The Gas Station MRE challenge

[ElevenBlade]

   like everything else... this looks like fun.

I'll have to figure out what I would do here.  Aside from morning coffee, I take just one regrettably large and unhealthy meal each evening.   

[ElevenBlade]

Bridgford does make their products commercially available and don’t even label them as MRE.
(Image removed from quote.)
There are actually several companies now that make commercially available MRE style meals.  Some don’t even look like MREs.
(Image removed from quote.)

What other "wet backpacker" meals do you know of in the US?  Everything I come across is freeze-dried, but in the UK they have Wayfarer meals that just need to be warmed up, like MREs

[Sos24]

What other "wet backpacker" meals do you know of in the US?  Everything I come across is freeze-dried, but in the UK they have Wayfarer meals that just need to be warmed up, like MREs

I’m not sure if packers would really want the MRE style meals, mainly because of the weight factor.  The MRE companies I know of are ones that manufacture military meals but also sell commercially or ones that make meals styled after military MREs.  The main ones, I know of are:
- Sopakco
- Ameriqual
- MRE Star
- Bridgford

[Nix]

Now for a couple clarifying questions:
- you mention freeze dried meals, I live just a couple miles from an REI which carries some nice freeze dried meals for backpackers.  Would one of those for say dinner count?
- Is repackaging items to smaller single serve or less bulky packages allowed?  Example: oatmeal in plastic bag instead of single serve cup like sold in gas station, macaroni and cheese removed from box, chips or crackers that come in big bag or box  broken down in smaller bag for space.
- The bag just has to fit the food as long as other implements or accessories (stove, spork, bowl, french press pot) could still be carried in pack, correct?

Super questions, Sos! 


• Military rations around the world differ in how they are created. Even the US Cold Weather ration uses freeze dried foods to save weight. The old LRP ration used to utilize freeze dried meals, too. I don't know about the current versions. So to be inclusive, yes, freeze dried components are permitted.  (I have my eye on some freeze dried eggs for my breakfast element.)

• Mags and I debated the bulk foods question a bit. I leaned toward using items that are prepackaged. E.g. allow small boxes/bags of raisins but not a small home-packed bag of raisins. In the end, Mags' wisdom won out. GSMRE designers may package their own bulk foods, but with two caveats: 1) safe food handling and storage is paramount, and 2) since we are trying to ensure a minimum of 2400 Kcal, repackaged items, e.g. a baggie of raisins, should be measured in some way so the calorie content can be estimated with some accuracy. As long as your MRE can be safely stored and meets the 2400 Kcal requirement, you are good to proceed.

(Side note: there is an Israeli ration called the 'Manot Krav' which is essentially a box of canned tuna, canned corn, canned halvah, some tinned meat, and maybe some canned olives. It is meant to feed a small squad, so it isn't really all that portable or convenient to carry, but it does demonstrate the wide range of MRE thoughts.)

• Size. My "2-gallon or 8L" size constraint is just a guide. I based that on, roughly, the size of 3 US MRE's (three meals for 24 hours). The focus here is on packability and portability....'cuz that's what one does with an MRE. If your food items fit in a 8L bay, I think you have met the goal perfectly.

Most MRE's are compromises in design. They try to be small, calorie dense, easy to prepare, easy to eat, durable, safe, and palatable. The US "First Strike Ration" is a great example. It was designed to be used for 24 hours, have a certain size, and have 2400 Kcal + 400 Kcal of extra carbs.


Here is what I'm planning for my GSMRE:

• Accessory pouch ('cuz every MRE needs an accessory pouch!) with clean up stuff, a utensil, some condiments, and goodies. I'm aiming for what I would have liked as an accessory pouch when I used MRE's as part of my job.
• Breakfast pouch: 800 Kcal of food and drink
• Lunch pouch: 800 Kcal of food and drink
• Dinner pouch: 800 Kcal of food and drink
• Snack pouch: 400-600 Kcal of food and drink

I plan on putting mine in a backpack and either going camping or for a good hike (so I can get some field experience with my ration). I am willing to bet that I won't eat more than 75% of what include in my MRE (and military studies show about only 75-80% of an MRE is typically eaten.).

Also in my pack will be a small stove, a water bottle, mug, and a cooking vessel of some kind. Those items don't count as part of the MRE, they are gear. 

[ezdog]

What other "wet backpacker" meals do you know of in the US?  Everything I come across is freeze-dried, but in the UK they have Wayfarer meals that just need to be warmed up, like MREs

Well Hormel for one makes an actual buttload of selections of meals like these under the guise of convenience packaging.
I imagine they offer no actual nutritional value and even less taste but they are ready to go at any time just how they are stored for a long time too!



You can also buy all forms of Rice and Beans and even Rice& Beans together in packs ready to dig right into and I have tried these too so I could know what I might be getting into before I made myself just in case.



Tell me this does not look tasty?!



And then of course there are Spam Singles which are just exactly what it sounds like they are and clearly a solid base of anyones home made MRE platform too,or at least I plan on having some on board!




I actually got into an argument with some guy somewhere not too long ago who would not accept the definition of MRE as "ready to Eat" and argued they require cooking or reconstitution of some kind?
I do not think the freeze dried stuff is an MRE either but more of a survival or camping meal as they are just not really ready to eat as packaged at all?

I mean really can the words "Ready to Eat" really stand to be interpreted?

For the purpose of this exercise though I do not care in the least!

In the name of Science and all.   

[Barry Rowland]

Those Hormel meals are a staple of my on the road diet 

[ezdog]

Those Hormel meals are a staple of my on the road diet 

Another wise road warrior like myself!

They are also 99 cents pretty often and I promise I have a stockpile right next to my 'Rona Toilet Paper,they really seemed to go together too.

[Nix]

I actually got into an argument with some guy somewhere not too long ago who would not accept the definition of MRE as "ready to Eat" and argued they require cooking or reconstitution of some kind?
I do not think the freeze dried stuff is an MRE either but more of a survival or camping meal as they are just not really ready to eat as packaged at all?

I mean really can the words "Ready to Eat" really stand to be interpreted?

   MRE means 'Meal, ready to eat.'  I think one of the strenghts of the MRE is that can be opened and eaten cold--zero prep aside from opening it up.

But in this day and age the term 'MRE  has come to encompass many rations. As I said earlier, the US military Cold Weather Ration has freeze-dried elements that require hot water to reconstitute. I think there are other NATO countries that call their freeze dried rations "MREs". Doesn't really make sense, but the usage has broadened.

For our purposes, 'MRE' means a ration that can be quickly prepared and eaten.

And....keep in mind...some of the components of a genuine US MRE require water: the drink mixes, shakes, and beverages all need water, hot or cold. So even the original 'meal, ready to eat' needs water for some components.

 

[Nix]

And then of course there are Spam Singles which are just exactly what it sounds like they are and clearly a solid base of anyones home made MRE platform too,or at least I plan on having some on board!

Spam Singles are a guilty pleasure of mine. I'll surely have one in my GSMRE!   

[ElevenBlade]

Spam Singles are a guilty pleasure of mine. I'll surely have one in my GSMRE!   

entire cans of Spam are a guilty pleasure of mine 

Over the last year, I've tried quite a few canned seafood products.

For science, and all that.

It was also an excuse to use the Victorinox Hook, and I secretly hoped that the pull tabs would fail. 

[Nix]

Spam is of course an iconic military ration element. Spam was developed in 1937 and it became really popular during the war with civilians and the military.




Spam was used by American, British, and Soviet military personnel during the war. It was included in Red Cross packages to allied POW's. Australians had 'bully beef', a similar concept. I'm sure that Yanks and Aussies swapped Spam for Bully Beef when they were fighting in the Pacific together, but I haven't seen confirmation of that.

Eventually the Allied troops ate so much Spam they came to loathe the stuff, but after the war Spam remained popular in parts of the US and Asia.

So....yes...Spam has earned a place in my GSMRE! 

[Sea Monster]

Sea Monster's Servo Subsistence Specifications

You should able to get buy on the contents of your cash stash, a poor man's MRE shouldn't be out of reach for a...poor man.

You can really get into the spirit of things (and cost effectiveness!) by buying things that are already past their best before!

This image has 13330 kj in it (more if you eat the packaging...) or around 3185 kcal, and cost about $11.50 AUD - This is roughly the same price as a Royale with Cheese with chips and a coke, which has a measly 983 kcal.

For those watching their macros, it's about
118 g Protein
169 g Fats
293 g Carbs

and enough salt to kill a horse.

Plenty of water recommended

You eat the chips first - it gets rid of the the biggest item, and you can use the package as a rubbish bag for the rest.

I'm not an amateur.


Edit: I've checked my work book, and I'll be on the road on Chow Day, so that's makes this even easier. I'll add a 500ml can of my energy drink of choice, and I'm set

Edit 2: I don't know if I'll include it in my final menu, but my "secret weapon" for travel food is....https://www.plumrose.com.au/products/canned-meat/hotdogs/

It doesn't quite have the cachet of spiced ham in a can, but I find it a nice treat, and they can be readily prepared in any billy can (or the modern equivalent - a jetboil)
You don't even need extra water, you just use the stuff in the tin! (you might not want to use it for your coffee though  )

the size and weight of it making it not great for hiking, but if you've got a vehicle and ample space handy, they're great.

[Sea Monster]

Separate post, so as not to sully my earlier contribution -

The Australian MRE has 24 hours worth of food in the same amount of space as the USA has for 1 meal. In your "2-Gallon" guide, you could carry a week's worth of Australian (or New Zealand, I believe they're basically the same?) MREs.
I don't know that you'd want to *eat* a week's worth.

Here's a video of some dude pulling one apart -

I note that his is a 2016 one.

I happen to know, as I did some truck driving for a supplier of this stuff years ago, that the "Brand name" stuff (fish, chocolates, cheese) wasn't always in it. I don't know when they added it (prior to 2016, obviously), but it's a (relatively) recent upgrade.

[magentus]

So much win in those pics sir 

[Nix]

Sea Monster's Servo Subsistence Specifications

You should able to get buy on the contents of your cash stash, a poor man's MRE shouldn't be out of reach for a...poor man.

You can really get into the spirit of things (and cost effectiveness!) by buying things that are already past their best before!

This image has 13330 kj in it (more if you eat the packaging...) or around 3185 kcal, and cost about $11.50 AUD - This is roughly the same price as a Royale with Cheese with chips and a coke, which has a measly 983 kcal.

For those watching their macros, it's about
118 g Protein
169 g Fats
293 g Carbs

and enough salt to kill a horse.

Plenty of water recommended

You eat the chips first - it gets rid of the the biggest item, and you can use the package as a rubbish bag for the rest.

I'm not an amateur.


Edit: I've checked my work book, and I'll be on the road on Chow Day, so that's makes this even easier. I'll add a 500ml can of my energy drink of choice, and I'm set

Edit 2: I don't know if I'll include it in my final menu, but my "secret weapon" for travel food is....https://www.plumrose.com.au/products/canned-meat/hotdogs/

It doesn't quite have the cachet of spiced ham in a can, but I find it a nice treat, and they can be readily prepared in any billy can (or the modern equivalent - a jetboil)
You don't even need extra water, you just use the stuff in the tin! (you might not want to use it for your coffee though  )

the size and weight of it making it not great for hiking, but if you've got a vehicle and ample space handy, they're great.

[Nix]

Edit: I've checked my work book, and I'll be on the road on Chow Day, so that's makes this even easier. I'll add a 500ml can of my energy drink of choice, and I'm set

We timed this one so that Chow Day would be on a Saturday to make it a bit easier for participation and play. Sorry you'll be working over the weekend, Mr Sulfites!

[Nix]

Separate post, so as not to sully my earlier contribution -

The Australian MRE has 24 hours worth of food in the same amount of space as the USA has for 1 meal. In your "2-Gallon" guide, you could carry a week's worth of Australian (or New Zealand, I believe they're basically the same?) MREs.
I don't know that you'd want to *eat* a week's worth.

Here's a video of some dude pulling one apart -

I note that his is a 2016 one.

I happen to know, as I did some truck driving for a supplier of this stuff years ago, that the "Brand name" stuff (fish, chocolates, cheese) wasn't always in it. I don't know when they added it (prior to 2016, obviously), but it's a (relatively) recent upgrade.

Good looking ration. I think US MREs started using more 'brand name' items as well. Skittles and M&Ms spring to mind. As Sos pointed out earlier, some the apparently nondescript items in a ration are just off-the-shelf products that get a dull beige wrapper. The snack pretzel we know as 'Combos' is a good example. So it may be that the recognizable packaging is not a food upgrade but a convenience. Some have suggested that it might be a 'moral booster' to find familiar food items in the old lunch bag. 

[McStitchy]

Pffffchrrr... where are you getting all these ideas from Jack 

No cooking skills needed?

- 2400 Kcal minimum
- To fit easily into a Backpack
- Must survive a week storage in a cool and dry place (no refrigerator)

...and I actually need to survive on it for 24hrs?

   I'll give it a try 


GSMRE Designers & Diners:

01. Nix, aka 'Mr Spork'
02. Magentus, aka 'Dr Tray'
03. Sea Monster, aka 'Mr Sulfites'
04. comis, aka 'Road Food Warrior'
05. Barry Rowland, aka 'Sack Lunch Commando'
06. ReamerPunch, aka 'Can Opener Connoisseur'
07. ezdog, aka 'Chow Hound'
08. Borg, aka "Turnip the Beet"
09. Eamo aka "Dadbrador"
10. Fuzzy aka "Chicken Supreme"
11. Sos24 aka “Concrete Camp Chef”
12. McStitchy aka "Backwards Cuisine veteran"

[Sos24]

  MRE means 'Meal, ready to eat.'  I think one of the strenghts of the MRE is that can be opened and eaten cold--zero prep aside from opening it up.

But in this day and age the term 'MRE  has come to encompass many rations. As I said earlier, the US military Cold Weather Ration has freeze-dried elements that require hot water to reconstitute. I think there are other NATO countries that call their freeze dried rations "MREs". Doesn't really make sense, but the usage has broadened.

For our purposes, 'MRE' means a ration that can be quickly prepared and eaten.

And....keep in mind...some of the components of a genuine US MRE require water: the drink mixes, shakes, and beverages all need water, hot or cold. So even the original 'meal, ready to eat' needs water for some components.

 

I agree completely on the ready-to-eat, which is why I asked the question about freeze dried for the purposes of this exercise.

But I will also add that if you consider some trends in the ultralight thru-hiker world, freeze dried foods can be closer than you think to ready to eat.  Depending on the climate, many thru-hikers will do cold-soaking of freeze-dried food.  The hikers add water to the meal that they plan to eat earlier in the day, so that when the arrive at camp the meal has already been reconstituted and as long as you don’t mind eating cold then it is ready to eat.  There are even some methods where the meal could be somewhat warm before the end of the hike, like solar bags (which I have a few) or the “crotch pot”.

[Sea Monster]

Good looking ration. I think US MREs started using more 'brand name' items as well. Skittles and M&Ms spring to mind. As Sos pointed out earlier, some the apparently nondescript items in a ration are just off-the-shelf products that get a dull beige wrapper. The snack pretzel we know as 'Combos' is a good example. So it may be that the recognizable packaging is not a food upgrade but a convenience. Some have suggested that it might be a 'moral booster' to find familiar food items in the old lunch bag. 

I suspect there's a few layers to it - and I doubt any of it has to do with morale.

In Australia we have
a) Limited number of producers/suppliers/packaging companies
b) A small government.

This means that whether something comes in a custom or wholesale or retail "pack" depends on how bothered the supplier can be to meet a contract requirement.
(Side note, back in the bad old days, 90s and before, there was heaps of government department stuff getting around - Furniture, stationery, cutlery, all sorts. Nowadays the government pretty much just shops retail.

Side side note - half our government is actually contracted services anyway, in order to make the "actual" government departments look slimmer they cut down all the department staffing and resources, then give juicy contracts to their mates (or themselves) to deliver the services the government used to manage....that is getting way off topic though)

I suspect when the government went to the (for example, M&Ms) and said "we want to buy M&Ms for our MREs" - Mr M&M asked "How many?" and when Mr Government replied "10,000" then Mr M&M said "Cool story bro, they're in aisle three, you can have the same ones as everyone else"


Occasionally we'll get a Groupon with our NZ buddies, and that "buying power"may have been able to swing something like the plain clothes noodles...

I don't know if it's a rule or if it has a name, but something like the USA Berry Compliant thing, our government has to provide preferential purchasing to Australian (and in particular Indigenous Australian owned) businesses - so if you're the only manufacture selling Ramen, then the government is (more or less) required to buy them from you - there's a work around for this though - your company might actually just be repackaging another manufacturer's goods into brown wrappers to fulfill a contract for the government - this meets the governments desire for brown packaging, and to have an "Australian" supplier - whilst really you're doing F-all being a middle man, wasting some resources with extra transit, handling, and packaging steps, and adding a cut for yourself.

Ahh....business.

[Nix]

GSMRE Designers & Diners:

01. Nix, aka 'Mr Spork'
02. Magentus, aka 'Dr Tray'
03. Sea Monster, aka 'Mr Sulfites'
04. comis, aka 'Road Food Warrior'
05. Barry Rowland, aka 'Sack Lunch Commando'
06. ReamerPunch, aka 'Can Opener Connoisseur'
07. ezdog, aka 'Chow Hound'
08. Borg, aka "Turnip the Beet"
09. Eamo aka "Dadbrador"
10. Fuzzy aka "Chicken Supreme"
11. Sos24 aka “Concrete Camp Chef”
12. McStitchy aka "Backwards Cuisine veteran"

Oh, Stitchy..... 

I thought you were above this sort of thing.......

[Barry Rowland]

 

[McStitchy]

Wouldn't want to miss it 

[Nix]

I agree completely on the ready-to-eat, which is why I asked the question about freeze dried for the purposes of this exercise.

But I will also add that if you consider some trends in the ultralight thru-hiker world, freeze dried foods can be closer than you think to ready to eat.  Depending on the climate, many thru-hikers will do cold-soaking of freeze-dried food.  The hikers add water to the meal that they plan to eat earlier in the day, so that when the arrive at camp the meal has already been reconstituted and as long as you don’t mind eating cold then it is ready to eat.  There are even some methods where the meal could be somewhat warm before the end of the hike, like solar bags (which I have a few) or the “crotch pot”.

Yeah, I know some hikers will toss a handful of couscous, a bullion package, and water into a jar, toss it in the backpack in the AM and consume in the PM. Fairly hardcore and I've never done that. For me, cold soaking was a 'bridge too far', it sounds like life on the U-boat and I thought it'd be nice for mags to have a brief change. The specter of cold soaking is why I included a '30 minute prep and eat' time limit--just to keep it focused on convenience foods that were 99% 'ready-to-eat'. 

When mags and I were cooking this one up, we thought it would be nice to incorporate the broader view of what a ration is. Since military rations now include everything from freeze dried "Chicken Tikka Masala" to cans of corn to packs of energy gel, it is hard to set strict limits on what might be included in a DIY 'MRE'. With the "Gas Station" element, I started to envision this as a challenge where one might be heading out of town....perhaps to rendezvous with the U-boat for extraction and a life of cold soaking at sea...with the need to quickly pick up 24 - 72 hours of food. 

In terms of running a challenge where people can test and share ideas for hiking, camping, road-tripping, or fleeing the zombies, a broader, more civilian, view seemed to have greater benefit for all participants. While still keeping it fun. Hopefully.... 

[Sea Monster]

When mags and I were cooking this one up, we thought it would be nice to incorporate the broader view of what a ration is. Since military rations includes everything from freeze dried "Chicken Tikka Masala" to cans of corn to packs energy gel, it is hard to set strict limits on what might be included in a DIY 'MRE'. With the "Gas Station" element, I started to envision this as a challenge where one might be heading out of town....perhaps to rendezvous with the U-boat for extraction and a life of cold soaking at sea...with the need to quickly pick up 24 - 72 hours of food. 

Energy gels have seen a rise in popularity in the "endurance athlete" crowd, particularly cyclists (and maybe the military if they're under the illusion that they are athletes)

but Sea Monster's pro tip for energy goop (works for high speed low drag U-Boat extractions too) is Saunders Malt Extract. http://saundersmalt.com.au/history/
it stills comes in a tin, because quaint, and it separates the old school athletes from the new on the block wastrels with their individually packed one-shot hits that they then toss their sticky litter all over the trail.

[Nix]

Very cool.

I had a tin of malt extract, not Saunders, around here for a while. Used it for some baking projects. Never thought to use it to 'power up' or 'carb load'.   

[Sos24]

Energy gels have seen a rise in popularity in the "endurance athlete" crowd, particularly cyclists (and maybe the military if they're under the illusion that they are athletes)

but Sea Monster's pro tip for energy goop (works for high speed low drag U-Boat extractions too) is Saunders Malt Extract. http://saundersmalt.com.au/history/
it stills comes in a tin, because quaint, and it separates the old school athletes from the new on the block wastrels with their individually packed one-shot hits that they then toss their sticky litter all over the trail.

Very interesting.  When I did long distance cycling, I did use some gels. 

[McStitchy]

Might be packing some of these... 

[Nix]

They seem fairly shelf stable.....but has anybody had them sit around long enough to really test that theory out?   

[Nix]

I got out to both the local market and the gas station ('petrol station' for youz who don't speak 'murican.) this morning.

Getting organized.....