Never seen this before (fish scaler)

[jazzbass]

Picked up a mid 1960s Fischermesser last week on a fairly reasonable buy-it-now on eBay. I got it a immediately noticed something I didn't expect - the fish scaler is not beveled at all.

Background on everyone's least favorite SAK tool - the fish scaler has gone through many design changes since its introduction in 1950. While there are a lot of minor changes, you can group the major design styles into three buckets:

1. Dual bevel, no scale (1950 - c. 1971)
2. Single Bevel, no scale (c. 1971 - c. 1973)
3. Single Bevel, scale (c. 1973 - present)

So getting a no bevel (completely flat both sides) scaler in this knife is a head scratcher. See pictures:





I figure there are two possibilities:

1. Production mistake. These are not common but statistically they have to happen, right? If your quality is at 99.999%, and you make a million knives, that means there are 10 errors that slip through.
2. Test of a cost saving production change. "Let's see if we can save a step by not grinding the fish scaler".... "Nope, it's terrible, people hate it. Go back the the original design"

So I'm thinking it's probably #1. I looked through lots and lot of pictures of other fish scaler knives from this era and nothing - not a single knife I saw had a "no bevel" scaler. Ever other short lived prod changes (e.g. 91mm no-nick metal files and 84mm 27T asym saws) can be found in a handful of knives (5% or so) from the same era. This? Nothing.

Interestingly, this scaler is completely polished, which would have been the step after grinding. So if this is a prod mistake, whoever polished it missed it, then whoever assembled the knife missed it, and then whoever did QC missed it. Being mid 60s I'm not sure how much of each of those steps was automated or still done by hand. I suspect polishing was largely automated at the time, but assembly was fairly manual.

Thoughts?

[Aligator]

I can not help you.

But I love your collection.
I love razors with hook removers.

[comis]

Great eye and great find!  It’s interesting how valuable this now may becomes due to its rarity, where other tool makers might be just a common occurrence.

[Reinier]

Cool!
I always like reading your informative posts

[Mechanickal]

I agree with probability 1.

IIRC, microbe has an alox SAK with Marlin Spike where the spike is shaped to follow the scales, but the gap is way too large.

So mistakes on SAK tools do occur...

[LeaF]

Great find, jazzbass!


Could you please share a link to original listing on ebay? I'm looking for blue Fischermesser for a while.. Don't know how I've missed it. 


By the way, have you noticed how changed font which used for on fish-scaler (I mean different shapes of digits)?


Regards,
Alex

[Aloha]

Its so interesting how a keen eye unveils such subtleties in the SAK world.  Not sure I would have ever noticed this and now I bet there are members looking at their fish scalers like never before 

[jazzbass]

Could you please share a link to original listing on ebay? I'm looking for blue Fischermesser for a while.. Don't know how I've missed it. 

Sent you a PM

By the way, have you noticed how changed font which used for on fish-scaler (I mean different shapes of digits)?

Indeed I have. Here are the four variations of the scale stamping that I know of:

• First version from a 1972 Champion LNF. Very narrow typeface with angular 2, round 3 and open 4. Scale includes the 7.5cm mark. This is the only knife I've ever seen this on - they came from a batch of Champion LNFs being sold (BNIB!) on eBay probably 10 years ago. There where about 10 of these sold, all with the same scaler, so it wasn't a fluke. I've always figured it was a prototype run of the scale stamping, they found the numbers somewhat hard to read, and immediately moved to v2.
• Second version from a 1973 Fischermesser. Wider typeface with round 2, angular 3, and closed 4. Scales includes the 7.5cm mark. This is the standard stamping until c 1988
• Third version from a 1996 Angler Original. Same typeface as the second version, but the 7.5cm mark is gone. Seems to show up around 1988 - 1986 model Champions and SwissChamps have it, the 1989 Battle Series Murten does not. Looking VERY closely there does seem to be some variation in the number between this and v2, but these are minor IMO and can be attributed stamping dies wearing out and being replaced.
• Fourth version from a 2007 Bass Fishing knife. Complete typeface change (actually looks to be a slightly wider variant of the first version) with angular 2, round 3 and open 4. This change seems to happen c. 1999-2000 give or take a couple years.

Those are the major variants I know of - if anyone knows of others please post.

BTW, I've tried to identify the typeface used on these with no success. It seems that typefaces with angular 2s have either angular 3s or closed 4s (e.g Futura, Twentieth Century).

[Rapidray]

Great information! 
So naturally I had to go check my 3, then some others. All 3 of the SwissChamps that I have do not have the 7.5 mark. My other 5 SAK’s do have it. That is interesting!

[VICMAN]

Picked up a mid 1960s Fischermesser last week on a fairly reasonable buy-it-now on eBay. I got it a immediately noticed something I didn't expect - the fish scaler is not beveled at all.

Thoughts?

Cool find jazzbass!

That is the only one I have ever seen with no bevel.

[jnoxyd]

Many thanks Jazzbass! It's very interesting.

[Steinar]

When I see a thread named “Never seen this before” and original poster is jazzbass, you can be d*mned sure I read the thread. Thanks, very interesting, and also, I am yet another member in the growing camp of people who have never seen that either. (No surprise there.)

[kamakiri]

Here are the four variations of the scale stamping that I know of:

(Image removed from quote.)

• First version from a 1972 Champion LNF. Very narrow typeface with angular 2, round 3 and open 4. Scale includes the 7.5cm mark. This is the only knife I've ever seen this on - they came from a batch of Champion LNFs being sold (BNIB!) on eBay probably 10 years ago. There where about 10 of these sold, all with the same scaler, so it wasn't a fluke. I've always figured it was a prototype run of the scale stamping, they found the numbers somewhat hard to read, and immediately moved to v2.

I think these were regular production and that the run must have been pretty brief...but long enough for the tooling to wear out. I found two ‘in the wild’ by spotting the different scaler on what I could see were c. (Late) ‘72 Champions/LNF.

The second one I found appears to exhibit wear on the stamping die. Can’t even see the ‘1’ and other numbers are only partially stamped/visible.

[Huntsman]

When I see a thread named “Never seen this before” and original poster is jazzbass, you can be d*mned sure I read the thread. Thanks, very interesting, ..........

Hey Steriner - You stole my words - I was going to say exactly that !!! 

Thanks for the post JB. I cannot help I am afraid on your find - But I am off to check my scalers!!

Hey and please coud I put those scaler evolution shots in the Wiki on the scaler page

Thanks