SAK that is not in the Victorinox catalogs

Ivo · **on:** July 04, 2019, 10:01:07 PM

I have a SAK that is not in the Victorinox catalogs.
According to SAKWiki it is a "CHAMPION plus" but this one has no pen.
The knife is brand new, has not the latest magnifier glas , has the latest stamps on the main blade.

Does anybody know more about this knife and why it is not in any catalog ?

Mechanickal · **Reply #1 on:** July 04, 2019, 10:21:38 PM

Scale swap?

Ivo · **Reply #2 on:** July 04, 2019, 10:26:21 PM

Why is it not in the catalogs ?

In 2004 there was a new magnifier glas and the stamps on the blade are new from 2005 this is also a mystery.
This one has no pen but it has a pin.

MiniChamp · **Reply #3 on:** July 05, 2019, 04:25:30 AM

Quote from: Ivo on July 04, 2019, 10:26:21 PM

Why is it not in the catalogs ?

This SAK is a Champion C. A model that was introduced around 1973 and, in essence, seems to be in production ever since. AFAIK, the last time that it appeared in a catalog was in 1985. When the SwissChamp was introduced, around 1985, it replaced the older Champion C as the top Victorinox SAK model. From then on the Champion C seems to have been dropped out of catalogs, but not out of production. It may have some special status as a limited availability model.

For the last 15 years (or so) the variant of the Champion C that seems to be available is the Champion Plus (NA model 54525) that comes with Plus scales and the Mini-Screwdriver. Before then (at least for some years in the 1990's), the Champion C was available in the US market with the Mini-Screwdriver (but without the Plus scales) under the name "Champion W/MSD" (NA model 54521).

It looks like the Champion Plus availability in the US market has always been limited to certain retailers and this may have been true also for earlier variants such as the "Champion W/MSD." I don't know if and how the Champion Plus was available in other markets. Current availability may be restricted to Amazon (US), but it seems to always be available there.

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In 2004 there was a new magnifier glas and the stamps on the blade are new from 2005 this is also a mystery.

The mag-glass is indeed the old (pre-2005) one, while the stamps on the blade seem to be the latest (post-2011) ones. This is indeed VERY strange.

One possibility that comes to mind is that this SAK was serviced by Victorinox. It may be connected to an interesting discussion on another thread. In particular, Sawl Goodman did a remarkable job collecting from Amazon complaints about the latest mag-glass version. One of them contains the following very interesting text: "I called Victorinox customer support and they are aware of this problem and said that they will gladly switch out the clear plastic-surrounded lens with a gray-plastic surrounded lens if I send the knife to their Repairs department." So maybe Victorinox is willing to replace the new mag-glass layer by the old one for those that request it and maybe, just maybe, this SAK is the consequence of such a swap. Possible???

P.S. I think that the current presentation of the Champion C/Champion Plus on SAKWiki is very awkward. These two are essentially the same SAK, but SAKWiki mixes the Champion C with the fairly different older 6-layer Champions while singling out the Champion Plus to a separate page. It seem to be a consequence of giving more weight to the marketing names that were used for certain SAKs than to the actual features of the SAKs.

Barry Rowland · **Reply #4 on:** July 05, 2019, 04:30:59 AM

A still in production Champion? I like that!!

Ivo · **Reply #5 on:** July 05, 2019, 11:39:21 AM

Thanks MiniChamp for the very good explanation.

So this knife can be one that was repaired by Victorinox and where they put in the wrong magnifier glas or that they replaced the main blad.

I was thinking the same about SAKWiki, the explanation of the CHAMPION version is very confusing.

Sawl Goodman · **Reply #6 on:** July 06, 2019, 01:09:42 AM

Hi MiniChamp. The review stating that Victorinox would replace the clear magnifier with the grey one was from 2010, when the then current version had the plastic lens. I'm sorry I didn't date the reviews in the post. The links are there for reference.

I'd be surprised if Victorinox would replace new with old, now - especially given that the instructions in the 2012 repair manual state:

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Replace the damaged tool with the same or replace the whole layer with the components of the newest generation.

MiniChamp · **Reply #7 on:** July 07, 2019, 02:51:27 AM

Quote from: Sawl Goodman on July 06, 2019, 01:09:42 AM

Hi MiniChamp. The review stating that Victorinox would replace the clear magnifier with the grey one was from 2010, when the then current version had the plastic lens.

Thanks for pointing this out, Sawl.

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I'd be surprised if Victorinox would replace new with old, now

It seems surprising to me that they apparently were willing to do this swap back in 2010. If this was really the case, then it's quite possible that they were willing to do this also on some later years. Hence, I still believe it to be a viable possibility that Ivo's SAK is the consequence of such a swap. Of course, since stocks of old parts don't last forever, it would be a lot more surprising if it turns out that they are still willing to do it even now.

It may be interesting if someone that has serious problems with the current mag-glass would contact them and ask if they are willing replace it with the old gray one. Now where can we find someone having such problems???

Sawl Goodman · **Reply #8 on:** July 07, 2019, 03:52:57 AM

Quote from: MiniChamp on July 07, 2019, 02:51:27 AM

Thanks for pointing this out, Sawl.
It seems surprising to me that they apparently were willing to do this swap back in 2010. If this was really the case, then it's quite possible that they were willing to do this also on some later years. Hence, I still believe it to be a viable possibility that Ivo's SAK is the consequence of such a swap. Of course, since stocks of old parts don't last forever, it would be a lot more surprising if it turns out that they are still willing to do it even now.

Yeah. This is partly what I was thinking about Vic doing a swap now: time passes and stock dries up. After all, the grey magnifier was phased out around 14 years ago. This in addition to the repair policy.

Quote from: MiniChamp on July 07, 2019, 02:51:27 AM

It may be interesting if someone that has serious problems with the current mag-glass would contact them and ask if they are willing replace it with the old gray one. Now where can we find someone having such problems???

Haha, who could that be?

Asking Vic if they'd replace the latest magnifier with the grey one isn't a bad idea. I may do it! But I wouldn't ask for me as I prefer the new version. I just want the darn thing to behave like the grey one and have virtually no possibility of the lens falling out!

cody6268 · **Reply #9 on:** July 07, 2019, 04:16:30 AM

Any comparison of the Phillips with a 1990s SAK? If it's shorter, it's the current model. To me, this knife is an obvious warranty rebuild. They did similar to an Artisan I had. The knife was a 1960s knife, and I only asked them to fix the broken scissors (the spring was missing, a common problem, but the screw had been lost and a length of brass rod had been substituted and crudely smashed in by its former owner); and I for some reason, also selected "Clean and Polish". While near full, the main blade had tons of deep scratches, so they replaced it, with a 1980s-1990s blade (I still have the old one, should I ever need to replace a 1960s SAK with a broken blade).