Multitool.org Forum
Tool Talk => Swiss Army Knights Forum => Topic started by: GuyWood on March 25, 2013, 08:14:34 PM
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Was googling SAKs at work today and found an article on some random men's site called something like '5 things you should know about Victorinox penknives'.
One of the facts was that Victorinox make every part of every SAK except... The corkscrew :o. Apparently, Victorinox have the corkscrews made for them by a Japanese company. Anyone know if this is true? Here's the aticle:
3- Not all of the Swiss Army Knife is Swiss-made
But most of it is. At the Victorinox headquarters in pastoral Ibach, even the machines that punch long strips of steel (2,500 pounds of it a year) into recognisable tools by grinding, polishing, hardening, and (excepting certain hand-made models) assembling and casing them, are made by Victorinox for Victorinox in their mechanical department. The only part of your Swiss Army Knife that’s not 100% Swiss-made, oddly enough, is the little corkscrew. Turns out, the Swiss are really good at working with steel but not so good at forging. For that, you need some Japanese know-how. A Japanese company forges the corkscrews and ships them to Ibach for assembly.
Feel free to ignore the obvious rubbish about using just over a ton of steel a year :D. Victorinox recycle 599 tons of steel grindings a year according to one of their own videos on YouTube.
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I'm not sure about this. I actually read somewhere that the corkscrews are made in France but not sure about that either.
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Sounds like an email to Switzerland might be called for...
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I had read France too. It was on the interweb, so it must be true. :think:
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I can not confirm this 100%, i had a question in one time on a economy or eco knife. I got in reply that the corkscrew was made by 3 different French makers. I have never double checked this.
But now i read others to have mentioned France too and Japan aswell?
It is strange to see on approx 1979-1981 Economy corkscrews and how similar they look today, now on the regular line.
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I heard France as well. Its a useless tool for me though. The one time I used it it snapped. I can live without it.
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Sorry to hear that :(. I use mine quite a bit and it seems pretty tough! I've emailed Ibach HQ so I await their answer with interest :).
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I had read France too. It was on the interweb, so it must be true. :think:
Think I read it on the sakwiki about France :tu:
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Space Cowboy -
The corkscrew is useless to me also. I drink cheap beer and expensive scotch.
Wine is for the frufru crowd. No offense intented to those of you who do
drink wine. Although as a youngster I did drink Ripple and
Boone's Farm - but didn't need a cordscrew for them :-)
Rich S
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I don't use a corkscrew either, but I keep the eyeglasses driver there. Although I don't wear glasses it can still be helpful when I don't have the superior one on my wave.
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Thankfully the Swiss are resistant to Californians.
California sued Leatherman for their USA logo on their tools, since not all parts were made in the USA. Good to see that the Swiss snub their noses at that over-nosy busy-body state. That's why there are no USA stamps on Leatherman tools anymore, but in all fairness the USA should still be allowed - since it does not state Made in USA. Even 'Oregon, USA' should be allowed. Even 'Oregon Proud' should be good.
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I also never use the CS as drink whisky and most the wine we get has screw tops :D its the reason I like the tinker,but i do prefer the champs inline phillips as easyer to use :tu:
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I'll give you time to adjust to your new reality.
:climber: Still Awesome!
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Any information on the corkscrew would be of interest. IIRC I read once that (some???) of the corkscrews on the Elinox models were made of inferior steel? One of the reasons I am curious in general about the corkscrew.
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Oh ye unimaginative ones who disparage the venerable corkscrew :twak: I do not drink wine either but that is probably the least use for the corkscrew anyway. The main one, already mentioned, is to perfectly hold a mini-screwdriver. It is also the perfect solution for tangled fine jewelry chain (my wife is a real believer since I have saved so many of her chains). Come on you closet corkscrew users out there, add to the list. :cheers:
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I was always under the impression they were made in japan. I read that long ago, I think on here somewhere. It was a thread about how various manufactures have parts made elsewhere and what they were. Leatherman pliers heads from mexico, and Im sure it was swiss corkscrews from japan.
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Turns out, the Swiss are really good at working with steel but not so good at forging. For that, you need some Japanese know-how. A Japanese company forges the corkscrews and ships them to Ibach for assembly.
This part makes me think it's BS, the corkscrew isn't forged.
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I'm a corkscrew user and proud of it. :salute: I only have a few without them (not counting ALOX) and if I carry them, there's always a corkscrew on my keychain. :)
I'd like to hear what Ibach has to say about where it's made though.
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This is what google turned up on corkscrew making.
1 An open worm is formed by forging a steel rod into a helix shape. After sharpening one tip, the rod is heated to soften it for shaping. For example, 440C stainless steel is heated at 1,500°F (650°C) for 30 minutes, then at 2,100lF (1,000°C) for five minutes.
2 The hot rod is wound around a rotating cylindrical mandrel. To help guide the rod into a uniform spiral with the desired angle and spacing between successive coils, a grooved mandrel may be used.
3 Immediately after coiling, the spiral is hardened. This is done by reheating the worm to 1,500°F (650°C) and letting it cool slowly. Mild steel, on the other hand, is quenched by plunging the still-hot spiral into room-temperature water.
http://www.madehow.com/Volume-6/Corkscrew.html
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Origin , no biggie , they work for me and many friends !
Chris
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"In the past the corkscrew was forged. But since decades we buy the corkscrew from a French supplier as a semi-finished product." Sachbearbeiterin - Customer Service, Victorinox, quoted by Metaleer over on KnifeForums, 10-07-12
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Thank you for this :tu: . Since my info also had "French supplier". It was mentioned 3 different aswell but not sure. This they have done for along time.
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Thankfully the Swiss are resistant to Californians.
Good to see that the Swiss snub their noses at that over-nosy busy-body state.
Not all of us native Californians are keen on the Big Brother Bureaucracy there either, seems they are trying to idiot-proof everything to the insult of those of us with a shred of common sense. Which is one of the reasons I left, kind of a shame though, there is a lot of natural beauty there along with the unnatural ugliness.
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Believe it or not i like Leatherman alot, no matter what people say it is a high quality product. Could be better against corrosion. this is just a maintenance problem. Well Leatherman is not for me to discuss here.
The Swiss use steel from other countries, design from other countries and parts. They have used different steels from Germany and France. Probarbly Sweden aswell, since both Wenger and Victorinox older catalogues say this. It must be steel from Sweden since they say drop forged Swedish stainless steel blades. I did some research before but i got to a stop. Could not find it, i had in mind Fagersta , this place suffered after the steel crisis in the 70s, put down around 1980. But Fagersta Sweden is just speculative.
Blades are not forged anymore on the SAK, and it is all about using high quality stainless with the DIN. After the image of the Brand
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Thankfully the Swiss are resistant to Californians.
Good to see that the Swiss snub their noses at that over-nosy busy-body state.
Not all of us native Californians are keen on the Big Brother Bureaucracy there either, seems they are trying to idiot-proof everything to the insult of those of us with a shred of common sense. Which is one of the reasons I left, kind of a shame though, there is a lot of natural beauty there along with the unnatural ugliness.
Am a defected native too. :D Lovely here in Idaho, 'cept for jobs & single women.
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Thankfully the Swiss are resistant to Californians.
Good to see that the Swiss snub their noses at that over-nosy busy-body state.
Not allra of us native Californians are keen on the Big Brother Bureaucracy there either, seems they are trying to idiot-proof everything to the insult of those of us with a shred of common sense. Which is one of the reasons I left, kind of a shame though, there is a lot of natural beauty there along with the unnatural ugliness.
Am a defected native too. :D Lovely here in Idaho, 'cept for jobs & single women.
Heh, chased a single woman to the Blue Ridge, and fell in love with the place, still lots of natural beauty and less frantic people. :cheers:
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(https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/529989_10152720364075105_2087486496_n.jpg)
I hope this gives an idea how it's actually made. I made this picture in Ibach at the factory....
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Thankfully the Swiss are resistant to Californians.
Good to see that the Swiss snub their noses at that over-nosy busy-body state.
Not allra of us native Californians are keen on the Big Brother Bureaucracy there either, seems they are trying to idiot-proof everything to the insult of those of us with a shred of common sense. Which is one of the reasons I left, kind of a shame though, there is a lot of natural beauty there along with the unnatural ugliness.
Am a defected native too. :D Lovely here in Idaho, 'cept for jobs & single women.
Heh, chased a single woman to the Blue Ridge, and fell in love with the place, still lots of natural beauty and less frantic people. :cheers:
Some guys have all the luck! :D She got a sister?
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Thankfully the Swiss are resistant to Californians.
Good to see that the Swiss snub their noses at that over-nosy busy-body state.
Not allra of us native Californians are keen on the Big Brother Bureaucracy there either, seems they are trying to idiot-proof everything to the insult of those of us with a shred of common sense. Which is one of the reasons I left, kind of a shame though, there is a lot of natural beauty there along with the unnatural ugliness.
Am a defected native too. :D Lovely here in Idaho, 'cept for jobs & single women.
Heh, chased a single woman to the Blue Ridge, and fell in love with the place, still lots of natural beauty and less frantic people. :cheers:
Some guys have all the luck! :D She got a sister?
Alas no, only a sister in law, and not to be overly superstitious, but I attribute my luck to carrying one of my lucky SAK's or other very faithfully. ;)
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"In the past the corkscrew was forged. But since decades we buy the corkscrew from a French supplier as a semi-finished product." Sachbearbeiterin - Customer Service, Victorinox, quoted by Metaleer over on KnifeForums, 10-07-12
Well, well... learning something new every day. I had read long ago that it was from a Japanese company, and didn't have any reason to doubt it.
Another proud corkscrew user here... It's a dandy micro-marlinspike, it holds the cord when I'm making lanyards and such, it holds the micro-screwdriver, it wrassles hard-to-get-to porous material (ceiling tiles, filters, etc.), an-nnd... it opens bottles of wine! My wife and I like to take day hikes to the many waterfalls here in the southern Blue Ridge Mountains, and pack in a picnic avec le vin.
If the can opener blade didn't work as well as it does on Phillips screws, then the corkscrew vs Phillips question would be a real quandry for me, but as it is, the corkscrew is a win-win.
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I actually used mine for the intended purpose the other day. Wine :). Funny thing is the cork was hard to come out so I thought how do this work? Then it occurred to me. The slight back movement the corkscrew and other back side tools do have a purpose. I screwed it in until it was flush with the end. Then a slight push with sak and it was uncorked. Gently pulled and out it came. Good on ya Vic. Works like a charm.
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"Corkscrew: Just start the point in near the center of the cork and turn; the corkscrew will naturally follow its point on in. The hardest part of pulling the cork is to first get it moving, that first millimeter. This can be done easily by turning the corkscrew all the way down, until the back of the SAK is on top of the bottle. Lever the body of the knife a bit against the top of the bottle, as if starting to close the corkscrew (along the length of the knife, not sideways) to start the cork. This will put a small dent in the alox divider, but now you’ve got a veteran SAK. Then hold the bottle between your feet and pull straight up. Try not to hit yourself in the face. Sommeliers say to turn the bottle and not the cork, so maybe don’t put it between your feet in a French restaurant."
The SAK Owner's Manual
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Actually, Vic recommends not using the handle for leverage.
From http://www.victorinox.com/ch/content/faq_SAK_customer_service_page/category/1 :
Fully insert the corkscrew into the cork and pull the cork vertically upwards and out of the bottle. Try to avoid twisting or tilting the knife body
Just use straight arms (yes, both arms) and pull with the shoulder muscles, instead of the arm muscles, if the cork puts up a fight.
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Who you gonna believe? Me and TattoSteve, or some knife speSmurfpillst in Switzerland?
I Like a little dent on my Climber's divider. Gives it character.
The link above does not work for me: the first time it went to the Victorinox US main page where a Search for Using corkscrew says No search results found; Use of corkscrew ditto; second time the page says Error processing your request. Do you suppose they read my mind in Ibach?
I take it back, Victorinox ! You guys are the greatest !
I need a beer. One Old Chub, please. Not too cold. :cheers:
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Who you gonna believe? Me and TattoSteve, or some knife speSmurfpillst in Switzerland?
Good point! :D
The link above does not work for me: the first time it went to the Victorinox US main page where a Search for Using corkscrew says No search results found; Use of corkscrew ditto; second time the page says Error processing your request. Do you suppose they read my mind in Ibach?
I think it's the genius of their region sensitive site which optimises for difficulty in sharing links across the pond. :rant:
(Pet peeve: Why don't corporations understand sharing links from their site is good for business? Instead they choose to hire some manager's nephew to implement the entire site as a flash application it's not even possible to cut and paste from.)
I need a beer. One Old Chub, please. Not too cold. :cheers:
The ultimate solution to corkscrew discussions... ;)
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The link above does not work for me: the first time it went to the Victorinox US main page where a Search for Using corkscrew says No search results found; Use of corkscrew ditto; second time the page says Error processing your request. Do you suppose they read my mind in Ibach?
I think it's the genius of their region sensitive site which optimises for difficulty in sharing links across the pond. :rant:
(Pet peeve: Why don't corporations understand sharing links from their site is good for business? Instead they choose to hire some manager's nephew to implement the entire site as a flash application it's not even possible to cut and paste from.)
Yea, that localisation thingie they did ruined a good resource site. :-\
Here's a screenshot from the part you quoted form the page.
(http://forum.multitool.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=43954.0;attach=47976;image)
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Received this yesterday - doesn't actually answer the question :-\:
Thank your for your mail and your interest in our products
All main-parts/tools are made in Ibach/Switzerland. There are some e.g. the corkscrew, small keyring that we do the finishing here in Ibach.
However there are other subcomponents (rivet, bushings, scissors springs and the ballpoint pen) that we use to manufacture the different features.
Therefore all main-parts like tools, springs, dividing layers and the original Victorinox handles are produced here in Ibach.
We hope that this mail answers your questions. If you have other queries please dont hesitate to re-contact us
With best regards,
Victorinox AG
Daniel Mettler
Global Customer Service
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Received this yesterday - doesn't actually answer the question :-\:
Thank your for your mail and your interest in our products
All main-parts/tools are made in Ibach/Switzerland. There are some e.g. the corkscrew, small keyring that we do the finishing here in Ibach.
However there are other subcomponents (rivet, bushings, scissors springs and the ballpoint pen) that we use to manufacture the different features.
Therefore all main-parts like tools, springs, dividing layers and the original Victorinox handles are produced here in Ibach.
We hope that this mail answers your questions. If you have other queries please dont hesitate to re-contact us
With best regards,
Victorinox AG
Daniel Mettler
Global Customer Service
As I read it; it answers the question (and more), and is consistent with their previous responses to this same question.
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I guess, but he didn't actually say the corkscrews are made in France. Mind you, we pretty much knew that anyway :).
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After the parcel hook, the corkscrew is the most maligned tool on a SAK. But, haters gonna hate... :whistle:
I prefer the corkscrew to the phillips by far; my two main uses of it are for holding the mini-driver for tightening up my glasses, and using it to undo knots in my shoe or boot laces. I also use the hook for doing fine detail tightening of the laces of my hiking boots. My wife and I are both avid hikers, and I have exceptionally wide feet (4xE), so I have to resort to some creative lacing strategies at times, and the hook and corkscrew together are invaluable tools for me when hiking!
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I guess, but he didn't actually say the corkscrews are made in France. Mind you, we pretty much knew that anyway :).
I would not be surprised if the actual source for the unfinished parts changes with different contracts.
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Got some interesting info from Pierre-Andre in Switzerland :
"Thiers is the capital for the french cutlery and a few miles away is living Charles Couttier, a "Maître artisan coutelier". I visited him a few years ago to buy him a knife and while talking I asked me from which area I was coming. When he heard that I was a Swiss guy, a smile came on his face and and he said "Ah Victorinox" with an obvious pleasure. He then explained to me that his father was working for the cutlery industry. At this time, a lot of workers had their own workshop and were acting as contract manufacturers. When times were hard, the situation of these workers was difficult to the low demand. Fortunately, Charles's father made corkscrew bits for Victorinox, ensuring a continuous income for the family. As a boy, Charles helped his father and earned his first money, using the hand driven machine, still operational as I saw from a demo from Mr Couttier. It was the first time I had the opportunity to knew a bit more about the SAKs.
Today, the corkcrew bits for Wenger and Victorinox are still manufactured in the area of Thiers."
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Thanks for the update. :salute: So we know have confirmation that the corkscrew is made in France. That it's actually made in the region of Thier is reassuring with it's long history.
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Pierre-Andre (who lives in Switzerland) also told the story of meeting a bunch of knife makers and fans in a park in France and having to lend them his SAK corkscrew for their vin francais. Yes, he was appropriately "compensated".
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Is this the chap to finally give the definitive answer as to the reason for the fluting? That is if it's not been answered already. :D. Good info nonetheless. :tu: