Victorinox discontinuing 84mm knives - hoax?

[Aloxfan]

I’ve seen some SAK focused YouTubers suggest Victorinox is going to discontinue the 84mm line of knives. It seems related to the discontinuation of the 74mm knives recently, as well as the discontinuation of all 84mm knives which included scissors many years back.

Is this just speculation? I see Victorinox still offers the following 84mm cellidor knives on their site:
- Bantam
- Recruit
- Tinker Small
- Tourist
- Waiter
- Walker

Not to mention the “my first Victorinox” and Alox Bantam.

Please help me believe they won’t kill the amazing 84mm knives. If they are, my collector senses will cause me to buy the whole line before it’s gone.
 

[hsherzfeld]

Where are these YouTubers getting their information? Is it just pure speculation based on the 74mm line being discontinued?

[Aloxfan]

Where are these YouTubers getting their information? Is it just pure speculation based on the 74mm line being discontinued?

That’s what I’m trying to figure out. It concerns me as I don’t want to miss my chance to pick them up if they are going to disappear. On the more logical standpoint, if they will be ongoing staple of product line, then I’m not too concerned with buying now as their may be special version or colored scale one I would prefer in future.

Speaking of 84mm, I’m noticing when I push the toothpick into my Walker, it really pops the scale up as it goes past the hump. It seems without the center rivet, the scales aren’t held on as tight as the 3 rivet scales of my 84mm Tinker small.

Interestingly, my ancient 84mm Golfer and Elinox Lumberjack have very tight scales. Could be the lack of scale tools…

[Simon_Templar]

As much as I hate to see SAKs being discontinued, the current 84 mm line - in particular the Celidor models - is irrelevant. The 84s are too close to the the Delemonts and, crucially, lack scissors, which imho is inexcusable in a small SAK. Buyers of small frame pocket knives are likely to prioritize overall practicality over sheer cutting capability. In this context, scissors are simply a must, which is why the only 84 mm knives everyone seems to rave about these days are the vintage Golfer and Voyageur.

Victorinox seems to know all this very well, why else would they have such a diverse range of tools in the 58 mm line and even offer a model without blades (the Jetsetter)? By withdrawing 84 mm scissors, Victorinox decided to send the 84 mm line the way of the Dodo a long time ago. So I for one am only surprised they haven't pulled the plug yet.

[kamakiri]

By withdrawing 84 mm scissors, Victorinox decided to send the 84 mm line the way of the Dodo a long time ago. So I for one am only surprised they haven't pulled the plug yet.

Yeah, seems like the decision was pretty clearly made in the ‘70s when it was the only frame size that didn’t get it’s scissors updated/retooled. The truth might be that it took them over a decade to go through old stock between the ‘70s and ‘80s

[Aloxfan]

So you both feel this rumor/theory is correct? 84mm series will fade away?

I thought about the Delemont series too. With all those 85mm knives now with Vic name on them, it may be hard business decision to keep them both alive.

[BPRoberts]

I could maybe see the cellidors going, but the Cadet alone seems like it sells enough units to justify keeping the 84mm line in some form.

[Aloxfan]

I could maybe see the cellidors going, but the Cadet alone seems like it sells enough units to justify keeping the 84mm line in some form.

Interesting comment. While I’m currently focused on cellidor/nylon 84mm knives, I do enjoy my Alox Cadet. If Vic instead wants to build out an 84mm Alox line, I’m on board. I personally think it needs more models than just the Cadet and Bantam however. Bring back the Alox Lumberjack and other variations.

[Myron]

Rumor and speculation, surely.  I personally love the Sportsman and own several.  And of course the Voyageur and Golfer live in legend.  My Mon-Fri daily carry SAK is a modified Cadet and I also enjoy collecting them.  I have to think there are a lot of other people in this camp as well.

What would Victorinox do, discontinue a huge part of their model lineup (thereby disenfranchising a huge part of their customer base) to expand their perfume market?  Sell more crappy Chinese-made luggage?  Their watches are ok, but that's such a crowded field that I can't imagine they'd make much headway there. 

[hsherzfeld]

As much as I hate to see SAKs being discontinued, the current 84 mm line - in particular the Celidor models - is irrelevant. The 84s are too close to the the Delemonts and, crucially, lack scissors, which imho is inexcusable in a small SAK. Buyers of small frame pocket knives are likely to prioritize overall practicality over sheer cutting capability. In this context, scissors are simply a must, which is why the only 84 mm knives everyone seems to rave about these days are the vintage Golfer and Voyageur.

Victorinox seems to know all this very well, why else would they have such a diverse range of tools in the 58 mm line and even offer a model without blades (the Jetsetter)? By withdrawing 84 mm scissors, Victorinox decided to send the 84 mm line the way of the Dodo a long time ago. So I for one am only surprised they haven't pulled the plug yet.

I also dislike seeing SAKs discontinued, but the 84mm line is already so limited by the lack of 84mm tools (scissors, file, pliers, magnifying glass, fish scaler, etc). that there's not much Victorinox can do to keep the 84mm line fresh and exciting. They can't add tool layers to create new models without first designing and producing new parts.

 With the 91mm line, they have plenty of tool combinations to play around with to create a "new" model without having to produce new parts other than different length pins.

I certainly wouldn't be surprised if they were to discontinue the 84mm knives that are duplicates of 91mm toolsets: the Tinker Small and the Tourist. I think the alox Cadet will probably stick around longer than the cellidor 84mm models.

[hsherzfeld]

Rumor and speculation, surely.  I personally love the Sportsman and own several.  And of course the Voyageur and Golfer live in legend.  My Mon-Fri daily carry SAK is a modified Cadet and I also enjoy collecting them.  I have to think there are a lot of other people in this camp as well.

What would Victorinox do, discontinue a huge part of their model lineup (thereby disenfranchising a huge part of their customer base) to expand their perfume market?  Sell more crappy Chinese-made luggage?  Their watches are ok, but that's such a crowded field that I can't imagine they'd make much headway there.

Maybe they could expand their 91mm line? I know it's not likely, but I can dream/ 

[cody6268]

I wish Victorinox would bring back the lanyard-ring free Tourist. It is, quite honestly, my favorite SAK when fitted with nylon handles.

[Aloxfan]

I wish Victorinox would bring back the lanyard-ring free Tourist. It is, quite honestly, my favorite SAK when fitted with nylon handles.

I love SAK’s without key rings too. It’s especially relevant on the 84mm and 85mm lines. I have an old Tinker small without key ring as well as a Wenger EVO 63. Both feel great in pocket and hand without key ring.

[kamakiri]

I love SAK’s without key rings too. It’s especially relevant on the 84mm and 85mm lines. I have an old Tinker small without key ring as well as a Wenger EVO 63. Both feel great in pocket and hand without key ring.

This is a good point. Frame size does make a difference in my general dislike of key rings and the lug. Never liked them on 91mm. Disliked them more as they protruded more. Really hate them on 84mm and smaller knives. With the exception of the one 58mm I use on my actual keying.

But your comment really highlighted the fact that I don’t really notice or mind them on 111mm frames and didn’t even remove it from my last 111mm mod.

[kamakiri]

So you both feel this rumor/theory is correct? 84mm series will fade away?

I thought about the Delemont series too. With all those 85mm knives now with Vic name on them, it may be hard business decision to keep them both alive.

Not saying I believe the rumor. Just not gonna be surprised if or when it ever becomes true.

[Aloxfan]

This is a good point. Frame size does make a difference in my general dislike of key rings and the lug. Never liked them on 91mm. Disliked them more as they protruded more. Really hate them on 84mm and smaller knives. With the exception of the one 58mm I use on my actual keying.

But your comment really highlighted the fact that I don’t really notice or mind them on 111mm frames and didn’t even remove it from my last 111mm mod.

You make a great counterpoint. I love the key ring on my 111mm and larger SAK’s as to me a lanyard is a must on the bigger ones. How else you gonna pull them quickly from pocket?

[kamakiri]

You make a great counterpoint. I love the key ring on my 111mm and larger SAK’s as to me a lanyard is a must on the bigger ones. How else you gonna pull them quickly from pocket?

(Image removed from quote.)

Man…I’m coming around to that thinking. I made and OHO slide lock mod and was going to put a lanyard on it (which I never do)…until I realized I removed the lug as usual. 

[cbl51]

I can't believe they would drop the whole 84mm line. Maybe trim it down some where theres some overlap like having two tinkers or spartan types. But the cadet and bantam certainly would stay I would think. But it a brutal and cutthroat business, and with completion some sacrifices may have to be made.

I would grieve for the bantam and waiter models, and probably go into depression over the loss of the cadet.

[hsherzfeld]

I guess I don't have very strong feelings either way about the 84mm line. There simply aren't enough options in it for me without scissors. Now, if Victorinox were to expand the range and create, say, an 84mm counterpart for every 91mm model...

...I'd be first in line to buy an 84mm Explorer.

[Aloxfan]

...I'd be first in line to buy an 84mm Explorer.

Dump the “opener layer” and swap the pen blade for a combo tool and I’m in. That said, has there ever been an 84mm with the inline Phillips or magnifier? I don’t think those tools would even fit. No way Vic would retool for 3 new 84mm tools.

[kamakiri]

Dump the “opener layer” and swap the pen blade for a combo tool and I’m in. That said, has there ever been an 84mm with the inline Phillips or magnifier? I don’t think those tools would even fit. No way Vic would retool for 3 new 84mm tools.

Easy peasy. I think the written mod guide for the magnifier mod is from ‘11 or so.

But Victorinox won’t ever do it, I think.

[z1913]

Please help me believe they won’t kill the amazing 84mm knives.

Yes, it would be very unfortunate... The 84mm has the everyday usability of regular knife and when I see the 91mm in the shops they are just...massive! Always surprised how much difference the 7mm make.

[cody6268]

Yes, it would be very unfortunate... The 84mm has the everyday usability of regular knife and when I see the 91mm in the shops they are just...massive! Always surprised how much difference the 7mm make.

And also, I've noticed that since there's less length, there's less metal, so it weighs less. I find my 84mm Craftsman MUCH easier to carry than a Fieldmaster; despite both technically having the same toolset, and the only real difference being tool-wise, it doesn't have a hook.

Problem is that I'm not going to find another Craftsman that easily (even one in rough condition that would be restored by warranty, as mine was); but Fieldmasters and Huntsmen are very common; and inexpensive.

[z1913]

Good point about the weight. I think the most important factor is the relative change in weight rather than absolute grams. My Rambler is 25g, alox minichamp 40g and normally you could not recognise 15g difference but as the 15g is 2/3 of the Rambler, the minichamp feels like brick.
And as the 84 are as well smaller knives, the relative increase in weight compared to their 91 relatives can be very tangible.

[Simon_Templar]

Good point about the weight. I think the most important factor is the relative change in weight rather than absolute grams. My Rambler is 25g, alox minichamp 40g and normally you could not recognise 15g difference but as the 15g is 2/3 of the Rambler, the minichamp feels like brick.
And as the 84 are as well smaller knives, the relative increase in weight compared to their 91 relatives can be very tangible.

But the question remains: who really gives a damn if the SAK does not feature scissors? 

[Fireman]

Always surprised how much difference the 7mm make.

Waiting...waiting...

[SurgeUk]

Waiting...waiting...

 

[z1913]

But the question remains: who really gives a damn if the SAK does not feature scissors? 

We don't need no stinkin scissors! 

[hsherzfeld]

But the question remains: who really gives a damn if the SAK does not feature scissors? 

[Farmer X]

I like Victorinox scissors just as much as (almost) everyone else. However, lack of them is not a deal-breaker. When carrying a larger SAK with no scissors, I usually carry a Classic SD on a neck lanyard. That gives me the scissors without much redundancy or extra bulk.