[FOUND] WTB: Leatherman crunch.

[xt60043f]

As title. 

Edit:// I live in the UK.

[Cupboard]

if it doesn't have to be a Leatherman and it's not going to be an every day hard user, the Silverline one on Amazon's pretty good for £10.

[xt60043f]

Heh, I am a huge fan of the silverline faux crunch (SLFC).  I have 3 of them!  I had 4 but I broke one trying to straiten it out.  The quality control is quite poor.  Not as poor as the SLF flair, that was a real piece of poo.

I REALLY like the design but the quality is quite 'meh'.  Hence the reason I am seeking a real one.

  

[Grant Lamontagne]

You have to have something to compare the Silverline one to!

Def

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk 2

[tattoosteve99]

Pm sent

[xt60043f]

1 crunch gratefully received.

 

The craftsmanship in this tool is beautiful.  It is a credit to US ingenuity.

Thank you very much tattoosteve!

EDIT:// In fact, it is almost too beautiful to actually use!  I may just have to continue using my faux crunch day to day and just keep this one in a glass cabinet.

...oh god.  It has begun.

[xt60043f]

On closer inspection the jaws do not line up *perfectly*.  close but not quite.  Maybe 0.3mm out.  While that in itself is not a problem, the fact the crunch has vertical grooves on the tip of the plier head means it makes an audible 'click' sometimes when you compress the plier.  This click is the result of the grooves 'clicking' into the meshed position.

If it was 'new' new I would have sent it back.  It is a feature that would have been nice to know about prior to purchase. 

[gregozedobe]

Is the problem only when you close the plier jaws completely when there is nothing in them (like you are trying to grab "nothing" ) ?

If so, it doesn't affect their functionality when trying to actually grip something, is that correct ?

I seem to remember reading a recent thread where LM stated that this exact behaviour wan't a problem that they would replace a tool for, so even if you could send it back you might not get any satisfaction from LM under their warranty.

[tattoosteve99]

On closer inspection the jaws do not line up *perfectly*.  close but not quite.  Maybe 0.3mm out.  While that in itself is not a problem, the fact the crunch has vertical grooves on the tip of the plier head means it makes an audible 'click' sometimes when you compress the plier.  This click is the result of the grooves 'clicking' into the meshed position.

If it was 'new' new I would have sent it back.  It is a feature that would have been nice to know about prior to purchase. 

This misalignment is normal and has been discussed here many times. Finding a "perfectly" aligned multitool or anything for that matter is highly improbable.

[xt60043f]

Here is a video.  Please excuse the quality.  It is not easy holding the camera at the correct focal length while operating an MT at the same time.



As I said, the tool still functions but it is annoying as hell.

Clearly there are only a few crunches that slipped through QC are like this.  If not, I would almost certainly have heard of this issue before.  The point is you knew about this extreme annoyance but handily neglected to mention it when asked to comment on the condition of the tool. 

I know I am only a 65 post peeon on the other side of the world but this kind of shady dealing is bang out of order mate.

Caveat emptor.

[AimlessWanderer]

Personaly I'd echo gregozedobe's comments and say that if this is the only issue ... it isn't an issue. As a tool the only reason to snap/lock the jaws shut is when there's something between them, in which case the fractional misalignment is irrelevant in use. It's almost like complaining your car doesn't accelerate as quickly as it should when the engine is turned off

Obviously if there are issues when gripping something, or there is excessive play in the plier pivot then that could be a different matter. In which case I'm sure a polite private discussion with the seller may give a better outcome alround than getting shirty in public 

Just personal opinion 

[xt60043f]

This is a false analogy.  No one expects a car to move when the engine is not running.  We do expect the head of a set of pliers to line up.  My silverline fake crunch lines up.  The pair of pliers I bought for £3 for the boot of my car lines up.  I expect the head of an 'in excellent condition' multi-tool to line up.

For a better analogy, suppose I sold you a car (sight unseen) and I told you it was 'in excellent condition'.  On driving said car for the first time you found it made a horrendous wheezing, grinding noise whenever you drove it above 70MPH.  You would say 'xt60043f, this car is not in the condition you implied it was.  It makes a horrendous grinding, wheezing noise above 70MPH!'.  Now imagine I replied with, 'But the car drives absolutely fine up to 70MPH, as there is no need to ever go above 70MPH on a British road this is a non issue and you have no right to complain.'

How would you feel?

As for trying to hammer out a mutually beneficial outcome, tattoosteve99 has demonstrated quite clearly his feelings on buisness.  First of all by failing to mention the flaw and secondary by brushing it off as a non-problem that one should reasonably expect from a MT.

So getting 'shirty' in public is my only recourse.  The trade section on this forum, or indeed any forum works on honor and trust.  When someone breaks that system, the entire forum has a right to know.

Caveat Emptor.

 
 
 

[Taxi Dad]

having watched the video (more than once !) i still don't see much of a problem do you have a NIB crunch to compare this one to ?
obviously I don't know how much you paid for this tool, but i'm guessing it wasn't RRP ? perhaps from now on, if you feel 'diddled' in some way by this deal, you should stick to getting your stuff from outlets that allow you to inspect before you buy to avoid this ?
could you not 'resell' the tool for the price you paid, even if you let the next owner see your lovely video so you couldn't be accused of 'misrepresetation', the tool does look in 'excellent condition' otherwise ! I wouldn't be put off by what I've seen (if I wanted a LM Crunch that is)
also we are not privy to ALL the PM's between you and Tattoosteve so it's impossible to judge how much he ''brushed off the non-problem'' and therefore been 'dishonorable', he may not have mentioned something he didn't perceive as a fault ?

[tattoosteve99]

I have received no pm regarding this. If you have a problem please feel free to do so. I have been here quite some time and although you haven't, your not a peeon, as you put it. Everyone here deserves the same treatment and therefore if you feel it's not right the proper course of action is talk about it. I have had a couple people here who wasn't happy with what they got and all were resolved and they were happy.

[AimlessWanderer]

@ xt60043f

My analogy was tongue in cheek, but effectively (or ineffectively, it seems) angling towards saying you were judging it's performance without actually using it. Apologies if that wasn't clear, but I hope you can see what I mean about judging it in use as a tool rather than a showpiece.

I have personally dealt with Steve several times and had no issues at all, in fact he's been a great help in me getting hold of several tools that I'm extremely happy with. I strongly believe that he's not the sort of guy to single you out due to a lower post count to give you a crappy deal on purpose, and if I had got this from Steve, I'd just be thinking it's a reflection on the product not the guy .... but that's my own personal opinion after both owning several Leatherman tools, and having several dealings with Steve 

Talk to him, and I hope you can both resolve this amicably 

[xt60043f]

I spoke to Steve.  He claimed he is not a collector and considered the tool to be functional enough.  I find this claim to be ludicrous.  He is a prominent member on theinternet forum for multitool enthusiasts.  He has a sizable collection.  He damn well knows what is working and what is not.

The only reason someone would send a lemon in a trade is either a complete lack of respect for other people or a genuine inability to discern if a tool is in good condition.

Steve opted to play the 'inability to discern the condition of the tool' card.So anyine trading with tattoosteve99 in the future, please bear in mind he is genuinely unable to tell if a tool is in good/lemon condition.   

I sent the crunch in for warranty repair.  It has come back with jaws that line up and do not click.  Surprise, surprise.

I will definitely not be trading with tattoosteve99 again and I would urge any one else to deal with caution.

[kkokkolis]

I wouldn't judge from one instance and I have to admit that I wouldn't be able to recognize that specific problem myself. But, end is good - all is good, they say.

[Aloha]

I have admired the crunch and hadn't yet stumbled upon the clicking issue.  could you post a video of your new non clicking crunch please.  what was leathermans response when you sent them in for the noise exactly? I wonder what they actually did to the tool or if they just gave you a new one as replacement? thanks in advance

[gregozedobe]

I spoke to Steve.  He claimed he is not a collector and considered the tool to be functional enough.  I find this claim to be ludicrous.  He is a prominent member on theinternet forum for multitool enthusiasts.  He has a sizable collection.  He damn well knows what is working and what is not.

It still looks to me like you are grossly over-reacting.  From what you have said yourself this Crunch actually did work quite effectively if you used it to grip something (anything at all !), it was only when you closed the jaws when there was nothing to grip that you noticed there was "a problem". 

So it was only when the tool was NOT WORKING that you noticed something you didn't like.  Hardly a "lemon" then, and definitely not an issue to be casting aspersions about.  If it had actually been mis-described as mint and it had some damage then you would have something to gripe about, but in this case the tool worked perfectly fine when used as a tool.

So based on what I've read in this thread I'd be quite happy to deal with Steve (like I have several times in the past), but I'd have second thoughts about selling or trading anything to xt60043f in case he found something he didn't like about the tool that I hadn't even thought to test (like gripping nothing) and then raised a big fuss about it.

Sorry if you don't like my opinion, but we are all entitled to our own opinions (and it has nothing whatsoever to do with post counts).

[tattoosteve99]

I spoke to Steve.  He claimed he is not a collector and considered the tool to be functional enough.  I find this claim to be ludicrous.  He is a prominent member on theinternet forum for multitool enthusiasts.  He has a sizable collection.  He damn well knows what is working and what is not.

The only reason someone would send a lemon in a trade is either a complete lack of respect for other people or a genuine inability to discern if a tool is in good condition.

Steve opted to play the 'inability to discern the condition of the tool' card.So anyine trading with tattoosteve99 in the future, please bear in mind he is genuinely unable to tell if a tool is in good/lemon condition.   

I sent the crunch in for warranty repair.  It has come back with jaws that line up and do not click.  Surprise, surprise.

I will definitely not be trading with tattoosteve99 again and I would urge any one else to deal with caution.

Here is the convo that we had. I want all to see it and let them make up their own minds.

    Here is another video of the plier head.   

   

    I am not an unreasonable person.  When I bought this crunch I did not expect a mint condition tool.  In fact small dings, scrapes and blemishes are expected with second hand tools.  The reason I am so miffed is I did not expect a plier head that does not line up and makes a clicking noise every time it is squeezed together.  This compounded with being told it is normal for a plier head to not line up
    annoyed me no end.  It is not normal for plier heads to not line up.

    I feel it was extremely remiss of you to not mention the fact this plier head does not line up and makes noises.  If I had known this I would have politely declined your offer.

    Do you have any comments on the current situation.?


I don't look at a tool to be perfect, I look at tools at what they are worth, tools. If it works then it works. I'm not a collector and I don't check everything or critique it. I look at function and usability. If your unhappy with it then I will do what I can to fix it however you want to. Honestly it worked like it was supposed to for me. It's all up to you what you would like. I'm easy going so I try to accommodate.   


I have been nice and I havent bad mouthed you or any of your business, in fact you were very quick to pay. I was quick to ship. You also started by it was great, then it went downhill from there. As everyone can see from the convo, I was more than willing to respond and do whatever it took to make everything right. I have had 2 deals go bad here at MTO, one local in the US and one in the UK. Both were resolved happily because the other person was willing, you were not or we could have worked something out. Your tool is fixed, you are happy, so be done with it and move on! Mods can lock, close or do whatever they want to with as I dont give a rats ass! I have done so many trades sells and help here that it would blow your mind! In the future, wait until you actually know people before you judge them.

Also my "collection" as you call it, how the hell do you know what I have or dont? Obviously you havent a clue, but I will tell you so you may rest tonight at ease. I have 5, yes 5! multitools and all are used and used hard! Thats it now you know and you can spread the word to the world!!! See ya!

[kkokkolis]

A Leatherman that  clicks like a Victorinox! Boy, this is not just rare, this is an once in a lifetime bargain! I  would keep  it and cherish it as a rare object. Now that the  Leatherman enginners  have the head at hand, they should study it well and (adding a reasonable  polish) product a Spirit killer multitool. 

[enki_ck]

 


[moderator] Guys, no use of arguing and name calling over this in public. This was a private trade between members and should be resolved per PM if necessary. Steve offered to fix any problems xt60043f had with the trade, xt60043f refused, sent his tool for warranty repair and got a new tool back. Seems to me like a case closed.

The forums is here for constructive discussions on multitools, not name calling and arguing. So please keep it constructive or the thread will be locked. [/moderator]

Now get back to discussing multitools.

[tattoosteve99]

Yep but had to speak my peace.