Multitool.org Forum
+-

Hello Lurker! Remove this ad and much more by logging in.


Matches in damp conditions - my experience

de Offline Shuya

  • Hero Member
  • *****
    • Posts: 582
Matches in damp conditions - my experience
on: July 14, 2021, 11:03:10 AM
Hi folks,

back from a loooong holiday (4 Weeks camping with the family, one week at home followed by a 10day  high-altitute mountain tour (to almost 4000m).

What I have in mind is the experience with matches while on my 4 week camping trip.

We camped in a woodlike campside with a lot of rain in the first 1... 1 1/2 weeks. Everything was wet, dripping wet, condensation in the tent, moiture everywhere. :rant: :ahhh

For lighting fires and the stoves I brought matches (regular and stormproof) sealed in ziplockbacks, BIC-Lighers and ferro rods.
After a few days the matches stopped working, they were simply moist, the striking surface damp. Would not light.
Lighters and of course ferro rods kept working.


This opened my eyes towards the useablilty of matches in damp condidions.
They suck. No matter how hard you try to keep them dry, after some time they will be as moist as everything else.
Ive seen people in the rainforrest rely on BIC Lighters, and now I know why.

At this point, I will never ever trust matches for survival anymore. If conditions are bad (survival rarely occuses in sunny holiday weather), you need bulletproof, waterproof fire sources.
Glad I learned it when I did not rely on them.

Anyone has similar experiences?

Michael


us Offline Aloha

  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Absolute Zombie Club
  • *
    • Posts: 28,247
Re: Matches in damp conditions - my experience
Reply #1 on: July 14, 2021, 04:02:44 PM
Even the storm matches were unusable?  Lighters, quality ones, and ferro rods, to my are a good combination.  I also like tinder thats impregnated with an accelerant.  I'll have to test and see if wet they could light  :think:.  I also like fat wood quite a lot. 

Thank you for your post.     
Esse Quam Videri


wales Offline GearedForwards

  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 2,428
Re: Matches in damp conditions - my experience
Reply #2 on: July 14, 2021, 05:29:38 PM
It's very surprising that the stormproof matches wouldn't light, I've seen demonstrations when some storm matches would light when soaking wet and reignite after a dunk in water  :think:

I would be interested in how well some water proofed strike anywhere matches would do. Just a normal strike anywhere dunked in some candle wax and left to set, at that point the striking surface shouldn't really matter and the heads (and some degree of wood) should be protected by the wax. On a similar note I've found the hook file on the Compact is a fantastic striking surface, it feels like using an over build match box  :tu:

I wonder if a mix of cottom and silica gel packets could keep matches alive in the conditions you went through  :think:
Check out my Youtube channel  for gear reviews, comparisons, and carry philosophy.

Love belt carry? Consider doing the Batman Challenge!


il Offline pomsbz

  • *
  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 2,590
Re: Matches in damp conditions - my experience
Reply #3 on: July 14, 2021, 05:47:53 PM
It's very surprising that the stormproof matches wouldn't light, I've seen demonstrations when some storm matches would light when soaking wet and reignite after a dunk in water  :think:

I would be interested in how well some water proofed strike anywhere matches would do. Just a normal strike anywhere dunked in some candle wax and left to set, at that point the striking surface shouldn't really matter and the heads (and some degree of wood) should be protected by the wax. On a similar note I've found the hook file on the Compact is a fantastic striking surface, it feels like using an over build match box  :tu:

I wonder if a mix of cottom and silica gel packets could keep matches alive in the conditions you went through  :think:

I'm also interested in this. Might do an experiment with my UCO Stormproof matches. Leave them in water for a few days or in the bathroom for a few days with lots of hot showers, etc.
"It is better to lose health like a spendthrift than to waste it like a miser." - Robert Louis Stevenson


us Offline Sos24

  • *
  • Absolutely No Life Club
  • *******
    • Posts: 8,020
Matches in damp conditions - my experience
Reply #4 on: July 15, 2021, 05:14:53 AM
If you like matches, then possibly try a tinder wick along with lighter and ferro rod carry matches.

If you haven’t seen them before, they are a length of some type of easy lighting rope like jute or help infused with wax and 2-4 inch metal tube.  I’ve gotten mine to light, even when damp, by fraying the one end and holding behind the striker of a ferro rod.
« Last Edit: July 15, 2021, 05:34:50 AM by Sos24 »


wales Offline GearedForwards

  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 2,428
Re: Matches in damp conditions - my experience
Reply #5 on: July 15, 2021, 05:26:19 AM
If you like matches, then possibly try a tinder or fire wick along with lighter and/ferro rod.

If you haven’t seen them before, they are a length of some type of easy lighting rope like jute or hemp infused with wax and a 2-4 inch metal tube.  I’ve gotten mine to light, even when damp, by fraying the one end and holding behind the striker of a ferro rod.
(Image removed from quote.)

I wonder if you could insert one of those into a sailor's rope lighter  :think:
Check out my Youtube channel  for gear reviews, comparisons, and carry philosophy.

Love belt carry? Consider doing the Batman Challenge!


us Offline Sos24

  • *
  • Absolutely No Life Club
  • *******
    • Posts: 8,020
Re: Matches in damp conditions - my experience
Reply #6 on: July 15, 2021, 05:41:09 AM
I wonder if you could insert one of those into a sailor's rope lighter  :think:

I’ve tried combo the two but ran into two problems.  The first issue was the hemp rope I have is not as fat as the cotton rope in the sailor’s rope lighter so it wouldn’t stay.  The other issue was the spark did not want to light the jute.  I’m not sure if it was direction of spark or what but I did not have success.  I have wondered about if a wick was ran through the cotton rope and the rope was coated in wax, but haven’t tried yet.  Now you have renewed my interest in experimenting.
« Last Edit: July 15, 2021, 05:48:48 AM by Sos24 »


wales Offline GearedForwards

  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 2,428
Re: Matches in damp conditions - my experience
Reply #7 on: July 15, 2021, 05:49:14 AM
I’ve tried combo the two but ran into two problems.  The first issue was the hemp rope I have is not as fat as the cotton rope in the sailor’s rope lighter so it wouldn’t stay.  The other issue was the spark did not want to light the jute.  I’m not sure if it was direction of spark or what but I did not have success.  I have wondered about if a wick was ran through the cotton rope and the rope was coated in wax, but haven’t tried yet.

Hmm an O-ring or some kind of space could provide the needed retention, maybe even a retaining pin at the bottom of the lighter body (could literally be a safety pin pressed into service).

I like that idea of yours! I love preppery stuff and those rope lights have always intrugued me
Check out my Youtube channel  for gear reviews, comparisons, and carry philosophy.

Love belt carry? Consider doing the Batman Challenge!


us Offline Sos24

  • *
  • Absolutely No Life Club
  • *******
    • Posts: 8,020
Re: Matches in damp conditions - my experience
Reply #8 on: July 15, 2021, 06:41:17 AM
Hmm an O-ring or some kind of space could provide the needed retention, maybe even a retaining pin at the bottom of the lighter body (could literally be a safety pin pressed into service).

I like that idea of yours! I love preppery stuff and those rope lights have always intrugued me
I think I may do some experimenting tomorrow if the weather will cooperate.  [

My wife doesn’t like me doing my experimenting (especially if involving lighters, flame, stoves, etc inside]


us Offline Aloha

  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Absolute Zombie Club
  • *
    • Posts: 28,247
Re: Matches in damp conditions - my experience
Reply #9 on: July 15, 2021, 07:06:03 AM
 :D
 :popcorn:
Esse Quam Videri


us Offline nate j

  • *
  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 2,484
Re: Matches in damp conditions - my experience
Reply #10 on: July 15, 2021, 08:24:40 AM
As GF notes, strike anywhere matches dipped in wax paired with a metal striking surface should be good.

The problem I’ve had with matches (even stormproof) that are not strike anywhere is that once the striking surface becomes wet, they generally don’t light.

I have some matches in my fire kit for completeness I suppose, but Bic lighters are my first option (I usually have 2-3 in my pockets and another two in my fire kit), ferro rod second, and matches third.


de Offline Shuya

  • Hero Member
  • *****
    • Posts: 582
Re: Matches in damp conditions - my experience
Reply #11 on: July 15, 2021, 09:11:42 AM
So, there are some unclear things I need to point out on this:

- the matches were not wet, they were damp including the strinking surface. submerging them in water for a few seconds and then striking them on a dry surface will not reproduce my problem.

- the process of failure with the regular matches was as following: when striking the match I either ripped the striking surface or "scratched" it, with the head of the match flying away without igniting, or the head would partially ignite and burn without setting the wooden match ablaze.

- with the stormproof matches it was similar, besides the larger head would not seperate from the match itself. I either damage the striking surface from several attempts to finally render it useless, or with luck, time and lots of attempts the head would finally ignite. The following combustion was far from the usual one, no flame, very slow combustion process that remindet me of a burning fuse. little sparks, small burning area and no flame at all. Nearly unalbe to ignite something with that except gas.

With the waterproofing process of matches you forget about the striking surface, that is critical except for strike anywhere matches. if the surface is damp, you will damage it without igniting your match.

Hope my problem is clear now.


us Offline Aloha

  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Absolute Zombie Club
  • *
    • Posts: 28,247
Re: Matches in damp conditions - my experience
Reply #12 on: July 15, 2021, 04:21:17 PM
 :salute:

Ah yes the striking surface. 

I am a massive fan of bringing my own combustibles.  Fatwood is a primary in any fire kit.  Jute is also carried and can double as light cordage.   

Esse Quam Videri


wales Offline GearedForwards

  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 2,428
Re: Matches in damp conditions - my experience
Reply #13 on: July 15, 2021, 05:42:15 PM
Yeah the striking surface is why I strongly dislike the practicality of safety matches. I found a large box of strike anywhere ones in my parents house over a year ago and... relieved them of a significant portion of them. Now I have a mixture of wax coated ones and about ten cut down matches in a waterproof capsule.

Tangent: I liked the idea of RR's 'match strike' nail knicks, but they.... are not suitable for actually striking matches  :facepalm:
Check out my Youtube channel  for gear reviews, comparisons, and carry philosophy.

Love belt carry? Consider doing the Batman Challenge!


ua Offline alexanderre

  • *
  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 1,360
Re: Matches in damp conditions - my experience
Reply #14 on: July 15, 2021, 10:18:07 PM
For the hiking trips or any activity in the woods I only always bring a ferro rod (a couple actually) and some fatwood - works 10/10 times even if soaking wet
Dream. Wish. Leave nothing undone. Repeat.


us Offline Sos24

  • *
  • Absolutely No Life Club
  • *******
    • Posts: 8,020
Re: Matches in damp conditions - my experience
Reply #15 on: July 16, 2021, 12:50:24 AM
I think I may do some experimenting tomorrow if the weather will cooperate.  [

My wife doesn’t like me doing my experimenting (especially if involving lighters, flame, stoves, etc inside]
After doing some failed experimenting, I’ll have to do some more thinking.

After trying it, I’m wondering if the really problem is just that the Sailor’s Rope lighter just doesn’t produce hot or sufficient enough  spark to light the jute wax rope?:dunno:  I wonder this because even the cotton rope infused with wax wasn’t lighting.  I also realized that putting the jute into the cotton rope, doesn’t really work because the jute doesn’t burn at the same rate so they don’t stay at the same level.

I could just be way off and it be operator error.  Maybe someone with better pyro skills can figure something out.


il Offline pomsbz

  • *
  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 2,590
Re: Matches in damp conditions - my experience
Reply #16 on: July 16, 2021, 08:43:24 AM
After doing some failed experimenting, I’ll have to do some more thinking.

After trying it, I’m wondering if the really problem is just that the Sailor’s Rope lighter just doesn’t produce hot or sufficient enough  spark to light the jute wax rope?:dunno:  I wonder this because even the cotton rope infused with wax wasn’t lighting.  I also realized that putting the jute into the cotton rope, doesn’t really work because the jute doesn’t burn at the same rate so they don’t stay at the same level.

I could just be way off and it be operator error.  Maybe someone with better pyro skills can figure something out.

I would imagine it is the wax which is the problem. A ferro rod will throw sparks hot enough to burn through the wax to the material underneath but the little spark wheel is probably not enough.
"It is better to lose health like a spendthrift than to waste it like a miser." - Robert Louis Stevenson


us Offline nate j

  • *
  • No Life Club
  • ******
    • Posts: 2,484
Re: Matches in damp conditions - my experience
Reply #17 on: July 16, 2021, 06:50:29 PM
After doing some failed experimenting, I’ll have to do some more thinking.

After trying it, I’m wondering if the really problem is just that the Sailor’s Rope lighter just doesn’t produce hot or sufficient enough  spark to light the jute wax rope?:dunno:  I wonder this because even the cotton rope infused with wax wasn’t lighting.  I also realized that putting the jute into the cotton rope, doesn’t really work because the jute doesn’t burn at the same rate so they don’t stay at the same level.

I could just be way off and it be operator error.  Maybe someone with better pyro skills can figure something out.
Just to verify, I assume you did pre-burn the ends of the rope before trying to light with the Sailors’ Lighter?


us Offline Sos24

  • *
  • Absolutely No Life Club
  • *******
    • Posts: 8,020
Re: Matches in damp conditions - my experience
Reply #18 on: July 16, 2021, 08:56:29 PM
Just to verify, I assume you did pre-burn the ends of the rope before trying to light with the Sailors’ Lighter?
Yes, I pre-burned to ensure a nice charred end, but it still would not catch a spark. 

I would imagine it is the wax which is the problem. A ferro rod will throw sparks hot enough to burn through the wax to the material underneath but the little spark wheel is probably not enough.
Agree.

The wax soaking into the rope provides too much resistance.  I should have known, because rope alone takes effort to really get a good glowing so of course the wax would make it too difficult.

I did have another idea of using liquid petroleum jelly to infuse before the wax.  I’m going to try this using some plain cotton before trying on the rope.


 

Donations

Operational Funds

Help us keep the Unworkable working!
Donate with PayPal!
August Goal: $300.00
Due Date: Aug 31
Total Receipts: $25.00
PayPal Fees: $1.53
Net Balance: $23.47
Below Goal: $276.53
Site Currency: USD
 8%
August Donations

Community Links


Powered by EzPortal