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Tool Talk => Swiss Army Knights Forum => Topic started by: M0rkoni on March 18, 2014, 08:42:16 PM

Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 18, 2014, 08:42:16 PM
In my humble opinion we should have to establish this club a long time ago.  :)

Regarding the knives:
let's say, from the beginning around 1890 till ca. 1970., all sizes old timers and both brand (Victorinox & Wenger) in one place, are most welcome.
As far as I know, such topic does not exist yet but if I'm wrong let somebody correct me please. And I just hope that many will approve and find themselves in this topic. So, here we go...

Gotta love those old models. As I see it, they built them with much, much... did I said much more quality at that time than now... After all, just look at the condition of these two 60+ years old knives. That's just absolutely amazing and I'm positively stunned every single time when I find one.  :)

What is more interesting to me, sometimes I think it'd be pretty amazing to know the history behind one as well. How many miles it's traveled, etc.

So let's start this wonderful journey into the past with these two gems.  :)

NOTICE:
It would be so nice and most useful if you already made a topic with some vintage knives in the past that you include that link in your post here. Just to keep everything in one place and tidy. Also, when you do a post, please include some useful info if you know regarding that particular model (year of manufacture, model name, number etc.) or simply ask if you don't know and somebody will answer, for sure.

As time goes by this topic could grow into a huge database of useful and much needed information about vintage SAKs if all of us put in some effort. That's my goal and general idea.
Thanks guys and gals.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: RamoN on March 18, 2014, 09:07:16 PM
Nice idea for a most interesting club, especially if the backstory of some saks could be told. I dont think ill ever be able to join but i could visit frequently  :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 18, 2014, 10:05:02 PM
Thank you for your support and yes, you should visit it as much frequently as possible, of course.  :)
I just hope that the majority will accept this idea, also.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: captain spaulding on March 18, 2014, 10:12:43 PM
Here is my rather uncommon Wenger. Found this on Craigslist.


(http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad112/ChadV_2010/Knives%20and%20MT%203/DSC04151.jpg) (http://s927.photobucket.com/user/ChadV_2010/media/Knives%20and%20MT%203/DSC04151.jpg.html)

 (http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad112/ChadV_2010/Knives%20and%20MT%203/DSC04149.jpg) (http://s927.photobucket.com/user/ChadV_2010/media/Knives%20and%20MT%203/DSC04149.jpg.html)

(http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad112/ChadV_2010/Knives%20and%20MT%203/DSC04152.jpg) (http://s927.photobucket.com/user/ChadV_2010/media/Knives%20and%20MT%203/DSC04152.jpg.html)

(http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad112/ChadV_2010/Knives%20and%20MT%203/DSC04190.jpg) (http://s927.photobucket.com/user/ChadV_2010/media/Knives%20and%20MT%203/DSC04190.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: sawman on March 18, 2014, 10:14:51 PM
Nice one, Cap'n! :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: captain spaulding on March 18, 2014, 10:18:33 PM
Nice one, Cap'n! :D

Thank you.  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 18, 2014, 10:23:42 PM
@captain spaulding

Nice one...  :tu:

And welcome to the club. :)

Is there any chance that you know the model name, number, year of manufacture...anything?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: captain spaulding on March 18, 2014, 10:53:06 PM
There was no model name when it was made only a catalogue number. I had a thread about it somewhere. Let me see if I can find it. 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Caranthanus on March 18, 2014, 11:15:18 PM
Kinda oldish snobbish club  :think: :whistle:
... the future of any society lies within the youth ... :facepalm:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: captain spaulding on March 18, 2014, 11:32:31 PM
@captain spaulding

Nice one...  :tu:

And welcome to the club. :)

Is there any chance that you know the model name, number, year of manufacture...anything?


I'm not sure of an exact age. I do remember someone linking to a old catalog with a picture of this model, but can't find it. This knife is estimated to be anywhere from the mid 50's to mid 60's. Here is a link to my original thread that has some more pictures. More info on this knife is always appreciated.

http://forum.multitool.org/index.php?topic=42545.msg682014#msg682014
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 18, 2014, 11:47:37 PM
These are all useful information, captain and I'm sure that someone will provide us with that link to solve the enigma regarding model name (number)...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Luna Knife on March 18, 2014, 11:53:56 PM
I really dont belong in the club...

I bought this for a dollar, owned it for a week, wiped it with a soft cloth then sold it. 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Blade runner on March 19, 2014, 01:50:36 AM
Not very old, but I love this one, much better quality than present models.(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/19/pujudy9e.jpg)


Enviado desde mi iPad con Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on March 19, 2014, 01:56:46 AM
Here's an interesting old fiber-handled model. Have no idea what the model number is. Its thinner and about 3mm shorter than the 1951 pattern Soldier. The can opener dates it to about the late 1940s.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 19, 2014, 08:35:32 AM
I really dont belong in the club...

I bought this for a dollar, owned it for a week, wiped it with a soft cloth then sold it.

At least, you had a nice piece in your hand for a while, Luna. I'm sorry to hear that is gone...  :(
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 19, 2014, 08:56:11 AM
Not very old, but I love this one, much better quality than present models.(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/19/pujudy9e.jpg)


Enviado desde mi iPad con Tapatalk

But it is old enough... :) Victoria crossbow tang stamp on the other side, right? And the frame size is...? Do you have any details regarding this particular model? Thanks.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: PTRSAK on March 19, 2014, 09:51:25 AM
Some of my oldies.

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/20130111_214811_zps12e2d457.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/20130111_214811_zps12e2d457.jpg.html)

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/20130111_214853_zps4e99cb9a.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/20130111_214853_zps4e99cb9a.jpg.html)

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/20130712_125447_zps40a380ec.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/20130712_125447_zps40a380ec.jpg.html)

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/20130527_161353_zps7af18b27.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/20130527_161353_zps7af18b27.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Blade runner on March 19, 2014, 11:31:50 AM
Not very old, but I love this one, much better quality than present models.(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/19/pujudy9e.jpg)


Enviado desde mi iPad con Tapatalk

But it is old enough... :) Victoria crossbow tang stamp on the other side, right? And the frame size is...? Do you have any details regarding this particular model? Thanks.
That's rigth, Victoria Crossbow tang stamp and is 84mm.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: GigaHz on March 19, 2014, 01:57:36 PM
From the late 40s. I think it is a model 146.

(http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll211/gigahzfemtohz/246E096_zps7dffb4ec.jpg) (http://s289.photobucket.com/user/gigahzfemtohz/media/246E096_zps7dffb4ec.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: neillcurrie on March 19, 2014, 02:04:43 PM
Strange, I have a model of similar vintage, with the same crab-claw opener, and mine has a fairly deep relief in the scale to access the nail nick in that opener.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 19, 2014, 03:11:31 PM
Not very old, but I love this one, much better quality than present models.(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/19/pujudy9e.jpg)


Enviado desde mi iPad con Tapatalk

But it is old enough... :) Victoria crossbow tang stamp on the other side, right? And the frame size is...? Do you have any details regarding this particular model? Thanks.
That's rigth, Victoria Crossbow tang stamp and is 84mm.

That should be 134kU aka small Tinker.  :)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on March 19, 2014, 03:11:48 PM
1958-1961 Model 134kU, aka Tinker or Tinker Small. I'd say 50 years old is old enough to be vintage.

Not very old, but I love this one, much better quality than present models.(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/19/pujudy9e.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 19, 2014, 03:17:51 PM
Some of my oldies.

Nice oldies you have there, PTRSAK...just beautiful.  :)
Any additional info regarding frame size, model name, number, year of manufacture will be much appreciate it...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 19, 2014, 03:22:52 PM
From the late 40s. I think it is a model 146.

(http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll211/gigahzfemtohz/246E096_zps7dffb4ec.jpg) (http://s289.photobucket.com/user/gigahzfemtohz/media/246E096_zps7dffb4ec.jpg.html)

It's just... :drool:  :tu:


Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 19, 2014, 03:34:39 PM
1958-1961 Model 134kU, aka Tinker or Tinker Small. I'd say 50 years old is old enough to be vintage.

Not very old, but I love this one, much better quality than present models.(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/19/pujudy9e.jpg)

Nice to see you here jazzbass... As a matter a fact, I expected that.
Your detailed information are most welcome. 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on March 19, 2014, 04:42:27 PM
From the late 40s. I think it is a model 146.

Definitely late 1940s, the model is 246ka.

Old model number key for the curious
First, the main number:
1xx = Phillips, 2xx = Corkscrew.
x34 = blades, openers
x35 = blades, openers, scissors
x36 = blades, openers, scissors, saw
x37 = blades, openers, saw
x45 = blades, openers, scissors w/ LNF
x46 = blades, openers, scissors w/ LNF, saw

Then the letters after:
k = 84mm (klein). No k = 91mm
a = toothpick/tweezers
f = fish scaler
m = metal file
U = bail/keyring


There are other numbers like 248k that are just assigned and don't really follow a pattern.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Blade runner on March 19, 2014, 06:32:38 PM
1958-1961 Model 134kU, aka Tinker or Tinker Small. I'd say 50 years old is old enough to be vintage.

Not very old, but I love this one, much better quality than present models.(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/19/pujudy9e.jpg)
That's nice, thought it was early 70's! I have a 91mm very similar, a Fisherman will take picture later.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Blade runner on March 19, 2014, 06:52:32 PM
(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/20/tu6e8y2e.jpg)


Enviado desde mi iPad con Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAKMikey on March 19, 2014, 07:46:52 PM
Here are my brass lined Pioneer from the '70s and Soldier from 1968. These aren't necessarily super vintage or anything but the Soldier is pretty hard to come by in red Alox.

(http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2825/12825046943_59c6b7ae20_c.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on March 19, 2014, 08:28:04 PM
(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/20/tu6e8y2e.jpg)

Same time frame as the other - 1958-1961 plus or minus a year or so. I'd call this one an Angler because of the corkscrew.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on March 19, 2014, 10:20:48 PM
I thought about posting some of the SAKs I have pictures of, but most have been posted in other threads here and I'm sure most are sick of seeing the same knives over and over. Here are three interesting ones I don't think I've posted before. The Cadillac is interesting in that it's much newer than you usually see for this model. You don't typically see them after about 1972.

(http://sakinfo.com/bbsimg/MVNTRangerLNF.jpg)

(http://sakinfo.com/bbsimg/MVNTFischermesser.jpg)

(http://sakinfo.com/bbsimg/TRANCadillac.JPG)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: GigaHz on March 19, 2014, 10:26:56 PM
Sweet LNF. I didn't know they came in Rangers.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on March 19, 2014, 10:29:34 PM
Sweet LNF. I didn't know they came in Rangers.

Officially they don't really. I think this was a custom run for Coutellerie du Mont Blanc. It's the only one I've ever seen.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: PTRSAK on March 19, 2014, 11:02:54 PM
Some of my oldies.

Nice oldies you have there, PTRSAK...just beautiful.  :)
Any additional info regarding frame size, model name, number, year of manufacture will be much appreciate it...

Will supply more details when I get home. Also got some others that will fit in this thread...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Blade runner on March 20, 2014, 01:00:49 AM
I thought about posting some of the SAKs I have pictures of, but most have been posted in other threads here and I'm sure most are sick of seeing the same knives over and over. Here are three interesting ones I don't think I've posted before. The Cadillac is interesting in that it's much newer than you usually see for this model. You don't typically see them after about 1972.

(http://sakinfo.com/bbsimg/MVNTRangerLNF.jpg)

(http://sakinfo.com/bbsimg/MVNTFischermesser.jpg)


(http://sakinfo.com/bbsimg/TRANCadillac.JPG)
The Huntsman small of your trade list is  :drool: :drool:
And thanks for the info.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Chako on March 20, 2014, 01:37:52 AM
Here are a couple of ones I have, and I am uncertain of their age. I do know they are old. Any info on them would be greatly appreciated.

The first is what SAKWiki calls a Student. However, my copy isn't 75mm, but more like 73mm.

(http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r207/Chako_photo/Chako_photo001/IMG_4357small_zps7b7afee1.jpg) (http://s145.photobucket.com/user/Chako_photo/media/Chako_photo001/IMG_4357small_zps7b7afee1.jpg.html)

(http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r207/Chako_photo/Chako_photo001/IMG_4360small_zpsa017a1b8.jpg) (http://s145.photobucket.com/user/Chako_photo/media/Chako_photo001/IMG_4360small_zpsa017a1b8.jpg.html)

(http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r207/Chako_photo/Chako_photo001/IMG_4362small_zpsd191bbb2.jpg) (http://s145.photobucket.com/user/Chako_photo/media/Chako_photo001/IMG_4362small_zpsd191bbb2.jpg.html)

this next one is 75mm and your guess is as good as mine. Probably better as I don't know what this one is called.

(http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r207/Chako_photo/Chako_photo001/IMG_4358small_zps5b50bd28.jpg) (http://s145.photobucket.com/user/Chako_photo/media/Chako_photo001/IMG_4358small_zps5b50bd28.jpg.html)

(http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r207/Chako_photo/Chako_photo001/IMG_4365small_zps331c0a05.jpg) (http://s145.photobucket.com/user/Chako_photo/media/Chako_photo001/IMG_4365small_zps331c0a05.jpg.html)

(http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r207/Chako_photo/Chako_photo001/IMG_4367small_zpsc6722e46.jpg) (http://s145.photobucket.com/user/Chako_photo/media/Chako_photo001/IMG_4367small_zpsc6722e46.jpg.html)

(http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r207/Chako_photo/Chako_photo001/IMG_4369small_zpsfb2587c4.jpg) (http://s145.photobucket.com/user/Chako_photo/media/Chako_photo001/IMG_4369small_zpsfb2587c4.jpg.html)

And both of them together.
(http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r207/Chako_photo/Chako_photo001/IMG_4372small_zps1e2dc8db.jpg) (http://s145.photobucket.com/user/Chako_photo/media/Chako_photo001/IMG_4372small_zps1e2dc8db.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on March 20, 2014, 02:45:04 AM
Here's an old 2-blade Wenger with carbon blades and silver handles.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 20, 2014, 09:17:53 AM
I thought about posting some of the SAKs I have pictures of, but most have been posted in other threads here and I'm sure most are sick of seeing the same knives over and over. Here are three interesting ones I don't think I've posted before. The Cadillac is interesting in that it's much newer than you usually see for this model. You don't typically see them after about 1972.

Never enough of these beautiful oldies, jazzbass... If you can find your previous posts about them it will be most generous of you to incorporate those links in this thread. All together in one place moto.
Btw, very nice pictures (knives), like from the catalog (book). :)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 20, 2014, 09:30:15 AM
Some of my oldies.

Nice oldies you have there, PTRSAK...just beautiful.  :)
Any additional info regarding frame size, model name, number, year of manufacture will be much appreciate it...

Will supply more details when I get home. Also got some others that will fit in this thread...

Thanks and I'm eager to see some more, like everybody else I presume.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: PTRSAK on March 20, 2014, 09:40:11 AM
All my oldies. (I think)

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0169_zps46bf52fa.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/IMG_0169_zps46bf52fa.jpg.html)

a nice little 84mm Tourist(?) with all the good stuff. Brassy shield, 5 turn corkscrew, Bail, +PAT opener, Wire scraper, Clip point blade, VICTORIA tang stamp.

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0171_zps88cca920.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/IMG_0171_zps88cca920.jpg.html)


A Hoffritz Small Tinker, VICTORIA, square Phillips with file, Metal tip Tweezers, +PAT opener, Brassy shield, clip point small blade.

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0174_zpsa9eea399.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/IMG_0174_zpsa9eea399.jpg.html)
(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0173_zps4a705e97.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/IMG_0173_zps4a705e97.jpg.html)


Hoffritz Tinker, clip point blade and square Phillips.

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0175_zps7513d210.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/IMG_0175_zps7513d210.jpg.html)

Tangs

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0178_zps2799ad27.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/IMG_0178_zps2799ad27.jpg.html)

1940 stamped M1908 soldier

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0176_zps37004055.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/IMG_0176_zps37004055.jpg.html)

A couple of c1940's Wengers.  Interesting for the tang stamps on the small blades as well as the main blades.

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0179_zpsf0c38733.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/IMG_0179_zpsf0c38733.jpg.html)

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0181_zps72d5cf2a.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/IMG_0181_zps72d5cf2a.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: PTRSAK on March 20, 2014, 10:14:18 AM
Before and after shots of my old Wenger with dog-leg opener and non-backspring scissors.
I have had this knife since I was a kid. It is what brought me to MTO in the first place searching for info on it.
I decided to retire it and give it a makeover with brass liners and polishing the aluminium scales I made for it 20 years ago.

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/P6140949_zps873b11f7.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/P6140949_zps873b11f7.jpg.html)
(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/Final_A_zps6be2143f.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/Final_A_zps6be2143f.jpg.html)

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 20, 2014, 10:43:13 AM
Very nice background story, thanks for sharing... That one can be one nice heritage, also.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: neillcurrie on March 20, 2014, 12:58:31 PM
Before and after shots of my old Wenger with dog-leg opener and non-backspring scissors.
I have had this knife since I was a kid. It is what brought me to MTO in the first place searching for info on it.
I decided to retire it and give it a makeover with brass liners and polishing the aluminium scales I made for it 20 years ago.

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/P6140949_zps873b11f7.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/P6140949_zps873b11f7.jpg.html)
(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/Final_A_zps6be2143f.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/Final_A_zps6be2143f.jpg.html)

Just beautiful work there. I remember reading your posts from a few months ago, before you had started the restoration. There's an almost impossible to convey sense of value and attachment to an item that's been so well used and then so lovingly restored.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Chako on March 20, 2014, 03:34:42 PM
Here are a few more.

A Fisherman.
(http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r207/Chako_photo/Chako_photo001/IMG_4386small_zpsc6794152.jpg) (http://s145.photobucket.com/user/Chako_photo/media/Chako_photo001/IMG_4386small_zpsc6794152.jpg.html)

A Champion. Unfortunately, my copy has a broken tip on one of the knife blades.
(http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r207/Chako_photo/Chako_photo001/IMG_4391small_zps908084cc.jpg) (http://s145.photobucket.com/user/Chako_photo/media/Chako_photo001/IMG_4391small_zps908084cc.jpg.html)

Outdoorsman.
(http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r207/Chako_photo/Chako_photo001/IMG_4379small_zps9761f8f0.jpg) (http://s145.photobucket.com/user/Chako_photo/media/Chako_photo001/IMG_4379small_zps9761f8f0.jpg.html)

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 20, 2014, 03:47:27 PM
That brassy Fish...  :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 20, 2014, 03:51:52 PM
Ambassador, Victoria tang stamp & No 248 aka Gourmet, Armee Suisse tang stamp...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: bmot on March 21, 2014, 07:54:08 AM
Here is my rather uncommon Wenger. Found this on Craigslist.

(http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad112/ChadV_2010/Knives%20and%20MT%203/DSC04190.jpg) (http://s927.photobucket.com/user/ChadV_2010/media/Knives%20and%20MT%203/DSC04190.jpg.html)


Is that a pate spreader?  :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: captain spaulding on March 21, 2014, 08:00:44 AM
Here is my rather uncommon Wenger. Found this on Craigslist.

(http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad112/ChadV_2010/Knives%20and%20MT%203/DSC04190.jpg) (http://s927.photobucket.com/user/ChadV_2010/media/Knives%20and%20MT%203/DSC04190.jpg.html)


Is that a pate spreader?  :think:

That would be a file as well as a mud scraper/snow scraper, but I guess you could use it as a pate spreader.  :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 21, 2014, 11:50:30 AM
Here is my long nail file Climber (along with a couple of commemorative models).

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/CollectableSAKs_zpsc301ee9f.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: framemaker on March 21, 2014, 12:36:50 PM
I think this belongs here :) The only vintage SAK so far, in my small but growing collection. Elinox alox pioneer, late 1950'S?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on March 21, 2014, 06:09:03 PM
Here's a couple of mine :)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/victorinox-victoria-champion.jpg)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/elinox.jpg)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/victorinox-victoria-armee-suisse-234H-spartan-01.jpg)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/victorinox-victoria-72-H-01.jpg)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/victorinox-officier-suisse-inoxyd-84mm-horn-01.jpg)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/victorinox-victoria-84mm-horn-01.jpg)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/victorinox-victoria-234-spartan-01.jpg)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/victorinox-victoria-horn-scaled-solo-clip-point.jpg)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/victorinox-75mm-01.jpg)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/victorinox-executive-alox-gold-03.jpg)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/victorinox-elsener-soldiers-knife-01.jpg)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/victorinox-2231-alox-lumberjack-02.jpg)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/victorinox-red-alox-cadet-ii-02.jpg)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/victorinox-victoria-72-H-02.jpg/img]

[img]http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/victorinox-ibach-schwyz-secretary.jpg)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/victorinox-alox-ambassador-lady-victoria-black.jpg)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/74mms.jpg)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/91mmwaiter1.jpg)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/91mmwaiter2.jpg)

I like that last one because it has a mirrored can opener where you would expect a bottle opener or maybe a combo tool.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: twiliter on March 21, 2014, 06:15:09 PM
Wow Reinier, lots of nice ones. That 74mm with the bail is just way cool, never saw one before. :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on March 21, 2014, 06:18:28 PM
Yes that's a cool one, and it's almost mint. Got it in a trade with jazzbass, very happy with that.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 21, 2014, 06:25:06 PM
I like that last one because it has a mirrored can opener where you would expect a bottle opener or maybe a combo tool.

:tu:

And some nice oldies Reinier...   :)

Is there any chance that somebody have spare aluminum head tweezers for 91mm frame? Thanks guys.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: DMA1965 on March 21, 2014, 07:05:55 PM
The combination of the sharpened bottle opener, patent marked can opener, clip shaped pen blade, and shackle on this old Victoria Champion places it at around 1968, according to what I have been able to gather.  It also has the file on the Phillips screwdriver, but does not have a long nail file, nor does it have toothpick and tweezers.  The wood saw is also finished with a very high polish.

It is absolutely solid and in superb condition.  I keep it hanging by my desk.

(http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff126/dma1965/VictoriaChampion_zps571956fb.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on March 21, 2014, 09:53:53 PM
Here's a couple of mine :)

Hey! Isn't one of those mine now? (5th from the top)  :cheers:

The combination of the sharpened bottle opener, patent marked can opener, clip shaped pen blade, and shackle on this old Victoria Champion places it at around 1968, according to what I have been able to gather.  It also has the file on the Phillips screwdriver, but does not have a long nail file, nor does it have toothpick and tweezers.  The wood saw is also finished with a very high polish.

This is a Master Craftsman, not a Champion. Model 136mU if you want to be precise. The polished saw would date it to around 1962-1963. Very nice knife.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on March 21, 2014, 10:06:10 PM
Here's a couple of mine :)

Hey! Isn't one of those mine now? (5th from the top)  :cheers:


You are right! And I think those three 74mm's were yours once ;)
The other horn scaled one and both 84mm SAKs have been sold as well.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on March 21, 2014, 10:09:22 PM
(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/victorinox-victoria-72-H-02.jpg)

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/victorinox-ibach-schwyz-secretary.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on March 21, 2014, 10:43:43 PM
A lot of great looking ones, Reinier!  :tu:

Old Wenger Electrician's (?) knife, dated 1946.


Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: DMA1965 on March 21, 2014, 10:53:08 PM
Here's a couple of mine :)

Hey! Isn't one of those mine now? (5th from the top)  :cheers:

The combination of the sharpened bottle opener, patent marked can opener, clip shaped pen blade, and shackle on this old Victoria Champion places it at around 1968, according to what I have been able to gather.  It also has the file on the Phillips screwdriver, but does not have a long nail file, nor does it have toothpick and tweezers.  The wood saw is also finished with a very high polish.

This is a Master Craftsman, not a Champion. Model 136mU if you want to be precise. The polished saw would date it to around 1962-1963. Very nice knife.


Wow thanks!  I thought it may have been a Master Craftsman, but the closest I could find on SAKWiki was Champion.  I appreciate your insight.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: GigaHz on March 22, 2014, 12:39:24 PM
74mm

(http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll211/gigahzfemtohz/glgl004_zps94597c09.jpg) (http://s289.photobucket.com/user/gigahzfemtohz/media/glgl004_zps94597c09.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 22, 2014, 07:15:35 PM
 :tu:

What tang stamp Giga? Thanks.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: GigaHz on March 22, 2014, 07:22:20 PM
(http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll211/gigahzfemtohz/74mm022_zps0c42022e.jpg) (http://s289.photobucket.com/user/gigahzfemtohz/media/74mm022_zps0c42022e.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mike, Lord of the Spammers! on March 22, 2014, 07:44:57 PM
Lovely stuff :)

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ICanFixThat on March 23, 2014, 06:42:31 PM
This one is not too special, but I just opened the package today and there is some sun for pics so...

84mm Brass Liners, spacer, pins.  Only the one tang stamp.  Can't remember the name for these scales. I can't remember if this one is much different than me or others have shown in the past but the brass liners I really like.

(http://forum.multitool.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=51152.0;attach=119960;image)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 23, 2014, 08:04:26 PM
This one is not too special, but I just opened the package today and there is some sun for pics so...

84mm Brass Liners, spacer, pins.  Only the one tang stamp.  Can't remember the name for these scales. I can't remember if this one is much different than me or others have shown in the past but the brass liners I really like.

Speaking of Brass Liners, spacers, pins... There is something classy in brass.   :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: HankSolon on March 27, 2014, 09:03:21 PM
Vintage Cybertool:

(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/28/ebyva9at.jpg)

Am I in? :-D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: GigaHz on March 27, 2014, 09:14:52 PM
me too

(http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll211/gigahzfemtohz/ct34riv001_zps6c741fc1.jpg) (http://s289.photobucket.com/user/gigahzfemtohz/media/ct34riv001_zps6c741fc1.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: HankSolon on March 27, 2014, 09:32:22 PM
Sounds legit to me. ;-)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: willc on March 29, 2014, 09:36:59 PM
(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/30/ysyqysu9.jpg)
I just got a couple older SAK's
The one on left is stamped Elinox, it is a Spartan, no Pat on opener and the thing I am curious about is the color of the scales.
Is this tomato red normal for a certain time period?

Not sure what model the other is.
VSSR stamped,+Pat on opener, small clip point blade, scissors, bottle opener, backside has awl and Phillips w/file.
Any info would be great. Thanks.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: detron on March 29, 2014, 09:40:32 PM
the term vintage seems to have different levels.

all I have is this,  not that vintage

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/Lumberjack/20131121_083253.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/Lumberjack/20131121_083253.jpg.html)

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/Lumberjack/20131121_083217.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/Lumberjack/20131121_083217.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ducttapetech on March 29, 2014, 10:30:59 PM
Very nice everyone! Here is mine.
(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/30/9erujaje.jpg)
84mm Huntsman
that's us mobile
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 29, 2014, 11:09:55 PM
the term vintage seems to have different levels.

all I have is this,  not that vintage

I was determine "Vintage" term for this thread in my first post here:
"let's say, from the beginning around 1890 till ca. 1970., all sizes old timers and both brand (Victorinox & Wenger) in one place, are most welcome."

So you are most welcome with your peace detron...  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 29, 2014, 11:40:42 PM
Very nice everyone! Here is mine.
(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/30/9erujaje.jpg)
84mm Huntsman
that's us mobile

Really nice one! :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ducttapetech on March 29, 2014, 11:42:59 PM
Thanks. She is a nice one. I will carry her every now and again. I like using the can opener on it. Very neat how it works.

that's us mobile

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on March 30, 2014, 10:17:17 PM
the term vintage seems to have different levels.

all I have is this,  not that vintage

That counts IMO. Everyone's terminology is different, but I consider anything before 1970 "vintage". Here are some of my older Lumberjacks from the 1950s. Interestingly, the pins on both the 240kUs are brass, not nickel-silver. These are the only knives from the era I've ever seen with brass pins, but I've seen it consistently on these 240kU models. The 1240kU is a very early Elinox model - if you look close enough you can kind of see the unpolished main and pen blades.

(http://sakinfo.com/bbsimg/OldLumberjacks.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on March 30, 2014, 10:18:09 PM
Very nice everyone! Here is mine.
(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/30/9erujaje.jpg)
84mm Huntsman
that's us mobile

Nice! What are the tang stamps on the main blade? Armee Suisse/Inoxyd?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: detron on March 30, 2014, 10:21:06 PM
the term vintage seems to have different levels.

all I have is this,  not that vintage

That counts IMO. Everyone's terminology is different, but I consider anything before 1970 "vintage". Here are some of my older Lumberjacks from the 1950s. Interestingly, the pins on both the 240kUs are brass, not nickel-silver. These are the only knives from the era I've ever seen with brass pins, but I've seen it consistently on these 240kU models. The 1240kU is a very early Elinox model - if you look close enough you can kind of see the unpolished main and pen blades.

(http://sakinfo.com/bbsimg/OldLumberjacks.jpg)

 :ahhh   it counts   :ahhh

those are lovely @jazzbass

I hope to find (flea markets, pawn shops, etc, not ebay) some other vintage SAKs in the future.  only time will tell
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ducttapetech on March 30, 2014, 10:53:56 PM
Very nice everyone! Here is mine.
(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/30/9erujaje.jpg)
84mm Huntsman
that's us mobile

Nice! What are the tang stamps on the main blade? Armee Suisse/Inoxyd?
That is correct.

that's us mobile

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on April 03, 2014, 04:05:38 PM
Well, pretty rare and odd one, for sure.
Fischer tang stamp with bail, all tools unpolished, sharpened bottle opener and off center shield...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Herman on April 03, 2014, 05:46:34 PM
Very nice Morkoni! All others too btw, nice to see.  :tu:
Who knows more about Fischer? I've seen it before, also with the Elinox-style emblem. Quite rare, no?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on April 03, 2014, 07:58:57 PM
Thanks Herman...
Not much is known about the Fischer company but all I know is that the company Fischer was a wholesaler in Switzerland, Victorinox importer for the Baltic countries viz a small area of Eastern Europe. Victorinox produced under the brand name Fischer some pocket tools around '57-'58.
More info on this tang stamp is always appreciated...  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: PTRSAK on April 05, 2014, 06:24:49 AM
latest oldie... restored from very "used" condition.

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0206_zpsd436a237.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/IMG_0206_zpsd436a237.jpg.html)

before

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0184_zps7c32e2a8.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/IMG_0184_zps7c32e2a8.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on April 05, 2014, 08:42:27 AM
It's always nice to see when somebody back to life an old timer especially like this one. I more prefer restoration type by restoring it to its original state but that's just me...  :)
Nevertheless this is a very nice work, I must say...   :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: singleshot03 on April 05, 2014, 01:45:47 PM
Some very impressive knives and takes collecting to another level.

Jim
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: detron on April 05, 2014, 11:58:54 PM
I just got this one,  anyone able to help date it?  or ID it?



(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140657.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140657.jpg.html)

Large blade Tang obverse

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140711.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140711.jpg.html)

the small blade tang stamp

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140635.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140635.jpg.html)

Shield


(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140825.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140825.jpg.html)

Rear inlaid "GENEVE"

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140907.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140907.jpg.html)

showing the top view of layers

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140743.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140743.jpg.html)

the bail

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140751.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140751.jpg.html)

Cork screw is fluted, but only 4 turns.

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140811.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140811.jpg.html)

Awl, can opener, and bottle opener

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_135808.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_135808.jpg.html)

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_135815.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_135815.jpg.html)

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_135841.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_135841.jpg.html)

single sided file

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_135917.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_135917.jpg.html)

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_135926.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_135926.jpg.html)

notice how short?

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_135956.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_135956.jpg.html)

Fish scaler

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140043.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140043.jpg.html)

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140051.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140051.jpg.html)

hard to see, but the tip is thicker than the main part of the scaler

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140109.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140109.jpg.html)

Saw

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140225.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140225.jpg.html)

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140236.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140236.jpg.html)

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140258.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140258.jpg.html)

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140310.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140310.jpg.html)

Scissors

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140405.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140405.jpg.html)

just below the screw here you can see a second notch that is like a nail nick

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140446.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140446.jpg.html)

main blade is not what it use to be

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140557.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140557.jpg.html)

small blade

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140602.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140602.jpg.html)

so, here is my newest SAK and though it is "well used?"  I love it

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140602.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/SAKs/OLD%20Wenger/20140405_140602.jpg.html)

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: captain spaulding on April 06, 2014, 02:31:09 AM
Sweet Wenger!  :tu:


Cant help to much but if you remember I have one similar we talked about in this thread and another thread. Go to page one of this thread.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on April 06, 2014, 09:10:14 AM
Nice one detron...  :tu:
Actually it seems exactly like yours Cap with addition of bail... regarding identification it will be pretty hard to do that especially with some older Wenger models, there is a considerable lack of information related to older models.  :(
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on April 10, 2014, 06:28:05 PM
N° 237 aka Camper
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on April 12, 2014, 02:06:33 AM
Got my Victoria marked Climber in....
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/VictoraiClimber_zps498adb9b.jpg)



...and as some of you already saw, I discovered I had a Victorinox Passenger in my possession (it was stuck in with a bunch of Explorers I bought a couple of years ago).

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Unknown_zps54910b34.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: GigaHz on April 13, 2014, 01:17:11 PM
Late 40s I would guess?
(http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll211/gigahzfemtohz/armee022_zps4b6bf026.jpg) (http://s289.photobucket.com/user/gigahzfemtohz/media/armee022_zps4b6bf026.jpg.html)
(http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll211/gigahzfemtohz/armee023_zpseba4fdb0.jpg) (http://s289.photobucket.com/user/gigahzfemtohz/media/armee023_zpseba4fdb0.jpg.html)
(http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll211/gigahzfemtohz/armee024_zps2a205973.jpg) (http://s289.photobucket.com/user/gigahzfemtohz/media/armee024_zps2a205973.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: PTRSAK on April 18, 2014, 12:46:38 AM
No official ID yet, but it's like an old exposed rivets Pocket Pal with Scissors and LNF

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0220_zps03079d00.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/IMG_0220_zps03079d00.jpg.html)

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0214_zps2aa33f59.jpg) (http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/Peter_Thorpe/media/IMG_0214_zps2aa33f59.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on April 19, 2014, 07:32:46 AM
No official ID yet, but it's like an old exposed rivets Pocket Pal with Scissors and LNF

I love it. I'd say it's a 75 aCr+ but that may have been a 75mm SAK.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on April 19, 2014, 11:04:42 AM
Here`s a vintage victoria knife, 113 mm.

(http://de.myalbum.com/GroteFoto-8IQYTGJO.jpg)

(http://de.myalbum.com/GroteFoto-DCYVMHPG.jpg)

(http://de.myalbum.com/GroteFoto-APZRWXHP.jpg)

(http://de.myalbum.com/GroteFoto-C3K4XJLU.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on April 20, 2014, 12:17:39 AM
Here`s a vintage victoria knife, 113 mm.

(http://de.myalbum.com/GroteFoto-8IQYTGJO.jpg)

(http://de.myalbum.com/GroteFoto-DCYVMHPG.jpg)

(http://de.myalbum.com/GroteFoto-APZRWXHP.jpg)

(http://de.myalbum.com/GroteFoto-C3K4XJLU.jpg)

Very interesting! Thanks for posting it.  :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: captain spaulding on April 20, 2014, 03:34:29 AM
Incredible history behind that knife. Very cool!  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: PTRSAK on April 20, 2014, 03:57:27 AM
No official ID yet, but it's like an old exposed rivets Pocket Pal with Scissors and LNF

I love it. I'd say it's a 75 aCr+ but that may have been a 75mm SAK.

Yeah, I think it rates right up there with my Long Awl Pioneer in terms of "a nice thing to behold" factor.

It is probably going to get "special duty" carry for more formal occasions.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on April 27, 2014, 08:23:55 PM
FarmWork Knife, N°310
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Blade runner on April 27, 2014, 08:44:32 PM
FarmWork Knife, N°310
Great knife  :drool: :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on April 27, 2014, 09:31:29 PM
Thanks.  :)
Always a good day if I can find something interesting.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: willc on April 27, 2014, 10:17:09 PM

FarmWork Knife, N°310
Wow!!!
That is awesome Marko.
A very clean specimen that is. 


Sent from my fancy work phone.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on April 28, 2014, 09:11:10 AM
Thanks, Will.
Yes, this one is in excellent condition.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MadPlumbarian on April 28, 2014, 01:20:19 PM
This was my old brass lined pioneer when I first got it and before I had it customized, this count? JR
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v196/mrssabrina/Justins%20junk%20and%20stuff/100_0611.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Novichok79 on May 04, 2014, 03:34:48 PM
My oldest SAKs - i choosed those which are dated before 1960s.
So there are basically soldiers dated 28, 33, 54, 55, 57 yrs, two screwdrivers for Vetterli rifle (i know they are not knives. But some appreciate them like the ancestors of the SAKs)
And old vitorinox gourmet, produced i believe in late 40s.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on May 04, 2014, 03:43:26 PM
Lots of nice ones, Novichok...  :tu:
And welcome to the club.  :)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Novichok79 on May 24, 2014, 10:24:20 AM
My latest Swiss oldy. Believe it late 40's early 50's.
 I bought it occasionally and don't know anything about it... I tried to find out some info and only version which is more-less credible is wenger Teton duck. But it has appeared much more late. So if anybody has an idea....
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ducttapetech on May 24, 2014, 01:27:16 PM
Oh that's nice!

live from Nate's mobile

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: PTRSAK on December 28, 2014, 10:46:04 AM
Necro of a thread that I think needs to continue because people should see come of the classy old SAKs that Vic' and Wenger used to make.

A couple of the vintage models I have acquired lately

234ku (Tourist)
(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0986_zps8474cdea.jpg)

one of several restored 1908s
before
(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_20141201_135127_zpssnp00uyo.jpg)

after
(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0946_zps544fff16.jpg)

Horn scaled 234k
(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0908_zps5e26d2d0.jpg)

62 Elsener Schwyz Soldier (my grail SAK)
(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0893_zps67476566.jpg)
(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0892_zps125dfa7e.jpg)
(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0890_zps23cfbfe1.jpg)

more old skool goodness 134k (small Tinker)
(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/6cf2269e-fef8-4801-b3fa-9e045c353d6c_zps8bc81334.jpg)

Victorinox 304  "Small Soldier"  91mm. shown next to full size (100mm) m1908
(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0994_zps5751fa1e.jpg)
(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0992_zpsaeea0f9a.jpg)
(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0993_zps38fefcfa.jpg)

So people, get that old stuff out and show it off.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: PTRSAK on December 28, 2014, 02:45:06 PM
235k (climber small) Horn scales

(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_0997_zps1de24cbf.jpg)
(http://i1309.photobucket.com/albums/s640/Peter_Thorpe/IMG_1001_zps709175aa.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Glofindel on December 29, 2014, 12:55:35 AM
She is beauty!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on February 28, 2015, 07:34:00 AM
Necro of a thread that I think needs to continue because people should see come of the classy old SAKs that Vic' and Wenger used to make.

So people, get that old stuff out and show it off.

I agree with PTRSAK and this thread should not be dead for sure...    :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on February 28, 2015, 09:27:11 AM
A trio of old Wengers with city crests on them.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on February 28, 2015, 09:29:51 AM
And a repost from Latest SAKs…

An old Wenger with fiber handles, and without a shield.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on March 02, 2015, 01:51:52 AM
An old Wenger with carbon steel blades and aluminum handles.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 02, 2015, 07:11:14 AM
An old Wenger with carbon steel blades and aluminum handles.

This is a beauty...very nice.  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mike, Lord of the Spammers! on March 02, 2015, 08:56:32 AM
Very cool :)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on March 04, 2015, 03:33:22 AM
Been showing some old Wengers. Here's some old horn-handled Vics to balance them.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: captain spaulding on March 04, 2015, 05:13:33 AM
Been showing some old Wengers. Here's some old horn-handled Vics to balance them.


Some.... actually all of those are amazing pieces.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 04, 2015, 07:22:43 AM
Been showing some old Wengers. Here's some old horn-handled Vics to balance them.

Simply beautiful...  :drool:
Gorgeous natural material for the handles and nice patterns as always...that's horn. I need some of those.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Corwyn on March 06, 2015, 09:11:39 PM
My application to the club (playing "Spot the Wenger" - hint: Not the one you'd think of  :P ) :
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-8vk4BP4Yr8w/VPoIRWRnHII/AAAAAAAAFpg/ymWFcHlWrKA/w871-h577-no/vintage.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sneider on March 06, 2015, 10:14:16 PM
A few of mine...

(http://up.picr.de/21200778rc.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on March 07, 2015, 03:09:19 AM
My application to the club (playing "Spot the Wenger" - hint: Not the one you'd think of  :P ) :
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-8vk4BP4Yr8w/VPoIRWRnHII/AAAAAAAAFpg/ymWFcHlWrKA/w871-h577-no/vintage.jpg)

Looks like a Wenger Model 1921 Soldier (dated P39, top left), a late 1940s Victorinox Spartan/Tourist (missing inlay, top right) and a Elinox Model 1242kU from the early/mid 1960s (bottom).
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on March 15, 2015, 12:57:39 PM
Here`s a vintage camper. I really like the tang stamps, 4x victoria inoxyd also on the can opener!

(http://de.myalbum.com/GroteFoto-KOZAF8CV.jpg)

(http://de.myalbum.com/GroteFoto-QBLEF7GL.jpg)

(http://de.myalbum.com/GroteFoto-WSOMEO6Q.jpg)

(http://de.myalbum.com/GroteFoto-DSKIZVHB.jpg)

(http://de.myalbum.com/GroteFoto-8WBLGGWY.jpg)

(http://de.myalbum.com/GroteFoto-R64OEEQ4.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: enki_ck on March 15, 2015, 01:28:04 PM
Very nice. :2tu:

Is that horn? Any idea what the inlay was?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on March 15, 2015, 02:18:58 PM
Yes those are horn handles.

There was just a plain metal plate like the one on this Picture of another knife.

(http://de.myalbum.com/GroteFoto-3EQ7SJMV.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on April 26, 2015, 01:46:49 PM
...a repost from "Victoria Princess".
Victoria tang stamp, exposed rivets and older cross-cut nail file...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: stressmaster5000 on April 26, 2015, 05:39:59 PM
Vintage Victoria 84mm Climber with long nail file and bail. More images on my blog here. (http://sakfan.blogspot.com/)


(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Z_DaV8K5QhQ/VTvpFvEGpcI/AAAAAAAAwg4/qdGbAtGcGrA/s800/DSC05610.JPG)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on April 26, 2015, 05:42:37 PM
Vintage Victoria 84mm Climber with long nail file and bail. More images on my blog here. (http://sakfan.blogspot.com/)

You have a lovely piece there...  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on April 26, 2015, 05:45:13 PM
Vintage Victoria 84mm Climber with long nail file and bail. More images on my blog here. (http://sakfan.blogspot.com/)

You have a lovely peace there...  :tu:

Yes very nice!!!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on April 26, 2015, 07:28:08 PM
Vintage Victoria 84mm Climber with long nail file and bail. More images on my blog here. (http://sakfan.blogspot.com/)

You have a lovely peace there...  :tu:

World Peace!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on April 27, 2015, 03:01:40 AM
A couple of nice old MoP Vics.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on April 27, 2015, 05:40:52 AM
Very pretty!!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on April 27, 2015, 06:07:29 AM
A couple of nice old MoP Vics.

...and as far as I can see, they are in pristine condition.  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mr. Blonde on April 27, 2015, 12:16:57 PM
Is that a Super Tinker with long nailfile? I want to build me one. I didn´t even know, it existed already. :o
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on April 27, 2015, 02:32:53 PM
Better pic of my LNF Climber.

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/LNFClimber_zps561c2266.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on April 27, 2015, 02:45:48 PM
A couple of nice old MoP Vics.

Those are beautiful, especially the one with exposed rivets and triangular awl :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on April 27, 2015, 06:20:21 PM
And here is one of mine, Victoria LNF Champion with MoP scales, mint condition:

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/victorinox-victoria-champion-lnf-mop-640x480.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on April 27, 2015, 06:43:51 PM
WOW! :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on April 27, 2015, 11:20:29 PM
And here is one of mine, Victoria LNF Champion with MoP scales, mint condition:

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/victorinox-victoria-champion-lnf-mop-640x480.jpg)

Beautiful!   :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on April 28, 2015, 02:01:36 PM
Here's something I noticed on that MoP Champion (I thought it was mint, but this pic says otherwise, there is a dent in one of the liners. It's also a bit dirty :o ): the toothpick is in the center of the scale just like on 58mm and 74mm SAKs. It is in fact a small toothpick as found on the smaller SAKs. Never noticed this on any other knife.

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/victorinox-champion-mop-asymmetrical.jpg)

Edit: I don't understand this. One of the pins should be there!? When I remove the toothpick there's no rivet :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: neillcurrie on April 28, 2015, 02:44:36 PM
Here's something I noticed on that MoP Champion (I thought it was mint, but this pic says otherwise, there is a dent in one of the liners. It's also a bit dirty :o ): the toothpick is in the center of the scale just like on 58mm and 74mm SAKs. It is in fact a small toothpick as found on the smaller SAKs. Never noticed this on any other knife.

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/victorinox-champion-mop-asymmetrical.jpg)

Edit: I don't understand this. One of the pins should be there!? When I remove the toothpick there's no rivet :think:
I'd guess the knife must be flush peened on that end/side......maybe both sides?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on April 28, 2015, 02:53:02 PM
Thanks neillcurrie, You're right. I took a better look and I think I can see it's flush peened, at least at the toothpick side :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: twiliter on April 28, 2015, 03:12:56 PM
Here's something I noticed on that MoP Champion (I thought it was mint, but this pic says otherwise, there is a dent in one of the liners. It's also a bit dirty :o ): the toothpick is in the center of the scale just like on 58mm and 74mm SAKs. It is in fact a small toothpick as found on the smaller SAKs. Never noticed this on any other knife.

(http://www.vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/victorinox-champion-mop-asymmetrical.jpg)

Edit: I don't understand this. One of the pins should be there!? When I remove the toothpick there's no rivet :think:

Nice one R!  :tu:

Noticed the same on my '85 MOP SwissChamp, the T&T are both more centered in the scales, but the tweezers slightly off center. Did not think to look at the pins though, but they are flush like yours also, very interesting!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on April 28, 2015, 03:19:23 PM
Now that's cool. My tweezers are in the usual location, not slightly off-center like yours :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on January 07, 2017, 10:52:06 AM
A little BUMP for this great thread with a vintage 84mm frame piece with all desirable features: exposed rivets, bail, long nail file etc. ...
If there is a will to continue with this thread this is a proper time to do that...  :)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: glenfiddich1983 on January 07, 2017, 12:12:51 PM
Nice piece you got there M0rkoni! :like:

I'll join the Vintage SAK owners club with this one:

(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170107/bbce138bf28d27bff403daad7f2c7ac4.jpg)

Victorinox Soldier from 1947
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on January 07, 2017, 12:56:55 PM
 :like:

Let's move on, keep ’em coming guys and gals...  :tu:

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 07, 2017, 02:40:46 PM
1950s Victorinox 246aU with interesting blade stamp.(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170107/76bc3a150a1fdc8ed157869f407add8d.jpg)(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170107/b3a87323b9b908bd8f5965edc86d3424.jpg)(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170107/cd311e1139fcf32cf307ad5406e131cc.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 07, 2017, 02:42:47 PM
:like:

Let's move on, keep ’em coming guys and gals...  :tu:
Very nice!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 07, 2017, 10:30:48 PM
My contribution:
Woodsman, Artisan, Camper, Standard, Golfer
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170107/1cf22071b064631e0c5d9dd396e6795c.jpg)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: glenfiddich1983 on January 07, 2017, 10:39:54 PM
My contribution:
Woodsman, Artisan, Camper, Standard, Golfer
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170107/1cf22071b064631e0c5d9dd396e6795c.jpg)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Wow, great collection all together, well done  :cheers:  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 07, 2017, 10:42:39 PM
My contribution:
Woodsman, Artisan, Camper, Standard, Golfer
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170107/1cf22071b064631e0c5d9dd396e6795c.jpg)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Wow, great collection all together, well done  :cheers:  :like:
Thank you!  :cheers:  One more in route, I think it's a Huntsman.  I'll update the photo when it's in hand.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on January 08, 2017, 01:48:49 AM
The Huntsman was may first SAK.  I can hardly wait to see an 84mm version!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on January 08, 2017, 12:52:06 PM
Until we are all waiting for a newest FolderBeholder acquisition which I'm looking forward to see it also, I presume you are eager to see something like this: NOS No 236 aka small Huntsman   :tu:

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 08, 2017, 12:58:30 PM
 :drool:  :tu:
Great knife!
Do you know when did Victorinox start to produce 84mm with LNF?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on January 08, 2017, 01:35:18 PM
As far as I know around 40' or so... If there is any knowledgeable members here about this subject please feel free to participate.  :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 08, 2017, 01:55:39 PM
Until we are all waiting for a newest FolderBeholder acquisition which I'm looking forward to see it also, I presume you are eager to see something like this: NOS No 236 aka small Huntsman   :tu:
Wow, beauty!  Does it have a small clip point blade as well?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on January 08, 2017, 09:04:50 PM
Until we are all waiting for a newest FolderBeholder acquisition which I'm looking forward to see it also, I presume you are eager to see something like this: NOS No 236 aka small Huntsman   :tu:

Love this knife - I have a NOS one as well that I paid a not-insignificant amount of money for. Probably just a typo, but this is a 246ka, not a 236ka (the difference being that a 236 wouldn't have the LNF). And given FolderBeholder's penchant for NOS knives with boxes, I'm going to put money on her joining the NOS 246ka club with us since one of those just sold on eBay a little while back.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on January 08, 2017, 09:05:59 PM
My contribution:
Woodsman, Artisan, Camper, Standard, Golfer

Great collection. Large awl SAKs are the best SAKs.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on January 08, 2017, 09:10:07 PM
Yes, yes of course... I didn't open all the tools but all vintage features are there...  :)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on January 08, 2017, 09:30:18 PM
A pair of old Victorinox gardening knives with bone handles.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on January 08, 2017, 09:35:17 PM
Until we are all waiting for a newest FolderBeholder acquisition which I'm looking forward to see it also, I presume you are eager to see something like this: NOS No 236 aka small Huntsman   :tu:

Love this knife - I have a NOS one as well that I paid a not-insignificant amount of money for. Probably just a typo, but this is a 246ka, not a 236ka (the difference being that a 236 wouldn't have the LNF). And given FolderBeholder's penchant for NOS knives with boxes, I'm going to put money on her joining the NOS 246ka club with us since one of those just sold on eBay a little while back.

That's absolutely correct...it's a typo, my mistake.  :salute: Always nice to see a full set and hard (not to say usually much more expensive) to find both - a knife with appropriate vintage box. That's a sight for my sore eyes...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Ron Who on January 08, 2017, 09:37:47 PM
A pair of old Victorinox gardening knives with bone handles.
:like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on January 08, 2017, 09:46:25 PM
A pair of old Victorinox gardening knives with bone handles.

How not to LIKE all oldies especially ones in those natural materials such as: a horn or mother of pearl... Simply magnificent! :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 08, 2017, 11:24:26 PM
Until we are all waiting for a newest FolderBeholder acquisition which I'm looking forward to see it also, I presume you are eager to see something like this: NOS No 236 aka small Huntsman   :tu:

Love this knife - I have a NOS one as well that I paid a not-insignificant amount of money for. Probably just a typo, but this is a 246ka, not a 236ka (the difference being that a 236 wouldn't have the LNF). And given FolderBeholder's penchant for NOS knives with boxes, I'm going to put money on her joining the NOS 246ka club with us since one of those just sold on eBay a little while back.
:cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on January 09, 2017, 01:05:33 AM
That's the one.....gorgeous knife!!   :like: :like: :drool: :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 14, 2017, 03:51:08 AM
Until we are all waiting for a newest FolderBeholder acquisition which I'm looking forward to see it also,

I'm looking forward to seeing it too.  Not sure why the seller decided to ship it First Class... :think: Hopefully it'll be here tomorrow, but at last USPS glance it has been stuck in New York for the past 6 days.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on January 14, 2017, 09:23:14 AM
Bummer!   :-\  Very annoying when see something like that, happened to me numerous times.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on January 14, 2017, 11:39:53 AM
Victorinox 236 a U
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 14, 2017, 01:24:48 PM
Victorinox 236 a U
:like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on January 14, 2017, 04:13:13 PM
+1!!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 14, 2017, 04:19:32 PM
+3!!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Aloha on January 14, 2017, 04:30:41 PM
Victorinox 236 a U
:like:

 :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SteveC on January 14, 2017, 04:49:40 PM
This is my only Vintage Sak,   A pre saw Camper


(http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k115/asc67/Multi%20tools%20and%20Knifes/SAK/DSC04068_zpscquw0aaq.jpg) (http://s86.photobucket.com/user/asc67/media/Multi%20tools%20and%20Knifes/SAK/DSC04068_zpscquw0aaq.jpg.html)



(http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k115/asc67/Multi%20tools%20and%20Knifes/SAK/DSC04071_zpsvzmjsa6c.jpg) (http://s86.photobucket.com/user/asc67/media/Multi%20tools%20and%20Knifes/SAK/DSC04071_zpsvzmjsa6c.jpg.html)


(http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k115/asc67/Multi%20tools%20and%20Knifes/SAK/DSC04073_zpsfzfapo50.jpg) (http://s86.photobucket.com/user/asc67/media/Multi%20tools%20and%20Knifes/SAK/DSC04073_zpsfzfapo50.jpg.html)


(http://www.sakwiki.com/show_image.php?id=2078&scalesize=o)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on January 14, 2017, 04:51:27 PM
 :drool: :drool: :like: :like: Gorgeous Steve!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 14, 2017, 05:18:25 PM
This is my only Vintage Sak,   A pre saw Camper

:drool: :like: :drool:
I love the Camper line and that one is a beauty!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Ron Who on January 14, 2017, 05:25:35 PM
It's only a name, FB. There's no saw. I would call it a Spartan if I didn't know better. >:D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 14, 2017, 05:29:02 PM
That's the oddity with the Camper line.  When I first got my Camper in 1986 it had a saw.  So I wonder do Campers have saws?  Or are Campers anything Victorinox calls a Camper at varying stages with varying tool sets.   :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Ron Who on January 14, 2017, 05:32:06 PM
I think at one time they added the saw, still calling it Camper, and invented the name Spartan for the existing model.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SteveC on January 14, 2017, 06:16:14 PM
I think at one time they added the saw, still calling it Camper, and invented the name Spartan for the existing model.

Camper then Standard then Spartan IIRC  :tu:
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 14, 2017, 11:52:49 PM
The most expensive SAK I own:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170114/5840ec267e31a0ea43ae3fa129404227.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170114/c915836d361596bfa4b4f0e83897b8c4.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170114/59263e17ca1eeb63beeb2aa28ca8a0a5.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170114/ec4fa353cb3d36b64aa29ef8e0be531a.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170114/5b841cf8c701bec72bf6a418159756a1.jpg)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Ron Who on January 15, 2017, 12:08:48 AM
That's a nice one FB. If you send it to me you can have my Camper.  :D :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on January 15, 2017, 12:16:23 AM
 :like: :like: :drool: :drool: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 15, 2017, 12:17:00 AM
That's a nice one FB. If you send it to me you can have my Camper.  :D :like:
:rofl: Campers are my weakness, but this time I better pass on the offer.  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 15, 2017, 12:18:25 AM
:like: :like: :drool: :drool: :tu: :tu:
Exactly what I am over here doing.  I had no idea until today just how pristine this is.  The photos in the auction didn't show off its beauty.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on January 15, 2017, 02:41:16 AM
:like: :like: :drool: :drool: :tu: :tu:

 :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 15, 2017, 03:27:42 AM
:like: :like: :drool: :drool: :tu: :tu:

 :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool:
Thanks SAK Guy!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 15, 2017, 04:47:08 AM
I have a question about the toothpick.  It seems like mine is almost see-through or translucent.  Does that seem right?  :think:

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/349/31473464314_4ce0248a03_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/PXcJqs)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on January 15, 2017, 06:50:50 AM
I have a question about the toothpick.  It seems like mine is almost see-through or translucent.  Does that seem right?  :think:

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/349/31473464314_4ce0248a03_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/PXcJqs)

Yep, normal. Mine's the same way.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on January 15, 2017, 08:39:08 AM
The most expensive SAK I own:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170114/5840ec267e31a0ea43ae3fa129404227.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170114/c915836d361596bfa4b4f0e83897b8c4.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170114/59263e17ca1eeb63beeb2aa28ca8a0a5.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170114/ec4fa353cb3d36b64aa29ef8e0be531a.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170114/5b841cf8c701bec72bf6a418159756a1.jpg)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Very nice indeed...  :salute:

I have a question about the toothpick.  It seems like mine is almost see-through or translucent.  Does that seem right?  :think:

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/349/31473464314_4ce0248a03_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/PXcJqs)

Yep, normal. Mine's the same way.

Same here...  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 15, 2017, 03:04:12 PM
Thank you jazzbass and M0rkoni for the reassurance.  :cheers:
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 21, 2017, 09:48:47 AM
Just got this old WENGER  92mm mod. 927 (Angler toolset) with not very common blade stamp INOXIDABLE with CB instead of usual WENGERINOX CB. The same WENGER blade stamp was shown here once so it is not fake :). It is interesting that this model has only tweesers and no tooth peak. Do you have any info about age?(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170121/e5a297f5a944b760b9ceda744bd4e331.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170121/543303608f8fe1e5bbcf86eb28e73459.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: PTRSAK on January 22, 2017, 08:42:27 AM
A pair of old Wengers, the small one is 2 layer and the larger one is 4 layers ("Huntsman" pattern)
Unfortunately both have one broken backspring so now the search is on for replacement parts.
Luckily they still look good in the display case :-)

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/6/5763/31826007971_8f490a456a_b.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on January 22, 2017, 09:04:17 AM
Just got this old WENGER  92mm mod. 927 (Angler toolset) with not very common blade stamp INOXIDABLE with CB instead of usual WENGERINOX CB. The same WENGER blade stamp was shown here once so it is not fake :). It is interesting that this model has only tweesers and no tooth peak. Do you have any info about age?(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170121/e5a297f5a944b760b9ceda744bd4e331.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170121/543303608f8fe1e5bbcf86eb28e73459.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

This should be a model 927 from the late 50' early 60'...
Nice find...  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 22, 2017, 09:09:44 AM
Just got this old WENGER  92mm mod. 927 (Angler toolset) with not very common blade stamp INOXIDABLE with CB instead of usual WENGERINOX CB. The same WENGER blade stamp was shown here once so it is not fake :). It is interesting that this model has only tweesers and no tooth peak. Do you have any info about age?(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170121/e5a297f5a944b760b9ceda744bd4e331.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170121/543303608f8fe1e5bbcf86eb28e73459.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

This should be a model 927 from the late 50' early 60'...
Nice find...  :like:
Thank you, M0rkoni!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 22, 2017, 02:23:18 PM
A pair of old Wengers, the small one is 2 layer and the larger one is 4 layers ("Huntsman" pattern)
Unfortunately both have one broken backspring so now the search is on for replacement parts.
Luckily they still look good in the display case :-)

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/6/5763/31826007971_8f490a456a_b.jpg)
:like: :like:
Agreed, they do display well!
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on February 02, 2017, 04:12:42 PM
Finally I got a Victorinox knife with this stamp: JNOXID! Another side stamp is VICTORIA with crossbow, so this knife is from 1920s. It is 90,5 mm long, has brass liners, nickel silver bolsters and fiber scales. There is an advertisement on the one scale: "Schweiz. Baubedarf A.G. Herzogenbuchsee".
This knife is very similar to mod. 304 from 1942 Elsener Catalog.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170202/bce05d8e5ce6d7d5d81c317d29c47e4c.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170202/0b4bca313313efbbb53c1a1655788fbb.jpg)
Together with Soldiers mod.1908 and mod.1951.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170202/06423b17d8bcf2428ca1db8ae7d62b48.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: glenfiddich1983 on February 02, 2017, 04:29:23 PM
Finally I got a Victorinox knife with this stamp: JNOXID! Another side stamp is VICTORIA with crossbow, so this knife is from 1920s. It is 90,5 mm long, has brass liners, nickel silver bolsters and fiber scales. There is an advertisement on the one scale: "Schweiz. Baubedarf A.G. Herzogenbuchsee".
This knife is very similar to mod. 304 from 1942 Elsener Catalog.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170202/bce05d8e5ce6d7d5d81c317d29c47e4c.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170202/0b4bca313313efbbb53c1a1655788fbb.jpg)
Together with Soldiers mod.1908 and mod.1951.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170202/06423b17d8bcf2428ca1db8ae7d62b48.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Great catch!  :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on February 02, 2017, 05:19:11 PM
Finally I got a Victorinox knife with this stamp: JNOXID! Another side stamp is VICTORIA with crossbow, so this knife is from 1920s. It is 90,5 mm long, has brass liners, nickel silver bolsters and fiber scales. There is an advertisement on the one scale: "Schweiz. Baubedarf A.G. Herzogenbuchsee".
This knife is very similar to mod. 304 from 1942 Elsener Catalog.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170202/bce05d8e5ce6d7d5d81c317d29c47e4c.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170202/0b4bca313313efbbb53c1a1655788fbb.jpg)
Together with Soldiers mod.1908 and mod.1951.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170202/06423b17d8bcf2428ca1db8ae7d62b48.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Nice one!  :like:

Something similar...N°310
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on February 02, 2017, 05:23:04 PM
Nice! What stamps are there?


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on February 02, 2017, 05:33:59 PM
It's a this one just on one side:

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on February 02, 2017, 05:35:47 PM
It's a this one just on one side:
Thank you.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on February 03, 2017, 12:52:31 AM
 :D I   :like: that saw!!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 03, 2017, 01:13:23 AM
:D I   :like: that saw!!!
Same here!  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on February 07, 2017, 07:44:56 AM
Such drool. Very awesome. Much nice :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on February 07, 2017, 09:25:17 PM
An assortment of old SAKs.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 07, 2017, 09:38:38 PM
Very nice Karl!!!!! :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on February 07, 2017, 10:01:40 PM
Thanks.   :cheers:

Here are a couple of old Wengers with modern custom handles.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 07, 2017, 11:07:30 PM
 :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool:  Those are most awesome as well!!!!!   :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on February 07, 2017, 11:35:21 PM
My contribution:
Woodsman, Artisan, Camper, Standard, Golfer
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170107/1cf22071b064631e0c5d9dd396e6795c.jpg)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Those are some beautiful knives!    :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: captain spaulding on February 07, 2017, 11:49:21 PM
Same one I posted a while back, but the pics are no longer there. Go tit from a guy on Craigslist years ago. Think I paid $30ish for it. Can't really remember.

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7378/27726175730_13468fe0fd_b.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7431/28006275945_10d4a20874_b.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7281/27971654086_a2df4a8b0c_b.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7413/27392949024_1c9583ab8e_b.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7080/27726078820_b6d970d55b_b.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7509/27392947074_0d2c2d3718_b.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7258/28006270835_4bfb2d32b6_b.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: detron on February 08, 2017, 01:48:33 AM
got an older Champion with a bail on it today.  I really wanted a thicker bail SAK, and am glad to have this,  I call it the File king.

File #1

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184112.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184112.jpg.html)

File #2

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_183906.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_183906.jpg.html)

File #3

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184031.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184031.jpg.html)


the most files I have on one SAK.   :tu:


(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_183802.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_183802.jpg.html)

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184145.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184145.jpg.html)

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184210.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184210.jpg.html)

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184249.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184249.jpg.html)

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on February 08, 2017, 03:19:47 AM
 :like: :like: :drool:  :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on February 08, 2017, 11:41:36 PM
Same one I posted a while back, but the pics are no longer there. Go tit from a guy on Craigslist years ago. Think I paid $30ish for it. Can't really remember.

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7378/27726175730_13468fe0fd_b.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7431/28006275945_10d4a20874_b.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7281/27971654086_a2df4a8b0c_b.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7413/27392949024_1c9583ab8e_b.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7080/27726078820_b6d970d55b_b.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7509/27392947074_0d2c2d3718_b.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7258/28006270835_4bfb2d32b6_b.jpg)

$30 for a Wenger with a scrapper? Great knife at a great price!   :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on February 08, 2017, 11:42:20 PM
got an older Champion with a bail on it today.  I really wanted a thicker bail SAK, and am glad to have this,  I call it the File king.

File #1

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184112.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184112.jpg.html)

File #2

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_183906.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_183906.jpg.html)

File #3

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184031.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184031.jpg.html)


the most files I have on one SAK.   :tu:


(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_183802.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_183802.jpg.html)

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184145.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184145.jpg.html)

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184210.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184210.jpg.html)

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184249.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184249.jpg.html)

Nice score!   :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 09, 2017, 12:50:46 AM
got an older Champion with a bail on it today.  I really wanted a thicker bail SAK, and am glad to have this,  I call it the File king.


 :like: :drool: :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on February 13, 2017, 06:53:34 AM
got an older Champion with a bail on it today.  I really wanted a thicker bail SAK, and am glad to have this,  I call it the File king.

File #1

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184112.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184112.jpg.html)

File #2

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_183906.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_183906.jpg.html)

File #3

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz255/detronphillips/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184031.jpg) (http://s833.photobucket.com/user/detronphillips/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20170207_184031.jpg.html)


the most files I have on one SAK.   :tu:


Cool!

But I have SAK with many, many more files. Hundreds, actually. On its USB flas drive ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: glenfiddich1983 on February 13, 2017, 11:39:29 AM
Same one I posted a while back, but the pics are no longer there. Go tit from a guy on Craigslist years ago. Think I paid $30ish for it. Can't really remember.

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7378/27726175730_13468fe0fd_b.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7431/28006275945_10d4a20874_b.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7281/27971654086_a2df4a8b0c_b.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7413/27392949024_1c9583ab8e_b.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7080/27726078820_b6d970d55b_b.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7509/27392947074_0d2c2d3718_b.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7258/28006270835_4bfb2d32b6_b.jpg)

That's a very nice one!  :like:

Does it have two large knife blades, or is the rounded blade something else?
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on February 13, 2017, 01:14:57 PM
Same one I posted a while back, but the pics are no longer there. Go tit from a guy on Craigslist years ago. Think I paid $30ish for it. Can't really remember.

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7378/27726175730_13468fe0fd_b.jpg)


That's a very nice one!  :like:

Does it have two large knife blades, or is the rounded blade something else?
It is file/snow scriper :) Nice knife!(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170213/8ff9ea2658b9b4fa37f69ecba541cf05.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on February 13, 2017, 02:31:47 PM
What a fantastic thread folks - I love all the oldies
Must read through all of this thread sometime and maybe post my oldies and join the club  :tu:

And this info is just great - Thanks for enlightening us once again JB.
I should have known there would be a logic to it !!
Old model number key for the curious
First, the main number:
1xx = Phillips, 2xx = Corkscrew.
x34 = blades, openers
x35 = blades, openers, scissors
x36 = blades, openers, scissors, saw
x37 = blades, openers, saw
x45 = blades, openers, scissors w/ LNF
x46 = blades, openers, scissors w/ LNF, saw

Then the letters after:
k = 84mm (klein). No k = 91mm
a = toothpick/tweezers
f = fish scaler
m = metal file
U = bail/keyring

There are other numbers like 248k that are just assigned and don't really follow a pattern.

Just one more question for JB - or anybody - When did they switch from numeric models like this to the named models we know today?
I'm guessing the 60's sometime - Maybe earlier?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on February 13, 2017, 05:58:36 PM
Just one more question for JB - or anybody - When did they switch from numeric models like this to the named models we know today?
I'm guessing the 60's sometime - Maybe earlier?

Early 1970s, probably right around the big 1974 transition. The new magnifier/Phillips layer introduced in the early 1970s is a good indicator of the change - I have yet to see any knife with a magnifier layer that has an old model number. You do see boxes into the mid 1970s with both model numbers, but then by the late 1970s everything has transitioned to the new "1.3703" style.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on February 13, 2017, 06:01:18 PM
got an older Champion with a bail on it today.  I really wanted a thicker bail SAK, and am glad to have this,  I call it the File king.

the most files I have on one SAK.   :tu:

The first *real* vintage SAK I ever bought was a Champion LNF almost identical to this one. I still remember being fascinated with the absurd number of different files on it. Great addition to your collection.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: detron on February 13, 2017, 08:44:57 PM
got an older Champion with a bail on it today.  I really wanted a thicker bail SAK, and am glad to have this,  I call it the File king.

the most files I have on one SAK.   :tu:

The first *real* vintage SAK I ever bought was a Champion LNF almost identical to this one. I still remember being fascinated with the absurd number of different files on it. Great addition to your collection.

thank you jazzbass,  I do love it.  some of the layers have lost their snap, but it is still a great knife 50 years later!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on February 14, 2017, 02:04:04 PM
Wow – Thanks JB – That is fascinating – And later than I thought - You always know the answer ;)
So the model number format changed at the same time as the descriptive names being introduced.
Makes sense I guess.
I have updated my collection database with the correct model numbers for the appropriate models (previously I just had the modern names) - Very excited about that  :ahhh

I checked the Wiki Champion page and indeed the 6-layer Champion has the old style numbering and the 7 layer the new.
After 100s of visits to that page I had never noticed that.
So is it possible that the 6 layer was not even called the Champion?

If it’s OK – I’ll update the Wiki and my tool dating sheet with this info about the model numbers change and switch to names.

Couple of other interesting things I noticed in the Wiki.
In the  tool guide (http://www.sakwiki.com/show_image.php?id=796) Victorinox describe the SAK as the “The Champion of the Swiss Army Officers’ Knives”.
So it looks like this name emerged from being an adjectival descriptor to a full Proper Noun! Although they do use a capital ‘C’ in ‘Champion’‘.

The tool guide for the 7 layer model - pre Chisel  (http://www.sakwiki.com/show_image.php?id=796) – shows 24 functions. The tool guide for the 7 layer - with Chisel model  (http://www.sakwiki.com/show_image.php?id=1393) is also there and of course has 25 functions
- Funny thing is they used the without Chisel picture for the with Chisel model and just stuck a number 25 in the gap in the picture where the Chisel would be. Check it out in the links  :)
Tut tut Victorinox!!  :twak:

got an older Champion with a bail on it today.  I really wanted a thicker bail SAK, and am glad to have this,  I call it the file king.
the most files I have on one SAK.
The first *real* vintage SAK I ever bought was a Champion LNF almost identical to this one. I still remember being fascinated with the absurd number of different files on it....

Well for me it was my second (in 2013) - But exactly the same thoughts about the files - Bizarre
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: LeaF on February 14, 2017, 02:58:47 PM
So is it possible that the 6 layer was not even called the Champion?


Hi, Huntsman!


I've asked jazzbass regarding almost the same in another thread (http://forum.multitool.org/index.php?topic=70711).
Here's his answer (hope, jazzbass allow to quote him here :)
Quote
1. Champion CS LNF (Model 246fmaU) - 6 layers, LNF, corkscrew, 1952-1974
2. Champion LNF (Model 146fmaU) - 6 layers, LNF, Phillips, 1952-1974
3. Handyman Original (Model 236fmaU) - 6 layers, corkscrew, 1973-1986
4. Craftsman Original* (Model 136fmaU) - 6 layers, Phillips, 1973-1986
5. Champion (Model 1.5793/1.6783) - 7 layers, mag/Phillips, 1973-present
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on February 14, 2017, 03:14:58 PM
The knife in the middle is a Champion with the lanyard bail and exposed rivets. On the back it has the triangular awl, phillips that is round on the outside edge, but square on the opposite edge with a file on the back of it, and a long fingernail file with the best tip for cleaning fingernails that I have ever used.

The main blade has a cross bow and VICTORIA OFFICIER on the one side of the tang and VICTORINOX  SWITZERLAND  STAINLESS on the other.
The small blade is a clip blade and it also has scissors, wood saw (with rounded off end), metal file(with rounded off end), fish scaler, arc style can opener( with a cross and Pat.), and bottle opener.

I was at a gun and knife show in Dayton, OH. about 10 years ago and there was a guy whose table just had a bunch of odds and ends on it.  I spotted a an old Victorinox box, so I asked if I could see it and it turned out to be a NOS Champion....it had never been used, so I asked how much he wanted and he said $10.00.

Obviously he was not into knives .......you never saw anybody go for their wallet as fast as I did..... I could not believe he did not want more.......that was the only time I have ever stumbled on to such a good deal in my life.

The tweezers have a nickel/silver tip on them. 1956 was the last year for the nickel/silver tip on the tweezers(it was changed to aluminum in 1957), so it has to be between 1951 and 1956, since the arc style can opener was introduced in 1951. I had only seen pictures of the exposed rivet models prior to that, and I have never run into another exposed rivet
model since.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: captain spaulding on February 14, 2017, 05:19:26 PM
Same one I posted a while back, but the pics are no longer there. Go tit from a guy on Craigslist years ago. Think I paid $30ish for it. Can't really remember.

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/8/7378/27726175730_13468fe0fd_b.jpg)


That's a very nice one!  :like:

Does it have two large knife blades, or is the rounded blade something else?
It is file/snow scriper :) Nice knife!(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170213/8ff9ea2658b9b4fa37f69ecba541cf05.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Correct! Thank you for answering that one for me.  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on February 14, 2017, 05:25:21 PM
to captain spaulding

 :salute: Cool knife!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on February 14, 2017, 05:36:09 PM
The knife in the middle is a Champion with the lanyard bail and exposed rivets. On the back it has the triangular awl, phillips that is round on the outside edge, but square on the opposite edge with a file on the back of it, and a long fingernail file with the best tip for cleaning fingernails that I have ever used.

The main blade has a cross bow and VICTORIA OFFICIER on the one side of the tang and VICTORINOX  SWITZERLAND  STAINLESS on the other.
The small blade is a clip blade and it also has scissors, wood saw (with rounded off end), metal file(with rounded off end), fish scaler, arc style can opener( with a cross and Pat.), and bottle opener.

I was at a gun and knife show in Dayton, OH. about 10 years ago and there was a guy whose table just had a bunch of odds and ends on it.  I spotted a an old Victorinox box, so I asked if I could see it and it turned out to be a NOS Champion....it had never been used, so I asked how much he wanted and he said $10.00.

Obviously he was not into knives .......you never saw anybody go for their wallet as fast as I did..... I could not believe he did not want more.......that was the only time I have ever stumbled on to such a good deal in my life.

The tweezers have a nickel/silver tip on them. 1956 was the last year for the nickel/silver tip on the tweezers(it was changed to aluminum in 1957), so it has to be between 1951 and 1956, since the arc style can opener was introduced in 1951. I had only seen pictures of the exposed rivet models prior to that, and I have never run into another exposed rivet
model since.
What stamp is on the can opener : US.PAT.PEND. or + PAT?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: captain spaulding on February 14, 2017, 05:37:10 PM
to captain spaulding

 :salute: Cool knife!

Thank you very much. As I said before it was a random Craigslist find. Turns out it was a friend of mine's neighbor. It was (the sellers) fathers knife. Sadly the guy looked like a drug addict needing money for his fix, but I gladly rescued the knife.  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on February 14, 2017, 06:12:02 PM
The knife in the middle is a Champion with the lanyard bail and exposed rivets. On the back it has the triangular awl, phillips that is round on the outside edge, but square on the opposite edge with a file on the back of it, and a long fingernail file with the best tip for cleaning fingernails that I have ever used.

The main blade has a cross bow and VICTORIA OFFICIER on the one side of the tang and VICTORINOX  SWITZERLAND  STAINLESS on the other.
The small blade is a clip blade and it also has scissors, wood saw (with rounded off end), metal file(with rounded off end), fish scaler, arc style can opener( with a cross and Pat.), and bottle opener.

I was at a gun and knife show in Dayton, OH. about 10 years ago and there was a guy whose table just had a bunch of odds and ends on it.  I spotted a an old Victorinox box, so I asked if I could see it and it turned out to be a NOS Champion....it had never been used, so I asked how much he wanted and he said $10.00.

Obviously he was not into knives .......you never saw anybody go for their wallet as fast as I did..... I could not believe he did not want more.......that was the only time I have ever stumbled on to such a good deal in my life.

The tweezers have a nickel/silver tip on them. 1956 was the last year for the nickel/silver tip on the tweezers(it was changed to aluminum in 1957), so it has to be between 1951 and 1956, since the arc style can opener was introduced in 1951. I had only seen pictures of the exposed rivet models prior to that, and I have never run into another exposed rivet
model since.
What stamp is on the can opener : US.PAT.PEND. or + PAT?

+PAT
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on February 14, 2017, 06:24:08 PM
The knife in the middle is a Champion with the lanyard bail and exposed rivets. On the back it has the triangular awl, phillips that is round on the outside edge, but square on the opposite edge with a file on the back of it, and a long fingernail file with the best tip for cleaning fingernails that I have ever used.

The main blade has a cross bow and VICTORIA OFFICIER on the one side of the tang and VICTORINOX  SWITZERLAND  STAINLESS on the other.
The small blade is a clip blade and it also has scissors, wood saw (with rounded off end), metal file(with rounded off end), fish scaler, arc style can opener( with a cross and Pat.), and bottle opener.

I was at a gun and knife show in Dayton, OH. about 10 years ago and there was a guy whose table just had a bunch of odds and ends on it.  I spotted a an old Victorinox box, so I asked if I could see it and it turned out to be a NOS Champion....it had never been used, so I asked how much he wanted and he said $10.00.

Obviously he was not into knives .......you never saw anybody go for their wallet as fast as I did..... I could not believe he did not want more.......that was the only time I have ever stumbled on to such a good deal in my life.

The tweezers have a nickel/silver tip on them. 1956 was the last year for the nickel/silver tip on the tweezers(it was changed to aluminum in 1957), so it has to be between 1951 and 1956, since the arc style can opener was introduced in 1951. I had only seen pictures of the exposed rivet models prior to that, and I have never run into another exposed rivet
model since.
What stamp is on the can opener : US.PAT.PEND. or + PAT?

+PAT
Thank you! Nice knife from 1953-1957, I have the same one and try to find Champion with US.PAT.PEND. but unsuccessfully  >:(
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on February 14, 2017, 06:56:33 PM
The knife in the middle is a Champion with the lanyard bail and exposed rivets. On the back it has the triangular awl, phillips that is round on the outside edge, but square on the opposite edge with a file on the back of it, and a long fingernail file with the best tip for cleaning fingernails that I have ever used.

The main blade has a cross bow and VICTORIA OFFICIER on the one side of the tang and VICTORINOX  SWITZERLAND  STAINLESS on the other.
The small blade is a clip blade and it also has scissors, wood saw (with rounded off end), metal file(with rounded off end), fish scaler, arc style can opener( with a cross and Pat.), and bottle opener.

I was at a gun and knife show in Dayton, OH. about 10 years ago and there was a guy whose table just had a bunch of odds and ends on it.  I spotted a an old Victorinox box, so I asked if I could see it and it turned out to be a NOS Champion....it had never been used, so I asked how much he wanted and he said $10.00.

Obviously he was not into knives .......you never saw anybody go for their wallet as fast as I did..... I could not believe he did not want more.......that was the only time I have ever stumbled on to such a good deal in my life.

The tweezers have a nickel/silver tip on them. 1956 was the last year for the nickel/silver tip on the tweezers(it was changed to aluminum in 1957), so it has to be between 1951 and 1956, since the arc style can opener was introduced in 1951. I had only seen pictures of the exposed rivet models prior to that, and I have never run into another exposed rivet
model since.
What stamp is on the can opener : US.PAT.PEND. or + PAT?

+PAT
Thank you! Nice knife from 1953-1957, I have the same one and try to find Champion with US.PAT.PEND. but unsuccessfully  >:(
Thanks for the info...hope you eventually find the one with US.PAT.PEND
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 16, 2017, 01:50:20 AM
Anyone know the possible age of this one?  I have it inbound:
Armee Suisse on one side.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2858/32771436782_dd1dd392a4_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RVUbq7)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2357/32544599730_26f8f43f17_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RzRzEs)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2319/32884758066_9e23ecb6d6_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/S6UYTm)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Ron Who on February 16, 2017, 01:55:43 AM
Somewhere between 1937 and 1946. I'm only guessing of course. :-\  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on February 16, 2017, 02:17:23 AM
Anyone know the possible age of this one?  I have it inbound:
Armee Suisse on one side.

c. 1944-1946. This would be the last of the old style can openers before the crab claw type was introduced in 1946.

Looks like a Tourist, no?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 16, 2017, 02:25:52 AM
Anyone know the possible age of this one?  I have it inbound:
Armee Suisse on one side.

c. 1944-1946. This would be the last of the old style can openers before the crab claw type was introduced in 1946.

Looks like a Tourist, no?
Thank you RS and JB, I'm unsure of the model name also.  I have been seeking a SAK with the old style can opener. 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 16, 2017, 02:28:42 AM
Yes, likely a Tourist (I just checked the SakWiki), and since this is 84mm it seems quite likely.  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on February 16, 2017, 02:31:04 AM
Sorry, I'll rephrase. It looks 84mm and not 91mm. But with older SAKs it's hard to tell sometimes. Technically it doesn't have a name anyway - just a model number. 205kU or 205U depending on 84mm or 91mm.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 16, 2017, 02:33:54 AM
I'm going to put it in the database as 205kU, thanks JB!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on February 16, 2017, 01:11:21 PM
Anyone know the possible age of this one?  I have it inbound:
Armee Suisse on one side.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2858/32771436782_dd1dd392a4_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RVUbq7)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2357/32544599730_26f8f43f17_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RzRzEs)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2319/32884758066_9e23ecb6d6_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/S6UYTm)

Nice find FolderBeholder!
Since you are finding some nice old Vics, I thought you might like this video on the evolution of the can opener....it not only shows the different styles, but shows how the can opener switched ends on the knife in 1951

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30fY1HHbl6A
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: LeaF on February 16, 2017, 01:13:04 PM
I'm going to put it in the database as 205kU, thanks JB!
Could you please tell me, which kind of database you're using for storing information about knives?
Thanks in advance!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 16, 2017, 01:54:52 PM
I'm going to put it in the database as 205kU, thanks JB!
Could you please tell me, which kind of database you're using for storing information about knives?
Thanks in advance!

At this time, I am using a database program written for the fountain pen collecting community (which I belong to).
It's a free program for Mac or PC, but it is pen specific, yet has a lot of fields I like.  My main information is in a spreadsheet at this time and I'm slowing putting info in this database to see if I like it for SAKs.  So far I'm thinking of just staying with my spreadsheet, Microsoft Excel.
Info about the database here:
http://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/29267-fountain-pen-database-available-for-download/

Screenshot of the data fields:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2447/32552518350_6c9798ff52_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RAyaAo)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 16, 2017, 01:56:44 PM

Nice find FolderBeholder!
Since you are finding some nice old Vics, I thought you might like this video on the evolution of the can opener....it not only shows the different styles, but shows how the can opener switched ends on the knife in 1951
I enjoyed the video, thank you!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: LeaF on February 16, 2017, 02:24:17 PM

Thanks!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on February 16, 2017, 03:46:20 PM

Nice find FolderBeholder!
Since you are finding some nice old Vics, I thought you might like this video on the evolution of the can opener....it not only shows the different styles, but shows how the can opener switched ends on the knife in 1951
I enjoyed the video, thank you!  :cheers:

You are welcome!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on February 16, 2017, 08:43:11 PM
Anyone know the possible age of this one?  I have it inbound:
Armee Suisse on one side.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2858/32771436782_dd1dd392a4_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RVUbq7)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2357/32544599730_26f8f43f17_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RzRzEs)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2319/32884758066_9e23ecb6d6_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/S6UYTm)


Here is a copy of a chart of tang stamps...you will notice there are 2 versions of Armee Suisse that were used...one from 1891 - 1935 and the other from 1935 - 1951
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 17, 2017, 01:07:23 AM

Here is a copy of a chart of tang stamps...you will notice there are 2 versions of Armee Suisse that were used...one from 1891 - 1935 and the other from 1935 - 1951
Thank you, I see the distinct difference.  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on February 17, 2017, 01:33:00 AM
Oops - Duplicate post
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 17, 2017, 01:40:03 AM
Thank you all for your help.
This one is inbound as well.  I guess from the same time period.  I decided to buy it since that way I'll have an 84mm and then this one a 91mm.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3699/32562164840_0c99a7e047_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RBpBab)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: NorCalJim on February 17, 2017, 01:42:32 AM
I'm going to put it in the database as 205kU, thanks JB!
Could you please tell me, which kind of database you're using for storing information about knives?
Thanks in advance!

At this time, I am using a database program written for the fountain pen collecting community (which I belong to).
It's a free program for Mac or PC, but it is pen specific, yet has a lot of fields I like.  My main information is in a spreadsheet at this time and I'm slowing putting info in this database to see if I like it for SAKs.  So far I'm thinking of just staying with my spreadsheet, Microsoft Excel.
Info about the database here:
http://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/topic/29267-fountain-pen-database-available-for-download/

Screenshot of the data fields:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2447/32552518350_6c9798ff52_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RAyaAo)

I have to admit to being curious when you mentioned that you were entering information in a database.  I have an information technology background (IT Manager, now retired) and mentioning databases has a similar effect on me as SAKs with magnifiers.  :)

Thanks for sharing some info on the DB application that you are using.  I am even more curious about the organization behind the application.  For example, suppose you REALLY LIKE Camper SAKs and have a number of them but only one new original stock still boxed and the rest unboxed.  Do you put the rest in labeled plastic bags that tie back to your database index?  This would probably make a great topic for a thread of its own.  :)

 :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 17, 2017, 01:48:15 AM
I would really like a database that is similar to the pen one, but with fields that pertain to knives.  That is why I am not being successful with the pen one, and have been mainly putting data into Excel.  I really prefer a database though and especially one that allows photos to be added.
I think you're on to something there with a topic starter!  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on February 17, 2017, 01:50:28 AM
If the rear stamp is "Inoxyd" then it's from the same time period. Most likely it is. If the rear stamp is "Victorinox" through a crossbow, it's a little older (early 40s).

Thank you all for your help.
This one is inbound as well.  I guess from the same time period.  I decided to buy it since that way I'll have an 84mm and then this one a 91mm.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3699/32562164840_0c99a7e047_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RBpBab)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 17, 2017, 01:54:51 AM
I can't quite make out the other side of the tang:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/502/32902514356_86dd606439_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/S8tZdh)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on February 17, 2017, 01:57:51 AM
Fairly sure that's an Inoxyd knife too. If so, then same time period, c. 1944-1946.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 17, 2017, 02:05:40 AM
Fairly sure that's an Inoxyd knife too. If so, then same time period, c. 1944-1946.
Thank you.
Sure can't seem to find them mint in box like I prefer.   :facepalm:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: AndyTiedye on February 17, 2017, 08:07:57 AM
I would really like a database that is similar to the pen one, but with fields that pertain to knives.  That is why I am not being successful with the pen one, and have been mainly putting data into Excel.  I really prefer a database though and especially one that allows photos to be added.
I think you're on to something there with a topic starter!  :tu:
l think you could do all this (including photos) with Google Sheets. That also provides hosting for the database if you want to make it publicly accessible.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on February 17, 2017, 03:11:54 PM
Thank you all for your help.
This one is inbound as well.  I guess from the same time period.  I decided to buy it since that way I'll have an 84mm and then this one a 91mm.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3699/32562164840_0c99a7e047_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RBpBab)

You are building up a nice collection of vintage VICS!  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 17, 2017, 04:45:01 PM
I would really like a database that is similar to the pen one, but with fields that pertain to knives.  That is why I am not being successful with the pen one, and have been mainly putting data into Excel.  I really prefer a database though and especially one that allows photos to be added.
I think you're on to something there with a topic starter!  :tu:
l think you could do all this (including photos) with Google Sheets. That also provides hosting for the database if you want to make it publicly accessible.
Thank you, I will look into that program.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 17, 2017, 04:46:51 PM
You are building up a nice collection of vintage VICS!  :like:
Thank you, though nothing else is on my radar at this time.  I wanted to find an old can opener style SAK, and I found it/them, so I doubt I'll be posting more in here anytime soon.  Just don't quote me on that.  :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Forklift on February 18, 2017, 08:12:23 AM
I have a few questions about the vintage models.
I might be obsessing over minor details, but I imagine there are many here that love the minor details
1) I saw a 134k on this thread that had the 1946 can opener and recently saw another on eBay.  All the reference materials I have found show the modern can opener being introduced in 1951 and the Phillips in 1952.  I understand transition times, but considering how few visible rivets knives I have seen with the Phillips yet I have seen at least 2 with the 1946 can opener, I am wondering if the 1946 can opener persisted for longer on the 84's.
Note: the eBay knife was listed as 91 but it was clearly 84
2) in regards to the old numbering system, I understand the 3 digit code.  However I can't seem to find much information on the leading digit when a 4 digit code is given.  It appears the 2xxx refers to the Alox knives.  I have also seen 1xxx and 8xxx but do not understand the distinction between them.  For example what is the model number in the below knife of mine?  It is a Hoffritz Victoria stamped knife.  Is it a 234U 8234U or 1234U?
3) what is the difference between a 205 and a 234?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on February 18, 2017, 03:11:08 PM
1) I saw a 134k on this thread that had the 1946 can opener and recently saw another on eBay.  All the reference materials I have found show the modern can opener being introduced in 1951 and the Phillips in 1952.  I understand transition times, but considering how few visible rivets knives I have seen with the Phillips yet I have seen at least 2 with the 1946 can opener, I am wondering if the 1946 can opener persisted for longer on the 84's.
Note: the eBay knife was listed as 91 but it was clearly 84
The Phillips back-spring tool definitely appears in the 84mm line first on models with the 1946 can opener. I've seen way too many knives with both to think that it's a factory goof, a one-off, or a later mod. So there are two conclusions: the official date is wrong and the Phillips was introduced earlier, or the 1946 can opener persisted longer for 84mm. I actually believe the answer is both. I think the official date is a little off and the Phillips was introduced c. 1950. BTW, this is actually somewhat common - many of the official dates from Victorinox don't match up with what you see with actual knives. I also believe that the 84mm line used older can openers/cap lifters a bit past 1952.

2) in regards to the old numbering system, I understand the 3 digit code.  However I can't seem to find much information on the leading digit when a 4 digit code is given.  It appears the 2xxx refers to the Alox knives.  I have also seen 1xxx and 8xxx but do not understand the distinction between them.  For example what is the model number in the below knife of mine?  It is a Hoffritz Victoria stamped knife.  Is it a 234U 8234U or 1234U?

The standard early numbering system was 3 numbers. A leading "1" indicated it was a cellidor handled "Elinox" line knife. So, a "Victoria" line Spartan w/ bail at the time would be a 234U, and an "Elinox" line spartan would be a 1234U. A leading "2" indicated it was an alox handled Elinox knife. There's very little overlap between cellidor "Victoria" line numbers and alox numbers mainly because most of the models were different. The one case were there was the same basic model in both cellidor and alox (The Voyegeur), they did actually have the same base model number - 232 (232k and 2232).

A leading "5", "7", or "8" typically indicated a "special" model - something with tools not part of the standard "Victoria" line (e.g. fine screwdriver, pruner blade, serrated main blade). The Picnicker, for example, is basically a Camper with a serrated main blade and pruner instead of pen blade. It was a model 8237aU, whereas the Camper was a  model 237aU. The Handwerkermesser (model 7236maU) was just a Ranger (model 236maU) with a fine screwdriver instead of a pen blade. There really isn't a logical system with these either - for example the Motorist was a 8134ma, the Picknicker was a 8237aU, but the Handwerkermesser was a 7236maU. Why the "7" instead of "8"?  All knives were "special" models, all were originally Elinox models, etc. But one started with 7 and the other 8.

Your knife below is a 1234U (Elinox line Spartan) made for Hoffritz. All Hoffritz knives in the early days got special "Hoffrtiz/Victoria" stamped blades, regardless if they were "Victoria" line or "Elinox" line models. So if Hoffritz ordered an economy Elinox line knife, they got the same knife anyone buying an Elinox knife at that time got - unpolished tools, unanodized liners, etc. The only difference is the blade was stamped "Hoffritz/Victoria" instead of "Elinox".

3) what is the difference between a 205 and a 234?

Same knife, just a minor change in the knife numbering system. Seems to have happened sometime in the mid- to late- 1940s. 205 is the original number of the knife most call a Spartan today. 234 is the number you see on boxes and in ads in the early 1950s until the change in 1974. In fact, earlier in this thread I told FolderBeholder her knife was a 205k, since it was older (pre-1946) and 84mm instead of 91mm (k for kleine). It looks like this might be a mistake - the real number is actually 206 if we're being pedantic about the old model numbers. If you look in the 1942 catalog (below), Victorinox is definitely using the same model number between 91mm and 84mm for the same knives (the 248 and 248k, for example), except for the Spartan/Tourist models which still have their original 205/206 numbers, respectively. By the early 1950s they have updated both of these to be more inline with the others (234 and 234k).

(http://i.imgur.com/tSWE50y.png)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 18, 2017, 10:04:06 PM
Pulled a few recent vintage ones out of the knife roll....I have others I just can't find them.   :facepalm:

Shown are a Victoria Champion, two Fisherman, an Original Outdoorsman, a Climber and Armee Suisse 84mm Tourist and a Spartan/Standard in 91mm.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Vintage%20SAKs%202-18-17_zpsdyeho6xr.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Ron Who on February 18, 2017, 10:15:54 PM
 :like: :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on February 18, 2017, 11:08:59 PM
:like: :like:

+1!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 18, 2017, 11:28:18 PM
Thx guys!!!!

Found another one....

Fisherman Deluxe.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Fisherman%20Deluxe%202-18-17_zpsgifki7mt.jpg)


And you guys already saw this one.

Wenger '60 Soldat
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Wenger%201960%20%201-26-17_zpsurdwrljx.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Forklift on February 18, 2017, 11:48:07 PM
Thanks jazzbass!  Excellent answers
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SteveC on February 19, 2017, 12:27:43 AM
Pulled a few recent vintage ones out of the knife roll....I have others I just can't find them.   :facepalm:

Shown are a Victoria Champion, two Fisherman, an Original Outdoorsman, a Climber and Armee Suisse 84mm Tourist and a Spartan/Standard in 91mm.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Vintage%20SAKs%202-18-17_zpsdyeho6xr.jpg)


 :drool: :drool: :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 19, 2017, 12:54:49 AM
Pulled a few recent vintage ones out of the knife roll....I have others I just can't find them.   :facepalm:

Shown are a Victoria Champion, two Fisherman, an Original Outdoorsman, a Climber and Armee Suisse 84mm Tourist and a Spartan/Standard in 91mm.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Vintage%20SAKs%202-18-17_zpsdyeho6xr.jpg)


 :drool: :drool: :drool:

Thanks buddy!!!!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 19, 2017, 12:57:54 AM
Pulled a few recent vintage ones out of the knife roll....I have others I just can't find them.   :facepalm:

Shown are a Victoria Champion, two Fisherman, an Original Outdoorsman, a Climber and Armee Suisse 84mm Tourist and a Spartan/Standard in 91mm.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Vintage%20SAKs%202-18-17_zpsdyeho6xr.jpg)

 :like: :drool: :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 19, 2017, 01:24:06 AM
Pulled a few recent vintage ones out of the knife roll....I have others I just can't find them.   :facepalm:

Shown are a Victoria Champion, two Fisherman, an Original Outdoorsman, a Climber and Armee Suisse 84mm Tourist and a Spartan/Standard in 91mm.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Vintage%20SAKs%202-18-17_zpsdyeho6xr.jpg)

 :like: :drool: :like:

Thx FB!!!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on February 19, 2017, 01:49:22 AM
 :drool: :drool:  :drool: :like: :like: :like:
Pulled a few recent vintage ones out of the knife roll....I have others I just can't find them.   :facepalm:

Shown are a Victoria Champion, two Fisherman, an Original Outdoorsman, a Climber and Armee Suisse 84mm Tourist and a Spartan/Standard in 91mm.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Vintage%20SAKs%202-18-17_zpsdyeho6xr.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 19, 2017, 05:06:20 AM
:drool: :drool:  :drool: :like: :like: :like:
Pulled a few recent vintage ones out of the knife roll....I have others I just can't find them.   :facepalm:

Shown are a Victoria Champion, two Fisherman, an Original Outdoorsman, a Climber and Armee Suisse 84mm Tourist and a Spartan/Standard in 91mm.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Vintage%20SAKs%202-18-17_zpsdyeho6xr.jpg)

Thx Barry!!!! 

Found one more.

Victoria Standard/Spartan.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Vicoria%20Standard%202-18-17_zpsmbzgguup.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on February 19, 2017, 06:55:27 AM
Thx guys!!!!

Found another one....

Fisherman Deluxe.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Fisherman%20Deluxe%202-18-17_zpsgifki7mt.jpg)


And you guys already saw this one.

Wenger '60 Soldat
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Wenger%201960%20%201-26-17_zpsurdwrljx.jpg)
Great old knives! Especially 60 Wenger!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 19, 2017, 07:18:36 AM
Thx guys!!!!

Found another one....

Fisherman Deluxe.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Fisherman%20Deluxe%202-18-17_zpsgifki7mt.jpg)


And you guys already saw this one.

Wenger '60 Soldat
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Wenger%201960%20%201-26-17_zpsurdwrljx.jpg)
Great old knives! Especially 60 Wenger!

Thx JNOXID!!!   :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on February 19, 2017, 07:27:47 AM
Shown are a Victoria Champion, two Fisherman, an Original Outdoorsman, a Climber and Armee Suisse 84mm Tourist and a Spartan/Standard in 91mm.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Vintage%20SAKs%202-18-17_zpsdyeho6xr.jpg)

This pic... :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 19, 2017, 07:33:22 AM
Shown are a Victoria Champion, two Fisherman, an Original Outdoorsman, a Climber and Armee Suisse 84mm Tourist and a Spartan/Standard in 91mm.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Vintage%20SAKs%202-18-17_zpsdyeho6xr.jpg)

This pic... :drool:

Thanks bud!!!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on February 19, 2017, 12:27:45 PM
 :like: :like: That's the vintage SAK of my dreams Robert!!  What a beautiful knife!

:drool: :drool:  :drool: :like: :like: :like:
Pulled a few recent vintage ones out of the knife roll....I have others I just can't find them.   :facepalm:

Shown are a Victoria Champion, two Fisherman, an Original Outdoorsman, a Climber and Armee Suisse 84mm Tourist and a Spartan/Standard in 91mm.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Vintage%20SAKs%202-18-17_zpsdyeho6xr.jpg)

Thx Barry!!!! 

Found one more.

Victoria Standard/Spartan.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Vicoria%20Standard%202-18-17_zpsmbzgguup.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 19, 2017, 03:34:07 PM
:like: :like: That's the vintage SAK of my dreams Robert!!  What a beautiful knife!

:drool: :drool:  :drool: :like: :like: :like:
Pulled a few recent vintage ones out of the knife roll....I have others I just can't find them.   :facepalm:

Shown are a Victoria Champion, two Fisherman, an Original Outdoorsman, a Climber and Armee Suisse 84mm Tourist and a Spartan/Standard in 91mm.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Vintage%20SAKs%202-18-17_zpsdyeho6xr.jpg)

Thx Barry!!!! 

Found one more.

Victoria Standard/Spartan.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Vicoria%20Standard%202-18-17_zpsmbzgguup.jpg)

Thx Barry!!! It's one of my favorites because I can carry and use it without worrying about  scratching/dinging the scale or something.  :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 19, 2017, 04:06:00 PM
Thx Barry!!! It's one of my favorites because I can carry and use it without worrying about  scratching/dinging the scale or something.  :D
SG, I know that feeling....I bought this total fixer upper on eBay for $10 and after some spa treatment it is not only nice to look at, I carry it too.
Before:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/693/32383799760_a3f9dc9093_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RkDrrb)
After:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/716/32640307111_f792e8ed03_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RJj78H)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 19, 2017, 04:44:24 PM
Thx Barry!!! It's one of my favorites because I can carry and use it without worrying about  scratching/dinging the scale or something.  :D
SG, I know that feeling....I bought this total fixer upper on eBay for $10 and after some spa treatment it is not only nice to look at, I carry it too.
Before:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/693/32383799760_a3f9dc9093_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RkDrrb)
After:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/716/32640307111_f792e8ed03_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RJj78H)

That's a really really nice job FB!!!  :cheers: :cheers:  :drool: :drool:

I also have a bail that I need to tap back on.   :facepalm:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 19, 2017, 04:47:44 PM
Thx Barry!!! It's one of my favorites because I can carry and use it without worrying about  scratching/dinging the scale or something.  :D
SG, I know that feeling....I bought this total fixer upper on eBay for $10 and after some spa treatment it is not only nice to look at, I carry it too.
Before:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/693/32383799760_a3f9dc9093_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RkDrrb)

That's a really really nice job FB!!!  :cheers: :cheers:  :drool: :drool:

I also have a bail that I need to tap back on.   :facepalm:
I have to give GigaHz the credit for the spa treatment, he did an amazing job!
If you look at the middle of the knife, a little bit of a blade is popping up, that is the broken small blade, it had to be replaced.
Then I had a saw added, because I love wood saws, ever since my first SAK, the Camper.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on February 19, 2017, 04:48:46 PM
Thx Barry!!! It's one of my favorites because I can carry and use it without worrying about  scratching/dinging the scale or something.  :D
SG, I know that feeling....I bought this total fixer upper on eBay for $10 and after some spa treatment it is not only nice to look at, I carry it too.
Before:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/693/32383799760_a3f9dc9093_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RkDrrb)
After:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/716/32640307111_f792e8ed03_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RJj78H)

That turned out great! :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 19, 2017, 04:53:06 PM
Thx Barry!!! It's one of my favorites because I can carry and use it without worrying about  scratching/dinging the scale or something.  :D
SG, I know that feeling....I bought this total fixer upper on eBay for $10 and after some spa treatment it is not only nice to look at, I carry it too.
Before:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/693/32383799760_a3f9dc9093_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RkDrrb)

That's a really really nice job FB!!!  :cheers: :cheers:  :drool: :drool:

I also have a bail that I need to tap back on.   :facepalm:
I have to give GigaHz the credit for the spa treatment, he did an amazing job!
If you look at the middle of the knife, a little bit of a blade is popping up, that is the broken small blade, it had to be replaced.
Then I had a saw added, because I love wood saws, ever since my first SAK, the Camper.

 :cheers: He sure did!!!!  :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on February 20, 2017, 12:10:23 AM
Yours is right there with SG's Folder...love that saw!!  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 20, 2017, 03:47:35 AM
Thank you all for the kind words.
I find myself reaching for this vintage user one more than any other at this time.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 20, 2017, 05:01:13 PM
Another inbound...unsure of model.  Ad states 0236MAU, he possibly got that info. from the box, if it is that it should have a wood saw as well?
More info. here:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/222415354018?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2182/32633167740_357ae107f1_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RHFvR7)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Fortytwo on February 20, 2017, 05:44:38 PM
I'll count myself in here with my Wenger. It followed me out for an outdoors lunch yesterday and saw most of a month of use during the minimalist challenge. I tried to determine (http://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,70198.msg1409470.html#msg1409470) when it was made but it lacks year of production stamp.
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/58245811/Multitool.org%20-%20Pictures/20170219_125822-2064x1161.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 20, 2017, 07:16:12 PM
Awesome knives guys!!!!! :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on February 20, 2017, 08:46:34 PM
+1...great to see some Wenger action!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: NorCalJim on February 20, 2017, 09:01:40 PM
Another inbound...unsure of model.  Ad states 0236MAU, he possibly got that info. from the box, if it is that it should have a wood saw as well?
More info. here:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/222415354018?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2182/32633167740_357ae107f1_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RHFvR7)

The toolset mostly aligns with the Mountaineer except for the absence of the multi-purpose hook.

 :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on February 20, 2017, 09:27:27 PM
Another inbound...unsure of model.  Ad states 0236MAU, he possibly got that info. from the box, if it is that it should have a wood saw as well?

Most likely it's an early 1960s version of a Ranger, and the seller just didn't open the wood saw (probably didn't know it had one). The model being 236maU would be correct for this.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on February 20, 2017, 09:38:27 PM
Another inbound...unsure of model.  Ad states 0236MAU, he possibly got that info. from the box, if it is that it should have a wood saw as well?
More info. here:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/222415354018?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
The toolset mostly aligns with the Mountaineer except for the absence of the multi-purpose hook.
Another great find FB - and a very good price too - amazing!  :tu:

You sometimes find that ebay sellers do not display the saw - I guess they think it is a liner!
So this could be a full 0236mau - a predecessor to the Ranger

You'll know soon let us know.

@ Norcaljim - The Mountaineer would not have had a hook pre 1991!! Assuming it was around then - Or maybe just the Grand Prix was around in those days!

Edit - Just seen JB's equivalent comment - Apologies - It took me a long time to post this as someone came to the door and I was on the phone!! :o Multitasking :)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 20, 2017, 09:46:04 PM
Thank you all for the replies.  I will know this week if it has the wood saw or not and post an updated photo.
I love to find older knives with their original box.  I believe that is what I collect because I don't seem to focus on any particular model, I thought I might at first, but I don't.

Regarding price, I was happy with this purchase, too many times I have had to pay dearly for mint in box.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: NorCalJim on February 20, 2017, 10:18:53 PM
Another inbound...unsure of model.  Ad states 0236MAU, he possibly got that info. from the box, if it is that it should have a wood saw as well?
More info. here:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/222415354018?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
The toolset mostly aligns with the Mountaineer except for the absence of the multi-purpose hook.
Another great find FB - and a very good price too - amazing!  :tu:

You sometimes find that ebay sellers do not display the saw - I guess they think it is a liner!
So this could be a full 0236mau - a predecessor to the Ranger

You'll know soon let us know.

@ Norcaljim - The Mountaineer would not have had a hook pre 1991!! Assuming it was around then - Or maybe just the Grand Prix was around in those days!

Edit - Just seen JB's equivalent comment - Apologies - It took me a long time to post this as someone came to the door and I was on the phone!! :o Multitasking :)

I neglected to mention that the awl didn't resemble the one for the Mountaineer.  I was pleased to see the input that this was a Ranger and that the seller may not have realized that there was a wood saw.  I have two Grand Prix models and they have a philips.  BTW, thanks for your reply.  I didn't know when the hook appeared but knew that it was missing on some of my older SAKs.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on February 20, 2017, 11:01:36 PM
I neglected to mention that the awl didn't resemble the one for the Mountaineer.  I was pleased to see the input that this was a Ranger and that the seller may not have realized that there was a wood saw.  I have two Grand Prix models and they have a philips.  BTW, thanks for your reply.  I didn't know when the hook appeared but knew that it was missing on some of my older SAKs.

Hi NCJ - You might find the table in this thread (http://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,51872.msg1214377.html#msg1214377) useful with tool availability and dating
It gives approximate dates when tools came out or tool versions changed.
I am about to post a slightly updated version

SAK dating seems to be as much an art as a science and nothing matches JBs encyclopaedic knowledge (- In fact some of the info in here came from him - Thanks JB!) - However this gives a pretty good idea
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: NorCalJim on February 20, 2017, 11:47:26 PM
I neglected to mention that the awl didn't resemble the one for the Mountaineer.  I was pleased to see the input that this was a Ranger and that the seller may not have realized that there was a wood saw.  I have two Grand Prix models and they have a philips.  BTW, thanks for your reply.  I didn't know when the hook appeared but knew that it was missing on some of my older SAKs.

Hi NCJ - You might find the table in this thread (http://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,51872.msg1214377.html#msg1214377) useful with tool availability and dating
It gives approximate dates when tools came out or tool versions changed.
I am about to post a slightly updated version

SAK dating seems to be as much an art as a science and nothing matches JBs encyclopaedic knowledge (- In fact some of the info in here came from him - Thanks JB!) - However this gives a pretty good idea

Thank you very much!  Very useful!!!

 :climber:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on February 21, 2017, 06:03:50 PM
Just now got this 84mm 244 k. Looks like ~ 1952-1957 with early 50s blade stamps, LNF nail notch and nickel silver tweezers head. How rare is it?(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170221/3383f949e419f395c5195a7bacd86d89.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on February 21, 2017, 06:26:21 PM
Just now got this 84mm 244 k. Looks like ~ 1952-1957 with early 50s blade stamps, LNF nail notch and nickel silver tweezers head. How rare is it?[

Probably from right around 1957-1958. It has the pre-1958 tang stamp but not the exposed rivet construction you would expect to see. The three-line "Victoria Switzerland Stainless" stamp changes to the four line "Victoria Switzerland Stainless Rostfrei" stamp around the same time as they go to hidden rivet construction, so around 1957/8. You see transitional knives in both directions - exposed rivets w/ 4 line stamps and hidden rivets w/ three line stamps. This is one of the latter obviously. Full model number on this one would be 244 kaU.

How rare? Certainly unusual but not what I'd call super rare.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on February 21, 2017, 06:39:03 PM
Thank you jazzbass, I've forgot about rivets :(. Of course it is 244 kaU from 1957-1958  :oops:


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 24, 2017, 01:50:04 AM
The 236maU arrived.  It's nice, and it does have the wood saw, I guess the seller didn't see it tucked in there close to the liner.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3805/32923687202_ec9c005555_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/Samvam)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3912/32264334543_d8fa2b2aef_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/Ra69A4)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3919/33079913525_303a816cd7_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/SpacND)

Adding some photos of it next to a modern Ranger:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3885/32924304972_63b3434305_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/SapENy)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2880/32234818284_b3b6ba901f_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/R7tSr3)]
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 24, 2017, 01:59:26 AM
Very nice FB!!! :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 24, 2017, 02:07:18 AM
Found 2 more...

An old Wengerinox (Huntsman style pattern) and another Champion with a Phillips.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Wengernox%20amp%20Champion%202-23-17_zps5vltnida.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 24, 2017, 02:09:37 AM
Found 2 more...

An old Wengerinox (Huntsman style pattern) and another Champion with a Phillips.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Wengernox%20amp%20Champion%202-23-17_zps5vltnida.jpg)


Nice ones SG!!!!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 24, 2017, 02:11:42 AM
Found 2 more...

An old Wengerinox (Huntsman style pattern) and another Champion with a Phillips.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Wengernox%20amp%20Champion%202-23-17_zps5vltnida.jpg)


Nice ones SG!!!!  :cheers:

Thx bud!   :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Roc on February 24, 2017, 02:14:07 AM
Found 2 more...

An old Wengerinox (Huntsman style pattern) and another Champion with a Phillips.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Wengernox%20amp%20Champion%202-23-17_zps5vltnida.jpg)
:like: That Champ with philips is  :drool: 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 24, 2017, 02:17:50 AM
Found 2 more...

An old Wengerinox (Huntsman style pattern) and another Champion with a Phillips.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Wengernox%20amp%20Champion%202-23-17_zps5vltnida.jpg)
:like: That Champ with philips is  :drool:

Thx Rocky!!!! Cool thing about these old Phillips Champs is that they have 3 files on them....and I love files! :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Roc on February 24, 2017, 02:21:36 AM
Found 2 more...

An old Wengerinox (Huntsman style pattern) and another Champion with a Phillips.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Wengernox%20amp%20Champion%202-23-17_zps5vltnida.jpg)
:like: That Champ with philips is  :drool:

Thx Rocky!!!! Cool thing about these old Phillips Champs is that they have 3 files on them....and I love files! :D
Seriously?!!! I didn't know that.  Guess I have some reading to do.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 24, 2017, 02:27:17 AM
Found 2 more...

An old Wengerinox (Huntsman style pattern) and another Champion with a Phillips.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Wengernox%20amp%20Champion%202-23-17_zps5vltnida.jpg)
:like: That Champ with philips is  :drool:

Thx Rocky!!!! Cool thing about these old Phillips Champs is that they have 3 files on them....and I love files! :D
Seriously?!!! I didn't know that.  Guess I have some reading to do.

 :cheers: Std Metal Saw/File, Long Nail File on the back and a file tucked away on the back of the Phillips!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on February 24, 2017, 02:30:36 AM
Found 2 more...

An old Wengerinox (Huntsman style pattern) and another Champion with a Phillips.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Wengernox%20amp%20Champion%202-23-17_zps5vltnida.jpg)

Some more nice goodies!   :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 24, 2017, 02:34:18 AM
Found 2 more...

An old Wengerinox (Huntsman style pattern) and another Champion with a Phillips.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Wengernox%20amp%20Champion%202-23-17_zps5vltnida.jpg)

Some more nice goodies!   :cheers:

Thx Karl!!!!!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 24, 2017, 02:44:18 AM
Posted this one earlier in the thread (I think) but I'm pretty proud of it so I'll throw it back up.

Hoffritz 84mm, Model 136kmaU (Journeyman) from '69/'70 acc. to JazzBass. :salute:  Basically an 84mm Master Craftsman.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Reposts/Hoffritz%2084mm%20Craftsman2_zpsfbjbnr9x.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Roc on February 24, 2017, 02:51:44 AM
Posted this one earlier in the thread (I think) but I'm pretty proud of it so I'll throw it back up.

Hoffritz 84mm, Model 136kmaU (Journeyman) from '69/'70 acc. to JazzBass. :salute:  Basically an 84mm Master Craftsman.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Reposts/Hoffritz%2084mm%20Craftsman2_zpsfbjbnr9x.jpg)
Didn't even know this existed!  :like:
You just keep adding to my homework.  :drool:
Mmm..84mm
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 24, 2017, 03:08:44 AM
Posted this one earlier in the thread (I think) but I'm pretty proud of it so I'll throw it back up.

Hoffritz 84mm, Model 136kmaU (Journeyman) from '69/'70 acc. to JazzBass. :salute:  Basically an 84mm Master Craftsman.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Reposts/Hoffritz%2084mm%20Craftsman2_zpsfbjbnr9x.jpg)
Didn't even know this existed!  :like:
You just keep adding to my homework.  :drool:
Mmm..84mm

 :rofl:  Thanks!!!!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 24, 2017, 03:29:40 AM
That looks great in size 84mm...I have a 91mm version inbound, but I really like that one you have!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 24, 2017, 03:39:38 AM
That looks great in size 84mm...I have a 91mm version inbound, but I really like that one you have!

 :cheers: Thx and congrats!!!! Love the Master Craftsman pattern!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 24, 2017, 03:47:31 AM
That looks great in size 84mm...I have a 91mm version inbound, but I really like that one you have!

 :cheers: Thx and congrats!!!! Love the Master Craftsman pattern!!

Interestingly enough, I mostly bought it because I didn't have a Hoffritz SAK, glad I did (well, I'll find out if I'm glad tomorrow or the next day), unfortunately, it isn't new old stock, no box.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 24, 2017, 04:13:35 AM
That looks great in size 84mm...I have a 91mm version inbound, but I really like that one you have!

 :cheers: Thx and congrats!!!! Love the Master Craftsman pattern!!

Interestingly enough, I mostly bought it because I didn't have a Hoffritz SAK, glad I did (well, I'll find out if I'm glad tomorrow or the next day), unfortunately, it isn't new old stock, no box.

 :salute: If you're unhappy and want to move it, give me a holler.  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 24, 2017, 04:15:36 AM
That looks great in size 84mm...I have a 91mm version inbound, but I really like that one you have!

 :cheers: Thx and congrats!!!! Love the Master Craftsman pattern!!

Interestingly enough, I mostly bought it because I didn't have a Hoffritz SAK, glad I did (well, I'll find out if I'm glad tomorrow or the next day), unfortunately, it isn't new old stock, no box.

 :salute: If you're unhappy and want to move it, give me a holler.  :tu:
Will do!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on February 24, 2017, 03:21:31 PM
Posted this one earlier in the thread (I think) but I'm pretty proud of it so I'll throw it back up.

Hoffritz 84mm, Model 136kmaU (Journeyman) from '69/'70 acc. to JazzBass. :salute:  Basically an 84mm Master Craftsman.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Reposts/Hoffritz%2084mm%20Craftsman2_zpsfbjbnr9x.jpg)

That is a cool find!  I did not know they ever made an 84mm Craftsman. That would be a nice size for pocket carry. :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on February 24, 2017, 06:17:47 PM
Robert they are all gorgeous  :drool: :drool: :drool: !!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 24, 2017, 06:39:30 PM
Thanks guys!!! :cheers:  It's a keeper for sure.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on February 24, 2017, 10:01:59 PM
Yep - That Journeyman/Baby Master Craftsman is a real beaut

It must be pretty rare/or at least uncommom
As Vicman says - It would be a great carry

I much prefer the 84mm - or Wenger, size
If I were Vic I would switch all my 91mm range to 84mm - It makes a surprisingly big differnce to size and weight in the pocket

And if you want a bigger tool - Get a 111/130 or pliers based!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 24, 2017, 10:55:09 PM
Yep - That Journeyman/Baby Master Craftsman is a real beaut

It must be pretty rare/or at least uncommom
As Vicman says - It would be a great carry

I much prefer the 84mm - or Wenger, size
If I were Vic I would switch all my 91mm range to 84mm - It makes a surprisingly big differnce to size and weight in the pocket

And if you want a bigger tool - Get a 111/130 or pliers based!!

Thank you sir!!!  :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 25, 2017, 02:17:33 AM
That looks great in size 84mm...I have a 91mm version inbound, but I really like that one you have!

 :cheers: Thx and congrats!!!! Love the Master Craftsman pattern!!

Interestingly enough, I mostly bought it because I didn't have a Hoffritz SAK, glad I did (well, I'll find out if I'm glad tomorrow or the next day), unfortunately, it isn't new old stock, no box.

 :salute: If you're unhappy and want to move it, give me a holler.  :tu:
It arrived today and although not as compact as an 84mm, it will be a keeper at this time.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 25, 2017, 02:22:12 AM
That looks great in size 84mm...I have a 91mm version inbound, but I really like that one you have!

 :cheers: Thx and congrats!!!! Love the Master Craftsman pattern!!

Interestingly enough, I mostly bought it because I didn't have a Hoffritz SAK, glad I did (well, I'll find out if I'm glad tomorrow or the next day), unfortunately, it isn't new old stock, no box.

 :salute: If you're unhappy and want to move it, give me a holler.  :tu:
It arrived today and although not as compact as an 84mm, it will be a keeper at this time.

 :cheers: :cheers: Congrats!!!  :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 25, 2017, 02:44:16 AM
Not mint in box, but now and again I like 'em used.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/285/33098639185_026e95b11d_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/SqPbhR)

Needs to be cleaned up a bit:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3936/33098639935_26277fb72b_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/SqPbvM)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 25, 2017, 02:45:58 AM
Nice!!!!      :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on February 25, 2017, 05:14:26 AM
+1!!!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on February 26, 2017, 12:16:18 AM
Spacing out!

Apollo Moon Landing Craftsman and Space Shuttle Master Craftsman.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 26, 2017, 12:51:28 AM
Spacing out!

Apollo Moon Landing Craftsman and Space Shuttle Master Craftsman.

 :like: :like: :cheers: :cheers:  :drool: :drool: :drool:


Impressive Karl...very impressive!!!   :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 26, 2017, 04:06:46 AM
One of these has been posted before but I wanted a decent pic of these two together. Created for the outdoors and related by serrated mains and pruner secondaries.

The Victorinox Elinox Campingmesser and the Victoria Original Outdoorsman (Hoffritz).
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Vic%20Orig%20Outdoorsman%20amp%20Picniker_zpssosh8o7a.jpg)

http://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Picnicker_91mm
http://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Outdoorsman_Original
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 26, 2017, 04:30:07 AM
One of these has been posted before but I wanted a decent pic of these two together. Created for the outdoors and related by serrated mains and pruner secondaries.

The Victorinox Elinox Campingmesser and the Victoria Original Outdoorsman (Hoffritz).

Cool picture having them both together!  :like: and  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 26, 2017, 04:35:32 AM
One of these has been posted before but I wanted a decent pic of these two together. Created for the outdoors and related by serrated mains and pruner secondaries.

The Victorinox Elinox Campingmesser and the Victoria Original Outdoorsman (Hoffritz).

Cool picture having them both together!  :like: and  :like:

Thanks FB!!!!  :cheers:  Wish they were in better shape but considering what they are, I'm amazed that I have them at all.  :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on February 26, 2017, 05:08:24 AM
 :drool: :drool: :drool: CS, the NASA knives are at the absolute top of my must have list!!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on February 26, 2017, 08:03:54 PM
Thanks all!   :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 27, 2017, 05:36:43 PM
Just posting an update to share my exposed rivet group.  Hope you like them.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/709/32306152994_df5d45b0d1_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RdMtKQ)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on February 27, 2017, 06:56:47 PM
I absolutely LUST over them Folder!!!  :drool: :drool: :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 27, 2017, 08:15:53 PM
I absolutely LUST over them Folder!!!  :drool: :drool: :drool:
Thank you Barry!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: NorCalJim on February 27, 2017, 08:23:07 PM
Just posting an update to share my exposed rivet group.  Hope you like them.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/709/32306152994_df5d45b0d1_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RdMtKQ)

 :like: :like: :like: :like:

I would be very much surprised if I ever acquired an exposed rivet SAK but I sure do admire your collection!  Thanks for sharing!

 :salute: :salute: :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: magentus on February 27, 2017, 08:26:27 PM
Just posting an update to share my exposed rivet group.  Hope you like them.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/709/32306152994_df5d45b0d1_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RdMtKQ)
Lush! Lovely collection FoBo  :cheers:  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on February 27, 2017, 10:20:57 PM
Just posting an update to share my exposed rivet group.  Hope you like them.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/709/32306152994_df5d45b0d1_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RdMtKQ)

Very impressive collection FB!  :drool: :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on February 27, 2017, 10:35:11 PM
Just posting an update to share my exposed rivet group.  Hope you like them.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/709/32306152994_df5d45b0d1_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RdMtKQ)

Outstanding!   :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 27, 2017, 10:42:17 PM
:like: :like: :like: :like:
I would be very much surprised if I ever acquired an exposed rivet SAK but I sure do admire your collection!  Thanks for sharing!
 :salute: :salute: :salute:

Thank you for taking a look at them.  :cheers:

Outstanding!   :cheers:
Thank you CS.  :cheers:

Very impressive collection FB!  :drool: :like:
It's not a lot, but I like them very much.  Thank you for checking them out.  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 27, 2017, 10:42:43 PM
Just posting an update to share my exposed rivet group.  Hope you like them.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/709/32306152994_df5d45b0d1_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RdMtKQ)

Awesome FB!!!  :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 27, 2017, 10:43:05 PM

Lush! Lovely collection FoBo  :cheers:  :like:
Thank you magsie!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 27, 2017, 10:44:51 PM
Awesome FB!!!  :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool:
Thank you SG, it took me two months to find these, wasn't easy.  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on February 28, 2017, 01:51:23 PM
 :like:
Just posting an update to share my exposed rivet group.  Hope you like them.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/709/32306152994_df5d45b0d1_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RdMtKQ)
Very nice!  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on February 28, 2017, 10:43:27 PM
LNF Climber (or Traveller...IDK) :facepalm:

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/LNF%20Climber%202-28-17_zps4ssupezb.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on March 01, 2017, 12:10:19 AM
 :like: :like: !!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 01, 2017, 12:18:03 AM
:like: :like: !!!

Thx Barry!!!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: glenfiddich1983 on March 01, 2017, 09:51:04 AM
Just posting an update to share my exposed rivet group.  Hope you like them.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/709/32306152994_df5d45b0d1_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RdMtKQ)

Very cool!  :drool:

Especially that Soldier! Which year is it from?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: glenfiddich1983 on March 01, 2017, 09:52:20 AM
LNF Climber (or Traveller...IDK) :facepalm:

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/LNF%20Climber%202-28-17_zps4ssupezb.jpg)

Nice picture!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 01, 2017, 01:18:56 PM
Just posting an update to share my exposed rivet group.  Hope you like them.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/709/32306152994_df5d45b0d1_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RdMtKQ)

Very cool!  :drool:

Especially that Soldier! Which year is it from?
Thank you!  The Soldier is 1954.  54 stamped on the tang.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 01, 2017, 09:30:30 PM
LNF Climber (or Traveller...IDK) :facepalm:

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/LNF%20Climber%202-28-17_zps4ssupezb.jpg)

Nice picture!  :cheers:

Thx Glen!!!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on March 02, 2017, 10:57:55 AM
Sorry for the avi pic, any ideas?
Like a Spartan?
Was old when I was a kid, now 60...
Better photo someday
thanks guys
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 12, 2017, 06:10:40 AM
Got this Wenger in today....
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Wenger%20Standard%203-11-17_zpsyiseurzt.jpg)

...kinda matches my "Melty" Vic.  :D

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Vicoria%20Standard%202-18-17_zpsmbzgguup.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 12, 2017, 06:11:47 AM
Sorry for the avi pic, any ideas?
Like a Spartan?
Was old when I was a kid, now 60...
Better photo someday
thanks guys

I looked Tony but I missed (or can't see) the pic.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 12, 2017, 02:49:24 PM
My mostly vintage SAKs with what I think are their original boxes.  I cannot be certain the box is correct as I am not the original owner of them.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/613/32998089130_13e8df2854_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/SgVQgd)

Top row:
246k a
no markings
134ku
0236maU
248kU
0.5700.61
1.4713. other side of box is136aU
1.57.13

Bottom row:
WOODSMAN
CHAMPION
CHAMPION
RANGER
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 12, 2017, 02:54:13 PM
Got this Wenger in today....
SG, the blades on the Wenger sure look to be in good shape.  You're right it looks like a match to your Victorinox.  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 12, 2017, 05:42:50 PM
Got this Wenger in today....
SG, the blades on the Wenger sure look to be in good shape.  You're right it looks like a match to your Victorinox.  :tu:

Thanks FB! The blades are nice for it's age having only normal use/surface scratches etc (not minty) The way I have to shoot SAKs inside, to balance the lighting/contrast ratios into acceptable ranges, requires letting the blade go a tiny bit "glary" which minimizes tiny surface imperfections. This is partly due to my 50 dollar cellphone and the simple (i.e. free) photo editing program not having a burn/dodge feature like my old (or current versions) of Adobe Photoshop. To depict the blades dead accurate (to show every tiny imperfection), I would have to boost the darker values (areas) to the point that the image becomes very artificial/manipulated looking. The particular technique I've worked out gives balanced levels without overly manipulating the image and lets me keep my sanity.  :D   We used to do all this with the Zone System back in the days of Black and White photography. It allowed you to expose/place scene values into ranges which could then (by prior testing and customizing film choices/processing technique) be accurately reproduced in the final print. Ansel Adams was the most famous photographer that used this technique.

Newer mirror polished SAKs are even more of a problem since a dead accurate depiction would show them as tiny mirrors reflecting my ceiling and whatever is in the room. So I have to manage the reflections as well by knife positioning and by obstructing (controlling) the reflected line of sight with (light or dark) neutral targets or, more commonly, a lighting panel (which again boosts the luminance value of the blade). All this is why some of my shots can take hours to get the final image.   :ahhh  It can be an ordeal sometimes since I have no lighting/studio setup...just a six dollar diffusion panel and a lamp on the table by my computer.  :salute:   I often mess it up but if it looks like I just set the knife down and shot it, I've been successful. :D

Older Carbon Steel blades (with patina) tend to render more accurately than SS SAK blades and are way easier to shoot. See below.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 12, 2017, 05:47:21 PM
Yes, I see what you mean about the carbon steel blade shown in the Old Timer photo.  :tu:
Even though your photos take time, they are always worth viewing!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 12, 2017, 05:58:57 PM
Yes, I see what you mean about the carbon steel blade shown in the Old Timer photo.  :tu:
Even though your photos take time, they are always worth viewing!  :cheers:

Thank you!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SteveC on March 12, 2017, 06:00:10 PM
Nice shots Robert and great explanation of your pic process   :cheers:


Love that Wenger BTW !    :drool: :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 12, 2017, 10:07:16 PM
Nice shots Robert and great explanation of your pic process   :cheers:


Love that Wenger BTW !    :drool: :drool:

Thanks Steve!!!!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pettydroid on March 12, 2017, 10:07:41 PM
Gentlemen, have anyone of you ever seen anything like this?
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170312/a01d3851f98efd4f9a218f8beb866565.jpg)
Should be 1944 Wenger.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: NorCalJim on March 12, 2017, 10:28:37 PM
Got this Wenger in today....
SG, the blades on the Wenger sure look to be in good shape.  You're right it looks like a match to your Victorinox.  :tu:

Thanks FB! The blades are nice for it's age having only normal use/surface scratches etc (not minty) The way I have to shoot SAKs inside, to balance the lighting/contrast ratios into acceptable ranges, requires letting the blade go a tiny bit "glary" which minimizes tiny surface imperfections. This is partly due to my 50 dollar cellphone and the simple (i.e. free) photo editing program not having a burn/dodge feature like my old (or current versions) of Adobe Photoshop. To depict the blades dead accurate (to show every tiny imperfection), I would have to boost the darker values (areas) to the point that the image becomes very artificial/manipulated looking. The particular technique I've worked out gives balanced levels without overly manipulating the image and lets me keep my sanity.  :D   We used to do all this with the Zone System back in the days of Black and White photography. It allowed you to expose/place scene values into ranges which could then (by prior testing and customizing film choices/processing technique) be accurately reproduced in the final print. Ansel Adams was the most famous photographer that used this technique.

Newer mirror polished SAKs are even more of a problem since a dead accurate depiction would show them as tiny mirrors reflecting my ceiling and whatever is in the room. So I have to manage the reflections as well by knife positioning and by obstructing (controlling) the reflected line of sight with (light or dark) neutral targets or, more commonly, a lighting panel (which again boosts the luminance value of the blade). All this is why some of my shots can take hours to get the final image.   :ahhh  It can be an ordeal sometimes since I have no lighting/studio setup...just a six dollar diffusion panel and a lamp on the table by my computer.  :salute:   I often mess it up but if it looks like I just set the knife down and shot it, I've been successful. :D

Older Carbon Steel blades (with patina) tend to render more accurately than SS SAK blades and are way easier to shoot. See below.

 :like: :like: :like: :like:

Thanks for the background!  I have been very curious about your pro quality photography.  These days I use my iPhone 7 Plus for quick snaps with zero post processing while my cameras sit in their bags slowly draining their batteries.  I don't see that changing anytime soon but I sure appreciate your photos and thank you for your time investment (it does inspire me to want to put more effort into my photos).

 :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: captain spaulding on March 13, 2017, 12:55:29 AM
Gentlemen, have anyone of you ever seen anything like this?
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170312/a01d3851f98efd4f9a218f8beb866565.jpg)
Should be 1944 Wenger.

I have not but it appears to be a nazi eagle over a swastika. I have some old Steyr ammo with that marking. Very cool for its history.

Want to sell it?   :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 13, 2017, 01:02:13 AM
Got this Wenger in today....
SG, the blades on the Wenger sure look to be in good shape.  You're right it looks like a match to your Victorinox.  :tu:

Thanks FB! The blades are nice for it's age having only normal use/surface scratches etc (not minty) The way I have to shoot SAKs inside, to balance the lighting/contrast ratios into acceptable ranges, requires letting the blade go a tiny bit "glary" which minimizes tiny surface imperfections. This is partly due to my 50 dollar cellphone and the simple (i.e. free) photo editing program not having a burn/dodge feature like my old (or current versions) of Adobe Photoshop. To depict the blades dead accurate (to show every tiny imperfection), I would have to boost the darker values (areas) to the point that the image becomes very artificial/manipulated looking. The particular technique I've worked out gives balanced levels without overly manipulating the image and lets me keep my sanity.  :D   We used to do all this with the Zone System back in the days of Black and White photography. It allowed you to expose/place scene values into ranges which could then (by prior testing and customizing film choices/processing technique) be accurately reproduced in the final print. Ansel Adams was the most famous photographer that used this technique.

Newer mirror polished SAKs are even more of a problem since a dead accurate depiction would show them as tiny mirrors reflecting my ceiling and whatever is in the room. So I have to manage the reflections as well by knife positioning and by obstructing (controlling) the reflected line of sight with (light or dark) neutral targets or, more commonly, a lighting panel (which again boosts the luminance value of the blade). All this is why some of my shots can take hours to get the final image.   :ahhh  It can be an ordeal sometimes since I have no lighting/studio setup...just a six dollar diffusion panel and a lamp on the table by my computer.  :salute:   I often mess it up but if it looks like I just set the knife down and shot it, I've been successful. :D

Older Carbon Steel blades (with patina) tend to render more accurately than SS SAK blades and are way easier to shoot. See below.

 :like: :like: :like: :like:

Thanks for the background!  I have been very curious about your pro quality photography.  These days I use my iPhone 7 Plus for quick snaps with zero post processing while my cameras sit in their bags slowly draining their batteries.  I don't see that changing anytime soon but I sure appreciate your photos and thank you for your time investment (it does inspire me to want to put more effort into my photos).

 :salute:

Thanks Jim!!!!  :cheers: :cheers: The iPhone's capabilities are amazing from what I've seen/read. I enjoy doing these pics but my poor health gets in the way sometimes. Haven't used my Leicas or Nikons for years either....  :facepalm:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 13, 2017, 01:06:04 AM
Gentlemen, have anyone of you ever seen anything like this?
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170312/a01d3851f98efd4f9a218f8beb866565.jpg)
Should be 1944 Wenger.

I have not but it appears to be a nazi eagle over a swastika. I have some old Steyr ammo with that marking. Very cool for its history.

Want to sell it?   :D

I have that same symbol on a Nazi era coin....
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on March 13, 2017, 01:19:14 AM
I agree with Steve...and i can always make room for that Wenger if you run out of room buddy!! 
Nice shots Robert and great explanation of your pic process   :cheers:


Love that Wenger BTW !    :drool: :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: NorCalJim on March 13, 2017, 01:59:33 AM
Got this Wenger in today....
SG, the blades on the Wenger sure look to be in good shape.  You're right it looks like a match to your Victorinox.  :tu:

Thanks FB! The blades are nice for it's age having only normal use/surface scratches etc (not minty) The way I have to shoot SAKs inside, to balance the lighting/contrast ratios into acceptable ranges, requires letting the blade go a tiny bit "glary" which minimizes tiny surface imperfections. This is partly due to my 50 dollar cellphone and the simple (i.e. free) photo editing program not having a burn/dodge feature like my old (or current versions) of Adobe Photoshop. To depict the blades dead accurate (to show every tiny imperfection), I would have to boost the darker values (areas) to the point that the image becomes very artificial/manipulated looking. The particular technique I've worked out gives balanced levels without overly manipulating the image and lets me keep my sanity.  :D   We used to do all this with the Zone System back in the days of Black and White photography. It allowed you to expose/place scene values into ranges which could then (by prior testing and customizing film choices/processing technique) be accurately reproduced in the final print. Ansel Adams was the most famous photographer that used this technique.

Newer mirror polished SAKs are even more of a problem since a dead accurate depiction would show them as tiny mirrors reflecting my ceiling and whatever is in the room. So I have to manage the reflections as well by knife positioning and by obstructing (controlling) the reflected line of sight with (light or dark) neutral targets or, more commonly, a lighting panel (which again boosts the luminance value of the blade). All this is why some of my shots can take hours to get the final image.   :ahhh  It can be an ordeal sometimes since I have no lighting/studio setup...just a six dollar diffusion panel and a lamp on the table by my computer.  :salute:   I often mess it up but if it looks like I just set the knife down and shot it, I've been successful. :D

Older Carbon Steel blades (with patina) tend to render more accurately than SS SAK blades and are way easier to shoot. See below.

 :like: :like: :like: :like:

Thanks for the background!  I have been very curious about your pro quality photography.  These days I use my iPhone 7 Plus for quick snaps with zero post processing while my cameras sit in their bags slowly draining their batteries.  I don't see that changing anytime soon but I sure appreciate your photos and thank you for your time investment (it does inspire me to want to put more effort into my photos).

 :salute:

Thanks Jim!!!!  :cheers: :cheers: The iPhone's capabilities are amazing from what I've seen/read. I enjoy doing these pics but my poor health gets in the way sometimes. Haven't used my Leicas or Nikons for years either....  :facepalm:

Now I can see how you can afford mountains of SAKs since you are no longer buying Leicas!  :)

I enjoyed the Nikon F series cameras for decades but sold my SLR equipment when I had to relocate in the early 80's.  It wasn't until sometime in the mid-90's that we resumed our enjoyment of capturing photos (now digital).   When I retired, I was determined to devote more time to the enjoyment of photography.  I'll skip the long story but I ended up with a sizable investment in two formats (Sony APS-C & M43).  Health has posed some delays to getting out and about with my equipment (knee problems, knee surgery & my wife fell and suffered a compression fracture in her back).  Meanwhile, phone cameras have gotten so good that it makes it harder not to capture some photos. :)

Here's hoping that your health improves!  Thanks for sharing your photos!

 :cheers: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 13, 2017, 02:18:19 AM
I agree with Steve...and i can always make room for that Wenger if you run out of room buddy!! 
Nice shots Robert and great explanation of your pic process   :cheers:


Love that Wenger BTW !    :drool: :drool:

 :D Thx Barry!!!!!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pettydroid on March 13, 2017, 10:50:55 AM
Gentlemen, have anyone of you ever seen anything like this?
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170312/a01d3851f98efd4f9a218f8beb866565.jpg)
Should be 1944 Wenger.

I have not but it appears to be a nazi eagle over a swastika. I have some old Steyr ammo with that marking. Very cool for its history.

Want to sell it?   :D

I have that same symbol on a Nazi era coin....
The date on the knife falls into WWII (1944) but I would like to know if anyone ever seen it on any SAK from that era?
Is it a first GAK ?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pettydroid on March 13, 2017, 10:56:32 AM
Gentlemen, have anyone of you ever seen anything like this?
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170312/a01d3851f98efd4f9a218f8beb866565.jpg)
Should be 1944 Wenger.

I have not but it appears to be a nazi eagle over a swastika. I have some old Steyr ammo with that marking. Very cool for its history.

Want to sell it?   :D
Would you be interested to buy it? The price would be USD 100  plus shipping. Selling at cost, just want to get it to anyone who would like it.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: captain spaulding on March 14, 2017, 12:12:28 AM
I can't afford that right now but someone else may want it. Thank you for pricing it.  :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 17, 2017, 04:03:59 AM
This knife is in route to me, but at this moment the shipment is delayed due to poor weather back East.
I'm curious if you folks think this is a Champion.  Not sure if the seller is showing all the tools or not.  Is it possible all the tools are showing?
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/563/33484294595_4fa0d08a0f_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/T1TLd4)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on March 17, 2017, 04:14:33 AM
This knife is in route to me, but at this moment the shipment is delayed due to poor weather back East.
I'm curious if you folks think this is a Champion.  Not sure if the seller is showing all the tools or not.  Is it possible all the tools are showing?

Looks like 236faU from c. 1960.

(http://i.imgur.com/lHjZ1VH.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 17, 2017, 04:27:29 AM
This knife is in route to me, but at this moment the shipment is delayed due to poor weather back East.
I'm curious if you folks think this is a Champion.  Not sure if the seller is showing all the tools or not.  Is it possible all the tools are showing?

Looks like 236faU from c. 1960.

(http://i.imgur.com/lHjZ1VH.jpg)
Yes that is the tool set, thanks JB!
Just now I went back to the SAKWiki thinking maybe I had missed seeing it when I was trying to figure out what I had.  Seems I can't find Angler Plus there.
I looked within the Angler link.   :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on March 17, 2017, 11:38:16 AM
Hey FB

Another great find and not even in the WIKI - Impressive - Although you did not beat JB  :o
And always good with that 'interim' config - Old awl - But internal rivets.

I will put it in the Wiki - Should it have its own page? Or should it be a variation of the Angler?
I am leaning towards variation  ??? But if it was common/catalogue model I guess it should have its own page? Let me know folks
And can I steal your piccie please JB? - I know you have quite a few piccies in there already.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on March 17, 2017, 03:55:10 PM
I will put it in the Wiki - Should it have its own page? Or should it be a variation of the Angler?
I am leaning towards variation  ??? But if it was common/catalogue model I guess it should have its own page? Let me know folks
And can I steal your piccie please JB? - I know you have quite a few piccies in there already.

By all means use the picture. I'd put it as it's own model under the five layer models so it's easy to find.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 18, 2017, 11:59:44 PM
Thank you Huntsman and JB, the knife is here and it indeed only has those 5 layers as shown in the ad.
Here is the picture I just took of it, I have to work on not getting reflections on the blades. For instance, the wood saw is glossy chrome looking, but it is picking up ceiling reflections.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2936/32703350373_c95c82a0bc_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RPTdGv)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 19, 2017, 12:01:56 AM
Very nice FB!!!! :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 19, 2017, 12:22:08 AM
Thanks SG!
I can't decipher if this is an overlay or inlay.  It's hard to tell by the photo, but there is a bit of an imprint of the logo into the cellidor, then there's paint?
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2856/32703682143_73e2433930_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RPUVjF)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on March 19, 2017, 06:07:13 AM
That really is a nice knife FB.

It is in amazing condition and as we said a reasonably unusual model
It's also nice as it has the older saw (slanted teeth) as well as the old style awl, and scissors, and SD with PAT stamp, metal tweezers etc
Very, very nice - How do you do it!!

I would say the logo is painted on - Not hot stamped and not inlay.
You can always tell an inlay as the pattern and letters, if present, are always joined up by a tiny strip of metal - ie The inlay is in one single piece
Check it out on SAKs where you know it is an inlay - you'll see what I mean. Actually look at the classic Vic shield above - The cross is joined to the shield edge.
Not hot stamp - As there usually is an small indentation in the plastic where the letters are stamped 
Pretty sure about the inlay, in this case - Not so sure about the hot stamp

Re the Wiki - You are right - it needs its own page - Will do and thanks JB
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 19, 2017, 02:55:34 PM
Thank you Huntsman.
Upon further investigation through a loupe, I believe it is painted on.  The only part on the logo that has a texture/ridge is the "triangular" area of the logo.  It seems as though it may have been imprinted a bit as it feels similar to my "Camping" teepee hot foil stamp.

Not sure why I'm focussed on that except for I rarely see a logo on the knives that have a large awl.  That is what caught my eye, well that and it has a large awl.  :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on March 19, 2017, 06:41:24 PM
Thank you Huntsman and JB, the knife is here and it indeed only has those 5 layers as shown in the ad.
Here is the picture I just took of it, I have to work on not getting reflections on the blades. For instance, the wood saw is glossy chrome looking, but it is picking up ceiling reflections.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2936/32703350373_c95c82a0bc_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RPTdGv)

That is a good looking knife FB.  You are really getting a nice collection of Vintage Vics :like: :cheers:   
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 19, 2017, 07:25:30 PM
Thank you Huntsman and JB, the knife is here and it indeed only has those 5 layers as shown in the ad.
Here is the picture I just took of it, I have to work on not getting reflections on the blades. For instance, the wood saw is glossy chrome looking, but it is picking up ceiling reflections.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2936/32703350373_c95c82a0bc_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RPTdGv)

That is a good looking knife FB.  You are really getting a nice collection of Vintage Vics :like: :cheers:
Thank you Vicman!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 19, 2017, 08:36:15 PM
75mm MoP Victoria Accountant
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 19, 2017, 10:25:42 PM
As much as I prefer original boxes, I will buy without, proof shown below:  :ahhh
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2831/33537801005_f4aa2acc2a_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/T6BZNn)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 19, 2017, 11:01:17 PM
As much as I prefer original boxes, I will buy without, proof shown below:  :ahhh
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2831/33537801005_f4aa2acc2a_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/T6BZNn)

 :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: cough, cough  :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 19, 2017, 11:06:50 PM
Thank you SG.  :cheers:
I have no more deals in the works, so it's likely a good stopping point for the vintage ones.
I still have one more modern one I'd like to get (Picnicker)...then I may take a break.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 19, 2017, 11:29:23 PM
Thank you SG.  :cheers:
I have no more deals in the works, so it's likely a good stopping point for the vintage ones.
I still have one more modern one I'd like to get (Picnicker)...then I may take a break.

I hear you!!! I have a few SAKs in transit then I'm gonna coast for a bit as well....got a bunch of stuff to to get serviced on the truck and out here at the farm!!!!  :ahhh :ahhh
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 20, 2017, 12:55:34 AM
Thank you SG.  :cheers:
I have no more deals in the works, so it's likely a good stopping point for the vintage ones.
I still have one more modern one I'd like to get (Picnicker)...then I may take a break.

I hear you!!! I have a few SAKs in transit then I'm gonna coast for a bit as well....got a bunch of stuff to to get serviced on the truck and out here at the farm!!!!  :ahhh :ahhh
I wonder which one of us will cave in first!  :rofl:  :pok:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 20, 2017, 12:59:19 AM
Thank you SG.  :cheers:
I have no more deals in the works, so it's likely a good stopping point for the vintage ones.
I still have one more modern one I'd like to get (Picnicker)...then I may take a break.

I hear you!!! I have a few SAKs in transit then I'm gonna coast for a bit as well....got a bunch of stuff to to get serviced on the truck and out here at the farm!!!!  :ahhh :ahhh
I wonder which one of us will cave in first!  :rofl:  :pok:

 :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on March 20, 2017, 01:29:48 AM
Pining for pins.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 20, 2017, 01:32:15 AM
Pining for pins.
Nice!
3rd down on the left is intriguing.  Do you have a close-up shot of it?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 20, 2017, 01:36:28 AM
Pining for pins.

 :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: Good stuff Karl!!!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on March 20, 2017, 01:36:54 AM
@ CS and FB .... and SG

Model names and numbers please for all group shot photos posted !!!

....It's a rule of this thread  :o ..... Did you not read it in the first post ???  ;)

In old format (246mafu etc) and modern equivalent of course  :pok:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on March 20, 2017, 01:37:08 AM
Pining for pins.
Nice!
3rd down on the left is intriguing.  Do you have a close-up shot of it?

Old Spartan for Danzas Transporte.



Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 20, 2017, 01:38:23 AM
Pining for pins.
Nice!
3rd down on the left is intriguing.  Do you have a close-up shot of it?

Old Spartan for Danzas Transporte.
:like: That's the oldest SAK I've ever seen with advertising.  Looks inlaid too.  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on March 20, 2017, 01:41:12 AM
@ CS and FB .... and SG

Model names and numbers please for all group shot photos posted !!!

....It's a rule of this thread  :o ..... Did you not read it in the first post ???  ;)

In old format (246mafu etc) and modern equivalent of course  :pok:

All of them:


XXXABCD, which is another way of saying I don't have that info for most of those knives. Sorry.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on March 20, 2017, 01:42:13 AM
Old Spartan for Danzas Transporte.

 :ahhh

One of the few times I've been outright swindled on eBay for a knife was for one of these. Seller was in France, I wired the money, and he simply never sent the knife. No paypal so I was out the money. SOB sold the knife a year later on eBay again to a seller in France.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 20, 2017, 01:42:51 AM
@ CS and FB .... and SG

Model names and numbers please for all group shot photos posted !!!
Okay, I will, but tomorrow, I put them all back and have to figure out the group shot again.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on March 20, 2017, 01:52:49 AM
Pining for pins.
Nice!
3rd down on the left is intriguing.  Do you have a close-up shot of it?

Old Spartan for Danzas Transporte.
:like: That's the oldest SAK I've ever seen with advertising.  Looks inlaid too.  :tu:

Definite inlay.

Here are a couple more old Vics with metal inlays, for Interlaken and Oris Watches (bottom).

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on March 20, 2017, 01:58:55 AM
Old Spartan for Danzas Transporte.

 :ahhh

One of the few times I've been outright swindled on eBay for a knife was for one of these. Seller was in France, I wired the money, and he simply never sent the knife. No paypal so I was out the money. SOB sold the knife a year later on eBay again to a seller in France.

Most people are decent, but there's a few in every group that need defenistration from an upper story.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on March 20, 2017, 02:10:19 AM
Yep - I am lucky too - I have always had good experiences - Although many very nervous moments - Eg Shipping taking eight weeks or more
Once Australia Post, in their wisdom  ???, even returned a package to the sender - when it was correctly addressed - and I was at home, during what would have been the delivery period
The seller (in US) very kindly shipped again - And even offered to pay for the re-ship - We split it in the end

One of the few times I've been outright swindled on eBay for a knife was for one of these. Seller was in France, I wired the money, and he simply never sent the knife. No paypal so I was out the money. SOB sold the knife a year later on eBay again to a seller in France.
But that really stinks JB - and clearly, brazen, outright fraud - As he 'sold it again later' (Thinks:  ??? I knew JB kept good records - But that is impressive!!)
It makes me very angry and upset - I know I am naïve - But I want to believe folk are honest !!

Presumably he did the same trick second time around
A bit difficult for you to send in the heavies from the US to France - But I hope his French compatriot did !! And gave him a good beating

And I hope he got nailed as an ebay seller too   
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 20, 2017, 03:05:01 AM
@ CS and FB .... and SG

Model names and numbers please for all group shot photos posted !!!

....It's a rule of this thread  :o ..... Did you not read it in the first post ???  ;)

In old format (246mafu etc) and modern equivalent of course  :pok:

 :rofl: I was counting on you guys to tell me!!!!  >:D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 20, 2017, 03:03:26 PM
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2831/33537801005_f4aa2acc2a_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/T6BZNn)

Top - TeleChrome - 91mm 5 layer Angler Plus, 236fa
Left to Right
84mm No rivet 4 layer Artisan
84mm No rivet w/bail 3 layer opener tools/scissors/blade layer
91mm Exposed rivet, 2 layer, opener tools/blade layer
91mm 2-layer Spartan, exposed rivet, blade layer/opener layer
84mm 2-layer w/bail, exposed rivet, opener layer/blade layer -  205ku
91mm 3-layer, my first exposed rivet w/bail Camper
Bottom - 91mm $10 knife that has been modded to become a Fieldmaster and one of my EDCs
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on March 20, 2017, 05:58:13 PM
Pining for pins.
Nice!
3rd down on the left is intriguing.  Do you have a close-up shot of it?

Old Spartan for Danzas Transporte.
Nice knife! Have the same one. It is interesting that this inlay is shown in 1942 Elsener catalog.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170320/299d246ad57575a26bf846b924fd722a.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170320/5c053da06f3fb3a9504d629264656553.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on March 20, 2017, 06:59:23 PM
As much as I prefer original boxes, I will buy without, proof shown below:  :ahhh
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2831/33537801005_f4aa2acc2a_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/T6BZNn)
:like: :like: :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on March 20, 2017, 07:00:46 PM
Pining for pins.
:like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: NorCalJim on March 20, 2017, 07:26:34 PM
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2831/33537801005_f4aa2acc2a_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/T6BZNn)

Top - TeleChrome - 91mm 5 layer Angler Plus, 236fa
Left to Right
84mm No rivet 4 layer Artisan
84mm No rivet w/bail 3 layer opener tools/scissors/blade layer
91mm Exposed rivet, 2 layer, opener tools/blade layer
91mm 2-layer Spartan, exposed rivet, blade layer/opener layer
84mm 2-layer w/bail, exposed rivet, opener layer/blade layer -  205ku
91mm 3-layer, my first exposed rivet w/bail Camper
Bottom - 91mm $10 knife that has been modded to become a Fieldmaster and one of my EDCs

 :like: :like: :like:

Impressive!!!

 :tu: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on March 20, 2017, 10:24:45 PM
+100!!!!!!!
As much as I prefer original boxes, I will buy without, proof shown below:  :ahhh
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2831/33537801005_f4aa2acc2a_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/T6BZNn)

 :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: cough, cough  :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 20, 2017, 11:01:43 PM
Thanks all for the Likes.  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Herman on March 21, 2017, 12:06:37 AM
Beautiful Danzas and Telechrome!!! 
Another rare 84mm 5-layer Telechrome was shown by Neil years ago (in 2010 to be exact   :ahhh time flies when you're having fun  ;) )... http://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,21990.msg426783.html#msg426783
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 21, 2017, 12:21:06 AM
Beautiful Danzas and Telechrome!!! 
Another rare 84mm 5-layer Telechrome was shown by Neil years ago (in 2010 to be exact   :ahhh time flies when you're having fun  ;) )... http://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,21990.msg426783.html#msg426783
Thanks for the link, I really like the looks of Neil's 84mm, wow!  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on March 21, 2017, 07:58:38 AM
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2831/33537801005_f4aa2acc2a_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/T6BZNn)

Top - TeleChrome - 91mm 5 layer Angler Plus, 236fa
Left to Right
84mm No rivet 4 layer Artisan
84mm No rivet w/bail 3 layer opener tools/scissors/blade layer
91mm Exposed rivet, 2 layer, opener tools/blade layer
91mm 2-layer Spartan, exposed rivet, blade layer/opener layer
84mm 2-layer w/bail, exposed rivet, opener layer/blade layer -  205ku
91mm 3-layer, my first exposed rivet w/bail Camper
Bottom - 91mm $10 knife that has been modded to become a Fieldmaster and one of my EDCs

OK, OK - I can see I am going to have to do this myself.  :pok:
Good chance to exercise my new found Vintage SAK naming skills - Thanks to the info provided by JB (earlier in this thread I think!!)
So here we go: ..... Top to bottom and left to right: .....

Seriously - Thanks for posting the info and pic - Love it and appreciate it      :)

* Was the model number for the Tourist on its box FB - As I was not sure why this was not a 234 ku - as I think the 5 in xx5 indicates scissors and I was not sure what the 0 in x0x was

And just noticed - Interestingly
- Only one with tp/tw
- And 1:3 Phillips:CS ratio - Hmmmmm

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 21, 2017, 12:27:17 PM
* Was the model number for the Tourist on its box FB - As I was not sure why this was not a 234 ku - as I think the 5 in xx5 indicates scissors and I was not sure what the 0 in x0x was

Hello Huntsman, thank you for your naming efforts.  I don't recall why I named that what I did except I thought someone at some point told me it was that, unsure who/where, and even quite possibly me trying to name it.

The set you just named are my non-boxed set with large awls.

Here are my boxed ones, much easier to name.  :D  :pok:  :cheers:

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/613/32998089130_13e8df2854_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/SgVQgd)

Top row:
246k a
no markings
134ku
0236maU
248kU
0.5700.61
1.4713. other side of box is136aU
1.57.13
Bottom row:
WOODSMAN
CHAMPION
CHAMPION
RANGER
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on March 21, 2017, 02:56:17 PM
* Was the model number for the Tourist on its box FB - As I was not sure why this was not a 234 ku - as I think the 5 in xx5 indicates scissors and I was not sure what the 0 in x0x was

That number came from me, and actually should be 206U.

A while ago FB posted an early 1940s Tourist and asked for a model number. From the late 1940s-1970s the Spartan/Tourist numbers were 234/234k. I knew however that Pre-1946 Victorinox was still using the original model numbers for the Spartan and Tourist. The original number for the Spartan is 205, so I told her the Tourist from this era was a 205k. When I got home I looked this up to verify, and found I made a mistake - pre-1946 Victorinox used the Model number 206 for the Tourist, instead of the typical "91mm model number + k" scheme they used for the other knives. I corrected the original post and added this except from the 43 catalog. Here you can see two Tourists labled "206", a Spartan labeled "205". Note the Gourmets in this images (84mm and 91mm) following the more usual "91mm model + k = 84mm model"

(http://i.imgur.com/tSWE50y.png)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 21, 2017, 03:10:08 PM
Thank you again JB.
So for my records, the 91mm Spartan on the left is 205, the 84mm Tourist on the right is 206.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3727/33413746852_1429901f70_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/SUEbPE)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on March 21, 2017, 03:19:13 PM
Thank you again JB.
So for my records, the 91mm Spartan on the left is 205, the 84mm Tourist on the right is 206.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3727/33413746852_1429901f70_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/SUEbPE)

Correct - well, technically the Tourist is a 206U (U = bail), but yes.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 21, 2017, 03:20:45 PM
Correct - well, technically the Tourist is a 206U (U = bail), but yes.
Noted, thank you.  :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 22, 2017, 01:31:15 AM
Well, we know the former owner had a big screwdriver and didn't drink wine....or those would have been screwed up too.  :facepalm:

It's an Armee Suisse too.....
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Whats%20wrong%20with%20people....._zpsaxnohgcg.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ColoSwiss on March 22, 2017, 01:33:23 AM
Well, we know the former owner had a big screwdriver and didn't drink wine....or those would have been screwed up too.  :facepalm:

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Whats%20wrong%20with%20people....._zpsaxnohgcg.jpg)

Your new EDC!   :pok:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 22, 2017, 01:35:36 AM
Well, we know the former owner had a big screwdriver and didn't drink wine....or those would have been screwed up too.  :facepalm:

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Whats%20wrong%20with%20people....._zpsaxnohgcg.jpg)

Your new EDC!   :pok:

 :rofl:  Probably couldn't hurt it any worse!!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 22, 2017, 01:44:06 AM
Well, we know the former owner had a big screwdriver and didn't drink wine....or those would have been screwed up too.  :facepalm:

It's an Armee Suisse too.....
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Whats%20wrong%20with%20people....._zpsaxnohgcg.jpg)
I'm not understanding the woodsaw coming out the opposite end.
In one regard, the knife was used and I have to respect that part.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 22, 2017, 02:00:55 AM
Well, we know the former owner had a big screwdriver and didn't drink wine....or those would have been screwed up too.  :facepalm:

It's an Armee Suisse too.....
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Whats%20wrong%20with%20people....._zpsaxnohgcg.jpg)
I'm not understanding the woodsaw coming out the opposite end.
In one regard, the knife was used and I have to respect that part.


Broken and lost backspring....nothing there to stop it..  I've used knives for 50+ years, pretty hard at times, and none of them looked even close to this so I'm less understanding.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on March 22, 2017, 04:18:42 AM
* Was the model number for the Tourist on its box FB - As I was not sure why this was not a 234 ku - as I think the 5 in xx5 indicates scissors and I was not sure what the 0 in x0x was

Hello Huntsman, thank you for your naming efforts.  I don't recall why I named that what I did except I thought someone at some point told me it was that, unsure who/where, and even quite possibly me trying to name it.

The set you just named are my non-boxed set with large awls.

Here are my boxed ones, much easier to name.  :D  :pok:  :cheers:

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/613/32998089130_13e8df2854_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/SgVQgd)

Top row:
246k a
no markings
134ku
0236maU
248kU
0.5700.61
1.4713. other side of box is136aU
1.57.13
Bottom row:
WOODSMAN
CHAMPION
CHAMPION
RANGER

With box!  I am not worthy! !   :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: NorCalJim on March 22, 2017, 04:44:16 AM
* Was the model number for the Tourist on its box FB - As I was not sure why this was not a 234 ku - as I think the 5 in xx5 indicates scissors and I was not sure what the 0 in x0x was

Hello Huntsman, thank you for your naming efforts.  I don't recall why I named that what I did except I thought someone at some point told me it was that, unsure who/where, and even quite possibly me trying to name it.

The set you just named are my non-boxed set with large awls.

Here are my boxed ones, much easier to name.  :D  :pok:  :cheers:

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/613/32998089130_13e8df2854_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/SgVQgd)

Top row:
246k a
no markings
134ku
0236maU
248kU
0.5700.61
1.4713. other side of box is136aU
1.57.13
Bottom row:
WOODSMAN
CHAMPION
CHAMPION
RANGER

 :like: :like: :like:

Wow!!!

I just saw this...very impressive!!!

Thanks so much for sharing!

 :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 22, 2017, 06:33:21 AM
Did I post this Fisherman pic here?
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Reposts/Vintage%20things%20-%20Vic%20Fisherman%20-%20pre%2070_zpsd5zvanct.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 22, 2017, 10:16:56 AM
Thank you TonySal and NorCal!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on March 24, 2017, 03:12:25 AM
Did I post this Fisherman pic here?
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Reposts/Vintage%20things%20-%20Vic%20Fisherman%20-%20pre%2070_zpsd5zvanct.jpg)
OMG i have that "album"  covered songs from them in the biz, YEARS ago
Its getting to the point where Im old......
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 24, 2017, 03:38:57 AM
Did I post this Fisherman pic here?
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Reposts/Vintage%20things%20-%20Vic%20Fisherman%20-%20pre%2070_zpsd5zvanct.jpg)
OMG i have that "album"  covered songs from them in the biz, YEARS ago
Its getting to the point where Im old......

 :cheers: Yeah getting old kinda sux...but wasn't the music awesome!!!!   8) :D :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 24, 2017, 04:17:09 AM
One of my nicer vintage Craftsman (square Phillips, fishscaler)...looks unused. Probably '80-'85 due to the tool types. It's VSSR stamped with a blank reverse tang.

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Early%2080s%20Craftsman%203-23-17_zpsezigdspp.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: glenfiddich1983 on March 24, 2017, 08:05:06 AM
One of my nicer vintage Craftsman (square Phillips, fishscaler)...looks unused. Probably '80-'85 due to the tool types. It's VSSR stamped with a blank reverse tang.

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Early%2080s%20Craftsman%203-23-17_zpsezigdspp.jpg)

 :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 24, 2017, 12:07:31 PM
One of my nicer vintage Craftsman (square Phillips, fishscaler)...looks unused. Probably '80-'85 due to the tool types. It's VSSR stamped with a blank reverse tang.

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Early%2080s%20Craftsman%203-23-17_zpsezigdspp.jpg)

 :like:
+1
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on March 24, 2017, 07:37:01 PM
Same here Robert, and I think you'd have to really put effort into destroying knives like some people do! 

Well, we know the former owner had a big screwdriver and didn't drink wine....or those would have been screwed up too.  :facepalm:

It's an Armee Suisse too.....
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Whats%20wrong%20with%20people....._zpsaxnohgcg.jpg)
I'm not understanding the woodsaw coming out the opposite end.
In one regard, the knife was used and I have to respect that part.


Broken and lost backspring....nothing there to stop it..  I've used knives for 50+ years, pretty hard at times, and none of them looked even close to this so I'm less understanding.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 24, 2017, 08:17:10 PM
One of my nicer vintage Craftsman (square Phillips, fishscaler)...looks unused. Probably '80-'85 due to the tool types. It's VSSR stamped with a blank reverse tang.

(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Early%2080s%20Craftsman%203-23-17_zpsezigdspp.jpg)

 :like:
+1

Thanks folks!!!!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on March 24, 2017, 08:20:14 PM
Same here Robert, and I think you'd have to really put effort into destroying knives like some people do! 

Well, we know the former owner had a big screwdriver and didn't drink wine....or those would have been screwed up too.  :facepalm:

It's an Armee Suisse too.....
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Whats%20wrong%20with%20people....._zpsaxnohgcg.jpg)
I'm not understanding the woodsaw coming out the opposite end.
In one regard, the knife was used and I have to respect that part.


Broken and lost backspring....nothing there to stop it..  I've used knives for 50+ years, pretty hard at times, and none of them looked even close to this so I'm less understanding.

Thx Barry!!!   :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 07, 2017, 05:03:55 PM
Although this isn't necessarily considered a vintage knife, I know you all in here know your tangs.  :tu:
Is this common?  I see on this tang thread it is 1957-1970, but shouldn't it have Victorinox or Elinox on the opposite side?
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,50014.30.html#_

The tang is blank on the other side.  :think:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2894/33764505461_c9ae0d2f87_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/TrDV8T)
The knife, it's a Picnicker:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2807/33737530392_cb70630786_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/TpgEou)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on April 07, 2017, 05:11:49 PM
Although this isn't necessarily considered a vintage knife, I know you all in here know your tangs.  :tu:
Is this common?
The tang, blank on the other side.  :think:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2894/33764505461_c9ae0d2f87_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/TrDV8T)
The knife, it's a Picnicker:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2807/33737530392_cb70630786_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/TpgEou)
I can't help myself wondering where you keep sourcing all those beauties...
Been searching my butt off for a vintage or exposed riveted SAK but they're nowhere to be found over here :cry:
Not even on the bay. The ones I do find, don't ship over here :dwts:
:bnghd:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 07, 2017, 05:15:05 PM
I can't help myself wondering where you keep sourcing all those beauties...
I find most of them on the auction site, and some are offered to me privately.  I do spend a LOT (too much) time looking for them. 
But I enjoy the hobby, I just wish some of them didn't cost as much as they do.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on April 07, 2017, 05:40:30 PM



But I enjoy the hobby, I just wish some of them didn't cost as much as they do.

Don't we all? :D :tu:

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on April 07, 2017, 05:41:33 PM
Although this isn't necessarily considered a vintage knife, I know you all in here know your tangs.  :tu:
Is this common?  I see on this tang thread it is 1957-1970, but shouldn't it have Victorinox or Elinox on the opposite side?

That stamp is a somewhat unusual one from c. 1974. It was used on both Picnickers and Outdoorsmans (I have an Outdoorsman with this same stamp). Around 1974 Victorinox start transitioning from old (Victoria/Elinox) stamps to newer stamps (Officer Suisse/Economy). This is part of this transition. You see Picnickers with Elinox, Victoria, this one, and Officer Suise stamps.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 07, 2017, 05:56:25 PM
Although this isn't necessarily considered a vintage knife, I know you all in here know your tangs.  :tu:
Is this common?  I see on this tang thread it is 1957-1970, but shouldn't it have Victorinox or Elinox on the opposite side?

That stamp is a somewhat unusual one from c. 1974. It was used on both Picnickers and Outdoorsmans (I have an Outdoorsman with this same stamp). Around 1974 Victorinox start transitioning from old (Victoria/Elinox) stamps to newer stamps (Officer Suisse/Economy). This is part of this transition. You see Picnickers with Elinox, Victoria, this one, and Officer Suise stamps.
Thank you JB!  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on April 07, 2017, 06:15:05 PM
Although this isn't necessarily considered a vintage knife, I know you all in here know your tangs.  :tu:
Is this common?  I see on this tang thread it is 1957-1970, but shouldn't it have Victorinox or Elinox on the opposite side?
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,50014.30.html#_

The tang is blank on the other side.  :think:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2894/33764505461_c9ae0d2f87_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/TrDV8T)
The knife, it's a Picnicker:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2807/33737530392_cb70630786_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/TpgEou)

Great find FB! I knew you would find another Picnicker with the box,

 :tu: :tu: :mail: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 07, 2017, 06:17:24 PM
Great find FB! I knew you would find another Picnicker with the box,
 :tu: :tu: :mail: :cheers:

Thanks Vicman, I just hope this time it is.... :mail:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 08, 2017, 03:40:34 PM
I love this knife and I'm just looking for some clarification on the opener layer as I like to document little variations in my notes about my knives.  As I'm examining my used, but new-to-me Picnicker, I notice the opener layer has two different versions of the tools.  :think:
On the left, the bottle opener doesn't have machine marks (usually diagonal lines).  On the right, the can opener with +Pat has the machine marks.
I am sorry the photos didn't pick it up, but the left tool, polished, right tool machine marks.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3945/33525917080_f65bae69de_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/T5z687)
The knife:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2925/33517006330_93d3201233_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/T4Mqgu)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on April 08, 2017, 06:30:57 PM
I love this knife and I'm just looking for some clarification on the opener layer as I like to document little variations in my notes about my knives.  As I'm examining my used, but new-to-me Picnicker, I notice the opener layer has two different versions of the tools.  :think:
On the left, the bottle opener doesn't have machine marks (usually diagonal lines).  On the right, the can opener with +Pat has the machine marks.
I am sorry the photos didn't pick it up, but the left tool, polished, right tool machine marks.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3945/33525917080_f65bae69de_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/T5z687)
The knife:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2925/33517006330_93d3201233_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/T4Mqgu)

Nice knife FB!

The nail nick on the can opener looks big compared to the one on the cap lifter. :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on April 16, 2017, 08:05:55 AM
NOS No 236
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on April 16, 2017, 10:34:45 AM
 :like: :like: :cheers:  :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on April 16, 2017, 10:50:15 AM
Thanks... :)  It's a very good example of vintage one in pristine condition...along with a "Swiss made" text on the bottle opener (barely visible on my picture).
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 16, 2017, 03:24:57 PM
NOS No 236
:tu: :like: :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on April 16, 2017, 03:39:35 PM
Thanks FB... :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on April 16, 2017, 06:06:23 PM
NOS No 236
Nice knife! Congratulations!  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Boonies on April 16, 2017, 09:59:05 PM
NOS No 236

Wow!!  That is really nice.  Is that 84 or 91mm?  I have need of a 91mm like that if you find yourself completely out of storage space.  😝        :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on April 16, 2017, 09:59:51 PM
NOS No 236

Nice find! :like: :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on April 16, 2017, 11:38:15 PM
I love this knife and I'm just looking for some clarification on the opener layer as I like to document little variations in my notes about my knives.  As I'm examining my used, but new-to-me Picnicker, I notice the opener layer has two different versions of the tools.
On the left, the bottle opener doesn't have machine marks (usually diagonal lines).  On the right, the can opener with +Pat has the machine marks.
I am sorry the photos didn't pick it up, but the left tool, polished, right tool machine marks.

Hi FB,
I don't really know the answer to your question - So this is just speculation - Others may chip in....

I think there are two things that affect whether a tool is polished or not.

1. Time
If you take the Soldier line for instance - The early knives always have the machine marks.
Over time Vic moved onto installing the highly polished tools in all the Soldiers
.. Or at a specific point in time - Late 70s/80s?
SA Knights or the Wiki may have clues as to exactly when

2. Economy/Elinox lines
Never fully understood this - However...
These tools were produced by Vic some time ago and were duplicates of the regular models, but always had a rougher finish (less/no polishing) than the regular lines. So were cheaper to produce and therefore also cheaper to buy. 

There is a nice article in MTo somewhere about the Economy/Regular versions of the St.Chistopher Automobile which you might want to dig out.

Your knife is an Elinox and has a 'economy' and 'regular' opener.
So this knife demonstrates another feature of Vic SAK manufacturing which we have all seen (....quite a bit!!)

3. Parts installed on a knife that do not seem to match the rest of the knife 
So this is where, for whatever reason, an older, or in this case different/wrong (ie polished), part is installed in the knife being made.

So either it was made in a transition period and/or the 'wrong'  part was installed

As I say just my guess  ???

PS. I never really understood the Economy/Elinox lines.
I do understand that they cost less to build and don't have such a nice finish ...
But was it really worth it? As the price difference at the time was only a dollar/franc or two?
And to have completely different productions runs/catalogues/orders/distribution channels etc
- Seems like a lot of effort for little gain!!
I guess 20/30 years ago maybe a dollar or two was worth saving?
And of course now the ridiculous prices we pay for these old guys completely eclipses any price differences.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on April 16, 2017, 11:48:39 PM
In case you were wondering, 60's Super Tinkers weigh around 89.4g.

I'm putting lots of SAKs on the scale here: https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,71599.0.html

 :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on April 17, 2017, 09:13:37 AM
NOS No 236
Nice knife! Congratulations!  :tu:

Thanks JNOXID!  :cheers:

NOS No 236

Wow!!  That is really nice.  Is that 84 or 91mm?  I have need of a 91mm like that if you find yourself completely out of storage space.  😝        :cheers:

Thanks Boonies!  :cheers: It's 91mm...btw nice try.  :)

NOS No 236

Nice find! :like: :like:

Thanks VICMAN!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on April 21, 2017, 11:42:16 PM
In case you were wondering, 60's Super Tinkers weigh around 89.4g.

I'm putting lots of SAKs on the scale here: https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,71599.0.html

 :salute:

Ok so I think mine is a Spartan, thanks, but it was old in the 50's....?  Sorry for the challenged  phone pic......
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on April 22, 2017, 09:53:15 AM
So that vintage super tinker turned out to be a Fieldmaster... It's in pretty good condition except the closing spring on the Philips is damaged and doesn't hold the tool closed.

Major bummer.

Anyone know about getting these repaired?

 :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 22, 2017, 01:57:35 PM
I love this knife and I'm just looking for some clarification on the opener layer as I like to document little variations in my notes about my knives.  As I'm examining my used, but new-to-me Picnicker, I notice the opener layer has two different versions of the tools.
On the left, the bottle opener doesn't have machine marks (usually diagonal lines).  On the right, the can opener with +Pat has the machine marks.
I am sorry the photos didn't pick it up, but the left tool, polished, right tool machine marks.

Hi FB,
I don't really know the answer to your question - So this is just speculation - Others may chip in....

I think there are two things that affect whether a tool is polished or not.

1. Time
If you take the Soldier line for instance - The early knives always have the machine marks.
Over time Vic moved onto installing the highly polished tools in all the Soldiers
.. Or at a specific point in time - Late 70s/80s?
SA Knights or the Wiki may have clues as to exactly when

2. Economy/Elinox lines
Never fully understood this - However...
These tools were produced by Vic some time ago and were duplicates of the regular models, but always had a rougher finish (less/no polishing) than the regular lines. So were cheaper to produce and therefore also cheaper to buy. 

There is a nice article in MTo somewhere about the Economy/Regular versions of the St.Chistopher Automobile which you might want to dig out.

Your knife is an Elinox and has a 'economy' and 'regular' opener.
So this knife demonstrates another feature of Vic SAK manufacturing which we have all seen (....quite a bit!!)

3. Parts installed on a knife that do not seem to match the rest of the knife 
So this is where, for whatever reason, an older, or in this case different/wrong (ie polished), part is installed in the knife being made.

So either it was made in a transition period and/or the 'wrong'  part was installed

As I say just my guess  ???

PS. I never really understood the Economy/Elinox lines.
I do understand that they cost less to build and don't have such a nice finish ...
But was it really worth it? As the price difference at the time was only a dollar/franc or two?
And to have completely different productions runs/catalogues/orders/distribution channels etc
- Seems like a lot of effort for little gain!!
I guess 20/30 years ago maybe a dollar or two was worth saving?
And of course now the ridiculous prices we pay for these old guys completely eclipses any price differences.
Thank you Huntsman for your thoughts.  I apologize I didn't see your post earlier, I usually get an email notification.  :think:

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: osasmudj on April 22, 2017, 07:07:17 PM
I belive its an old handyman with old style blade and dog leg can opener also the screw diver and cap lifter is non locking ...
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170422/96de54793f20c3db3a0466f7acaaf2d0.jpg)

TeTeyac
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on May 20, 2017, 11:03:11 PM
Victorinox/Elinox Automobile - St. Christopher
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Victorinox-Elinox%20Automobile%20-%20St.%20Christopher_zpsqz2edjrl.jpg)

I don't know what this engraving means or could be a name ...
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/ENGRAVING-%20St.%20Christopher_zpsrqxn1nap.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on May 20, 2017, 11:10:50 PM
NOS No 236

 :like: :like: :like: :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Ron Who on May 20, 2017, 11:11:55 PM
I think it spells the name of Schärer.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: SAK Guy on May 21, 2017, 01:00:56 AM
I think it spells the name of Schärer.

Thanks Ronald!!!  :cheers:   I'll google that around a bit!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on May 29, 2017, 09:04:52 AM
It is not rare knife just early 1960s Angler 235 faU, but it looks like in 1960s this one is not so common as Fisherman with Phillips instead of corckscrew. (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170529/74408695f10e40c9ad0b1bdd27ab1c12.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on May 29, 2017, 10:16:08 AM
It is not rare knife just early 1960s Angler 235 faU, but it looks like in 1960s this one is not so common as Fisherman with Phillips instead of corckscrew. (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170529/74408695f10e40c9ad0b1bdd27ab1c12.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 :like: That's a beautiful SAK  :cheers:  Still need a blank fish scaler.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: rivercity on May 29, 2017, 12:45:48 PM
 :like: :like: :like: :like:

(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4220/34120915304_a06e619923_c.jpg)

 :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: glenfiddich1983 on May 29, 2017, 08:04:06 PM
It is not rare knife just early 1960s Angler 235 faU, but it looks like in 1960s this one is not so common as Fisherman with Phillips instead of corckscrew. (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170529/74408695f10e40c9ad0b1bdd27ab1c12.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

:like:

:like: :like: :like: :like:

(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4220/34120915304_a06e619923_c.jpg)

 :cheers:

Excellent pic! :2tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on June 01, 2017, 12:03:09 PM
1.3703 Hoffritz 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MadPlumbarian on June 01, 2017, 05:43:03 PM
:like: :like: :like: :like:

(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4220/34120915304_a06e619923_c.jpg)

 :cheers:
I take it your a classic DE safety user?
JR
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: rivercity on June 02, 2017, 07:10:53 AM
:like: :like: :like: :like:

(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4220/34120915304_a06e619923_c.jpg)

 :cheers:
I take it your a classic DE safety user?
JR

When I bother shaving these days..... yes. My preference is the old Gillette razors, favorite being the fatboy.
 :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MadPlumbarian on June 02, 2017, 08:08:35 AM
:like: :like: :like: :like:

(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4220/34120915304_a06e619923_c.jpg)

 :cheers:
I take it your a classic DE safety user?
JR

When I bother shaving these days..... yes. My preference is the old Gillette razors, favorite being the fatboy.
 :cheers:
Ditto when, mine is a Merkur,
JR
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Boonies on June 04, 2017, 07:18:11 AM
Finally finished my collection of 84mm metal file SAKs with the addition of a small Mountaineer (top right).  Has issues with over-sharpening of the blades but as my dear old mom used to say, "beggars can't be choosers".  It will be a good place holder until (or is that "if") a better example comes along.  It is from the 70's.

The others are the small Grand Prix (top left), also from the 70's, small Master Craftsman (bottom left) from the 70's and small Master Craftsman (bottom right) from the 60's.        :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on June 04, 2017, 12:02:59 PM
Finally finished my collection of 84mm metal file SAKs with the addition of a small Mountaineer (top right).  Has issues with over-sharpening of the blades but as my dear old mom used to say, "beggars can't be choosers".  It will be a good place holder until (or is that "if") a better example comes along.  It is from the 70's.

The others are the small Grand Prix (top left), also from the 70's, small Master Craftsman (bottom left) from the 70's and small Master Craftsman (bottom right) from the 60's.        :cheers:
Really nice collection! Congrats!

Now you need 1950s Master Craftsman small and 1980s Grand Prix small  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Boonies on June 04, 2017, 05:28:44 PM
Finally finished my collection of 84mm metal file SAKs with the addition of a small Mountaineer (top right).  Has issues with over-sharpening of the blades but as my dear old mom used to say, "beggars can't be choosers".  It will be a good place holder until (or is that "if") a better example comes along.  It is from the 70's.

The others are the small Grand Prix (top left), also from the 70's, small Master Craftsman (bottom left) from the 70's and small Master Craftsman (bottom right) from the 60's.        :cheers:
Really nice collection! Congrats!

Now you need 1950s Master Craftsman small and 1980s Grand Prix small  :cheers:

I knew  I wasn't finished!!  😛  My oh my, that 1950's MC is yummy.  Always liked that old style awl.  Very, very nice.  :tu:

My small Grand Prix could be (probably is) from the 1980's, late 1970's to early 1980's at least.  A backup would be good though, so I'll keep looking.  😜    :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on June 05, 2017, 05:44:13 AM
Finally finished my collection of 84mm metal file SAKs with the addition of a small Mountaineer (top right).  Has issues with over-sharpening of the blades but as my dear old mom used to say, "beggars can't be choosers".  It will be a good place holder until (or is that "if") a better example comes along.  It is from the 70's.

The others are the small Grand Prix (top left), also from the 70's, small Master Craftsman (bottom left) from the 70's and small Master Craftsman (bottom right) from the 60's.        :cheers:
Really nice collection! Congrats!

Now you need 1950s Master Craftsman small and 1980s Grand Prix small  :cheers:
Very nice. Afraid to touch my "Spartan " it's  at least 70 yoa.....and I used it as a beater as a kid. OMG (she is safe now)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Fortytwo on July 11, 2017, 11:58:13 PM
I'm a big fan of the vintage look and I'm planning a mod that will hopefully have a little of the best of old and new but I got stuck a little on the bail.

How big are the "heads" of the bail (where the rivet goes through) and what's the diameter of the rod? With all these nice vintage SAKs around maybe someone could be so kind as to measure for me?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on July 12, 2017, 09:04:23 AM
Hi F2

I made a bail for an old British/Indian Army Knife last weekend
I am hoping to post a mod guide on this sometime - I took the photos etc etc

Briefly - The bail pin/rivet diameter for my BAK is the same size as a SAK - 2.5mm
And the bail itself is going to be about 2.5mm - So as you say .....
Challenge: How do I get the pin through the brass of the same thickness ???
My solution: …. was to get some 3.2mm brass rod - Then thin the middle section to 2.5, then flatten the ends so that they are wide enough to have a 2.5mm hole drilled through them, then bend to make the bail!!
Simples !! .......... Not :pok:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Fortytwo on July 12, 2017, 05:16:25 PM
Hi F2

I made a bail for an old British/Indian Army Knife last weekend
I am hoping to post a mod guide on this sometime - I took the photos etc etc

Briefly - The bail pin/rivet diameter for my BAK is the same size as a SAK - 2.5mm
And the bail itself is going to be about 2.5mm - So as you say .....
Challenge: How do I get the pin through the brass of the same thickness ???
My solution: …. was to get some 3.2mm brass rod - Then thin the middle section to 2.5, then flatten the ends so that they are wide enough to have a 2.5mm hole drilled through them, then bend to make the bail!!
Simples !! .......... Not :pok:

That's basically the same way I'm doing it except I started with a 4 mm rod. Rigging the rod up in a drill press to use as a lathe. Right now I have a four millimeter sphere at one end that I intend to flatten once the second is done. It just felt like 4 mm would look a bit small but it's hard to say until I'm closer to finishing it.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on July 12, 2017, 11:55:06 PM
 8) Great minds think alike  :cheers:

Yep I made a 'lathe' too - 'cept I don't have a press - So had to clamp the hand drill then use that

I am pretty sure it was 3.2mm. The thinning took for ever  >:(

I was also worried it would be too thin for the attachment point - but it worked fine

One important tip:
Heat the brass before you flatten it. My first attempt failed, as the brass split on the flattening after several hits - When heated it was fine.

EDIT: Here is how it turned out - I was pretty happy
More to be revealed later !!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Fortytwo on July 13, 2017, 01:54:08 PM
8) Great minds think alike  :cheers:

Yep I made a 'lathe' too - 'cept I don't have a press - So had to clamp the hand drill then use that

I am pretty sure it was 3.2mm. The thinning took for ever  >:(

I was also worried it would be too thin for the attachment point - but it worked fine

One important tip:
Heat the brass before you flatten it. My first attempt failed, as the brass split on the flattening after several hits - When heated it was fine.

EDIT: Here is how it turned out - I was pretty happy
More to be revealed later !!

Hmm, then it seems like our approaches were less similar than I thought, here's how I've been working. I have the second "head" left but I'm getting there. My approach will require another step where I plan on flattening the bulbs against a sander before drilling.

(https://drive.google.com/uc?export=download&id=0ByrViABqmcpCREM3Wi1JSnMzd2s)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 05, 2017, 09:46:51 AM
Elinox 1137U and 1237U from 1960s-early 1970s. Not very common Phillips screwdriver without file. Who knows when they changed the ELINOX  stamp from big to small size?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on August 05, 2017, 10:30:46 AM
I believe it coincides with the change in the other stamp with at 74. 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on August 08, 2017, 05:36:57 PM
 :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pfrsantos on August 08, 2017, 06:03:02 PM
8) Great minds think alike  :cheers:

Yep I made a 'lathe' too - 'cept I don't have a press - So had to clamp the hand drill then use that

I am pretty sure it was 3.2mm. The thinning took for ever  >:(

I was also worried it would be too thin for the attachment point - but it worked fine

One important tip:
Heat the brass before you flatten it. My first attempt failed, as the brass split on the flattening after several hits - When heated it was fine.

EDIT: Here is how it turned out - I was pretty happy
More to be revealed later !!

Hmm, then it seems like our approaches were less similar than I thought, here's how I've been working. I have the second "head" left but I'm getting there. My approach will require another step where I plan on flattening the bulbs against a sander before drilling.

(https://drive.google.com/uc?export=download&id=0ByrViABqmcpCREM3Wi1JSnMzd2s)

Wouldn't it be easier to just cut a piece of brass rod, bend it in half and then bend the two extremities and insert them in the knife?...

 :think: :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Fortytwo on August 08, 2017, 10:20:13 PM
8) Great minds think alike  :cheers:

Yep I made a 'lathe' too - 'cept I don't have a press - So had to clamp the hand drill then use that

I am pretty sure it was 3.2mm. The thinning took for ever  >:(

I was also worried it would be too thin for the attachment point - but it worked fine

One important tip:
Heat the brass before you flatten it. My first attempt failed, as the brass split on the flattening after several hits - When heated it was fine.

EDIT: Here is how it turned out - I was pretty happy
More to be revealed later !!

Hmm, then it seems like our approaches were less similar than I thought, here's how I've been working. I have the second "head" left but I'm getting there. My approach will require another step where I plan on flattening the bulbs against a sander before drilling.

(https://drive.google.com/uc?export=download&id=0ByrViABqmcpCREM3Wi1JSnMzd2s)

Wouldn't it be easier to just cut a piece of brass rod, bend it in half and then bend the two extremities and insert them in the knife?...

 :think: :think:

Like how it is done on the Soldiers with bail? Probably would, but I'm going for the genuine look with the shaped part where the bail is riveted on (see El Corkscrews picture above). I also plan on shaping the handle closer to how the 1890 Model Soldier looks as well as adding brass bolsters and a saber-point small blade from a Delemont edition tool.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on August 09, 2017, 01:55:38 AM
Hi F2

I made a bail for an old British/Indian Army Knife last weekend
I am hoping to post a mod guide on this sometime - I took the photos etc etc

Briefly - The bail pin/rivet diameter for my BAK is the same size as a SAK - 2.5mm
And the bail itself is going to be about 2.5mm - So as you say .....
Challenge: How do I get the pin through the brass of the same thickness ???
My solution: …. was to get some 3.2mm brass rod - Then thin the middle section to 2.5, then flatten the ends so that they are wide enough to have a 2.5mm hole drilled through them, then bend to make the bail!!
Simples !! .......... Not :pok:

Hi guys, I neef a bale for a pocket knife, the U shape that "presses" in to eitjer side, no fancy work except the bending to shape.  Any hints ? Thank you
We now return to VSAKOC. already in progress...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on August 09, 2017, 01:27:18 PM
Wouldn't it be easier to just cut a piece of brass rod, bend it in half and then bend the two extremities and insert them in the knife?...
No not possible - As the pin that holds the bail on is the rivet on which the tools pivot, and holds the knife together  :twak:
..... Unless you have a hollow rivet - a la Wenger Soldier - as 42 mentions !!
And for these old SAKs - that is not authentic  :o

Hi guys, I neef a bale for a pocket knife, the U shape that "presses" in to eitjer side, no fancy work except the bending to shape.  Any hints ? Thank you
We now return to VSAKOC. already in progress...
Some hints above in my and 42's posts ???
I hope to make a full step by step guide on how I did it - But it may take some time
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on August 09, 2017, 05:15:44 PM
Elinox 1137U and 1237U from 1960s-early 1970s. Not very common Phillips screwdriver without file. Who knows when they changed the ELINOX  stamp from big to small size?

Got 2 exactly like that but the Super Tinker is Hoffritz w/ regular cross.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 09, 2017, 05:19:56 PM
Elinox 1137U and 1237U from 1960s-early 1970s. Not very common Phillips screwdriver without file. Who knows when they changed the ELINOX  stamp from big to small size?

Got 2 exactly like that but the Super Tinker is Hoffritz w/ regular cross.
Nice! Do you have pictures?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Fortytwo on August 09, 2017, 05:31:46 PM
Hi F2

I made a bail for an old British/Indian Army Knife last weekend
I am hoping to post a mod guide on this sometime - I took the photos etc etc

Briefly - The bail pin/rivet diameter for my BAK is the same size as a SAK - 2.5mm
And the bail itself is going to be about 2.5mm - So as you say .....
Challenge: How do I get the pin through the brass of the same thickness ???
My solution: …. was to get some 3.2mm brass rod - Then thin the middle section to 2.5, then flatten the ends so that they are wide enough to have a 2.5mm hole drilled through them, then bend to make the bail!!
Simples !! .......... Not :pok:

Hi guys, I neef a bale for a pocket knife, the U shape that "presses" in to eitjer side, no fancy work except the bending to shape.  Any hints ? Thank you
We now return to VSAKOC. already in progress...

If it is for a model with holes in the scales to fit a bail it should work. My best recommendation would be to start with the 90° bends, give them a quarter of an inch or so (5 mm) to have something to hold on to, a vice would be preferred but a hole drilled in a decently hard wood should work too. Bend the curve around some sort of mandrel, if that's unavailable I would try to make a small jig from some wood. Cut to length last.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on August 09, 2017, 05:37:58 PM
Elinox 1137U and 1237U from 1960s-early 1970s. Not very common Phillips screwdriver without file. Who knows when they changed the ELINOX  stamp from big to small size?

Got 2 exactly like that but the Super Tinker is Hoffritz w/ regular cross.
Nice! Do you have pictures?


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Oh Man, I just notice the screwdriver doesn't have a file. Seems to be rare indeed.  I had never seen a bail without the file. :o  I think that must be one of the very last Bails before the transition in 68. Maybe a 69...  But I guess they kept selling rach piece until they ran out, into the early 70s.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on August 09, 2017, 05:47:44 PM
Oh Man, I just notice the screwdriver doesn't have a file. Seems to be rare indeed.  I had never seen a bail without the file. :o  I think that must be one of the very last Bails before the transition in 68. Maybe a 69...  But I guess they kept selling rach piece until they ran out, into the early 70s.

Phillips screwdrivers without files are the norm for Elinox line knives from their inception in 1957 until discontinuation in the mid 1970s. Early Elinox Phillips drivers up until c. 1970 were simply unfinished versions of the Victoria line tools where they skipped the file grinding and polishing step. Some Elinox models from the 1960s can be found with the Victoria Phillips (with file), but these tend to be the exception not the norm (probably < 10%). Around 1970 Victorinox drops the Phillips file from almost all models - both Victoria and Elinox - with the notable exception of the Fisherman. Champions, Craftsmans, Artisans, etc, all get a solid, square, fully polished, file-less Phillips from about 1970-1974, at which point the can-key slot is introduced into the square Phillips. This same time Elinox knives begin to get fully polished tools as well so they get the same Phillips as the Victoria knives. This stays the same until c. 1983 when the round, can-key slotted Phillips is introduced.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on August 09, 2017, 05:51:44 PM
great information! but I thought the round can key phillips showed up closer to 80?? :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on August 09, 2017, 05:54:39 PM
great information! but I thought the round can key phillips showed up closer to 80?? :cheers:

I said 85 originally but should have said c 83. Definitely after 1980 by a couple years.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on August 09, 2017, 05:56:07 PM
I mostly collect Corkscrews and had not really considered the differences between the Elinox and Victoria line that you pointed out.  I had notice more of these differences with the economy lines on the Corkscrews that came later. So thank you  :tu: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 09, 2017, 06:15:53 PM
Oh Man, I just notice the screwdriver doesn't have a file. Seems to be rare indeed.  I had never seen a bail without the file. :o  I think that must be one of the very last Bails before the transition in 68. Maybe a 69...  But I guess they kept selling rach piece until they ran out, into the early 70s.

Phillips screwdrivers without files are the norm for Elinox line knives from their inception in 1957 until discontinuation in the mid 1970s. Early Elinox Phillips drivers up until c. 1970 were simply unfinished versions of the Victoria line tools where they skipped the file grinding and polishing step. Some Elinox models from the 1960s can be found with the Victoria Phillips (with file), but these tend to be the exception not the norm (probably < 10%). Around 1970 Victorinox drops the Phillips file from almost all models - both Victoria and Elinox - with the notable exception of the Fisherman. Champions, Craftsmans, Artisans, etc, all get a solid, square, fully polished, file-less Phillips from about 1970-1974, at which point the can-key slot is introduced into the square Phillips. This same time Elinox knives begin to get fully polished tools as well so they get the same Phillips as the Victoria knives. This stays the same until c. 1983 when the round, can-key slotted Phillips is introduced.
Great! Thank you JAZZBASS. Here is another file-less Phillips on Victoria Champion from early 1970s(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170809/bef567cf2fe7a24f12cf6efdf03cf507.jpg)


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on August 09, 2017, 06:30:44 PM
Oh Man, I just notice the screwdriver doesn't have a file. Seems to be rare indeed.  I had never seen a bail without the file. :o  I think that must be one of the very last Bails before the transition in 68. Maybe a 69...  But I guess they kept selling rach piece until they ran out, into the early 70s.

Phillips screwdrivers without files are the norm for Elinox line knives from their inception in 1957 until discontinuation in the mid 1970s. Early Elinox Phillips drivers up until c. 1970 were simply unfinished versions of the Victoria line tools where they skipped the file grinding and polishing step. Some Elinox models from the 1960s can be found with the Victoria Phillips (with file), but these tend to be the exception not the norm (probably < 10%). Around 1970 Victorinox drops the Phillips file from almost all models - both Victoria and Elinox - with the notable exception of the Fisherman. Champions, Craftsmans, Artisans, etc, all get a solid, square, fully polished, file-less Phillips from about 1970-1974, at which point the can-key slot is introduced into the square Phillips. This same time Elinox knives begin to get fully polished tools as well so they get the same Phillips as the Victoria knives. This stays the same until c. 1983 when the round, can-key slotted Phillips is introduced.
Great! Thank you JAZZBASS. Here is another file-less Phillips on Victoria Champion from early 1970s(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170809/bef567cf2fe7a24f12cf6efdf03cf507.jpg)


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Sweet knife! :like: But wouldn't that be a Craftsman?
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 09, 2017, 06:47:27 PM
Thank you El Corkscrew! This one is c.1972-1973 Champion, very close to 1970s Craftsman but with long nail file.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170809/7dd34058bc122c677938c1c37a5efcce.png)


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on August 09, 2017, 07:21:18 PM
Ah so! I've got a couple champion C's, one NIB.  I really want to find a pre 61 climber and 60's standard with bail and scale tools (does it exist?)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on August 09, 2017, 07:47:30 PM
Thank you El Corkscrew! This one is c.1972-1973 Champion, very close to 1970s Craftsman but with long nail file.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170809/7dd34058bc122c677938c1c37a5efcce.png)


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 :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on August 10, 2017, 03:51:51 AM
Wouldn't it be easier to just cut a piece of brass rod, bend it in half and then bend the two extremities and insert them in the knife?...
No not possible - As the pin that holds the bail on is the rivet on which the tools pivot, and holds the knife together  :twak:
..... Unless you have a hollow rivet - a la Wenger Soldier - as 42 mentions !!
And for these old SAKs - that is not authentic  :o

Hi guys, I neef a bale for a pocket knife, the U shape that "presses" in to eitjer side, no fancy work except the bending to shape.  Any hints ? Thank you
We now return to VSAKOC. already in progress...
Some hints above in my and 42's posts ???
I hope to make a full step by step guide on how I did it - But it may take some time
Thanks, sorry bout the phone typos -
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 10, 2017, 04:03:37 PM
Ah so! I've got a couple champion C's, one NIB.  I really want to find a pre 61 climber and 60's standard with bail and scale tools (does it exist?)
I have no 60s Standard with scale tools but here are some old "Climbers". Mod.235, 235aU, 235kaU and 245kaU  :salute:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170810/9dbc925279c9643db14d448e91fbbdb6.jpg)


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on August 10, 2017, 10:43:53 PM
Ah so! I've got a couple champion C's, one NIB.  I really want to find a pre 61 climber and 60's standard with bail and scale tools (does it exist?)
I have no 60s Standard with scale tools but here are some old "Climbers". Mod.235, 235aU, 235kaU and 245kaU  :salute:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170810/9dbc925279c9643db14d448e91fbbdb6.jpg)


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 :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on August 11, 2017, 12:34:36 AM
Ah so! I've got a couple champion C's, one NIB.  I really want to find a pre 61 climber and 60's standard with bail and scale tools (does it exist?)
I have no 60s Standard with scale tools but here are some old "Climbers". Mod.235, 235aU, 235kaU and 245kaU  :salute:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170810/9dbc925279c9643db14d448e91fbbdb6.jpg)


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Just beautiful  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 11, 2017, 10:09:06 AM

Just beautiful  :like:
:cheers:  :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 11, 2017, 10:12:09 AM

 :like: :tu: :tu:
:cheers: :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on August 26, 2017, 11:47:17 PM
El Hoffritz "Super Tinker" & "Climber"
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Boonies on August 27, 2017, 12:59:23 AM
Oh, oh....another bail addict.  It was bound to happen.   :tu:     :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on August 29, 2017, 10:48:36 PM
Victoria, 84mm, file on driver..   Pre '73?  Or would the file on the driver date it earlier?  :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Fast Bill on August 29, 2017, 11:09:30 PM
El Hoffritz "Super Tinker" & "Climber"

 :like: :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jaya_man on October 05, 2017, 04:44:04 PM
My latest... Model 136aU...(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171005/a3fb008dbabc9d0049ecd38c3fea40a1.jpg)


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on October 05, 2017, 04:47:24 PM
My latest... Model 136aU...(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171005/a3fb008dbabc9d0049ecd38c3fea40a1.jpg)


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 :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jaya_man on October 05, 2017, 04:48:28 PM
My latest... Model 136aU...(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171005/a3fb008dbabc9d0049ecd38c3fea40a1.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 :like:
Thanks M0rkoni :cheers:


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on October 05, 2017, 05:50:23 PM
My latest... Model 136aU...(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171005/a3fb008dbabc9d0049ecd38c3fea40a1.jpg)


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:like:  :tu:  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jaya_man on October 05, 2017, 05:52:47 PM
My latest... Model 136aU...(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171005/a3fb008dbabc9d0049ecd38c3fea40a1.jpg)


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:like:  :tu:  :like:
Thanks FB... :cheers:

How are you? Haven’t seen you in a while?


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on October 05, 2017, 07:58:27 PM
My latest... Model 136aU...(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171005/a3fb008dbabc9d0049ecd38c3fea40a1.jpg)


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Nice condition! :like: :tu: :tu: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Boonies on October 05, 2017, 11:11:36 PM
My latest... Model 136aU...(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171005/a3fb008dbabc9d0049ecd38c3fea40a1.jpg)


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Very, very nice........the woodsaw on those things are "mean"!!   :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jaya_man on October 06, 2017, 07:56:31 AM
My latest... Model 136aU...(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171005/a3fb008dbabc9d0049ecd38c3fea40a1.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Nice condition! :like: :tu: :tu: :cheers:
My latest... Model 136aU...(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171005/a3fb008dbabc9d0049ecd38c3fea40a1.jpg)


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Very, very nice........the woodsaw on those things are "mean"!!   :tu:
Thanks Vicman and Boonies :cheers:


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on October 06, 2017, 12:40:18 PM
Nice knife! Great condition!   Congrats!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jaya_man on October 06, 2017, 01:45:28 PM
Nice knife! Great condition!   Congrats!  :cheers:
Thanks JNOXID :cheers:


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on October 06, 2017, 11:39:53 PM
I want one of those Jaya!!!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Pile Driver on October 24, 2017, 06:24:31 PM
I just got this knife from an older gentleman on Craigslist this past weekend, was fun!

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on October 24, 2017, 06:29:05 PM
I just got this knife from an older gentleman on Craigslist this past weekend, was fun!

(https://preview.ibb.co/kr4vY6/huntsman.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ckxFY6)

Very nice. Mid 1950s, probably 54-55.

(p.s. use the "Embed codes" at the bottom of your image host side to get the picture to show up. The BBCode is the one you want.)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Pile Driver on October 24, 2017, 06:35:37 PM
Thank you jazzbass, I've always loved your contributions. I haven't been by here in a while, tons of inspiring knives I will have to contribute more often.

Some knife content for the post:

A Wenger Tahara contracted for Neiman Marcus, I've never seen another like it before. All Stainless Steel I believe nickel silver liners and shims/stops.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on October 24, 2017, 07:26:52 PM
I just got this knife from an older gentleman on Craigslist this past weekend, was fun!

Nice one Pile Driver!   :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on October 24, 2017, 07:27:27 PM
Nice Wenger Tahara too!   :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: T14 on October 24, 2017, 07:38:07 PM
All these heirloom treasures are lovely!  :drool:

I have only two contenders for being vintage enough. Both of the 1960-1973 Elinox variety.
If I am not mistaken the model numbers are 2232r & 2070r. Please excuse my subpar photography.
-Tom
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on October 24, 2017, 07:50:49 PM
I just got this knife from an older gentleman on Craigslist this past weekend, was fun!
:drool: :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on October 24, 2017, 07:51:21 PM
All these heirloom treasures are lovely!  :drool:

I have only two contenders for being vintage enough. Both of the 1960-1973 Elinox variety.
If I am not mistaken the model numbers are 2232r & 2070r. Please excuse my subpar photography.
-Tom
:like: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on October 24, 2017, 09:08:58 PM
Beautiful knife Pile Driver!  If anyone has a Spartan that vintage that is looking for a great home pm me as I'm lusting after one  :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on October 24, 2017, 11:23:06 PM
Some knife content for the post:
A Wenger Tahara contracted for Neiman Marcus, I've never seen another like it before. All Stainless Steel I believe nickel silver liners and shims/stops.

Nice one PD - Not seen one like that before either
- The 'Huntsman' above is also very very nice
Loved your old 'Super Tinker' too JayaMan

Thanks all
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jaya_man on October 25, 2017, 05:23:23 AM
Thanks Huntsman :cheers:

Nice find Danny... :drool:

Love those red alox T14 :drool:


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Pile Driver on November 03, 2017, 02:52:37 PM
Anyone seen a knife like this before? Pictured with a 58mm. Old crossbow stamp and INOXYD on the reverse.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on November 03, 2017, 02:56:21 PM
Passenger?  My son has a similar knife but he's not here for me to look at it.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on November 03, 2017, 07:10:51 PM
Anyone seen a knife like this before? Pictured with a 58mm. Old crossbow stamp and INOXYD on the reverse.

Holy moly!  That thing is awesome!!!  Judging by the tang stamp it's from the '20s!  (1923-1930)

Just 2 blades?  Early version of Pocketpal or student?  I'm guessing horn scales... 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Pile Driver on November 04, 2017, 12:35:49 AM
Yes horn scales nickel silver rivets and liners. Its too small for a pocket pal no? 58mm with it for reference.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on November 04, 2017, 01:01:48 AM
Yes horn scales nickel silver rivets and liners. Its too small for a pocket pal no? 58mm with it for reference.


Maybe jazzbass knows... Maybe just had a number at one point?  There was an early 58mm with just blade/file called the pocket pal, btw. At any rate beautiful (antique) knife! :tu:  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jaya_man on November 04, 2017, 01:11:26 AM
Could it be one of those 75mm ones or peasant knives?

http://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Victorinox+Plier+Multitools+-+Swiss+Card+-+Others


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on November 04, 2017, 07:27:03 AM
Anyone seen a knife like this before? Pictured with a 58mm. Old crossbow stamp and INOXYD on the reverse.

There was no name for that knife, just a number. Its a No 610. You can see that knife on page 31 of the 1942 catalog on sakwiki.
It should be 61 mm, not 58.
There was also a 610 ring version. Both very rare. Usually horn or mop scales.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Pile Driver on November 05, 2017, 12:54:23 PM
Anyone seen a knife like this before? Pictured with a 58mm. Old crossbow stamp and INOXYD on the reverse.

Thanks very cool. I'm sure this one predates that catalog though based on the stamps?

There was no name for that knife, just a number. Its a No 610. You can see that knife on page 31 of the 1942 catalog on sakwiki.
It should be 61 mm, not 58.
There was also a 610 ring version. Both very rare. Usually horn or mop scales.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on November 05, 2017, 04:50:50 PM
Right?    Those stamps are AWESOME!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on November 23, 2017, 05:29:59 AM
Had this wierd camo one gota be at least 70?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on November 24, 2017, 04:34:58 AM
Wow, is it definitely a vic?  The camo scales didn't start until the 80s from my recollection, but it's looking pre 61 :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on November 24, 2017, 08:04:41 AM
No, thats no vic, no wenger, no swiss made. Its french. Propably Pradel.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on November 24, 2017, 04:57:29 PM
Yeah, the cross and corkscrew... Theyre not looking right either.

Really cool, interesting knife tho
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on November 24, 2017, 05:12:52 PM
Anyone seen a knife like this before? Pictured with a 58mm. Old crossbow stamp and INOXYD on the reverse.

Holy moly!  That thing is awesome!!!  Judging by the tang stamp it's from the '20s!  (1923-1930)

Just 2 blades?  Early version of Pocketpal or student?  I'm guessing horn scales...
I know of one like that for sale but with the long nail file on the back.
That one is from the 40's so this one might be too...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on November 24, 2017, 09:43:39 PM
Yeah, the cross and corkscrew... Theyre not looking right either.

Really cool, interesting knife tho
And the answer is. ...Pradel
Thanks gang for all the help and interest.
 :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: T14 on November 24, 2017, 11:14:55 PM
I "might" be able to persuade an older gentleman to part with his elinox pruner blade picknicker.
5 turn fluted corkscrew, metal camping inlay, sharpened bottle opener, holeless awl.  :ahhh :ahhh :ahhh

The serrations are almost worn away, but the knife has a story to tell, and has lots of character.
Wish me luck!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on December 30, 2017, 03:46:09 AM
I have a few questions about a new-to-me 58mm SAK that is inbound.
1) Any idea of year range that this was produced?  Or will the tang stamp help me there?
2) Any idea of why it is wrapped in cellophane?  I haven't seen that before, perhaps the former owner had a plastic wrap machine used for preserving knives?  :think:
3) Does it look authentic?  For some reason the rivets seem big, but maybe it's just the angle of the photo.

Any thoughts appreciated.
Thank you.

(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4691/38662421824_ed92019c2d.jpg)

Other side:
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4594/25510907388_a8a21864bf.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on December 30, 2017, 08:47:27 AM
I know this knife. It has to be authentic.

1: Its a classic, patented in 1952. The rivets disappeared in 1957. So in that time range it should be produced.

2: Thats not an original wrapping/packing method. No idea why its wrapped like this.

3: Yes, authentic.

A very beautiful and rar knife. I don`t know why but in the last weeks appeared many of exact this knife (Southern Railway System) on the net.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on December 30, 2017, 02:07:20 PM
I have a few questions about a new-to-me 58mm SAK that is inbound.
Nice one FB    :like:

Thanks for the info Ulli

Never seen an exposed rivet 58mm before  :tu:

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on December 30, 2017, 02:25:50 PM
Thank you ulli and Huntsman.  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on December 30, 2017, 03:02:01 PM
I'd add that one to my collection if I got the chance!
Beautifull piece and in new condition as far as the picture goes.
Awesome! :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on December 30, 2017, 03:11:59 PM
I'd add that one to my collection if I got the chance!
Beautifull piece and in new condition as far as the picture goes.
Awesome! :tu:
Thank you Mechanickal.  I do hope the condition is as good as it seems it might be.  Postal service says delivery is Jan 8th.  :cry: Long wait.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on December 30, 2017, 03:33:49 PM
Given that most 58mm's live a hard life dangling from a keychain, plus the date range it was made, this knife is in incredibly great shape!  My brother in law is a huge railroad buff and would love to have one of these! 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on December 30, 2017, 03:40:38 PM
ftp://
Given that most 58mm's live a hard life dangling from a keychain, plus the date range it was made, this knife is in incredibly great shape!  My brother in law is a huge railroad buff and would love to have one of these!
I was shocked at the condition too, which is why I kind of overpaid for it.  But, I thought it would go nicely with my other railroad SAK.
(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/500/32387572602_c6f0281d57.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on December 30, 2017, 04:04:19 PM
 :drool: :drool: :drool:  I don't know how you find these gems Lisa!!!    :like: :like: :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on December 30, 2017, 04:05:29 PM
:drool: :drool: :drool:  I don't know how you find these gems Lisa!!!    :like: :like: :like:
Good question!

Most be some sort of high-tech radar...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on December 30, 2017, 04:29:05 PM
:drool: :drool: :drool:  I don't know how you find these gems Lisa!!!    :like: :like: :like:
Good question!

Most be some sort of high-tech radar...
Thank you Barry and Mechanickal, you are too kind.
Here's hoping that 2018 is the year of the 4 exposed rivets find (on a 91mm), that would be awesome!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on December 30, 2017, 06:17:57 PM
I would love to see that myself Lisa :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on December 30, 2017, 06:34:15 PM
ftp://
Given that most 58mm's live a hard life dangling from a keychain, plus the date range it was made, this knife is in incredibly great shape!  My brother in law is a huge railroad buff and would love to have one of these!
I was shocked at the condition too, which is why I kind of overpaid for it.  But, I thought it would go nicely with my other railroad SAK.
(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/500/32387572602_c6f0281d57.jpg)
That is a nice looking knife FB!  :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on December 30, 2017, 06:38:23 PM
I would love to see that myself Lisa :like:
Thank you Barry!  :tu:

That is a nice looking knife FB!  :like: :tu: :tu:
Thanks Vicman!  Looks like I'm back to buying again.  :D :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 09, 2018, 12:08:34 AM
I have a 1962 Soldier inbound and it is arriving in a sheath, see picture.
Do you think the sheath is an after-market item, or???  :think:
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4595/27798603309_0c747a9ce3.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 16, 2018, 10:18:18 PM
Question, is this 2 layer SAK a Spartan or a Standard?  Sorry for the poor photo, I'm having some technical difficulties at this moment.
(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/851/41504177121_f94b5f2011.jpg)

This listing:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Victorinox-Elinox-Spartan-Swiss-Army-Knife-/123067842149?_trksid=p2047675.l2557&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&nma=true&si=%252BIHSqJq8vHsjdQYlequEu5pBgQc%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: LeaF on April 16, 2018, 10:34:48 PM


Question, is this 2 layer SAK a Spartan or a Standard?

In my opinion, it's not a Spartan neither Standart. Spartan it's a relatively modern name for this knife, when it was produced, it has only numeric index, but no own name.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 16, 2018, 10:39:06 PM


Question, is this 2 layer SAK a Spartan or a Standard?

In my opinion, it's not a Spartan neither Standart. Spartan it's a relatively modern name for this knife, when it was produced, it has only numeric index, but no own name.

Thank you LeaF, I guess I'll put it in my spreadsheet as a 234.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: LeaF on April 16, 2018, 10:47:11 PM


Question, is this 2 layer SAK a Spartan or a Standard?

In my opinion, it's not a Spartan neither Standart. Spartan it's a relatively modern name for this knife, when it was produced, it has only numeric index, but no own name.

Thank you LeaF, I guess I'll put it in my spreadsheet as a 234.
Just curious, how many rows in your spreadsmurf..
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 16, 2018, 10:48:06 PM


Question, is this 2 layer SAK a Spartan or a Standard?

In my opinion, it's not a Spartan neither Standart. Spartan it's a relatively modern name for this knife, when it was produced, it has only numeric index, but no own name.

Thank you LeaF, I guess I'll put it in my spreadsheet as a 234.
Just curious, how many rows in your spreadsmurf..

A lot of rows.  :P  :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on April 16, 2018, 11:17:42 PM
Agreed LeaFy

This model is late 50s -->  New can opener / old awl

Names only came in in the mid 70s

If it was later it would be a Standard   -->  No kr, tp or tw
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on April 17, 2018, 12:28:05 AM
Thank you LeaF, I guess I'll put it in my spreadsheet as a 234.
, how many rows in your spreadsmurf..
A lot of rows.  :P  :D

Probably a lot fewer than yours Mr. L !!  :o

PS. BTW  - Just curious - What is a spreadsmurf.  ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on April 17, 2018, 03:00:56 AM
I guess I'll put it in my spreadsheet as a 234.

Model numbers of Elinox knives are actually a little different than those of corresponding regular line knives: If this knife is 91mm, it's a 1234. If it's 84mm, it's a 1234k.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 17, 2018, 03:05:18 AM
I guess I'll put it in my spreadsheet as a 234.

Model numbers of Elinox knives are actually a little different than those of corresponding regular line knives: If this knife is 91mm, it's a 1234. If it's 84mm, it's a 1234k.
Thank you, I didn't know that about the Elinox line.  I believe it to be 91mm.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 19, 2018, 11:24:28 PM
Turns out it's an 84mm:  :tu:
(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/919/40856228574_3d43c42ee8.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on April 20, 2018, 12:06:36 AM
Smurf yeah!  Nice score!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on April 20, 2018, 12:12:02 AM
Turns out it's an 84mm:  :tu:
(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/919/40856228574_3d43c42ee8.jpg)

Nice Sak FB! :like: :tu: :tu:

84mm SAKs are cool! :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Borg on April 20, 2018, 12:24:41 AM
+1 Nice one FB  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 20, 2018, 12:43:57 AM
Thanks all!  This was a rare purchase where the SAK turned out to be much nicer than the photos.  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on April 20, 2018, 02:08:28 AM
Nice!!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jaya_man on April 20, 2018, 02:43:49 AM
Nice score Lisa :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 20, 2018, 03:15:54 AM
Thank you Barry and jaya_man.  Every now and again something catches my eye (and I overpay), and this time I am very pleased with my purchase.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on April 20, 2018, 03:20:22 AM
Thank you Barry and jaya_man.  Every now and again something catches my eye (and I overpay), and this time I am very pleased with my purchase.
:cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 20, 2018, 02:46:04 PM
Thank you Barry and jaya_man.  Every now and again something catches my eye (and I overpay), and this time I am very pleased with my purchase.
:cheers:
:hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on June 27, 2018, 05:41:58 PM
Just to move this topic rolling a little bit with this one...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on June 27, 2018, 05:56:46 PM
Just to move this topic rolling a little bit with this one...
:like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pfrsantos on June 27, 2018, 06:29:29 PM
Just to move this topic rolling a little bit with this one...

Nice roll!

 :drool: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on June 27, 2018, 06:32:06 PM
Just to move this topic rolling a little bit with this one...

Nice SAK M0rkoni! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on June 27, 2018, 06:42:29 PM
 :gimme: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on June 27, 2018, 10:16:26 PM
Oh my!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Boonies on June 27, 2018, 11:03:12 PM
What?  No box or instructions...... :rofl:

Very, very nice....... :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Aloha on June 28, 2018, 03:12:38 AM
Just to move this topic rolling a little bit with this one...

 :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on June 28, 2018, 04:35:24 AM
Just to move this topic rolling a little bit with this one...
Name my friend? Im kinda new... :salute:
Spartan, no...did they use names for this year....interesting one...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on June 28, 2018, 07:10:42 AM
Thanks guys ...  :hatsoff:

In my opinion this topic deserves to be a live as much as it can be and I know for sure that you have great vintage ones as well, so let's see them...   :tu:

Just to move this topic rolling a little bit with this one...
Name my friend? Im kinda new... :salute:
Spartan, no...did they use names for this year....interesting one...

You're correct, no names for this year... N° 235kaU aka Climber small (someone rather prefer to call it like this). 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on July 26, 2018, 03:19:38 AM
Nothing like finding out my possibly 80 year old Spartan was actually a Pradel,  that's French. Still cool, but not like the vintage  SAK I thought I carried 60+ years ago...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: gustophersmob on July 26, 2018, 03:35:15 AM
I didn't realize this club existed. I'm pretty sure this pioneer qualifies. The Elinox stamp and the +PAT can opener most likely date it to the 60's.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on July 26, 2018, 08:01:35 AM
I didn't realize this club existed. I'm pretty sure this pioneer qualifies. The Elinox stamp and the +PAT can opener most likely date it to the 60's.

Sure it qualifies, nice one  :tu: ...just shame for the bail.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on July 26, 2018, 08:33:32 AM
Didn't know this thread either!

But count me in!
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180726/7f1ac27794d220e794355005e8f6eace.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180726/e4f4baffb8eaaa59d7f5d9a92f3ae996.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: glenfiddich1983 on July 26, 2018, 10:48:57 AM
This one is probably the oldest I have:

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/nyk49oeay7evm55/Wenger%2054%201.jpg?raw=1)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on July 26, 2018, 01:48:18 PM
Anything on a 1953?  Site with vintage SAKs still there but not up and running...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on July 26, 2018, 05:03:43 PM
Only got a 1950 one after this one.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on July 27, 2018, 02:32:04 PM
Red & Blue Fisherman
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on July 27, 2018, 02:33:41 PM
Red & Blue Fisherman
Great set! Congrats!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: glenfiddich1983 on July 27, 2018, 02:37:33 PM
Red & Blue Fisherman

Awesome! And very expensive nowadays  :D :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on July 27, 2018, 02:39:01 PM
Red & Blue Fisherman
Great set! Congrats!

Thanks but you should have the same set, right?  :pok:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on July 27, 2018, 02:46:55 PM
Red & Blue Fisherman
Great set! Congrats!

Thanks but you should have the same set, right?  :pok:
Almost the same 😉 :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on July 28, 2018, 02:50:02 AM
Red & Blue Fisherman

 :salute:    :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on July 30, 2018, 12:21:03 PM
I thought I might be in with a chance to join the club with this one ... four days before closing....

Now it belongs in the Crazy thread .......   :o

But what a beaut !!!  And for its age - Perfect condition.

Anyone of you lot bought it?   ???  Would be the centrepiece of the collection for sure !!
And must be one of the very first 'Champions'  - Which I guess is why it went for so much

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Victorinox-Switzerland-Stainless-Officer-Knife-11-Blade-/332729185575?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&nma=true&si=1kx7yAyyZjFZrqfpvHcxV030kZQ%253D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on July 31, 2018, 01:24:12 AM
I thought I might be in with a chance to join the club with this one ... four days before closing....

Now it belongs in the Crazy thread .......   :o

But what a beaut !!!  And for its age - Perfect condition.

Anyone of you lot bought it?   ???  Would be the centrepiece of the collection for sure !!
And must be one of the very first 'Champions'  - Which I guess is why it went for so much

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Victorinox-Switzerland-Stainless-Officer-Knife-11-Blade-/332729185575?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&nma=true&si=1kx7yAyyZjFZrqfpvHcxV030kZQ%253D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557
[/quote
Which year?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on July 31, 2018, 04:52:21 AM
Are you asking how old it is?  / Year of manufacture?
I’d say 53-57
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on July 31, 2018, 12:50:09 PM
Are you asking how old it is?  / Year of manufacture?
I’d say 53-57
Yes thanks,  looking fo a 53 but that's quite the collector's price!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jaya_man on August 08, 2018, 05:11:54 PM
My latest acquisition, an Old Soldat...(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180808/c0b50bf10cee564c697e688cb26dbc5d.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: glenfiddich1983 on August 08, 2018, 08:12:56 PM
Nice!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on August 09, 2018, 07:31:03 AM
My latest acquisition, an Old Soldat...(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180808/c0b50bf10cee564c697e688cb26dbc5d.jpg)

 :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jaya_man on August 09, 2018, 10:33:40 AM
:hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jaya_man on August 09, 2018, 12:46:02 PM
Nice!
Thanks... :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jaya_man on September 25, 2018, 02:19:20 PM
Here’s a recent addition... Model 235U(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180925/fff77997200f001a3f5c59153c8280ab.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on September 25, 2018, 03:22:41 PM
Here’s a recent addition... Model 235U(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180925/fff77997200f001a3f5c59153c8280ab.jpg)
:tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on September 25, 2018, 04:01:42 PM
I might have a heads up to add tomorrow.  :whistle:
 :popcorn:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on September 25, 2018, 08:03:08 PM
El Officers Knife
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: twiliter on September 25, 2018, 09:07:07 PM
Nice bail SAKs, Jaya and El C!  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on September 25, 2018, 09:21:32 PM
Requested by Jaya:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180925/6b603d7fece7ed1f543929c433d285c7.jpg)

136ka
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jaya_man on September 26, 2018, 01:45:09 AM
Niiiice :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on September 26, 2018, 09:38:42 AM
Requested by Jaya:
136ka

With replacement scissor spring I reckon - Right ??
Clip-point small blade disappeared in 73ish - Double spring appeared in 75ish - So must be replacement

PS.  :like:
To all of you recent picture posters !!   :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on September 26, 2018, 10:45:51 AM
Requested by Jaya:
136ka

With replacement scissor spring I reckon - Right ??
Clip-point small blade disappeared in 73ish - Double spring appeared in 75ish - So must be replacement

PS.  :like:
To all of you recent picture posters !!   :tu:
I'm guessing the same.
Bought it this way.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on October 13, 2018, 09:20:54 PM
Craftsman, Champion, Elinox Camper, Standard
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on October 13, 2018, 09:36:09 PM
Pins and bails....what’s not to like!  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on October 13, 2018, 11:50:42 PM
Very very nice El CS - Love the bails and rivets

I am guessing some scale polishing has happened here
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on October 14, 2018, 12:55:11 AM
Very very nice El CS - Love the bails and rivets

I am guessig some scale polishing has happened here
Thanks Ralph, :-) amazingly, no, I was lucky enough to find these awl in very good condition. I have the original box for the Elinox camper.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on October 14, 2018, 01:22:09 AM
Craftsman, Champion, Elinox Camper, Standard
O M G El C!
:tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on October 14, 2018, 01:30:05 AM
Craftsman, Champion, Elinox Camper, Standard
O M G El C!
:tu:
lol!  Thanks, Tony!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on November 05, 2018, 04:47:11 AM
Champion A & B
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Boonies on November 05, 2018, 06:09:21 AM
Yummm........favorites.     :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: glenfiddich1983 on November 05, 2018, 11:11:59 AM
Champion A & B

 :gimme: :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on November 05, 2018, 12:41:44 PM
Champion A & B

Nice duo El C! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on November 05, 2018, 12:57:26 PM
Champion A & B
Love the long nail files... :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Boonies on November 07, 2018, 09:50:56 PM
Early Golpher........no combo tool, just the clip point pen blade.  Double leg spring but it is black oxided so guessing somewhere around ‘73.      :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on November 07, 2018, 11:11:01 PM
Early Golpher........no combo tool, just the clip point pen blade.  Double leg spring but it is black oxided so guessing somewhere around ‘73.      :cheers:
I never would have thought that one to be an early golfer...if I understand your spelling. Either way...nice knife!  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Boonies on November 07, 2018, 11:54:16 PM
 :rofl:  Thinking about the gopher that’s been digging tunnels around my horse corrals, guess he just slipped in here. 🤪

That knife must be a cross between a golfer and a gopher....new model.  😜
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on November 08, 2018, 03:23:48 AM
:rofl:  Thinking about the gopher that’s been digging tunnels around my horse corrals, guess he just slipped in here. 🤪

That knife must be a cross between a golfer and a gopher....new model.  😜
:rofl: :rofl: good one
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: marko14 on November 10, 2018, 09:40:14 AM
Just got this from my dad,need some help is this Woodsman or old Huntsman there is no tweezers and toothpick i looked at SAK Wiki but no luck?(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181110/2c500f118ff8151b5a52b2dd6542d002.jpg)

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on November 10, 2018, 09:43:24 AM
Looks like an Economy Huntsman.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: marko14 on November 10, 2018, 10:12:35 AM
Looks like an Economy Huntsman.
Thank you.

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: armi101 on November 10, 2018, 05:06:27 PM
In the field.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on November 11, 2018, 02:14:00 PM
Looks like an Economy Huntsman.
Thank you.

I thought to no T&T made it a Woodsman - Or is it too recent to be one of those - Definitely Economy with the worn our hot stamped shield logo
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: marko14 on November 11, 2018, 02:21:25 PM
Looks like an Economy Huntsman.
Thank you.

I thought to no T&T made it a Woodsman - Or is it too recent to be one of those - Definitely Economy with the worn our hot stamped shield logo
I also thought that,thank you,cheers.

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: glenfiddich1983 on November 11, 2018, 03:09:33 PM
In the field.

:hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on November 11, 2018, 04:08:10 PM
Looks like an Economy Huntsman.
Thank you.

I thought to no T&T made it a Woodsman - Or is it too recent to be one of those - Definitely Economy with the worn our hot stamped shield logo

That's entirely possible :)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on November 11, 2018, 09:36:55 PM
Looks like an Economy Huntsman.
Thank you.

I thought to no T&T made it a Woodsman - Or is it too recent to be one of those - Definitely Economy with the worn our hot stamped shield logo

That's entirely possible :)

Like some other model names, the name "Woodsman" was used over time to refer to different models. Quoting what JAZZBASS wrote in another thread: (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,63053.msg1180606.html#msg1180606)

"* In the early versions of Victorinox names, the Huntsman was the standard four layer knife (blades/openers/saw/scissors) with a LNF, the Woodsman was the same model without LNF. After the phase out of the LNF on the majority of 91mm models in the early 1970s, the Huntsman becomes the standard 4 layer model with T&T, the Woodsman is the model without T&T. This distinction doesn't last long and my the early 1980s Woodsman = Explorer with saw, Huntsman = standard 4 layer model regardless of T&T/keyring."

Indeed, evidence for the use of the "Woodsman" name to refer to a Huntsman without scale tools can be found in catalogs from the late 1970's and early 1980's (such as this one (http://sakwiki.com/tiki-browse_gallery.php?galleryId=57) and this one (http://sakwiki.com/tiki-browse_gallery.php?galleryId=56)), but since the SAK in question seems to be post-1985, calling it a "Woodsman" is probably inappropriate (as this name was likely already used for a different SAK (http://sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Woodsman+91mm) when it was made). While some people seem to still use the name "Woodsman" to refer to any Huntsman without scale tools (I personally prefer the name "Huntsman NT" for such a SAK), I think that it's probably better to avoid this and reserve the name "Woodsman" (in the context of 91mm SAKs) for the SAK of the Woodsmans Owners Club (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,59897) (note that things are already quite confusing due to the use of the "Woodsman" name to also refer to a totally different 93mm Alox SAK (http://sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Woodsman)).

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on November 12, 2018, 05:09:37 AM
Great find MC - JB is just the best (better than SAKWiki!!)

To quote Hiraethus from another thread:
"Don't you just love Victorinox's naming conventions" - Or words to that effect   :think:

So for this one I think we can definitely conclude that it is a Huntsman - It has the large V in VSSR - So is post 85 - So Economy version Huntsman (w/o t&t !)

Also not sure it belongs in this thread either  :D   :pok:
For me vintage means at least bail  - preferably exposed rivets !!
But I guess we can treat it as a thread hijack !!   ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: marko14 on November 12, 2018, 09:45:42 AM
Thank you MC,cheers

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on November 15, 2018, 09:39:36 PM
The knife I had purchased a while back was a mystery about the cellophane.
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4691/38662421824_ed92019c2d.jpg)

Other side:
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4594/25510907388_a8a21864bf.jpg)

Update:
I bought the knife seen below today.  It solves the cellophane mystery for me.  Apparently they either came packaged that way for the railroad, or when the railroad received them, they special boxed them.
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4917/44080872030_89f458d198.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on November 15, 2018, 10:26:16 PM
That’s a nice find for sure.  :like: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: glenfiddich1983 on November 15, 2018, 10:28:13 PM
The knife I had purchased a while back was a mystery about the cellophane.
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4691/38662421824_ed92019c2d.jpg)

Other side:
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4594/25510907388_a8a21864bf.jpg)

Update:
I bought the knife seen below today.  It solves the cellophane mystery for me.  Apparently they either came packaged that way for the railroad, or when the railroad received them, they special boxed them.
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4917/44080872030_89f458d198.jpg)

:like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on November 15, 2018, 10:30:13 PM
The knife I had purchased a while back was a mystery about the cellophane.


Other side:


Update:
I bought the knife seen below today.  It solves the cellophane mystery for me.  Apparently they either came packaged that way for the railroad, or when the railroad received them, they special boxed them.


Those are both cool SAKs FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Borg on November 16, 2018, 12:00:00 AM
 :iagree: Very nice
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Aloha on November 16, 2018, 12:05:10 AM
You are finding some real gems.    :like: 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on November 16, 2018, 12:43:51 AM
Thank you all for the kind words.  I was perplexed by the cellophane for a while.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on November 28, 2018, 04:20:42 PM
My 2 old Officers knives.

Left: 1902 with scissors.
Right: 1930-1936 Spartan.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181128/48c2c91be329d4abda7328a34fa98109.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on November 28, 2018, 04:21:49 PM
My 2 old Officers knives.

Left: 1902 with scissors.
Right: 1930-1936 Spartan.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181128/48c2c91be329d4abda7328a34fa98109.jpg)
Wow!   :o :like:   :drool:  :tu:  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on November 28, 2018, 04:24:29 PM
1943 Gourmet
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181128/8a772e9d47d9e2cc0c79869244e4043c.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on November 28, 2018, 04:24:52 PM
My 2 old Officers knives.

Left: 1902 with scissors.
Right: 1930-1936 Spartan.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181128/48c2c91be329d4abda7328a34fa98109.jpg)
Wow!   :o :like:   :drool:  :tu:  :cheers:
Thanks! :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on November 28, 2018, 04:31:59 PM
1943 Gourmet
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181128/8a772e9d47d9e2cc0c79869244e4043c.jpg)
Model 248 to be precise...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Aloha on November 28, 2018, 04:41:46 PM
 :dd:  Nice ones Mechanickal
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on November 28, 2018, 04:44:40 PM
Thank you! :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on November 28, 2018, 05:09:18 PM
My 2 old Officers knives.

Left: 1902 with scissors.
Right: 1930-1936 Spartan.

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181128/48c2c91be329d4abda7328a34fa98109.jpg)
Wow...very nice!  :like:  :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on November 28, 2018, 05:10:21 PM
1943 Gourmet
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181128/8a772e9d47d9e2cc0c79869244e4043c.jpg)
Not bad...not bad at all!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on November 28, 2018, 06:56:47 PM
My 2 old Officers knives.

Left: 1902 with scissors.
Right: 1930-1936 Spartan.



Nice Officers knives Mechanickal! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on November 28, 2018, 06:57:32 PM
1943 Gourmet


Cool Gourmet Mechanickel! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on November 28, 2018, 06:57:54 PM
Thanks!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on December 30, 2018, 09:28:48 PM
1952ish Fisherman/Angler
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on December 30, 2018, 09:32:59 PM
That very nice looking Fisherman!  :like: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Aloha on December 30, 2018, 10:07:35 PM
1952ish Fisherman/Angler

The polish on these older tools is pretty great.  I often wonder why they aren't as polished these days  :think: 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on December 30, 2018, 10:15:25 PM
Time = $$$$
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on December 30, 2018, 10:16:34 PM
1952ish Fisherman/Angler

Very nice El C! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on December 30, 2018, 11:06:12 PM
Agreed!
beautifull knife.

A SAK with bail is still missing from my collection.

And given the PayPal embargo, will possibly take quite some years before I get the chance to...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on December 31, 2018, 02:17:37 AM
1952ish Fisherman/Angler
Very nice El C  :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on December 31, 2018, 04:33:23 AM
 :hatsoff:  was lucky to find it
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on December 31, 2018, 07:19:12 AM
@ Meccy - How can you have those two amazing old Officer's knives? - Yet not have a bail SAK ? - Gotta get one !!   :think:
@ El CS - Lovely SAK - Jealous   ::)
@ All - Probably said this before - But this is my favourite thread - and these are my favourite SAKS   :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on December 31, 2018, 09:02:18 AM
I know, right?

Sadly I can no longer buy online or international untill I figured out a workaround...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on December 31, 2018, 10:12:51 PM
Mine,= shield inlay, bale, Spartan tools. Probably close to 100?
Its a Pradel, French, bummer...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 01, 2019, 12:11:24 AM
I bought this one recently, a 40p:
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4866/44153276530_ce6b3fd163.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on January 01, 2019, 04:12:03 PM
I bought this one recently, a 40p:


Great find FB! :like: :tu: :tu:

Nice pic! :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on January 01, 2019, 04:28:41 PM
Very nice  :like: :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on January 19, 2019, 03:33:18 AM
old wenger
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on January 19, 2019, 03:35:56 AM
old wenger
I could live with one of those!  :like: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on January 19, 2019, 07:22:40 AM
old wenger
:like:
Year?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on January 19, 2019, 08:14:31 AM
old wenger
I could live with one of those!  :like: :tu:
thanks buddy
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on January 19, 2019, 08:15:54 AM
old wenger
:like:
Year?
No year sign, probably in the 1950s.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on January 19, 2019, 01:09:42 PM
old wenger

Very nice Wenger xfile! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 03, 2019, 04:22:26 PM
I can't tell if this is an 84mm or 91mm. 
What do you think?
If I had to guess I would think 84mm, but then that's because I'd like it to be an 84mm.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7913/40001547883_6dde1a0e5d.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on February 03, 2019, 05:26:46 PM
I'm guessing 91mm.
Because I've never seen that type of can opener in 84mm. But that doesn't mean anything :)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 03, 2019, 05:29:51 PM
I'm guessing 91mm.
Because I've never seen that type of can opener in 84mm. But that doesn't mean anything :)
I was looking at this SakWiki page and trying to compare the two. 
https://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Victorinox+Huntsman+84mm
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on February 03, 2019, 06:46:38 PM
I'm guessing 91mm.
Because I've never seen that type of can opener in 84mm. But that doesn't mean anything :)
I was looking at this SakWiki page and trying to compare the two. 
https://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Victorinox+Huntsman+84mm

Thanks for the link (I fixed a typo ;) )
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on February 03, 2019, 09:25:44 PM
I can't tell if this is an 84mm or 91mm. 
What do you think?
If I had to guess I would think 84mm, but then that's because I'd like it to be an 84mm.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7913/40001547883_6dde1a0e5d.jpg)
:like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on February 03, 2019, 10:15:28 PM
I'm guessing 91mm.
Because I've never seen that type of can opener in 84mm. But that doesn't mean anything :)

Hmmm ... The picture in the Wiki page? ???  ;)
Or is that a 91 masquerading as a 84?  ???

Someone here posted and easy way to check 84 vs 91 from an ebay piccie

But I did not bookmark the post :twak: - Something to do with the positioning of the shield relative to the corkscrew pivot point I think
You may want to dig - If anyone finds it or posts - We coudl put the info in the Wiki !! :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 03, 2019, 10:17:25 PM
Someone here posted and easy way to check 84 vs 91 from an ebay piccie
Correct, it has something to do with a pinky finger distance between the two I think.  :think: 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on February 03, 2019, 10:19:04 PM
I'm guessing 91mm.
Because I've never seen that type of can opener in 84mm. But that doesn't mean anything :)

Hmmm ... The picture in the Wiki page? ???  ;)
Or is that a 91 masquerading as a 84?  ???


Well I guess I was mistaken :)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on February 03, 2019, 10:22:12 PM
Since this is a pre-1951 knife, it uses the old style dimensions so the typical ways of distinguishing 84mm and 91mm don't apply. The only things you can try to use are the size of the Victorinox logo on the scales (which is super tough) or use the saw, if there is one. 84mm knives from this era will have a 25T saw and 91mm will have a 27T saw. This looks like it has a 27T saw, but its hard to tell with the poor image quality/part of the saw hidden.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 03, 2019, 10:27:37 PM
Since this is a pre-1951 knife, it uses the old style dimensions so the typical ways of distinguishing 84mm and 91mm don't apply. The only things you can try to use are the size of the Victorinox logo on the scales (which is super tough) or use the saw, if there is one. 84mm knives from this era will have a 25T saw and 91mm will have a 27T saw. This looks like it has a 27T saw, but its hard to tell with the poor image quality/part of the saw hidden.
Thank you JB for your input.  I should have the knife in hand later this week to know for sure.  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on February 04, 2019, 06:24:06 AM
It's good to see you again jazzbass :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on February 04, 2019, 01:34:41 PM
It's good to see you again jazzbass :salute:
:iagree:   :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Boonies on February 07, 2019, 08:09:28 PM
I can't tell if this is an 84mm or 91mm. 
What do you think?
If I had to guess I would think 84mm, but then that's because I'd like it to be an 84mm.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7913/40001547883_6dde1a0e5d.jpg)

Probably no help at all except to occupy your time while waiting for the postman..... :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 08, 2019, 12:08:59 AM
I can't tell if this is an 84mm or 91mm. 
What do you think?
If I had to guess I would think 84mm, but then that's because I'd like it to be an 84mm.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7913/40001547883_6dde1a0e5d.jpg)

Probably no help at all except to occupy your time while waiting for the postman..... :cheers:
Those are beauties Boonies!  :like:

Mine is 91mm, but I couldn't be happier.  It's as if it was never used at all.  I tucked the flap on the case to show the writing on the sheath.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7812/40056511783_a5bc4d70e6.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on February 08, 2019, 12:27:39 AM
Mine is 91mm, but I couldn't be happier.  It's as if it was never used at all.  I tucked the flap on the case to show the writing on the sheath.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7812/40056511783_a5bc4d70e6.jpg)

That's a great find. Those late 40s knives show up now and then in unused condition (spent their life at the bottom of a shoebox in a closet I imagine) and when you get one, you understand the quality and craftsmanship that went into them. They are solid. The snap is amazing. The fit and finish almost perfect and the blades are polished to a mirror shine. Modern SAKs are still well made, but ones from this era are simply on another level.

It's good to see you again jazzbass :salute:

:iagree:   :tu:
:salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on February 08, 2019, 02:12:54 AM
Mine is 91mm, but I couldn't be happier.  It's as if it was never used at all.  I tucked the flap on the case to show the writing on the sheath.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7812/40056511783_a5bc4d70e6.jpg)

That's a great find. Those late 40s knives show up now and then in unused condition (spent their life at the bottom of a shoebox in a closet I imagine) and when you get one, you understand the quality and craftsmanship that went into them. They are solid. The snap is amazing. The fit and finish almost perfect and the blades are polished to a mirror shine. Modern SAKs are still well made, but ones from this era are simply on another level.

It's good to see you again jazzbass :salute:

:iagree:   :tu:
:salute:
:iagree:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on February 08, 2019, 05:31:47 AM
I can't tell if this is an 84mm or 91mm. 
What do you think?
If I had to guess I would think 84mm, but then that's because I'd like it to be an 84mm.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7913/40001547883_6dde1a0e5d.jpg)

Probably no help at all except to occupy your time while waiting for the postman..... :cheers:
Those are beauties Boonies!  :like:

Mine is 91mm, but I couldn't be happier.  It's as if it was never used at all.  I tucked the flap on the case to show the writing on the sheath.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7812/40056511783_a5bc4d70e6.jpg)
That beauty and a case! You did very well!  :cheers: :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on February 08, 2019, 07:19:03 AM
Mine is 91mm, but I couldn't be happier.  It's as if it was never used at all.  I tucked the flap on the case to show the writing on the sheath.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7812/40056511783_a5bc4d70e6.jpg)

Wow FB - That SAK is amazing - As JB said its been stuck in a drawer for 70 years
- Although how that can happen I am not sure - as it must span a couple of human lifetimes!!

I also checked the suppliers photo in your post above .... and it so does not do the SAK justice - That's a real score.

Boonies - Nice pic and very nice set - I love all the oldies - But the 84mm oldies are even more exciting !
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on February 09, 2019, 12:01:52 AM
I can't tell if this is an 84mm or 91mm. 
What do you think?
If I had to guess I would think 84mm, but then that's because I'd like it to be an 84mm.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7913/40001547883_6dde1a0e5d.jpg)

Probably no help at all except to occupy your time while waiting for the postman..... :cheers:
Those are beauties Boonies!  :like:

Mine is 91mm, but I couldn't be happier.  It's as if it was never used at all.  I tucked the flap on the case to show the writing on the sheath.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7812/40056511783_a5bc4d70e6.jpg)
:hatsoff: and the sheath looks in good shape too!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Myron on February 09, 2019, 03:11:17 PM

Those are beauties Boonies!  :like:

Mine is 91mm, but I couldn't be happier.  It's as if it was never used at all.  I tucked the flap on the case to show the writing on the sheath.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7812/40056511783_a5bc4d70e6.jpg)

Lisa,

What a fantastic SAK!  Be super careful and don't let the inside of the snap rivet on the leather case damage the scale of the knife. 

Congratulations!

Myron
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on February 09, 2019, 03:27:51 PM


Mine is 91mm, but I couldn't be happier.  It's as if it was never used at all.  I tucked the flap on the case to show the writing on the sheath.


Very nice find FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Archibald Tuttle on February 10, 2019, 03:05:29 PM
I can't tell if this is an 84mm or 91mm. 
What do you think?
If I had to guess I would think 84mm, but then that's because I'd like it to be an 84mm.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7913/40001547883_6dde1a0e5d.jpg)

 :like: :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 10, 2019, 03:16:22 PM
Thank you all for the kind words. 
I do believe this is the 91mm mate to the 84mm version I bought last year.  :tu:

Good point about being careful with the snap, Myron, thank you.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 01, 2019, 04:47:04 PM
Bumping one of my favorite threads  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 01, 2019, 04:50:31 PM
Bumping one of my favorite threads  :tu:
Nice, what is that one you have there?  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 01, 2019, 04:58:36 PM
Thank you Lisa...
I really like natural material for the scales such as buffalo horn, stag, MoP etc. along with at least Victoria tang stamps and older one off course. It's a simple Spartan but it's a superb quality and it looks very nice as well.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on March 01, 2019, 05:00:54 PM
Bumping one of my favorite threads  :tu:

Wait, I just saw that one on FB a minute ago. Very cool.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Aloha on March 01, 2019, 05:03:31 PM
I need to come around this way more often  :drool:. 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on March 01, 2019, 05:03:46 PM
It's a simple Spartan but it's a superb quality and it looks very nice as well.
:iagree:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 01, 2019, 05:10:35 PM
Wait, I just saw that one on FB a minute ago. Very cool.

 :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on March 01, 2019, 06:20:57 PM
Bumping one of my favorite threads  :tu:

Cool SAK MOrkoni! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on March 01, 2019, 06:22:59 PM
Cool SAK MOrkoni! :like: :tu: :tu:

Thanks buddy!  :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on March 01, 2019, 06:26:13 PM
:tu:

What you wrote originally cannot be unseen :P
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on March 01, 2019, 10:16:32 PM
Bumping one of my favorite threads  :tu:
Oh boy, that is a nice one!  :like: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on March 02, 2019, 12:31:56 AM
Bumping one of my favorite threads  :tu:
That is a beauty!   :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 01, 2019, 04:07:12 AM
Bumping this thread back up with what I think is a Champion "a" version:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7810/33634452928_ce02db3e0e.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on April 01, 2019, 04:13:31 AM
Very nice Lisa!! :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on April 01, 2019, 06:13:10 AM
Looks like a nice  246fmaU from the late 50s :tu: FB
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on April 01, 2019, 07:55:41 AM
Nice Champion Lisa! Congrats!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on April 01, 2019, 08:23:32 AM
Bumping this thread back up with what I think is a Champion "a" version:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7810/33634452928_ce02db3e0e.jpg)
:like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on April 01, 2019, 12:32:55 PM
Bumping this thread back up with what I think is a Champion "a" version:


Great find FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on April 01, 2019, 01:54:31 PM
Very nice Lisa!! :drool:
:tu:  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on April 01, 2019, 02:59:05 PM
What's not to like about this SAK FB
and the best
And a narrow date range: Old awl, but hidden rivets - which as a few here know is a contradiction to Victorinox's tool evolution dates !!
See second link in the first post in this thread (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,51872.msg881641.html#msg881641)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 01, 2019, 03:49:26 PM
Thank you all for the kind words.
I actually thought there were exposed rivets on it, even though they're clearly hidden.  :facepalm:  I still love it though.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 01, 2019, 04:25:02 PM
What's not to like about this SAK FB
  • Bail
  • Clip-point blade
  • Long nail file
  • PAT mark on CO
  • Sharpened ws edge on SD
  • Old style scissors
  • Old style file
  • Old style saw (teeth count?)
and the best
  • Old style awl

And a narrow date range: Old awl, but hidden rivets - which as a few here know is a contraduction to Victorinox's tool evolution dates !!
See second link in the first post in this thread (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,51872.msg881641.html#msg881641)
That was a good read Huntsman, thank you for pointing out the link.  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Aloha on April 01, 2019, 05:36:15 PM
Great find.  I really like the finish on those older tools.   
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on April 02, 2019, 06:05:55 AM
Bumping this thread back up with what I think is a Champion "a" version:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7810/33634452928_ce02db3e0e.jpg)

 :like: Nice find, FB!  I have a same/similar one, but several parts are broken/chipped and front scale is melted. It has 29 angled teeth on the wood saw and a 1.5mm thick nickel silver bird head spacer. Looking forward to pics when you get it.

(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7839/32577219447_413474b4ef.jpg)

(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7848/32577219297_23c45fb73d.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 02, 2019, 06:11:34 AM
Thank you Aloha!
kamakiri, I will post photos when it arrives, possibly Wednesday.  I'll count the saw teeth as well.  :tu:
What is a "nickel silver bird head spacer"  :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on April 02, 2019, 06:47:26 AM
That's the spacer next to the small blade. Looks like a bird head when disassembled. I picked up the term while lurking here...maybe only some of the modders use it?  Some from this era are aluminum. Not sure if those are anodized.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on April 02, 2019, 07:05:34 AM
Forgot these:
Cheekily added into my earlier post !!

Every tool has changed - some significantly - from current versions

And a couple of things to check:
- Nickel sliver or aluminium tipped tweezers
- Tang stamps - eg Is it a Victoria?

As you may have gathered - I love the old SAKs
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 02, 2019, 05:15:15 PM
- Tang stamps - eg Is it a Victoria?
As you may have gathered - I love the old SAKs
Victoria from the seller's photo:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7867/33645951548_ff75e624a6.jpg)[/url]

That's the spacer next to the small blade. Looks like a bird head when disassembled. I picked up the term while lurking here...maybe only some of the modders use it?  Some from this era are aluminum. Not sure if those are anodized.
Oh, I didn't now that.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 03, 2019, 11:52:00 PM
- Nickel sliver or aluminium tipped tweezers
Happy to report it has nickel silver tipped tweezers, hard to capture in the photo.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7841/47479058422_2ed7a04e1b.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on April 04, 2019, 12:18:03 AM
Happy to report it has nickel silver tipped tweezers, hard to capture in the photo.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7841/47479058422_2ed7a04e1b.jpg)

Nice! That's what I was expecting should be there, but this knife is from the transition range between the two.  Looks pretty clean in that shot...

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on April 04, 2019, 02:27:33 AM
Very nice!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 04, 2019, 04:30:55 AM
Thank you kamakiri and Barry.  I forgot to mention it has 29 wood saw teeth.  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on April 04, 2019, 08:45:48 AM
The best Champion I have ;)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190404/f3bebb6a1837a284a981af3fb20945df.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on April 04, 2019, 11:47:27 AM
Happy to report it has nickel silver tipped tweezers, hard to capture in the photo.


Very nice FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on April 04, 2019, 11:48:25 AM
The best Champion I have ;)

Nice Champion jnoxyd! :like: :tu: :tu:

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 04, 2019, 03:53:00 PM
The best Champion I have ;)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190404/f3bebb6a1837a284a981af3fb20945df.jpg)
Nice one!  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on April 04, 2019, 08:04:06 PM
The best Champion I have ;)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190404/f3bebb6a1837a284a981af3fb20945df.jpg)

 :like: Fantastic! Definitely on my list!

I have a 235U:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7853/47484189082_7836d88c56_n.jpg)

Hoffritz on the back!
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7909/47484189252_e5d2c08c0a_n.jpg)

One of the liners (Scissor) is strangely thin and aluminum ~0.52mm

A later +PAT Camper 234U has the Hoffritz/HSS front and VO crossbow on the back.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on April 05, 2019, 10:01:28 PM
:like: Fantastic! Definitely on my list!

I have a 235U:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7853/47484189082_7836d88c56_n.jpg)

Hoffritz on the back!
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7909/47484189252_e5d2c08c0a_n.jpg)

One of the liners (Scissor) is strangely thin and aluminum ~0.52mm

A later +PAT Camper 234U has the Hoffritz/HSS front and VO crossbow on the back.
Nice vintage Hoffritz  :tu:
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on April 07, 2019, 11:42:21 AM
Two interesting Champions made for Hoffritz :
Champion from 1957-1958 with hidden rivets (since 1957) and pre1957 old tools and stamps:
-39 teeth wood saw,
- square nail nick on LNF,
- aluminum small blade spacer,
- round section shape bail,
- VO CB stamp (1952-1957)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190407/27300acae5dca75d3254e03afdbf9b30.jpg)
Champion from early 1980s. It has only Hoffritz name on it, no Victorinox name in blade stamp!(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190407/0fc65136ce587b8e132b0d6e75db5ce1.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: glenfiddich1983 on April 07, 2019, 12:02:03 PM
 :hatsoff:  :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 07, 2019, 02:10:58 PM
Two interesting Champions made for Hoffritz :
Champion from 1957-1958 with hidden rivets (since 1957) and pre1957 old tools and stamps:
-39 teeth wood saw,
- square nail nick on LNF,
- aluminum small blade spacer,
- round section shape bail,
- VO CB stamp (1952-1957)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190407/27300acae5dca75d3254e03afdbf9b30.jpg)
Champion from early 1980s. It has only Hoffritz name on it, no Victorinox name in blade stamp!(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190407/0fc65136ce587b8e132b0d6e75db5ce1.jpg)
Wow!  Two beauties there jnoxyd!  I have one in route to me like your bottom knife (only Hoffritz stamp), except mine is a Camper model.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on April 07, 2019, 04:06:32 PM
Two interesting Champions made for Hoffritz :
Champion from 1957-1958 with hidden rivets (since 1957) and pre1957 old tools and stamps:
-39 teeth wood saw,
- square nail nick on LNF,
- aluminum small blade spacer,
- round section shape bail,

Champion from early 1980s. It has only Hoffritz name on it, no Victorinox name in blade stamp!

Nice pics jnoxyd! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ReamerPunch on April 07, 2019, 04:25:00 PM
:dd:
Thanks for sharing, those are absolutely stunning. :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on April 07, 2019, 06:39:08 PM
Two interesting Champions made for Hoffritz :
Champion from 1957-1958 with hidden rivets (since 1957) and pre1957 old tools and stamps:
-39 teeth wood saw,
- square nail nick on LNF,
- aluminum small blade spacer,
- round section shape bail,
- VO CB stamp (1952-1957)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190407/27300acae5dca75d3254e03afdbf9b30.jpg)
Champion from early 1980s. It has only Hoffritz name on it, no Victorinox name in blade stamp!(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190407/0fc65136ce587b8e132b0d6e75db5ce1.jpg)

 :like: Top one gets my vote for 'Best Champion' in your collection!  ;) I don't have anything that nice from that date range.

I have one just like the bottom one. It's actually late '70's. I have one exactly like it. The Hoffritz/SSR blades bridge into the '80s, but are Hot Stamped on the scale by then. The Awl will tell all. The configuration makes it late seventies, but the late-V1 Hoff inlay and the plastic tweezer tip put it in the c.'78-79 range. Scissor screw confirms - makes it firmly '77 or later.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on April 07, 2019, 07:12:30 PM
With the c.'77 version on top:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7822/40591265493_6239b18993_n.jpg)

Looking at mine again it looks closer to '79 and jnoxyd's might be more '78.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7878/40591265313_9b07604932_n.jpg)

Devil is in the detail.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on April 07, 2019, 08:10:23 PM
With the c.'77 version on top:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7822/40591265493_6239b18993_n.jpg)

Looking at mine again it looks closer to '79 and jnoxyd's might be more '78.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7878/40591265313_9b07604932_n.jpg)

Devil is in the detail.
Yes, I should say scissors has large screw and awl has pre 83 tip  shape ;) I date it as 1980-1983 only due to steel Victorinox inlay emblem. They changed nickel silver emblem inlay to steel one around 1980, at least I don't know another version. Do you?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on April 07, 2019, 09:01:35 PM
Yes, I should say scissors has large screw and awl has pre 83 tip  shape ;) I date it as 1980-1983 only due to steel Victorinox inlay emblem. They changed nickel silver emblem inlay to steel one around 1980, at least I don't know another version. Do you?

There's a lot of misunderstanding about the stainless steel inlay use in the '70s. 

The awl tip is '77 to '79. Maybe late '76 to early '80. If you measure the angle of the grind, it will be ~70º.  Past '80, it would not have a ground tip, and would definitely have a hot stamp Hoffritz scale. '76 and earlier, the tip would be a different angle and other different details. Hoff tang stamps run to about '82 or so. There's a lot of those to prove the overlap in that date range as well as the c. '80 and post '80 awl styles.

Both Nickel Silver and Stainless inlays were used from '73 to '80.  c. 1980 is only the end of Nickel Silver use.  There is solid proof of stainless use with main line knives. The best proof are the combination with black double scissor springs from the '73 to '75 range, confirmed with the blank rear tangs ('73, '75, and '77 only). Far too many out there to ignore, and I have several examples from various lines/models. See the camping date thread for some of what I have on inlays and I put some of the awl info in my intro thread.

Perhaps the most compelling proof I have are knives with the exact same construction...main line with nickel silver scale inlays and SS Hoffritz inlays and tang stamp. Or maybe the mid- '70s Outdoorsman and Picnickers with nickel silver inlays that correspond to the Ranger and Camper counterparts with SS inlays.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on April 07, 2019, 09:13:49 PM
Yes, I should say scissors has large screw and awl has pre 83 tip  shape ;) I date it as 1980-1983 only due to steel Victorinox inlay emblem. They changed nickel silver emblem inlay to steel one around 1980, at least I don't know another version. Do you?

I forgot...There's also the Wood Saw tip...yours has the pre- c. '79 version.  ;)
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on April 07, 2019, 10:32:18 PM
Thanks for the answer, Kamakiri! So 1980 is not first year for stainless shield? All 1970s knives I have with double black scissors spring, blank blade stamp etc. have nickel silver inlay but I trust you. So my Hoffritz Champion is from late 1970s.
BTW do you know Hoffritz's name for Champion? They called it Super Knife (picture from 1979 Hoffritz catalog. Yes, they used old picture with clip point blade ) (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190407/57b229a5aec137640509be0b96b00a7c.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on April 08, 2019, 12:19:21 AM
Thanks for the answer, Kamakiri! So 1980 is not first year for stainless shield? All 1970s knives I have with double black scissors spring, blank blade stamp etc. have nickel silver inlay but I trust you. So my Hoffritz Champion is from late 1970s.
BTW do you know Hoffritz's name for Champion? They called it Super Knife (picture from 1979 Hoffritz catalog. Yes, they used old picture with clip point blade ) (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190407/57b229a5aec137640509be0b96b00a7c.jpg)

Wow. Excellent pic and info! Thanks, jnoxyd!  :cheers: And thanks for your trust on the matter.  :)  As the new guy here, I really appreciate it.  :hatsoff:
I'm not really surprised by the clip point in their catalog...I have examples with odd, old parts.

And no, 1980 isn't the first of SS inlays. I don't think I'm the first to say it either. I remember a post from jazzbass about a c. '75 Elinox Outdoorsman that has an SS Elinox shield. (I have one of those too - I'll dig up that thread and add to it).  That post was probably the first that got me doubting the published and convention regarding the '80 change date. My own collection of Rangers, Hoffritz, Fisherman and Camper inlays supports the earlier change, as well as other construction details that I've observed and documented. I also have several of the nickel silver ones from the '70s, Elinox shields from the early '70s through to c. '79 in other models like Explorers, Passenger, Champions etc. so I've done a lot of side-by-side comparisons to verify.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on April 08, 2019, 02:59:51 AM
Amazing detail, information and pics lads - I am just thinking how we get this into the Wiki and/or my dating spreadsheet ?   ???   :o

Nice Hoffritz catalogue - I always liked Hoffiritzs and have three or four including what I always thought was a SwissChamp - So should I be calling it a Super Knife?  Or was that only the Champion?

So here's a question and observation - The catalogue calls the blade a spear-point blade - Which I think is wrong - and BTW is a common mistake -  SAKWiki also often calls this blade a spear-point
I believe a spear-point blade has sharpened edges on both sides of the point ?  Think of ..... errrm ..... a spear  :think:   :whistle:

I believer the classic Swiss Army Knife blade has a drop-point blade - As the smooth unsharpened top of  the blade drops down to the point

What say you?  ???
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on April 08, 2019, 07:00:27 AM
Amazing detail, information and pics lads - I am just thinking how we get this into the Wiki and/or my dating spreadsheet ?   ???   :o

 :dunno: I thought that was up to you!  ;)

The hard part is that so much of the info is also model and line dependent. For example these are in chronological order L-R:

(https://live.staticflickr.com/7916/47508340542_378d922ac8.jpg)

SS Fish c. '75 black spring thin liner clearly a c. '75 SS shield (to me)
SS Auto c. '76 gray spring thin liner
NS Auto Special c. '77/78 thin liner
NS Fish c.'78/79 gray spring thick liner

And we know that much earlier 'brass fish' were used in the '60s, so those have gone back and forth in evolution so to speak...and twice since both Autos and Fish go back to stainless after '80.

Gets even weirder when I insert some Hoffritz in chronological order:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7863/46837457974_89005d433a.jpg)

The Hoff Fish in the middle is c. '78 but has no Fish inlay
The next Hoff Fish c. '79 has the V2 SS Fish and a late V1 Hoff inlay.
Last is an '80 Hoff Camper with the V2 Hoff inlay with the '80 awl (and of course the post-c.'79 wood saw).


Nice Hoffritz catalogue - I always liked Hoffiritzs and have three or four including what I always thought was a SwissChamp - So should I be calling it a Super Knife?  Or was that only the Champion?
We need to find a Hoffritz catalog after '86 to find out! I have some of those Champs but no idea if they got a newer name. Worst part is I think I've seen that page before...before I cared about this subject!  :facepalm:


So here's a question and observation - The catalogue calls the blade a spear-point blade - Which I think is wrong - and BTW is a common mistake -  SAKWiki also often calls this blade a spear-point
I believe a spear-point blade has sharpened edges on both sides of the point ?  Think of ..... errrm ..... a spear  :think:   :whistle:

I believer the classic Swiss Army Knife blade has a drop-point blade - As the smooth unsharpened top of  the blade drops down to the point

What say you?  ???
I think you're right, but some of the older knives did have machined bevels on the top side/spine in the curved area toward the tip. Never to a sharp edge, but still very visible.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on April 08, 2019, 07:05:19 AM
And how about something more fun in the mean time?  :D

Show content
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7870/47508340712_7a89cc492b_n.jpg)

Show content
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7875/47508340432_a64e1d339a_n.jpg)

Show content
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7822/47508341062_a8f6921f5b_n.jpg)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/7828/47508340632_fa1028bfbd_n.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on April 08, 2019, 07:45:18 AM
 :like: :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on April 08, 2019, 05:41:19 PM
And how about something more fun in the mean time?  :D

Show content
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7870/47508340712_7a89cc492b_n.jpg)

Show content
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7875/47508340432_a64e1d339a_n.jpg)

Show content
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7822/47508341062_a8f6921f5b_n.jpg)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/7828/47508340632_fa1028bfbd_n.jpg)
:like: :gimme:  I'd settle for just the box.  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on April 08, 2019, 05:50:34 PM
:like: :gimme:  I'd settle for just the box.  :tu:

HA! But it's *not* up to FB standards...missing the label/box end flap. Oh, and all that TAPE holding it together!
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on April 09, 2019, 10:45:33 AM
One more Champion today.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190409/96dd828739d0c94fd792ca5c13e5ba5e.jpg) I believe it is one of the first mod.1973 with mag glass and Phillips line. It still has 2.7mm main blade with Victoria Officier crossbow stamp and clip point small blade.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190409/ec56cfc14e491ee12d5a7aa101285573.jpg)
Here's mod.1973 in early 1970s catalog and booklet. There's +Pat stamp on can opener, just curious why?
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190409/cb44886de18cb4b551b4c569970d8018.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190409/b22fa78e9c19babf4d0893111c79d1b0.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: glenfiddich1983 on April 09, 2019, 11:58:44 AM
 :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on April 09, 2019, 04:21:11 PM
Me too!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on April 10, 2019, 01:44:44 AM
Here's mod.1973 in early 1970s catalog and booklet. There's +Pat stamp on can opener, just curious why?

As in you mean 'Why does a catalogue from 1973 have a picture of a CO with a PAT stamp when the PAT stamp was withdrawn in 1971?"

I think I know the answer - Sometimes Victorinox were lazy about updating their pictures    :o   

Take a look at the second tool guide in the Identifiers section of this Champion page (https://sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Champion#Identifiers)
This is for the 1985 revision of the Champion which introduced the chisel and the new version of the backspring screwdriver.

However the image in the guide is of the previous Champion version (see the other tool guide on that page) with the old SD and no chisel - even though the chisel is written in the text - and they put a 25 on the diagram where the chisel would be! ie They just re-used on old image.

There is even a more recent example - No excuse with new digital capability!!
Check out the XAVT from the 2017 (current) Vic catalogue in the image below
The model described is the new revision of the XAVT with the Wenger wrench - See the tool list - But if you look at the piccie - It's the old one with 2 x mag glass !!

Fascinating !!    ::)

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on April 10, 2019, 03:41:51 AM
One more Champion today.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190409/96dd828739d0c94fd792ca5c13e5ba5e.jpg) I believe it is one of the first mod.1973 with mag glass and Phillips line. It still has 2.7mm main blade with Victoria Officier crossbow stamp and clip point small blade.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190409/ec56cfc14e491ee12d5a7aa101285573.jpg)
Here's mod.1973 in early 1970s catalog and booklet. There's +Pat stamp on can opener, just curious why?
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190409/cb44886de18cb4b551b4c569970d8018.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190409/b22fa78e9c19babf4d0893111c79d1b0.jpg)

Excellent!  It certainly is early '73. *Maybe* even late '72 production.  I have a c. '72 Master Craftsman w/ smooth phillips and no can key... and your scissors (esp. machining) look more like those than my later blank rear tang late-'73 Champion. You should side-by-side review it against your c. '73 Outdoorsman and see all the construction similarities...and the minor differences.

My belief is that the red 35 model catalog was published for c. '73 release. Not later than say '75. The pictured prototypes could have been made with +PAT parts from c. late '71 or even '72.  Not that I'd know, but I'm certain catalogs weren't produced very quickly back then. Ditto for all the magnifier models and misc. prototyping happening c. '73.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Herman on April 10, 2019, 10:15:31 PM
Here's the real McCoy  8)  Nice to see it in a catalog!
Actually, I've always loved this knife, because it's the only colored Small Huntsman I have (and I do have several...). Does anyone know what brand or company that is? I have no idea...   
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on April 10, 2019, 11:03:09 PM
Have you tried searching on the internet for Dolder?  ??? :pok:  (maybe images)
If you do - You will find it. 
Not the hotel in Zurich  - It's in Basel
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on April 11, 2019, 01:39:34 AM
Here's the real McCoy  8)  Nice to see it in a catalog!
Actually, I've always loved this knife, because it's the only colored Small Huntsman I have (and I do have several...). Does anyone know what brand or company that is? I have no idea...
I dont see a saw buddy, so did ya mean Climber (Spartan w/scizzors )?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on April 11, 2019, 06:50:31 AM
Here's the real McCoy  8)  Nice to see it in a catalog!
Actually, I've always loved this knife, because it's the only colored Small Huntsman I have (and I do have several...). Does anyone know what brand or company that is? I have no idea...
Very nice knife Herman! It is really rare for it's color/size/age.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Herman on April 12, 2019, 11:24:53 AM
"Have you tried searching on the internet for Dolder?  ??? :pok:  (maybe images)"  -> Oh, ok it's an 'L' in the middle, pfff... 
Don't think they've won an award with their logo... :facepalm:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on May 12, 2019, 10:34:25 PM
I have a, I think, Climber with a metal file, maybe Mountineer?
Only awl and small straight driver under corkscrew as back tools.
Screw scizzors, metal TW tip, lines on the corkscrew.
Wiki was close... was a Swiss Jewel Co. giveaway.....
Thanks for the help!   :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on May 13, 2019, 02:08:19 AM
I'm curious, what defines vintage to y'awl when it comes to Swiss Army Knives??
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: gustophersmob on May 13, 2019, 02:52:51 AM
I'm curious, what defines vintage to y'awl when it comes to Swiss Army Knives??

In M0rkoni’s 1st post in the thread, he gave these guidelines:

“let's say, from the beginning around 1890 till ca. 1970., all sizes old timers and both brand (Victorinox & Wenger) in one place, are most welcome.”

Though I doubt anyone would be too strict if you’re outside that  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on May 13, 2019, 03:06:22 AM
I have a, I think, Climber with a metal file, maybe Mountineer?
Only awl and small straight driver under corkscrew as back tools.
Screw scizzors, metal TW tip, lines on the corkscrew.
Wiki was close... was a Swiss Jewel Co. giveaway.....
Thanks for the help!   :think:
my dad had this one, prior to the 70's I'm sure..
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on May 13, 2019, 04:07:12 AM
I have a, I think, Climber with a metal file, maybe Mountineer?
Only awl and small straight driver under corkscrew as back tools.
Screw scizzors, metal TW tip, lines on the corkscrew.
Wiki was close... was a Swiss Jewel Co. giveaway.....
Thanks for the help!   :think:

Tony - What is your question here please?  :think:   
Are you asking what model you have? or what age is your model? or what?  - It is not clear !

For sure it is not a Climber if it has a file, if it is Spartan plus scissors and file - It is a Mountaineer
If it has the back-spring screwdriver, by my definition - It is not vintage! See below .... as the back SD came in in 1977
....... And also not a Mountaineer - As I don't think that model had one

For Model queries see here:
https://sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Victorinox+91mm
For dating queries see here:
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,51872.msg1629826.html#msg1629826

Could be a custom model for the Swiss Jewel Company - If so please describe all tools layers etc -  and we could put in in the Wiki as variation
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on May 13, 2019, 04:10:54 AM
I'm curious, what defines vintage to y'awl when it comes to Swiss Army Knives??
For me anything with a bail or earlier - Nothing later - As that is basically what we have today - So cannot be vintage !
Although I would be tempted to say it has to have exposed rivets and/or old awl or earlier

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on May 13, 2019, 04:29:18 AM
Thanks, sirs gustophersmob & Ralph! Since this thread began five years ago, do you think the definition should extend to 1975 now?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on May 13, 2019, 04:43:43 AM
See below .... as the back SD came in in 1977

Disagree there. The back SD shows up c. '73.

jnoxyd's c. '72/'73 Champion below is a good example.  As well as several black scissor spring knives I have. Anything with the nail cleaner tip on the metal saw (aside from the exceptions like Outdoorsman and Hoff LE2, etc.).

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190409/96dd828739d0c94fd792ca5c13e5ba5e.jpg)

One more Champion today.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190409/96dd828739d0c94fd792ca5c13e5ba5e.jpg) I believe it is one of the first mod.1973 with mag glass and Phillips line. It still has 2.7mm main blade with Victoria Officier crossbow stamp and clip point small blade.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190409/ec56cfc14e491ee12d5a7aa101285573.jpg)
Here's mod.1973 in early 1970s catalog and booklet. There's +Pat stamp on can opener, just curious why?
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190409/cb44886de18cb4b551b4c569970d8018.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190409/b22fa78e9c19babf4d0893111c79d1b0.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on May 13, 2019, 04:53:23 AM
Ah OK - Thanks K

My date came from the SAAM's blog (http://victorinox.metodi.me/91mmtools.php#finescrew)
So it looks like SAAM's is wrong - It has been wrong on lots of other items !!! :-[

The piccie of the file certainly has a nail cleaner tip which it says came in in 75 - Or was that 73 too!!   :think:

Are you sure about 73 - ie Same time as mag glass and inline phillips .........  Would make sense ie for the new seven layer Champion

If so I can change in my spready and that date is also in the wiki in a couple of places !!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on May 13, 2019, 05:20:39 AM
Ah OK - Thanks K

My date came from the SAAM's blog (http://victorinox.metodi.me/91mmtools.php#finescrew)
So it looks like SAAM's is wrong - It has been wrong on lots of other items !!! :-[

The piccie of the file certainly has a nail cleaner tip which it says came in in 75 - Or was that 73 too!!   :think:

Are you sure about 73 - ie Same time as mag glass and inline phillips .........  Would make sense ie for the new seven layer Champion

If so I can change in my spready and that date is also in the wiki in a couple of places !!

It's just what *I* think!  :D

The SAAM's blog was a good place to start, but if you check it against almost any post by jazzbass regarding the matter...you can quickly see the inconsistencies. I wasn't kidding when I said I read every post of his back into the 2015 range. It confirms and refines a lot of the dates I've found on my own the hard way. 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on May 13, 2019, 07:51:08 AM
My date came from the SAAM's blog (http://victorinox.metodi.me/91mmtools.php#finescrew)
So it looks like SAAM's is wrong - It has been wrong on lots of other items !!! :-[
The situation with the (wrong) 1977 date for the backside fine screwdriver is actually more complicated, because the source of this isn't just SAAM's (http://victorinox.metodi.me/91mmtools.php#finescrew), but the "official Victorinox chronology" (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=75774.0;attach=356509) (as it appears in the document Everything you need to know about Multi-tools and cutlery (https://www.nyttigbras.dk/nblibrary/victorinox-everything-you-need-to-know-about-multi-tools-and-cutlery.pdf) and also in both the second edition and the third edition of the book by Derek Jackson (https://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Book+List#A_Collector_s_Companion)). However, as Kamakiri correctly pointed out and JAZZBASS previously explained in detail (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,45676.msg1180789.html#msg1180789), we very clearly see this fine screwdriver appearing along with the magnifying glass just before the end of the Victoria era. Hence, 1973 is probably the best year one can assign to it.
Quote
The piccie of the file certainly has a nail cleaner tip which it says came in in 75 - Or was that 73 too!!   :think:
Yes, 1973 is probably the best year to assign to this change of the file tip as well.
Quote
If so I can change in my spready
If you are going to change your "spready" you may want to also look at the 40 posts that accumulated in the relevant thread (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,51872.0.html) after you posted the last version and contain many suggested corrections.  :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on May 13, 2019, 08:17:53 AM
......
Yes, 1973 is probably the best year to assign to this change of the file tip as well.If you are going to change your "speedy" you may want to also look at the 40 posts that accumulated in the relevant thread (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,51872.0.html) after you posted the last version and contain many suggested corrections.  :D

As the third last of those 40 or so posts says .......
.......
Give me a while to process it -
I think a couple of principles (that are already listed in the sheet) will stand:
- The table is mainly for 91mm
- Dates are always estimates !!
To those I might add - That I will concentrate on visible/external changes - Eg: Some of the spring changes are very subtle!!
 
Having said that I will get it as accurate as possible - and also try to get as much into the chart as I can

So, surprise, surprise - We will have a version X  !!    ......And probably beyond !
..............

All those 40 posts with their amazing level of detail and information and other stuff that has accumulated in the last year - is why it has not happened yet!!
(and SAKWiki and real life too of course)

Backspring sd 1977 --> 1973 is easy !!

PS. It's a 'spready' - ie spreadsheet - Not a 'speedy'
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on May 13, 2019, 10:57:03 AM
Ah OK - Thanks K

My date came from the SAAM's blog (http://victorinox.metodi.me/91mmtools.php#finescrew)
So it looks like SAAM's is wrong - It has been wrong on lots of other items !!! :-[
C'mon friends, SAAM created its wonderful site 10+ years ago, this site was one of the best at that time and yes, it used the existing dating at that time. I really like it so far. I recently asked him about corrections in some dates, but apparently he is busy with other things now. Anyway, thanks to him for his work.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on May 13, 2019, 11:26:09 AM
Aha We finally find someone who knows Mr Saam - Brilliant I always assumed he had a secret identity!! 😳
I assume from the site that it is connected with vsakcs - right?

Hey no-one is saying it’s not a great site and we don’t appreciate it - it is and we do - for many of us it was the starting point of our SAK collecting and dating journey
I refer to it in my dating spreadsheet thread and  have pointed many people to the site - and I usually use the same adjective as you to describe it ie wonderful
But if it is wrong on some dates and we all collectively agree on that ...... What is wrong with calling that out?   ???
As you say time has moved on and we know more. And also as we have mentioned SAK dating is as much an art as a science.

Btw he did update the backspring Phillips dates within the last year or two - I noticed that!!
H
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on May 13, 2019, 01:23:37 PM
C'mon friends, SAAM created its wonderful site 10+ years ago, this site was one of the best at that time and yes, it used the existing dating at that time. I really like it so far. I recently asked him about corrections in some dates, but apparently he is busy with other things now. Anyway, thanks to him for his work.
I don't know SAAM, but to the best of my understanding, the site was created in October 2009 (just under 10 years ago) and its creation was discussed in this MTO thread (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,14646.0.html). In spite of limited activity (about two weeks in the second half of October 2009 and three days in March 2014) this thread is still an important source of information about certain SAK evolution issues that I don't recall seeing discussed elsewhere (such as the removal of the 7.5cm mark (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,14646.msg854047.html#msg854047) from the fish scaler around 1987).

There is no doubt that SAAM's site is indeed "wonderful" in that it does a great job of presenting things very clearly. Unfortunately, it contains some inaccuracies and many tools have more natural variants (that can be used for dating) than what it shows. For me, this raises the following question: How can we get to the point of having something similarly nice, but better?  :dunno:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on May 13, 2019, 04:59:48 PM
84mm
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on May 13, 2019, 05:06:39 PM
 :like: :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on May 13, 2019, 05:11:35 PM
... this thread is still an important source of information about certain SAK evolution issues that I don't recall seeing discussed elsewhere..."

That was my main point about this thread. From my first post here:

"NOTICE:
It would be so nice and most useful if you already made a topic with some vintage knives in the past that you include that link in your post here. Just to keep everything in one place and tidy. Also, when you do a post, please include some useful info if you know regarding that particular model (year of manufacture, model name, number etc.) or simply ask if you don't know and somebody will answer, for sure.

As time goes by this topic could grow into a huge database of useful and much needed information about vintage SAKs if all of us put in some effort. That's my goal and general idea.
Thanks guys and gals."
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on May 13, 2019, 06:08:14 PM
84mm
Cool 84mm ! Thanks  for sharing, Marko ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on May 13, 2019, 06:27:48 PM
Cool 84mm ! Thanks  for sharing, Marko ;)

Thank you... You're welcome Julius ;)
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on May 13, 2019, 06:31:22 PM
Champion with 39 teeth saw
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190513/64ec4e28124b984f0a83c9393105a087.jpg)
Picture for MiniChamp ;) :
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190513/5328a313178ec2e5cbc3a235729ac02b.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on May 13, 2019, 06:53:07 PM
 :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on May 13, 2019, 08:41:33 PM
I certainly don't mean any disrespect for the SAAM's blog.  It certainly was useful getting started with production evolution/chronology for me.  It has a clear and easy to understand format. I just wish it was updated.

84mm
Very nice!  :drool: Recent acquisition?

Champion with 39 teeth saw
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190513/64ec4e28124b984f0a83c9393105a087.jpg)
Picture for MiniChamp ;) :
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190513/5328a313178ec2e5cbc3a235729ac02b.jpg)

 :like: Nice knife! You should send me the Champion for, uh, metal saw cleaning.  ;)  :D


Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on May 13, 2019, 09:00:55 PM
Quote from: kamakiri link=

 :like: Nice knife! You should send me the Champion for, uh, metal saw cleaning.  ;)  :D
[/quote


Haha, thank you! What is your treatment for rust metal saw? Acid?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on May 13, 2019, 09:04:04 PM
Very nice!  :drool: Recent acquisition?

Thank you, no it's not recent. Its one of mine 84mm. I manage to grab it before some time and it's in an excellent condition.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on May 13, 2019, 09:59:36 PM
Haha, thank you! What is your treatment for rust metal saw? Acid?

 :D

Yes, as a last resort for anything that doesn't come off mechanically, I attack it chemically...whatever it is. The worst knives need to go back and forth between the two.

Thank you, no it's not recent. Its one of mine 84mm. I manage to grab it before some time and it's in an excellent condition.
. I certainly looks excellent! Just curious. I'm trying hard not to expand my collecting to pre WWII era knives...but knives like yours make me reconsider!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on May 13, 2019, 10:07:41 PM
:D

Yes, as a last resort for anything that doesn't come off mechanically, I attack it chemically...whatever it is. The worst knives need to go back and forth between the two.
Can you say what acid/concentration/temperature or it is top secret? Once I tried ortophosforic acid low concentration and got nice deep patina
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on May 13, 2019, 11:01:53 PM
Can you say what acid/concentration/temperature or it is top secret? Once I tried ortophosforic acid low concentration and got nice deep patina
Eesh. That's what I fear once I go chemical. I suspect you left it in too long?

The stronger treatments are TOP SECRET hush-hush.  ;)  The strongest need to be used only for spot treatment and immediately neutralized.

But the first thing I use if needed is just acetic/white vinegar at room temp. Even with that, I keep exposure brief. I try to do most of the cleaning mechanically, as it's 'safest' and easiest to control.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on May 13, 2019, 11:46:12 PM
...this thread is still an important source of information about certain SAK evolution issues that I don't recall seeing discussed elsewhere...
That was my main point about this thread. From my first post here:
There seems to be some confusion here. I was writing about (and providing a link to) another thread, titled "Victorinox 91mm Tools Evolution," that was started in October 2009, discusses the formation of SAAM's site (http://victorinox.metodi.me/91mmtools.php), and is available at this URL: https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,14646.0.html

Of course, the current thread is also a great resource!  :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on May 13, 2019, 11:53:44 PM
Champion with 39 teeth saw
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190513/64ec4e28124b984f0a83c9393105a087.jpg)
Picture for MiniChamp ;) :
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190513/5328a313178ec2e5cbc3a235729ac02b.jpg)
Cool!   :like:  Can you show (or describe) the tang stamps on the main blade of this Champion? Thanks!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on May 14, 2019, 01:05:22 AM
...any assist on my "Climber with a metal file?" screw scizzors I cant find a spring for, metal TW,  grooved El Corkscrew?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on May 14, 2019, 02:06:13 AM
Please see my original reply ......  :pok:
Tony - What precisely is your question here please?  :think:   
Are you asking what model you have? or what age is your model? or what?  - It is not clear !


For sure it is not a Climber if it has a file, if it is Spartan plus scissors and file - It is a Mountaineer
If it has the back-spring screwdriver, by my definition - It is not vintage! See below .... as the back SD came in in 1977  1973   ;)
....... And also not a Mountaineer - As I don't think that model had one

For model queries see here:
https://sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Victorinox+91mm
For dating queries see here:
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,51872.msg1629826.html#msg1629826

Could be a custom model for the Swiss Jewel Company - If so please describe all tools layers etc -  and we could put in in the Wiki as variation
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on May 14, 2019, 03:05:01 AM
Please see my original reply ......  :pok:
Sorry and thanks! Asking the experts.  Yes, model, maybe I didn't Wiki enough... year? my dad had it when I was young and I am now 65 ...
It is a basic Climber tool set add metal file. Only back tools are the awl and a flat type driver/scraper kinda hidden by the corkscrew which has the ridges, 4 turns.
The belt pouch is a brown basket weave type, on the belt loop is stamped  28-009 but I may have purchased it later. Oh, the Tweezers has a metal tip too.
Hoping to add to this great effort- The scizzors spring (screw scizzors) I can't replace with ones I just got from a certain Knife Shop, should have left the half broken, it worked...
And as mentioned Swiss Jewel Company on reverse, regular Vic shield on the obverse.
Thanks dont sweat it, again, just contributing!  May try to get an Avi shot if necessary.
Thanks again gang  :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: cody6268 on May 14, 2019, 03:33:47 AM
Sorry and thanks! Asking the experts.  Yes, model, maybe I didn't Wiki enough... year? my dad had it when I was young and I am now 65 ...
It is a basic Climber tool set add metal file. Only back tools are the awl and a flat type driver/scraper kinda hidden by the corkscrew which has the ridges, 4 turns.
The belt pouch is a brown basket weave type, on the belt loop is stamped  28-009 but I may have purchased it later. Oh, the Tweezers has a metal tip too.
Hoping to add to this great effort- The scizzors spring (screw scizzors) I can't replace with ones I just got from a certain Knife Shop, should have left the half broken, it worked...
And as mentioned Swiss Jewel Company on reverse, regular Vic shield on the obverse.
Thanks dont sweat it, again, just contributing!  May try to get an Avi shot if necessary.
Thanks again gang  :salute:

I think they do sell springs that fit, but they're exclusive to the special toolkit for replacing springs, and I am not spending $60 on that for $5 worth of springs I need. Figure it's easier just to send them off to Vic. Besides, the only one I need to have the spring replaced on has a bunch of other issues, so it will be going as a part of my next batch to be sent off to Vic. I try to send off 4-5 with issues at a time to help offset the high UPS shipping.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on May 14, 2019, 05:16:36 AM
Hey Tony

So this sounds like a custom Mountaineer to me - Custom as they have added the fine screwdriver on the back of the file - which would be normal for a Champion from that period, but not a Mountaineer.
Maybe it was customised for the Swiss Jewel Company - as they thought the fine SD would be good for jewelers - eg Prizing back off watch or watch spring etc

I used to have a lot of confidence in my dating spreadsheet - However now I get very nervous with my dates, as there are way more knowledgeable people than me around, who correct me.  >:D  However .....
I would say the model comes from 73-78. 73 as you have the SD and four looped corkscrew 78 as you have metal tipped tweezers
Does the file have the smooth end or does the file surface go right up to the tip? That would but it before or after 75

You can check the file and screwdriver shapes here - This is the SAAMs site we talked about earlier in this thread - So bear in mind some dates are out! eg Corkscrew and SD!
http://victorinox.metodi.me/91mmtools.php#finescrew

The double spring came in  in 75 too - So a Vic replacement spring could fit - It is quite hard to get in without the special tool but can be done
If the scissors had the single leafed spring I think a newer spring can still be used if you pinch the wee loop with pliers a bit to make it smaller ?  ???

Hope that helps

Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on May 14, 2019, 05:38:45 AM
Cool!   :like:  Can you show (or describe) the tang stamps on the main blade of this Champion? Thanks!
Stamps are VO CB and VSS, used c.1952-1957 imho
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190514/5e49791b437d9162a1211cd9bd65cd13.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on May 14, 2019, 05:58:04 AM
Stamps are VO CB and VSS, used c.1952-1957 imho
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190514/5e49791b437d9162a1211cd9bd65cd13.jpg)
Cool!  :tu:  Thanks!  :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on May 14, 2019, 01:48:15 PM
Hey Tony

So this sounds like a custom Mountaineer to me - Custom as they have added the fine screwdriver on the back of the file - which would be normal for a Champion from that period, but not a Mountaineer.
Maybe it was customised for the Swiss Jewel Company - as they thought the fine SD would be good for jewelers - eg Prizing back off watch or watch spring etc

I used to have a lot of confidence in my dating spreadsheet - However now I get very nervous with my dates, as there are way more knowledgeable people than me around, who correct me.  >:D  However .....
I would say the model comes from 73-78. 73 as you have the SD and four looped corkscrew 78 as you have metal tipped tweezers
Does the file have the smooth end or does the file surface go right up to the tip? That would but it before or after 75

You can check the file and screwdriver shapes here - This is the SAAMs site we talked about earlier in this thread - So bear in mind some dates are out! eg Corkscrew and SD!
http://victorinox.metodi.me/91mmtools.php#finescrew

The double spring came in  in 75 too - So a Vic replacement spring could fit - It is quite hard to get in without the special tool but can be done
If the scissors had the single leafed spring I think a newer spring can still be used if you pinch the wee loop with pliers a bit to make it smaller ?  ???

Hope that helps
Sure does help and thanks!  :cheers:
File does not go all the way to the tip btw.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on May 14, 2019, 09:02:43 PM
Does the file have the smooth end or does the file surface go right up to the tip? That would but it before or after 75
*cough* '73.

 ;)



The double spring came in  in 75 too

..or c. '71/'72. Could be a bit earlier. I have '72  91mm knives (like Champion 146fmaU and 'Master' Craftsman) which have the new scissor/double leaf spring. Pre-'73 because the aren't black oxide.  c. '71/'72 is a start date range and might just be the LNF change date. Non-LNF might have switched earlier, like '70 or even '69.  Single leafs were still used for a while longer and certainly in 84mm and (I think) for some non-main line like Hoffritz where old stock was 'disposed' or used up.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on May 14, 2019, 09:10:41 PM
Stamps are VO CB and VSS, used c.1952-1957 imho
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190514/5e49791b437d9162a1211cd9bd65cd13.jpg)

I think the 2.5mm end pins confirm the date range too?  My guess is that it has an aluminum 'bird head' spacer ~1.6mm thick.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on May 14, 2019, 09:42:51 PM
I think the 2.5mm end pins confirm the date range too?  My guess is that it has an aluminum 'bird head' spacer ~1.6mm thick.
Yes, you are right ;). Also round in cross section bail, rectangular notch on LNF usual for 1952-1957 knives but MiniChamp put this wood saw type into 1954-1955 time range.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on May 14, 2019, 11:35:37 PM
Stamps are VO CB and VSS, used c.1952-1957 imho


Nice pics jnoxyd! :like: :tu: :tu:

I have the same Champion model only mine has the phillips screwdriver instead of the cork screw.

It has the same blade stampings.

It was NOS in the box when I bought it.


Click on pictures for best pictures
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on May 15, 2019, 12:04:30 AM
I used to have a lot of confidence in my dating spreadsheet - However now I get very nervous with my dates, as there are way more knowledgeable people than me around, who correct me.  >:D 

See what I mean !!
I had a feeling that you'd say exactly that! ie 75 --> 73

Although I even asked for corrections in my dating thread - I am just dealing with the tidal wave
- And it's all good - As the collective knowledge improves!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on May 15, 2019, 05:11:05 AM
Nice pics jnoxyd! :like: :tu: :tu:

I have the same Champion model only mine has the phillips screwdriver instead of the cork screw.

It has the same blade stampings.

It was NOS in the box when I bought it.


Click on pictures for best pictures

 :like:
Excellent example VICMAN!!

See what I mean !!
I had a feeling that you'd say exactly that! ie 75 --> 73

Although I even asked for corrections in my dating thread - I am just dealing with the tidal wave
- And it's all good - As the collective knowledge improves!!
:D

I've been meaning to 'get in' that thread...it would just take time to compile the backup data, pictures and catalog cuts to further the discussion. I think to M0rkoni's point in creating this thread, it's easier to discuss chronology when you're already looking at a picture example of a knife and various members are estimating/evaluating it's likely production date. I think it's more fun with the interaction.

Otherwise, I'll try to behave.  >:D  ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on May 15, 2019, 06:26:15 AM
^^^ Yep agreed - My plan for the next update to that spready is to review:

And for the Wiki updates - To review
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on May 15, 2019, 06:57:39 AM
I think to M0rkoni's point in creating this thread, it's easier to discuss chronology when you're already looking at a picture example of a knife and various members are estimating/evaluating it's likely production date.

 :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on May 15, 2019, 12:38:02 PM
:like:
Excellent example VICMAN!!
 :D


Thanks kamakiri! :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on June 01, 2019, 08:56:18 AM
It looks like 84mm Super Tinker with LNF is not so common as 84mm Climber small LNF What do you think?
 (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190601/4ef6e6a46aefdf84aab7c3cea9d40fb3.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on June 01, 2019, 10:11:49 AM
I think...

I'm in love :dd:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on June 01, 2019, 12:39:54 PM
It looks like 84mm Super Tinker with LNF is not so common as 84mm Climber small LNF What do you think?


Very nice duo jnoxyd! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on June 01, 2019, 12:50:18 PM
Thanks VICMAN


Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on June 01, 2019, 02:15:56 PM
It looks like 84mm Super Tinker with LNF is not so common as 84mm Climber small LNF What do you think?

I think  ........ I'd be happy (and amazed!) to own either of those !!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on June 01, 2019, 10:32:08 PM
It looks like 84mm Super Tinker with LNF is not so common as 84mm Climber small LNF What do you think?
 (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190601/4ef6e6a46aefdf84aab7c3cea9d40fb3.jpg)

Methinks you're right!  I only have the corkscrew type in 245ka (shiny silver single leaf spring and 5 turn CS, +PAT) and the same c. '79 in 91mm.

145ka(?) - my guess is a custom order. Nice knife and thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on June 09, 2019, 07:50:28 AM
Mod.1908 from 1942 with not very common blade stamp
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190609/e619f8f46533e55e4859557e417cafae.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190609/f182ed12519630ea1cb1072b24b14edd.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190609/a744239f0c856db478fded8185f92607.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on June 17, 2019, 06:22:45 AM
Nice Hoffritz catalogue - I always liked Hoffiritzs and have three or four including what I always thought was a SwissChamp - So should I be calling it a Super Knife?  Or was that only the Champion?

We need to find a Hoffritz catalog after '86 to find out! I have some of those Champs but no idea if they got a newer name. Worst part is I think I've seen that page before...before I cared about this subject!  :facepalm:

Found it...The Hoffritz SwissChamps were called: 'Deluxe Super Swiss Army Knife' cat. #11452 in 1987 and/or possibly updated to #11460 in 1988.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on June 17, 2019, 07:14:17 AM
Found it...The Hoffritz SwissChamps were called: 'Deluxe Super Swiss Army Knife' cat. #11452 in 1987 and/or possibly updated to #11460 in 1988.
Great find! Can you show pictures please? I believe there are many funny names for other knives ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on June 17, 2019, 05:52:44 PM
Great find! Can you show pictures please? I believe there are many funny names for other knives ;)

from 1987:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48080052386_d3bd1b49a4.jpg)

And yeah, very funny names.  Going through all the Hoffritz stuff here, it's strange how they generally followed all the 'standard' US market names...until they didn't c. '74...and wow.

My favorite so far is that their 84mm Master Craftsman #136 was actually called that back in the '60s.  :D   And the 91mm 136U was simultaneously called a Craftsman #2236.  I long suspected that too, but also found that yesterday in the 1960 catalog.  Numbers for both stayed the same in the '68 catalog, but the names aren't used.

But this has gotta be my favorite thing to find:
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on June 17, 2019, 05:59:13 PM
from 1987:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48080052386_d3bd1b49a4.jpg)

And yeah, very funny names.  Going through all the Hoffritz stuff here, it's strange how they generally followed all the 'standard' US market names...until they didn't c. '74...and wow.

My favorite so far is that their 84mm Master Craftsman #136 was actually called that back in the '60s.  :D   And the 91mm 136U was simultaneously called a Craftsman #2236.  I long suspected that too, but also found that yesterday in the 1960 catalog.  Numbers for both stayed the same in the '68 catalog, but the names aren't used.

But this has gotta be my favorite thing to find:
You are right, here are pics for illustration ;)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190617/9d7278079c6e0d9e43495a4ed98e769f.jpg)
But they called lately 84mm Master Craftsman ... Explorer (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190617/2c9394496e452d786b2b73fc6a962c96.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190617/7b97bb81aa19abbd02129cf0b6734a39.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on June 17, 2019, 06:34:26 PM
But this has gotta be my favorite thing to find:
Oh Dear   :facepalm:

Maybe for the Australian market?   ???    :pok:   
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on June 17, 2019, 06:54:59 PM
Oh Dear   :facepalm:

Maybe for the Australian market?   ???    :pok:   

 :rofl: :rofl:   :ahhh :ahhh


You are right, here are pics for illustration ;)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190617/9d7278079c6e0d9e43495a4ed98e769f.jpg)
But they called lately 84mm Master Craftsman ... Explorer (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190617/2c9394496e452d786b2b73fc6a962c96.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190617/7b97bb81aa19abbd02129cf0b6734a39.jpg)

And then in '79 the Hoff  'Explorer' grows to 91mm and numbered F11037...all crazy.  I still need to find one of those.

I'm also sure the catalog info lagged the production style a bit and didn't always get updated with new photo layouts. The '79 updated styles with the stainless Hoff inlays show up first with late '75/'76 parts. Easiest parts to ID are the small scissor screw, and confirmed with the shield inlay.  So I think the '77 catalog wasn't updated in time, which would be typical of most catalog photos.

Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on June 20, 2019, 01:12:17 PM
And then in '79 the Hoff  'Explorer' grows to 91mm and numbered F11037...all crazy.  I still need to find one of those.

So Victorinox didn't produce 84mm Master Craftsman after 1978.
BTW here are both sizes together:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190620/c94efaf68c17320dd5cf2efb077f6dba.jpg)



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Ivo on June 20, 2019, 03:24:07 PM
This one is a WENGER from late 60' or early 70' , can't find it in any catalog , in should be in the 70' catalog but it is not.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on June 20, 2019, 08:21:56 PM
So Victorinox didn't produce 84mm Master Craftsman after 1978.
BTW here are both sizes together:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190620/c94efaf68c17320dd5cf2efb077f6dba.jpg)

I suspect main line production stopped for 84mm Master Craftsman by/before '76 based on the '76 dealer catalog showing the Fish Scaler version. '78 end date could be right for the Hoffritz versions. My guess is whenever the 84mm metal saws ran out.  My latest (Hoffritz) is c. '76 production.  After that any Hoffritz should have an inlay.

I still need to find a date for when the T&T was 'normally' included on the 91mm versions. Seeing yours makes me think it could be '65-'66.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on June 20, 2019, 08:37:19 PM
It looks like 84mm Super Tinker with LNF is not so common as 84mm Climber small LNF What do you think?
 (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190601/4ef6e6a46aefdf84aab7c3cea9d40fb3.jpg)

Very nice find. This is only the third one of these I've ever seen. ColoSwiss had one with MOP scales and I have a red scaled version with bail (that I got from ColoSwiss for a SwissChamp XL). 145ka for yours, 145kaU for mine. All look to be from around the same time period (late 1960s) but with different variants could be three separate production runs. Which would make you think there were more of them out there, but no... they're one of the rarest post WWII 84mm knives.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on June 20, 2019, 08:39:49 PM
Very nice find. This is only the third one of these I've ever seen. ColoSwiss had one with MOP scales and I have a red scaled version with bail (that I got from ColoSwiss for a SwissChamp XL). 145ka for yours, 145kaU for mine. All look to be from around the same time period (late 1960s) but with different variants could be three separate production runs. Which would make you think there were more of them out there, but no... they're one of the rarest post WWII 84mm knives.
Thanks jazzbass
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on June 20, 2019, 09:20:41 PM
I suspect main line production stopped for 84mm Master Craftsman by/before '76 based on the '76 dealer catalog showing the Fish Scaler version. '78 end date could be right for the Hoffritz versions. My guess is whenever the 84mm metal saws ran out.  My latest (Hoffritz) is c. '76 production.  After that any Hoffritz should have an inlay.

The newest 136kmaU (84mm Master Craftsman) I've ever seen dates to about c. 1972/73. This is from a sample size of about 50. The earliest I've seen is c. 1960 with hidden rivets and the large triangular awl. 1974 seems to be when Victorinox really made a massive change in their product lines and philosphy - revamping all of the 91mm products (2.7mm > 2.4mm blades, clip point to spear point, dropping the LNF), changing some stuff on the 93mm lines (Elsener > Victorinox), and really starting to de-emphasize the 84mm and position it as more of a kid/economy product vs. just being slightly smaller variants of the 91mm line. Post 1974 you almost never see and 4 and 5 layer 84mm knives with the exception of a couple special runs, and 3 layer 84mm are all but gone by the early 1980s.

84mm metal saws were still used in special runs through the 1980s (I have an 84mm Grand Prix small from c. 1986), and 84mm scissors were still used in a handful of small runs in the early 90s, but then they to go the way of the dodo.

I still need to find a date for when the T&T was 'normally' included on the 91mm versions. Seeing yours makes me think it could be '65-'66.

I think you're correct with c. 1966. In the period 1962-1969 there's a major change to the wood saw from a 29 tooth asymmetric style (29TA) to a 29 tooth symmetric design (29TS - the current design). Numbers suggest that this change happened c. 1966. When you look at Master Crafsman knives from this period, almost every knife with a 29TA saw = no T&T, and almost every knife with a 29TS saw = T&T.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on June 20, 2019, 11:42:22 PM
The newest 136kmaU (84mm Master Craftsman) I've ever seen dates to about c. 1972/73. This is from a sample size of about 50. The earliest I've seen is c. 1960 with hidden rivets and the large triangular awl. 1974 seems to be when Victorinox really made a massive change in their product lines and philosphy - revamping all of the 91mm products (2.7mm > 2.4mm blades, clip point to spear point, dropping the LNF), changing some stuff on the 93mm lines (Elsener > Victorinox), and really starting to de-emphasize the 84mm and position it as more of a kid/economy product vs. just being slightly smaller variants of the 91mm line. Post 1974 you almost never see and 4 and 5 layer 84mm knives with the exception of a couple special runs, and 3 layer 84mm are all but gone by the early 1980s.

84mm metal saws were still used in special runs through the 1980s (I have an 84mm Grand Prix small from c. 1986), and 84mm scissors were still used in a handful of small runs in the early 90s, but then they to go the way of the dodo.

Thanks for the reply jazzbass.  But I think there's pretty solid proof in two Hoffritz catalogs that the 84mm 'Master Craftsman'/Hoffritz 'Explorer' 11037 was produced outside of '74-'77. I dated my knife to c. '76 before seeing the Hoffritz catalogs posted by minichamp.

From the '77 Hoffritz catalog:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48099722836_e4da5a3982_o.jpg)

I certainly believe that your dates are correct for main line production, but Hoffritz knives are regularly or often exceptions.  The main things that make me think my later copy is '76 are the 'gray' double leaf scissor spring, H/VSSR tang stamps (instead of HSS which I would expect if it was earlier and later would get H/SSR), machining of the awl, proportions of the tweezer head and shrinkage of the cellidor. It also does not side-by-side to my +PAT copy (HSS/VOS, black single leaf, symmetrical tooth wood saw, etc.)


I think you're correct with c. 1966. In the period 1962-1969 there's a major change to the wood saw from a 29 tooth asymmetric style (29TA) to a 29 tooth symmetric design (29TS - the current design). Numbers suggest that this change happened c. 1966. When you look at Master Crafsman knives from this period, almost every knife with a 29TA saw = no T&T, and almost every knife with a 29TS saw = T&T.

Then that's just a good guesstimate on my part! I certainly don't have many samples from this era.  Adding them gets progressively more expensive for *any* of the Craftsman 136x variants!

My current focus in this era is trying to figure out when the wood saw polishing got dropped and aluminum 'bird head' spacers got dropped for good.

Thanks again for your reply. I've read your posts back into the 2015 range before I started posting here, and appreciate any of your input.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on June 21, 2019, 03:20:57 PM
There are another two knives I've not seen often: 84mm "Hiker" and ""Camper" small, mod. 137kU and 237k. Who of you has such knives?
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190621/cfea3a3e6f65e447f49f09a0f73e8664.jpg)
"Camper small" 237k was shown in 1940s catalogs
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190621/b220358a0fb41dae19fadcb1ae7a8d89.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on June 21, 2019, 04:39:08 PM
There are another two knives I've not seen often: 84mm "Hiker" and ""Camper" small, mod. 137kU and 237k. Who of you has such knives?

I have both. The small Camper 237k was a regular catalog model and actually a pretty common model pre-1950. It shows up with some frequency until about 1970 and then... nothing. I have several including a 4 pin version from pre-1920 (in rough shape unfortunately).

The Hiker Small is an interesting one. It doesn't ever seem to be a regular catalog model, but I have seen a few that appear to be special runs from the late 1940s (crab claw can opener, etc) through the 1960s. Here's one I found NIB that was clearly a special order from the mid 1960s:

(https://i.imgur.com/0NEVRbg.jpg)

The thing I like about these models is that they are very unusual but you could get them made today if you wanted. None of the parts in these knives are out of production.
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on June 21, 2019, 05:07:25 PM
Thanks for the answer jazzbass. Nice to see your new picture , hope you keep them safe now
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: wengercollector on June 22, 2019, 05:57:17 PM
Very nice find. This is only the third one of these I've ever seen. ColoSwiss had one with MOP scales and I have a red scaled version with bail (that I got from ColoSwiss for a SwissChamp XL). 145ka for yours, 145kaU for mine. All look to be from around the same time period (late 1960s) but with different variants could be three separate production runs. Which would make you think there were more of them out there, but no... they're one of the rarest post WWII 84mm knives.

Here`s another one with original sheet, produced for General Motors, end of the 50-ies.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on June 23, 2019, 12:12:36 AM
Here`s another one with original sheet, produced for General Motors, end of the 50-ies.
It's a beautiful SAK. Thanks for posting this image. I don't have this model, unfortunately, but here is a first generation Hiker small of the kind mentioned above by JAZZBASS.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on June 23, 2019, 11:17:55 PM
I just posted (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,76947.msg1956059.html#msg1956059) links to several Victorinox catalog compilations in the catalogs thread. I find it intriguing how some of the recent discussion here seems to be reflected in differences that can be observed between the "Gesamt-Katalog bis 1970" and the "Gesamt-Katalog bis 1980." The attached image shows, side by side, the catalog page with the list of Victoria officer's knife models from the "Gesamt-Katalog bis 1970" (I'm guessing that the actual page is from the early 1960's) and the corresponding page from the "Gesamt-Katalog bis 1980" (I'm guessing that the actual page is from the early 1970's).

Most of the changes involve models getting manually deleted in the newer catalog. I believe that this reflects the withdrawal of these models in the early 1970's or slightly before then. One can see, in particular, the withdrawal of most 84mm models with more than two layers (with the notable exception of the three layer models with scissors), as discussed above by JAZZBASS. There are also some other subtle differences, such as the fact that model 136mU in the older catalog is replaced by model 136maU in the newer one (something that was also discussed above).
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on June 24, 2019, 12:50:53 AM
I just posted (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,76947.msg1956059.html#msg1956059) links to several Victorinox catalog compilations in the catalogs thread. I find it intriguing how some of the recent discussion here seems to be reflected in differences that can be observed between the "Gesamt-Katalog bis 1970" and the "Gesamt-Katalog bis 1980." The attached image shows, side by side, the catalog page with the list of Victoria officer's knife models from the "Gesamt-Katalog bis 1970" (I'm guessing that the actual page is from the early 1960's) and the corresponding page from the "Gesamt-Katalog bis 1980" (I'm guessing that the actual page is from the early 1970's).

Most of the changes involve models getting manually deleted in the newer catalog. I believe that this reflects the withdrawal of these models in the early 1970's or slightly before then. One can see, in particular, the withdrawal of most 84mm models with more than two layers (with the notable exception of the three layer models with scissors), as discussed above by JAZZBASS. There are also some other subtle differences, such as the fact that model 136mU in the older catalog is replaced by model 136maU in the newer one (something that was also discussed above).

Excellent!  Am I being thick, or might the documents be Jan '69 and comparing Jan '69 to July '71?  :dunno:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on June 24, 2019, 12:54:18 AM
On the first/left doc, it would be nice to have the pics that correlate to:  "the 12 illustrated models" and "the other 24 master-selling models"
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on June 24, 2019, 12:55:36 AM
Here`s another one with original sheet, produced for General Motors, end of the 50-ies.

Very, very nice example!   :like: Could I ask for pictures of the top and ends?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on June 24, 2019, 03:05:47 AM
might the documents be Jan '69 and comparing Jan '69 to July '71?  :dunno:
Probably not. While I don't know what the numbers are, I don't think that they designate dates (also XII isn't 7 and the right page doesn't seem to be doing by itself any kind of comparison). Moreover, the theory about 136mU being replaced by 136maU around 1966 suggests that the left page is from before 1966.

On the first/left doc, it would be nice to have the pics that correlate to:  "the 12 illustrated models" and "the other 24 master-selling models"
???  A picture of "the 12 illustrated models" is precisely the content of the preceding page in each of the actual PDF Gesamt-Katalog documents. I'm not familiar with any picture of "the other 24 best-selling models."
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on June 24, 2019, 04:43:06 AM
Probably not. While I don't know what the numbers are, I don't think that they designate dates (also XII isn't 7 and the right page doesn't seem to be doing by itself any kind of comparison). Moreover, the theory about 136mU being replaced by 136maU around 1966 suggests that the left page is from before 1966.

 :facepalm:  Typing before thinking again!  Even if I said 'December'...still doesn't really fit with the 136x example as discussed.

???  A picture of "the 12 illustrated models" is precisely the content of the preceding page in each of the actual PDF Gesamt-Katalog documents. I'm not familiar with any picture of "the other 24 best-selling models."

Oops, again.  Counted 13 on the page and figured it was the wrong picture. And now see that the 24 aren't pictured.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on June 26, 2019, 08:08:25 AM
Returning to 84mm Master Craftsman:
Three wood saw types:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190626/e2581f6e5910593be7a2a3cbed2f33c2.jpg)

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190626/a618e9f0054e7a31b523da0e9248d4c4.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190626/fa8c811da138f24f011b03c5498467d3.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190626/e9580cc6b5940f23d0616b42c6b91bf4.jpg)
Last one has Phillips without file.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on June 26, 2019, 06:32:35 PM
Nice set, jnoxyd! 

I'd say the first one is late '50s/early '60s. Just because it could be '60/'61 too.

I think the middle one is mid-60's at the earliest. Pretty sure after say '63-'64. Scissor spring isn't silver, saw isn't polished, and the tweezer doesn't look nickel silver in the pic. Good chance after '66 since it's a Hoffritz.

The third one could be into the early '70s. Like '70 or '71 construction. And again, possibly later because Hoffritz.I have one almost exactly like that, but with the file on the phillips.

The one I have that is c. '76 is H/VSSR and the newer 'smooth'/square phillips. In 91mm, those tang stamps are used in the '73 to early '76 range.

.......

Craftsman pre-'51 and c. '51 US. PAT. PEND.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48124433788_776a5a6d38.jpg)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48124494852_791bd35c80.jpg)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48124405026_b3d98fed34.jpg)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48124494222_4b89d4438a.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on June 26, 2019, 06:36:40 PM
And I should have asked what 'bird head' spacer is on the middle one.  I suspect nickel silver and not aluminum.  I'd expect aluminum on early '60s with hidden awls.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on June 26, 2019, 06:42:25 PM
Here`s another one with original sheet, produced for General Motors, end of the 50-ies.
That knife is fantastic! Is this in your collection? I have some questions if so.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on June 26, 2019, 06:46:38 PM
Returning to 84mm Master Craftsman:
Three wood saw types:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190626/e2581f6e5910593be7a2a3cbed2f33c2.jpg)

Great picture. From this era you're only missing one variation - the very hard to find 25T asymmetric polished. I have that in a Camper Small, Artisan and Huntsman Small from the early 60s (small awl). It's weird because it's almost like they went 35TAP > 25TAP > 35TAM > 25TSM*.

(T = tooth, A = asymmetric, S = symmetric, P = polished, M = machined)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on June 26, 2019, 06:47:36 PM
And I should have asked what 'bird head' spacer is on the middle one.  I suspect nickel silver and not aluminum.  I'd expect aluminum on early '60s with hidden awls.

I've seen you asking about the pen blade spacer - what exactly would you like to know about these?

BTW - have you posted pics of your 136kmaU from 1976? Love to see those - that's the latest one of these I know of.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on June 26, 2019, 07:22:23 PM
I've seen you asking about the pen blade spacer - what exactly would you like to know about these?
I'm trying to use it as a tool to date knives in the mid-'60s. Use of aluminum seems pretty consistent for indicating early 60's and nickel silver used exclusively after some date.  It seems to differ enough from other mid-'60s features like saw teeth and polishing and the earlier tweezer head material change over.

BTW - have you posted pics of your 136kmaU from 1976? Love to see those - that's the latest one of these I know of.

This is what I could find quickly. I might have more in the Hoffritz threads.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7867/33703207048_4c65439003.jpg)

Back is VSSR stamped
(https://live.staticflickr.com/7858/40614053913_5a3a2e0cb0.jpg)

Top knife here, obviously:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/33884259508_f0e5c86ba7.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on June 26, 2019, 08:10:37 PM
I'm trying to use it as a tool to date knives in the mid-'60s. Use of aluminum seems pretty consistent for indicating early 60's and nickel silver used exclusively after some date.  It seems to differ enough from other mid-'60s features like saw teeth and polishing and the earlier tweezer head material change over.

In the taxonomy I developed for my collection, I call the time period from 62-69 the "late vintage" or LVNT period. In the LVNT period there is a change from thin 1.0mm aluminum pen blade spacer to nickel silver. In general this coincided with the change from polished to machined saws and silver > black scissor springs.

Thin aluminum spacers come into being in the last part of the "mid vintage" (57-62) period. Prior to that they used a thicker 1.5mm spacer that was either aluminum or nickel silver in no way that seems to indicate preference. The thicker spacer goes away when the main/pen blade backspring is redesigned c 1960 to go from a design that was thicker at the pen blade side to one that was of uniform thickness (roughly 2.75mm).
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on June 26, 2019, 08:29:27 PM
It's weird because it's almost like they went 35TAP > 25TAP > 35TAM > 25TSM*.
???  I'm a little confused by this statement. Are you proposing that they actually did something else? If so, what?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on June 26, 2019, 08:41:35 PM
???  I'm a little confused by this statement. Are you proposing that they actually did something else? If so, what?

Is it my odd naming that is confusing? Or the chronology? AFAIK, the chronology of the 84mm wood saw goes like this:

c. 1955: 35TAP
c. 1963: 25TAP (this is the rare one)
c. 1963: 35TAM
c. 1966: 25TSM

I find it interesting that they tried the 25TAP saw very briefly after about a year into the LVNT period, but then got rid of it almost immediately in favor of the older 35T saw (this time machined and not polished). I'd love to know why they didn't like the 25TAP version. 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on June 26, 2019, 08:50:55 PM
Is it my odd naming that is confusing?
No. The confusing thing for me was the statement "it's almost like" which seems to suggest that they actually did something different. I believe that your proposed ordering and chronology are correct.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: wengercollector on June 26, 2019, 08:53:28 PM
That knife is fantastic! Is this in your collection? I have some questions if so.

Yes it is. What questions do you have?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on June 26, 2019, 08:58:11 PM
In the mean time a little bit of vintage alox ones: Old Cross ELINOX with bail, "the whole nine yard" instant vintage collection...  :)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on June 27, 2019, 07:41:28 PM
In the taxonomy I developed for my collection, I call the time period from 62-69 the "late vintage" or LVNT period. In the LVNT period there is a change from thin 1.0mm aluminum pen blade spacer to nickel silver. In general this coincided with the change from polished to machined saws and silver > black scissor springs.
I already understood that much.  I'm trying to assign/estimate dates for these smaller changes, like I have done for the '70s/91mm.

I'd like to refine and reorganize this list for 91mm main line production:
c. '63 End - Nickel Silver tipped tweezers
c. '63/'64 End -  Silver scissor spring
c. '63/'64 End -  Aluminum 'birdhead' spacer
c. '64-'66 End -  Polished Wood Saw
c. '66 End -  Angled Wood Saw teeth

I have a tendency to use start and end dates in my chronology since they do not always coincide but overlap like clip and drop point small blades.

Thin aluminum spacers come into being in the last part of the "mid vintage" (57-62) period. Prior to that they used a thicker 1.5mm spacer that was either aluminum or nickel silver in no way that seems to indicate preference. The thicker spacer goes away when the main/pen blade backspring is redesigned c 1960 to go from a design that was thicker at the pen blade side to one that was of uniform thickness (roughly 2.75mm).

I don't have very many of my own notes from this period, but broadly understand that all.  I would like to eventually work more on that period.  On the list are the transition dates from nickel silver liners to aluminum - for both 91mm 'sharp' transition and 83/84mm where parts may have been more mixed as MiniChamp has suggested. Use of the thin ~0.52mm aluminum liners.

 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on June 28, 2019, 08:19:56 PM
Let's do some serious vintage - probably the favorite knife in my collection, the 1905 Model 290:

(https://i.imgur.com/XPGVccg.jpg)

It's quite large. Here is a comparison of the screwdriver between other models:

[pic removed for bad info - will repost later]
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on June 28, 2019, 09:07:21 PM
Great knife in excellent condition. Nice to see it again here.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on June 28, 2019, 09:09:36 PM
Let's do some serious vintage
Cool!!!  :salute:  :like:

Quote
It's quite large. Here is a comparison of the screwdriver between other models:

(https://i.imgur.com/0BUzXhx.jpg)
I'm a bit puzzled. Ulli's table (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,50014.60.html#att306974) lists 1901 as the end year of the "Gesetzlich Geschützt" SD stamps. Also, as was recently discussed (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,79865.msg1819876.html#msg1819876) in Ulli's pictorial evolution thread, he thinks that Victorinox moved to three visible rivets around 1909. Are you sure about the dating estimate for the model 234k in that image?

There seem to be somewhat different opinions concerning SAK evolution in the very early 20th century. Any light you can shed here (When did they move to three visible rivets? When did they introduce the groove in the corkscrew? etc.) will be greatly appreciated.     
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on June 28, 2019, 09:48:06 PM
Cool!!!  :salute:  :like:
I'm a bit puzzled. Ulli's table (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,50014.60.html#att306974) lists 1901 as the end year of the "Gesetzlich Geschützt" SD stamps.

Oh man, that’s a brain fade mistake on my part that I forgot about. I originally took that pic with a 3 rivet Tourist but didn’t like the way the lighting came out. When I retook the picture I used a new-to-me 1890s Tourist and forgot to change the text overlay.  :-[

Going to delete that one and repost with the correct info. Thanks for catching that!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on June 29, 2019, 01:21:35 AM
Great knife in excellent condition. Nice to see it again here.

Yay  :iagree:  I very well remember the fascinating thread when JB first found this model  :tu:  Thanks

 - Some interesting tools too
BTW - What is the wee tool between the saw and opener? And are the scales are glued on? 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on June 29, 2019, 02:36:27 AM
Three wood saw types:

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190626/e2581f6e5910593be7a2a3cbed2f33c2.jpg)
Cool pics (as usual), Jnoxyd. :like:  I attach an image of the fourth type of wood saw from the 1960's that was mentioned by JAZZBASS.

AFAIK, the chronology of the 84mm wood saw goes like this:

c. 1955: 35TAP
c. 1963: 25TAP (this is the rare one)
c. 1963: 35TAM
c. 1966: 25TSM

I find it interesting that they tried the 25TAP saw very briefly after about a year into the LVNT period, but then got rid of it almost immediately in favor of the older 35T saw (this time machined and not polished). I'd love to know why they didn't like the 25TAP version.
If I understand correctly, this proposed chronology relates only to Victoria SAKs. AFAIK, things were a bit different for the Elinox line. I believe that the unpolished saws with 35 asymmetric teeth were first introduced on Elinox SAKs in the late 1950's and then when they started using them on the Victoria line, they didn't really make any new type of saw, but rather just adopted the Elinox saw variant for use on the Victoria line. It's possible that these saws with 35 teeth also lasted longer on Elinox SAKs, because they can be found on model 1240kU SAKs with a keyring. (So either these saws lasted longer on the Elinox line, or that the keyring was introduced on the Elinox line before it was introduced on the Victoria line, or both.)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on June 29, 2019, 04:15:39 AM
Cool pics (as usual), Jnoxyd. :like:  I attach an image of the fourth type of wood saw from the 1960's that was mentioned by JAZZBASS.
If I understand correctly, this proposed chronology relates only to Victoria SAKs. AFAIK, things were a bit different for the Elinox line. I believe that the unpolished saws with 35 asymmetric teeth were first introduced on Elinox SAKs in the late 1950's and then when they started using them on the Victoria line, they didn't really make any new type of saw, but rather just adopted the Elinox saw variant for use on the Victoria line. It's possible that these saws with 35 teeth also lasted longer on Elinox SAKs, because they can be found on model 1240kU SAKs with a keyring. (So either these saws lasted longer on the Elinox line, or that the keyring was introduced on the Elinox line before it was introduced on the Victoria line, or both.)

Seems to me that the 35TAP saws lasted past '63.  It's easy to find ones with black scissor springs, aluminum tweezers and either birdhead material.

What tweezer, scissor spring and 'birdhead' go with that 25TAP?  Machined main blade tang?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on June 29, 2019, 05:19:50 AM
What tweezer, scissor spring and 'birdhead' go with that 25TAP?
Aluminum spacer, no tweezers (missing) and no real scissors spring (there is a small relic suggesting a silver spring).
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on June 29, 2019, 06:11:36 AM
Aluminum spacer, no tweezers (missing) and no real scissors spring (there is a small relic suggesting a silver spring).

Perfect, thanks. That does confirm c.'63 production and not outside of '62 to '64 possibility.  I actually think the broken scissor spring attachment is  somewhat stronger proof of OE status. Especially if it's the preceding/earlier material.  The rest of the knife should be able to confirm earlier or latter on that date range. 

I have a 136ka Craftsman with a broken black spring with the 35TAP saw. Aluminum spacer and tweezer makes it close to yours, but overall polish on mine put it in the latter part and I estimate c. '64/'65, or shortly *after* your 25 TAP.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on June 30, 2019, 02:43:09 PM
Let's do some serious vintage - probably the favorite knife in my collection, the 1905 Model 290:

(https://i.imgur.com/XPGVccg.jpg)


Nice to see you reposted that pic!

I bid on it as well. I was truly hoping nobody had noticed the eBay listing :)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on June 30, 2019, 07:47:35 PM
Cool!!!  :salute:  :like:
Also, as was recently discussed (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,79865.msg1819876.html#msg1819876) in Ulli's pictorial evolution thread, he thinks that Victorinox moved to three visible rivets around 1909.

This is one change I'm still not sure about. I haven't seen any sources for the 1909 date other than the "official" Victorinox timeline, which has so many errors that I question all of it. But I have seen (and own) several stainless steel 4 rivet knives and I believe them to be original. That said, these knives were all hand made at the time, so it would have been no big deal for a knife maker to make one with 4 rivets post 1923 despite three rivets being the "standard way. "

The other thing that makes me think that 4 rivets lasted longer are sales numbers. Knives made pre-cap lifter with the large screwdriver fall into what I call the "Original" era. I divide the Original era into two periods - Early Original (EORG) knives with 4 rivets and Late Original (LORG) knives with 3 rivets. If the EORG period really only went from 1897-1909, then the LORG period would span from c. 1909-1930.  This means that the LORG period lasted 2x longer than EORG, as thus you should see many, many more LORG knives for sale than EORG. Esp since as a growing company during this era, any later period would always be biased to show up more in online sales. 

But the numbers don't back this up. Of all the Original era knives sold in the last 10 years online, 42% were EORG and 58% were LORG. This is one of the main reasons I tend to think the EORG period pushes out until at least 1920. There are too many EORG knives sold to represent such a small time window of manufacture.

Of course, this is all basically archeology. Looking at various bits of evidence and trying to draw conclusions on it all, and there's going to be a lot of guesses that are wrong. The 4 rivets knives could very well have disappeared in 1909, but there would have to be another explanation for their over-representation vs 3 rivet knives in knife sales.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on June 30, 2019, 08:03:10 PM
Yay  :iagree:  I very well remember the fascinating thread when JB first found this model  :tu:  Thanks

 - Some interesting tools too
BTW - What is the wee tool between the saw and opener? And are the scales are glued on?

I believe it to be a leather punch. Here's a closer detail of it along with a detail view of the hoof pick w/ file and drill tool.

(https://i.imgur.com/uL7u6Bh.jpg)

The interesting thing about it is that it's hollow - if you look at the end it's not a solid awl like we're all used to. It's more like one of these:

(https://i.imgur.com/9MB0cyi.jpg)

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on July 01, 2019, 01:35:26 AM
Ah - Thanks for the detail JB -  Much appreciated - I wondered if it might be one of those - A hole making punch - but normally hit with a hammer - which would not be good for a SAK!
And a cut out on both sides of the handles ... unusual !

Wonderful knife - Not just the age and size - But also all the unusual/whacky tools - Thanks again for showing us

Another Q - Do you ever think of a little cleaning up your older models?
You see some old models completely transformed and polished and shiny - which I think looks ridiculous for what is an antique!
But sometimes a little cleaning makes it look a lot better - eg a bit of wire wool on the black bits around the joints - which is probably just hardened old oil and muck!
I can also understand the 'leave exactly as is' approach!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on July 01, 2019, 04:31:11 AM
This is one change I'm still not sure about.
Thanks a lot for the detailed reply!  :hatsoff:  It seems to be really hard to figure out this early evolution and it's extremely interesting to know your current perspective.

Quote
I haven't seen any sources for the 1909 date other than the "official" Victorinox timeline
Are you referring to the famous (attached) image? If so, it's not really clear to me that they ever said anything about moving to three visible rivets. The fact that the second officer's knife from the top has only three visible rivets may be a consequence of not considering it a significant detail. The thing that they do explicitly mention about 1909 (in the text accompanying the image as well is in their official chronology (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=75774.0;attach=356509)) is that this is the year when they started to inlay the Swiss shield on the fiber scales. This is something that they also say as part of telling their history outside chronology lists (in their 1984 book "The Knife and its History" as well as in the book by Derek Jackson (https://books.google.co.il/books?id=N5R2DwAAQBAJ&pg=PA40)).

The point is that there are certainly quite a lot of four rivets SAKs that have the inlaid Swiss shield, so the claim that they started inlaying it in 1909 actually supports the theory that the move to three visible rivets occurred somewhat later. Of course, as you pointed out, it's not clear how much weight one should give to anything that they say.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on July 01, 2019, 07:29:29 AM
I believe it to be a leather punch. Here's a closer detail of it along with a detail view of the hoof pick w/ file and drill tool.

(https://i.imgur.com/uL7u6Bh.jpg)

The interesting thing about it is that it's hollow - if you look at the end it's not a solid awl like we're all used to.
This tool was quite common on multiblade folding knives with many blades in the late 19th century, but I don't recall seeing it on any Victorinox SAK other than this model 290. I attach some images of an old 9-layer knife that has this tool. As can be seen from the image showing it along with a Swiss champ, it is quite small (80mm long). It's a very well made knife. Really impressive craftsmanship, but not nearly as impressive as what you can see in the following link:
http://www.waynedriskillminiatures.com/miniature-firearms/antique-joseph-rodgers-sons-of-sheffield-england-miniature-40-blade-exhibition-knife/
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on July 01, 2019, 11:21:22 AM
An interesting knife on eBay :
-1963 advertisement
- triangular awl
- aluminum small blade spacer
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F233275192707
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190701/ec7424a279a6c8547f9aeb106df655e3.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: wengercollector on July 01, 2019, 12:00:07 PM
There are many difficulties to date a knife. One important thing is, that often, there`s not a changing point where one new tool replace an old one. One exception is the can opener. But for the screwdriver/caplifter for example, the old one was used for a long time where the new one already was introduced. You also could order a knife with the old or the new tool. The same thing with the rivets. I know some knives from arount 1900 with only 3 rivets and I know knives with 4 rivets from arount 1915. For mop scales for example, they used alway only 3 visible rivets - 2 rivets on smaller, 75 mm knives. And Victorinox provided some knifemakers with tool/scale kits. Then it was up to the knifemaker if they want to build up a knife with 3 or 4 visible pins.

The same thing with the triangular awl. The new one was available since 1961. But I`m sure that any dealer could order still knives with the old triangular awl if they want so.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on July 01, 2019, 06:28:43 PM
An interesting knife on eBay :
-1963 advertisement
- triangular awl
- aluminum small blade spacer

I've posted this Tourist before with similar features and date stamp:

(https://i.imgur.com/e1Qmgem.jpg)

There are many difficulties to date a knife. One important thing is, that often, there`s not a changing point where one new tool replace an old one. One exception is the can opener. But for the screwdriver/caplifter for example, the old one was used for a long time where the new one already was introduced. You also could order a knife with the old or the new tool. The same thing with the rivets. I know some knives from arount 1900 with only 3 rivets and I know knives with 4 rivets from arount 1915. For mop scales for example, they used alway only 3 visible rivets - 2 rivets on smaller, 75 mm knives. And Victorinox provided some knifemakers with tool/scale kits. Then it was up to the knifemaker if they want to build up a knife with 3 or 4 visible pins.

Agree with all of this. Post WWII I think the best you can get is +/- a year or two. Pre WWII? Lots of bets are off. As an example, I've been collection for > 10 years and when I first started most people (myself included) thought that 1923 was the "changeover" year from carbon steel > stainless. In other words, if you found a carbon steel knife it was pre-23 and a stainless knife was post-23. Now, having looked at thousands of knife sales and different pieces of members collections, I know that Victorinox continued making carbon steel Officer's Knives well past 1923 - into the mid 1940s at least. So yeah, a stainless knife will date to 1923 at the earliest, but a carbon steel knife? You have to look at other features. For at least two decades you could order the same knife in either carbon or stainless steel (I'm guessing the former were cheaper).

Even info from Victorinox is incorrect in the face of observed knives. For example, they say that fiber scales end in 1937 and the cap lifter is introduced in 1942:

(https://i.imgur.com/2xc1hJL.png)

I have never - not once in over 10 years of doing this - seen an Officer's Knife in celuloid/celidor scales with a large screwdriver. I have, however, seen > 100 different fiber scaled knives with cap lifters. I personally own at least 20, including one dated to 1935. Personally, I gave up trying to date knives to specific years long, long ago. I group mine into categories based on a shared set of observable features (e.g. fiber scales + caplifter), give that category a name, and leave it at that. When I first started I thought that this aforementioned fiber/caplifter category was from 1937-1942. Now I suspect it actually is from 1931-1937. But the category itself and the features it's based on are still the same.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on July 01, 2019, 06:41:00 PM
Fiber scales with cap lifter, 1931 on scale
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190701/200168513e84181f93fe0015e641be80.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on July 01, 2019, 07:51:45 PM
Great looking knives for sure
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on July 01, 2019, 07:53:08 PM
Let's do some serious vintage - probably the favorite knife in my collection, the 1905 Model 290:

(https://i.imgur.com/XPGVccg.jpg)

It's quite large. Here is a comparison of the screwdriver between other models:

[pic removed for bad info - will repost later]
Now that is really cool and interesting knife!  :like: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on July 01, 2019, 08:59:46 PM
An interesting knife on eBay :
-1963 advertisement
- triangular awl
- aluminum small blade spacer
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F233275192707
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190701/ec7424a279a6c8547f9aeb106df655e3.jpg)

Was just gonna post the same. Perfect example of why you can't count on any advertising or non-main line knife for reliable end dates. Ditto for Hoffritz and Elinox lines.

There are also lots of catalog cuts that show both types of awls together on the same page.  I don't think it was a very hard transition, even for main line production.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on July 02, 2019, 04:17:51 AM
There are many difficulties to date a knife.
True, but this is what makes it fun.  :D

As I see it, there are actually two different questions here. One of them is the question of dating a concrete knife, which often cannot be done with much precision. In fact, I don't even know how to date a current Victorinox Huntsman, say, to any time window other than "post-2011." The other question is that of dating various evolution changes that occurred. This is something that, in principle, should be doable.

Over time, we do seem to make some progress as a community. The links at the top of the sticky MTO thread "SAK/Swisstool dating and identification resources" (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,75774.0.html) can take anyone to lots of information that would have been much harder to obtain just a few years ago. Sharing information can go a long way to increase our collective knowledge.

Quote
One important thing is, that often, there`s not a changing point where one new tool replace an old one.
True, most transitions take time and there are also other complexities, such as changes occurring at different times for different SAK models, but it shouldn't be beyond our ability to deal with such complexities.

Quote
But for the screwdriver/caplifter for example, the old one was used for a long time where the new one already was introduced. You also could order a knife with the old or the new tool.
Many thanks for this very interesting information. :hatsoff:  Can you explain how you know this? Also, do you have any estimates for the start and/or end of this long transition?

Quote
The same thing with the rivets. I know some knives from arount 1900 with only 3 rivets and I know knives with 4 rivets from arount 1915. For mop scales for example, they used alway only 3 visible rivets - 2 rivets on smaller, 75 mm knives.
I think that it is well understood that things were a bit different for special scales, etc. (the above shown model 290, for example, seems to have just one semi-visible rivet). For me, at least, the core question concerning the transition to three visible rivets is about officer knives with fiber scales. It's certainly possible that it was a long transition, but then it should have started at some point and ended on another and I'm very curious to know when.

Quote
And Victorinox provided some knifemakers with tool/scale kits. Then it was up to the knifemaker if they want to build up a knife with 3 or 4 visible pins.
This information about such hybrid production taking place is also very interesting. Can you explain how you know this? Thanks!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on July 02, 2019, 04:38:56 AM
Fiber scales with cap lifter, 1931 on scale
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190701/200168513e84181f93fe0015e641be80.jpg)
It's a very interesting knife!   :like:  Do have more pictures of it? If so, it would be great if you post them as well.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on July 02, 2019, 06:07:02 AM
It's a very interesting knife!   :like:  Do have more pictures of it? If so, it would be great if you post them as well.
It is not my knife to my regret, here are all pictures I have.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190702/e09c9d2c71c5c0159236fe420d4d85fc.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190702/ac7367c065b71e559ebfc9db8914ab17.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190702/549ce662920e7ea5a0f4783d93a985ec.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on July 02, 2019, 07:13:36 PM
It is not my knife to my regret, here are all pictures I have.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190702/e09c9d2c71c5c0159236fe420d4d85fc.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190702/ac7367c065b71e559ebfc9db8914ab17.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190702/549ce662920e7ea5a0f4783d93a985ec.jpg)
Thanks!  :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on July 05, 2019, 10:32:29 PM
Thanks!  :salute:
You are welcome ;)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on July 10, 2019, 01:48:18 PM
Can you help me with dating this 242 kU? No Victorinox shield on scales, steel liners, rivets and small blade spacer, nickel silver bail, back spring thickness decreases from one side to another. It has some imperfection in the form of a protruding spring with the main blade open.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190710/7be382b13034368cef4578756054a1c6.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Ivo on July 10, 2019, 05:04:04 PM
My latest WENGER  :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on July 11, 2019, 02:17:26 PM
Can you help me with dating this 242 kU? No Victorinox shield on scales, steel liners, rivets and small blade spacer, nickel silver bail, back spring thickness decreases from one side to another. It has some imperfection in the form of a protruding spring with the main blade open.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190710/7be382b13034368cef4578756054a1c6.jpg)
Interesting knife, Jnoxyd!  :like: I hope that someone will indeed be able to shed some light on it. It may help if you could clarify the following:
Thanks!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: wengercollector on July 11, 2019, 04:21:50 PM
Can you help me with dating this 242 kU? No Victorinox shield on scales, steel liners, rivets and small blade spacer, nickel silver bail, back spring thickness decreases from one side to another. It has some imperfection in the form of a protruding spring with the main blade open.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190710/7be382b13034368cef4578756054a1c6.jpg)

For me this knife looks a bit strange. The mainblade is original, thats for sure.
But the scales, shackle, liners, pins not. Thats my opinion. If you compare the knife with the picture of the shown No 242k, you can see that the pin on the feet of the knife is more in the middle, where the original is more left; the middle pin is far more down to the feet.

I think long time ago, someone brought the knife to a knifemaker for repair because of a broken mainblade. He changed it and used a blade he had, a Victoria blade. Such things were pretty common those days. Because everything was handmade and hand adjusted, so no problem for a knifemaker. The blade is from around 1910, so really old.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on July 12, 2019, 04:47:52 PM
Interesting knife, Jnoxyd!  :like: I hope that someone will indeed be able to shed some light on it. It may help if you could clarify the following:
  • Are the blades and spring made of carbon steel?
  • What type of steel (carbon/stainless) are the liners, rivets and small blade spacer made of?
  • What material are the scales made of?
Thanks!
Hi, MiniChamp. Blades, liners, rivets and spacer all are made of carbon steel, scales are from very good quality fiber. Riveting is really professional, it looks like factory made.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on July 12, 2019, 04:54:00 PM
For me this knife looks a bit strange. The mainblade is original, thats for sure.
But the scales, shackle, liners, pins not. Thats my opinion. If you compare the knife with the picture of the shown No 242k, you can see that the pin on the feet of the knife is more in the middle, where the original is more left; the middle pin is far more down to the feet.

I think long time ago, someone brought the knife to a knifemaker for repair because of a broken mainblade. He changed it and used a blade he had, a Victoria blade. Such things were pretty common those days. Because everything was handmade and hand adjusted, so no problem for a knifemaker. The blade is from around 1910, so really old.
Thanks for the answer, Wengercollector. I think you are right, it looks like this is what you said, it explains the protruding spring.
I just would like to compare this knife with another 84mm from this time period (my picture above is from late 1940s catalog)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: cody6268 on July 13, 2019, 03:37:43 AM
I already had to use this photo on another board, to help a guy ID his knife.

Mid 1970s Craftsman. Couple years back, I went on a camping trip. SInce the Craftsman was in really rough shape, I put it in my tackle box, and a Fireman on my belt. Ended up carrying and using the Craftsman, gave the Fireman's sheath away (it was a 1980s Browning sheath, to which my friend owned the knife; but his sheath had been lost years ago), and kept the Fireman in my bag.   

The problems: saw is bent; scale tools are non original (came from Artisan Vic repaired), and the scissors rub badly against the liners. Vic will straighten it out and make this knife better to use, I'm sure.

(https://i.imgur.com/tGn5sQs.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/V8cEHM0.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on July 13, 2019, 05:06:53 AM
Hi, MiniChamp. Blades, liners, rivets and spacer all are made of carbon steel, scales are from very good quality fiber. Riveting is really professional, it looks like factory made.
Thanks for the info, Jnoxyd!  :hatsoff:

I just would like to compare this knife with another 84mm from this time period (my picture above is from late 1940s catalog)
I'm not sure what information you are looking for, but I looked at the three fiber-scaled tourists in the attached image, which I believe to be from the relevant time period. I tend to believe that the one on the right is from the 1910's, the one on the center from the 1920's and the one on the left from the 1930's.

The thickness of the springs on such SAKs cannot be measured precisely like on your knife, but I tried to estimate it by placing a caliper very close to the springs. As far as I can tell, the dimensions of the blades layer spring are roughly the same on all three. The thickness of the thinner side of the spring seems to be about 2.3mm (like on your knife), while the thickness of thicker side seems to be about 3.3mm, namely, a little more than on your knife.

The liners and spacers of all three are made of brass, as are the rivets of the (stainless steel) tourist on the center. The rivets of the other two tourists are made of carbon steel (like their blades and springs).

I don't know if such a comparison is what you had in mind or that you were looking to compare with a model 242k, but I should point out that I don't know if Victorinox made model 242k SAKs at any time before the 1940's. The earliest known catalog that has the model 242k (or any corkscrew-less officer's knife for that matter) is the late-1940's catalog from which you took the image and while I did indeed see such model 242k SAKs from the late 1940's, I don't recall seeing earlier ones.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on July 13, 2019, 11:00:21 AM
Thank you very much, MiniChamp! Nice knives, especially right one ;) As Wengercollector said rivets layout on my knife is different from your original Elsener made ones and scales are another shape too. (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190713/c4be3e79be35d8f11faa7420a2d293d9.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on July 29, 2019, 10:59:42 PM
Victoria Huntsman
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on July 29, 2019, 11:16:40 PM
Beautiful!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on July 29, 2019, 11:24:56 PM
Thanks Barry...
In my book all the ones (horn, pearl, celidor, fiber etc.) with exposed rivets are simply  :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on July 29, 2019, 11:37:04 PM
:
Thanks Barry...
In my book all the ones (horn, pearl, celidor, fiber etc.) with exposed rivets are simply  :drool:
  :iagree:   :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on July 30, 2019, 03:43:14 AM
Victoria Huntsman

Nice horn scales M0rkoni!  :like:

Looks like late 60's to '71 to me...Does anybody know when horn scales stopped getting exposed rivets?

My latest exposed rivet horn scale is also '68 to pre- '71.5 +PAT and my earliest hidden rivet is c. late'76/early '77.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on August 07, 2019, 06:04:43 PM
VICTORIA Execitive
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on August 07, 2019, 06:15:31 PM
Sweet!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on August 07, 2019, 06:17:43 PM
Sweet!

Thanks buddy!  :salute:

I know that you are a big fun of the horn ones, me too...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on August 07, 2019, 07:21:46 PM
Victoria Huntsman
:dd: beautiful for sure!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on August 07, 2019, 07:23:00 PM
VICTORIA Execitive
:dd: and another! Very nice.  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on August 08, 2019, 06:11:36 AM
VICTORIA Execitive

 :like:

Wish I had one like that or with the fine serrations on the peeler.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on August 17, 2019, 01:28:52 AM
Added this older Golfer today. 
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48554703721_9d0b1c1764.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 17, 2019, 06:20:01 AM
Added this older Golfer today. 
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48554703721_9d0b1c1764.jpg)
Very nice FB!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on August 17, 2019, 07:37:45 AM
Added this older Golfer today. 
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48554703721_9d0b1c1764.jpg)

 :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on August 17, 2019, 03:23:02 PM
Thank you jnoxyd and M0rkoni.  :cheers: 
I wish it had the original box, but sometimes I have to buy something that I don't have in my collection and hope for a boxed one to come along later.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on August 17, 2019, 07:03:24 PM
Added this older Golfer today. 


Great find FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VoetSak on August 17, 2019, 11:54:34 PM
Couple of recent finds.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on August 18, 2019, 01:31:21 AM
Great find FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Thank you Vicman!  :cheers:

Couple of recent finds.
:like: :drool: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on August 18, 2019, 02:21:08 AM
Lovely finds FB and VS - Especially that old Golfer - ARMEE SUISSE - Yay

Hey did anyone notice/know that the accent goes the wrong way on the E.

Very interesting lettering/logos on both SAKs
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on August 21, 2019, 05:39:53 PM
Lovely finds FB and VS - Especially that old Golfer - ARMEE SUISSE - Yay
Thank you Huntsman!  :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Boonies on August 21, 2019, 09:00:22 PM
Added this older Golfer today. 
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48554703721_9d0b1c1764.jpg)

Be happy to help you clean up your collection if you decide that old ad knife doesn’t fit 😈.       👍👍👍👍👍
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Boonies on August 21, 2019, 09:02:46 PM
Couple of recent finds.

Exposed rivets and old style awls....yummmmm!        👍👍👍👍👍
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on August 22, 2019, 03:02:27 AM
Be happy to help you clean up your collection if you decide that old ad knife doesn’t fit 😈.       👍👍👍👍👍
If a mint-in-box one comes along, you'll have first dibs!  It actually arrived just today, it's very nice for its age.  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Boonies on August 22, 2019, 07:25:41 PM
Ok, I’m holding my breath 🤪🤪🤪.......
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on August 25, 2019, 03:45:34 PM
Added this older Wenger:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48612255887_fd23f7e75b.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: cody6268 on August 25, 2019, 03:50:43 PM
Added this older Wenger:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48612255887_fd23f7e75b.jpg)

And it's in remarkable shape for its age! I really need to get an older piece in that good a shape myself. Pretty much everything pre-1980s I own looks like heck.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on August 25, 2019, 03:52:39 PM
And it's in remarkable shape for its age! I really need to get an older piece in that good a shape myself. Pretty much everything pre-1980s I own looks like heck.
Apparently the other side has some marks on the scales, but that didn't stop me from wanting it.  It seemed to be in pretty good shape, I agree.  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 26, 2019, 05:58:18 PM
It looks like Victorinox started using new tools a bit earlier than 1952. What do you think?(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190826/b1a8bff14fd190e45fed7ea55a593fe1.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on August 26, 2019, 06:16:39 PM
It looks like Victorinox started using new tools a bit earlier than 1952. What do you think?

So the big question here is "officially" the fish scaler comes out in 1952 with the rest of the big changes to the 91mm line. In actuality, we see the fish scaler come out in several models BEFORE the big 1952 changes and show up in the 1946-1951 Post War era knives. I have several of these and seen many more, and they are always knives from the end of the post war era, so my guess is that they were made late in the era (say 1950-1951) just looking at the tang stamps (always Armee Suisee/VaSS), how the knives are assembled, and how the parts are made. They could have been made early in the early vintage era (1952-1958) from left over parts, but this seems less likely - the post war fish scaler is slightly different in design from the early vintage scaler, so it's not just a case of "hey, let's cram this new fish scaler tool into the old knives".

I've seen four models from this era - the Angler (like this), Angler Jr (no scissors), Angler Solo (literally just a fish scaler), and Angler Plus (this but adds woodsaw). The latter is, AFAIK, the first 5 layer knife they made. The Angler variant is fairly unusual but shows up the most. The Angler Jr., Angler Solo, and Angler Plus models are very hard to find.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on September 02, 2019, 05:14:24 PM
I have this one coming, a 1908 version of the Soldier.  No date stamp on the back.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48665272318_5b3eaa36b1.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on September 02, 2019, 05:45:49 PM
I have this one coming, a 1908 version of the Soldier.  No date stamp on the back.


That is beautiful FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on September 02, 2019, 08:14:51 PM
I have this one coming, a 1908 version of the Soldier.  No date stamp on the back.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48665272318_5b3eaa36b1.jpg)
  :like:   :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on September 03, 2019, 01:05:47 AM
So the big question here is "officially" the fish scaler comes out in 1952 with the rest of the big changes to the 91mm line. In actuality, we see the fish scaler come out in several models BEFORE the big 1952 changes and show up in the 1946-1951 Post War era knives. I have several of these and seen many more, and they are always knives from the end of the post war era, so my guess is that they were made late in the era (say 1950-1951) just looking at the tang stamps (always Armee Suisee/VaSS), how the knives are assembled, and how the parts are made.
I think that's the strongest argument for it being in your late pwar era.  'Construction details' seem to make a very sharp transition in 91mm knives.

They could have been made early in the early vintage era (1952-1958) from left over parts, but this seems less likely - the post war fish scaler is slightly different in design from the early vintage scaler, so it's not just a case of "hey, let's cram this new fish scaler tool into the old knives".
I think if jnoxyd's knife was assembled c. '52 or later that it would likely have aluminum liners and 2.5mm pins on both ends, etc.


I've seen four models from this era - the Angler (like this), Angler Jr (no scissors), Angler Solo (literally just a fish scaler), and Angler Plus (this but adds woodsaw). The latter is, AFAIK, the first 5 layer knife they made. The Angler variant is fairly unusual but shows up the most. The Angler Jr., Angler Solo, and Angler Plus models are very hard to find.
. Would be interesting to see these together.  I gotta wonder what would be on the box of the solo.  Just 'f'? Something different like 70xxf?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on September 03, 2019, 01:11:06 AM
That is beautiful FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
  :like:   :tu:
Thank you Vicman and TonySal!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on September 03, 2019, 02:12:07 AM
I have this one coming, a 1908 version of the Soldier.  No date stamp on the back.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48665272318_5b3eaa36b1.jpg)
Very nice  :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on September 03, 2019, 07:53:39 PM
I think if jnoxyd's knife was assembled c. '52 or later that it would likely have aluminum liners and 2.5mm pins on both ends, etc.
What I meant was they assembled post 52 with leftover pre-52 parts - so old NS liners, etc. So chronologically the scaler was introduced in 1952, but at first in the old knives as they used up old stock. This is, IMO, a (slightly) possible but (extremely) not plausible theory. Much more likely they introduced the scaler in 1950(ish), and the official timeline from Victorinox is wrong (not for the first time).

I gotta wonder what would be on the box of the solo.  Just 'f'? Something different like 70xxf?

My suspicion is that it doesn't really have a model number in that it was never something made for sale. More likely a factory demo model for showing of the then-new fish scaler tool. Make a couple at the factory, give them to sales reps to show off, take orders for the 234fU, 235faU, and 236faU. Not dissimilar from the "Huntsman with backspring fine screwdriver" they made in the 80s/90s for display purposes.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on September 04, 2019, 06:31:40 AM
Not dissimilar from the "Huntsman with backspring fine screwdriver" they made in the 80s/90s for display purposes.

Mine has the chisel instead of the fine screwdriver. Is that a different model?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on September 05, 2019, 05:19:58 PM
Mine has the chisel instead of the fine screwdriver. Is that a different model?

Nope - that's the one I was thinking of. I looked at a pic real quick and thought "oh yeah, fine screwdriver" - you know, the older one that looks like the chisel.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on September 05, 2019, 05:40:45 PM
Understood :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on September 06, 2019, 02:30:38 AM
I think  :think: this might be my first Pat. Pend. SAK
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48685415938_9195867e05.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on September 06, 2019, 02:32:42 AM
Nice! Armee Suisse, Hoffritz or Victoria tang stamp?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on September 06, 2019, 02:57:09 AM
Nice! Armee Suisse, Hoffritz or Victoria tang stamp?
Thank you JB!  It is Victoria tang stamp.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on September 06, 2019, 03:35:54 AM
I think  :think: this might be my first Pat. Pend. SAK


Very cool FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on September 09, 2019, 07:26:25 AM
Added this older Wenger:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48612255887_fd23f7e75b.jpg)
:like: :like: :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Boonies on September 10, 2019, 03:20:28 AM
Filled another of the remaining holes in the 84mm “accumulation”, all the way from Switzerland.  I think I read that the seller is a member of this forum but not sure.  Small Climber, long nail file.....so good 😛.         :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on September 10, 2019, 03:55:14 AM
Filled another of the remaining holes in the 84mm “accumulation”, all the way from Switzerland.  I think I read that the seller is a member of this forum but not sure.  Small Climber, long nail file.....so good 😛.         :cheers:
The long nail file...another SAK that is on my list! Enjoy  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on September 11, 2019, 03:47:06 AM
Filled another of the remaining holes in the 84mm “accumulation”, all the way from Switzerland.  I think I read that the seller is a member of this forum but not sure.  Small Climber, long nail file.....so good 😛.         :cheers:
:tu: :tu: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TXSAK on September 11, 2019, 03:57:18 AM
All these vintage SAK's look great!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on September 11, 2019, 02:41:32 PM
Filled another of the remaining holes in the 84mm “accumulation”, all the way from Switzerland.  I think I read that the seller is a member of this forum but not sure.  Small Climber, long nail file.....so good 😛.         :cheers:

Nice find Boonies! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on September 11, 2019, 04:40:03 PM
No-nick metal file on Motorist. It was mentioned by Jazzbass recently as “short lived prod change”  ;)
I like this “tip opening” for metal file.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190911/35021806b50c0a02065f664e4e784a2c.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190911/674ddac1034bbac78188bd0ed8143726.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190911/5e217a13db44a5a89c314bfa95a43531.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190911/3689f5f7a17b64be606cc8379dbc6d78.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Boonies on September 11, 2019, 07:11:54 PM
No-nick metal file on Motorist. It was mentioned by Jazzbass recently as “short lived prod change”  ;)
I like this “tip opening” for metal file.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190911/35021806b50c0a02065f664e4e784a2c.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190911/674ddac1034bbac78188bd0ed8143726.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190911/5e217a13db44a5a89c314bfa95a43531.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190911/3689f5f7a17b64be606cc8379dbc6d78.jpg)

Works well on the 84mm, wonder why they changed to the nail nick?  Very nice 👍👍👍.           :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on September 11, 2019, 09:22:03 PM
Very nice jnoxyd  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Boonies on September 11, 2019, 10:20:03 PM
Thanks Rr, Tony and Vicman......I get sidetracked sometimes (way too often) but the 84mm are what I really enjoy.   :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on September 18, 2019, 09:58:56 PM
No-nick metal file on Motorist. It was mentioned by Jazzbass recently as “short lived prod change”  ;)
I like this “tip opening” for metal file.

I love that file. No idea why Victorinox didn't like it, but it didn't last very long. The interesting thing about these are it seems like Victorinox experimented with the design around 1960/61 on "Victoria" line knives (I have this file in a couple large awl Champions and blue Fischermesser), decided they weren't fans of the design, and said "nope, go back to the old design" What do we do with the unused files we have here? "[shrug] use them in the Elinox line". The only post 62 "small awl" knives I've ever seen with these are Elinox knives - I have a couple Motorists just like this with the same - but I've yet to see a "small awl" Victoria knife with it.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on September 21, 2019, 10:31:26 PM
One of my latest, I think it is an older Tourist.  Victoria on back tang.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48771295891_b84a38cce7.jpg)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48770961743_2e47134a86.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on September 21, 2019, 11:43:32 PM
One of my latest, I think it is an older Tourist.  Victoria on back tang.


Very nice FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on September 22, 2019, 03:01:26 AM
One of my latest, I think it is an older Tourist.  Victoria on back tang.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48771295891_b84a38cce7.jpg)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48770961743_2e47134a86.jpg)
Very nice  :like: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on September 22, 2019, 03:11:03 AM
Thank you Vicman and RR!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on September 22, 2019, 07:21:26 AM
That's a real beauty FB!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on October 04, 2019, 08:45:12 PM
What do you think about blank main blade stamp on 1950s knives? This Huntsman LNF has VSS front side stamp and blank back one. Wood saw has 27 teeth and nail nick.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191004/9ddb94c7d9ba4b147db77608e4ac5a5d.jpg)
Here's it together with other 1950s knives.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191004/3dfd518921265caa3c6bc42d2ac87a31.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191004/de95edaaf549d8e6f69e42a3780dc571.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on October 04, 2019, 09:01:55 PM
Thats a great Huntsman!  :drool: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on October 04, 2019, 09:04:46 PM
What do you think about blank main blade stamp on 1950s knives? This Huntsman LNF has VSS front side stamp and blank back one. Wood saw has 27 teeth and nail nick.

Seems to be a short-lived stamp used either concurrently with the early Armee Suisse models or in a short transition time between the "Armee Suisse/VaSS" stamps and the "VSS/VO" stamps. Definitely the shortest lived and hardest to find of the stamps in this era. I personally think they're a transition stamp as you do see some with the "US PAT PEND" can opener. Dates the knife to the beginning of the early vintage era, say 1953 or so.

The progression of stamps in the early vintage (EVNT) era from 1951-1957 seems to go:

1. Armee Suisse/Victoria Switzerland Stainless
2. Victoria Switzerland Stainless
3. [Large] Victorinox Switzerland Stainless/Victoria Officier
4. [Small] Victorinox Switzerland Stainless/Victoria Officier
5. Victorinox Switzerland Stainless Rostfrei/Victoria Officier Suisse

Stamps #3 and #4 make of the bulk of the knives from this era. #5 is really the stamp they started using with the mid-vintage hidden rivet knives in 1957/58, with a bit of over lap in both directions.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on October 05, 2019, 12:17:49 AM
What do you think about blank main blade stamp on 1950s knives? This Huntsman LNF has VSS front side stamp and blank back one. Wood saw has 27 teeth and nail nick.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191004/9ddb94c7d9ba4b147db77608e4ac5a5d.jpg)
Here's it together with other 1950s knives.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191004/3dfd518921265caa3c6bc42d2ac87a31.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191004/de95edaaf549d8e6f69e42a3780dc571.jpg)

My guess is that it *has to* be '53+ with the +PAT opener and VaSS tang. Presumably after the patent was granted in Feb. '53.

It does make me wonder if this knife that MiniChamp posted in your US.PAT. PEND (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,77840.msg1792185.html#msg1792185) thread is fake or just consuming old parts in an advertising knife built mid-'50s.

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/UDIAAOSwv5xbulbI/s-l1600.jpg)

I am wondering how the machining on your Huntsman's can opener compares to the US.PAT.PEND versions...or any other 'construction' similarities they might have.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on October 05, 2019, 04:51:37 AM
What do you think about blank main blade stamp on 1950s knives? This Huntsman LNF has VSS front side stamp and blank back one. Wood saw has 27 teeth and nail nick.

Seems to be a short-lived stamp used either concurrently with the early Armee Suisse models or in a short transition time between the "Armee Suisse/VaSS" stamps and the "VSS/VO" stamps. Definitely the shortest lived and hardest to find of the stamps in this era. I personally think they're a transition stamp as you do see some with the "US PAT PEND" can opener. Dates the knife to the beginning of the early vintage era, say 1953 or so.
I'm a little confused here.  :think:  I have seen this stamp on earlier SAKs. The earliest being a fiber-scaled SAK that was shown by Jnoxyd (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,76257.msg1735073.html#msg1735073) in the "Evolution of wood saws" thread (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,76257.0.html). (It's the second from the top in the following two images; more images of it can be seen in the original posts by Jnoxyd (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,76257.msg1735073.html#msg1735073).)

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180823/5ef9ffabcc5dedf5cc5bc9b858af8514.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180823/b0d5e24771f045ec9d9ab09d0b2c94a7.jpg)

It also occurs on SAKs with the crab-claw can opener. The attached images show two such SAKs (they are from internet sales; the first two show one such SAK and the last two show another).

Quote
The progression of stamps in the early vintage (EVNT) era from 1951-1957 seems to go:

1. Armee Suisse/Victoria Switzerland Stainless
2. Victoria Switzerland Stainless
3. [Large] Victorinox Switzerland Stainless/Victoria Officier
4. [Small] Victorinox Switzerland Stainless/Victoria Officier
5. Victorinox Switzerland Stainless Rostfrei/Victoria Officier Suisse

Stamps #3 and #4 make of the bulk of the knives from this era. #5 is really the stamp they started using with the mid-vintage hidden rivet knives in 1957/58, with a bit of over lap in both directions.
Interesting. Can you explain what are the differences between #3 and #4? Thanks!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on October 05, 2019, 07:11:01 AM
I'm a little confused here.  :think:  I have seen this stamp on earlier SAKs.

Oh yeah, it's definitely used on earlier knives too. For this thread I was really just addressing when it shows up in the early vintage 1951-1957 knives.

The earliest being a fiber-scaled SAK that was shown by Jnoxyd (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,76257.msg1735073.html#msg1735073) in the "Evolution of wood saws" thread (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,76257.0.html). (It's the second from the top in the following two images; more images of it can be seen in the original posts by Jnoxyd (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,76257.msg1735073.html#msg1735073).)

It also occurs on SAKs with the crab-claw can opener.

Yes, you do see this stamp used a bit in the post war era knives from 1946-1951. Actually more often than EVNT knives. The fiber scale knife I suspect is a repair using a blade from the late 40s. By all accounts, the "VaSS" on the front of these two different runs - the ones from the PWAR era and the ones from the EVNT era - are simply the regular VaSS stamping typically done on the back of the tang done on the front. If you figure that most of this work was done by hand at the time, it would have been pretty easy to do. Why'd they do it? That's all speculation as far as I know. There are enough of these in both eras that you think it's not an accident. Maybe the VaSS blades were repair blades and these are all repair jobs? Maybe they were made for a specific market? Honestly I have no idea why they were made this way.

Interesting. Can you explain what are the differences between #3 and #4? Thanks!

How about a picture - Large VxSS/VO on top, two versions of the Small VxSS/VO on bottom. The front stamp of the large VxSS is stamped in a sans-serif font and the VO on the back is quite large - usually the bottom of "Officier" is cut off. While putting this image together I discovered that the Small VxSS stamping comes in two varieties: Small Type I where the front VxSS uses a much more precise serif font for the VxSS, and Small Type II that uses a smaller, less precise sans-serif font for the VxSS. Both versions appear to use the same smaller, more precise VO stamp on the back that is not cut off when the blade is open. (Note that the VO stamp in the lower left looks cut off in the picture but that is just the perspective)

(https://i.imgur.com/OXJB5PB.jpg)

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on October 05, 2019, 08:49:02 AM
For this thread I was really just addressing when it shows up in the early vintage 1951-1957 knives.
Thanks for clarifying that.

Quote
The fiber scale knife I suspect is a repair using a blade from the late 40s.
I was actually hoping for you saying something like that because the wood saw on this knife also looks like one from the end of the PWAR era. It certainly simplifies life to consider it to be a repair job that mixes parts from different periods (something that I also suspected before). On the other hand, the range of years that is assigned to the VaSS stamp in Ulli's table (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,50014.60.html#att306974) is 1930-1950, so I can't help wondering if he didn't have a good reason to think that this stamp was used long before the late 1940's.

Quote
How about a picture - Large VxSS/VO on top, two versions of the Small VxSS/VO on bottom.
Thanks!!! I didn't know that these variations could be used for dating. Now I have some homework.  :D
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on October 05, 2019, 09:19:50 AM
Quote
kamakiri  :
I am wondering how the machining on your Huntsman's can opener compares to the US.PAT.PEND versions...or any other 'construction' similarities they might have.
It  looks very close to previous and past can openers just a bit less polished:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191005/fca0b8e7fff07c944a308150d3ef1886.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191005/11afed8a92b6533a5aee0c24db69cc97.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on October 05, 2019, 11:06:48 AM
Another blank stamp I have  is from late 1940s(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191005/90e390df4391740e8ee1281ccd727d7d.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191005/adb5b932810300ab207dc37c2c43438c.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on October 05, 2019, 07:42:38 PM
It  looks very close to previous and past can openers just a bit less polished:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191005/fca0b8e7fff07c944a308150d3ef1886.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191005/11afed8a92b6533a5aee0c24db69cc97.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191005/fca0b8e7fff07c944a308150d3ef1886.jpg)

 :cheers: Thanks for the pictures jnoxyd.  The +PAT stamp is probably the most definitive part of the can opener.  It is certainly of the first variation that I'd call v1a +PAT which is distinctive in font proportions, but I'd also make the subjective assignment of being early in the tooling cycle. I'd assign it '53 production unless something shows up that looks like it's produced earlier. 

The +PAT example on the right matches other mid-'50s knives that I have and have pictures of. It's the same font as the knife in question, but there are some subtle tooling updates that I think are pretty clear and very visible in your pic. I'd call these v1b.

I don't have a changeover date stipulated for v2 +PAT stamps but it's on all the '57+ knives I own.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on October 05, 2019, 09:19:15 PM
I don't have a changeover date stipulated for v2 +PAT stamps but it's on all the '57+ knives I own.

Pretty much right at 1957, although there is the typical "random old/new part in a new/old knife" thing going on.

Here's how I look at it. Lots of changes happen in the transition from the early vintage period knives (EVNT: new openers, exposed rivets, 1951-1957) and the mid vintage period (MVNT: large awl, hidden rivets, 1957-1961). The typical EVNT knife from the latter part of the period look like this Huntsman - Small VSS/VO main stamp, large +PAT:

(https://i.imgur.com/uu3zTVb.jpg)

Then we switch to the MVNT period in 1957, where the typical knife from the early part of this period looks like this Huntsman - large awl, hidden rivets, large VSSR/VOS stamp on unpolished tang, and small +PAT.

(https://i.imgur.com/8xE0PGY.jpg)

Statistically speaking, all of these changes seem to happen around the same time because the majority (80%+) of knives from these periods look like these two. However, because this is a production factory and not a mint or anything like that, production overalaps do occur.

This is the first and probably most common one you see - EVNT knife with a typical MVNT main blade stamp. On all the knives I have and have seen in this configuration, the can opener is always a large +PAT:

(https://i.imgur.com/3aX2vzV.jpg)

Next, you do see a fair number of MVNT knives with the small VSS/VO stamped main blades. The majority of this variant (about 75%) also have the large +PAT can opener, like this Master Craftsman:

(https://i.imgur.com/gVxz2J8.jpg)

However, there are a small minority of knives that have the small +PAT in the MVNT knife with the older VSS/VO stamp, like this Climber Small:

(https://i.imgur.com/poQrUJA.jpg)

My assertion has always been that these changed happened more-or-less at the same time, with some of the usual variations at transition time as old parts were used up. All of the MVNT knives above with older main blade/can openers are from very early in the MVNT period judging byt other design factors (the pen blade separator, the saws on the certain models, and the main blade backspring).
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on October 06, 2019, 12:02:22 AM
Here is one more SAK with the VaSS/blank stamp. A somewhat unusual Artisan. It has two (anodized) aluminum liners and three nickel-silver liners. Also, the can opener has no stamp.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on October 06, 2019, 12:08:25 AM
Here is one more SAK with the VaSS/blank stamp. A somewhat unusual Artisan. It has two (anodized) aluminum liners and three nickel-silver liners. Also, the can opener has no stamp.

Nice. I have pretty much that same knife (mixed up liners and everything). Mine has the US PAT PEND can opener.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on October 06, 2019, 12:49:56 AM
Nice. I have pretty much that same knife (mixed up liners and everything). Mine has the US PAT PEND can opener.
Interesting. I keep wondering if the lack of a stamp on my can opener is a singular production error or that maybe they made some of these can openers without any stamp before they even made them with the US PAT PEND stamp. Since there are US PAT PEND can openers on SAKs with all nickel-silver liners, I tend to believe that a production error is more likely.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on October 06, 2019, 04:44:47 AM
Pretty much right at 1957, although there is the typical "random old/new part in a new/old knife" thing going on.

Here's how I look at it. Lots of changes happen in the transition from the early vintage period knives (EVNT: new openers, exposed rivets, 1951-1957) and the mid vintage period (MVNT: large awl, hidden rivets, 1957-1961). The typical EVNT knife from the latter part of the period look like this Huntsman - Small VSS/VO main stamp, large +PAT:

(https://i.imgur.com/uu3zTVb.jpg)

Then we switch to the MVNT period in 1957, where the typical knife from the early part of this period looks like this Huntsman - large awl, hidden rivets, large VSSR/VOS stamp on unpolished tang, and small +PAT.

(https://i.imgur.com/8xE0PGY.jpg)

Statistically speaking, all of these changes seem to happen around the same time because the majority (80%+) of knives from these periods look like these two. However, because this is a production factory and not a mint or anything like that, production overalaps do occur.

This is the first and probably most common one you see - EVNT knife with a typical MVNT main blade stamp. On all the knives I have and have seen in this configuration, the can opener is always a large +PAT:

(https://i.imgur.com/3aX2vzV.jpg)

Next, you do see a fair number of MVNT knives with the small VSS/VO stamped main blades. The majority of this variant (about 75%) also have the large +PAT can opener, like this Master Craftsman:

(https://i.imgur.com/gVxz2J8.jpg)

However, there are a small minority of knives that have the small +PAT in the MVNT knife with the older VSS/VO stamp, like this Climber Small:

(https://i.imgur.com/poQrUJA.jpg)

My assertion has always been that these changed happened more-or-less at the same time, with some of the usual variations at transition time as old parts were used up. All of the MVNT knives above with older main blade/can openers are from very early in the MVNT period judging byt other design factors (the pen blade separator, the saws on the certain models, and the main blade backspring).
Those are some nice SAK, especially that 56...my birth year!  :woohoo:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on October 06, 2019, 06:17:22 PM
Pretty much right at 1957, although there is the typical "random old/new part in a new/old knife" thing going on.

Here's how I look at it. Lots of changes happen in the transition from the early vintage period knives (EVNT: new openers, exposed rivets, 1951-1957) and the mid vintage period (MVNT: large awl, hidden rivets, 1957-1961). The typical EVNT knife from the latter part of the period look like this Huntsman - Small VSS/VO main stamp, large +PAT:

(https://i.imgur.com/uu3zTVb.jpg)

Then we switch to the MVNT period in 1957, where the typical knife from the early part of this period looks like this Huntsman - large awl, hidden rivets, large VSSR/VOS stamp on unpolished tang, and small +PAT.

(https://i.imgur.com/8xE0PGY.jpg)

Statistically speaking, all of these changes seem to happen around the same time because the majority (80%+) of knives from these periods look like these two. However, because this is a production factory and not a mint or anything like that, production overalaps do occur.

This is the first and probably most common one you see - EVNT knife with a typical MVNT main blade stamp. On all the knives I have and have seen in this configuration, the can opener is always a large +PAT:

(https://i.imgur.com/3aX2vzV.jpg)

Next, you do see a fair number of MVNT knives with the small VSS/VO stamped main blades. The majority of this variant (about 75%) also have the large +PAT can opener, like this Master Craftsman:

(https://i.imgur.com/gVxz2J8.jpg)

However, there are a small minority of knives that have the small +PAT in the MVNT knife with the older VSS/VO stamp, like this Climber Small:

(https://i.imgur.com/poQrUJA.jpg)

My assertion has always been that these changed happened more-or-less at the same time, with some of the usual variations at transition time as old parts were used up. All of the MVNT knives above with older main blade/can openers are from very early in the MVNT period judging byt other design factors (the pen blade separator, the saws on the certain models, and the main blade backspring).
Thanks for the response and excellent level of detail and documentation, jazzbass!  This is the kind of info that should be in the SAKWiki...or in a book.  ;)  :tu:  :cheers: I'll certainly be referring to it.

Here is one more SAK with the VaSS/blank stamp. A somewhat unusual Artisan. It has two (anodized) aluminum liners and three nickel-silver liners. Also, the can opener has no stamp.
:like:
Thanks for sharing the pic MiniChamp!  :tu:  You mentioned this knife in previous discussions and it's nice to see it.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on October 06, 2019, 06:25:09 PM
Is this one considered large +PAT or small?
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48853625161_c037cffabe.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on October 06, 2019, 09:01:28 PM
Is this one considered large +PAT or small?
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48853625161_c037cffabe.jpg)

Looks like 'Large' or v1b.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on October 06, 2019, 10:08:24 PM
Interesting. I keep wondering if the lack of a stamp on my can opener is a singular production error or that maybe they made some of these can openers without any stamp before they even made them with the US PAT PEND stamp. Since there are US PAT PEND can openers on SAKs with all nickel-silver liners, I tend to believe that a production error is more likely.

I agree. I'd say the explanation was, from most likely to least likely:

1. Production error; the opener never got stamped in production
2. Production defect; the opener was stamped but lightly and the stamping was polished off
3. The can opener was replaced during a repair after 1971.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on October 06, 2019, 10:49:06 PM
I think it's probably an error.  I doubt they'd issue a single one on purpose without either stamp during that time.

OOPS! - SAK Production Errors (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,82832.0.html)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48790750103_1ebd72ef42.jpg)

This picture also proves that the tool is stamped separately from markings and that such errors are possible.  Wether loading was by hand or automatically fed from a hopper, errors like this would be common.  I think it's just a matter of QC for how many get through to assembly stations and ultimately end up leaving the factory.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on October 07, 2019, 01:44:22 AM
Really great information and pics guys - Thanks so much - And as always especially to JB   :tu: 
Although I start to feel very ignorant and inadequate when you guys get talking!!    :(    :think:    :o 


That mis-stamped cross on the CO is fascinating KK - Never seen that before !!


Thanks for the response and excellent level of detail and documentation, jazzbass!  This is the kind of info that should be in the SAKWiki...or in a book.....
Yes I have been thinking and wondering about this for a while ....  ???


PS. One admin point @ kamakiri and rapidray - Please don't quote full posts like you did above
It repeats stuff unnecessarily and clogs up the thread
- Usually a quoteless response is sufficient - maybe with  a comment such as: "@ JB re your post above"
Or just a partial quote
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on October 07, 2019, 02:00:40 AM
  • Re the book ...... JB - How's it going ? ! ....  :pok:   ;)
 

Its an excellent question. I stepped away from collecting after some bad/frustrating experiences and being slammed at work. Only within the past 6 mos have I been back at it and gathering info for the book. The biggest challenge with this project is data gathering and organization. I was unhappy with the old database I had so I designed a new one and me and another developer are putting a UI on it to make it useful for information/collection info gathering. That should be done soon.

Then - enter all the info, sort it, and write it up. Or just make the info available via a website? That might be easier. But having a book would be cooler. Like way cooler.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on October 07, 2019, 03:21:34 AM
That mis-stamped cross on the CO is fascinating KK - Never seen that before !!
Yeah, stuff I 'had to have' when I saw it. Should have thought about putting it in this thread earlier too.

PS.
:oops:  Yeah, sorry about that. I know better, and generally dislike clutter and chatter in 'technical' threads.

But having a book would be cooler. Like way cooler.
:iagree:  My suggestion is to do both.  I think a nice coffee table sized hardcover would work well for the book.  Might as well 'show off' your examples in nice glossy large print.  Website should be able to at least pay for itself with advertising links, if you care about that.

My collection is more suitable for a xeroxed pamphlet.  :-[  :rofl:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on October 07, 2019, 03:25:09 AM
 :oops: I’ll try to remember
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on October 07, 2019, 06:57:15 AM
I'd say the explanation was, from most likely to least likely:

1. Production error; the opener never got stamped in production
2. Production defect; the opener was stamped but lightly and the stamping was polished off
3. The can opener was replaced during a repair after 1971.

I think it's probably an error.
I guess it is. I think that JB's explanation #3 is unlikely because this can opener doesn't look like it's post-1971. In terms of finish and some other subtle details it is similar to a US PAT PEND can opener. I attach an image that attempts to illustrate this similarity.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on October 07, 2019, 07:07:52 AM
Only within the past 6 mos have I been back at it and gathering info for the book.
It's really great to have you back.  :woohoo:

Quote
Or just make the info available via a website? That might be easier. But having a book would be cooler. Like way cooler.
I'm thirsty for your knowledge and I'll be happy with whatever way you choose to serve it, but I believe that a website is the better route. The big problem with a book is that it needs to get completed before it can be made available. This can take forever. A website can be put together with only part of the planned content and then evolve. It can keep changing and expanding along with the progress of your research as well as due to feedback from others. It will also be accessed by a much larger population.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on October 07, 2019, 08:34:47 AM
^ Great points about the website, but I'd personally like a book.

I guess it is. I think that JB's explanation #3 is unlikely because this can opener doesn't look like it's post-1971. In terms of finish and some other subtle details it is similar to a US PAT PEND can opener. I attach an image that attempts to illustrate this similarity.

Exactly. That's the kind of comparison I was getting at earlier with jnoxyd's 'v1a' opener.  A post-'71 opener would have a 'clear' or sharper transition near the nail nick.  Your shot clearly shows early type of irregular (hand) machining prior to the polishing.  Devil is in the detail comparing many parts.  I've probably spent too much time comparing parts using a loupe.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on October 07, 2019, 08:44:18 AM
KUDOS to everyone who contribute and keep this topic a live, thanks guys and gals...  :salute:

Only within the past 6 mos have I been back at it and gathering info for the book.

By the way I'm always for a book (I guess I'm old school).
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on October 08, 2019, 03:52:58 AM
Thank YOU for helping us with our special hobby  :salute:
To bad I found out my Spartan looking +80yoa was a Pradel... :(
It did have the Vic inlay shield. but youz guys thought it was not authentic!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on October 08, 2019, 06:27:13 AM
Filled another of the remaining holes in the 84mm “accumulation”, all the way from Switzerland.  I think I read that the seller is a member of this forum but not sure.  Small Climber, long nail file.....so good 😛.         :cheers:

 :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on October 08, 2019, 06:29:26 AM
Its an excellent question. I stepped away from collecting after some bad/frustrating experiences and being slammed at work. Only within the past 6 mos have I been back at it and gathering info for the book. The biggest challenge with this project is data gathering and organization. I was unhappy with the old database I had so I designed a new one and me and another developer are putting a UI on it to make it useful for information/collection info gathering. That should be done soon.

Then - enter all the info, sort it, and write it up. Or just make the info available via a website? That might be easier. But having a book would be cooler. Like way cooler.

I want a signed copy
 :popcorn:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on October 08, 2019, 07:24:25 AM
Re  The Book .......... Some great points about the online version  :tu:

But a printed book for me - all the way please. ...... And yes,  great idea El CS - Signed    :D

With all your great photos and information this is something to browse through and absorb 'with a glass of whisky, by the fireside'    :salute:

SAKWiki is a great online reference tool - But methinks this is something a bit different / special     8)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Myron on October 08, 2019, 02:55:54 PM
Yup, my thoughts exactly.  I have an acquaintance  who became the world's expert on wrist chronographs issued to the Royal Canadian Airforce in the 60's, 70's, and 80's.  There are lots of people who collect them, but for one person to study them and document the many differences, evolutions, manufacturers, numbers and dates of issue, etc etc took a special effort.  He eventually published his own book and sold it on Amazon.  Quite the achievement.

Good luck, Jazzbass!

Myron
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Aloha on October 08, 2019, 03:17:06 PM
I get so excited even thinking about a book  :woohoo:.  There is some really incredible information happening in this thread.  Thank you all so much for sharing your knowledge.   :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on October 09, 2019, 01:19:03 AM
I want a signed copy
 :popcorn:
   :like:   :iagree:  +1
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on October 28, 2019, 07:46:17 AM
Can anyone remind me what the first digits 7 and 8 mean in the model numbers please?
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191028/1864e193d35d4eef99613f736aa60c97.jpg)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on October 28, 2019, 03:08:21 PM
 :popcorn:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: LeaF on October 28, 2019, 03:19:51 PM
Can anyone remind me what the first digits 7 and 8 mean in the model numbers please?
I can  :D
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,51152.msg1428436.html#msg1428436 (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,51152.msg1428436.html#msg1428436)


A leading "5", "7", or "8" typically indicated a "special" model - something with tools not part of the standard "Victoria" line (e.g. fine screwdriver, pruner blade, serrated main blade). The Picnicker, for example, is basically a Camper with a serrated main blade and pruner instead of pen blade. It was a model 8237aU, whereas the Camper was a  model 237aU. The Handwerkermesser (model 7236maU) was just a Ranger (model 236maU) with a fine screwdriver instead of a pen blade. There really isn't a logical system with these either - for example the Motorist was a 8134ma, the Picknicker was a 8237aU, but the Handwerkermesser was a 7236maU. Why the "7" instead of "8"?  All knives were "special" models, all were originally Elinox models, etc. But one started with 7 and the other 8.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on October 28, 2019, 03:41:47 PM
There really isn't a logical system with these either - for example the Motorist was a 8134ma, the Picknicker was a 8237aU, but the Handwerkermesser was a 7236maU. Why the "7" instead of "8"?  All knives were "special" models, all were originally Elinox models, etc. But one started with 7 and the other 8.

In this case, the 8 sort of had more commonality because both the Picknicker and Outdoorsman used it as prefix. And perhaps the motorist should have been a '7' instead...or had the '5' or 'A' from the Caddy...or some other common number or letter for the technician's SD.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on October 28, 2019, 09:16:37 PM
Here are pics of some these knives with numbers on the boxes. Pics are provided SAK collector Haoran Yang from China.
What other 7..., 8... or 5... knives with boxes do you have?
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191028/6e73970b12a28a99d1a38de45aa54102.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191028/9c3e521bedc3fcd7365521e3d5708b75.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on October 28, 2019, 10:17:41 PM
Nice  :like: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on October 28, 2019, 10:42:32 PM
I don't think I have any.  But I think the Handyman might have the wrong scissor spring in it.  Black single leaf springs were still produced post +PAT for that type of scissor.  :dunno:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on October 28, 2019, 10:48:39 PM
GigaHz sold a nice one:

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/X24AAOSwJ8JdWaEb/s-l1600.jpg)

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/q0MAAOSwiG1dWaEq/s-l1600.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on October 28, 2019, 10:53:25 PM
GigaHz sold a nice one:

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/X24AAOSwJ8JdWaEb/s-l1600.jpg)

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/q0MAAOSwiG1dWaEq/s-l1600.jpg)
Thats a nice score!  :like: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on October 29, 2019, 09:34:49 PM
I found this in one of ColoSwiss' cases:  I think the wrong knife is in this box.  :think:  :dunno:
It was in a case of the latest items he had purchased and didn't put into his spreadsheet yet.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48981716233_c544551702.jpg)

Has main blade and a combo tool:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48982273391_fe77503c55.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Myron on October 29, 2019, 09:41:16 PM
Has main blade and a combo tool:


So a Bantam?  Looks super cool. 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on October 29, 2019, 09:52:31 PM
So a Bantam?  Looks super cool.
Yes, a Bantam, but I think the box is for a Pioneer.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on October 30, 2019, 12:05:06 AM
I have bought some new SAK and gotten the wrong boxes. It happens.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on October 30, 2019, 01:45:33 PM
I found this in one of ColoSwiss' cases:  I think the wrong knife is in this box.  :think:  :dunno:
It was in a case of the latest items he had purchased and didn't put into his spreadsheet yet.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48981716233_c544551702.jpg)

Has main blade and a combo tool:


Cool SAK FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on October 30, 2019, 01:46:54 PM
Here are pics of some these knives with numbers on the boxes. Pics are provided SAK collector Haoran Yang from China.
What other 7..., 8... or 5... knives with boxes do you have?


Very nice jnoxyd! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on October 30, 2019, 01:47:51 PM
GigaHz sold a nice one:



Cool SAK kamakiri! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on November 17, 2019, 10:32:00 AM
Any one else with a FISCHER tang stamp? Don't see a lot of these around here...at least not in celidor.
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on November 17, 2019, 02:42:16 PM
I have one ;) It is not so cool as M0rkoni’s one above but has nice inlay
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191117/b2e70d2f2b9f0427daf7b8a53ea73786.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191117/1d74db9fd5c6037a882dbd0934b92251.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on November 17, 2019, 02:57:41 PM
I have one ;) It is not so cool as M0rkoni’s one above but has nice inlay

It's a nice one still...  :tu:
But I'm starting to wondering is there any other celidor model with Fischer tang stamp except this one?  :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on November 17, 2019, 03:01:56 PM
It's a nice one still...  :tu:
But I'm starting to wondering is there any other celidor model with Fischer tang stamp except this one?  :think:
It seems to me I saw mod.237 (Camper now) on eBay some years ago, hope somebody here got it.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 17, 2019, 05:20:26 PM
It's a nice one still...  :tu:
But I'm starting to wondering is there any other celidor model with Fischer tang stamp except this one?  :think:

One just went up for auction last week. I failed to get it, though. Same model, no advertising.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Myron on November 17, 2019, 08:45:56 PM
And there's a Fischer Pioneer on eBay right now, but I see your question was regarding Cellidor models. 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on November 17, 2019, 08:58:17 PM
It's a nice one still...  :tu:
But I'm starting to wondering is there any other celidor model with Fischer tang stamp except this one?  :think:

I have both a Spartan (1234) and a Camper (1237). These are the only Fischer cellidor models I've seen. All in all they're pretty much the exact same in construction as Elinox models of the same vintage. I've never seen a small-awl version of these. The only other Fischer stamped knives I know of other than these two and the large awl Pioneer are some 84mm student knives (Popular, Secretary).

(https://i.imgur.com/PO8kHIh.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on November 17, 2019, 10:16:39 PM
Very nice looking SAK’s  :like: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on November 18, 2019, 01:54:05 AM
I've always wanted to post here!  I've had this beauty for awhile, but life has been crazy.  Folder Beholder found this one for me, and I pounced upon it :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on November 18, 2019, 02:08:38 AM
Waiting for  '53.   :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on November 18, 2019, 02:11:30 AM
I understand that Tony...we happen to have the difficult years  :facepalm:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on November 18, 2019, 04:24:03 AM
I've always wanted to post here!  I've had this beauty for awhile, but life has been crazy.  Folder Beholder found this one for me, and I pounced upon it :D
A great find on any BYSAK  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on November 18, 2019, 04:32:29 AM
Thanks Ray! :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on January 02, 2020, 10:45:19 AM
This topic almost have been forgotten so just not to be - a nice well preserved pearl one with exposed rivets...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 02, 2020, 01:21:30 PM
Nice one!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on January 02, 2020, 02:02:43 PM
 :iagree: Very nice  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on January 03, 2020, 12:04:45 AM
:iagree: Very nice  :cheers:
Beautiful!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on January 03, 2020, 08:21:16 AM
Thanks guys!  :salute:
No 76 in in all its glory...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on January 03, 2020, 03:06:52 PM
This topic almost have been forgotten so just not to be - a nice well preserved pearl one with exposed rivets...

Very nice M0rkoni! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on January 04, 2020, 01:25:50 AM
...waiting on that vintage site, almost back up, still looking for a '53 birth year. 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on January 04, 2020, 09:14:10 AM
...yet another one with exposed rivets and scissors but with horn scales and wide long nail file.
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 04, 2020, 04:41:10 PM
...yet another one with exposed rivets and scissors but with horn scales and wide long nail file.
Another cool vintage knife!  :like: I have later version in red cellidor.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200104/857228730eebee0cd06e44b1116b8a87.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200104/b05b4a273958435cd798892b3f98497e.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on January 04, 2020, 04:50:24 PM
...yet another one with exposed rivets and scissors but with horn scales and wide long nail file.
Oh boy, that is a nice one! I like those sissors with the nail nick? by the screw. And the long nail file!  :like: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: LeaF on January 04, 2020, 05:07:47 PM


I have later version in red cellidor.

I hate you both...

Отправлено с моего SM-G930F через Tapatalk

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on January 05, 2020, 09:45:19 PM
Another cool vintage knife!  :like: I have later version in red cellidor.(http://)
()

Nice ones, you know my soft spot...   :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on January 05, 2020, 09:46:31 PM
Oh boy, that is a nice one! I like those sissors with the nail nick? by the screw. And the long nail file!  :like: :cheers:

Thanks buddy, by the way I like that specific feature as well...  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on January 06, 2020, 03:14:04 AM
So... I have a 58 2 blade (1 blade 1 file ) no key ring. Maybe Princess? The other has the 4 'rivets' mine does not...  :think:
Ah.. (glasses) blade reads Rostfri and has the crossbow...you can see the 4 indents under the celi scales...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Deedee on January 15, 2020, 03:35:15 PM
My vintage SAK collection so far....First one is very special. Threefaces wenger officer's knife. If someone have something similar, please post pictures  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on January 15, 2020, 06:18:08 PM
My vintage SAK collection so far....First one is very special. Threefaces wenger officer's knife. If someone have something similar, please post pictures  :cheers:

Nice assortment...  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 16, 2020, 10:32:47 PM
Handyman 7236 maU, early- mid 1960s.
Remind me please when they changed large Elinox stamp for a bit smaller one
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200116/b1b5bf97dad2c83bbb5a72b425003b80.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on January 16, 2020, 11:18:25 PM
Handyman 7236 maU, early- mid 1960s.
Remind me please when they changed large Elinox stamp for a bit smaller one

Great knife. I think the stamp change happens late 1964 (ish - you know how these things are). It happens before the change to symmetric saw teeth, as there are lots of Elinox knives with the small Elinox stamp and asymetric saws, and I have the saw change dated c. 1965.

Does the metal file in this knife have a nail nick or no?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on January 17, 2020, 01:48:05 AM
Handyman 7236 maU, early- mid 1960s.
Remind me please when they changed large Elinox stamp for a bit smaller one
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200116/b1b5bf97dad2c83bbb5a72b425003b80.jpg)
Sweet  :like: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on January 17, 2020, 04:02:20 AM
Sweet  :like: :cheers:
  60's  good one!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 17, 2020, 06:19:15 AM
Great knife. I think the stamp change happens late 1964 (ish - you know how these things are). It happens before the change to symmetric saw teeth, as there are lots of Elinox knives with the small Elinox stamp and asymetric saws, and I have the saw change dated c. 1965.

Does the metal file in this knife have a nail nick or no?
Thanks for the answer, Jazzbass. Metal file has nail nick.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 17, 2020, 02:27:14 PM
Just to illustrate what was said by Jazzbass above
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200117/761ff63c6520b62e1ab990d109efb31a.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on January 17, 2020, 03:18:39 PM
Just to illustrate what was said by Jazzbass above


Nice comparison pic jnoxyd! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on January 17, 2020, 08:10:56 PM
Just to illustrate what was said by Jazzbass above
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200117/761ff63c6520b62e1ab990d109efb31a.jpg)
Oh boy  :drool:  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on January 17, 2020, 11:18:30 PM
You guys JB, JNOX - and all the vintage collectors are ......... A-M-A-ZING

Your knowledge, your collections, your pics  ...... FAN-TAST-IC

Thanks so much for sharing all this
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on January 17, 2020, 11:29:04 PM
:dd:

Awesome pieces guys!

Got in an 84mm Climber this week.
Needs polishing work an a repeen, but it's a lovely 60's piece for sure.
LNF included...

So waiting for a rainy day alone at home to give it some TLC :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Ivo on January 19, 2020, 11:24:40 AM
Just to illustrate what was said by Jazzbass above
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200117/761ff63c6520b62e1ab990d109efb31a.jpg)

So nice  :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Myron on January 19, 2020, 03:26:12 PM
You guys JB, JNOX - and all the vintage collectors are ......... A-M-A-ZING

Your knowledge, your collections, your pics  ...... FAN-TAST-IC

Thanks so much for sharing all this

I have to agree and echo thanks for taking the time to post these great pictures and share your information.  I learn so much here.

Myron
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on January 19, 2020, 04:16:34 PM
My oldest SAK
 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 23, 2020, 03:58:58 AM
Handyman 7236 maU, early- mid 1960s.
Remind me please when they changed large Elinox stamp for a bit smaller one
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200116/b1b5bf97dad2c83bbb5a72b425003b80.jpg)

I’ve seen the large Elinox with both aluminum and nickel silver bird head spacers, and they certainly are produced into the range of asymmetrical machined (main line) knives, which I estimate production covering/through ‘65. Maybe ending then or in ‘66.  I estimate my latest large Elinox copy to be c. ‘65+. It’s also a Handyman like yours.

But honestly, while I believe that my ‘60s chronology is pretty good from an ordinal standpoint, it currently has nowhere near the accuracy of my data from the ‘70s. Accuracy of anything Elinox relies heavily on using main line knives for side by side comparison. That also takes some work and expertise to see the similarities in various tools and construction details despite the difference in finish/level of polish.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on January 23, 2020, 06:24:50 AM
An old soldier  :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Deedee on January 23, 2020, 10:35:37 AM
An old soldier  :salute:

Nice one  :2tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rapidray on January 23, 2020, 02:02:06 PM
An old soldier  :salute:
A 1933 -  :drool:
I like that sheath - is it after market  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on January 23, 2020, 03:07:45 PM
A 1933 -  :drool:
I like that sheath - is it after market  :cheers:

That sheath is not the original match. I match it myself.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on January 23, 2020, 03:09:33 PM
Nice one  :2tu:
Thank you  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on January 23, 2020, 09:42:19 PM
Thank you  :cheers:
   :tu:  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on March 05, 2020, 07:42:08 AM
Good post don't sink :climber:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on March 05, 2020, 07:45:29 AM
 :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on March 05, 2020, 12:26:59 PM
Good post don't sink :climber:

Very nice xfile! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on March 06, 2020, 12:21:40 AM
Thank you @Jnoxyd @VICMAN,I wonder how the bail was removed?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on March 06, 2020, 02:37:47 AM
I wonder how the bail was removed?

I’m thinking it was filed off. Looks like file marks near the blue arrow.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on March 06, 2020, 04:31:34 AM
I’m thinking it was filed off. Looks like file marks near the blue arrow.

It looks like this, but how is the base ring fixed?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on March 06, 2020, 07:46:22 AM
Thank you @Jnoxyd @VICMAN,I wonder how the bail was removed?

Why do you think there was a bail in the first place - Didn't they make them with or without bails?    ???
Maybe this was one without    :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on March 06, 2020, 09:15:08 AM
They made both variants: with and without bail
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200306/617bcd8db02db5f60e5729e9bdcbaa43.jpg)
I’m agree with Kamakiri, the rest of broken bail was accurate filed off (or just somebody didn’t like bails)
Probably it was like this one
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200306/f0075c903c1bc4802754402dceebaf20.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on March 06, 2020, 11:30:00 AM
They made both variants: with and without bail
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200306/617bcd8db02db5f60e5729e9bdcbaa43.jpg)
I’m agree with Kamakiri, the rest of broken bail was accurate filed off (or just somebody didn’t like bails)
Probably it was like this one
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200306/f0075c903c1bc4802754402dceebaf20.jpg)

You have a point jnoxyd,Maybe someone took it down and fixed it perfectly,I'll try and see if I can turn it :climber:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on March 06, 2020, 11:32:56 AM
Why do you think there was a bail in the first place - Didn't they make them with or without bails?    ???
Maybe this was one without    :think:

I'll try and see if I can turn it,If it turns, it must be bail.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on March 06, 2020, 01:29:07 PM
I'll try and see if I can turn it,If it turns, it must be bail.
It can be riveted a little after filing so can be no turn. It is definitely rest of bail.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on March 06, 2020, 03:53:59 PM
They made both variants: with and without bail
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200306/617bcd8db02db5f60e5729e9bdcbaa43.jpg)
I’m agree with Kamakiri, the rest of broken bail was accurate filed off (or just somebody didn’t like bails)
Probably it was like this one
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200306/f0075c903c1bc4802754402dceebaf20.jpg)

 :iagree:

And thanks for the example pics.

On the stag horn models there is also a washer/spacer between the shackle/bail to help clear the extra width from the ridges and contours of the horn.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on March 06, 2020, 04:55:28 PM
Handyman 7236 maU, early- mid 1960s.
Remind me please when they changed large Elinox stamp for a bit smaller one

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200116/b1b5bf97dad2c83bbb5a72b425003b80.jpg)



I was thinking about this recently and I’m thinking the big Elinox tang stamp ends c. ‘66 and maybe later. Perhaps even much later.

We all ‘know’ that lines like Elinox and Hoffritz and advertising use older parts. But analysis is tricky with all the cheaper parts and finishes that Elinox knives got.

My copy like your Handyman is IMO at least ‘65+. It pretty clearly post-dates any ‘63 and ‘64 ‘pegs’ that I have established for main line and advertising knives. Like 100% of the details as far as I’m concerned. It has too many details that match main line ‘65-‘66 range, could be later than that if just 1 or 2 parts are ‘old’/discontinued parts. Which I think is somewhat likely.

One of the thing I want to study more are the Elinox scissors that immediately follow these machined ones...old style stampings that are tumble polished. And continue to look for knives that may be produced between these two types within the later ‘60s. 




Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on March 06, 2020, 09:08:22 PM
Just to illustrate what was said by Jazzbass above
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200117/761ff63c6520b62e1ab990d109efb31a.jpg)

I think my point is better made with pictures. Without getting into all the details it is tougher to explain. But here’s some that show how close the last big Elinox stamp is to the main line 29TAM production, tang polishing, VSSR stamp transition to keyrings and 29TSM transition.

.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on March 07, 2020, 12:45:14 AM
Why do you think there was a bail in the first place - Didn't they make them with or without bails?    ???
Maybe this was one without    :think:

Ahhh -  I've got it - Thanks lads
If it were bail-less - It would not have had the ring/'bushing' around the rivet head
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on March 07, 2020, 02:32:27 AM
Ahhh -  I've got it - Thanks lads
If it were bail-less - It would not have had the ring/'bushing' around the rivet head

And there's another washer/spacer under that, because it's stag horn. That's not done on other scales since they are essentially flat. 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on March 08, 2020, 06:49:27 AM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200117/761ff63c6520b62e1ab990d109efb31a.jpg)

I think my point is better made with pictures. Without getting into all the details it is tougher to explain. But here%u2019s some that show how close the last big Elinox stamp is to the main line 29TAM production, tang polishing, VSSR stamp transition to keyrings and 29TSM transition.

.
Good knowledge kamakiri !I also found a small e Handyman :climber:
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on March 25, 2020, 03:40:03 PM
One more 84mm Super Tinker LNF , now with bail - 145kaU . It is not good condition, even LNF is broken off but I'd like to show these knives here because they are hard to find and only few were shown ( Jazzbass called 145k "one of the rarest post WW2 84mm knives" )
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200325/28edcf561731cba1118c766ef826ed97.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on March 26, 2020, 01:49:07 AM
One more 84mm Super Tinker LNF , now with bail - 145kaU . It is not good condition, even LNF is broken off but I'd like to show these knives here because they are hard to find and only few were shown ( Jazzbass called 145k "one of the rarest post WW2 84mm knives" )
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200325/28edcf561731cba1118c766ef826ed97.jpg)
yes interesting,  I learn a lot from youz guys
I have a Pradel that masquerades as a Spartan ... nothing broken but it is ancient, as a kid and now I'm 66! So I enjoy this thread  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on March 26, 2020, 04:34:05 AM
I’ve seen the large Elinox with both aluminum and nickel silver bird head spacers, and they certainly are produced into the range of asymmetrical machined (main line) knives, which I estimate production covering/through ‘65. Maybe ending then or in ‘66.  I estimate my latest large Elinox copy to be c. ‘65+. It’s also a Handyman like yours.

Finally found the ‘backup’ proof for my ‘65+ estimate for the big Elinox tang stamp. And I still believe mine to be a bit later than this ‘65 inlay dated sample based on the surface finish. It’s from Ulli’s dated advertising knife thread.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on March 26, 2020, 01:20:19 PM
Finally found the ‘backup’ proof for my ‘65+ estimate for the big Elinox tang stamp. And I still believe mine to be a bit later than this ‘65 inlay dated sample based on the surface finish. It’s from Ulli’s dated advertising knife thread.
Congrats! I like these dated knives  :clap:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on March 26, 2020, 06:29:35 PM
Congrats! I like these dated knives  :clap:
:cheers:
Thanks jnoxyd. I was pretty sure about the ‘65+ estimate based on tool and finish progression analysis, but it only ‘proves’ the ordinal nature of things when there aren’t good or nearby ‘pegs’ to confirm.

I’m still thinking/suspecting it’s later for the actual end. Of course it’s too much to ask for a ‘66 or ‘67 marked knife to confirm.   ;)



Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: elsinox on March 27, 2020, 07:33:25 PM
...from the category "copy a catalog page"... not perfect, but almost.
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on March 27, 2020, 07:51:04 PM
Absolutely perfect! Can you tell us about these  Elsener Rapperswil knives? Who made these two shown in Victorinox's catalog? Elsener from Schwyz, another knife maker Elsener from Rapperswil or it is collaboration knives? Thank you!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: elsinox on March 27, 2020, 08:07:08 PM
Nice picture! Can you tell us about these  Elsener Rapperswil knives? Who made these two shown in Victorinox's catalog? Elsener from Schwyz, another knife maker Elsener from Rapperswil or it is collaboration knives? Thank you!
Difficult to describe... I would say it is/was a collaboration. The knifemaker shop still exists, located in Rapperswil (1 mile from Rüti). Victorinox never did grillon scales as far as I know. So I think Elsener Rapperswil (relative of Karl Elsener, Schwyz), got the tools from Ibach (always carbon steel!), assembled the knives and sold them at his store, stamped with "Elsener Rapperswil". So what is it? A victorinox or not?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on March 27, 2020, 08:46:15 PM
I'd say they are Elsener Rapperswil knives which were made with great help of Victorinox according Karl Elsener principles. Anyway it looks better than famous Buck knives completely made by Schrade and Camillus.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on March 28, 2020, 09:56:14 AM
...from the category "copy a catalog page"... not perfect, but almost.

Wow, what a great collection!They're probably the oldest metal inlaid advertising SAK :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Mechanickal on March 28, 2020, 11:10:58 AM
Those are truly astonishing...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on May 25, 2020, 03:53:17 AM
Beautiful!
Can we include Wenger here?
What year do we consider Vintage?  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: M0rkoni on May 25, 2020, 07:10:41 PM
Off course Tony.  :tu:  Just read my first post here in this topic, please...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on May 26, 2020, 02:47:47 AM
Off course Tony.  :tu:  Just read my first post here in this topic, please...
  :salute:   :tu:    :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jph_777 on June 08, 2020, 11:43:26 PM
Where are some good places to look for/shop for specific vintage SAKS besides the big bay on the web?  (I know about the listings on this forum in the Tools Needed section).  I just don't see much showing up on the bay.  Thanks!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Joe58 on June 09, 2020, 03:15:11 AM
Where are some good places to look for/shop for specific vintage SAKS besides the big bay on the web?  (I know about the listings on this forum in the Tools Needed section).  I just don't see much showing up on the bay.  Thanks!

There was a Swiss site that offered old Soldiers, both the 1961 version, and those prior. From Vic and Wenger. I purchased a few from them a few years back. But I no longer have the bookmark for it and had no luck searching for it. I don’t know if they’re now defunct or what. It may have been run by the same folks at LCSAS? Could be likely the sources for the older knives has pretty much dried up. eBay, at least in my view, has really driven prices through the roof on older pieces. I guess that’s good if you’re a seller, but tough to be a buyer. :(
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on June 09, 2020, 03:41:43 AM
Maybe you mean these guys - I think they are French
https://www.couteaux-du-soldat-suisse.ch/J01/index.php/en/

I think one of them is a member here and I think they are linked to LCSAS
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Joe58 on June 09, 2020, 12:30:33 PM
Maybe you mean these guys - I think they are French
https://www.couteaux-du-soldat-suisse.ch/J01/index.php/en/

I think one of them is a member here and I think they are linked to LCSAS

I’m not sure that’s the site that used to sell. It seems to be just info on older SAK’s. Unless at one time they did, since it looks familiar to me. Thanks!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on June 09, 2020, 12:49:47 PM
They did used to sell ......  I have bought from them :)
- There is a shop button on the page now which I don't think, from memory,  was there, or worked like that, before
It now takes you to LCAS and they are on holiday!!    :o
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on June 09, 2020, 07:47:02 PM
This thread needs more pics.

PWAR 235aU
PWAR 235f(a?)U tweezers only as is typical for this run.
UPP 236aU

.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jph_777 on June 09, 2020, 11:10:20 PM
Thanks for the feedback Joe58 and Huntsman!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sneider on June 28, 2020, 01:41:02 PM
Get some beautiful 75 / 84mm Victorinox with horn handles. From the old days when almost everything was still done by hand. Corkscrews are really rare in this size.

(https://up.picr.de/38889799nr.jpeg)

(https://up.picr.de/38889798fn.jpeg)

(https://up.picr.de/38889796br.jpeg)



Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on June 28, 2020, 01:44:44 PM
Get some beautiful 75 / 84mm Victorinox with horn handles. From the old days when almost everything was still done by hand. Corkscrews are really rare in this size.

(https://up.picr.de/38889799nr.jpeg)

(https://up.picr.de/38889798fn.jpeg)

(https://up.picr.de/38889796br.jpeg)
Nice set!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on June 28, 2020, 03:25:35 PM
Nice set!
   :iagree:   :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on June 28, 2020, 05:25:54 PM
Get some beautiful 75 / 84mm Victorinox with horn handles. From the old days when almost everything was still done by hand. Corkscrews are really rare in this size.

(https://up.picr.de/38889799nr.jpeg)

(https://up.picr.de/38889798fn.jpeg)

(https://up.picr.de/38889796br.jpeg)
Impressive group! I really like those 75mm.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on July 10, 2020, 06:18:29 AM
It’s funny how many times Victorinox changed the tool order on the 6 layer knives. And I bet I’m missing something within the first 4 on the left.

.
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 19, 2020, 04:46:39 PM
Hi everyone!
I have a couple of questions about the 84/91mm Elinox cellidor knives.  The series was conceived as a cheaper alternative to the main series (with polished tools, anodized liners, passing 100% quality control, etc.) I looked at my Elinoxes and realized that I have / saw only a few models:
91mm: 1234, 1134(?), 1237, 1137, Outdoorsman 8236maU, Picnicker 8237aU, Handyman 7236maU, Motorist 8134ma;
84mm: 1242k, 1240k and 1230k. 
What else do you have or ever seen?
What about the popular Climber, Woodsman, Ranger, Craftsman, Fisherman?  Has anyone seen their Elinox version? 
What do you think?
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200819/6a4dd6a093b9efa48159f725595021ae.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200819/ba548f30fd8cfa73794c8c0947c1a7f1.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200819/f9f1271d8339493a5ad4e6373c3076f0.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200819/a1a21aaa88bcb17f8f2238c54d7d4c82.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: LeaF on August 19, 2020, 05:40:35 PM
jnoxyd, what about 84-mm models like Tourist, Recruit, Bantam I, Bantam II? (I don't know their digital ID's..)
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 19, 2020, 08:17:20 PM
jnoxyd, what about 84-mm models like Tourist, Recruit, Bantam I, Bantam II? (I don't know their digital ID's..)
I don't have these knives or it's pics, do you?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on August 19, 2020, 11:31:41 PM
Are you requiring both tangs and scale shields?

I have variants (mostly 91mm, of course) that have either tang Elinox or ESSR or ‘federal’ scale shield. At least ones before the broad change to Economy tangs.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 20, 2020, 06:33:12 AM
Are you requiring both tangs and scale shields?

I have variants (mostly 91mm, of course) that have either tang Elinox or ESSR or ‘federal’ scale shield. At least ones before the broad change to Economy tangs.
I'd like to see first what you have with Elinox stamp and then with ESSR stamp. The main question is why didn't they make a wide enough line of cheap Elinox knives in 1950s-1960s?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: LeaF on August 20, 2020, 09:12:28 AM
I don't have these knives or it's pics, do you?
Yes, I have few.


Tourist (https://leaf-vics.com/2014/12/378-tourist.html)
(https://leaf-vics.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/378_09-600x400.jpg)


Recruit (https://leaf-vics.com/2014/12/380-recruit.html)
(https://leaf-vics.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/380_10-600x400.jpg)


Another Recruit (https://leaf-vics.com/2014/12/379-recruit.html)
(https://leaf-vics.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/379_11-600x400.jpg)


Bantam (https://leaf-vics.com/2019/03/733-bantam-tortoise-shell-imitation-scales.html)
(https://leaf-vics.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/733_06-600x400.jpg)


Camper (https://leaf-vics.com/2020/03/846-camper.html) and Camper (https://leaf-vics.com/2014/11/169-camper.html). Both has ESSR tang on front side and no tang on the back
(https://leaf-vics.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/846_10-600x400.jpg)




(https://leaf-vics.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/169_09-600x400.jpg)


You can click on models' names (above the pictures) if you want to view more pictures.


P.S. Also I have several knives with Elinox (+ crossbow) (https://leaf-vics.com/topics/tangs/tang-front/elinox-crossbow) tang, not ESSR (https://leaf-vics.com/topics/tangs/tang-front/elinox-switzerland-stainless-rostfrei). Let me know if more pictures are needed
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: dks on August 20, 2020, 11:22:47 AM
Not sure about the exact age of all (if they are all pre 70s) but here are a few from some older pictures.

Elinox pruner, INOXYD marked Tahara model, ribbed alox and 2 older soldier style ones.

I am sure I have better photographs somewhere, or I could photograph them again, but you get the idea.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 20, 2020, 03:11:27 PM
Nice knives, LeaF! Now we have more small simple  Elinox knives but still no Climbers, Super Tinkers, Woodsmans, Rangers etc.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on August 20, 2020, 09:27:38 PM
I'd like to see first what you have with Elinox stamp and then with ESSR stamp. The main question is why didn't they make a wide enough line of cheap Elinox knives in 1950s-1960s?

I don’t think I have anything 84mm in that date range. Maybe the exception could be the ‘oval’ shaped ones? Not sure.

I can’t think of any 91mm models outside of your list. And all my ‘50s/‘60s Hoffritz ones only have the scale shield even though they are clearly Elinox line.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on August 21, 2020, 01:52:39 AM
Not sure about the exact age of all (if they are all pre 70s) but here are a few from some older pictures.

Elinox pruner, INOXYD marked Tahara model, ribbed alox and 2 older soldier style ones.

I am sure I have better photographs somewhere, or I could photograph them again, but you get the idea.

Garden knife also has elinox tang stamp?? It's really rare :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Zanza on August 22, 2020, 12:38:07 PM
I have a stupid question, and thought that place was quite right to post it...sorry  :angel:

- Is there any sure trick/tip to recognize an 84 mm of a 91 mm, when surfing on various auction sites, where there are only pictures and not given measurements by the seller ?
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 22, 2020, 12:43:37 PM
I have a stupid question, and thought that place was quite right to post it...sorry  :angel:

- Is there any sure trick/tip to recognize an 84 mm of a 91 mm, when surfing on various auction sites, where there are only pictures and not given measurements by the seller ?
Good question. Yes, of course ;). Different numbers of saw teeth, awl/Phillips/ Corkscrew position, scissors handles shape, cap lifter length etc. Just put 84mm and 91mm together and check differences ;)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Zanza on August 22, 2020, 12:50:49 PM
Good question. Yes, of course ;). Different numbers of saw teeth, awl/Phillips/ Corkscrew position, scissors handles shape, cap lifter length etc. Just put 84mm and 91mm together and check differences ;)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Obviously when I put them besides, I clearly see the differences...
But when you just rely on posted pictures of one particular knife, it's not so easy, especially on one model without saw and scissors, like a Sportsman for example  ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on August 22, 2020, 02:39:42 PM
...never a stupid question... we answer questions here - you should have seen some of mine!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 22, 2020, 06:32:53 PM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200822/5baa907433d864fb5fdba52ac4e8223d.jpg)
84mm awls are closer to emblem, you can easy see the difference (if awl is open of course)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Zanza on August 22, 2020, 06:46:41 PM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200822/5baa907433d864fb5fdba52ac4e8223d.jpg)
84mm awls are closer to emblem, you can easy see the difference (if awl is open of course)

Really good tip indeed, thanks

BTW, really nice knives  ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 22, 2020, 08:36:21 PM
Really good tip indeed, thanks

BTW, really nice knives  ;)
Thanks! Glad to help you.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: chapel976 on August 23, 2020, 08:39:35 PM
Just thought I'd pop in and say hi. Here's my wife's 65-68 Master Craftsman

https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,85353.0.html
https://imgur.com/a/JdaZBms
(https://i.imgur.com/duFFcDP.jpg)

She had been keeping it (it's her dad's) in a box for a long time because it had gotten too hard to open.
I gave it a iso bath, dried it out, cleaned it with a q-tip and then oiled it up with some hair trimmer blade lube and worked it clean.
it's in pretty good nick. Her dad kept it razor sharp. Now she can finally open it and use it.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on August 23, 2020, 11:34:39 PM
Just thought I'd pop in and say hi. Here's my wife's 65-68 Master Craftsman

https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,85353.0.html
https://imgur.com/a/JdaZBms
(https://i.imgur.com/duFFcDP.jpg)

She had been keeping it (it's her dad's) in a box for a long time because it had gotten too hard to open.
I gave it a iso bath, dried it out, cleaned it with a q-tip and then oiled it up with some hair trimmer blade lube and worked it clean.
it's in pretty good nick. Her dad kept it razor sharp. Now she can finally open it and use it.

Nice!  I’d say ‘66-‘68 for the saw and shackle. My guess for the details I can see would be closer to the c. ‘68 side. A couple of good pics from the top and bottom with the tools closed might help me move or narrow that date guesstimate down a bit.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: chapel976 on August 24, 2020, 01:36:48 AM
sure thing - https://imgur.com/a/tqXgXDa
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on August 24, 2020, 02:55:08 AM
  :like:   .... Lovely old Master Craftsman Mr. Chapel
I love these vintage SAKs - It's even nicer when they have a history and family connection behind them.  :like:    :like:

And well done for bringing it back to life - That's the amazing thing about SAKs - They almost always restore to full operational use with a nice clean, oil and some love!!

EDIT PS: Much prefer the old file where the textured area goes right to the end - I think it was a real mistake by Vic to put on the nail cleaner tip. As so often I need a small file where i can file at the tip. You can always use the awl as a nail cleaner!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on August 24, 2020, 03:12:08 AM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200822/5baa907433d864fb5fdba52ac4e8223d.jpg)
84mm awls are closer to emblem, you can easy see the difference (if awl is open of course)

Great info and pic jnox .......... or if it has exposed rivets!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 24, 2020, 05:27:12 PM
Great info and pic jnox .......... or if it has exposed rivets!!
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200824/498d4af7e95ba305a71aeefd1adab1fb.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on August 24, 2020, 05:56:10 PM
Another great pic ......

So are those all 91mms? ........ As the awl to logo gap is larger?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 24, 2020, 05:57:54 PM
Another great pic ......

So are those all 91mms? ........ As the awl to logo gap is larger?
Yes, you are right ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on August 24, 2020, 07:23:33 PM
sure thing - https://imgur.com/a/tqXgXDa

Thanks for the follow-up! 

Below are some of my Master Craftsman knives produced close to your wife’s knife. I think it clearly fits between my 1st and 2nd knives (left to right).

The first is ‘65-‘66 and has the 29TAM (angled teeth, machined finish) and to T&T.

The second I believe is ‘69-ish and maybe even early ‘70s. It’s my observation that shackles were in use past ‘68 for some models.

The third is late ‘71.

After reviewing your pictures and comparing against my knives (including other Champions in this date range) I still think yours is c. ‘68.

Thanks so much for posting your pictures. They really help me refine my chronology of the ‘60s production and when the Master Craftsman models gained the Toothpick & Tweezers.

 :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on August 24, 2020, 07:33:01 PM
I'd like to see first what you have with Elinox stamp and then with ESSR stamp. The main question is why didn't they make a wide enough line of cheap Elinox knives in 1950s-1960s?

Unrelated, but looking through some 84mm boxes, I did find the ‘63 SAC knife with the conical awl...

.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on August 24, 2020, 08:16:03 PM
Unrelated, but looking through some 84mm boxes, I did find the ‘63 SAC knife with the conical awl...

Interesting

And 50 years later this:
https://sakwiki.com/tiki-index.php?page=Wenger+RangerWood+161
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on August 29, 2020, 05:28:09 AM
The main question is why didn't they make a wide enough line of cheap Elinox knives in 1950s-1960s?

I’ve been meaning to get back to the root of your question...but I keep getting sidetracked looking through the collection.

Bottom line is that I don’t think you’re missing much, if any from your list. (Aside from the ESSR variants which I think LeaF covered better than I could)

Anyway...My theory is that there weren’t really reasons, needs or niches to ‘fill’ with Elinox model ‘construction’.  The main niches in my view are price related. If you look at the prices in the misc. US ‘60s catalogues, I find it hard to price theoretical additional Elinox models where they wouldn’t cannibalize sales of main line products. Especially, if you consider that they might be built with minor defect parts and not just cheaper process parts. Meaning that if Elinox part bins were primarily filled with mildly out of toloerance parts, they would likely be the high volume parts. Certailnly starting with parts found in a modern Spartan...plus scissors, wood saw, then what? Like a long nail file was a labor intensive part that didn’t belong in an Economy model...it commanded a whopping ~$4 of retail price premium. Metal files being case hardened, would be pretty useless as out of tolerance items...because they should have been tossed/recycled prior to hardening.

The theory continues and as manufacturing quality and costs improve, there is less need to dispose of such parts. My guess is that this shift happened broadly through the ‘70s and coincided with what we see in reduced Elinox model availability. Broader main line use of other manufacturing processes originally used for Elinox lines like tumble polishing seem pretty clear.

Once most parts were tumble polished, there was very little supply of parts for or diverted to the Elinox bins. Or so it seems to me, as it all coincides with my chronology. Machining and finishes are important parts of my study. Understanding how these two processes change through time allow me to put dates to almost any part of any knife as seen be member elsinox’s blind test for the UPP stamped can opener. This is also why I can date many knives looking at them closed. Mostly machining changes for the ‘50s as everything is hand polished all the way through and into the ‘70s where nothing is.

The theory also supports the reason for fewer 84mm Elinox knives. Fewer main line part production leads to proportionally fewer rejects for the Elinox bins.

Thanks, jnoxyd, for always asking such excellent questions and bringing up excellent topics.  :cheers:
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on August 30, 2020, 05:23:16 PM
Thanks Kamakiri for the answer! 
Indeed, I also do not see much sense in producing a cheap line using 50x-60x technologies.  Scissors in the Elinox series look terrible without usual manual polishing, non-oxidized liners have cracks (to be honest, even in the main series they are a problem), the absence of a file on the phillips hardly gives a strong price reduction, etc. Interestingly, they did not abandon the idea of inexpensive series and released the Economy line without obvious degradation (hot stamping instead of a metal emblem, no tools in the scales, a corkscrew without a groove, what else?).
And yes, Huntsman Economy exists ;). What other 3-4 lines Economy knives do you have?
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200830/4d33c1beb990377b72880a9bf8475484.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200830/d5c2db6b39d4ecbb1a7df44e7f3daebd.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: 39hotrod on August 30, 2020, 05:38:08 PM
 :like: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on August 30, 2020, 11:57:58 PM
Thanks Kamakiri for the answer! 
Indeed, I also do not see much sense in producing a cheap line using 50x-60x technologies.  Scissors in the Elinox series look terrible without usual manual polishing, non-oxidized liners have cracks (to be honest, even in the main series they are a problem), the absence of a file on the phillips hardly gives a strong price reduction, etc. Interestingly, they did not abandon the idea of inexpensive series and released the Economy line without obvious degradation (hot stamping instead of a metal emblem, no tools in the scales, a corkscrew without a groove, what else?).
And yes, Huntsman Economy exists ;). What other 3-4 lines Economy knives do you have?
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200830/4d33c1beb990377b72880a9bf8475484.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200830/d5c2db6b39d4ecbb1a7df44e7f3daebd.jpg)

Lol. Pulled one of those out too.

I think time for the tumble polish is reduced for most parts. Or I’m just seeing the out of tolerance QC culls.

I have these as c. ‘79

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on August 31, 2020, 12:01:18 AM
Was busy taking this apart last night. Gotta love 70+ year old grime!

.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on September 01, 2020, 05:29:45 AM
I'd say!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on September 02, 2020, 11:43:35 AM
Was busy taking this apart last night. Gotta love 70+ year old grime!

.
What was a reason? Every parts look good
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on September 02, 2020, 07:13:28 PM
What was a reason? Every parts look good

Parts have some damage and wear. Most of it could be ‘fixed’ to some degree for functionality...and also a bit for cosmetics. At the very least these aspects can be improved without taking it apart.

I didn’t make a list when I decided to take this one apart, because I’m still not 100% certain about restoring it. Some of the pros for taking it apart:
Parts. I bought it for parts, which aren’t that great. Decent shape for some but all need a fair amount of work to look ‘good’.
Already missing original shackle. So less concern about parting out an incomplete knife.
Cleaning. Hardly a reason, but I don’t like the ‘spa’ treatment...and never do that with vintage knives.
Practice. Before I do some other crab claw knives that need disassembly without scale damage, I thought it better to do one with lower value.
And the big one. Smashed liner ends. These could be improved a bit assembled, but I wanted to try an ‘agressive’ or intensive restoration on them. Now I know I’ll never make the look new, but the intent is to make them look far less used and abused. See pics below.

The plate width of the outer liners essentially doubled. ~0.7mm -> 1.35mm and 1.40mm. Sure, I could have ‘fixed’ it with a file, but I got to the last pic with zero material removed.

I hope that explains some of my crazy!

.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on September 03, 2020, 10:16:11 PM
Yes it was worth doing. Hope you are going to use nickel silver rods for rivets
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on September 04, 2020, 12:31:15 AM
Yes it was worth doing. Hope you are going to use nickel silver rods for rivets

 :tu:
Of course! And for the shackle too.

I turn down the pins myself to 2.25mm from 3/32” stock ~2.37mm. I can re-use the long pin and 4th pin since they came out without material removal.

I’m going to try for the earlier style of shackle lugs that went into the early crab claws. Probably not the right style, but I haven’t made of that type before. Those usually go with the scales that have the nail relief for the corkscrew. This one is later than that and should probably have the ‘flatter’ style lug.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on September 04, 2020, 07:53:32 AM
Great plan!  Let us see what happens, please.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jph_777 on September 06, 2020, 06:00:36 PM
Kamakiri,  looking forward to seeing how this project goes! :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Zanza on September 11, 2020, 11:44:25 AM
Here are some of my latest finds (I've already shown the Richartz Solingen from Germany on the far right in another thread (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,21658.msg2156963.html#msg2156963))

(https://i50.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/vintag11.jpg)


---------------------------------------------------------


- Victorinox 234 Bgl. (Spartan). 
I suppose it's from late 40's early 50's...

(https://i50.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/vic23410.jpg)
(https://i50.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/vic23411.jpg)
(https://i50.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/vic23412.jpg)
(https://i50.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/vic23414.jpg)
(https://i50.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/vic23413.jpg)


---------------------------------------------------------


- Wenger ? (Commander)
Measuring 82 mm, but I can't find not much more information to date it. Apparents rivets and can opener type claw "army style"

(https://i.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/wenger26.jpg)
(https://i.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/wenger23.jpg)
(https://i.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/wenger24.jpg)


---------------------------------------------------------


- Unknown brand.
Measuring also 82mm, really nice and every blades are closing like a gator  ;)

(https://i50.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/unknow10.jpg)
(https://i50.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/unknow12.jpg)
(https://i50.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/unknow13.jpg)
(https://i50.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/unknow11.jpg)


---------------------------------------------------------


I let the gurus of vintage sak telling more... ;)

(https://i50.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/vintag10.jpg)



Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: 39hotrod on September 11, 2020, 02:51:47 PM
 :like: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Aloha on September 11, 2020, 03:57:47 PM
 :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on September 11, 2020, 08:22:48 PM
Great plan!  Let us see what happens, please.

Kamakiri,  looking forward to seeing how this project goes! :salute:

Many of my posts got obliterated in the covid data dump. Uploaded pics didn’t seem to be affected. But I can’t tell for sure.

Anyway, the shackle is taking shape. I didn’t proceed with the ‘older’ style.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on September 11, 2020, 08:34:47 PM
Looks good
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on September 11, 2020, 08:35:29 PM
---------------------------------------------------------

- Victorinox 234 Bgl. (Spartan). 
I suppose it's from late 40's early 50's...

(https://i50.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/vic23410.jpg)
(https://i50.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/vic23411.jpg)
(https://i50.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/vic23412.jpg)
(https://i50.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/vic23414.jpg)
(https://i50.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/vic23413.jpg)

---------------------------------------------------------

Nice additions!

Looks more on the ‘40s side to me. Tang stamps, scale details, shackle style, etc.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on September 11, 2020, 08:42:40 PM
Looks good

Thanks jnoxyd.  :cheers:

Just hoping I don’t make any big mistakes as there’s a lot of time into it already.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on September 11, 2020, 08:45:21 PM
Thanks jnoxyd.  :cheers:

Just hoping I don’t make any big mistakes as there’s a lot of time into it already.
The main problem for me is getting proper length after hammering the ends of rod
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on September 12, 2020, 04:33:53 AM
The main problem for me is getting proper length after hammering the ends of rod

No kidding. I use an offset from the pin center or ‘eye’ for control. If forming for widening also lengthens too much, then I gotta quickly figure out if there’s enough width or material toward the center. Always an issue with the second end.

I’ve tried 2.0mm wire, but I can’t seem to make it work...yet. Would save a lot of time.
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on September 12, 2020, 12:55:40 PM
You are right, 2.0mm rods fit better for both bail versions (pre and post 1957). What is the problem with them? Here’s post 1957 version hand made bail together with  original one (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200912/fe89472e7a52988da2ded9272a688312.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on September 12, 2020, 06:32:10 PM
You are right, 2.0mm rods fit better for both bail versions (pre and post 1957). What is the problem with them? Here’s post 1957 version hand made bail together with  original one (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200912/fe89472e7a52988da2ded9272a688312.jpg)

Nice work!  :tu:

Nothing wrong with the 2.0mm wire...just the guy wielding the hammers! (Apparently)

I was already intent on trying again with 2mm...as I’m sure that’s the way they were originally fabricated in forming dies. I just haven’t been able to move enough material the right way.

 :think: Also makes me think we could or should have a vintage restoration thread.  :dunno: The data dump and lost posts gives me pause.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on September 13, 2020, 09:39:32 PM
I was already intent on trying again with 2mm...as I’m sure that’s the way they were originally fabricated in forming dies. I just haven’t been able to move enough material the right way.

How do you make loop hole ? I use conical awl instead of drill for keeping enough metal for loop.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Zanza on September 13, 2020, 11:25:07 PM
Nice additions!

Looks more on the ‘40s side to me. Tang stamps, scale details, shackle style, etc.

Thank you Kamakiri for these precisions  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on September 14, 2020, 08:04:29 PM
How do you make loop hole ? I use conical awl instead of drill for keeping enough metal for loop.

 :facepalm:

That never occurred to me!!  :rofl:

Punches, modern awls, needle files, burrs and drill bits...are what I’ve been using.

Ironically, I’ve always assumed a cone or cut/frustum of a cone were used in the original forming dies.

I’ll have to try the conical awls. Now I gotta figure out which one to use!  :think:

Thank you Kamakiri for these precisions  :tu:

 :cheers: Glad to help, I only wish I could narrow it to specific year(s). In the sampling of 5 knives below from between roughly ‘47/‘48 and ‘52/‘53, yours appears to be closest to the second.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rizio Il Ghiro on September 14, 2020, 11:33:15 PM
Wow - they look great! :like: :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on September 18, 2020, 06:25:15 AM
Wow - they look great! :like: :like:

 :cheers: Perhaps my favorite era to collect, But certainly fun to restore!

...

Decided to try the 2.0mm wire again for the shackle. Still tight on material but some changes in my forging techniques let me move forward with one of the smaller profiles.

Gonna turn one of my pins down to about 2.20-2.21 or so to help make it work. Re-forged the original shackle pin back into shape and 2.25mm dia., but I don’t want to turn it down in size.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on September 20, 2020, 01:38:18 AM
Almost done. Pretty happy with it considering the original condition. Achieved the goal of looking ‘less abused’ as well as the replacement shackle.

Tools still need some work and I’ll probably include it in EDC rotation when it’s done.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on September 20, 2020, 01:58:16 AM
Almost done. Pretty happy with it considering the original condition. Achieved the goal of looking ‘less abused’ as well as the replacement shackle.

Tools still need some work and I’ll probably include it in EDC rotation when it’s done.

 :like:    :cheers:    :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on September 20, 2020, 09:22:33 PM
:like:    :cheers:    :salute:

 :cheers: Thanks Tony! It was good practice. Especially the flush peening.

Some comparison pics to a decent copy with the shackle I was trying to duplicate.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on September 24, 2020, 01:16:51 AM
nice...I have a similar Pradel in green, it was old when I was a kid- now 65 so it must be 100  lol...wish it were a SAK!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on September 24, 2020, 05:25:48 AM
nice...I have a similar Pradel in green, it was old when I was a kid- now 65 so it must be 100  lol...wish it were a SAK!!

Those are still cool...especially that old!  Isn’t there a SAK-alike thread? Have you posted it there?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on September 24, 2020, 10:26:26 PM
Those are still cool...especially that old!  Isn’t there a SAK-alike thread? Have you posted it there?
Hey thanks!  Ill have to look....
and it's a weird kinda camo, blades are blackened but I won't touch it as yet. SAK like shield may be brass?  little brass bale almost useless...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on October 16, 2020, 06:51:57 PM
Just added a model 247:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50494822236_3628652d43.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on October 16, 2020, 06:55:04 PM
Just added a model 247:

Ohhh, nice! Still looking for it ...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on October 16, 2020, 06:57:05 PM
Ohhh, nice! Still looking for it ...
Thank you jnoxyd, but for some reason I thought you had one already.  :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on October 16, 2020, 07:35:28 PM
Shame on me, you are right )))
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201016/c62d9fcc72603ce69ca78871df2d6ee7.jpg)
I have old version from 1940s and thought you shown later 1950s-1960s version.
Here’s it on Jazzbass’s pic:

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201016/b427ff709a9af0f9fa410839cad8e7b8.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on October 16, 2020, 08:03:55 PM
I have old version from 1940s
Yes, there it is!  :cheers:
Does your can opener close in front of the main blade or behind it?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on October 16, 2020, 10:33:45 PM
Yes, there it is!  :cheers:
Does your can opener close in front of the main blade or behind it?
It is in front of the main blade and has nail nick available from the front knife side. Later versions have nail nick on the back side.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201016/29c9250db87c2beab0eb961229039dc1.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on October 16, 2020, 11:26:22 PM
It is in front of the main blade and has nail nick available from the front knife side. Later versions have nail nick on the back side.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201016/29c9250db87c2beab0eb961229039dc1.jpg)
Thank you, that is what I have too.  :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on October 17, 2020, 12:20:15 AM
Just added a model 247:


Very nice FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on October 17, 2020, 12:34:50 AM
Very nice FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Thank you Vicman!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on October 17, 2020, 03:53:55 AM
Just added a model 247:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50494822236_3628652d43.jpg)

Shame on me, you are right )))
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201016/c62d9fcc72603ce69ca78871df2d6ee7.jpg)
I have old version from 1940s and thought you shown later 1950s-1960s version.
Here’s it on Jazzbass’s pic:

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201016/b427ff709a9af0f9fa410839cad8e7b8.jpg)

Both nice ones! Mine is the same, but ugly. I mean, butt ugly.  :D

The cool part of these knives IMO, is that the crink of the main blade goes the other way. So these would be difficult to ‘fake’...between that and the ‘blank’ no awl front scale, make these rare for their parts.

EDIT:  Oh, and for the bird-head spacer location.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on October 17, 2020, 03:32:15 PM
So these would be difficult to ‘fake’...
:like:
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on October 23, 2020, 11:08:37 AM
Take a look at this interesting knife.  I looked for it for a long time everywhere in the world until my friend, 13 km away, pulled it out of his box with various knives airport confiscated he keeps for many years
 (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201023/eb3d44cbdb418dab1a1b3a778022a510.jpg)
It looks very close to post 73 Elinox knives but has strange blade stamp without any company or trade mark name on it. Other side is blank. Corkscrew looks less quality than pre73 Elinox and even another "bright red scales" ESSR stamped knife.
 (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201023/654b63830313676fb66f2cdbefe66e1e.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201023/f99f657ee9bf87733ffdb67bf128925e.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201023/e455e561715b6fcf1aee440a7861b5ac.jpg)
Another knife without Victorinox or Elinox in the stamp exists but it has Hoffritz stamp at least ;)
 (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201023/1eee1cd675eb7c5e02d62400c3a17e7b.jpg)
It's not unique stamp, SAKHOME described same stamp Standard it in his blog:
 (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201023/ed2d116307bfc0cff65aee30ae8b2cd0.jpg)
So what do you think? I believe it is Victorinox made knife but what was the reason for this strange blade stamp?
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201023/af7cb195de259fddb053fd49d7e9ddbb.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on October 24, 2020, 04:05:43 PM
Take a look at this interesting knife.  I looked for it for a long time everywhere in the world until my friend, 13 km away, pulled it out of his box with various knives airport confiscated he keeps for many years
Cool find!  :tu:  A NIB Picnicker with this stamp was shown (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,51152.msg1454394.html#msg1454394) earlier in this thread by FolderBeholder and then JazzBass pointed out (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,51152.msg1454415.html#msg1454415) that it occurs on both Picnickers and Outdoorsmans from the mid-1970's.

Quote
So what do you think? I believe it is Victorinox made knife but what was the reason for this strange blade stamp?
It's certainly a Victorinox made knife with a known Victorinox stamp that appears in Ulli's table (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,50014.60.html#att306974), however, as discussed (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,50014.msg2172562.html#msg2172562) in the Tang Stamps thread, details in the table suggest that this stamp mainly occurs on the back side of the blades of floral knives. So why do we find it by itself on economy officer knives? I can only guess. Maybe at some point they weren't sure if they want to proceed with the Elinox name and how to brand their economy SAKs, so they just used this brandless stamp for a while. Another possibility is that (for officer knives) this is what Ulli called (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,50014.msg2106602.html#msg2106602) a "Monday stamp" (although the fact that we find this stamp on both serrated and normal blades is a bit challenging to this theory).
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on October 29, 2020, 02:34:09 PM
Thanks for the comment MiniChamp. Yes, I like "Monday stamp" version better, just tried to find good picture of this stamp on Elinox gardeners to be sure it is technically same puncheon/stamp they keep and can use it accidentally wrong. They looks same to me:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201029/785cc1f34c8b85646ddc1d48e340016b.jpg)

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on October 29, 2020, 02:47:44 PM

The cool part of these knives IMO, is that the crink of the main blade goes the other way.


Do you think they later decided it would be cheaper to alter the can opener (mirrored, nail nick on the other side) and use "regular" blades? The one I have has a regular blade.
Also, I can only find a reference to the 84mm model (247 k) but it seems to make sense that the 91mm model was in fact model no. 247.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on October 29, 2020, 04:39:28 PM
Do you think they later decided it would be cheaper to alter the can opener (mirrored, nail nick on the other side) and use "regular" blades? The one I have has a regular blade.
Also, I can only find a reference to the 84mm model (247 k) but it seems to make sense that the 91mm model was in fact model no. 247.

I think that’s a good theory. At least based on the progression of similar models. I mean the retooling to flip and make thinner would have to be justified somehow. So keeping the main blades the same, and the spacer on the ‘normal’ side for assembly was probably worthwhile in their view. In my chronology, efficiency like this seems to be at the forefront of their design and decision making process.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on October 29, 2020, 04:45:58 PM
:tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on October 29, 2020, 04:53:35 PM
Thanks for the comment MiniChamp. Yes, I like "Monday stamp" version better, just tried to find good picture of this stamp on Elinox gardeners to be sure it is technically same puncheon/stamp they keep and can use it accidentally wrong. They looks same to me:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201029/785cc1f34c8b85646ddc1d48e340016b.jpg)

There is also the possibility that it was used intentionally for advertising knives. There was an Excelsior (?) posted in another thead that was only stamped ‘ROSTFREI’. So like the late ‘70s/early ‘80s Hoffritz H/SSR, I believe that Victorinox was very willing to exclude their name.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on October 29, 2020, 05:27:41 PM
I can only find a reference to the 84mm model (247 k) but it seems to make sense that the 91mm model was in fact model no. 247.
???  The 91mm model 247 appears in the 1942 catalog (https://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-browse_gallery.php?galleryId=112):

(https://www.sakwiki.com/show_image.php?id=3307&scalesize=o)

as well as in the late 1940's catalog (https://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-download_file.php?fileId=3665):

(http://gallery.multitool.org/var/albums/MiniChamp/Catalogs/Late-1940s_Elsener_Catalog/Elsener_Late-1940s_Catalog_07.jpg)

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on October 29, 2020, 06:45:24 PM
OK sorry, I don't know how I missed that :think:

What's up with the pin locations on that 248 and 248 k (second pic) by the way? Was the middle pin actually located so far up?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on October 29, 2020, 07:12:19 PM
OK sorry, I don't know how I missed that :think:

What's up with the pin locations on that 248 and 248 k (second pic) by the way? Was the middle pin actually located so far up?

My guess is that the ‘4th’ pin could have been used for scale attachment, instead of the center ‘3rd’ pin. Just reversing what pin is exposed vs hidden.  There’s no reason it couldn’t be done that way.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on October 29, 2020, 07:20:52 PM
Makes sense I guess, thanks.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Zanza on October 30, 2020, 10:32:50 AM
Hello to all vintage saks gurus, I have a little question

Is this cap-lifter genuine or customized, as I can't find it in the catalogs ?  :angel: ???

(https://i50.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/tealea10.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on October 30, 2020, 01:49:20 PM
Customized. As in: abused and broken...

Nice technician's screwdriver though!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on October 30, 2020, 09:38:49 PM
Customized. As in: abused and broken...

Nice technician's screwdriver though!
  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on October 30, 2020, 11:19:11 PM
Another knife without Victorinox or Elinox in the stamp exists but it has Hoffritz stamp at least ;)
 (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201023/1eee1cd675eb7c5e02d62400c3a17e7b.jpg)

So like the late ‘70s/early ‘80s Hoffritz H/SSR, I believe that Victorinox was very willing to exclude their name.

I wonder: Is there a more accurate estimate for when Hoffritz used this combination of stamps that excluded any reference to the Victorinox brand? Also, did they use it exclusively for some period of time or along side stamps that did contain Victorinox branding? What I'm really asking is this: Is there any indication that Victorinox branding was removed from Hoffritz SAKs at some concrete point in time and then later restored at another concrete point in time? If so, when?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Frailer on October 31, 2020, 03:26:44 AM
Hello to all vintage saks gurus, I have a little question

Is this cap-lifter genuine or customized, as I can't find it in the catalogs ?  :angel: ???

(https://i50.servimg.com/u/f50/19/13/23/70/tealea10.jpg)
I’m no guru, but I do know what that particular knife is supposed to look like:

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201031/b194550179e7edc9da2de1a8e715054f.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Zanza on October 31, 2020, 04:48:27 PM
Thanks for your help guys, gurus or not  ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pa_strunk on October 31, 2020, 08:19:57 PM
Victorinox 84 mm Golfer Plus - I think it is the best two layer SAK to carry with any MT
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on November 10, 2020, 06:21:57 AM
I wonder: Is there a more accurate estimate for when Hoffritz used this combination of stamps that excluded any reference to the Victorinox brand? Also, did they use it exclusively for some period of time or along side stamps that did contain Victorinox branding? What I'm really asking is this: Is there any indication that Victorinox branding was removed from Hoffritz SAKs at some concrete point in time and then later restored at another concrete point in time? If so, when?
I didn’t see any information about time range but here are two Hoffritz from eBay (sorry for bad pics). Both have 1983-1985 awl but different blade stamps. So probably Hoffritz knives without Victorinox branding produced since at least late 1970s till mid 1980s. No idea why they did it.
Hoffritz only stamp
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201110/69e18ed16a15db86b5f3235deb612418.jpg)
OS stamp (hope scales haven’t been replaced)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201110/a411d678d173a951b342b2f49552bda5.jpg)
 Awls:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201110/0c53aceb590030314e92ec5438642216.jpg)
Yes, we need more knives for statistic. What Hoffritz do you have, guys?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on November 10, 2020, 12:44:22 PM
I didn’t see any information about time range but here are two Hoffritz from eBay (sorry for bad pics). Both have 1983-1985 awl but different blade stamps. So probably Hoffritz knives without Victorinox branding produced since at least late 1970s till mid 1980s. No idea why they did it.
Many thanks for the info and pics. One of the reasons that I find this interesting is because of the potential connection with the how and when the company that was called Forschner for most of its life (and changed its name to "Swiss Army Brands, Inc." (SABI) in the mid-1990's) became the exclusive North American distributor of Victorinox. There is something a bit strange with this piece of history. The attached document contains the first part of the last annual financial report that SABI submitted as a publicly traded company (before being completely bought by Victorinox in 2002). It has a lot of information about the history of the company. In particular, the emphasized portion on the 3rd page claims that SABI has been the exclusive Victorinox US distributor since 1972. However, the emphasized portion on the 7th page states that the agreement securing this exclusivity is from December 12, 1983. There are no typos here. In some earlier SEC filings (see, e.g., https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/731947/0000731947-97-000002.txt) SABI used the following formulation: "The Company has been marketing Victorinox Original Swiss Army Knives and Victorinox cutlery for over fifty years and has been the exclusive United States distributor of such products since 1972, an arrangement that was formalized in 1983." So... they were exclusive since 1972 but this was "formalized" only 11 years later in 1983 (after SABI became a publicly traded company and Charles Elsener bought a piece of it in 1981). ???  Meanwhile, we know that during these 11 years Hoffritz sold quite a few Hoffritz-branded Victorinox SAKs (using names and catalog numbers that were independent from those used by SABI). It seems unlikely that these Hoffrits SAKs were imported by SABI, so... Is it possible that the removal of the Victorinox brand name from Hoffritz SAKs enabled Victorinox to sell them directly to Hoffritz without breaking the supposed status of SABI as the exclusive US Victorinox distributor?

P.S. Some fun with names: Before changing its name to "Swiss Army Brands, Inc." in the 1990's, Forschner sold Victorinox SAKs through a division that was called "Swiss Army Knives, Inc." (in the early 1980's) and later mutated into the subsidiary "Swiss Army Brands, Ltd." (in the late 1980's).
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on November 10, 2020, 01:42:04 PM
Nice reading!  Thanks a lot MiniChamp.  This document mentions another interesting Victorinox partner: Bear Cutlery MGC.  We all know this intriguing story of the purchase and subsequent sale of this company by Victorinox.  What do you think, how independent was the development of the innovative SwissTool for Victorinox?
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201110/db54248c981016e66082792f8e78219e.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 10, 2020, 05:09:50 PM
I didn’t see any information about time range but here are two Hoffritz from eBay (sorry for bad pics). Both have 1983-1985 awl but different blade stamps. So probably Hoffritz knives without Victorinox branding produced since at least late 1970s till mid 1980s. No idea why they did it.
Hoffritz only stamp
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201110/69e18ed16a15db86b5f3235deb612418.jpg)
OS stamp (hope scales haven’t been replaced)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201110/a411d678d173a951b342b2f49552bda5.jpg)
 Awls:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201110/0c53aceb590030314e92ec5438642216.jpg)
Yes, we need more knives for statistic. What Hoffritz do you have, guys?

Neither of those are ‘84 and certainly not ‘85.

And the two awls are different.  ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 10, 2020, 05:39:46 PM
Anybody think statements like these are relevant to the issue?

I think so. And I suspect this was from close to the start of that period of ‘Victorinox’ being absent from the Hoffritz tangs.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on November 10, 2020, 06:58:17 PM
:)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 10, 2020, 11:56:11 PM
...I’ve been looking at it wrong the whole time.  :D

.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: El Corkscrew on November 11, 2020, 07:37:57 AM
 :popcorn:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Max Stone on November 11, 2020, 09:57:28 AM
Anybody think statements like these are relevant to the issue?

I think so. And I suspect this was from close to the start of that period of ‘Victorinox’ being absent from the Hoffritz tangs.
...was from 1987 Victorinox (Swiss printed) brochure, so about the right time?  :dunno:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 11, 2020, 04:07:20 PM
...was from 1987 Victorinox (Swiss printed) brochure, so about the right time?  :dunno:

Interesting that they expanded to Victorinox-Switzerland.

Certainly by this time, Hoffritz got the main line stampings like everything else.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 12, 2020, 03:30:24 AM
Approximately 24 years of 136ka - Craftsman SAKS
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on November 13, 2020, 07:42:20 AM
Approximately 24 years of 136ka - Craftsman SAKS
WOW! What a nice set!  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 13, 2020, 07:34:30 PM
WOW! What a nice set!  :like:

 :cheers: Thanks jnoxyd! But unfortunately still at least three particular variants that I want but do not have, and two in there that I would really like better copies of.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on November 13, 2020, 08:06:00 PM
:cheers: Thanks jnoxyd! But unfortunately still at least three particular variants that I want but do not have, and two in there that I would really like better copies of.
Are you collecting the Small Craftsman and the Master Craftsman too?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on November 13, 2020, 08:18:29 PM
:cheers: Thanks jnoxyd! But unfortunately still at least three particular variants that I want but do not have, and two in there that I would really like better copies of.
What variants are you looking for?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 13, 2020, 08:54:28 PM
Are you collecting the Small Craftsman and the Master Craftsman too?

Pretty much anything that’s 136xx. 84mm 91mm...kinda doesn’t matter.

What variants are you looking for?

The main one is the ‘25TAP’ version. I passed on one a while back because it looked kinda junky. Today I think I would have preferred having the placeholder than not.

There’s a bigger list of things I’m sure exist and would certainly add them if possible. Like comis has a ‘pwar’ version with the ‘Swiss Made’ cap lifter. Pretty sure that precedes mine. And there’s probably one out there with the mixed liner construction. I’d like those, but not really considering them big gaps between in my collection so far.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on November 13, 2020, 10:58:55 PM
Approximately 24 years of 136ka - Craftsman SAKS

Nice Craftsman collection kamakiri! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 14, 2020, 12:30:12 AM
Nice Craftsman collection kamakiri! :like: :tu: :tu:

 :cheers:  Thanks, VICMAN!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on November 15, 2020, 01:18:41 AM
I just won my first old Victorinox. Stamped Elsener over Zug. Can anyone date that stamp? I do have pics from the seller. Is it appropriate to post those up here?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 15, 2020, 03:43:37 AM
I just won my first old Victorinox. Stamped Elsener over Zug. Can anyone date that stamp? I do have pics from the seller. Is it appropriate to post those up here?

Sure!  Post here and check or post in this one too:

https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,50014.0.html#_

It’s listed in one of the reference stickies, as well as other date resources.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on November 15, 2020, 03:50:28 AM
I just won this one. Can someone tell me the model name? Bartender comes to my mind first. I’m hoping I did ok on it. I believe the writing is a trucking company. When I did a search I saw early trucks with the name on it.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on November 15, 2020, 03:51:14 AM
Here’s the tang stamp. The stamp itself doesn’t look too deep from the pictures. Supposedly it was serviced at a Victorinox factory.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on November 15, 2020, 03:53:51 AM
The other side of the blade.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 15, 2020, 04:12:03 AM
I just won this one. Can someone tell me the model name? Bartender comes to my mind first. I’m hoping I did ok on it. I believe the writing is a trucking company. When I did a search I saw early trucks with the name on it.

I think it would be a model 248. Take a look in the wiki and look at the earlier catalogs like from the ‘40s.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on November 15, 2020, 10:56:13 AM
I think that the size is 84 mm, so its a model 248k.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on November 15, 2020, 01:41:12 PM
Here’s another picture taken by the seller.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on November 15, 2020, 01:42:10 PM
Open....
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on November 16, 2020, 09:29:47 AM
Pretty much anything that’s 136xx. 84mm 91mm...kinda doesn’t matter.

The main one is the ‘25TAP’ version. ....
I have no 25TAP version too, they are really hard to find to my regret but I have this nice Craftsman with usual saw and not very common scales ;)
VOs/vssr, black double leaf spring
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201116/cbebfbce821b5a32bb0d4a148ee44bff.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on November 16, 2020, 02:43:27 PM
What is 25TAP?
I'm thinking 25 tooth something?  :think: :dunno:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on November 16, 2020, 02:56:07 PM
What is 25TAP?
I'm thinking 25 tooth something?  :think: :dunno:
You are right, 25 teeth (84mm) asymmetric polished wood saw variant
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on November 16, 2020, 03:01:13 PM
You are right, 25 teeth (84mm) asymmetric polished wood saw variant
Thank you!  :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on November 16, 2020, 03:04:55 PM
My pleasure
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 16, 2020, 05:18:11 PM
I have no 25TAP version too, they are really hard to find to my regret but I have this nice Craftsman with usual saw and not very common scales ;)
VOs/vssr, black double leaf spring
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201116/cbebfbce821b5a32bb0d4a148ee44bff.jpg)

Nice Golfer.  ;)  This is the model that I believe should be reference as the ‘Original Golfer’.   AFAIK, the two blade (don’t get me started on the LNF versions which were never Golfers) were all produced mid ‘70s are the second to be named such and look like they might immediately follow yours. As I’ve suspected for a while.

Mine is latter ‘60s, perhaps one of the early ones. But I still gotta address the damaged (maybe bug eaten and/or dried out) scales. Not sure if I want to attempt the repair, or replace with donor parts I already have.

What is 25TAP?
I'm thinking 25 tooth something?  :think: :dunno:

Yes, it’s jazzbass’ nomenclature for wood saws.

And I got a good look at the one I passed on. Pretty sure that it was produced in between 35TAP use. Between that copy and the one Minichamp described, it has to be in the middle. Perhaps in about ‘64-‘65 range, but very briefly I’m guessing.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 16, 2020, 06:02:55 PM
My Golfer (top w/ 35TAM) with a 236k H

.
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on November 16, 2020, 09:16:08 PM
Nice pic of Golfer Original! Where is it from?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on November 16, 2020, 09:22:59 PM
My Golfer (top w/ 35TAM) with a 236k H

.
Really nice two!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 16, 2020, 09:59:31 PM
Nice pic of Golfer Original! Where is it from?

From the Wiki listed as the ‘70s (26 model), which I believe was late ‘60s issued and used into the early ‘70s range like ‘72-‘73 or maybe whenever the ‘red’ catalog actually came out.

Really nice two!

 :cheers:  Thanks but I let a couple get away from me and wish I had a nicer one (Golfer).

I also suspect FB might have a nicer one tucked away, because I think I saw that coloswiss had one.  :dunno:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on November 16, 2020, 10:43:36 PM
I also suspect FB might have a nicer one tucked away, because I think I saw that coloswiss had one.  :dunno:
If you can give me its name and tools it has, I can locate it.
It seems you're talking about Golfers but they don't have a wood saw from what I recall, so I'm confused.  :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 16, 2020, 11:12:19 PM
If you can give me its name and tools it has, I can locate it.
It seems you're talking about Golfers but they don't have a wood saw from what I recall, so I'm confused.  :think:

Just like the ‘catalog cut’ I posted above. 84mm with saw, scissors and back Phillips or 136ka H.

I’ll go look for his post.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 16, 2020, 11:25:18 PM
Found the post where I learned about it from Karl. Looks like I might be wrong about him having one, though. He had info from the catalog scan.

Here (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,40654.msg650701.html#_) in a thread titled ‘Artisan’ which is probably how I found the thread long ago.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on November 17, 2020, 12:44:08 AM
Found the post where I learned about it from Karl. Looks like I might be wrong about him having one, though. He had info from the catalog scan.

Here (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,40654.msg650701.html#_) in a thread titled ‘Artisan’ which is probably how I found the thread long ago.
I looked at the post and since it is from 2012, Karl added a lot of knives to his collection since that date.
Also, I may have one in my personal collection.
Which tools are you looking for in the knife?  Is it 4-layer?  Again, curious if I have one.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 17, 2020, 01:34:13 AM
I looked at the post and since it is from 2012, Karl added a lot of knives to his collection since that date.
Also, I may have one in my personal collection.
Which tools are you looking for in the knife?  Is it 4-layer?  Again, curious if I have one.

Yes 4 layer. Curious if you do too!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on November 17, 2020, 01:47:30 AM
Yes 4 layer. Curious if you do too!
I have at least 4 of the 4-layer 84mm knives.  Just not sure if I have what you're wondering about.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 17, 2020, 03:34:05 AM
Like jnoxyd’s knife:

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201116/cbebfbce821b5a32bb0d4a148ee44bff.jpg)

Similar to the early 136ka Craftsman, but with horn scales.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pa_strunk on November 17, 2020, 05:16:57 AM
 :like: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on November 17, 2020, 03:09:12 PM
Like jnoxyd’s knife:

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201116/cbebfbce821b5a32bb0d4a148ee44bff.jpg)

Similar to the early 136ka Craftsman, but with horn scales.
Would this be one?
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50612830798_82cd1284ba.jpg)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50613686867_7920e8c97c.jpg)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50612830838_f337edba54.jpg)

Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on November 17, 2020, 03:14:07 PM
Nice one! Looks better then mine
What scissors spring it has?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on November 17, 2020, 03:15:27 PM
Would this be one?


Beautiful SAK FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on November 17, 2020, 03:25:06 PM
What scissors spring it has?
It has a single dark colored spring:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50612874043_9ab10cbc9d.jpg)
Beautiful SAK FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Thank you Vicman!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rizio Il Ghiro on November 17, 2020, 04:05:08 PM
Wow, FB what a beauty! :like: :like: :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 17, 2020, 04:52:01 PM
Would this be one?
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50612830798_82cd1284ba.jpg)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50613686867_7920e8c97c.jpg)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50612830838_f337edba54.jpg)

Looks great! :tu:  Glad you found it!  Was it one of coloswiss’ ?

And is it +PAT on the can opener? I’m guessing yours is between mine and jnoxyd’s.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on November 17, 2020, 04:53:54 PM
Looks great! :tu:  Glad you found it!  Was it one of coloswiss’ ?

And is it +PAT on the can opener? I’m guessing yours is between mine and jnoxyd’s.
Thank you, yes, it was one of ColoSwiss' and you're right it is +PAT on the can opener.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 17, 2020, 05:13:31 PM
Thank you, yes, it was one of ColoSwiss' and you're right it is +PAT on the can opener.

Sweet. I’ve long thought that these were the ‘Original Golfer’ but had zero proof that they were produced at any time other than near mine in the late ‘60s. Thanks for finding it FB!!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on November 18, 2020, 12:06:59 AM
I’ve had this Soldier new since 1997. If I remember right it retailed for $17.00.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on November 18, 2020, 12:08:23 AM
Rear side.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 18, 2020, 12:25:47 AM
I’ve had this Soldier new since 1997. If I remember right it retailed for $17.00.

Sterg- nice knife and we love alox soldiers, but this thread is for older knives. Originally up to the early  ‘70s, and has crept a bit up since the thread is pretty old.

There are lots of threads for alox or your original knives. I think of this one for alox:
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,53842.11430.html (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,53842.11430.html)

Threads are also listed in the club sticky. And there’s also one for ‘old cross’ knives. Lots to see!

Hope that helps!  I’d just want you to show off in the places it’ll be noticed.  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on November 18, 2020, 01:41:40 AM
Sterg- nice knife and we love alox soldiers, but this thread is for older knives. Originally up to the early  ‘70s, and has crept a bit up since the thread is pretty old.

There are lots of threads for alox or your original knives. I think of this one for alox:
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,53842.11430.html (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,53842.11430.html)

Threads are also listed in the club sticky. And there’s also one for ‘old cross’ knives. Lots to see!

Hope that helps!  I’d just want you to show off in the places it’ll be noticed.  :cheers:
Ok np. I thought I saw something about that somewhere.  :facepalm: If things proceed as planned I’ll have some to post here.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 18, 2020, 03:15:51 AM
Ok np. I thought I saw something about that somewhere.  :facepalm: If things proceed as planned I’ll have some to post here.

 :cheers: looking forward to that update too.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Max Stone on November 18, 2020, 10:58:20 AM
I had the chance to view some vintage SAKs yesterday. Need some help identifying these two. I think one is a 75mm Accountant with MOP scales. Must be an early example.  :dunno:

But I’m stumped on the other. Looks like a Pocket Pal with scissors? I did not measure it at the time unfortunately.  ???
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on November 18, 2020, 12:00:54 PM
That MoP one is nice with the Elsener Schwyz tang stamp :dd:

I'd say the other one is a 74Cr if it's 84mm.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Max Stone on November 18, 2020, 12:28:18 PM
Thanks Reinier. I’ll try get a size to confirm. Yes, the Elsener is smart.  :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pfrsantos on November 18, 2020, 01:50:46 PM
I had the chance to view some vintage SAKs yesterday. Need some help identifying these two. I think one is a 75mm Accountant with MOP scales. Must be an early example.  :dunno:

But I’m stumped on the other. Looks like a Pocket Pal with scissors? I did not measure it at the time unfortunately.  ???

View?! Don't you mean buy?!

 :pok: :pok:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on November 18, 2020, 02:05:20 PM
That model 74 is basically the one I just sold on eBay, minus the LNF:

(https://vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/victorinox-victoria-75acr-accountant-with-lnf-front-800x600.jpg)

https://vicfan.com/2020/11/victorinox-victoria-accountant-with-long-nail-file/
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pfrsantos on November 18, 2020, 02:21:34 PM
That model 74 is basically the one I just sold on eBay, minus the LNF:

(https://vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/victorinox-victoria-75acr-accountant-with-lnf-front-800x600.jpg)

https://vicfan.com/2020/11/victorinox-victoria-accountant-with-long-nail-file/

You had this and let it go?!

(https://i.giphy.com/media/RLKREmdXjN9GLXywaY/giphy.webp)

 :facepalm:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on November 18, 2020, 02:25:07 PM
#NotCollecting75mmSAKs #74and91mmOnly #SellNowRegretLater ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Max Stone on November 18, 2020, 02:32:28 PM
@pfrsantos #sadlynotmysakandnfs  :facepalm:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 18, 2020, 10:26:44 PM
That model 74 is basically the one I just sold on eBay, minus the LNF:

(https://vicfan.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/victorinox-victoria-75acr-accountant-with-lnf-front-800x600.jpg)

https://vicfan.com/2020/11/victorinox-victoria-accountant-with-long-nail-file/

I was eyeballing this one...and a couple of others...but too many knives showed up that week that were higher up on ‘the list’.  :(
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on November 18, 2020, 11:05:42 PM
I was eyeballing this one...and a couple of others...but too many knives showed up that week that were higher up on ‘the list’.  :(
Me too and I wanted it very much, but at the last minute I thought it would go skyrocket in price so I didn't bid.  :facepalm:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 19, 2020, 05:35:29 AM
Me too and I wanted it very much, but at the last minute I thought it would go skyrocket in price so I didn't bid.  :facepalm:

That’s how it goes. I did the opposite with one I thought could wait another week. Boom. Picked up some competition and skyrocketed.  :facepalm: could have picked it up for 2/3rds the final price a week earlier on that one. Oops.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on November 19, 2020, 08:19:21 AM
In the end it didn't go that high though :)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on November 19, 2020, 03:16:27 PM
In the end it didn't go that high though :)
I know and I will always consider that one the one that got away.  :facepalm: :oops:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pfrsantos on November 19, 2020, 03:48:10 PM
In the end it didn't go that high though :)

(https://thumbs.gfycat.com/JovialPlumpArgentineruddyduck-size_restricted.gif)

 :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on November 19, 2020, 03:59:31 PM
:tu: :tu:

I was waiting for that one :P

(that's also what she said)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pfrsantos on November 19, 2020, 04:01:00 PM
:tu: :tu:

I was waiting for that one :P

(that's also what she said)

 :D :D :D :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 19, 2020, 07:29:15 PM
In the end it didn't go that high though :)
Yeah, because FB and I weren’t fighting for it!


I know and I will always consider that one the one that got away.  :facepalm: :oops:

Oh, so many of those to remember...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on November 20, 2020, 02:02:21 AM
Yeah, because FB and I weren’t fighting for it!
Truth!  :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Max Stone on November 22, 2020, 11:33:50 PM
Nice reading!  Thanks a lot MiniChamp.  This document mentions another interesting Victorinox partner: Bear Cutlery MGC.  We all know this intriguing story of the purchase and subsequent sale of this company by Victorinox.  What do you think, how independent was the development of the innovative SwissTool for Victorinox?
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201110/db54248c981016e66082792f8e78219e.jpg)
It was not Victorinox that purchased Bear MGC Cutlery in 1999 (as often reported), but Swiss Army Brands, Inc. ("SABI"). Bear had an established multi-tool and knife manufacturing, retail and OE supplier business at the time, with over 50 models, which is what SABI was most likely interested in. Victorinox had the benefit of assessing many of the early MTs when developing their SwissTool, so it's not surprising that some common design features are seen across brands. Victorinox just enhanced and refined what was in the market at the time to a level that even 20+ years on, is still a competitive product. SABI sold Bear back to one of the original owners of Bear, Ken Griffey, in 2004.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on November 23, 2020, 01:59:27 AM
It was not Victorinox that purchased Bear MGC Cutlery in 1999 (as often reported), but Swiss Army Brands, Inc. ("SABI").
True, but at that time SABI itself was in the process being purchased by Victorinox (Victorinox owned more than 35% of SABI at the time of the Bear purchase and that ownership portion quickly grew until SABI became wholly-owned by Victorinox in the summer of 2002).
Quote
Bear had an established multi-tool and knife manufacturing, retail and OE supplier business at the time, with over 50 models, which is what SABI was most likely interested in.
They may have been more interested in their patents, particularly, the US5697114 patent. (https://patents.google.com/patent/US5697114A) (Victorinox couldn't sell the SwissTool without a license to this patent.)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 23, 2020, 05:00:45 AM
 :think: Which of you bought this fine specimen of a ‘pwar’ 235faU today?

Even I had a tough time seeing the parts value.  :dunno:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Max Stone on November 23, 2020, 07:26:30 AM
True, but at that time SABI itself was in the process being purchased by Victorinox (Victorinox owned more than 35% of SABI at the time of the Bear purchase and that ownership portion quickly grew until SABI became wholly-owned by Victorinox in the summer of 2002).They may have been more interested in their patents, particularly, the US5697114 patent. (https://patents.google.com/patent/US5697114A) (Victorinox couldn't sell the SwissTool without a license to this patent.)
Probably a consideration in the purchase, but $7m was not small change at the time, about 14% of their entire Victorinox/Bear revenue in 1999.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on November 23, 2020, 10:11:41 AM
the one that got away.

I just missed out on a MoP Champion with old triangular awl. First one I've ever seen for sale and it has been on my wanted list since August 2010 :cry:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rizio Il Ghiro on November 23, 2020, 11:41:41 AM
Most annoying  :rant:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on November 23, 2020, 02:25:16 PM
:think: Which of you bought this fine specimen of a ‘pwar’ 235faU today?

Even I had a tough time seeing the parts value.  :dunno:
Wasn't me, but I bet someone would be able to clean it up nicely.  What price did it go for?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 23, 2020, 05:01:34 PM
I just missed out on a MoP Champion with old triangular awl. First one I've ever seen for sale and it has been on my wanted list since August 2010 :cry:

Sorry to hear.
MoP Hoffritz Champ for me. I estimate I missed it by minutes. MoP isn’t really high on the list for me, but it’s not like I turn down opportunities when they show up.

Wasn't me, but I bet someone would be able to clean it up nicely.  What price did it go for?
Under $30 with shipping. Not quite sure what would be really salvageable there. Scissors and the scaler are probably most of the value. But almost everything else looked pretty abused or missing. Even though the ends weren’t clearly shown, the ‘squareness’ of the scales mean the liners are probably smashed and smurfed a lot.  :dunno:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on November 23, 2020, 05:40:35 PM
I just missed out on a MoP Champion with old triangular awl. First one I've ever seen for sale and it has been on my wanted list since August 2010 :cry:

I missed the same... I just check that platform for alox master craftsman. I think the mop one went for a low price... Maybe it will be put on another platform for a lot of money in some days.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on November 23, 2020, 10:44:13 PM
Any Hoffritz lovers ? Nice but pricey (not mine to my regret  ;) )

https://www.ebay.com/itm/c-1973-VTG-Victorinox-HOFFRITZ-Earliest-CHAMPION-C-Swiss-Army-Knife-NEW-IN-BOX-/254674039171?_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l49292
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on November 23, 2020, 11:53:57 PM
I have the Champ, a bit much to pocket carry. Nice though  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 23, 2020, 11:58:17 PM
Any Hoffritz lovers ? Nice but pricey (not mine to my regret  ;) )

https://www.ebay.com/itm/c-1973-VTG-Victorinox-HOFFRITZ-Earliest-CHAMPION-C-Swiss-Army-Knife-NEW-IN-BOX-/254674039171?_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l49292

I might know what they bought it for.  ;)

And I know 100% it’s not ‘73 or really even c.’73.

I have a similar one produced after this one that is c.’77. Small clip points were used in more places and ways than most understand.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on November 24, 2020, 12:45:14 AM
I might know what they bought it for.  ;)

And I know 100% it’s not ‘73 or really even c.’73.

I have a similar one produced after this one that is c.’77. Small clip points were used in more places and ways than most understand.
OMG yes just a bit expensive! Lolol
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 24, 2020, 02:02:50 AM
OMG yes just a bit expensive! Lolol

Might be worth that to somebody.  :dunno:

But been listed for several months now. They might have bought it in 2019, if not earlier this year.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on November 24, 2020, 01:55:54 PM
Who can help me date this SAK? It's a horn scaled standard with these tang stamps:

(https://forum.multitool.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=85982.0;attach=493918;image)

According to Ulli's tang stamp guide the main blade stamp should be 1943-1951 but the cap lifter says 1891-1935. Obviously I may be totally wrong here.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on November 24, 2020, 06:29:15 PM
According to Ulli's tang stamp guide the main blade stamp should be 1943-1951 but the cap lifter says 1891-1935.
???  Like many other things, Ulli's table works much better when you use the latest version. (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,50014.60.html#att306974)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on November 24, 2020, 07:16:53 PM
No need to be grumpy I think?

But thanks, I thought I was using the latest version but had not noticed it was an old one.

So 1943-1945 probably.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on November 24, 2020, 08:11:51 PM
No need to be grumpy I think?
I didn't realize that my response sounded grumpy. It was not my intention. Sorry.

With that said, the fact that people keep using older versions of Ulli's table seems to be a recurring problem. I think that it will be good if something will be done to make it easier for people to end up using the latest version. Maybe it will help if someone who can do such things will add a remark with a link to the latest version at the top of the Victorinox Tang Stamps thread. (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,50014.0.html)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Max Stone on November 24, 2020, 11:31:43 PM
Added link to Tang Stamp Wiki page :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on November 25, 2020, 03:10:59 AM
Hi Folks

Just caught up on the last four pages of this thread - Amazing discussions and knowledge as always  :salute:
Particularly interested in all the discussions around Bear, Hoffritz, SABI, Forschner and the US Vic imports etc
And of course all the old SAKs goes without saying!!

The Chief moderators and Grant prefer us never to alter any previously posted content - And certainly not without the permission of the OP.
With that said - MiniChamp's suggestion is a very sensible proposition.

So I could add the latest Ulli TS image to the very first post in his thread - with his permission - Shall I ask him? (I did that for my dating spreadsheet recently)
Max if you want I could also add it to your first post in the Tang Stamp project  - Let me know 

:cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Max Stone on November 25, 2020, 06:37:46 AM
Yes, makes sense to include it. There are some dates on Ulli’s table that don’t align 100% with the Wiki page, but as you’ve stated before, dating SAKs is not an exact science.   :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on November 25, 2020, 09:10:39 AM
I didn't realize that my response sounded grumpy. It was not my intention. Sorry.

OK I apologize, I probably misread your post. :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on November 25, 2020, 12:42:29 PM
Hi Folks

Just caught up on the last four pages of this thread - Amazing discussions and knowledge as always  :salute:
Particularly interested in all the discussions around Bear, Hoffritz, SABI, Forschner and the US Vic imports etc
And of course all the old SAKs goes without saying!!

The Chief moderators and Grant prefer us never to alter any previously posted content - And certainly not without the permission of the OP.
With that said - MiniChamp's suggestion is a very sensible proposition.

So I could add the latest Ulli TS image to the very first post in his thread - with his permission - Shall I ask him? (I did that for my dating spreadsheet recently)
Max if you want I could also add it to your first post in the Tang Stamp project  - Let me know 

:cheers:

I m happy if I could help. I stopped uploading newer version of my tang stamp sheet, because people always take the one on page 1 (approx. 7000 download) and not the newest one (approx. 1000 downloads) and some use the sheet without permisson on their pages.
Tang stamps are just one tool to date knives. I really like the tang stamp project on the other thread. I would stick on the mainly and regular used stamps. Because on knives before 1950, there are so many variants, around 5 versions of the VICTOR-INOX crossbow stamp. I dont think that would help people much when they just want date a knife in a timerange of some years.
MT is a really good place to bring people together, to share the knowledge, but I m not sure if its the perfect place for content based on facts and evidence. I m not sure if you know what I mean. Its a platform for discussions, for sharing. My intention with the tang stamp sheet was not to bring a perfect product that is 100% correct, because almost every day I see and learn something new. And thats the way I like it, to create something as a base for discussions. Thats very common in science. If you buy today a book in biology, in 5 years its worth nothing, because its already too old, not accurate, because now in 2020 people know much more than in 2015. But the problem with online content like here on MT is, that you cant replace old content with new content. So I see old tang stamp sheets everywhere, on online auctions, on homepages, most time with a claim that its 100% correct.
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on November 25, 2020, 01:15:56 PM
Hi Ulli!  You're right, I'm tired of fixing guys using old versions of your date sheet and reminding them that it's not good to share this cool sheet without the name of the creator.  However, could you please post the most recent version with a proper title with your name.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Max Stone on November 25, 2020, 01:17:16 PM
Thanks Ulli for your comment/feedback. I hope that by adding your most recent table to these threads and to the updated Wiki tang page, we can steer people to this version. I do believe (and have stated before) that the Wiki tang page should follow the general format and content of the rest of the Wiki, which has a bias towards more recent models. Winding the clock back before 1950 becomes a lot more challenging for content and data, and almost deserves its own Vintage section that would require a lot of work. I think that threads like this one are of more value for those with an interest in vintage SAKs and willing to share/discuss information.  :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on November 25, 2020, 06:59:21 PM
Thanks Ulli for your comment/feedback. I hope that by adding your most recent table to these threads and to the updated Wiki tang page, we can steer people to this version. I do believe (and have stated before) that the Wiki tang page should follow the general format and content of the rest of the Wiki, which has a bias towards more recent models. Winding the clock back before 1950 becomes a lot more challenging for content and data, and almost deserves its own Vintage section that would require a lot of work. I think that threads like this one are of more value for those with an interest in vintage SAKs and willing to share/discuss information.  :salute:

I think I better give you a link to the sheet. There the size is not restricted and I can be sure its always the newest version.

https://elsinox.com/.cm4all/mediadb/.2020.11.%20zwo.jpg/picture-2600

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Max Stone on November 25, 2020, 07:12:28 PM
Thank you Ulli - I have updated on the Wiki. Huntsman will need to update the threads on the forum.  :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 25, 2020, 08:07:58 PM
MT is a really good place to bring people together, to share the knowledge, but I m not sure if its the perfect place for content based on facts and evidence. I m not sure if you know what I mean. Its a platform for discussions, for sharing. My intention with the tang stamp sheet was not to bring a perfect product that is 100% correct, because almost every day I see and learn something new. And thats the way I like it, to create something as a base for discussions. Thats very common in science. If you buy today a book in biology, in 5 years its worth nothing, because its already too old, not accurate, because now in 2020 people know much more than in 2015. But the problem with online content like here on MT is, that you cant replace old content with new content. So I see old tang stamp sheets everywhere, on online auctions, on homepages, most time with a claim that its 100% correct.

Sadly, you are right. This is the problem with static unchanging sources of info.

It is one of my main challenges in improving the chronology data available here and ultimately in the Wiki.

Like the “1973” Hoffritz Champion for sale above which is actually c.’76. It would be nearly impossible to correct such errors because they feel that they have done ‘extensive research’ on the matter. I know, because I’ve tried.

The tang stamp updates, both yours and the wiki, will go a long way toward making it better.

My thanks to all who have participated in the wiki update. And especially to Max for taking the lead and listening to all the input. Excellent.

Not to say that it is or I am done with some of the refinements I need to get to, but it really is a huge milestone for the wiki regarding more accurate chronology.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Max Stone on November 25, 2020, 08:17:06 PM
 :cheers: kamakiri, and the Wiki will continue to be developed to be a valuable resource  :salute:

And I saw what you did, good signature  :D

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on November 25, 2020, 09:06:22 PM
Like the “1973” Hoffritz Champion for sale above which is actually c.’76.
Why do you think that it's c.’76? It seems to have a 2.7mm Victoria-era spring/corkscrew/main-blade-shank combination. I don't recall encountering before any claims that such SAKs were produced after 1974.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 26, 2020, 12:31:24 AM
:cheers: kamakiri, and the Wiki will continue to be developed to be a valuable resource  :salute:

And I saw what you did, good signature  :D

 :D Imitation is a sincere form of flattery!  ;) I like the way you worded that. Better than I would do.  :tu:

Why do you think that it's c.’76?
I know it’s c.’76. There are perhaps a dozen things that confirm it. The seller’s pictures are very good, and it’s very easy to see what I need to see.

There are more obscure reasons like the similarities to a Hoffritz Super Knife I own...aside from one part that does not exist before ‘76 or ‘77. And I have lots of main line Champions produced on either side of this date range.

It seems to have a 2.7mm Victoria-era spring/corkscrew/main-blade-shank combination.

Are you 100% certain about that? I suggest looking at the pictures again. More cost effective than spending $400+ for it.

I don't recall encountering before any claims that such SAKs were produced after 1974.

Well, now you have. But I’m pretty sure we skirted the topic of your changeover theories in this time frame before. I’ll eventually get to the proof in the “dating in the ‘70s” series, assuming I don’t croak before then.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on November 26, 2020, 03:38:19 AM
I know it’s c.’76. There are perhaps a dozen things that confirm it. The seller’s pictures are very good, and it’s very easy to see what I need to see.
You are not really answering the question. Clearly, if you think that this SAK is c.’76, it's because of some "things" that you see in the pictures. The question is: What are those mysterious things?

Quote
Are you 100% certain about that?
I'm never 100% certain about anything, but I do believe that the attached image shows a 2.7mm Victoria-era spring. If I'm wrong, then surely you have an appropriate post-Victoria-era SAK with a 2.4mm spring that looks like this one. Can you show images of such a SAK?

Quote
Well, now you have.
Well, now you got me confused. Are you claiming that I'm wrong about this particular SAK having a 2.7mm Victoria-era spring or that SAKs with such springs were produced at least until 1976 (or both)?

Quote
I’ll eventually get to the proof in the “dating in the ‘70s” series, assuming I don’t croak before then.
I'll be extremely happy if you will ever start providing some sort of evidence to support your claims. Until then I tend to consider them as being quite questionable.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 26, 2020, 04:17:17 AM
Let me not answer that with another question:

If you were Victorinox and you ran out (intentionally as part of the 2.7mm phase out) of one of those parts, but not other components in this layer, what would you do in order to use those other parts?

Regarding c.’76, there’s actually relevant info even in the cropped picture that you posted.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 27, 2020, 08:00:46 PM
You are not really answering the question.
Yeah, that’s intentional. Incorrect suppositions are difficult to answer.

Clearly, if you think that this SAK is c.’76, it's because of some "things" that you see in the pictures. The question is: What are those mysterious things?
Going through all the pics, I counted 19. But you only really need the one to prove the point. And two are the most relevant parts to this discussion. Both are visible in the crop you posted.


I'm never 100% certain about anything, but I do believe that the attached image shows a 2.7mm Victoria-era spring. If I'm wrong, then surely you have an appropriate post-Victoria-era SAK with a 2.4mm spring that looks like this one. Can you show images of such a SAK?
You were pretty certain that the 84mm double cut file didn’t exist. This is like that. You’ve been looking at something you didn’t know existed. And are making all sorts of incorrect statements and assumptions about it.

And yes, I am able to show another knive that would prove the point just the same. But without explanation, it wouldn’t matter one bit.


Well, now you got me confused. Are you claiming that I'm wrong about this particular SAK having a 2.7mm Victoria-era spring or that SAKs with such springs were produced at least until 1976 (or both)?
Now I expect you to get really confused. My answers to both questions above are ‘No’.


I'll be extremely happy if you will ever start providing some sort of evidence to support your claims. Until then I tend to consider them as being quite questionable.
Lol. All there in the pics. Even in the crop you posted. Clear as daylight.


Found where we kinda discussed this before:
Hard to be certain, IMO. I do believe that transitions involving multiple parts tend to be relatively sharp. When they changed the thickness of the main blade shank from 2.7mm to 2.4mm, for example, this also involved changing the spring and the corresponding backside tool (corkscrew or Phillips SD). I think that you will never find a pre-3 variant of the backside Phillips SD on a SAK with a 2.4mm main blade shank, because they never made such variants that would fit. When a transition involves a single fully interchangeable part, however, the older parts tend to keep getting used in overlap with the new ones.

There are actually two non-interchangeable types of variant 3 of the backside Phillips SD. The first appeared towards the end of the Victoria era and has a 2.7mm shank. I expect that it was used in some overlap with both variant 2b and variant 1b (because they were all interchangeable). The second has a 2.4mm shank and was introduced along with the corresponding main blades (this should be the only square backside Phillips SD that you will find along with these newer blades).
I happen to have a similar Grand-Prix. The only difference is that mine has the older big-gap scissors. I believe it to be from "around 1973." For me this essentially means 1972-1974. I tend to be skeptical about anyone's ability to date SAKs with an error margin of less than a year (except, maybe, a small number of very special cases). Nevertheless, I'm curious how you would date the two Victoria craftsmen in the attached image (sorry about the quality). I believe them to be from "around 1973" as well. Both have the same standard-gap scissors with a black spring. The only differences are as follows: The upper one has the can-key Phillips (variant 3) and a scraper on the cap-lifter. The lower one has a file on the Phillips (variant 1b) and no scraper on the cap-lifter.

This is like the 84mm double cut file on the Philiips.

Basically, take everything you think you know, and just throw that out. Look at the auction pictures again. Pretty much prove everything you say in the above two posts to be flat out wrong. Or buy the knife and see for yourself.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on November 27, 2020, 10:37:40 PM
Well my Elsener Zug or INOX Y D arrived today. I’m more than a little concerned that the Elsener Zug is engraved with a pen and not a stamp. If I had a keener eye I wouldn’t have bid on it. I’m hoping that someone can verify that Victorinox would have done this when they reconditioned the knife. The description on the auction said it was at Victorinox. Either that or the Zug retailer would have done that before the knife was sold. The INOX YD stamp looks legit as does the rest of the knife. The blades look reprofiled and reconditioned with a high polish. It’s smooth as glass open and closing, nickel silver liners and old looking scales. What’s everyone’s thoughts?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on November 27, 2020, 10:40:25 PM
Another shot...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on November 28, 2020, 01:03:05 AM
Here’s a shot of the stamp on the other side. This looks legit.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 28, 2020, 03:44:09 AM
What’s everyone’s thoughts?

I do think you’re right that it’s engraved. I have been under the assumption that it is ‘normal’. But I do not have many knives as such and in general prefer tangs stamped with dies like the INOXYD one.

AFAIK, It’s all legit.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on November 28, 2020, 04:33:52 AM
I do think you’re right that it’s engraved. I have been under the assumption that it is ‘normal’. But I do not have many knives as such and in general prefer tangs stamped with dies like the INOXYD one.

AFAIK, It’s all legit.
Thanks kamakiri. The inoxyd stamp is on the same knife so I think the blade is legit also. I also prefer stamped tangs. It does look like it was rebuilt professionally so it leads me to believe Victorinox did the work.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on November 28, 2020, 10:30:10 AM
Hi Kamakiri!  I think it would be great if you could share your dating of the tools, backsprings and back tools changes between 1973-1983.  A lot of small changes have been made and you need to have a large number of samples for comparison.  Not all of us have as many 1970s knives as you do, I'm sure.  Well, especially for me, please, your opinion on awl dating in the period from 1973 to 1985. Many thanks!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on November 28, 2020, 07:34:27 PM
Hi Kamakiri!  I think it would be great if you could share your dating of the tools, backsprings and back tools changes between 1973-1983. 

Best thing I can say is that I’m working on it.  :D

I don’t have anything planned specifically for backsprings though. I’ve avoided somewhat writing what was supposed to be the first chapter about my philosophy and methods...which really should go first, but perhaps easiest to write last.

I also don’t want to have the issue as ulli pointed out about updates. Lack of editing ability makes posts rather final.

There is also somewhat the issue of credibility. Like in the example of the “1973” knife for sale, would I really have to point out over a dozen things to ‘show’ that it’s c.’76? I can also just ‘prove’ it’s not ‘73 with as little as the tweezer. Seriously, would that be enough?  :dunno:

One chapter/topic I conceptualized would be titled “Stare ‘till it hurts”. It would only contain pictures and stipulated dates...nothing else. Like the catalogs, I’m not sure how many would appreciate the topic.

I just gotta figure out what I’ll post next. Or if I’m going to do a bit more on the catalogs with the Hoffritz ones.

A lot of small changes have been made and you need to have a large number of samples for comparison.  Not all of us have as many 1970s knives as you do, I'm sure. 

Yes, nobody else is this stupid!  ;)

Sad thing is that I’m not done. Like ulli said, there’s always something new to learn.

Well, especially for me, please, your opinion on awl dating in the period from 1973 to 1985. Many thanks!

Don’t thank me yet!  I posted about awls in my intro thread covering that timeframe. Albeit with some omission errors...and yes it needs updating and refinement. It’s planned for more detail as a separate thread/chapter in my ‘70s series.

(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4807/31662277017_601aafabd8_o.jpg)

Here (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,80164.msg1844561.html#msg1844561)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on November 28, 2020, 07:56:42 PM
Well my Elsener Zug or INOX Y D arrived today. I’m more than a little concerned that the Elsener Zug is engraved with a pen and not a stamp. If I had a keener eye I wouldn’t have bid on it. I’m hoping that someone can verify that Victorinox would have done this when they reconditioned the knife. The description on the auction said it was at Victorinox. Either that or the Zug retailer would have done that before the knife was sold. The INOX YD stamp looks legit as does the rest of the knife. The blades look reprofiled and reconditioned with a high polish. It’s smooth as glass open and closing, nickel silver liners and old looking scales. What’s everyone’s thoughts?

Thats a really cool knife, you dont have to be concerned about it. I dont know any victorinox knife with a lacking front tang stamp. So your knife is factory made, or the knifemaker elsener zug assembled them and engraved the knives with his name. That was common those days. Value I would estimate $50-80 $.
Dübendorfer was a small company from Bassersdorf: "The purpose of the company is gravel and concrete deliveries, building material recycling, industrial waste disposal, dump service and transport, management of real estate, trade in miniatures. "
Had a history over 100 years, that ended in 2012.

I have a similar knife, but instead of inoxyd it has a victoria switzerland stainless stamp on the back.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on November 28, 2020, 08:21:11 PM
Thats a really cool knife, you dont have to be concerned about it. I dont know any victorinox knife with a lacking front tang stamp. So your knife is factory made, or the knifemaker elsener zug assembled them and engraved the knives with his name. That was common those days. Value I would estimate $50-80 $.
Dübendorfer was a small company from Bassersdorf: "The purpose of the company is gravel and concrete deliveries, building material recycling, industrial waste disposal, dump service and transport, management of real estate, trade in miniatures. "
Had a history over 100 years, that ended in 2012.

I have a similar knife, but instead of inoxyd it has a victoria switzerland stainless stamp on the back.
Thanks for that info ulli. I put $102 dollars on the auction not expecting to win. I won. So I overpaid a little. I don’t feel too bad because I like it. I’m just learning about SAKs so I’ll chalk it up as a lesson learned. You have some nice examples.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on November 29, 2020, 12:14:48 AM
Ulli, what is this pattern? Officers or a bartender/waiter?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on November 29, 2020, 12:36:24 AM
Thanks for that info ulli. I put $102 dollars on the auction not expecting to win. I won. So I overpaid a little. I don’t feel too bad because I like it. I’m just learning about SAKs so I’ll chalk it up as a lesson learned. You have some nice examples.

I think you paid a fair price for a knife you like.  I like it too and if I didn't have one that is similar, I would have likely paid the same.
Some folks on this forum have the luxury of being in the collecting arena so long they know how often a particular knife will come up for sale/bid.
Like you, I don't have all that time/knowledge experience so I have to go with what I like.  Enjoy that one in good health.  :tu: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on November 29, 2020, 05:50:16 AM
I think you paid a fair price for a knife you like.  I like it too and if I didn't have one that is similar, I would have likely paid the same.
Some folks on this forum have the luxury of being in the collecting arena so long they know how often a particular knife will come up for sale/bid.
Like you, I don't have all that time/knowledge experience so I have to go with what I like.  Enjoy that one in good health.  :tu: :cheers:
Thank you. The knife definitely has a quality feel about it.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on November 29, 2020, 08:57:50 AM
Ulli, what is this pattern? Officers or a bartender/waiter?

Its an officer knife, model nr 248k (k means small, 84 mm instead of 91 mm). It later becomes a name, the "gourmet".
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on November 29, 2020, 02:35:52 PM
Its an officer knife, model nr 248k (k means small, 84 mm instead of 91 mm). It later becomes a name, the "gourmet".
Thanks
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on December 03, 2020, 06:39:10 AM
Not really sure this would help regarding the “1973” knife, but the attached pic has a comparison against two knives that are between ‘73 and ‘76. One is closer to ‘73 and the other, of course, closer to ‘76.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on December 03, 2020, 06:26:05 PM
More comparison...Two Grands Prix variants one ‘73 and the other c.’74.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on December 08, 2020, 11:36:47 PM
 :dunno: Okay...I guess the tang size and comparison doesn’t convince.  :think:

I can also just ‘prove’ it’s not ‘73 with as little as the tweezer. Seriously, would that be enough?  :dunno:

Perhaps the tweezer might. They change in between the dates in question.

The knife in question has the latter style and the scale to fit it. Makes sense?

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on December 10, 2020, 07:54:56 PM
So I’m guessing that the silence equals acceptance regarding the “1973” knife?  The tweezer was enough proof? :dunno:

Is there anyone who sees what I mean about one of the 2.7mm parts running out from the blade layer? Lots of views, but no comments.

I understand that the blade layer change alone doesn’t prove that the knife isn’t ‘73 or c.’73. But there are other tools and more importantly what I call ‘construction’ that makes the knife later. And the knife in question does not have the same construction in both parts and protocol for other Champion knives that are ‘74 and well into ‘75. So from both parts and construction/assembly the knife can not be ‘73 or c.’73.

To me, it seems to fit with Victorinox needing to take the time to figure out how or that they want to use the rest of the remaining 2.7mm parts. The solution is not unlike how knives were built when the ‘bird head’ spacers were thicker than 1mm ones used since the ‘60s.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on December 10, 2020, 11:34:23 PM
Closer comparison might help see the thickness difference?  :dunno:

This time with the blades open. “1973” knife is on the top in both crops.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on December 12, 2020, 06:01:32 PM
Not my knife, but I think a good example of a knife that I can say 100% is c.‘73 production.

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/51kAAOSwrjtfb8Ji/s-l1600.jpg)

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/zcMAAOSwI8Vfb8Jm/s-l1600.jpg)

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on December 12, 2020, 11:05:34 PM
Not my knife, but I think a good example of a knife that I can say 100% is c.‘73 production.

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/51kAAOSwrjtfb8Ji/s-l1600.jpg)

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/zcMAAOSwI8Vfb8Jm/s-l1600.jpg)

Any guesses on the part that actually gives me the highest confidence regarding Chronology?  And no, it’s not the clip point. That’s my only hint. These pictures are surprisingly good in that respect. Normally, I would need the knife in hand to see the needed details.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on December 12, 2020, 11:17:14 PM
Obviously, 1973 was the only year they made half scissors as a cost cutting measure :dunno:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on December 12, 2020, 11:53:04 PM
Obviously, 1973 was the only year they made half scissors as a cost cutting measure :dunno:

Well, duh.  ::)

I’m surprised you missed the spring delete too.  :D

 ;)  :rofl:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ComboTool on December 13, 2020, 04:18:44 PM
I fail to see how a half scissors can be a cutting measure :whistle:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on December 14, 2020, 01:11:40 AM
Not my knife, but this is an example of another clip point that is certainly not c.’73

Notice that it doesn’t have a ‘Victoria era’ backspring like noted previously in the thread.

Note the VSSR/OS tang stamps.

I hope this is clear enough proof of what I’ve been saying.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: teno_ioti on December 14, 2020, 09:59:32 PM
Are this:

(https://otroblogdemarcelo.files.wordpress.com/2020/12/img_20201210_090005.jpg?w=1024)

Vintage enought ?

Cheers!

Marcelo from Argentina
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on December 15, 2020, 09:14:58 PM
Hello everyone!  I found that I also have a few 1970s Champions, even with whole scissors.  I thought it would be interesting to list the tool changes you know and the approximate dates.  In the pictures there are two champions pre 1973, two 1973-1974 (I believe, but you can correct me) and last two from c.1974 and late 1970s. 
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201215/f8b943d22e5643459fe7445ef713e859.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201215/0eba6601491e678c4c5bda67673841bd.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201215/d11194b015198d680593d5998beda7aa.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201215/c0fdbd418dd17e3c16a0e17e8578066f.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20201215/cf017dcc0348fbfe516be4514c35a226.jpg)
Here is my list of changes we can see on knives above, correct and add it please!
 1. Let's list well known 1973 changes together:
 - introduction of a magnifying glass and phillips
 -scissors now without LNF and, accordingly, on the opposite side of the main blade
 -a new kind of metal saw / file plus a small flat screwdriver on its back
 -ruler on hook extractor
 - introduction of a corkscrew with 4 turns
 -reduction of the thickness of the main blade from 2.7 to 2.4mm
 -changing the type of spring of blades
 - missing Victoria Officier's Suisse crossbow stamp
 - introduction of clip point small blade
 2. Scissors model 1952 with a single spring - until 1973
 3. Transit scissors (late 1960s) with long groove, double spring, blunt ends -  until 1973 or 1974?
 4. Scissors with short groove, double spring, small spring attachment hole and screw, blunt ends 1973(?) - 1974(?)
 5. Scissors with double thinner spring, large spring hole and screw, sharp ends 1975-1991
 6. Thick liner between metal saw and wood saw - since ?
 7. Additional full liner without cutouts (see Champion on the right) - since ?
 8. Notch at the end of the metal saw/wood saw spring 1979?
 9. Changing the shape of the wood saw end - 1979?
 10. Blank main blade stamp- 1973-1974?
 11. Officier's Suisse crossbow stamp - since 1974 or 1975?


Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rizio Il Ghiro on December 15, 2020, 10:21:45 PM
Wow - what a collection! :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on December 16, 2020, 01:13:57 AM
Now it looks like we’re getting somewhere!  :tu:

But I noticed that the knife in position ‘5’ changes in the bottom pic.  ;) (see attached)

I could use one shot of all 6 from the top tools closed to confirm some things. Perhaps I will wait to ask for more, because several tool details are ‘hidden’ to me with the provided views.

But my guesses for the dates are:

c.’71.75
c.’72.25
c.’73.25
c.’73.5
c.’74.25
Last one...tough to dial in at all and should be the easiest. ‘79ish? Looks like the scaler got the saw backspring or the same stamping.  :dunno: Mod/repair?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on December 16, 2020, 06:22:46 AM
Here is my list of changes we can see on knives above, correct and add it please!
 1. Let's list well known 1973 changes together:
 - introduction of a magnifying glass and phillips
 -a new kind of metal saw / file plus a small flat screwdriver on its back
I think these are pretty clear for start dates. I used to think the back driver was c.‘72, but less so recently.

Quote
-scissors now without LNF and, accordingly, on the opposite side of the main blade
Perhaps yes...the end date for main line knives and Champions...but not all.

Quote
-ruler on hook extractor
I think very late ‘72 for these. But early ‘73 is certainly possible. There is the example of the 146fmaU with the short-lived early font. I have this in main line and Hoffritz variants.

Quote
- introduction of a corkscrew with 4 turns
 -reduction of the thickness of the main blade from 2.7 to 2.4mm
 -changing the type of spring of blades
 - missing Victoria Officier's Suisse crossbow stamp
 - introduction of clip point small blade
I caution combining the start/introduction dates with the end dates.
2.7mm layer parts were used later than ‘73, and as I’ve been trying to show, MIXED with 2.4mm parts.
Look at how some parts were introduced as 2.7mm, like the 4 loop CS when seen with clip points...

Quote
2. Scissors model 1952 with a single spring - until 1973
 3. Transit scissors (late 1960s) with long groove, double spring, blunt ends -  until 1973 or 1974?
 4. Scissors with short groove, double spring, small spring attachment hole and screw, blunt ends 1973(?) - 1974(?)
I think the relevant starts are ‘51, c.’70
The gap machining is transitional, and varies quite a bit. I haven’t ‘assigned’ a date to the first major variation of the gap size. There is more progression of sorts if you look for it, as well as many other observable traits. Some that are shared with the “1951” when their use overlaps.

 
Quote
5. Scissors with double thinner spring, large spring hole and screw, sharp ends 1975-1991
I think later start. c.’77 late or 2nd half ‘76 at the very earliest, from what I can tell.

Quote
6. Thick liner between metal saw and wood saw - since ? 
From what I can tell, depends on the model. Note that later, it shows up on knives with either saw. Like in later Grands Prix and Campers.

Quote
7. Additional full liner without cutouts (see Champion on the right) - since ?
Look at the “1973” auction knife. ;) Hint, hint.

Quote
8. Notch at the end of the metal saw/wood saw spring 1979?
 9. Changing the shape of the wood saw end - 1979?
these two go together. The surprise for me was the scaler with the bump. Not sure if yours is an error or perhaps a running change that I did not spot or own.

 
Quote
10. Blank main blade stamp- 1973-1974?
I think a later end date.

Quote
11. Officier's Suisse crossbow stamp - since 1974 or 1975?
Ditto on this start date.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on December 19, 2020, 10:30:10 PM
Not my knife, but this is an example of another clip point that is certainly not c.’73

Notice that it doesn’t have a ‘Victoria era’ backspring like noted previously in the thread.

Note the VSSR/OS tang stamps.

I hope this is clear enough proof of what I’ve been saying.
The occurrence of clip point pen blades on SAKs with a 2.4mm blades layer is well known. Here is what JazzBass wrote about it more than eight years ago:
The earliest 2.4mm blade knives seem to come in two flavors: plain back main + spear point pen blade, or "Officier Suisse" back/clip point pen. I have no idea which of these are the older of the two. Plain back 2.4mm blades are more common to see than plain back 2.7mm blades. Mid-late 70s they evolve into the common "Officier Suisse"/spear point pen that you see until the change in 2004.
This is quite different from the following:
2.7mm layer parts were used later than ‘73, and as I’ve been trying to show, MIXED with 2.4mm parts.
You have been circling around something here for about ten posts with quite a few images and I still don't understand what is your EXACT claim. Are you trying to say that they installed 2.4mm blades on SAKs with 2.7mm springs? If so, why can't you just express it in clear language. If you are claiming something else, I cannot even guess what it is. So, what exact mixture (or mixtures) of parts are you referring to? Also, are your claims based on SAKs in your possession or on things that you believe to be seeing in images like the ones that you posted here?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on December 21, 2020, 09:53:30 PM
Well, now I understand the source and manner of the confusion.

I’m trying too hard to bridge small gaps in understanding of the chronology, where larger gaps exist.

I don’t think explaining further is going to help right now. At least not without a massive effort on my part.

The main thing I’d assert is as I said...that the “1973” knife in question isn’t 1973 or even c.’73. The tweezers alone prove that. I probably should have stopped right there to avoid further confusion.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on December 23, 2020, 04:36:55 AM
Well, now I understand the source and manner of the confusion.
I doubt it.

Quote
I’m trying too hard to bridge small gaps in understanding of the chronology, where larger gaps exist.
:rofl:

Quote
I don’t think explaining further is going to help right now.
I tend to agree.

Quote
The tweezers alone prove that.
I wonder what do the tweezers "prove" in the attached image.

Quote
I probably should have stopped right there to avoid further confusion.
Not much real confusion here. I think that quite a lot has been clarified.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on December 23, 2020, 07:32:11 PM
I doubt it.
Well, that’s what you do.

I’ll give you one more thing to doubt. Your dates for the Hoffritz catalogs you posted are closer to the ‘end’ dates for thier use. Particularly the “1974” and “1979” copies. The included price sheets are likely the last ones used for those. The “1979” copy was likely in use by ‘77. 

The irony here is that you’re doubting my claim that the “1973” Super Knife (Champion) isn’t built c.’76. If I’m wrong, then why the heck isn’t it in the “1974” catalog or the one you call “1977”?

FWIW, and I’m sure you’ll doubt something else here...but I have lots of Hoffritz knives from the entire 1970s range to support this. As well as the main line counterparts or ‘twins’ (where available because of models like the 136kmaU). More specifically, enough knives of all product lines that date separately to ‘73 and ‘74...to know 100% that the auction knife isn’t 1973 or even c.’73.

But I see now that I can’t convince you of subtle or minor differences when you don’t seem to have the major ones well sorted. You doubt that the majority of knives can be dated to within a year. And for that I can only feel sorry for you.

The snark about the tweezers, I actually appreciate. But I think you take your fixed opinions far too seriously. Loosen up. You just might learn something. Even if by accident.


Quote
Not much real confusion here. I think that quite a lot has been clarified.

I doubt that.

 :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on December 25, 2020, 02:16:23 PM
You just might learn something.
Why do you think that anyone can learn anything from you when you refuse to answer questions or to otherwise provide explanations that involve any concrete details? In fact, it looks like you specifically avoid concrete details like they were some kind of a taboo. Why is that? Let's try this again; a simple concrete question:

What kind of main blade is installed on what you called the "1973" auction knife?

Clearly, any person can give one of the following three answers: 2.4mm, 2.7mm or "I don't know." What is your answer? I'm guessing that you will not be willing to answer this question. Prove me wrong. ::)

P.S. Since you seem to like communicating this way, I attach images of two of my SAKs. Can you see what I mean?  :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on December 25, 2020, 05:55:45 PM
That’s nuts. You’re essentially challenging me to answer my own question.  :pok:

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on December 25, 2020, 06:06:22 PM
And the that super knife looks like c.’75. And not gonna ask for more pics of that one ‘cause we both know how that goes. Clearly from before the “1973” knife in question. But I’m sure you’ll doubt something there too.   ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on December 28, 2020, 07:00:28 PM
Any Hoffritz lovers ? Nice but pricey (not mine to my regret  ;) )

https://www.ebay.com/itm/c-1973-VTG-Victorinox-HOFFRITZ-Earliest-CHAMPION-C-Swiss-Army-Knife-NEW-IN-BOX-/254674039171?_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l49292

Looks like somebody actually bought it!  :rofl:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VoetSak on December 29, 2020, 12:36:48 AM
Looks like somebody actually bought it!  :rofl:
Ten bucks says its Minichamp. I have never seen so much love for one knife 😂🤣😂🤣🤣😂😆😆😆😆😆😆
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on December 29, 2020, 07:31:03 AM
Ten bucks says its Minichamp. I have never seen so much love for one knife 😂🤣😂🤣🤣😂😆😆😆😆😆😆

 :D I’m not taking that bet!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MexSAK on January 01, 2021, 04:29:10 PM
Hello guys! Happy 2021!

Here is another SAK, also claimed to be from 1973, same seller, but in this case, the featured "Modeler" has a Clip-Point, the VICTORIA stamp and five turns cork screw:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/353338041506
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on January 01, 2021, 05:06:45 PM
Hello guys! Happy 2021!

Here is another SAK, also claimed to be from 1973, same seller, but in this case, the featured "Modeler" has a Clip-Point, the VICTORIA stamp and five turns cork screw:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/353338041506

Wow. I have never seen one that old, and I watch most Modeler auctions as its one of my favorite models. I would love to see it with the scales off to see if its real, or a repair/mod of a similar vintage Champion. You know that Victorinox was making mag glass knives in the early 70s "Victoria" era, so its not unheard of that this is a real thing. But this is the first time I've ever seen one. Until this the only Victoria-era mag glass knives I've seen are Passengers, Explorers, and Champions.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 01, 2021, 05:27:49 PM
Hi Jazzbass, you're right about the scales.  One day I finally found the Champion with old tools, VOS stamp and a magnifying glass / Phillips but when I removed the scales I found it was reriveted.  As for the c.1973 Modeler, one similar was shown by German collector a few years ago and I saved a couple of photos.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210101/b3d004e5226b82bb42a72e2e3cf87654.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210101/815160a8b1306db2fb4be5621a5be39f.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MexSAK on January 01, 2021, 05:37:40 PM
Why would someone remove the scales from a 1970s SAK in order to verify anything? The scales would get damaged in the process, didn't they? There should be any other ways to make sure that it is -or not- a MODED SAK... Please share  ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 01, 2021, 05:50:30 PM
Why would someone remove the scales from a 1970s SAK in order to verify anything? The scales would get damaged in the process, didn't they? There should be any other ways to make sure that it is -or not- a MODED SAK... Please share  ;)
Some folks can tell, I started a topic about this very question:
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,70857.msg1430680.html#msg1430680
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on January 01, 2021, 06:34:43 PM
As for the c.1973 Modeler, one similar was shown by German collector a few years ago and I saved a couple of photos.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210101/b3d004e5226b82bb42a72e2e3cf87654.jpg)

That's cool - thanks for sharing. I like to see several of these in the wild before assuming they're real. It's reasonable to think they'd make several runs of different tool combos as they were expanding the line by in 73-74. Until this, though, the earliest Modeler I've ever seen was early 80s.

Why would someone remove the scales from a 1970s SAK in order to verify anything? The scales would get damaged in the process, didn't they? There should be any other ways to make sure that it is -or not- a MODED SAK... Please share  ;)

You can remove the scales without damage if you get them warm. These early 70s scales are a challenge because the plastic itself is not very stable (observe how the ends are curling up - super common with knives from this era). I did this on an early 90s Yeoman I found years ago that had a pen blade in place of the combo tool. Its the only one I've ever seen and I was 90% sure it was a mod and not factory. Pulled the scales and to my surprise - factory rivets. It's either a mistake that slipped through QC, a low volume custom order or a test idea for a new model that got sold off.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 01, 2021, 08:51:31 PM
Looks correct to me for early ‘73.  Also note that there’s no backside SD. Hard detail to ‘fake’ if you didn’t already know.

Nice part about partly peeling scales are they can be ‘verified’ as original assembly without taking them off.

Thanks Mexsak for the post and jnoxyd for the comparison pic.  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 02, 2021, 10:30:24 AM
One more Modeler from my collection. Think it’s a little later then VOS stamped one shown above. Mine has 2.4mm blank stamp blade, small holes/black spring scissors. Look at the liners type and arrangement , pics together another  1970s knife (c.1976-1979)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210102/d80d7ad2f8f5859fbe82b628ba6c30ab.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210102/4722ec771dc54ec196e1ca3b2a30db44.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210102/4895e20bf0c96f93da4c17fb2711fbe1.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210102/b5dc9b2367f978a56f43c50b9bd97eec.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 02, 2021, 07:06:08 PM
‘74-‘75 for sure. No way it’s on the + side of ‘76. Argument for ‘76 would be weak, IMO.

The Grand Prix is ‘78-‘79.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on January 02, 2021, 07:13:14 PM
%u201874-%u201875 for sure. No way it%u2019s on the + side of %u201876. Argument for %u201876 would be weak, IMO.

How so? All these dates are approximate at best. Parts fall to the bottom of bins, repairs made, etc. Esp the older knives in times when things were changing a lot (like the 73-80 time frame).
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 02, 2021, 07:18:00 PM
Not sure of age of this one, but it seems to be similar to jnoxyd's:

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50791379063_54bb7d5563_w.jpg)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50792244887_0d314b813c_w.jpg)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50791379053_ba7ee60245_w.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 02, 2021, 07:25:09 PM
Not sure of age of this one, but it seems to be similar to jnoxyd's:

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50791379063_54bb7d5563_w.jpg)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50792244887_0d314b813c_w.jpg)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50791379053_ba7ee60245_w.jpg)
Yours is ‘85-‘86. Early ‘87 at the very latest.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 02, 2021, 07:26:11 PM
Yours is ‘85-‘86. Early ‘87 at the very latest.
Thank you, I didn't know what age it was.  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 02, 2021, 07:34:40 PM
How so? All these dates are approximate at best. Parts fall to the bottom of bins, repairs made, etc. Esp the older knives in times when things were changing a lot (like the 73-80 time frame).

This is exactly why argument for ‘76+ would be ‘weak’. Lots of things would have to be from the bottom of their respective bins. And that’s rarely done with main line construction.

My feeling without seeing more detail is that it’s about early ‘75.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 02, 2021, 07:37:44 PM
Thank you, I didn't know what age it was.  :tu:
:cheers:
I should also say, if and assuming it has no eyelet in the awl that it would likely be on the ‘85 side of that range.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 02, 2021, 07:41:56 PM
:cheers:
I should also say, if and assuming it has no eyelet in the awl that it would likely be on the ‘85 side of that range.
It has a an eyelet.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 02, 2021, 07:52:05 PM
It has a an eyelet.
Then ‘86 it should be!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jazzbass on January 02, 2021, 08:00:19 PM
This is exactly why argument for %u201876+ would be %u2018weak%u2019. Lots of things would have to be from the bottom of their respective bins. And that%u2019s rarely done with main line construction.

My feeling without seeing more detail is that it%u2019s about early %u201875.

This doesn't answer my question. How is the argument weak? You make a lot of assertions as fact without explaining the logic behind them. Not saying you're wrong, I'd just love to know the thought process.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MexSAK on January 02, 2021, 08:11:03 PM
Thank you, Kamakiri, Holder_Beholder, Jnoxyd, all you guys, for sharing your knowledge.
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 02, 2021, 08:18:15 PM
It has a an eyelet.
This is why I suggested the "list of changes" above. Taking into account various changes in knife construction, materials, tools, stamps and keeping in mind the "parts from the bottom of the bin" (I like this meme! ) we can determine the possible production time range of the knife.
My mother-in-law doctor calls this differential diagnosis.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on January 02, 2021, 10:51:56 PM
Lisa, that knife is gorgeous!  It looks like it just came out of the shipping box  :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 03, 2021, 04:53:36 AM
Thank you, Kamakiri, Holder_Beholder, Jnoxyd, all you guys, for sharing your knowledge.

 :cheers: That’s what the thread is for!

This doesn't answer my question. How is the argument weak? You make a lot of assertions as fact without explaining the logic behind them. Not saying you're wrong, I'd just love to know the thought process.

A knife assembled in or after ‘76 should have parts made in or shortly before ‘76 and have ‘construction’ details consistent with ‘76 or later. Doesn’t have all of that. And that’s why I’d say an argument for ‘76 or later would be ‘weak’.

I’m assuming I don’t have to get into details about why it can be ‘74-‘75.

This is why I suggested the "list of changes" above. Taking into account various changes in knife construction, materials, tools, stamps and keeping in mind the "parts from the bottom of the bin" (I like this meme! ) we can determine the possible production time range of the knife.
My mother-in-law doctor calls this differential diagnosis.

I think you get it. I don’t blindly ignore the ‘binning’ issue. But it’s not as widespread and random as some might think.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 03, 2021, 06:16:48 AM
Esp the older knives in times when things were changing a lot (like the 73-80 time frame).

I think it’s all the little changes make it easier to separate production into individual, perhaps even discreet annual production. The interesting part is how they can tie different product lines and even different frame sizes.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 05, 2021, 01:22:07 AM
Any guesses on this one?

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50800934538_540bd78471_z.jpg)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50801676781_02be5ea584_o.jpg)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50801676766_108ff57008_o.jpg)

Anybody have one like it? Parts-wise, that is.

Again, seems original to me and despite the unique parts combination, I think it can be dated to sub half year accuracy from just these pics.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 05, 2021, 01:33:49 AM
An Angler with a file... :think: I'm stumped.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on January 05, 2021, 02:01:54 AM
Anybody have one like it? Parts-wise, that is.
Yes, many of us do. It's a Fischermesser F235fmaU (like the one in the attached brochure). The scales were probably blue, once upon a time, and it looks like the fish inlay was destroyed by corrosion. It's well known that the blue scales on these SAKs were often very unstable. This particular discoloration seems to be a bit unusual, though. Quite interesting.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 05, 2021, 02:11:32 AM
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50802013632_7715c3636a_w.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on January 05, 2021, 03:01:15 AM


Very nice FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pa_strunk on January 05, 2021, 03:06:20 AM
 :iagree: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 05, 2021, 05:45:02 AM
I’m sorry, everybody! I thought it would be clear what it is...but less so on when it is from.

Mine pictured below are all +PAT...

Does anybody have one like the other beat up one in their collection...and can anybody make a guess about when it was produced?

.
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 05, 2021, 07:42:21 AM
I’m sorry, everybody! I thought it would be clear what it is...but less so on when it is from.

Mine pictured below are all +PAT...

Does anybody have one like the other beat up one in their collection...and can anybody make a guess about when it was produced?

.
Do you mean your knife has no +Pat can opener (post 1971) and all other tools from Victoria era (till 1973) and was made in this time range?
Yes, all of my blue "Fischermessers" also have +Pat but very close 234f  doesn't have it. It also has pre73 blades and corkscrew but already has ruler on fishtool. So it was made a bit later than yours.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210105/b0284c7eaed61c69ef6723bd334f94c3.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 05, 2021, 05:19:27 PM
Do you mean your knife has no +Pat can opener (post 1971) and all other tools from Victoria era (till 1973) and was made in this time range?

The knife I posted on the other page is from an auction knife. It does not have the +PAT. All three of my knives above with the black background do.

One reason I have used auction pics for examples is that we can all look at the same picture and I won’t have the distinct advantage of taking the pics or using a knife I own and can hold or inspect under a loupe. Essentially, I can often asses a precise date with smurfy *bay auction pics, when they are ‘good enough’ to see what I need to.

Quote
Yes, all of my blue "Fischermessers" also have +Pat but very close 234f  doesn't have it. It also has pre73 blades and corkscrew but already has ruler on fishtool. So it was made a bit later than yours.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210105/b0284c7eaed61c69ef6723bd334f94c3.jpg)

Excellent example...what is your date estimate for this one and the damaged one I posted earlier? All estimates and guesses welcome. Please include reasons why.

....


I feel my answer to jazzbass did not satisfy. One or all, regarding my process. My earlier attempts to ‘show’ differences about the “1973” Hoffritz didn’t seem to help. So I am trying again with a new example.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 05, 2021, 08:06:19 PM
Not sure of age of this one, but it seems to be similar to jnoxyd's:

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50791379063_54bb7d5563_w.jpg)

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50792244887_0d314b813c_w.jpg)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50791379053_ba7ee60245_w.jpg)


(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210102/b5dc9b2367f978a56f43c50b9bd97eec.jpg)

FB-
If you show what’s under the in line phillips, it will be clearly different from jnoxyd’s. It should either have a brass collar/spacer surrounding the pin/rivet...or the updated backspring where the center ‘hump’ is rlongated so it touches the pin. Either is possible.

My guess is that it’s the brass collar.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: nitram on January 05, 2021, 08:43:31 PM
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50791379053_ba7ee60245_w.jpg)


(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210102/b5dc9b2367f978a56f43c50b9bd97eec.jpg)

FB-
If you show what’s under the in line phillips, it will be clearly different from jnoxyd’s. It should either have a brass collar/spacer surrounding the pin/rivet...or the updated backspring where the center ‘hump’ is rlongated so it touches the pin. Either is possible.

My guess is that it’s the brass collar.


Interesting, I just noticed that collar on one of mine today and posted a question about it. I had to go back and check, the backsprings are different on the newer ones and the older Champs have no hump or collar. Just out of curiosity, is there a timeframe known for this?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 05, 2021, 08:57:17 PM

Interesting, I just noticed that collar on one of mine today and posted a question about it. I had to go back and check, the backsprings are different on the newer ones and the older Champs have no hump or collar. Just out of curiosity, is there a timeframe known for this?

Yes, it’s believe it to be roughly ‘81 to ‘86. I’ll expand a bit more in your other thread (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,86336.msg2196936.html#msg2196936).
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 05, 2021, 09:22:58 PM

The knife I posted on the other page is from an auction knife. It does not have the +PAT. All three of my knives above with the black background do.
...
Excellent example...what is your date estimate for this one and the damaged one I posted earlier? All estimates and guesses welcome. Please include reasons.
To be honest, we still do not have a consensus here on the sequence and dates of changes in the 1973-1975 transit period.  So I usually use 1973 as a reference year for the end of the Victoria era and the introduction of new tools such as magnifier, Phillips, 2.4mm blade, spear point blade, new file / metal saw, screwdriver on back, ruler on hook remover.  So (roughly) your self-destructive knife is from 1972 (no +Pat) -1973(VOS stamp, Victoria age tools) and mine - from 1973.  I will be happy to hear the arguments in favor of your, I am sure, more detailed dating ;)
P.S. Remind me please where we had discussion here about different fonts on fish hook extractor .
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 06, 2021, 01:00:52 AM
To be honest, we still do not have a consensus here on the sequence and dates of changes in the 1973-1975 transit period. 
True. I would like to achieve that, but it is not the top priority for me. I’d be happy with removal of gross (as in large) errors.

Quote
So I usually use 1973 as a reference year for the end of the Victoria era and the introduction of new tools such as magnifier, Phillips, 2.4mm blade, spear point blade, new file / metal saw, screwdriver on back, ruler on hook remover.  So (roughly) your self-destructive knife is from 1972 (no +Pat) -1973(VOS stamp, Victoria age tools) and mine - from 1973.  I will be happy to hear the arguments in favor of your, I am sure, more detailed dating ;)

For yours, I would stipulate ‘73 production. Probably 1st half, without seeing more. Basically to confirm there are no ‘74+ parts or ‘construction’ issues. I would ask for additional pictures of top and bottom tools closed, as I often do.

Before you post those two pics, please compare you knife to the pictures I posted. And see if you still think they are in separate year production.

Broadly, I agree that it ‘must’ or at least should be from between ‘71.5 and ~’73.5. There are some subtle details that change in that time. Consider especially the two picture views that I ask for.


Quote
P.S. Remind me please where we had discussion here about different fonts on fish hook extractor .
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 06, 2021, 01:03:14 AM
Oops forgot to answer about the numbered scalers...I don’t recall much discussion on them, but probably somewhere in this thread.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on January 06, 2021, 04:15:05 AM
P.S. Remind me please where we had discussion here about different fonts on fish hook extractor .
Several threads, over the years, but most importantly here:
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,82709.0.html
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 06, 2021, 03:41:47 PM
Several threads, over the years, but most importantly here:
Many thanks, MiniChamp!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 06, 2021, 04:50:25 PM
Hi Kamakiri!
Here are the photos you like ;). But I still believe that your knife could (just could!) have been made in an earlier period (than mine) from 1972 (no + Pat on the opener, single bevel no scale fish scaler) and until 1973 (all parts/stamps in my opinion are from the Victoria era).  My knife has a scale and font is 1973 version (according to Jazzbass) and Victoria era tools/stamps. In addition, your knife has full middle liners, which is typical for the pre-1973 era, I showed below a same tool set knife from c.1973 that has liners with cutouts.  Show me please what part of your knife could not have been completed before 1973?  Maybe awl?
I've put together a small selection of similar knives from the 1960s-1970s.  By the way, it is interesting that the right Fisherman looks from 1979-1980 (notch on the back spring, nickel silver emblem) has a pre73 liner of the blade line from the "bottom of the bin" (yes, also it can be repaired )
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210106/59f282ca60c69ebc325e44ba854b6aa3.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210106/4a64bb47a9498c93d1029a73c8ed5a5b.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210106/c3fe502ccaedc70a5bd6ffc4cd0f6424.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210106/dd12dae02fa6a61d6677dc3e22e1719e.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210106/3e19e7c464d0ac4d967d33b054892105.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210106/f722fcfbd16ed5dcb94e39cfeb66ae8e.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 06, 2021, 09:30:49 PM
Focus on that first comparison that I asked you for. Consider this...remove the scissor and metal saw from the knife I posted and then how many differences remain? Do the same for your latest +PAT knife.

For the visible ‘73 or ‘73+ parts there are two. One (neither of the previous two) that is visibly unique from all your other knives in the above post.

Is that a can key on the first non +PAT?

Maybe more ‘73 knives than you were thinking.  ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 07, 2021, 04:12:52 PM
Focus on that first comparison that I asked you for...
...Is that a can key on the first non +Pat?
There’s no can key but single-cut file 1b type (according MiniChamp)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210107/be3e76facbcdefebf776468ad52ce449.jpg)

What about knives comparison... On my 235fmU knives from 1960s, early 1970s, c.1973 (234f) and c.1973 I see only these differences :
-different liners on opener line (they really changed from full 1960s variant to post73 variant but not sure about dating middle one);
-slightly different awl body shape (no idea if it can help in dating)
-sharpened edge on bottle opener (do you have exact date when they stop it?)
We don’t talk about bail/key rings, scissors type/layout, fish scaler and scales color and emblem.
What am I missing? C’mon Kamakiri, share your knowledge with us.  I am sure it will be very useful and interesting.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210107/e9863eb113dd36ce3f098bce44653ce2.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210107/7d14e4b2cd3e5324025c9401aff31a2e.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 07, 2021, 05:51:44 PM
There’s no can key but single-cut file 1b type (according MiniChamp)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210107/be3e76facbcdefebf776468ad52ce449.jpg)
Maybe that one is late ‘71. Same ‘pose’ flipped over might help.
Quote
What about knives comparison... On my 235fmU knives from 1960s, early 1970s, c.1973 (234f) and c.1973 I see only these differences :
-different liners on opener line (they really changed from full 1960s variant to post73 variant but not sure about dating middle one);
:tu: This is one of the things to understand. But first, you need to know the construction protocol is different depending on what tool is next to it. In other words, you cannot equate the opener-scaler to opener-scissor, etc. The construction protocols for liners depend on what is on both sides.

The same applies to the knife liners in later years.

Quote
-slightly different awl body shape (no idea if it can help in dating)
Changes in the awl are somewhat irrelevant in the tight scope of ‘71.5 to ‘73.5 range.

Quote
-sharpened edge on bottle opener (do you have exact date when they stop it?)
I don’t have an exact date, but I believe ‘74 is devoid of them. Early ‘73 knives seem to all have them. Some later ‘73 do not. I am not sure if it is just by time or by model or by batching to explain why. All three could be relevant factors.
Quote
We don’t talk about bail/key rings, scissors type/layout, fish scaler and scales color and emblem.
We can expand a bit, but already we are discussing many parts and details.

There is some info to be gleaned from the scaler. Hard to see from that auction pic.
Quote
What am I missing? C’mon Kamakiri, share your knowledge with us.  I am sure it will be very useful and interesting.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210107/e9863eb113dd36ce3f098bce44653ce2.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210107/7d14e4b2cd3e5324025c9401aff31a2e.jpg)
What am I not sharing?  ;)

I feel like I blab about chronology stuff whenever possible. And yes, I frequently do provide dates with explaining or taking the time to explain. That’s why I have the “dating in the ‘70’s” series.

Thinking back to yesterday when I posted in the thread about the Explorer and the non-anodized liners and no hook making it ‘90-‘91...I could or should have clarified or added that it is because of models like the ‘89 Battle series and the ‘91 Rutli and the Apollo 30th as well as misc. changeover knives that I have. But I don’t sit at a computer much anymore (it was a 2020 new year resolution) and I hate typing on this smurfing phone. But it’s what I do now.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 09, 2021, 05:22:49 AM
No other observations? Saw something else that’s different. Perhaps not so specific to ‘73, but observable difference in your grouping and the knife in question.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 09, 2021, 10:17:04 PM
One thing I’d like to point out is that the scissors on the Fish related models do not all follow the same timeline. 235faU use the 1951 style scissors longer, and believe due to the crimper and splitter functions that were not (to my knowledge) updated on the 1970 style scissors. Xfile’s c.’70 knife (attached) is a good example.

One oddball trait on the non-PAT 235faU I posted is the finish on the scissors. Similar to one of the Elinox finishes, but also shared traits with early 1970 style. Something I see ending within 1973.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 12, 2021, 12:47:43 AM
Maybe this helps? Differences in parts and construction/assembly protocol matter. Again, I assert that there is more similarity in the ‘damaged’ 235faU knife I posted on the previous page to jnoxyd’s 234faU and that they are both ‘73.
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 12, 2021, 09:26:07 AM
Hello Kamakiri!  Sorry, but I showed these different profile liners from can opener/bottle opener line 5 days ago (though without arrows):
 "...-different liners on opener line (they really changed from full 1960s variant to post73 variant but not sure about dating middle one)"
 I was not sure at first what type of liner is on the damaged knife, but maybe you're right and it's 1973 (and knife couldn't be made earlier). Okay, and what is one more difference you mentioned above?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 12, 2021, 05:34:53 PM
I responded to the liners question in post #1397?  :dunno:

I posted the composite picture to show them side by side and the arrows for anyone else looking.

The other differences are visible in the pics and are differences in finish and machining details. That’s all I’m going to say here on this topic. Others feel I’ve already overstayed my welcome in this thread regarding 1973-ish knives.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 12, 2021, 08:06:36 PM
Hello everybody!  I want to show a few pictures that are not quite relevant because I am not the owner of this knife or even this picture, to my regret.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210112/47ecec31b8276f911dbc209e78fb8d33.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210112/3dd0f39f4792dbc34757b6426d5dab39.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210112/e552cc552e3d7266815b340e96e9e115.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on January 13, 2021, 01:58:47 AM
Hello everybody!  I want to show a few pictures that are not quite relevant because I am not the owner of this knife or even this picture, to my regret.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210112/47ecec31b8276f911dbc209e78fb8d33.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210112/3dd0f39f4792dbc34757b6426d5dab39.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210112/e552cc552e3d7266815b340e96e9e115.jpg)

This is great, I've seen similar personal letters :climber:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on January 13, 2021, 02:03:26 AM
I recently found a SAK. I think it's the 204 model in the 42 catalog,but it doesn't have the stamps of Victorinox,I'm a little confused. :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on January 13, 2021, 04:47:46 AM
Nice and amazing images jnox

The shield looks very different and the corkscrew has seven turns  ......... aristic license? .... Maybe      :think:

That is a beauty xfile - And in incredible condition for 75 years old - I hope it's not one of those cleverly constructed fakes

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on January 13, 2021, 06:41:24 AM
Nice and amazing images jnox

The shield looks very different and the corkscrew has seven turns  ......... aristic license? .... Maybe      :think:

That is a beauty xfile - And in incredible condition for 75 years old - I hope it's not one of those cleverly constructed fakes
In my experience, this knife should not be an imitation, and it is probably made by Victorinox, but I wonder why there is no stamp on it :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MexSAK on January 14, 2021, 06:09:03 AM
Hello guys. Here is my late blue Fisherman. Have a good Thursday.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on January 14, 2021, 06:30:35 AM
:drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 14, 2021, 06:54:38 AM
Hello guys. Here is my late blue Fisherman. Have a good Thursday.

 :tu: Nice. Very nice. Never seen one of those with a box! Only junky ones with the stainless inlay.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rizio Il Ghiro on January 14, 2021, 08:01:04 AM
That is a nice example! Cool find!  :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on January 14, 2021, 08:22:50 AM
I so want one of those blue Fishermans

Anyone fancy RAKing me ?  ;)

Please, pretty please    :)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on January 14, 2021, 08:45:11 AM
Pretty unusual with the fish and the shield & cross  :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 14, 2021, 01:45:06 PM
Hello guys. Here is my late blue Fisherman. Have a good Thursday.
What a beauty with box!  :like:  :dd:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on January 14, 2021, 03:10:12 PM
What a beauty with box!  :like:  :dd:

 :iagree:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Aloha on January 14, 2021, 03:21:57 PM
 :iagree:
Congrats. 
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MexSAK on January 14, 2021, 09:20:50 PM
Thank you all guys for your nice comments! :cheers: Yes, this blue Fisherman (c. 1991, my guess, screwed scissors + hook) should have been a special run for ORSO Genève.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: elsinox on January 15, 2021, 10:52:39 AM
Here`s a real vintage one to go a bit away from those mid 70s knives  ;) Hope you like it. 100 points for the one who can write the correct catalog number of it.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on January 15, 2021, 10:55:29 AM
290 Cure Pied combo mix-up :)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 15, 2021, 12:45:11 PM
What a knife! It seems to me  it has 1st version “nail file on the hook” ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on January 15, 2021, 01:22:07 PM
Here`s a real vintage one to go a bit away from those mid 70s knives  ;) Hope you like it.
Wow! This is absolutely remarkable!  :like:   :drool:

Quote
100 points for the one who can write the correct catalog number of it.
Unfortunately, I have no real basis from which to deduce such a catalog number (unless, by some miracle, they called it 236H). Seeing a document from which this number can be deduced will be VERY interesting. (Much more interesting than just being told the number.)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Frailer on January 15, 2021, 02:53:07 PM
Here`s a real vintage one to go a bit away from those mid 70s knives  ;) Hope you like it. 100 points for the one who can write the correct catalog number of it.

I have no clue regarding a catalog number for this knife, but I do know that it is a beautiful thing.  Most pre-1960s knifes hold little interest for me, but that one most certainly does.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pfrsantos on January 15, 2021, 03:14:51 PM
Here`s a real vintage one to go a bit away from those mid 70s knives  ;) Hope you like it. 100 points for the one who can write the correct catalog number of it.

Nº 3?

 :think: :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on January 15, 2021, 03:37:30 PM
To be honest, I dont know the model nr :-) In the first catalog I know from 1901, that model already disappeared. It could be a pre-model of the later Nr. 290 in 100 mm. Its not so close to a Nr 236 because of the 4 backsprings. Interesting thing is also, that it has the very first broad screwdriver, and already 9 tools and toothpick/tweezers.

Here s a comparison of the 3 known hooks ;-)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on January 15, 2021, 04:19:43 PM
Are you and Elsinox the same person? ;)

Nice photo. The SAK on the right looks interesting. Never seen a photo of an actual one, only the catalog pics.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on January 15, 2021, 06:44:36 PM
Are you and Elsinox the same person? ;)

Nice photo. The SAK on the right looks interesting. Never seen a photo of an actual one, only the catalog pics.

Maybe ;-)

The model on the right is just a model nr. 240, cure-pied.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on January 15, 2021, 07:03:34 PM
I just sent a SAK to Elsinox and his name is not Ulli. But it's similar.

More pics of that model 240? Pretty please? :)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: elsinox on January 15, 2021, 07:29:21 PM
I think I already shared those pictures. But I added one again.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on January 15, 2021, 07:34:21 PM
That's an awesome piece.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on January 15, 2021, 07:37:11 PM
Yes it is. And everything original, no restoration, no change of blades or scales.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 15, 2021, 07:41:23 PM
Yes it is. And everything original, no restoration, no change of blades or scales.
Wow!  :like:
I think that is considered in the category of "almost unattainable".  As in beyond rare.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 15, 2021, 07:47:46 PM
Yes it is. And everything original, no restoration, no change of blades or scales.
Great knife, Ulli! Thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pfrsantos on January 15, 2021, 08:01:19 PM
That's an awesome piece.

 :whistle:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on January 15, 2021, 08:03:58 PM
:whistle:

:D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on January 15, 2021, 08:04:45 PM
Wow!  :like:
I think that is considered in the category of "almost unattainable".  As in beyond rare.

You should see the rest of his collection. Much nice. So drool. Very yes.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on January 15, 2021, 10:30:23 PM
Fans of the model 240 may find the following Hobie video interesting (it shows one with aluminum scales).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z110MoWhYYg
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rizio Il Ghiro on January 15, 2021, 11:23:55 PM
Thanks for sharing that - I’ve seen the first knife before, but not the second.  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on January 16, 2021, 01:18:03 AM
Here`s a real vintage one to go a bit away from those mid 70s knives  ;) Hope you like it. 100 points for the one who can write the correct catalog number of it.

awesome! Is this hook suitable for lifting boots?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on January 16, 2021, 06:56:59 AM
awesome! Is this hook suitable for lifting boots?

Of course. Its the perfect lifting boot tool :-)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on January 16, 2021, 08:33:17 AM
Of course. Its the perfect lifting boot tool :-)
:like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 16, 2021, 05:00:29 PM
Here`s a real vintage one to go a bit away from those mid 70s knives  ;) Hope you like it. 100 points for the one who can write the correct catalog number of it.

Cool knife, but can you put a date on it? 😉
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on January 16, 2021, 05:36:43 PM
Cool knife, but can you put a date on it? 😉

Sure. The head of the tweezers tells me that this knife was hand grinded and assembled by Mr. Elsener Senior in the 3rd week of april in the year 1898 ;-)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on January 16, 2021, 05:43:14 PM
Impossible. That's when he was on a camping holiday in France.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on January 16, 2021, 05:53:47 PM
Impossible. That's when he was on a camping holiday in France.

Thats what he told his wife. But in fact, he worked day and night on that knife, together with his 12 years old son Karl Elsener the second. The son was so fascinated on that project and of the passion how his father developed that special hoofcleaner, that on that very week, he decided to become also a knifemaker.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on January 16, 2021, 06:11:36 PM
Thanks for sharing that - I’ve seen the first knife before, but not the second.  :cheers:
:hatsoff:  Here is another early SAK with aluminum scales (this one is mine  :D ):

(http://gallery.multitool.org/var/albums/MiniChamp/SAKs/Al205.jpg)

It's a Spartan (model 205) and it's probably a bit older than both of the SAKs in Hobie's video. Also, it has the following features that I find quite interesting:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on January 16, 2021, 06:19:59 PM
...I have one similar with Durinox on the main blade. A bale, newer can opener, grooved corkscrew.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on January 16, 2021, 06:26:35 PM
Wonderfull knife MiniChamp!

I think those aluminium scaled officer knives were produced for the french market. Dont know what was the reason.. but I have seen other similar aluminium scaled knives from french knifemakers. Maybe the french people just like the bling-bling of polished aluminium.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on January 16, 2021, 06:39:38 PM
Wonderfull knife MiniChamp!
Thanks!

Quote
I think those aluminium scaled officer knives were produced for the french market.
Well, I bought this knife from a French seller.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on January 16, 2021, 06:41:04 PM
Wait, I'm damaging my phone with all the drooling that is happening :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 16, 2021, 06:42:00 PM
Nice knife, MiniChamp!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on January 16, 2021, 06:50:42 PM
I have seen a similar knife...
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 16, 2021, 07:20:05 PM
Nice knives ulli and MiniChamp, such rare beauties!  :tu: :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 16, 2021, 11:24:26 PM
A trifecta of goodies arrived today!
Left to right:
84mm Tinker
91mm Modeler -that I worry will end up in the "Crazy" thread as I had to way over pay for it.
91mm Spartan 205u or something, I'll have to look it up
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50842717506_a7a7c44354_w.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 16, 2021, 11:55:47 PM
Sure. The head of the tweezers tells me that this knife was hand grinded and assembled by Mr. Elsener Senior in the 3rd week of april in the year 1898 ;-)
:facepalm:

And I here thought you were without humor.  ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 17, 2021, 12:00:05 AM
A trifecta of goodies arrived today!
Left to right:
84mm Tinker
91mm Modeler -that I worry will end up in the "Crazy" thread as I had to way over pay for it.
91mm Spartan 205u or something, I'll have to look it up
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50842717506_a7a7c44354_w.jpg)

I would have built you a correct looking one for less. Looks like it’s in pretty good shape. Is the metal saw clean-able?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 17, 2021, 12:13:23 AM
I would have built you a correct looking one for less. Looks like it’s in pretty good shape. Is the metal saw clean-able?
Well dang!  :facepalm:  But actually, I'd want this hopefully original one.  Only thing that could have made it better was its box.
I haven't tried to clean the metal saw yet.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on January 17, 2021, 12:28:06 AM
A trifecta of goodies arrived today!
Left to right:
84mm Tinker
91mm Modeler -that I worry will end up in the "Crazy" thread as I had to way over pay for it.
91mm Spartan 205u or something, I'll have to look it up


Very nice finds FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 17, 2021, 12:41:09 AM
Well dang!  :facepalm:  But actually, I'd want this hopefully original one.  Only thing that could have made it better was its box.
I haven't tried to clean the metal saw yet.
Yeah, I’d want one in a box. Anything I can build by reducing a Champion...I’d really only rather have with a box and the correct label.

Congrats on winning it. I’m sure there was competition from MTO viewers.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 17, 2021, 01:35:24 AM
Very nice finds FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Thank you Vicman!  :cheers:
Yeah, I’d want one in a box. Anything I can build by reducing a Champion...I’d really only rather have with a box and the correct label.

Congrats on winning it. I’m sure there was competition from MTO viewers.
I figure I'll hold onto this one until a mint-in-box one comes along....not sure how long that will be. 
Bidding was brutal, I feel the pain.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Frailer on January 17, 2021, 01:52:17 AM
Thank you Vicman!  :cheers:I figure I'll hold onto this one until a mint-in-box one comes along....not sure how long that will be. 
Bidding was brutal, I feel the pain.

I was watching that auction from the sidelines, as I already have a Modeler (albeit a more recent one), but I think we all know the bittersweet feeling of digging deep for something we really want.

Not to worry; it's only money.  Congratulations!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on January 17, 2021, 01:55:25 AM
I was watching that auction from the sidelines, as I already have a Modeler (albeit a more recent one), but I think we all know the bittersweet feeling of digging deep for something we really want.

Not to worry; it's only money.  Congratulations!
Thank you Frailer!   :cheers: I didn't have a Modeler on my side of the collection.  Karl has a more modern one.  I believe I showed it earlier in this thread.

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: teno_ioti on January 17, 2021, 02:27:37 AM
Three editions of Victorinox Camper:

(https://otroblogdemarcelo.files.wordpress.com/2021/01/2021-01-16_09-49-34.jpg?w=700&h=)

(https://otroblogdemarcelo.files.wordpress.com/2021/01/2021-01-16_09-46-29.jpg?w=700&h=)

Check https://otroblogdemarcelo.wordpress.com/2021/01/16/victorinox-camping-circa-1985/ (https://otroblogdemarcelo.wordpress.com/2021/01/16/victorinox-camping-circa-1985/) for more pictures!

Cheers!

Marcelo from Argentina!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on January 17, 2021, 10:51:43 PM
Hi Marcelo!
Your knives are from 1979, ‘90s and ‘00+.

They would also be good in the Camper Collective (https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,74472.0.html) thread.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 18, 2021, 10:17:17 PM
Bumping this thread up with my newest Vintage.



Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Frailer on February 18, 2021, 10:21:12 PM
Bumping this thread up with my newest Vintage.

This looks ever better than it did in the eBay photos. It’s remarkable that it has survived so well.

Congratulations!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rizio Il Ghiro on February 18, 2021, 10:36:42 PM
 :iagree: :like: :like: that’s lovely!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 18, 2021, 11:32:21 PM
Thank you Frailer and Rizio!  :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on February 18, 2021, 11:34:25 PM
Looks great FB!  :like:

Congrats!  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on February 18, 2021, 11:36:59 PM
Looks great FB!  :like:

Congrats!  :tu:
:iagree: what a beauty FB :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 19, 2021, 12:32:20 AM
Thank you kamakiri and Echotech!  :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on February 19, 2021, 01:29:10 AM
Bumping this thread up with my newest Vintage.
That is great! Is this a 1930s SAK?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 19, 2021, 01:31:17 AM
That is great! Is this a 1930s SAK?
I'm sorry, I don't know the age.  Perhaps someone here will know.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: VICMAN on February 19, 2021, 02:57:26 AM
Bumping this thread up with my newest Vintage.

Nice Vintage FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on February 19, 2021, 04:19:06 AM
I'm sorry, I don't know the age.  Perhaps someone here will know.

And they better speak up quickly or I’ll start blabbing about 1973 again!  ;)  :D

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on February 19, 2021, 08:04:20 AM
Beautiful SAK FolderBeholder! And in such a good shape. Look at the shield and cross (actually two separate inlays). They are in surprisingly good condition.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 19, 2021, 01:35:40 PM
Nice Vintage FB! :like: :tu: :tu:
Thank you Vicman!  :cheers:
And they better speak up quickly or I’ll start blabbing about 1973 again!  ;)  :D
And you know how much we all look forward to that!  :pok:  :D :rofl:
Beautiful SAK FolderBeholder! And in such a good shape. Look at the shield and cross (actually two separate inlays). They are in surprisingly good condition.
Thank you Reinier!  :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on February 19, 2021, 06:39:48 PM
And you know how much we all look forward to that!  :pok:  :D :rofl:
:rofl: I know, right?!  :D  Especially the tweezer part.  ;)

I think you got the answer in Hobie’s video?

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 19, 2021, 08:04:49 PM
I think you got the answer in Hobie’s video?
Yes, definitely pre 1923.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on February 20, 2021, 01:11:05 AM
So who can analyze the age of this SAK? :climber:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on February 20, 2021, 05:31:31 AM
So who can analyze the age of this SAK? :climber:

Nice knife!

Definitely 1973. Definitely.  ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on February 20, 2021, 03:00:12 PM
So who can analyze the age of this SAK? :climber:
Nice knife, Xfile! I like combination of four rivets and these stamps. Can you tell what metal are liners made from? Rivets looks steel, aren't they?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on February 21, 2021, 01:14:15 AM
Nice knife!

Definitely 1973. Definitely.  ;)
Thank you kamakiri. But why 1973? What's the special significance of this year? :climber:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on February 21, 2021, 01:23:17 AM
Nice knife, Xfile! I like combination of four rivets and these stamps. Can you tell what metal are liners made from? Rivets looks steel, aren't they?
Hi jnoxyd,Its liners looks like copper, as shown in the picture. I think its rivets and reamer are made of carbon steel, which is very interesting. Can you confirm the right age?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on February 21, 2021, 01:58:03 AM
Thank you kamakiri. But why 1973? What's the special significance of this year? :climber:

 :D

I’m not allowed to say.  ;)

...

The liners are brass, not copper.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on February 21, 2021, 01:12:14 PM
:D

I’m not allowed to say.  ;)

...

The liners are brass, not copper.

I'm just wondering, is there a four rivet structure in the Victorinox of the 1920s? ???
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on February 21, 2021, 10:29:38 PM
I'm just wondering, is there a four rivet structure in the Victorinox of the 1920s? ???

Maybe the stainless parts are replacements in a slightly older knife?  :dunno:

Those two parts can’t be from before 1921.

Well, unless your flux capacitor is working  ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on February 27, 2021, 07:39:16 PM
I'm not how vintage, but has brass liners!

Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: elsinox on February 27, 2021, 08:29:23 PM
I'm just wondering, is there a four rivet structure in the Victorinox of the 1920s? ???

I think the swiss knifemaker "Kloetzli" assembled that knife with victorinox parts. That was common those days. He just used 4 visible pins instead of 3. So he could use 4 pins with the same lenght. Everything looks original. All inox parts.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on February 27, 2021, 11:57:00 PM
Just picked this one up. The stamp looks like 1943-1951. Can someone tell me the pattern and value? Decent condition, I had to stone the blade tip as it looks like it was dropped and the cork screw is slightly bent. Also if you know what the engraving on the blade means. Thanks.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on February 27, 2021, 11:58:00 PM
Some more pics
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on February 27, 2021, 11:58:57 PM
Sorry for the multiple posts. I can’t upload multiple pictures.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on February 28, 2021, 12:09:25 AM
N°247?

Maybe worth ~$100 USD with minor condition issues.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on February 28, 2021, 12:22:42 AM
N°247?

Maybe worth ~$100 USD with minor condition issues.

I did good then, having paid 1/4 of that. Is the N247 the pattern number? Thanks kamakiri.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on February 28, 2021, 01:14:21 AM
I did good then, having paid 1/4 of that. Is the N247 the pattern number? Thanks kamakiri.

Then I think you did very well! At least from what I can see. Main blade looks like it’s only missing the very tip? Hard to tell without seeing it tools closed. Ditto for the valuation without seeing everything like the ends.

I think that’s what it would be. Based on this later catalog:

(http://gallery.multitool.org/var/albums/MiniChamp/Catalogs/Late-1940s_Elsener_Catalog/Elsener_Late-1940s_Catalog_07.jpg?m=1556934415)

I don’t think earlier catalogs have that pattern?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 28, 2021, 01:53:48 AM
Just picked this one up. The stamp looks like 1943-1951. Can someone tell me the pattern and value? Decent condition, I had to stone the blade tip as it looks like it was dropped and the cork screw is slightly bent. Also if you know what the engraving on the blade means. Thanks.
Lovely!  :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: MiniChamp on February 28, 2021, 01:55:40 AM
The stamp looks like 1943-1951. Can someone tell me the pattern and value?
Cool find!  :like:  It's indeed a model 247 and it's probably from the 1943-1946 period (because it has the pre-1946 can opener). Here is the page with this variant from the 1942 catalog (https://www.sakwiki.com/tiki-browse_gallery.php?galleryId=112):

(https://www.sakwiki.com/show_image.php?id=3307&scalesize=o)

Quote
Also if you know what the engraving on the blade means.
That's probably the name of the original retailer that sold this SAK (J. Chesi from the town Neuchatel).
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on February 28, 2021, 04:41:08 AM
Thanks for all the info guys!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on March 01, 2021, 01:52:18 AM
I think the swiss knifemaker "Kloetzli" assembled that knife with victorinox parts. That was common those days. He just used 4 visible pins instead of 3. So he could use 4 pins with the same lenght. Everything looks original. All inox parts.

So you think this knife is assembled with  "Kloetzli", not Victorinox?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on March 01, 2021, 01:54:10 AM
Just picked this one up. The stamp looks like 1943-1951. Can someone tell me the pattern and value? Decent condition, I had to stone the blade tip as it looks like it was dropped and the cork screw is slightly bent. Also if you know what the engraving on the blade means. Thanks.

Wow, great! Is it 84mm or 91mm in length?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sterg on March 01, 2021, 02:03:46 AM
Wow, great! Is it 84mm or 91mm in length?
91. I think antique stores see saks as inexpensive and let them go for cheap.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on March 01, 2021, 04:37:18 AM
91. I think antique stores see saks as inexpensive and let them go for cheap.

Yeah, unless they see them on *bay...then they think their broken one is worth the same as the mint one sold a month prior.  :rofl:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on March 18, 2021, 12:06:35 AM
Wenger I picked up recently, tang stamps and badge suggest from 1930-45, would love to know model number if anyone has more information :tu:

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210317/2627d63f091e42a69bdb16df11e74f85.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210317/854f2d7ae150af1286a8a1dcc0726b58.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210317/cf78b52c05893f4fbd8d2eaf0793a6c3.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210317/d9ca54f907b9a95d7d2e2b1b8a270dbe.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210317/06e4cce5758d3639456246c0d390ba1b.jpg)


With a cadet and FX for size

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210317/616f74bbf12f3dbe1c2299e9b1a46ecf.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on March 18, 2021, 01:58:43 AM
Very nice!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on March 18, 2021, 03:25:45 AM
Thanks Barry  :tu: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pfrsantos on March 18, 2021, 01:53:39 PM
Wenger I picked up recently, tang stamps and badge suggest from 1930-45, would love to know model number if anyone has more information :tu:

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210317/2627d63f091e42a69bdb16df11e74f85.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210317/854f2d7ae150af1286a8a1dcc0726b58.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210317/cf78b52c05893f4fbd8d2eaf0793a6c3.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210317/d9ca54f907b9a95d7d2e2b1b8a270dbe.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210317/06e4cce5758d3639456246c0d390ba1b.jpg)


With a cadet and FX for size

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210317/616f74bbf12f3dbe1c2299e9b1a46ecf.jpg)

That's a great find!

 :cheers: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on March 18, 2021, 11:02:16 PM
That's a great find!

 :cheers: :cheers:

Thanks pfrsantos  :cheers: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on April 25, 2021, 05:21:10 PM
Mod. 146k from c.1951. Still has nickel silver liners and pre 1951 tools but already has back side Phillips and new style openers.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210425/24ec768d48ef6e1961dd4850dbf1c0f9.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210425/1c55797c9bd74b814b57a10edc4bc1af.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on April 25, 2021, 07:08:22 PM
Mod. 146k from c.1951. Still has nickel silver liners and pre 1951 tools but already has back side Phillips and new style openers.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210425/24ec768d48ef6e1961dd4850dbf1c0f9.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210425/1c55797c9bd74b814b57a10edc4bc1af.jpg)
...is that a broken and re-profiled small blade?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pfrsantos on April 25, 2021, 09:49:42 PM
...is that a broken and re-profiled small blade?

Nah, just broken...

 :facepalm:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on April 25, 2021, 10:38:59 PM
Right, just broken. Should be replaced for another one.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on April 26, 2021, 05:59:56 PM
Mod. 146k from c.1951. Still has nickel silver liners and pre 1951 tools but already has back side Phillips and new style openers.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210425/24ec768d48ef6e1961dd4850dbf1c0f9.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210425/1c55797c9bd74b814b57a10edc4bc1af.jpg)

Nice condition considering its rarity. It’s better than one I’ve seen, and the other one I found which has lots to fix.

Does it have any ‘unusual’ liners in it?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on April 26, 2021, 06:14:31 PM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210426/fc01f0dedb1f3fbd574adee345948b54.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210426/fb7eeb9cda9ffc3a61f7b4b457e0056b.jpg)
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on May 25, 2021, 06:21:29 PM
Hello everybody.  I need your help explaining the markings on the swiss soldier's knife handle.  Model 1901 made by Forges L&C Vallorbe.  The numbers 238966 and 1911 are stamped on the handle. I was told that the number of the rifle was often put on the knife (in fact, it was intended for disassembling / assembling the rifle) and this number corresponds to Rubin-Schmidt mod.1896 made in 1899. This date is quite consistent with the years of production of the knife (1901-1907) but what can 1911 on the handle mean?  It is also noticeable that the tools of the knife were nickel plated, however I saw this on knives of a later period.  Maybe someone after the service put on his old soldier's knife the number of the rifle, the year of the end of service (????) and plated it with nickel??  Who knows how many years the service was at the beginning of the 20th century?  Any ideas about the markings on the handle of this knife?
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210525/2ae55820612c2c834ad032171de53e76.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210525/2d2c4b7646f9f4f2a41905ce022cab3e.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210525/d4dbcc6b6849764a714b1bfb2899deee.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210525/3afb08099263f04fa1eb58a6b8508583.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on May 28, 2021, 06:16:55 PM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210426/fc01f0dedb1f3fbd574adee345948b54.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210426/fb7eeb9cda9ffc3a61f7b4b457e0056b.jpg)

Nothing unusual that I see. Thanks for the pics. Yours is like mine, but different and fewer broken parts. Mine is quite a beater.  ;) I do think yours is on the earlier side ‘51/‘52 and mine is ‘52 maybe even as late as ‘53.

I ask because there are some different liners from what I believe is only just before this (UPP) range.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on July 02, 2021, 04:07:07 AM
I found such a SAK. According to the stamps, it should be a hand-made knife made in the 1930s. My question is whether it was made by Victorinox? Will it be a customized product?and will Victorinox make such a strange product? ???
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on July 02, 2021, 05:12:44 AM
Really looks like a Vic blade.
So I'd say Vic blade in a non-Vic knife to me .... See corkscrew and other tools - don't look like Vic versions

But way more knowledgeabe folk here than me!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Max Stone on July 02, 2021, 12:49:54 PM
Judging by the rough execution of the scales and differing condition of the tools, it appears to be a hand-made combination of donor parts.

How well finished are the back springs, as this will also be a clue to whether or not it's a mod of an existing knife, or a one-off creation?  :think:

EDIT: I think it is not a Victorinox blade, as the marking appears carved and not stamped.  :dunno:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on July 02, 2021, 02:14:40 PM
Some details
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on July 02, 2021, 02:17:42 PM
Some details,I believe this knife is made by hand. Will Vic in the 1930s make this kind of knife by hand?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Max Stone on July 02, 2021, 03:40:10 PM
Thanks for the additonal pictures.

I do not think this is a Victorinox knife. But it does look like it came from a factory, as the back springs and corkscrew are properly fabricated to work together.

I suspect that this is from a different factory (not Victorinox), and at some point, the main blade was replaced and someone engraved the Victorinox logo into the blade tang.

But this is only my opinion. There are experts on this forum that will probably be in a better position to comment...  :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on July 02, 2021, 04:22:46 PM
Thanks for the additonal pictures.

I do not think this is a Victorinox knife. But it does look like it came from a factory, as the back springs and corkscrew are properly fabricated to work together.

I suspect that this is from a different factory (not Victorinox), and at some point, the main blade was replaced and someone engraved the Victorinox logo into the blade tang.

But this is only my opinion. There are experts on this forum that will probably be in a better position to comment...  :salute:
Thank's for your opinion, Max stone! I've seen some early pocket knives (most of them were before the 1930s). They all have Vic stamps, but they're not in Vic product catalog. So I'm very confused. First , did Vic make some special products in the early stage? Second, it may be that other knife makers or shops use Vic parts for assembly, but have they been authorized by Vic?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Max Stone on July 02, 2021, 04:53:53 PM
Yes, I agree it is confusing and still a mystery.

The question I have is that it appears the blade marking is carved (engraved by hand), and not stamped as you would expect with a Victorinox mark - even the very early Victorinox marks would be stamped and not engraved.

I may be wrong about this, but if I am correct, then no part of this knife is from Victorinox. Maybe you can have a closer look at the Victorinox mark again, to see if it is stamped or engraved?  :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on July 02, 2021, 05:31:11 PM
Yes, I agree it is confusing and still a mystery.

The question I have is that it appears the blade marking is carved (engraved by hand), and not stamped as you would expect with a Victorinox mark - even the very early Victorinox marks would be stamped and not engraved.

I may be wrong about this, but if I am correct, then no part of this knife is from Victorinox. Maybe you can have a closer look at the Victorinox mark again, to see if it is stamped or engraved?  :think:
I don't think it's a problem with this stamp. This is another stamp from Vic in the 1920s. They all used this technology in their early days
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Max Stone on July 02, 2021, 05:41:52 PM
OK, you are correct. Then I think we need the experts to comment as the rest of the knife does not look Victorinox. Let's see what other comments you get for this interesting knife.  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on July 03, 2021, 02:42:25 AM
Ulli / Elsinox  / JNOXYD ....... we need you!!!   :D
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on July 03, 2021, 04:34:12 AM
Ulli / Elsinox  / JNOXYD ....... we need you!!!   :D
And jazzbass/Minichamp…… :mail:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on July 03, 2021, 08:39:32 AM
Most things are already mentioned.

I would say: the mainblade is original from Victorinox, the rest not. The mainblade seems to be the only part that is inox steel. Victorinox did not produce such knives, at least I dont know of any. The knife seems to be much older that the mainblade.

It could have happened that way: mainblade got broken on the 1930s, the owner brought it to a knifemaker, who repaired the knife as good as he could and used spareparts that were available. That was very normal those days. The owner of the knife was happy, he had his loved knife back with an upgraded inox steel mainblade.
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on July 03, 2021, 09:37:15 AM
I agree with Ulli , knife body and other tools looks not Victorinox made (small blade nail nick, scissors, corkscrew). BTW I have
Victoria blade on non-Victorinox body also, blades swap was usual that times as Ulli said.
Probably Victorinox (Elsener Messer-Fabrik that days) made very close knife pattern. It’s not shown in known catalogs but looks well factory made. Victoria blade stamp, 1909-1930 according Ulli. It’s not mine to my regret.
Same knife was sold recently:
Sackmesser Victoria https://ricardo.ch/en/a/1177353610

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210703/611ed5f45a529410e7c4fe83331637dc.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210703/5e89d3c7caef79cd32611f8887eeed62.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210703/fb78f2e4af3a5931f2b8418fe74bd915.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210703/0d450809a9e60a40c98c045854d243d5.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210703/81169890b1dd181e50db1c3c268d6ca2.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210703/bd399c2b64aa252cdca5e9a083a82bfd.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on July 03, 2021, 01:07:10 PM
I agree with Ulli , knife body and other tools looks not Victorinox made (small blade nail nick, scissors, corkscrew). BTW I have
Victoria blade on non-Victorinox body also, blades swap was usual that times as Ulli said.
Probably Victorinox (Elsener Messer-Fabrik that days) made very close knife pattern. It’s not shown in known catalogs but looks well factory made. Victoria blade stamp, 1909-1930 according Ulli. It’s not mine to my regret.
Same knife was sold recently:
Sackmesser Victoria https://ricardo.ch/en/a/1177353610

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210703/611ed5f45a529410e7c4fe83331637dc.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210703/5e89d3c7caef79cd32611f8887eeed62.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210703/fb78f2e4af3a5931f2b8418fe74bd915.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210703/0d450809a9e60a40c98c045854d243d5.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210703/81169890b1dd181e50db1c3c268d6ca2.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210703/bd399c2b64aa252cdca5e9a083a82bfd.jpg)

This knife is too beautiful! Is this also a blade exchange product? What is the reason for the blade swap? At that time, Vic also made knives by hand. Could it be customized according to customers' requirements?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on July 03, 2021, 01:15:49 PM
Most things are already mentioned.

I would say: the mainblade is original from Victorinox, the rest not. The mainblade seems to be the only part that is inox steel. Victorinox did not produce such knives, at least I dont know of any. The knife seems to be much older that the mainblade.

It could have happened that way: mainblade got broken on the 1930s, the owner brought it to a knifemaker, who repaired the knife as good as he could and used spareparts that were available. That was very normal those days. The owner of the knife was happy, he had his loved knife back with an upgraded inox steel mainblade.

Your analysis is very reasonable.However, I feel that this main blade is not quite the same as the other 91mm main blades, especially the shape of the root. I do not seem to have a sample of the 91mm main blade from the 1930s, so I cannot make an accurate comparison. :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on July 03, 2021, 01:41:22 PM
I found another picture of a SAK that is not in the Vic catalog. It seems that several tools are made by Vick. What kind of situation does this knife belong to?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on July 03, 2021, 02:09:51 PM
This knife is too beautiful! Is this also a blade exchange product? What is the reason for the blade swap? At that time, Vic also made knives by hand. Could it be customized according to customers' requirements?
I think these two knives are not "blade swap product". We have no Elsener catalogs from 1910s-1930s period and they can made this model that time. Of course we need more these knives to be sure.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210703/3c4a95b9452630adf0e7a67decf86b6c.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on July 03, 2021, 02:29:52 PM
I think these two knives are not "blade swap product". We have no Elsener catalogs from 1910s-1930s period and they can made this model that time. Of course we need more these knives to be sure.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210703/3c4a95b9452630adf0e7a67decf86b6c.jpg)

I think so, too :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on July 03, 2021, 04:39:40 PM
The shape of your knife is different. Victorinox produced 2 lines of s-shaped knives, the Nr 1230 serie and the Nr 1240 series, 79 mm and 84 mm. The one shown from an auction is a nr 1239 or nr 1249.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on July 03, 2021, 04:44:43 PM
The shape of your knife is different. Victorinox produced 2 lines of s-shaped knives, the Nr 1230 serie and the Nr 1240 series, 79 mm and 84 mm. The one shown from an auction is a nr 1239 or nr 1249.
Thanks for sharing pics, Ulli! Never seen them, where are they from?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on July 03, 2021, 05:12:39 PM
The shape of your knife is different. Victorinox produced 2 lines of s-shaped knives, the Nr 1230 serie and the Nr 1240 series, 79 mm and 84 mm. The one shown from an auction is a nr 1239 or nr 1249.

Wow, what catalog is this? I've never seen such a picture about SAK. It's so sexy! I would appreciate it if you could share it with me.  :salute: BTW,the length of my knife is 88 mm :climber:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: ulli on July 04, 2021, 09:02:36 AM
Those pictures are from a project I m working on. Release hopefully soon.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on July 04, 2021, 09:38:50 AM
Those pictures are from a project I m working on. Release hopefully soon.
Looking forward to it very much! :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on July 04, 2021, 04:04:43 PM
Those pictures are from a project I m working on. Release hopefully soon.
Sounds great!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on July 17, 2021, 09:07:58 PM
Nice ones guys!

If my 100 yr old Spartan style has a  Vic emblem but I'm told it's a Pradel (French?), then they stole emblems years ago too?
I asked this awhile ago but honestly forgot your answers!  :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on October 23, 2021, 09:50:25 AM
I really love the various Victorinox anniversary knives.  I thought they started releasing them from the 1984 series but recently this 75mm Lady Victoria / Ambassador was sold on Ricardo.  Do you think we can call it the first Victorinox Anniversary Knife or were there others?  Has anyone seen this etching 75 Ann on other knives?
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211023/530e5867027e66ace5c68a7c9a6f0c72.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211023/2fd60269609d66e9e5367a4f63ee3107.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211023/0239afb42d19b974464c55f216c7366e.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on October 23, 2021, 03:33:01 PM
I have the same one. I like the scales, they are a different shade of gold compared to the "regular" gold alox scales from the 1960s or so.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Reinier on October 23, 2021, 03:40:34 PM
Wait: sold for CHF 10?  :o
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on October 23, 2021, 04:04:19 PM
Wait: sold for CHF 10?  :o
Looks like that ;)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on October 27, 2021, 01:55:11 AM
I really love the various Victorinox anniversary knives.  I thought they started releasing them from the 1984 series but recently this 75mm Lady Victoria / Ambassador was sold on Ricardo.  Do you think we can call it the first Victorinox Anniversary Knife or were there others?  Has anyone seen this etching 75 Ann on other knives?
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211023/530e5867027e66ace5c68a7c9a6f0c72.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211023/2fd60269609d66e9e5367a4f63ee3107.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211023/0239afb42d19b974464c55f216c7366e.jpg)
It's very beautiful :climber:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on October 27, 2021, 05:19:33 AM
I really love the various Victorinox anniversary knives.  I thought they started releasing them from the 1984 series but recently this 75mm Lady Victoria / Ambassador was sold on Ricardo.  Do you think we can call it the first Victorinox Anniversary Knife or were there others?  Has anyone seen this etching 75 Ann on other knives?

So would the year for that 75th anniversary be 1959 - ie 1884+75?

Nice - I like that year too
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on February 17, 2022, 05:11:08 AM
And I got a good look at the one I passed on. Pretty sure that it was produced in between 35TAP use. Between that copy and the one Minichamp described, it has to be in the middle. Perhaps in about ‘64-‘65 range, but very briefly I’m guessing.

So I finally got a Craftsman with the 25TAP saw sometime last year and can confirm the range estimate of ‘64-‘65 for their use. Mine appears to be later than the others which I’ve only seen pictures of and contains mainly parts I know to be from ‘65, and only two parts aside from the saw itself that were earlier, but I knew could possibly extend to this range. Which also wouldn’t be a stretch for 84mm knives when comparing to their 91mm counterparts.

I was also able to confirm is that these were used between 35TAP versions, which I can clearly see based off the specific saw tooling and the balance of the remainder of the part mixes on my Craftsman lineup before and after…as well as several other 84mm with fewer layers that are from ‘63 up to ‘67.


Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on February 17, 2022, 05:19:05 AM
Also got one of the other 136ka Craftsman that was missing from my lineup…with the Swiss Made stamped cap lifter.
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on February 17, 2022, 06:03:12 AM
Congrats on your find Kamakiri :like:
Great feeling of satisfaction when you can tick one off the list
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on February 17, 2022, 04:37:09 PM
Nice set kamakiri!  It's always fun to see this thread get a bump and to wonder who got what.  :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pa_strunk on February 17, 2022, 05:53:51 PM
 :iagree: :tu: Sweet collection
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rizio Il Ghiro on February 17, 2022, 06:42:22 PM
Very indeed! :like: :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on February 17, 2022, 10:43:03 PM
Thanks everybody!  :cheers:

I do have to get an updated lineup pic of the whole 136ka Craftsman collection…and maybe one extending to the last pliers version for the Craftsman love thread.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on February 17, 2022, 11:13:57 PM
Thanks everybody!  :cheers:

I do have to get an updated lineup pic of the whole 136ka Craftsman collection…and maybe one extending to the last pliers version for the Craftsman love thread.
   :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Barry Rowland on February 20, 2022, 02:14:18 AM
 :iagree:
Very indeed! :like: :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Deedee on March 13, 2022, 02:35:12 PM
Old stuff in my collection  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on March 13, 2022, 10:07:47 PM
Great collection Deedee :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: kamakiri on March 13, 2022, 11:11:03 PM
 :iagree:

….

The pair are from different times but each are later than most would think.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rizio Il Ghiro on March 14, 2022, 08:33:04 AM
Excellent stuff, Deedee and Kamakiri, :like: :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sammler91 on March 19, 2022, 07:26:27 PM
Hey everyone, I started to collect SAK since last month and I bought today very old one, but cant identify its model and production date
Could anybody please help about it.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rich S on March 19, 2022, 10:12:51 PM
Yes, you have a very early one (I think).  The chart I have of Victorinox tang stamps put the Armee Swiss from the late 1890's to 1930's. and the Inoxyd in the 1930's.
That is assuming this chart is right. At any rate, you got an oldie and goodie. The model is possibly the "Standard Swiss Officers" knife; known today as the "Spartan".  The tool design has changed over time, but the same "type" of tools. Others with more info or correct info will chime in I'm sure.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jaydar on March 20, 2022, 10:37:35 AM
Going through my knife drawers and found an accidental collection of Zwicky advertising knives look good all together.

All with different Tang Stamps

(https://i.vgy.me/pgE8Y2.jpg)

(https://i.vgy.me/M8yMcM.jpg)

I particularly like the wrap around celluloid one these break so easily   

(https://i.vgy.me/lZVNAG.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rizio Il Ghiro on March 20, 2022, 10:58:10 AM
Nice - not seen knives like those early ones - thanks for sharing, Jaydar! :like: :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Sammler91 on March 20, 2022, 04:55:46 PM
Yes, you have a very early one (I think).  The chart I have of Victorinox tang stamps put the Armee Swiss from the late 1890's to 1930's. and the Inoxyd in the 1930's.
That is assuming this chart is right. At any rate, you got an oldie and goodie. The model is possibly the "Standard Swiss Officers" knife; known today as the "Spartan".  The tool design has changed over time, but the same "type" of tools. Others with more info or correct info will chime in I'm sure.
Thanks a lot buddy.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on May 14, 2022, 12:30:00 PM
I once bought a 234K with 1945 engraved on the blade and was very upset to find aluminum liners on it.  As we all know, the transition from nickel silver liners to aluminum liners took place in the early 1950s.  I first thought that the knife was rebuilt after 1950 and the liners were replaced.  However, upon closer examination, I did not find any traces of repair, scales had traces of shrinkage characteristic of that period along the length and near the rivets.  I remembered that exactly the same knife is in the collection of my friend from the USA and asked him to check the material of the liners, they also turned out to be aluminum.  I recently saw another knife from this period 1943-1946 on ebay and it also had aluminum liners.  So it looks like the aluminum liners used by Victorinox are much earlier than 1951. What do you think?
My knife:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220514/e3d99e1a7330783612863eecb6bbb38e.jpg)

Friend’s knife:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220514/52f1a0652ee715d02b3aa1907f464c31.jpg)

 eBay knife:(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220514/5e4f3fdc1318a68d8006e5c3637409f8.jpg)

Nickel silver and aluminum liners difference :
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220514/d613d7fff0cbb03abb5fa853a9cc1b25.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on May 19, 2022, 02:01:06 PM
Some guys here have same 1940s knives with aluminum liners too. That what MiniChamp said few years ago:
“I remember JAZZBASS writing about having in his collection early-1940's SAKs with aluminum liners and speculating that they may have been the result of copper alloys being hard to obtain during WWII. (I don't recall him ever mentioning the length of these SAKs, though.) Other than this, what I know is that I have two early-1940's 83mm SAKs with non-anodized aluminum liners and one 83mm SAK from around 1950 (I think) with the 1946-51 can opener and anodized aluminum liners.”
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: tjfarrington2000 on June 17, 2022, 10:36:02 PM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220617/e56474d4b3a6b5da6199bd127fbb9673.jpg)
My EDC


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Vintage Tourist
Post by: trouthunter on June 18, 2022, 05:11:04 AM
This just came the other day from a great Etsy seller in Mexico.
 [ This attachment cannot be displayed inline in 'Print Page' view ]  

 [ This attachment cannot be displayed inline in 'Print Page' view ]  

 [ This attachment cannot be displayed inline in 'Print Page' view ]  
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pfrsantos on June 20, 2022, 11:28:45 AM
Hey everyone, I started to collect SAK since last month and I bought today very old one, but cant identify its model and production date
Could anybody please help about it.

Welcome to :MTO:

Great find!

 :cheers: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: tjfarrington2000 on June 22, 2022, 06:45:03 PM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220622/eef422e5e42cad33a1ef41d16c2a04d1.jpg)
Here’s a 1960s Champion I saved


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on June 22, 2022, 11:26:54 PM
Nice!!   :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: FolderBeholder on June 23, 2022, 12:14:59 AM
Nice!!   :tu:
:iagree:
Dig the Mac Classic too!  :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: tjfarrington2000 on June 23, 2022, 04:09:51 AM
:iagree:
Dig the Mac Classic too!  :tu:
That’s a labor of love. It’s 10 years older than me, so using it is a bit of a learning curve.


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: tjfarrington2000 on June 23, 2022, 04:10:46 AM
Is there anything prettier than mirror-polished celluloid? (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220623/4fc29be947da5a1b3b5e30991b09741e.jpg)


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on June 23, 2022, 04:59:21 AM
WOW  :tu:  :salute: very nice!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on June 23, 2022, 08:58:25 AM
:iagree: lovely
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pa_strunk on June 23, 2022, 02:58:20 PM
 :iagree: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Jessica78 on December 09, 2022, 06:14:59 PM
This is my sak. It was my grandfather’s. I’ve been trying to date it. I think it must be early 1950’s from all the resources I’ve found here. It’s an as2 tang with Victoria Switzerland Stainless on the opposite side. It also has the hidden file on the screwdriver.  It was a work gift when he worked in the Ford dealership. I just need to research the best way to tidy it up a bit.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: tjfarrington2000 on December 09, 2022, 07:29:32 PM
This is my sak. It was my grandfather’s. I’ve been trying to date it. I think it must be early 1950’s from all the resources I’ve found here. It’s an as2 tang with Victoria Switzerland Stainless on the opposite side. It also has the hidden file on the screwdriver.  It was a work gift when he worked in the Ford dealership. I just need to research the best way to tidy it up a bit.
It looks like a late 1940s model based on the can opener design. Great knife!


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Miles42 on December 10, 2022, 02:29:09 AM
Hunting one with a Mercedes Benz logo.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Aloha on December 10, 2022, 03:55:04 PM
This is my sak. It was my grandfather’s. I’ve been trying to date it. I think it must be early 1950’s from all the resources I’ve found here. It’s an as2 tang with Victoria Switzerland Stainless on the opposite side. It also has the hidden file on the screwdriver.  It was a work gift when he worked in the Ford dealership. I just need to research the best way to tidy it up a bit.

I think 45-51 range however someone should be along to better date it for you.  Very nice SAK,  a little clean up would be nice.   
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Vitor Pereira on December 24, 2022, 12:04:30 PM
Pulled a few recent vintage ones out of the knife roll....I have others I just can't find them.   :facepalm:

Shown are a Victoria Champion, two Fisherman, an Original Outdoorsman, a Climber and Armee Suisse 84mm Tourist and a Spartan/Standard in 91mm.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz256/SAKGuy/Vintage%20SAKs%202-18-17_zpsdyeho6xr.jpg)

Fine collection there! Am I right saying the one in the middle on the left is a fisherman? If so, what year is it? I’m guessing 54-61?
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on December 24, 2022, 03:52:53 PM
I think 45-51 range however someone should be along to better date it for you.  Very nice SAK,  a little clean up would be nice.   

Yep - This ^^^

This spreadsheet may help:
https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,51872.0.html

As for cleaning I use wire wool inside the knife and on the liner;
Metal polish will work nicely on the blade and other tools (and handles!!) - Not too much though as you should keep it authentic
Then a nice oil worked into the joints to smooth it all out
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on December 25, 2022, 11:33:02 PM
Mod 51’s
Three main variants plus a civilian version

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221225/4e3bc46fb50224e9c9b8f8369ad4e7d0.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221225/d6afeae6c2f4099e2133e77dda3d6427.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rizio Il Ghiro on December 27, 2022, 10:06:07 AM
Cracking photos, Echotech!  :like: :like: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on December 28, 2022, 12:56:47 AM
Thanks Rizio :tu: :cheers:

I’m doing the 30 SAKs in 30 days challenge this month and have decided to finish up with Soldiers these last few days

Today, Mod 08 Pt1 - P’s and civilian
The 42P on the left also has a P stamp near the WK stamp on the scales, the civilian on the right has a triangle stamp

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221227/cd1d9bc8aad045090e064a7d8ebeb1c4.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221227/90d11f8ede80362a1b1befa26451bafc.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221227/e4c0f5ce733153f2acc1142767252be3.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221227/48e75ea26c624d50164fa3f40cd7d160.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rizio Il Ghiro on December 28, 2022, 08:06:50 AM
More awlsomeness!  :like: :like: :cheers:
Title: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on December 28, 2022, 09:04:58 AM
Thank you good Sir :hatsoff:
:cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on December 29, 2022, 01:43:23 AM
Mod 08 Pt2

L-R
1932 Wenger Delemont
1941 Elsener Schwyz
1943 Wenger Delemont (note Swiss Cross stamps over WK stamp)
1943 Elsener Schwyz (note exposed pivot)

(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221229/e1e398bac6533335167e3bc6c9d90e1e.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221229/dcf2606095905a84ba5bc0c136fddbee.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221229/5b01918bb45d938bb24cb9287250883e.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221229/94f86edc69e01113abdc18b05930fb45.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221229/412c00271c8ebf242b9521b771f717ff.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221229/fd848a7ba0921881fbd2309a5c726894.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on December 30, 2022, 01:10:01 AM
Last day of the 30 SAKs in 30 days challenge, mod 61’s

 
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221230/d99cc4c0b48fb984190f02e55c57ffe2.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221230/36b3128b5dd3726e87416db629cb4b91.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221230/e4fc819b977bd4d045c4729d198c4797.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221230/fbabf3e8426997c473583d0495c00f55.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221230/60bb8a7bf3f391ea51a3b4d6e6fb9676.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20221230/695a6a5e980ea52960cafce271fa5ee4.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rizio Il Ghiro on December 30, 2022, 10:14:32 AM
Nicely done, Echotech, and a splendid finale!  :like: :like: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on December 31, 2022, 08:24:37 AM
Thanks very much Rizio :tu: :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jingzd on January 10, 2023, 05:39:13 AM
angler
  [ This attachment cannot be displayed inline in 'Print Page' view ]  
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on January 10, 2023, 05:54:19 AM
angler
  [ This attachment cannot be displayed inline in 'Print Page' view ]

Lovely  :climber: :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rizio Il Ghiro on January 10, 2023, 09:27:35 AM
 :iagree: they look to be in fantastic condition!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pa_strunk on January 10, 2023, 03:43:00 PM
 :iagree: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on January 11, 2023, 05:42:01 AM
angler

Oh My ..............  :climber:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on January 11, 2023, 05:44:01 AM
Nice Soldiers - ET - Particularly like the Model 51s - for some reason!!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on January 11, 2023, 06:05:20 AM
Nice Soldiers - ET - Particularly like the Model 51s - for some reason!!
Thanks H :tu:

Pete and I reckon it’s time for a catch up again soon :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Swisster on January 12, 2023, 07:52:20 AM
what constitutes vintage ? Vintage is a subjective word
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on January 12, 2023, 04:13:59 PM
Agreed - However this from the OP......

.......
Regarding the knives:
let's say, from the beginning around 1890 till ca. 1970., all sizes old timers and both brand (Victorinox & Wenger) in one place, are most welcome.
As far as I know, such topic does not exist yet but if I'm wrong let somebody correct me please. And I just hope that many will approve and find themselves in this topic. So, here we go...

Gotta love those old models. As I see it, they built them with much, much... did I said much more quality at that time than now... After all, just look at the condition of these two 60+ years old knives.
That's just absolutely amazing and I'm positively stunned every single time when I find one.  :)
.........

My definition, in terms of Vic knives, for this, was always anything with a bail / exposed rivets or earlier - Which more or less ties in with the above ?   ???
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Myron on January 13, 2023, 03:18:07 PM
angler
  [ This attachment cannot be displayed inline in 'Print Page' view ]

Those Anglers are just unreal!  Congratulations.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: tjfarrington2000 on January 13, 2023, 06:41:41 PM
Does anyone carry any of their vintage knives? I for one daily my 1947 Huntsman.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230113/81d38fcfbc187e4aa66a583374ea90ba.jpg)


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on January 13, 2023, 08:57:32 PM
angler
  [ This attachment cannot be displayed inline in 'Print Page' view ]
Wow, left one is really rare now! Congrats!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on January 14, 2023, 12:20:01 AM
Does anyone carry any of their vintage knives? I for one daily my 1947 Huntsman.(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230113/81d38fcfbc187e4aa66a583374ea90ba.jpg)


That’s a beauty tjf  :like:

Must admit I don’t although I’d have no problems carrying one of the mod 61 soldiers. The mod 08’s are real nail breakers but otherwise still work as well as the day they were made

Maybe a vintage SAK 30 day challenge is in order?    :think:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: TonySal on January 14, 2023, 12:47:29 AM
NICE  :salute:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jingzd on January 14, 2023, 12:58:43 AM
Thanks guys.
  [ This attachment cannot be displayed inline in 'Print Page' view ]  
  [ This attachment cannot be displayed inline in 'Print Page' view ]  
  [ This attachment cannot be displayed inline in 'Print Page' view ]  
  [ This attachment cannot be displayed inline in 'Print Page' view ]  
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: tjfarrington2000 on January 14, 2023, 02:24:05 AM
That’s a beauty tjf  :like:

Must admit I don’t although I’d have no problems carrying one of the mod 61 soldiers. The mod 08’s are real nail breakers but otherwise still work as well as the day they were made

Maybe a vintage SAK 30 day challenge is in order?    :think:
I think a 30 day vintage only challenge is in order, yes!


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on January 14, 2023, 04:04:11 AM
I think a 30 day vintage only challenge is in order, yes!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

8) ok we’re on, sign up below  :D

https://forum.multitool.org/index.php/topic,90413.new.html#new
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: quaydvt on April 02, 2023, 07:45:04 PM
Definitely late 1940s, the model is 246ka.

Old model number key for the curious
First, the main number:
1xx = Phillips, 2xx = Corkscrew.
x34 = blades, openers
x35 = blades, openers, scissors
x36 = blades, openers, scissors, saw
x37 = blades, openers, saw
x45 = blades, openers, scissors w/ LNF
x46 = blades, openers, scissors w/ LNF, saw

Then the letters after:
k = 84mm (klein). No k = 91mm
a = toothpick/tweezers
f = fish scaler
m = metal file
U = bail/keyring


There are other numbers like 248k that are just assigned and don't really follow a pattern.
Thanks jazzbass.  I have the german page and have managed to work with it to a reasonable degree.  But this breaks it down so much better for my old brain and eyes!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: tjfarrington2000 on May 30, 2023, 06:48:13 PM
Latest vintage model:
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230530/6ca47d4efbc4319dd75d9af7dbb3734e.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230530/4596f00f732414614b20e657a044f07f.jpg)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230530/8ff976b69c386940513e2dd00b6148f6.jpg)


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on May 30, 2023, 10:22:45 PM
:drool :drool :like: :tu: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rizio Il Ghiro on May 30, 2023, 11:25:25 PM
 :iagree: very nice….. :drool:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on June 02, 2023, 07:25:41 PM
Victoria & Wengerinox stamped oldies
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230602/ac3008f9504947cc2ef148be8bbe06a9.jpg)
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on June 02, 2023, 11:26:39 PM
Lovely:angel: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: tjfarrington2000 on June 02, 2023, 11:35:06 PM
Where are you finding these?!


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rizio Il Ghiro on June 03, 2023, 07:44:00 AM
Very nice indeed! Great finds, jnoxyd!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: jnoxyd on June 07, 2023, 07:23:41 PM
Thanks guys!  :hatsoff:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Myron on June 08, 2023, 02:28:19 AM
Oh man, I'll say!   Congrats on these beauties!
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Victorinox69 on June 20, 2023, 06:27:52 PM
Found this old pearl victorinox, can't find another like this one anywhere, but newer pearl ones seem to retail for about 500 so I'd like to sell mine. I'm dating it from anywhere between 1897 and 1955, thats what I was able to figure out based off the logos on it but I'm not an expert.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/VICTORINOX-ARMEE-SUISSE-INOXYD-VOGT-MONTREUX-PEARL-SWISS-ARMY-KNIFE-1897-1955-/304985411474?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p4429486.m46890.l6249&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: tjfarrington2000 on June 21, 2023, 03:27:51 PM
That’s a neat knife, however conditionally it’s seen better days for sure. I’d date it to the late 40’s


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Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: PoppaSus on August 03, 2023, 08:29:08 PM
Realised I have no idea how old this knife is.  This one came to me from my Dad a few years before he passed away, along with a belt pouch he made.  I started dropping it in my pocket rather than my SAK after he passed away.  From what I can tell it is about 50 years old, maybe a few years older than that, and I think it is the Champion.

Anyway, here I am and here it is.   
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: DIAMOND on August 03, 2023, 09:46:03 PM
That's a beauty. And thanks for sharing the story. Neat that your dad carried it.
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rizio Il Ghiro on August 03, 2023, 11:18:18 PM
 :iagree: great story!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on August 04, 2023, 03:40:30 AM
:iagree: a real beauty :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Huntsman on August 05, 2023, 04:30:46 PM
Yep it's a real beauty - In great condition - And with a lovely provenance - And a six-layer Champion as you say

I reckon it was made between 61 - new awl came in - and 65 - slopey saw teeth finished

So most likely 60 years old
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Myron on August 06, 2023, 02:53:40 AM
Excellent!   What a lovely keepsake from your dad, and I'm glad you shared it with us here on MTO.   

Myron
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: pfrsantos on August 09, 2023, 12:32:05 PM
That's a beauty. And thanks for sharing the story. Neat that your dad carried it.

+1

 :cheers: :tu:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: xfile on March 26, 2024, 01:13:04 PM
It's time to surface!  :climber:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Rizio Il Ghiro on March 26, 2024, 06:33:34 PM
That’s an interesting old Wenger - not seen one like that before!  Thanks for sharing xfile! Love the scales!  :cheers:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: AzteCypher on March 26, 2024, 07:25:54 PM
 :like:
Title: Re: Vintage SAK Owners Club
Post by: Echotech on March 27, 2024, 06:17:07 AM
:iagree: :like:

Good to see this thread bumped up :tu: