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(Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers 21601

Absolute Zombie Club Posts: 21,458 Gone

dks cy

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(Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« on: May 16, 2012, 12:26:18 PM »
Seeing Travis's thread on battery preferences I thought it will be interesting to see the batteries and charges most people use for their everyday torches toys etc. with some details about them; like a sort of buying guide.

I leave out the equipment specific batteries and charges of mobile phones, cordless drills, cameras, some torches, cars etc. (mainly Li-ion, Lead Acid and some NiCd) .

Like most people nowadays I use rechargeable batteries and have several chargers. I have been using commonly available rechargeables for over a decade, from what I remember.

Mainly I use or have used NiCd, NiMh (AA,AAA,C,D) and Li-ion (18650).

I will focus on some AA batteries, for the moment, that happened to be in a battery box I have. I have at least 2 of each shown, and for some a lot more. I had at least four of each when I first got them. Some are cheap some not so, some are good some are rubbish, but more later.

I also have the Duracell “Eneloops”, AKA Duraloops, but everybody knows about them…  :D

The batteries, in no particular order, so as to see their size difference.



The batteries in order of claimed capacity, with some comments.




Starting from the left:

3000mAh, typical no name exaggerated eBay battery. These also come in blue, purple etc. These work but their longevity and capacity are hit and miss. I had 4 blue ones in my flashgun and could get 100 full on flashes before they went flat, so they were pretty decent (replaced after 2 years, but 3 are still in use). However others were a lot worst and died early. Cheap but a gamble.

Ansmann 2700mAh. I bought these a few years back, thinking that they were the canine’s private parts and in truth I was underwhelmed. I used them in my flashgun and they started developing problems with charging pretty early (the 3000mAh eBay ones that I replaced them with for my flashgun proved to be better…). Out of the 4 I now have 2 left which are still usable, though I would not use them in anything important.

Tronik (Lidl) 2500mAh. My current flashgun batteries. They seem to work well, charging the flash quickly, though they seem to lose their charge quite quickly too, especially in comparison to the 3000mAh ones I used before. Cheap, their capacity seems realistic, but they have not yet seen heavy, continuous use and are pretty new (a couple of months).

Duracel 2450mAh (not Duraloops). Used mainly in toys and some smaller point and shoot cameras. In use for a year with no problems so far. The capacity seems realistic but they lose their charge quickly, in storage. Not so cheap.

Energizer 2450mAh. Bought because of some good reviews for use in a point and shoot camera. Work OK and behave like the duracell’s. In use for over a year. Not a fantastic as the reviews claimed.

Sony 2300mAh. Bought with a charger, 4 years ago. Nothing exceptional, no problems, used in various flashguns, cameras, toys etc. 2 still in use, with low capacity. Solid batteries.

Carrefour 2300mAh. Really bad. Rubbish actual capacity, lose charge quickly, problems after a few uses. 1 left, barely. Not shown here but the IKEA ones are much better.

Tronik 2100mAh (Eneloop style LSD). Definitely not rebranded Eneloops. Cheap but I question their capacity as they do not seem to last that long; possibly not very LSD... Decent enough for applications requiring LSD batteries, that your life will not depend on.

Sanyo 1850mAh. Possibly 7 years old, one left in use. Bought for use in a camera, easily damaged by dropping (more than normal). They were pretty good for their time.

GP 1000mAh NiCd. One of the few 2-3 NiCd AAs I still use. Bought a few years ago for some equipment (I do not remember which) that required/asked for NiCd batteries. I was never keen on GP batteries, but these seem to still work reasonably OK. Good for applications where they could go totally flat during use.


The batteries arranged in groups based on how there +ve ends look.



I suspect, based on looks and capacity, that the Duracell and the Energizer are the same batteries. The Ansman looks hard! :D

The chargers:



All my main chargers have individual charging channels (can charge 1 battery or two or three and so on; not only pairs 2-4-6 and so on). I like the extra control and capabilities this offers. All shown charge well, with no overheating or overcharging noticed.

GP Smart charger. Over a decade old, fast 1 hour charger with some good features (timer, temperature sensor, minus Delta V). Charges AA, AAA, NiMh and NiCd. Requires a transformer (shown) and works fine, batteries get warm but never hot. If you get it wet just dry it.. My first decent charger and still my main charger.
Surprisingly, still available.. http://www.thomasdistributing.com/Closeout-Special-GP-SMART-1-HOUR-FAST-POWERBANK-Battery-Charger_p_970.html

Tronic (Lidl) charger. Cheap, charges up to 8 NiCd or NiMh batteries including 9V ones. Also AA, AAA, C, D.
Has several features like precharge refresh, bad battery recognition… and so on, but no manual control over them, which would have been nice. It was suggested that it is made by Ansmann in the flashlight forums. Faster than I expected, comparable to the GP (though not that fast). Good for charging 6AA batteries like you would use on RC cars, helicopters etc. Very cheap for what it offers. (Apparently the other Tronik charger, smaller, is not very good). Has an LCD display and lights too.

Sony CycleEnergy, bought for practically nothing with 4 Sony batteries (shown previously) 4 years ago.
My travel charger. Works on 120-240V, light and small. Charges AA and AAA NiMh batteries. Has a manually operated refresh setting. 2 hours for up to two batteries and 4 for 3 or more. Has an LCD display.

Duracell charger. This is not in use, since I got the Tronik. Bought to charge C and D batteries, but can also charge AA, AAA and 9V. Slow and stupid.

I also had some more chargers that I threw or gave away.

One more closeup of the 3 main chargers


And yours??

EDIT: Underlined TWO wordS
« Last Edit: May 16, 2012, 03:18:24 PM by dks »

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Absolutely No Life Club Posts: 5,053
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #1 on: May 16, 2012, 02:27:36 PM »
omG, that's a DETAILED battery description :D

I'm not an expert in any way, so just a brief description :D

I have the same battery charger GP Power Bank- ok, not the SAME, I meant the same brand/company, but the shape is different though. It can charge a total of two either AA or AAA batteries. I friend of mine bought it for me once togehter with four AAA batteries SONY again like yours in your very first picture : ) (yours seems to be AA, though)

ANd I have another charger, my first one, SanYo for charging a total of four either AA or AAA batteries.

 

I bought it for my camer back in .... :think: May 2008... so it's been exactly four years... It's worked without fail. Well... the lamp never really went to green... no idea if it does at all (when your batteries are charged). I have only two of the very same AA batteries shown in the picture with the charger.

Absolute Zombie Club Posts: 21,458 Gone

dks cy

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Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #2 on: May 16, 2012, 02:54:03 PM »
omG, that's a DETAILED battery description :D

I'm not an expert in any way, so just a brief description :D

I thought my description was short...  :D (compared to some proper expert reviews in BLF and CPF)

Yes, all the bateries shown are AA. I have some (many similar), AAAs too, but then this writeup would have been toooooo long.

The eneloops/duraloops seem to be the best according to the forums, though truthfully I have not yet used them hard.

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Al : "Women!"

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No Life Club Posts: 2,261 This isn't me, but I'm just as dysfunctional
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2012, 02:56:38 PM »
On the left is a smart charger for my AA and AAA Eneloops. It has 4 independant charging channels.

On the right is a Pila IBC for my 18650's. I only use AW cells. The Pila is considered to be one of the best chargers on the market for lithium ion cells.

If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck.
Absolute Zombie Club Posts: 21,458 Gone

dks cy

********* *
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2012, 03:30:08 PM »
For 18650 I upgraded from a cheap single cell, overcharging, charger to a cheap Ultrafire WF-139 (newer model).
Charges to 4.17V, so OK for my needs and stops. Fine so far.

The Pila and Xtar seem to have good reputation.

MAHA seems well respected in the US for AA, AAA but I have not seen them here.

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Al : "Women!"

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Absolute Zombie Club Posts: 21,458 Gone

dks cy

********* *
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2012, 05:38:14 PM »
Sysmax Intellicharger i4, v2.

Got a new charger that charges both Lithium and Nickel based batteries (rechargeables..)

Under $20, got good reviews on BLF.

Tested it on 10440, 14500, 18650 and Ni-Mh AA.

Works fine. Charged the 14500 to 4.2V and the 10440 to 4.15V (separate channels).

Reasonably fast for Ni-Mh, but faster on two batteries than on four. Charged them to 1.42V.

Bought it as an upgrade to my Ultrafire charger (faster, charges Nickel based batteries too, costs 3 times more though).

Big, 100-240V compatible.




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No Life Club Posts: 2,901
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #6 on: July 28, 2012, 06:30:27 PM »
Great thread!

I use a WF139 for my li-ion cells, and it's been fine so far.  I only have AW protected cells though; 18650 and 14500.

I also have a C9000 and it's a fantastic charger.  We have one of the cheaper 8 bay Energizer chargers that I keep older cells in so my wife and son can just grab a battery out of it when they need.

My other batteries are all nimhs, about half older non-LSD and half newer eneloops or duraloops.

The first Noble Truth: life is suffering.  Only by accepting that fact can we transcend it.
No Life Club Posts: 1,475
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #7 on: July 28, 2012, 06:38:00 PM »
I have couple of Sanyo chargers which came with Eneloop batteries and Uniross charger which I used to charge my batteries, but since I bought Maha/Powerex MH-C9000 WizardOne Charger-Analyzer year ago I'm only using Maha charger.
Although it is almost 5 or 6 years old design, it's still the best in the world.
Absolutely No Life Club Posts: 5,053
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #8 on: July 28, 2012, 06:39:42 PM »
I saw some battiers in our LIDL today.... but I wasn't sure if they're good or not that good. Now I saw this topic and recalled them, but I definitely can't recall their name... it was sth wtih FIRE in them, but not the UltraFire I see here. What I remember was that they were 1.2V, could be recharged 1000 times and lost 20% of their charge for one year.

Any idea if it's worth purchasing them? :D
Keeper Of The PowerCut Admin Team Zombie Apprentice Posts: 16,895 - Allan

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Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #9 on: July 28, 2012, 06:45:02 PM »
but I definitely can't recall their name...
Tronic..?  :think:


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Absolute Zombie Club Posts: 21,458 Gone

dks cy

********* *
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #10 on: July 28, 2012, 06:53:07 PM »
I have only seen the Tronic ones too. (see my 1st post here)

The "eneloop" type ones are OK, but do not seem to hold as much charge as the real ones and from my experience get damaged easily. I have one that went bad after being charged only twice. They do not last as long as the eneloops in my torches either.

but they are cheap.

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No Life Club Posts: 2,901
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #11 on: July 29, 2012, 02:19:31 AM »
I saw some battiers in our LIDL today.... but I wasn't sure if they're good or not that good. Now I saw this topic and recalled them, but I definitely can't recall their name... it was sth wtih FIRE in them, but not the UltraFire I see here. What I remember was that they were 1.2V, could be recharged 1000 times and lost 20% of their charge for one year.

Any idea if it's worth purchasing them? :D
As a general rule, I avoid the "fire" branded stuff.  The WF139 I have has been the only exception so far.  With li-ion cells especially, it pays to pony up the few extra bucks for protected cells.  The AW ones are particularly nice; I've had nothing but good results from them for a couple of years now.

The first Noble Truth: life is suffering.  Only by accepting that fact can we transcend it.
Hero Member Posts: 571
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #12 on: July 29, 2012, 03:40:51 AM »
LIDL here also sells batteries branded AEROCELL but I think they're the same as those Tronic.

On the right is a Pila IBC for my 18650's. I only use AW cells. The Pila is considered to be one of the best chargers on the market for lithium ion cells.
cof cof... http://translate.google.pt/#pt/en/pila   :ahhh
Absolute Zombie Club Posts: 21,458 Gone

dks cy

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Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #13 on: July 31, 2012, 01:21:13 PM »
The WF139 I have has been the only exception so far.

Just an accidental observation. Though the wf-139 will light green when fully charged, it will continue charging, slowly, after that.
Mine stops at 4.15V but a pair of protected Sanyos stayed in overnight and reached 4.25V.
Not too bad, but something to know.

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No Life Club Posts: 2,901
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #14 on: July 31, 2012, 09:31:42 PM »
The WF139 I have has been the only exception so far.

Just an accidental observation. Though the wf-139 will light green when fully charged, it will continue charging, slowly, after that.
Mine stops at 4.15V but a pair of protected Sanyos stayed in overnight and reached 4.25V.
Not too bad, but something to know.
My understanding (and I could be mistaken of course) is that the WF139 does continue to trickle charge the cells it has in it after they've reached a certain voltage level, but I don't think it's genuine 'protection'...  That's one of the reasons I prefer protected cells.  I'm also not sure if the protection circuits in the Sanyos are different than what's in the AW cells.  I suspect their different, because I recall reading on CPF that the AW cells use the Panasonic core, and have a custom PCB for the protection circuit that's in them.  The newer ones also have a vent mechanism integrated into them so that if they do overcharge, they expel the gas produced instead of blow up. 

There are also two different versions of the WF139, an older model with a circuit in it that isn't as good as the newer version.  The newer version was specifically updated because it was found that the old circuit would overcharge li-ion cells. 

The first Noble Truth: life is suffering.  Only by accepting that fact can we transcend it.
Absolute Zombie Club Posts: 21,458 Gone

dks cy

********* *
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #15 on: July 31, 2012, 09:56:23 PM »
My charger, based on the information for differentiating given in BLF (e.g. voltage output) is the newer version.

I do not think the protection in the Sanyos will kick in at 4.25V only.

I have some protected panasonics too, though I am not willing to pay the price for "superior" AW cells; at least untill they open the market a bit with more sellers and lower the total cost for getting them (price and shipping).

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No Life Club Posts: 1,793 I EDC a cell phone
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #16 on: August 02, 2012, 09:31:38 PM »
The WF139 I have has been the only exception so far.

Just an accidental observation. Though the wf-139 will light green when fully charged, it will continue charging, slowly, after that.
Mine stops at 4.15V but a pair of protected Sanyos stayed in overnight and reached 4.25V.
Not too bad, but something to know.
My understanding (and I could be mistaken of course) is that the WF139 does continue to trickle charge the cells it has in it after they've reached a certain voltage level, but I don't think it's genuine 'protection'...  That's one of the reasons I prefer protected cells.  I'm also not sure if the protection circuits in the Sanyos are different than what's in the AW cells.  I suspect their different, because I recall reading on CPF that the AW cells use the Panasonic core, and have a custom PCB for the protection circuit that's in them.  The newer ones also have a vent mechanism integrated into them so that if they do overcharge, they expel the gas produced instead of blow up. 

There are also two different versions of the WF139, an older model with a circuit in it that isn't as good as the newer version.  The newer version was specifically updated because it was found that the old circuit would overcharge li-ion cells. 

yes the WF139 will trickle charge.
I've tested this.
I prefer the pila charger and it will NOT trickle charge.
i feel much safer

I also have a bc700 la crosse
« Last Edit: August 02, 2012, 09:33:48 PM by New_World »

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Absolutely No Life Club Posts: 5,053
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #17 on: August 04, 2012, 03:43:41 PM »
The batteries I asked you guys about are TRONIC, indeed :facepalm: I have no idea what "fire" I'd seen in the name. I went to our LIDL again today and checked them, then went to buy sth else and forgot to buy them again.........

Not many positive comments? :D

« Last Edit: August 04, 2012, 03:49:02 PM by N_N_R »
Absolute Zombie Club Posts: 21,458 Gone

dks cy

********* *
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #18 on: August 04, 2012, 07:29:35 PM »
They are OK, cheap, and with LIDL if you have a problem you take them back and get a refund (for most products).

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Al : "Women!"

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Absolute Zombie Club Posts: 21,458 Gone

dks cy

********* *
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #19 on: August 04, 2012, 10:25:30 PM »
Of interest to Li-Ion users (found link on BLF)
I have heard of this research before but never had the chance to see the whole project in a paper
http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/20100037250_2010040765.pdf

Some of the conclusions:

•The overdischarge test results indicate that several factors have to be taken into consideration while using cells in series and parallel configurations.
–Cell matching should be stringent and based on capacity as well as internal resistance of the cells and not just the Open circuit voltage (Voltage versus capacity should be characterized for each cell design)
–Cell modules should have an undervoltage cutoff to prevent cells from going into very low voltages especially if they are not stringently matched.
–Have cell balancing to prevent one or more cells from being significantly imbalanced from the others.
–Provide monitoring or it would be difficult to capture deep discharge or voltage reversal of one or more cells.
•Balancing during discharge may be more critical than during charge.

The thermal environment is an important criteria –
–Thermal signature of a large pack may indicate that there are huge gradients due to unbalanced internal resistances with cycle and calendar life which can in turn lead to overdischarge or overcharge due to imbalance as well as change the properties of protective devices.
•Modeling studies have shown that if the temperature is controlled to a reasonable value (below 55 ?C was used in NASA-JSC studies), then the hazards do not manifest themselves into a thermal runaway condition.
•Tests have shown that for ease of monitoring and control, high voltage/ high capacity batteries are built with a P-S topology. However, the limitation of having too many in parallel should be understood. If there is a weak cell, all the current from the neighboring cells will feed into the weak cell.
–4 cells in parallel is maximum recommended design for medium-rate cell designs (provided the charge current is also controlled) based on available test data.
–If more need to be paralleled, the limitations of the cell module needs to be determined and safety controls at the appropriate levels need to be incorporated.
•Use high quality cells with manufacturing control wherever possible.

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Al : "Women!"

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Global Moderator Absolute Zombie Club Posts: 20,235 I may get older but I refuse to grow up.
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #20 on: August 07, 2012, 01:13:40 PM »
"your batteries" you say  :think:

Can you guess my preference for flashlights and a specific battery manufacturer? :D

Absolutely No Life Club Posts: 5,053
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #21 on: August 08, 2012, 10:09:31 AM »
My 4 Sony AAAs have just disappointed me :'( None of them had even a liiiiittle juice left. Don't remember when was the last time I'd used/charged them :think: Anyway, it's going to be a .... rechargeable day :D
No Life Club Posts: 1,793 I EDC a cell phone
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #22 on: August 08, 2012, 07:03:55 PM »
"your batteries" you say  :think:

Can you guess my preference for flashlights and a specific battery manufacturer? :D

(Image removed from quote.)

sanyo eneloop?  lol


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Absolutely No Life Club Posts: 5,053
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #23 on: October 06, 2012, 12:52:38 PM »
I've just bought two sets of Tronic batteries from LIDL :D The last time they were there I hesitated for too long, then I checked the rechargeables in other shops and seeing the prices, I regreted not having bought those from LIDL.... Now I have 4 x AAs and 4 x AAAs... :D We'll see how they''ll be behaving once they're charged :D
Absolute Zombie Club Posts: 21,458 Gone

dks cy

********* *
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #24 on: October 06, 2012, 04:04:51 PM »
I am still using mine, with no problems!

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Al : "Women!"

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No Life Club Posts: 1,793 I EDC a cell phone
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #25 on: October 06, 2012, 06:32:12 PM »
i need to buy more eneloop AAs

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Ambidangerous Mistress of Mod Admin Team Zombie Apprentice Posts: 15,072 I'm not all bad, I'm just drawn that way.
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #26 on: October 06, 2012, 09:06:06 PM »
I have had more luck with Eneloops compared to cheaper ones, but the price point is of course different accordingly.

For Li-ions, I always buy good protected ones like AW.

My current quandary is about solar chargers - has anyone found a good one yet?
I want something which can charge an iphone or similar, and either has a built in battery, or maybe capacity to charge and use AA cells for that function.
Struggling to decipher what's what in that market... ideas anyone?! :D

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Absolutely No Life Club Posts: 6,243 I don't LIKE anything!i!¡!¡!¡!
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #27 on: October 06, 2012, 09:33:50 PM »
This is a great topic. Currently, I use Energizer AA and AAA for the rechargeable batteries. I also use the Energizer charger that charges 8 at a time (not sure the model). I primarily use the AAs for my camera flash and AAAs for things around the house (salt/ pepper grinder and other stuff). I have really not done any research as to which battery brand is best but this thread has me  :think: ing I do need to start. We recently had a new (to my area) chain move in called Batteries Plus. They have an excellent selection of any kind of battery needed. Thoughts and ideas welcome..............


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Terry
Absolutely No Life Club Posts: 8,723 The MTO handshake.
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #28 on: October 07, 2012, 03:35:33 AM »
Yep I have Eneloop AA & AAA + Duraloop AAs.
I had misplaced my Tank007 E07 AA torch for around 4-5 months it has a Eneloop in it.I found it last week  8), fired up & it worked great  8) 8). I LOVE the way Eneloop/Duraloops hold their charge.
I wish my cordless drill batteries could hold a charge like Eneloops  :think: :gimme: :D :D


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Absolutely No Life Club Posts: 5,053
Re: (Your) Batteries and Battery Chargers
« Reply #29 on: December 26, 2012, 11:26:22 AM »
I have a brief question: can you charge AA and AAA batteries simultaneously in the same charger? :D Because I'm already doing it.. :X

They're the same brand, Tronic, just I'm now charging two AAAs and one AA ... is it a problem? :think:

 

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