Demko Knife Triad Lock

[Old Boy]

So when Andrew Demko came out with the custom AD-10 that really kicked my knife hobby in high gear. Though at the time I could not afford his custom. Ironically they now cost 10x more so I am kicking myself a bit. So I was extremely happy when they came out with the American Lawman and AD-10 production version.

I just recently was watching Bladeshow 22 and learned he is coming out with a improvement on the Triad lock in a AD-10M model.



That restarted a question I always had when Cold Steel first started those lock testing videos with their competitors vs. Triad lock. I’ve been avoiding asking this question as in those times the lock debate was in high swing and people were a bit rude in their replies at one point or another. But I figured maybe now it’s time, plus folks here are much nicer.

My question is, are Triad locks really better than a lockback? I only ask this as I never encountered Cold Steel testing the Triad against the lock back. I figured either I missed a video, or they are comparable, or most likely they just didn’t have the equipment to safety test to failure.

My second question after watching the AD-10M video is that will the improvements really make the original Triad stronger? Again in my mind I feel like there is no difference, both versions the lock won’t budge. In fact most likely you are just introducing more risk of wear in the improvement? The video seemed to also imply a stronger lock as well as wear resistance.

Caveat: yes I am aware that you don’t need a folding knife to withstand 10 tons of weight, a fixed knife is better, etc. 😀

I am hoping this thread won’t get too derailed. Just curious as I am not an engineer and would love some qualified insights from our MT community. 👍

[aicolainen]

My question is, are Triad locks really better than a lockback?

Better is subjective and stronger doesn't always equal better..

My only real experience with the Triad lock is from my use of the American Lawman, I have some of the smaller ones with Triad lock as well, but they're so small lock type doesn't matter.
In use, the Triad lock is pretty much indistinguishable from most mid-backlocks.
The strength you gain is predominantly in the vertical axis, so it's not like it's fool proof.
It's a solid lock that's well executed by Cold Steel and their OEM, it has a stop pin, which is confidence inspiring and basically eliminates lock rock.
It's probably one of the strongest locks in any of my folders, and definitively the strongest "backlock", but I don't rate it as the best.
Lock strength only matters to a point. At the point blades snaps and the frames de-form, additional lock strength doesn't gain you an advantage.
My own requirements for a lock is way below even that point. So other, more tactile, attributes also plays in when determining what's best (subjectively).
My favorite lock, that I've discovered to date, is the one on Spyderco's Native line. I have the Native 5 CF and LW Salt, as well as the Chief in G10. All of them are perfectly executed, with even tighter lockup than my Lawman.

My philosophy around this is to be lock agnostic up to the point where it really counts. Too much emphasis on the lock will severely limit your available options to no real benefit. So let your application determine how much emphasis to put on lock type.
There is a place for folders with strong locks, but for most people, most of the time, it's not the most important criteria for a successful cut.

[Old Boy]

Agree.  Thanks for the reply. I just found it strange I never found a CS video testing lockbacks vs Triad.

[Etherealicer]

First off... Triad lock is only 2nd strongest... behind Fox/LionSteels Sliding-Bar-Backlock 
IIRC then BladeHQ tested locks as well including a backlock

The strength of a folder is depending on a lot of factors, not just the lock. In fact, most lock types are more than strong enough.
Frame: Obviously in a Spyderco lightweight, the handle will fail long before the lock.
Lock engagement: Probably the most common reason for failure is poor lock engagement. This is most common with frame-/liner- locks.
          Poor QC: For a while the LM Surge had a problem with that. Fairly common in cheap gas-station knives.
          Dirt: Dirt can keep a lock from engaging properly. Tight locks (including the triad lock) are more susceptible to this, open locks like a frame lock won't have that problem.
          Impact: Impact (e.g. Batoning) can dis-engage a lock. Frame-locks are known to have this problem.
User error: Especially a button lock, you can disengage a lock when gripping your knife wrong. And while it is in theory possible to do that with a backlock (and triad lock) it is extremely unlikely.

Looking at all this above, I would choose the Scorpion Lock over the Triad. Even though I have no idea how well the Scorpion Lock handles impact.
- Less problematic with dirt
- Gripping hard strengthens the lock

In the end it is probably more important, that a knife sits well in your hand, as your hand slipping off is the greater danger, than the lock failing.

[Etherealicer]

Found it, it's only 8 years old

Chapter is called Lock-Bags

Summary:
Buck 110 performs as well as the CS Voyager, both max out at 375 pounds (they didn't have more weights). Gerber Voyager the handle gives at 350 pounds.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4KmHfbG7z7g&ab_channel=BladeHQ

[Old Boy]

You the man! Ok so I kinda feel after watching the video that the back lock and Triad are probably the same in weight hang strength as could be safely tested. I guess we will never know the actual limits until someone is able to design a proper safe test.

I’ve been thinking about the improvements made on the Triad lock and I kinda feel it’s more designed to reduce wear then to increase strength.

By the way agree with all points stated above on frame locks, etc. I was just curious about the Triad lock. Good lock regardless.

[Etherealicer]

 

Part II (Spydercos)

Remember these are 8 year old videos, knives have gotten better. Also, they test force applied to the spine. How on earth would you ever load up a knife with that much force to the spine

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERxHUXAFVs4&ab_channel=BladeHQ

[Old Boy]

Part II (Spydercos)

Remember these are 8 year old videos, knives have gotten better. Also, they test force applied to the spine. How on earth would you ever load up a knife with that much force to the spine

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERxHUXAFVs4&ab_channel=BladeHQ

Nice