Vintage SAK Owners Club

[jnoxyd]

I'll try and see if I can turn it，If it turns, it must be bail.

It can be riveted a little after filing so can be no turn. It is definitely rest of bail.

[kamakiri]

They made both variants: with and without bail
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I’m agree with Kamakiri, the rest of broken bail was accurate filed off (or just somebody didn’t like bails)
Probably it was like this one
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And thanks for the example pics.

On the stag horn models there is also a washer/spacer between the shackle/bail to help clear the extra width from the ridges and contours of the horn.

[kamakiri]

Handyman 7236 maU, early- mid 1960s.
Remind me please when they changed large Elinox stamp for a bit smaller one

I was thinking about this recently and I’m thinking the big Elinox tang stamp ends c. ‘66 and maybe later. Perhaps even much later.

We all ‘know’ that lines like Elinox and Hoffritz and advertising use older parts. But analysis is tricky with all the cheaper parts and finishes that Elinox knives got.

My copy like your Handyman is IMO at least ‘65+. It pretty clearly post-dates any ‘63 and ‘64 ‘pegs’ that I have established for main line and advertising knives. Like 100% of the details as far as I’m concerned. It has too many details that match main line ‘65-‘66 range, could be later than that if just 1 or 2 parts are ‘old’/discontinued parts. Which I think is somewhat likely.

One of the thing I want to study more are the Elinox scissors that immediately follow these machined ones...old style stampings that are tumble polished. And continue to look for knives that may be produced between these two types within the later ‘60s. 

[kamakiri]

Just to illustrate what was said by Jazzbass above

I think my point is better made with pictures. Without getting into all the details it is tougher to explain. But here’s some that show how close the last big Elinox stamp is to the main line 29TAM production, tang polishing, VSSR stamp transition to keyrings and 29TSM transition.

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[Huntsman]

Why do you think there was a bail in the first place - Didn't they make them with or without bails?   
Maybe this was one without   

Ahhh -  I've got it - Thanks lads
If it were bail-less - It would not have had the ring/'bushing' around the rivet head

[kamakiri]

Ahhh -  I've got it - Thanks lads
If it were bail-less - It would not have had the ring/'bushing' around the rivet head

And there's another washer/spacer under that, because it's stag horn. That's not done on other scales since they are essentially flat. 

[xfile]

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I think my point is better made with pictures. Without getting into all the details it is tougher to explain. But here%u2019s some that show how close the last big Elinox stamp is to the main line 29TAM production, tang polishing, VSSR stamp transition to keyrings and 29TSM transition.

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Good knowledge kamakiri !I also found a small e Handyman

[jnoxyd]

One more 84mm Super Tinker LNF , now with bail - 145kaU . It is not good condition, even LNF is broken off but I'd like to show these knives here because they are hard to find and only few were shown ( Jazzbass called 145k "one of the rarest post WW2 84mm knives" )

[TonySal]

One more 84mm Super Tinker LNF , now with bail - 145kaU . It is not good condition, even LNF is broken off but I'd like to show these knives here because they are hard to find and only few were shown ( Jazzbass called 145k "one of the rarest post WW2 84mm knives" )
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yes interesting,  I learn a lot from youz guys
I have a Pradel that masquerades as a Spartan ... nothing broken but it is ancient, as a kid and now I'm 66! So I enjoy this thread 

[kamakiri]

I’ve seen the large Elinox with both aluminum and nickel silver bird head spacers, and they certainly are produced into the range of asymmetrical machined (main line) knives, which I estimate production covering/through ‘65. Maybe ending then or in ‘66.  I estimate my latest large Elinox copy to be c. ‘65+. It’s also a Handyman like yours.

Finally found the ‘backup’ proof for my ‘65+ estimate for the big Elinox tang stamp. And I still believe mine to be a bit later than this ‘65 inlay dated sample based on the surface finish. It’s from Ulli’s dated advertising knife thread.

[jnoxyd]

Finally found the ‘backup’ proof for my ‘65+ estimate for the big Elinox tang stamp. And I still believe mine to be a bit later than this ‘65 inlay dated sample based on the surface finish. It’s from Ulli’s dated advertising knife thread.

Congrats! I like these dated knives 

[kamakiri]

Congrats! I like these dated knives 

Thanks jnoxyd. I was pretty sure about the ‘65+ estimate based on tool and finish progression analysis, but it only ‘proves’ the ordinal nature of things when there aren’t good or nearby ‘pegs’ to confirm.

I’m still thinking/suspecting it’s later for the actual end. Of course it’s too much to ask for a ‘66 or ‘67 marked knife to confirm.   

[elsinox]

...from the category "copy a catalog page"... not perfect, but almost.

[jnoxyd]

Absolutely perfect! Can you tell us about these  Elsener Rapperswil knives? Who made these two shown in Victorinox's catalog? Elsener from Schwyz, another knife maker Elsener from Rapperswil or it is collaboration knives? Thank you!

[elsinox]

Nice picture! Can you tell us about these  Elsener Rapperswil knives? Who made these two shown in Victorinox's catalog? Elsener from Schwyz, another knife maker Elsener from Rapperswil or it is collaboration knives? Thank you!

Difficult to describe... I would say it is/was a collaboration. The knifemaker shop still exists, located in Rapperswil (1 mile from Rüti). Victorinox never did grillon scales as far as I know. So I think Elsener Rapperswil (relative of Karl Elsener, Schwyz), got the tools from Ibach (always carbon steel!), assembled the knives and sold them at his store, stamped with "Elsener Rapperswil". So what is it? A victorinox or not?

[jnoxyd]

I'd say they are Elsener Rapperswil knives which were made with great help of Victorinox according Karl Elsener principles. Anyway it looks better than famous Buck knives completely made by Schrade and Camillus.

[xfile]

...from the category "copy a catalog page"... not perfect, but almost.

Wow, what a great collection!They're probably the oldest metal inlaid advertising SAK

[Mechanickal]

Those are truly astonishing...

[TonySal]

Beautiful!
Can we include Wenger here?
What year do we consider Vintage? 

[M0rkoni]

Off course Tony.    Just read my first post here in this topic, please...

[TonySal]

Off course Tony.    Just read my first post here in this topic, please...

        

[jph_777]

Where are some good places to look for/shop for specific vintage SAKS besides the big bay on the web?  (I know about the listings on this forum in the Tools Needed section).  I just don't see much showing up on the bay.  Thanks!

[Joe58]

Where are some good places to look for/shop for specific vintage SAKS besides the big bay on the web?  (I know about the listings on this forum in the Tools Needed section).  I just don't see much showing up on the bay.  Thanks!

There was a Swiss site that offered old Soldiers, both the 1961 version, and those prior. From Vic and Wenger. I purchased a few from them a few years back. But I no longer have the bookmark for it and had no luck searching for it. I don’t know if they’re now defunct or what. It may have been run by the same folks at LCSAS? Could be likely the sources for the older knives has pretty much dried up. eBay, at least in my view, has really driven prices through the roof on older pieces. I guess that’s good if you’re a seller, but tough to be a buyer.

[Huntsman]

Maybe you mean these guys - I think they are French
https://www.couteaux-du-soldat-suisse.ch/J01/index.php/en/

I think one of them is a member here and I think they are linked to LCSAS

[Joe58]

Maybe you mean these guys - I think they are French
https://www.couteaux-du-soldat-suisse.ch/J01/index.php/en/

I think one of them is a member here and I think they are linked to LCSAS

I’m not sure that’s the site that used to sell. It seems to be just info on older SAK’s. Unless at one time they did, since it looks familiar to me. Thanks!

[Huntsman]

They did used to sell ......  I have bought from them
- There is a shop button on the page now which I don't think, from memory,  was there, or worked like that, before
It now takes you to LCAS and they are on holiday!!   

[kamakiri]

This thread needs more pics.

PWAR 235aU
PWAR 235f(a?)U tweezers only as is typical for this run.
UPP 236aU

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[jph_777]

Thanks for the feedback Joe58 and Huntsman!

[Sneider]

Get some beautiful 75 / 84mm Victorinox with horn handles. From the old days when almost everything was still done by hand. Corkscrews are really rare in this size.

[jnoxyd]

Get some beautiful 75 / 84mm Victorinox with horn handles. From the old days when almost everything was still done by hand. Corkscrews are really rare in this size.

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Nice set!