much info much text

[North Man]

Me the collector…..Victorinox and Wenger

I will inform about a few things I have researched on Wenger and Victorinox ,
first I will mention the scales, I searched for information on completely other than what I found, a little funny maybe, when you are doing this you can not be a 100% correct with what you find, instead you must use the mind and reason.
It happened searching for dates to fill in on the Wenger timeline that I have made so far 3 times better that what I had. In 1976 Tenite Butyrate was mentioned is the scale material used by Delemont…. One thing led to another and I came up with an organic plastic made by wood.
So I looked further and it seems this is Cellidor.. Wrong or not I do not care, so in a recent topic on the Victorinox forum they mentioned that Cellidor is an Organic natural Cellulose kind of Acetate. I would not be shocked if things has changed from 1937, 1976 and 2010 and the formula can be other now, at least we have discussion points, so I had the guts to write this on my page and other places also.

Next was the Fischer stamped Pioneers with old awl from 1957, I searched much without results so I sent an email to Ibach, with response that these was made around 1957 for Fischer company in Switzerland.
Later I did some search again on finding out when was the first Pioneer made, from earlier info i found out that the range like we all know started in 1957, is this the start of the Alox mania we see today, could be...
I did find out that the Pioneer was before the Soldier of 1961 type, that was delivered first in June 1962, the Pioneer Range had led to the development of the Soldier 1961 type, this I got told from Ibach.
We can argue who started the Alox phenomenon…..Then later it seems that the Farmer also dates back to 1957…Also 1957-1971 you can find the +Pat on the can opener on this range.

During my research I found that during the 50s a lot of Swiss army Knife look-alikes was advertised in newspapers and other media as the genuine stuff, some from Solingen I believe, from information given by Ibach it is mentioned until 1969 there was a lot of or almost just cheap knives with Swiss emblem made abroad in Switzerland`s souvenir shops, this is why Elinox was made and like told dates back to 1957.
Very early on copy knives was made and already in 1909 the founder Mr Carl Elsener put on the cross to distinguish his from the others.
I can tell that symbols and emblems is something that is important to Switzerland, shown in 1889, 1955 and 2008. 1949 Geneva convention to copy Swiss Symbols is forbidden.

Today Wenger in video tells that in the 1970s  there was a huge camping/outdoor wave in Japan with a lot of their products sold, in the 1970s in USA there was a huge backpacking wave with a lot of Victorinox products sold.
Then my quest led me to the Packlock mechanism on 85mm knives, 1982 was mentioned and can have a meaning i do not know, I found a lot of ads around 1979 that tells this was developed to be on the Backpacker knives as a safety feature, feeling says it is from a little before 1979.
The oldest patent I found on the old construction on the V.I.P that is sad to been introduced in 1976, this is believe to be correct, anyhow the construction is from 1971 and in 1973 the scissors with integrated spring was found.
The earliest on the patented lock flat screwdriver with cap opener is from 1982.
Some information is already out there on Wenger steel, know to little yet to tell, this can be later.I can mention however that 4034 Hi-Chrome was mentioned 14% Chrome and .5-.55%Carbon RC 54-56., in another place I found what seems to be the nail file modern type and it says .3-.4% Carbon and 13-14% Chrome RC 53-57

What about the orienting tool with compass, 1986 was my information and this may be so yes, I did found in news search this in 1984 and 1985, I would believe that the compass has always been on , there are two types of compass. I have one that must be from around 84 or 85, maybe more also. The brand entered the American marked around 1967, in 1985 however the word personalized knife is mentioned with imprints.
I have already mentioned in topics about the fashion fight with the two brands Forschner and Precise in the late 80s and beginning of  the 90s.

To conclude this days writing I can say that knockoffs, fakes copies has been a big problem all the way, it seems so. Both companies has suffered, for Ibach we know 1909 the 1950s 1969 1981 1987 1990s and today.

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

Thanks for the info mate

[North Man]

Hi

You are welcome

[ICanFixThat]

As you say, a lot of information in there.  Some good research, and yes you never know exactly what you'll find when you start looking or what you thought you knew changes as you find new information.

Speaking of fakes, there was a advertisement/postcard on ebay for a while before it sold that advertised a SAK, a pretty large one and had Wenger type suisse emblem on it. It was pretty expensive so I did not buy it, and it eventually sold.  The thing that was very strange about it is the company doing the selling only said that it was made in switzerland by a top company, or something like that I could look it up, but never mentioned the manufacturer.  I found this very strange and I was quite sure that this was a professional looking fake, but I can't be sure.  Maybe you saw that on ebay?

Great work!

[North Man]

Hi

Thank you!

No i did not see that card? I do however feel i have heard about this one time....

[stressmaster5000]

Then my quest led me to the Packlock mechanism on 85mm knives, 1982 was mentioned and can have a meaning i do not know, I found a lot of ads around 1979 that tells this was developed to be on the Backpacker knives as a safety feature, feeling says it is from a little before 1979.

What are your sources for this info? Ads in what magazine or periodical? What date or issues specifically? I would like to see.

Thanks for digging into Wenger history.

[North Man]

I used many, scanned newspapers, forums, Wenger.ch, my own knives,scanned books, atleast 4 patent databases or, scanned articles, i cross navigated the information,.
The packlock you can see in the Backpacker magazine ad by Precise, i used this with more since i am not 100% sure the add was in there, anyhow  http://books.google.no/books?id=buADAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA2&dq=wenger+backpacker&hl=en&ei=OaIwTZmwHoiUOvuPwKwK&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=3&ved=0CDIQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=wenger%20backpacker&f=false 

[stressmaster5000]

Google Books is truly becoming a great history resource!

[North Man]

Hi

Thank you, yes the google books is really a good tip, one can find ads with packlock several places there, another very good tip is this patentdatabase(no packlock there but much other), when reading patents one must have in mind different years for europe and US f.example it is difficult with several languages, see the original documents and so on,
On this try quick search first use persons or organizations and type exactly Victorinox AG or Wenger SA and so on
http://ep.espacenet.com/quickSearch?locale=en_EP

[J-sews]

I've used Google books for a fair bit of research myself. Thanks for the news North Man

[Ombudsman]

Thnxs 4 the info on google books North Man ! 

I have been using Google for patent search and it a great place to look for information too. 

Recently I discovered that some of the Gerber patents are not under Fiskars but a misterious company called Alterra Holdings...   

[North Man]

Hi

Glad to be of help, yes Google patents also there..!