i need a new headlight - thinking of the led lenser seo5

[eamo]

I can guarantee
 on Zebralight and Armytek waterproofing.
I used them in torrential rain and often wash my armytek in water :-)
If you need advice on which of the many models to buy, write here or also in PM.

thank you.

[Syncop8r]

I'm after a headlamp with similar features myself - my requirements are:
- Variable modes very bright down to not very
- Good run time
- Red light
- Durable
- Weatherproof, or as waterproof as I can get without paying too much.
- Easy to find in this part of the world

My previous one was (is - it's around here somewhere) a Black Diamond Cosmo but I'm thinking of trying another brand, perhaps Petzl.

[Stefano]

I have seen that customer interest in a red auxiliary light has grown in recent years.
Until now I did not give much importance to this feature.

I was intrigued recently when I read that red light doesn't attract insects, this can be useful in summer when watering the garden.
Typically the torches that have a white/red light have a red auxiliary light with a very low power, are one or two lumens really useful? Can anyone tell about their experiences with red light?

My only experiences with red light are with Fenix lanterns, I have an old CL25R that has a fixed/flashing red light of 1.5 lumens which I find very low and useful only as a signal.

It is different with the small CL09 (I have bought 3 copies) it has a fixed/flashing red light of 5 lumens, with it (red light) I already have a decent vision, the hot season with the annoying insects has almost arrived, one evening I want to test although I would like a few more lumens to water the garden and have good brightness..

I was considering whether to buy a headlamp only with completely red light (Zebralight H502pr - 100 lumens) then I saw that Armytek has made a dual version withe/red (Armytek Wizard WR) with 1000 lumens (withe) and 250 lumens (red light)  In Europe, however, I currently cannot find it.

I don't want to go off topic with red light but I'd like to hear some story about how you use red light and how many lumens (it can be very interesting)

I hope it is understandable :-)
(I use Google translator, I edited the original message because the translation was having problems.)

[Syncop8r]

Your English is better than that of many native English speakers. 

I initially wanted the red light for night flying as it allows you to see things inside the cockpit (that aren't illuminated) without compromising your night vision as badly as white light does.
I also see it being useful in situations where you want to see what you are doing without disturbing others eg. camping.

[Stefano]

Your English is better than that of many native English speakers. 

I initially wanted the red light for night flying as it allows you to see things inside the cockpit (that aren't illuminated) without compromising your night vision as badly as white light does.
I also see it being useful in situations where you want to see what you are doing without disturbing others eg. camping.

Thanks
I have read many discussions about red light in the past.
Today I went back to CPF to read again, there are many threads on this.
I understand that there is a good deal of myth around the red light.
To preserve night vision more than color it is important that the power is sub lumens (less than 1 lumens)
I had an interest in the red light because I read that the insects do not see it, it seems to be true but unfortunately the mosquitoes can see it and therefore the utility in my case would be less, probably I will not pay 50/70 euros for a professional Headlamp with powerful red light only to water the garden.

I looked at some Petzl models, on Amazon they can be bought cheaply, but all the models I have seen have a red light with 2 lumens.
I stay with my Headlamp Armytek and Zebralight which have many ultra-low levels.
The flashing red light however still interests me, it can be used as a taillight for the bike.
The rear lights for the bike are all cheap and short-lived, there are professional models but they are expensive and I wonder if they are much longer lasting.
I bought a third CL09 mini_lantern for this reason, a small fixed / flashing red light can therefore be useful for many purposes.

[Don Pablo]

I am also convinced that it is mainly low lumens, not colour, that preserves night vision.
My Manker E03H has an user-adjustable low mode: 21 options from 0.0000000001 lumens to somewhere between 0.1 and 1 lumens?
I will take a comparison picture tonight.
It also came with a red clip-on filter, but I haven't noticed a difference when it comes to preserving my night vision.

[eamo]

Yeah my interest in red light is for map reading at night and also not blinding the others in my group.
Pabs / Stefano you might be right with regards to low lumens vs red light vs night vision I'll try a test tonight 

[Don Pablo]

Me too.
I'll adjust my eyes to the dark tonight, and try to spot a difference after reading with the lowest white and red light levels that I can read with.

Then I'll see if turbo mode with the red filter clipped on ruins my night vision.

[Syncop8r]

Oh great, now I have to investigate if this is true or not. Thanks guys. 

Oh well, it makes a break from busting COVID-19 conspiracy theories. 

[Syncop8r]

The rods respond to low light levels.
The cones respond to colour.

There might be something to do with red light having a longer wavelength.

I'll look into it tomorrow...

[eamo]

i look forward to the results of your research

[eamo]

So lads, how did the research go ? Do we actually need a red light option for night nav ?

So, I've settled on either the Fenix HM65R or the HL60R but I can't decide

Both are pretty high lumen lights plenty for my needs.
Both IPX8 very important to me.
Both are rechargable I've decided I want this feature.

The difference in price is about €13 once shipping etc is taken into account. The HL60R does have a red light, not sure if this is a deal breaker or what to do when I need to preserve my night vision   
The HM65R has a spot and a flood, I think I prefer that rather then just one beam.
HM65R is USBC vs HL60R micro USB, not a big deal either way.
HM65R weighs 97 g vs HL60R 121 g.

Suggestions ?

[Don Pablo]

I forgot to do some research.
But it's on the nighttime agenda for this weekend now!
I've selected a book with hard to see pics to provide a worst case scenario.

[eamo]

Good job Pabs - I'm closer then ever to making a decision - the Fenix HM65R SuperRaptor is on sale I can get it for about the same price (€4 difference) as the regular light. Seems it can only be bought in Finland but thats ok too

[Stefano]

So lads, how did the research go ? Do we actually need a red light option for night nav ?

So, I've settled on either the Fenix HM65R or the HL60R but I can't decide

Both are pretty high lumen lights plenty for my needs.
Both IPX8 very important to me.
Both are rechargable I've decided I want this feature.

The difference in price is about €13 once shipping etc is taken into account. The HL60R does have a red light, not sure if this is a deal breaker or what to do when I need to preserve my night vision   
The HM65R has a spot and a flood, I think I prefer that rather then just one beam.
HM65R is USBC vs HL60R micro USB, not a big deal either way.
HM65R weighs 97 g vs HL60R 121 g.

Suggestions ?

If I had to choose between the two I would take HL60R.
I am a traditionalist on headlamps, as a form I do not differ from Armytek and Zebralight but between the two Fenix you mentioned I would take HL60R.
Although it has a particular shape, it is a robust, sold and reliable lamp.
Sorry only for the fact that HL60R is sold with a 2600 mA battery only
Check if it has two springs in which case you can also use flat cells, otherwise you will need a button top battery.

Too much weight in my head then I don't like it at all (that's why I would reject the other model)
The other model (HM65R) is original but I don't like it because it is dual_tint, a light must be cold or warm.
In the woods at night I did tests in the past, the result of two shades at the same time is not beautiful but neither is the eye going from hot to cold.

Question: Did you also consider the HM61R?

[Stefano]

Good job Pabs - I'm closer then ever to making a decision - the Fenix HM65R SuperRaptor is on sale I can get it for about the same price (€4 difference) as the regular light. Seems it can only be bought in Finland but thats ok too

If you decide to choose HM65R, *buy it in Finland*
(Fenix HM65R SUPERRAPTOR 2020)
The Finnish version maintains constant brightness in a better way than the standard version.

There are rumors that this Finnish version will become standard and the previous one will be abandoned.

Edit:I know a person who has the Finnish version and has told me well of this light.

[eamo]

If you decide to choose HM65R, *buy it in Finland*
(Fenix HM65R SUPERRAPTOR 2020)
The Finnish version maintains constant brightness in a better way than the standard version.

There are rumors that this Finnish version will become standard and the previous one will be abandoned.

Edit:I know a person who has the Finnish version and has told me well of this light.

Thanks the Finnish version isn't much more expensive given I'm buying online anyway.
Interesting about what you said about the different tones of ligjt I hadn't thought about that but makes sense when you said it

The hm61r the shape doesn't appeal to me I dunno why I just don't like lights shaped that way 

[Stefano]

Thanks the Finnish version isn't much more expensive given I'm buying online anyway.
Interesting about what you said about the different tones of ligjt I hadn't thought about that but makes sense when you said it

The hm61r the shape doesn't appeal to me I dunno why I just don't like lights shaped that way 

It is not the first time that Fenix has made dual tint lights.
Their thought is that neutral light is useful if you have to see it up close, tint is less important over long distances.
In theory it may be true but I do not agree with this opinion.
In the past, many thrower lights were only sold with a cool withe tint because if you illuminate an object at 200 meters, the tint does not count much but even here I disagree.
In a wood, the difference between a CW and a NW tint  can be clearly seen!
I had many warm headlamps but I wanted to combine them with a hand-torch of the same tint, using a Fenix TK15 or TK09 for the throw, the cool withe tint disturbed the warm light of my Armytek Wizard.
For this reason I bought first the cheap Convoy  C8 with warm (T6 4C) and after a warm Predator.
Naving a homogeneous tint is nice.
I have not understood if the HM65R Finnish version is dual tint or if it is entirely neutral?

[Stefano]

The hm61r the shape doesn't appeal to me I dunno why I just don't like lights shaped that way 

To me the angular headlamp shape
I use them without the upper band, I carry them hanging on the neck with their band, then I can use them with the band on the forehead or on the neck (or a light in the forehead and another hanging on the neck)
They can be unhooked from the band and used as a standing torch (or if they have a magnet in the tail they can be hung)
in the trousers pocket they take up little space even with the band (at least the Zebralight or Armytek band, other brands may have larger and bulky bands)

[eamo]

so, it finally arrived - it's bright alright  - going to be a few months before I really see what it can do ! Thanks Stefano for the help

[eamo]

and i got around to taking a picture of it -

[Don Pablo]

Reminds me of this robot.


How well does it work?

[eamo]

Reminds me of this robot.
(Image removed from quote.)

How well does it work?

yeah, well, it's the middle of summer so . . . . . . . it seems real bright, actually, really really bright

[Don Pablo]

This is important! Stay up until 1am.

[eamo]

This is important! Stay up until 1am.

You've never watched gremlins have you ?

[Don Pablo]

You've never watched gremlins have you ?

Err... No?
I did see Beetlejuice, so I don't think I'm a lost cause...

[eamo]

Err... No?
I did see Beetlejuice, so I don't think I'm a lost cause...

Um ? What ?

[Don Pablo]

I thought we were talking about classic movies and so I missed the point... all because I didn't see Gremlins.

[eamo]

I thought we were talking about classic movies and so I missed the point... all because I didn't see Gremlins.

No. We're talking about my new headlight not that I've a whole pile to say about it. Gremlins might be old, but if it is a classic ? hmmm maybe we are talking about old/classic movies ?

[cody6268]

No. We're talking about my new headlight not that I've a whole pile to say about it. Gremlins might be old, but if it is a classic ? hmmm maybe we are talking about old/classic movies ?

At least we're not talking about old headlamps. My Granddad has a Kohler lamp which he used in the coal mines. It is incandescent, thus pretty dim. Battery pack is huge (and its charger is bigger than a toaster!), lead-acid, and weighs about 5-6 pounds.  They only recently phased them out, in favor of LED models (and I mean as recently as 5-6 years ago), some of them don't even have battery packs, others have Li-Ion packs that are tiny.