replacement Blade (0.5mm Thick)
(https://i.imgur.com/ZjmZRCj.jpg)
A #22 Scalpel Blade (0.4mm thick)
(https://i.imgur.com/HL5cyof.jpg)
A Swann Morton #26 Scalpel Blade (0.4mm thick)
I have also ordered some Havalon #60XT (Extra Thin) blades, and some #4 and #3 blade handles from Swann Morton to use as reference. (Since they invented these things)
----
I will get started on a 3D design for the FREE series using what I have now though. The plan is to make something that allows for the largest number of different blades, while only replacing either the main or serrated blades which are 0.1" (2.54mm) thick.
Post by: ZapWizard on June 20, 2020, 08:12:59 PM
However, today I noticed my first Amazon.com order come in. So I checked and they finally listed one of my items! Thumb tabs for the FREE P4.
Item number: B087QRZ6VN and B087QS9GGS
I have mixed feeling on this.
They are listing them for $29.66 + Free shipping. Standard shipping is $8.99 in the U.S. for Shapeways, so Amazon is taking a $5.67 fee, which actually sounds about right from my research.
But they listed it with just two one colors: Pink and White. These some of the most unpopular colors I sell. And you can't even find the pink except by the related listing to the white.
The white color get dingy faster than a pair of sneakers, so I hope anyone ordering from Amazon will take the time to use some alcohol markers (or a sharpie) to dye the tabs.
Initially they said the listing on Amazon would be a copy of what is on the Shapeways store, however it is just a cropped copy/paste with no formatting.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on June 20, 2020, 09:21:45 PM
:like:
Post by: ZapWizard on June 20, 2020, 10:26:06 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/4tDjvOe.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/f4FYgfV.jpg)
How is this for one day of design.
I kept most of Metropolicity's profile for the actual blade grip, and then built around it.
It has a built-in thumb-tab, and because the blade is on the inside, it should help keep you thumb away from the blade while deploying.
That said, I am going to only recommend either the 60A blade from Havalon, or the Wiebe Blades be used. This is because these are the only blades long enough to ensure the blade stays docked when using the pliers.
I will offer it in a mirrored version for replacing the serrated blade instead of the main blade.
For now, I will sit on the design until my handles arrive.
Post by: Time22 on June 21, 2020, 12:57:09 AM
Small Free P4 based tool kit using some of ZapWizard's mods and accessories. The kit brings the versatility of some older Leatherman offerings to the Free series, and there is space for one or two Victorinox additions ;)
:hatsoff: DT & ZapWizard
Post by: ZapWizard on June 21, 2020, 04:35:54 PM
The Leatherman FREE P4, Klingon Edition
(https://i.imgur.com/bqU2oUf.jpg)
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on June 21, 2020, 05:14:54 PM
Hmm... the mirrored holder that goes where the serrated blade usually sits might be something to consider :think:
Post by: Slygrin on June 21, 2020, 05:16:48 PM
Coming soon...
The Leatherman FREE P4, Klingon Edition
(https://i.imgur.com/bqU2oUf.jpg)
STOP IT. I'm going broke and I'm tired of taking my P4 apart!
Post by: pa_strunk on June 22, 2020, 03:26:14 AM
Post by: Poncho65 on June 22, 2020, 11:28:37 AM
Post by: ZapWizard on June 25, 2020, 01:17:24 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/WWCtDQx.jpg)
So my #4 scalpel handle came in. I photographed and 3D modeled it in great detail.
I learned a few things that I may integrate into my holder.
#1, The actual scalpel grip is just a simple set of slits, and doesn't have any feature that follows the middle area of the cutout. As best I can measure, the middle wider cutout is only to allow the blade to slide on easier, the position of the middle cutout doesn't actually equate to any sort of stop. Instead, it is where the blade is designed to start bending.
#2 The blade bend at the handle. I knew this already, but this handle uses a simple angled ramp to achieve this, I will emulate this, as I realized the bump idea allows the blade to tilt left/right on the bump.
#3 The angled back edge of the blade is actually quite important, it is the primary stop to allow you to exert pressure on the blade. i will have to keep this area with a tight tolerance to the blade.
About tolerances. These things seem to be designed with zero or nearly zero tolerances. For example, the small end of the cutout in the blades measure 2.00mm. And that is also the exact width (as best i can determine) of the middle support in the handle.
The length of the cutouts in the blade is 24.24mm, the length of the oblong receiver on the handle is just 24.15mm, leaving just 0.11mm of gap for the blade. Finally the regular blades are 0.40mm thick, and the slot is just 0.50mm wide. This means this handle can't even hold the 0.5mm blades unless you want to jam them on just once.
Since my part is sintered and shrinks a bit, I have to oversize carefully. (As Metropolicity already did in his design). Just do a few design tweaks and I can get to prototyping.
Post by: ZapWizard on June 25, 2020, 03:21:53 AM
(Not a photograph! :twak:)
Also, the prototypes have been ordered.
Post by: Poncho65 on June 25, 2020, 03:28:07 AM
Post by: pa_strunk on June 25, 2020, 04:02:36 AM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on June 25, 2020, 09:47:00 PM
Post by: Time22 on June 26, 2020, 11:25:13 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/pq5NBrH.jpg)
(Not a photograph! :twak:)
Also, the prototypes have been ordered.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on June 27, 2020, 01:32:55 PM
Thanks guys :D
Good news on the tweezers holder Zap, looking forward to that :tu:
I discovered I need to make a small notch in the file to allow the plier head tooth to engage the handle :whistle:
Notch made in the file and in the saw blade (where the screw threads point) now allows the pliers to engage the handles properly with tool stored.
Post by: Poncho65 on June 28, 2020, 02:40:40 PM
Post by: Slygrin on July 09, 2020, 11:34:36 PM
Notch made in the file and in the saw blade (where the screw threads point) now allows the pliers to engage the handles properly with tool stored.
I didn't need the notch for my setup. I'm thinking I shortened the file a little more, past where your notch is.
Post by: brab on July 10, 2020, 01:11:20 AM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on July 10, 2020, 07:43:03 AM
I didn't need the notch for my setup. I'm thinking I shortened the file a little more, past where your notch is.Probably. I thought of that too but I didn't like the thought of taking off more blade length than absolutely necessary. Plus the resulting hook might come in handy for picking up things out of reach of your hands ;)
Pic shows P4 on standby at the grill...
Post by: Rocket surgery on July 10, 2020, 11:13:57 PM
From factory the springs sit just to either side of the plastic cover part, but when installing the thicker blade exchanger the spring is pushed over the top of the plastic piece, meaning the bottom claw(?) Of the spring is floating above the magnet, causing me to be unable to get the pin even nearly lined up :-[ I have tried all sorts, but each time it's deforming the plastic piece more, and every time I can get the screw tight, the whole frame is out of wack because it's pushing the magnet cover all over the shop. Has anyone found this, or better yet, found a solution to this? Getting rather frustrated and feeling a bit stupid :facepalm:
Post by: Slygrin on July 10, 2020, 11:20:02 PM
Probably. I thought of that too but I didn't like the thought of taking off more blade length than absolutely necessary. Plus the resulting hook might come in handy for picking up things out of reach of your hands ;)
Pic shows P4 on standby at the grill...
Great picture! I decided to just shorten the file and not the saw. I use the file 90% of the time. I also carry a Surge, rotate it with the P4. I can always use the longer blades when needed on the P4, I just have to put the file back in to close it or leave it empty.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on July 11, 2020, 10:04:31 AM
??? Hi guys, so the stars finally aligned, my P2 came back from warranty for the second time and the pliers where problem free! So I have gone to install the bit exchanger and blade exchanger... Well that was 3 hours ago. The problem I'm having is with the little plastic piece which covers and holds the magnet in place and how it contacts the base of the spring (part which sits around the magnet).
From factory the springs sit just to either side of the plastic cover part, but when installing the thicker blade exchanger the spring is pushed over the top of the plastic piece, meaning the bottom claw(?) Of the spring is floating above the magnet, causing me to be unable to get the pin even nearly lined up :-[ I have tried all sorts, but each time it's deforming the plastic piece more, and every time I can get the screw tight, the whole frame is out of wack because it's pushing the magnet cover all over the shop. Has anyone found this, or better yet, found a solution to this? Getting rather frustrated and feeling a bit stupid :facepalm:
Good to have a functional P2 now :tu:
Yes, I had a similar problem - not enough space left for the plastic bit between the springs, seeing that there are now only three implements between them. I ended up leaving the plastic bit out. One could maybe shorten it and reprofile the shortened end but I decided it wasn't worth the hassle. It seems that the magnet still sits where it should even without the plastic bit.
Post by: ZapWizard on July 16, 2020, 05:55:15 PM
Has anyone found this, or better yet, found a solution to this? Getting rather frustrated and feeling a bit stupid :facepalm:
I haven't modified my P2 as much, but I can imagine what your talking about. The plastic bit does nothing more than make the magnet surface a bit easier to clean. The magnet itself is held in place by the springs.
You could always trim off a tiny portion of the plastic where the spring now hits.
---------
In other news Shapeways has finally finished producing the Scalpel holder prototypes, which are now in the mail. Metal parts now take a month even when paying for rush production. That sucks as each time I need to tweak the design it takes 5 weeks to get the new parts to confirm the changes.
Post by: fishbulb59 on July 24, 2020, 12:00:05 AM
I'm starting a new build based on the T2, and I'm keeping the factory dimensions for pivots and magnets. I've ordered your 4mm bit driver to replace the two 'thick' tools, since it's better than anything I've come up with. In my existing T4, I use a scalpel blade on a ground-down awl tool, which is the standard 'thin' size for the Free tools. Any chance you'd be able to do a thinner version of your scalpel holder without the thumb tab? That way I could replace my terrible, hand-ground version. :)
Post by: ZapWizard on July 24, 2020, 12:52:10 AM
If the scalpel holder works out (the blade holding profile) I could alter the rest of the design to make it fit in place of a thin tool.
A #3 profile holder may be a good project for the smaller T2 or T4.
Post by: fishbulb59 on July 24, 2020, 01:34:10 AM
Post by: ZapWizard on July 28, 2020, 01:38:11 AM
Teaser image!
The prototype scalpel holder finally arrived. :mail: (The damn UPS Mail Innovations delivery took 12 days)
I just have a few tweaks to make to the design. As usual I will still order a 2nd prototype before selling. So expect another 4-6 weeks till is is available to order.
The great news is that the slot profile works well. The slot came with a bit of gunk still stuck in the slot. The good news is that thinnest dremel grind off wheels (https://www.dremel.com/en_US/products/-/show-product/accessories/409-15-16-cutting-wheels-36-pack) happen to be exactly the right size to clear the slot. Just a few tiny hits from the dremel and the slot allows the blade to slide on perfectly. The 0.6mm blade I have (60XT) doesn't want to fit, but that isn't a big deal.
I did also have to grind off a bit of the back stop of the blade. I need ~0.7mm more clearance in that area. The thumb tab also needs improving.
The term "scary sharp" applies. No I didn't cut myself (yet), but its weird how the scalpel blade feels much more dangerous when deployed compared to the regular blade. Part of that is also the fact that the pointed tip of the blade is exposed with the slightest deployment angle. So I am going to recommend that anyone who installs this use a holster, and not just the tool in their pocket or belt clip.
Post by: Poncho65 on July 28, 2020, 11:48:23 AM
Post by: ReamerPunch on July 28, 2020, 12:06:51 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on July 31, 2020, 05:49:40 PM
This doesn't even feel legal. >:D
----------
(https://i.imgur.com/mKcVRWn.jpg)
I have finished all the tweaks to the design. Lots of small things you can't see, such as moving things by 0.1mm to get just a slightly tighter fit.
The biggest change is the scalloped curve in the thumb tab to increase the grip while opening. Another larger change is less material near the back outside edge of the blade, this allows you to get a better grip with pliers when removing the blade.
I will order the 2nd prototype, and paid extra for shipping so I don't have to wait so long.
Post by: fishbulb59 on August 04, 2020, 04:56:03 PM
Here's my prototype T2 with my ideal tools: Leatherman blade (which I think is just about the perfect size for me in the T2/T4 form), 4mm driver and bottle opener, and #3 scalpel blade holder. I'm not carrying this around yet, but only because the 3D-printed tools aren't magnetic, and I *really* don't want the scalpel opening in my pocket. :)
The scalpel holder is 3.2mm thick, which is the thickness of the 'thick' extra tools, like the philips head or big flat head tools. The driver is 4.8mm thick, which is one 'thick' tool and one 'thin' tool, such as the file or awl. Since the T2 comes with two thick and one thin extra tool, the tool is still the same thickness overall. This is nice, because I didn't have to do the crazy stuff I did with the T4, like reshaping the thumb lock or shortening the screw posts. And since my metalworking skills are B- at best, that means the whole things fits back together a lot better.
I also reordered the stacking so there's a spring on either side of the bit driver. That means I can use a bit of extra width to hold the driver bit a little better. Those springs are 0.8mm thick, so I'm pressing my luck, but it seems to work OK for now.
I also designed a custom spacer that 'squares off' the profile of the handle, which also makes some room in the bottom for a few extra screwdriver tips held in by magnets. There are three tips in there right now, but it'll hold another two on top and still close just fine. I'm trying to figure out how to make the bottom of the spacer swing open, because getting the bits out is a real pain—you have to open all the tools, then fiddle around in there to get the tips to come loose from the magnet. It's a recipe for disaster with so many sharp blades nearby!
The custom spacer means I can make the tools a bit longer too. ZapWizard's bit drivers are designed to fit in the shorter tool space of the P2, which makes more sense; these tools only really work with a custom spacer in one of the knife bodies.
I ordered a metal printed version from Craftcloud (who is getting it printed by Sculpteo I think). I'll post here when it arrives if I can add anything useful to the discussion.
Post by: ZapWizard on August 04, 2020, 05:20:30 PM
I would recommend your own thread however, so folks can watch the progress and make/order their own copies once you get something prototyped.
Post by: fishbulb59 on August 04, 2020, 08:56:27 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on September 03, 2020, 05:59:51 PM
I would make the video with the mirrored version, except that one of the main requests was making the P2 bladeless using this mod, and so I need to wait.
(https://i.imgur.com/mYPoEjg.jpg)
Post by: Poncho65 on September 04, 2020, 01:18:03 AM
Post by: ZapWizard on September 15, 2020, 02:51:23 AM
The Scalpel holder for the Leatherman FREE P4 & P2 is now available!
https://youtu.be/tRQ7uay5Ji8
Post by: ZapWizard on September 15, 2020, 06:15:14 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/FWqOPgq.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/ddPM2Oh.jpg)
Post by: Poncho65 on September 15, 2020, 11:34:38 AM
One of those scapel holders is just what a person needs for bladeless areas :salute: :tu:
Post by: Juan el Boricua on September 15, 2020, 12:55:15 PM
Also for whacking on a disposable instead of chipping/snapping on the OE blade; or if you're not too keen on resharpening! :rofl:
Post by: Poncho65 on September 15, 2020, 08:51:26 PM
Post by: Slygrin on September 20, 2020, 10:54:53 PM
Post by: brab on September 22, 2020, 09:23:34 PM
One thing I noted about the P4 was that the back side of the main blade protrudes slightly beyond the side of the tool, wherein it is enclosed, similar to the Charge and the Wave, which makes access to the thumb opening aperture more easier and really obviates the necessity of adding a thumb assist opener to the main blade. At first I was going to add the thumb assist opener to the serrated blade only but decided to go ahead and add it to the main blade as well, (it does make the main blade more easy to open but not appreciably so). This situation made me wonder why Leatherman didn't make the P4 serrated blade the same as the Charge and Wave blades, with the protrusion of the blade back side beyond the side of the tool as the main blade is, so that the thumb opening aperture was easily accessible on both blades?.
I also purchased the flat bit driver from Shapeways, Zapwizard's outfit or the company marketing his mods, because I really wanted to be able to use the Leatherman bits and I felt the loss of the Phillips was not a big deal because I inserted the combination Flat Screwdriver/Phillips No.2 bit in the bit driver. Don't remember what the other tool that was lost from the P4 was, (because of adding the bit driver), but it wasn't a big deal because I never used it.
But the main reason I added this post was because I wanted to know if the long Leatherman flat bit, which combines the Flat Screwdriver with the Phillips No. 2, would fold into the tool and clear the pliers so that it folded up completely. Does anyone know? I guess I could shorten the Flat Screw driver end of the long bit, to make a longer bit work. Such a mod would make the default bit in the bit driver, more useful because it would have greater reach.
See attached pic.
Post by: ZapWizard on September 22, 2020, 09:36:39 PM
@brab
They made one only blade protrude so you can tell which blade your opening without looking, one of the issues with the wave is pulling out, opening the blade, only to look down and realize it was the wrong blade (since it is 180 degrees symmetrical)
Just to be clear, Shapeways is the manufacturer, they produce and drop ship the parts that I (and lots of other folks) design. They don't own my designs, or market them beyond giving me a store front to list my goods.
I assume your talking about the Leatherman Mut bit (https://www.leatherman.com/mut-bit-kit-140.html)? It looks to be twice as long as the standard bit. It would hit the pliers when folded up.
Leatherman does make a short combination bit kit here: https://www.leatherman.com/1-2-phillips-3-16-flat-screwdriver-bits-624.html
In other news:
I just purchased a Raptor, a Signal and a Skeletool with the intent of designing accessories. I get request for Thumb tabs for the signal and skeletool all the time, so those will be first, for the raptor I want to design a much slicker holster than the very bulky model that it comes with.
Post by: ZapWizard on September 24, 2020, 09:03:42 PM
It won't be cheap (nothing in the FREE series seems to be) as the vials are $10 a piece + UV adhesive. So to that end I rendered out all 72 possible color combinations so folks can visually decide on what combination they may want.
Also, will have a 2nd version for use with glow powder / epoxy.
I am partial to the orange/green combination.
(https://i.imgur.com/6dbvbpb.png?1)
https://youtu.be/0hq9aSKQuCw
I won't be prototyping this for a bit, working on lot of other stuff at the same time.
Post by: Poncho65 on September 25, 2020, 01:53:49 AM
Post by: PeaceInOurTime on September 29, 2020, 12:10:11 AM
Very cool! Do you have plans to make them for the Surge? (Not sure if these are interchangeable with the other non-Free tools)
Post by: ZapWizard on September 29, 2020, 12:11:39 AM
Post by: PeaceInOurTime on September 29, 2020, 12:16:03 AM
Post by: Slygrin on October 11, 2020, 09:22:34 PM
(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-zmJ4xWB/0/8620e6f3/M/i-zmJ4xWB-M.jpg)
Post by: ZapWizard on October 11, 2020, 11:58:54 PM
Post by: Poncho65 on October 13, 2020, 03:48:36 AM
Post by: Slygrin on October 13, 2020, 04:50:00 AM
Post by: SteveC on October 13, 2020, 05:36:29 AM
Is it OK to post up a scalpel holder for sale on this site? Like I said in my earlier post, I ordered the wrong one to begin with. I have a "medium" available. I don't want to break any rules.
Yes, be sure to read the rules. Here's a link to the for sale forum :tu:
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/board,7.0.html
Post by: Slygrin on October 13, 2020, 02:51:08 PM
Yes, be sure to read the rules. Here's a link to the for sale forum :tu:
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/board,7.0.html
Thanks! I know I should have just looked tor the rules.
Post by: Slygrin on October 28, 2020, 04:42:30 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on October 29, 2020, 04:30:23 AM
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B011730QDY/
Post by: carl on November 29, 2020, 02:08:25 AM
Allowing the thickness to be increased can allow extra implements to be added without removing original implements.
Post by: SteveC on November 29, 2020, 02:45:56 AM
Is there any Leatherman multitool where a mod to increase the thickness can be done?
Allowing the thickness to be increased can allow extra implements to be added without removing original implements.
You can squeeze a few extra tools in a Rebar using pivot screws from a Blast.
Post by: GeneralOsik on December 04, 2020, 02:52:44 AM
@ZapWizard, your mods have made me seriously reconsider my daily carry Multi-tool of 15 years, my trusty Victorinox SwissTool X. I work in IT, and I use it daily to pull and trim zip ties, unscrew PC components, slice packages or pallets open, and cut lots of things. I heard about the Leatherman Free P4, and decided to give Leatherman a solid chance at upsetting the venerable SwissTool.
I'm a tinkerer at heart, and I'm always looking to change or improve the things I choose to buy. The other day while I was cleaning the packing tape residue off the blade, I realized that there were about half the tools I never use. Then there's the scissors, which I know you guys love, but they are annoying me. Maybe it's because they don't cut well anymore, and Victorinox wouldn't warranty them, so I don't like them. The fact that Victorinox makes it difficult to modify their tool, and that their warranty procedure leaves something to be desired, I immediately turned to the best option for modification. In my opinion, that would be Leatherman. I've always wanted a Wave, ever since I saw Adam Savage use one on MythBusters. I've looked for them at thrift stores, but haven't had any luck, so I'm probably going to buy one used on fleaBay.
Since I'm looking to slim down my EDC, I'm looking for a tool that can replace one of my essential tools, a precision screwdriver. Now, I know what you're saying, the Wave has one, but that's too small for my needs. I personally carry, and outfit my IT department and team with Klein Tools precision screwdrivers. They come in a few sizes, and the bit is a non standard 3.5mm size, with integrated ball bearing retainer. There are three versions I own, and many more configurations for different trades. The models I own are the 32717 39 bit set with driver (just ordered because new tools), 32581 4 in 1 electronics screwdriver (my bench top, desk top, and laptop bag driver), and the 32614 4 in 1 pocket carry screwdriver (you guessed it, my pocket carry). They also have 32613, 32585, 32314, maybe a few others. I absolutely love these tools! The bits are dual sided, very high quality, self retaining, magnetic, and a nice length for laptop screws. The top cap spins nicely, but after a while, the rubber grip loosens and slides down. The pocket clip sucks, so it sort of just sits in my pocket most times I use it. You can find them on Amazon for pretty cheap, so when the grips wear out, I toss them, keep the barrels and bits, and order a new one.
What I would love to do is integrate this bit into a Leatherman tool, either a Wave or a P2 or P4. Because of the slimmer size, it would actually take up less space than your existing 4mm bit mod, which is amazing by the way! It would also integrate dual tips, in a wide variety of options, or specific tips from the 39 bit set. If you are interested in this mod, I would be happy to send you a tool above of your choice, or the ones that I recommend. And since I don't quite know if I still know how to upload photos, or what this forum's link policy is, I'll leave you to search for the above model numbers.
Thank you all for spurring my interest into another hobby I can tinker with! Now I'm going to go back to page 42 of the Leatherman Mods thread. :popcorn:
Post by: ZapWizard on December 04, 2020, 07:26:22 AM
I've always wanted a Wave, ever since I saw Adam Savage use one on MythBusters
What I would love to do is integrate this bit into a Leatherman tool, either a Wave or a P2 or P4.
FYI, that video of Adam making his Wave holster is what got me started on all this in the first place.
I had an old RadioShack screwdriver that had those 3.5mm double sided bits with built in ball retention. I loved using them. The ball might mean no magnet is needed, which has been a pain for the 4mm bit driver.
The 32717 model is the most interesting since it come with so many bits.
0.5mm isn't much of a saving over 4mm, but I am interested in trying out a design, I am not sure when I will get to doing it, but its on the list now.
Post by: GeneralOsik on December 04, 2020, 04:37:36 PM
FYI, that video of Adam making his Wave holster is what got me started on all this in the first place.
I had an old RadioShack screwdriver that had those 3.5mm double sided bits with built in ball retention. I loved using them. The ball might mean no magnet is needed, which has been a pain for the 4mm bit driver.
The 32717 model is the most interesting since it come with so many bits.
0.5mm isn't much of a saving over 4mm, but I am interested in trying out a design, I am not sure when I will get to doing it, but its on the list now.
I'm so glad you're interested!
I don't have it yet, but the 32717 bits look to be one sided and with no ball bearing retainer. Who knows, the bits might even be 4mm like iFixit or Wiha. All of the other tools listed look to have the 3.5mm dual sided bits with retainer. I also went ahead and ordered 32314, which appears to have all of the 4 different dual sided bits from the 4 in 1 sets, but no Schrader bit from the 32613 3 in 1 HVAC set. There is also a difference between the bits on my bench driver and my pocket driver. One set is slightly longer, and the bit pairing is different too. When I get home from work, I'll take some photos and upload them. That being said, I would recommend 32314 if you want all the different dual sided bits, 32581 and 32613 if you want to play with the different bit sizes and pairings, and 32717 if you want the large variety of single sided bits. Once you're ready to dig in, send me a message and I'll ship you some Klein Tools!
Post by: GeneralOsik on December 05, 2020, 08:06:38 PM
How do you guys live with the file size limit?
Post by: SteveC on December 05, 2020, 08:24:45 PM
Here is an Imgur album https://imgur.com/a/Gfld8vM (https://imgur.com/a/Gfld8vM) showcasing the bits from the two Klein drivers I have on hand.
How do you guys live with the file size limit?
Use the bbcode img tags from imgur or you can use a resizing app.
(https://i.imgur.com/DyAzqN2.jpeg)
Post by: GeneralOsik on December 18, 2020, 11:06:18 PM
I also got the 32717, and I have to say, this is the nicest bit set I own! The handle is almost identical to the pocket carry one I have, and the bit retention in the case is perfect. The case is very hard plastic and very nice. The bits are 3.5mm, 32.60mm long, but one sided.
I will order 32585, which has 4 Torx bits. This, with the 32581, should hold all 8 full length, dual sided, ball retention 3.5mm bits Klein sells.
Maybe there is a way to design the holder to either hold a double sided bit, or a single sided bit with a magnet installed in the bottom?
Post by: massmanjr on December 28, 2020, 03:38:18 PM
Post by: massmanjr on January 17, 2021, 03:22:08 AM
Post by: ZapWizard on February 03, 2021, 05:48:12 PM
ZapWizard, any update/news on the Laser-etched ruler along inside of scales? I apologize if I overlooked a recent post on this topic.
Sorry, apparently I ignored a email update on this thread, and forgot to manually check for updates!
I have put some thought into this. It means taking apart the FREE p4 entirely to do the etching. I still plan on doing this on my own personal P4, but I have lots of other things I am working on all at the same time, so its just on the back burner.
Also CO2 laser etcher I have access to requires me to use Cermark to mark bare metals. I can't directly etch the metal like a fiber laser could.
Cermark is a fusible ceramic coating that is sprayed onto metal and then laser etched. The markings are permanent and durable. However, the overspray has to be washed off with water, and I am not fond of dunking the assembled tool in water. Cermark is also very expensive, and while using our company supply for a one off is no issue, but offering it to others as a service means I would have to purchase my own can of it.
I'm so glad you're interested!
Regarding the 3.5mm bit holder, but sorry I have decided to not design it.
In the past few months I have had no less than four customers have issues with the 4mm bit holder arriving with a clogged magnet slot inside. The part is made from adhesively jointed steel powder that goes through a sintering process where the adhesive is exchanged for bronze. Using compressed air they have to clear any powder from inside the middle, but it isn't always cleared and so clogs and burrs sometimes remain. On top of that while clearing the powder, they have to be careful not to bend, squish or otherwise deform the part.
So far Shapeways has replaced each of the clogged prints, but they won't do that forever. If there are enough reprints/complaints they will deem the part "unprintable" and I will have to pull the 4mm bit holder from the market. A 3.5mm holder just will make this issue worse. I am also not confident I can tune the tolerances without a lot of prototypes.
Post by: MisterGizmo on February 04, 2021, 07:20:31 PM
Regarding the 3.5mm bit holder, but sorry I have decided to not design it.
In the past few months I have had no less than four customers have issues with the 4mm bit holder arriving with a clogged magnet slot inside. The part is made from adhesively jointed steel powder that goes through a sintering process where the adhesive is exchanged for bronze. Using compressed air they have to clear any powder from inside the middle, but it isn't always cleared and so clogs and burrs sometimes remain. On top of that while clearing the powder, they have to be careful not to bend, squish or otherwise deform the part.
So far Shapeways has replaced each of the clogged prints, but they won't do that forever. If there are enough reprints/complaints they will deem the part "unprintable" and I will have to pull the 4mm bit holder from the market. A 3.5mm holder just will make this issue worse. I am also not confident I can tune the tolerances without a lot of prototypes.
Can this clog be cleared with a 1/8" drill bit, similar to what you show in your video? I have no problem doing this kind of tuning but if the clog is really bad and drilling it out is not an option than I hesitate to order this. And what is the ratio of good parts to clogged parts, you say 4 were clogged but how many were ordered and delivered without clogs?
I am really impressed with the mods you have done and am about to order most of them, but I need to know weather this 4 mm bit holder is a good idea to get, thanks.
Post by: ZapWizard on February 04, 2021, 08:03:16 PM
Drilling this material is actually quite difficult even with cutting fluid and a carbide coated bit. It has both the hardness of stainless steel, and to binding of bronze.
The ratio is pretty low on the 4mm, but when it does happen it means the customer has to contact Shapways customer service, which I cannot do on their behalf. For some customers they just want a refund, which comes out of my pocket as Shapeways doesn't offer any warranty or refund beyond re-prints that are their fault.
Post by: MisterGizmo on February 04, 2021, 09:03:02 PM
If the 1/8" (3.2mm) hole can get clogged, than so can the 3.5mm hex opening. Also the smaller the hex opening the tighter the tolerance needs to be. I am not confident that the smaller opening will work every time.
Drilling this material is actually quite difficult even with cutting fluid and a carbide coated bit. It has both the hardness of stainless steel, and to binding of bronze.
The ratio is pretty low on the 4mm, but when it does happen it means the customer has to contact Shapways customer service, which I cannot do on their behalf. For some customers they just want a refund, which comes out of my pocket as Shapeways doesn't offer any warranty or refund beyond re-prints that are their fault.
Sorry, I wasn't asking about the hypothetical 3.5mm hex holder, that was another guy. I just wanted to ask about the frequency of the 4mm prints having clogs and if there was a way for me to clear it if it happens. It sounds like it is not too frequent so will order one and hope for the best. It's good to know that refund requests come out of your pocket - that is a terrible policy by Shapeways - if I have get a clogged one I will ask them to reprint, the last thing I want to do is take it out of your pocket and discourage you from continuing these awesome mods!
Post by: RedMango on February 15, 2021, 07:05:35 AM
Is there any chance you could do one of your very clear videos (or photo, whatever works for you) showing us the finishes of your bit mods side by side? I really can't decide between Bronzed Silver, Polished Bronze, Bronzed Black, etc.
Post by: fishbulb59 on February 15, 2021, 10:41:56 PM
I tried several different 4mm and 3.5mm tools to get a multi-bit driver in my pocket. (I'm looking at the same Wiha driver and Klein bit set on my desk right now.) I ended up getting a Husky 8-in-1 Precision Slotted and Philips Screwdriver from Home Depot. It was like $6, and it comes with a few two-sided bits with ball bearing retention that are 3.5mm wide. They have another one with Torx bits, if you're into that sort of thing.
It got me what I wanted: A 4.8mm-wide bit driver tool and extra bits in my pocket.
(https://i.imgur.com/9eIVAKW.jpg)
I designed that driver and had Shapeways print it, but I ground down the sides a bit to allow it to close up into the knife a bit better.
(https://i.imgur.com/ToD8mUk.jpg)
The bit driver is exactly as wide as one "thick" tool and one "thin" tool. I also did a scalpel holder that's the same thickness as a single "thick" tool:
(https://i.imgur.com/vVKiaYQ.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/Rc50QLt.png)
The idea is that you can stack both of those tools with the original blade and they'll all fit nicely into a T2. Both of the bits are a bit longer than normal, closer to the length of the main blade, because I was already printing a custom backplane. If there's sufficient interest, I can probably tweak both of these to make them publicly available.
Post by: ZapWizard on February 18, 2021, 06:56:37 PM
Mr. Wizard,
Is there any chance you could do one of your very clear videos (or photo, whatever works for you) showing us the finishes of your bit mods side by side? I really can't decide between Bronzed Silver, Polished Bronze, Bronzed Black, etc.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50956721296_12df19f65e_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2kCSvWh)
In the photo the two top scalpel holders and the loose flat bit holder are all both "Bronze Silver Steel". As you can see the color can vary a bit.
The flat bit holder in the P4 is the "Black Bronze Steel". It seems to have a treatment that will patina off in time. (Which I actually like)
The 4mm bit holder that is in the P2 at the bottom of the tool is the straight bronze color, which is more even, but also duller looking.
My ears were burning in this thread. :)
Both designs look good. Did you need to grind it down due to the minimum thickness that Shapeways required?
Post by: fishbulb59 on February 18, 2021, 10:53:24 PM
No, it wasn't them. :) I had done the same thing you did on one of your bit adapters, where I took advantage of the additional width available toward the end of the bit when there's a spring on either side. I think I had done an extra 0.8mm on either side, figuring I'd probably end up grinding it down a bit. When I got the tool back from Shapeways, it fit, but it brushed against the blade on one side and the scale on the other in a way that annoyed me. I think my next iteration of that tool is going to be shorter, so it will fit with the original plastic spacer in place, and also a bit narrower so I don't have to grind it down. This full-length version is also a bit heavier than I'd like, so making it shorter will help with that too.
Both designs look good. Did you need to grind it down due to the minimum thickness that Shapeways required?
Post by: CovertPenguin on February 27, 2021, 05:27:38 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on February 27, 2021, 05:30:47 PM
What did you use to cut the Surge T shank file and saw down to fit inside the P4? I can't seem to find anything detailing how to shorten file steel.
I just used a Dremel with a reinforced cutoff wheel, and then a stone grinder to smooth the cut.
Since it is a hardened steel file, you can't use a hack saw or anything metal to make the cut.
Post by: CovertPenguin on February 28, 2021, 01:28:06 AM
Post by: RedMango on March 01, 2021, 07:12:30 PM
I wonder if someone (Zap wink wink) could develop a little tiny area for engraving using this space. Like a little plate that fits seamlessly with the style of the Leatherman free, that we could take to an engraver to put our initials or something in.
Anyway I thought that would be more fun than just filling it with screws.
Post by: ZapWizard on March 02, 2021, 05:11:20 PM
I wonder if someone (Zap wink wink) could develop a little tiny area for engraving using this space.
That is a great idea! But the area would be quite small as you said, but enough space for some initials.
Here is the design I came up with. (No plans on manufacturing this, so DIY folks)
(https://i.imgur.com/6Up7UoX.jpg)
Here are some renderings I whipped up with different materials.
(https://i.imgur.com/rMMk0fr.jpg)
Stainless steel, Cermark etching
(https://i.imgur.com/8OWvAIs.jpg)
Blackened Aluminum, Laser Etched
(https://i.imgur.com/KKFtiVR.jpg)
Polished Brass, Cermark etching
Post by: RedMango on March 05, 2021, 04:32:30 AM
However, I appreciate your work on the idea. Always the best from the ZapWizard. Thanks.
Post by: CovertPenguin on March 14, 2021, 06:59:01 PM
I got the tritium vial prototypes in, and didn't have any blades even left in my P4 to install them into. (I am going to put the main blade back in)
:gimme: Thank you, ZapWizard! I eagerly await this one too. (Already have the flat bit driver, t-shank, and scalpel mods)
Post by: Syncop8r on March 22, 2021, 11:29:59 AM
It would be great if there was a way to shorten the file/saw blade holder so that one didn't need to shorten the file and saw blade. :shrug:
I'm guessing the barrier to this is the screws needing to sit in the cutout and no further back?
I wonder if the file/saw could be secured another way to get around this... maybe the screws drive in from the spine instead of the face and push a wedge-shaped piece down to secure it. :think:
Other than that :nothingtoadd:
Post by: ZapWizard on March 22, 2021, 06:47:41 PM
It would be great if there was a way to shorten the file/saw blade holder so that one didn't need to shorten the file and saw blade. :shrug:
As you guessed: If the blades were left full length then the shank of the T-Shank would end up inside the pivot point.
I did look at using set screws to bind directly against the blade, the catch here is that there isn't enough thickness in the metal for the set screw length. If tightened on a 1mm blade the screws would have had only one or two threads left to hold.
I actually didn't think about having them on the side, that might have worked but would still have something protruding. But I may look at what a side screw might do just because a new idea can sometimes open up other ideas. :cheers:
Post by: ZapWizard on March 25, 2021, 10:49:01 PM
https://youtu.be/0fSLZB3yZfc
Post by: Poncho65 on March 26, 2021, 01:58:40 AM
:like:
:popcorn:
Post by: ZapWizard on March 26, 2021, 02:37:58 AM
Here is the end result:
(https://i.imgur.com/gVjonq9.jpg)
Post by: pa_strunk on March 26, 2021, 03:16:36 AM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on March 27, 2021, 11:33:44 AM
Post by: Poncho65 on March 27, 2021, 06:40:12 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on March 28, 2021, 01:04:14 AM
Today I sat down to design a holster for the new Leatherman Ratchet Driver. Instead ended up with these designs. (All these images are 3D renderings)
----------
(https://i.imgur.com/hzklgXb.gif)
I designed a very cool (if it works) design that will use magnets to retain the Ratchet Driver and twelve regular bits.
There is a revolver style ejector that you get started by pushing a button at the end of the handle. This allows easier access to six of the bits.
The cool part is that you can take the handle apart from the Ratchet Driver to allow it to take up less space in a bag or pocket.
----------
(https://i.imgur.com/LjOI8yg.jpg)
This part would be 3D printed with all the moving parts already stuck inside. Getting all the magnets glued in will be a bit tricky.
----------
(https://i.imgur.com/AcmBnVr.jpg)
I also designed a no-magnet option which uses friction to hold the bits and Ratchet Driver. It has a deep 1/4" socket at the back of the handle.
----------
(https://i.imgur.com/fHuj2mK.jpg)
Finally, the actual ratchet mechanism is hard to turn. So this little addon will increase the grip and leverage on the Ratchet mechanism.
----------
I don't know when I will get around to 3D printing these all up. I also still need to make a holster style design.
Post by: Poncho65 on March 28, 2021, 01:15:47 AM
Great work :like:
Post by: Syncop8r on March 28, 2021, 01:45:00 AM
Post by: vadsoom on March 28, 2021, 03:18:14 AM
Post by: ReamerPunch on March 28, 2021, 03:34:21 AM
That's fantastic, what a design! And the gif is also sweet. :cheers:
Post by: pa_strunk on March 28, 2021, 06:13:57 AM
Post by: Poncho65 on March 28, 2021, 07:01:22 AM
:D
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on March 28, 2021, 10:37:03 AM
Pure genius. I had been idly wondering why you hadn't instantly come up with the appropriate holster Zap, but now I know why :D
When will it be available?
Post by: ZapWizard on March 29, 2021, 01:11:16 AM
Okay, now I have a holster design. Plus a bonus micro carrier. Each one can hold six bits, and the Ratchet. They should also work with the regular bit extender.
The will be available in BDU, Duty and Open Clip variants.
I had been idly wondering why you hadn't instantly come up with the appropriate holster Zap, but now I know why :D
When will it be available?
What happened is I started to try do a design that would surround the whole ratchet, allowing to to sort of dock into the handle, but this turned out to be very bulky. Then I realized it would work better as a handle.
I have had lots of requests for adding this to the holster designs. I will take a look at that next. However, I already have a ton of holster combinations, so I may only do the popular ones at first, and on a request basis after that.
As always I will be physically prototyping these. Shapeways shipping isn't fast, and neither is their service during Covid. I am not sure if I will order every variant, as that gets expensive quick, especially if I have to makes tweaks.
I don't expect to sell these for 4 to 6 weeks. In 4 to 6 weeks I also may be able to print these on a FormLabs Fuse 1.... that will change everything as I will have to setup my own store and ship from home.
Post by: MisterGizmo on March 30, 2021, 06:35:56 AM
Everything you do is awesome! I've been following your work with the P4 since I got mine a year ago and thanks to the convergence of my stimulus money coming and the Leatherman Ratchet being released, I took the plunge and ordered one of everything you make for the P4, should be getting the goodies from Shapeways in a week or so and I'm so excited.
It is funny that the ratchet was the tipping point but all of a sudden I saw how great the combination of your bit holder and the ratchet would make driving fasteners. Lets face it - a multitool has never been a very good way of dealing with alot of screws or bolts but we do it because we have the dang thing in our pocket and don't want to run to our toolbox to get a proper screwdriver when we just need to tighten a couple screws or get that little battery cover off of all those toys and gadgets. But now everything has changed - using a big square hunk of stainless steel to drive screws is fine if there is a nice ratchet attached and you don't have to re-grip that big square tool every half turn of the screw. I've been using the bit driver in my Skeletool with the ratchet for the last week as a proof of concept and it is great - so fast, so easy, so satisfying. And it will be even better with the P4 when I get your mods because it will be such a versatile and powerful tool.
Of course there are plenty of people dissing the Leatherman Ratchet - it's not made in America - its only guaranteed for 2 years - it blows up if you try to drive some 1/2 lag bolts into some hardwood... but come on people it's not made for that! Mine has worked great on all of the light and medium duty screw driving I've done, and more importantly it has made it fast and fun.
Anyway, I love the bit driver handle design that you couldn't resist making and am excited you may have access to a Fuse 1 so you can stop sharing the profits with Shapeways!
Post by: ZapWizard on March 31, 2021, 09:15:53 PM
I need some opinions on this.
I am hesitant to add a ratchet grip to any of my existing tool holsters because of the larger diameter of the Ratchet Tool.
Here it is attached to a FREE P4 holster, and visually it doesn't look that bad, but physically I feel it would be quite awkward.
Post by: Poncho65 on March 31, 2021, 09:23:57 PM
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on March 31, 2021, 10:15:02 PM
Or, for balance, the extension on one side and the ratchet on the other. One can't fully exclude the need for both. This is the way :D
Post by: Syncop8r on March 31, 2021, 10:36:52 PM
Or, for balance, the extension on one side and the ratchet on the other. One can't fully exclude the need for both.Can the ratchet do everything the extender can do? The extender might be redundant...
Ratchet on one side and flashlight on the other, for balance. ;)
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on April 01, 2021, 03:05:39 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on April 01, 2021, 04:17:48 PM
@Syncop8r, I stay away from adding flashlight holsters as there are just way too many damn flashlights, no way to make a universal grip.
I do carry a seperate flashlight holster right next to my Free P4 holster, I just put them on together each time I head out to work. So this is why the separate holster is preferred myself.
Before I go through the process of making it fit all the multitools, I may end up just prototyping the P4 version for myself to see if it replaces my holster as the daily carrier.
Post by: Dutch_Tooler on April 01, 2021, 04:44:13 PM
Understood. No real harm done as I usually carry the P4 holster together with a mini Skinth holding extra tools/bits which, lo and behold, has space for the ratchet (looks more in danger of falling out than it is, as the setting knob hooks behind the cover flap).
Post by: Happy Gilmore on April 05, 2021, 01:08:44 AM
how are we not talking about this?
Post by: ZapWizard on April 05, 2021, 02:53:47 AM
how are we not talking about this?
The first I have seen this. It's a bit funny that he made the video without watching the how-to videos I published. Fortunately he caught himself on that detail. (mostly)
His video does have some good points, I didn't realize how much folks would want the 4mm over the flat bits.
Post by: CovertPenguin on April 05, 2021, 07:11:22 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/8Tw9A0j.jpg)
I need some opinions on this.
I'd buy the ratchet holster variant. I'm even one of those horizontal carry weirdos.
Post by: Happy Gilmore on April 06, 2021, 03:40:12 AM
The first I have seen this. It's a bit funny that he made the video without watching the how-to videos I published. Fortunately he caught himself on that detail. (mostly)
His video does have some good points, I didn't realize how much folks would want the 4mm over the flat bits.
I'm with him, and I'm very thankful you were willing to make it. So thank you!
Post by: ZapWizard on April 22, 2021, 07:24:37 AM
I finally got around to ordering the prototypes for the Ratchet Driver. Including a ratchet holder version of the P4 holster, not guarantees on that yet.
Also, for the past month I have been working on my own storefront, powered by Shopify.
Initially it will be stocked with just Shapeways sourced products, along with Amazon affiliate links for items which I can't stock.
The main goal of the shop will be to reduce the confusion with all the variants and options available. The FREE P4 holster for example comes in more than 45 different configurations, and that doesn't even include the different color options.
Feel free to visit the site and sign up to be notified. (Link in the image)
Post by: Poncho65 on April 22, 2021, 11:23:21 AM
Post by: Poncho65 on May 03, 2021, 11:44:57 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on May 04, 2021, 03:44:59 AM
Post by: Poncho65 on May 04, 2021, 04:55:19 AM
Hoping it arrives in great condition at least by tomorrow :salute: :tu:
Post by: ZapWizard on May 05, 2021, 09:56:59 PM
I ordered four prototype products for the Ratchet driver. Three of them have identical retention mechanisms.
The holster works beautifully, it snaps into place and isn't too loose or too tight. The micro carrier however required a whole ton of filing. (Nylon doesn't file well)
The 1/4" hex opening at the bottom on the holster is too loose, and the one on the micro carrier is perfect.
Then there was the handle. Again the same retention geometry, but this time I had to file about 2x material away, and it still doesn't have the nice snap of the holster, just a dull press fit.
Finally, the deluxe handle. It had looser tolerances so that the bits could slide in and out, and relied on magnets. However, it is super tight and nothing slides without jamming up.
SLS 3D printing typically holds a tolerance of +/- 0.2mm, but today it didn't. Some of the dimensions are off by 0.5mm. I think the issue is that Shapeways isn't fully cleaning out the internal powder before dying the parts, and the parts end up with the loose powder glued inside.
At this point I can tweak the tolerances and hope they aren't too loose, or just wait until I have access to a Fuse 1. Considering the production and shipping takes a month, I may end up with the Fuse 1 before I can receive another order.
Post by: Poncho65 on May 05, 2021, 11:44:07 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on June 07, 2021, 01:11:12 AM
ZapWizard.com is now open for business. I spend a lot of time on this website, making sure everything works great. Currently all the printed items are still fulfilled by Shapeways, but that may change in time.
I also finished the designs for the Ratchet drive accessories. I can now print up my prototypes on a Fuse 1, so that will save time on future developments. It's not my own Fuse 1, so I won't be able to do any production runs on it.
Post by: Poncho65 on June 07, 2021, 02:15:27 AM
Great about the 3D printer as well 8) :like:
Post by: Tikker on July 19, 2021, 04:07:27 PM
Post by: Michael Y on July 27, 2021, 03:59:01 PM
I'll wait until that's released as I'll be ordering a bunch of other bits and pieces and that Shapeways shipping to Oz is steep!
On another note, just thought I'd flag this YouTube video: https://youtu.be/ibw-GT-IRBA
Not sure if you're aware of this fellow or not and maybe there's some relationship there I'm not aware of, but if not it just seems a bit like he's misrepresenting your work as his. In the comments he's even discussing charging to make some modifications for another YouTuber.
Post by: Poncho65 on July 27, 2021, 04:39:05 PM
oh man, that mini ratchet handle/holder is fantastic
The Large and Micro handles are awesome 8) :like: :like:
Post by: ZapWizard on July 27, 2021, 05:35:41 PM
He also posted a follow-up video with my name since he wanted to live with the mods before promoting anything:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NCdzybkGvk
Sorry for the lack of new things (such as the ratchet added holster)/. I have been working on some other projects.
I have spent some time to get the ratchet design to work on all the tools so can update them all at once, but it is harder to fit to the Wave and others without it protruding. So soon that will get the P4 holster with ratchet driver ready to order for folks.
Post by: ZapWizard on October 07, 2021, 05:49:02 PM
At the request of a customer I designed a shorty version of my Leatherman Ratchet Driver handle.
This one is specifically designed to fit half of the awesome Wiha 77781 tehcnician bit refill kit.
Also, I am now offering a custom install service. See my website in signature for details.
Post by: Poncho65 on October 07, 2021, 07:13:13 PM
I have both the large handle that fits the regular 1/4 inch bits and the micro handle that fits the LM flat bits but that looks awfully tempting :dwts:
:like: :like:
Post by: ZapWizard on October 24, 2021, 06:01:14 PM
I discovered you can use the FREE P4 sort of like a T-Handle, with the ratchet driver as a nice extender. This came in handy when replacing my Dad's yard cart carbonator.
Post by: Poncho65 on October 24, 2021, 08:52:46 PM
Post by: PeaceInOurTime on October 25, 2021, 04:16:41 AM
Post by: Tikker on February 21, 2022, 02:17:05 AM
Post by: ZapWizard on August 29, 2022, 03:59:31 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJB_CuFUfzc
Post by: Poncho65 on August 29, 2022, 04:00:09 AM
Post by: ZapWizard on July 31, 2023, 04:59:58 AM
First off the Garage #5 (with a few mods) is to culmination of everything I wanted in a multitool.
First off here is a short video showing the mods I have already made to my #5:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9o8mINGCaB4
And here is a 48 minute video showing how I did it all, along with other design details.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIcpzRkpQms
Over on Reddit I made a post showing some interesting details regarding the blade design:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Leatherman/comments/15dt2gu/leatherman_garage_5_blade_rendered_in_detail/
Back in June of 2022 I rendered up what I called the FREE Z1 (https://www.reddit.com/r/Leatherman/comments/vfb7u7/free_series_with_file_and_bit_changer_an/). I invite you to compare the toolset to the Garage #5.
I have spent today 3D modeling the new tools, and designing a new holster for the Garage #5. I will be physically prototyping it soon.
The images below are renderings.
(https://i.imgur.com/h25wF9x.jpg)
And per a customer request I designed The Barnacle, a scale-mounted compact single bit holder.
We will see if this needs glue or can snap into place.
(https://i.imgur.com/97oZcZT.jpg)
Post by: Cynan on July 31, 2023, 08:05:11 AM
Post by: Poncho65 on July 31, 2023, 01:02:24 PM
Post by: Rich_SD on July 31, 2023, 03:43:05 PM
Post by: fishbulb59 on July 31, 2023, 06:07:56 PM
Post by: Cynan on July 31, 2023, 06:34:31 PM
Post by: ZapWizard on July 31, 2023, 08:10:04 PM
Post by: Outback in Idaho on November 11, 2023, 11:32:21 PM
As such, will be looking for the Bit Extender and probably order one next payday.