Sak warranty question

[cnlson]

Leatherman user here. Have a ton of Leatherman, I use them enough to wear or break things often enough, send them in and worn or broken they get fixed and returned.

I was on YouTube on a swisstool v Leatherman comparison video. And got to 'discussing' ruggedness of the tools and we both agreed it would be interesting to see what holds up better. So I ordered a Swisstool of some sort. I figure it should be easy to see how quickly a knife wears down cutting cardboard and such. and I've got some ideas on wearing files, scissors, and saws but, I don't want to just throw away the Swisstool when done and while what I'm talking about is "use" to me I'm not sure if it's abuse to someone else and based on the warranty I see on there Vic website it might not even matter:

Victorinox AG guarantees all knives and tools to be of first class stainless steel and also guarantees a life time against any defects in material and workmanship (save for electronic components 2 years). Damage caused by normal wear and tear, misuse or abuse are not covered by this guarantee.

I can resharpen a knife blade, and a scissors in theory at least. But if I wear a file or a saw, according to what they say I'm out of luck. Or if I bend a screwdriver or pliers testing grip.

Can anyone confirm how strict they are on this?

Much as I would like to entertain more questions of toughness I've pretty much already discussed that enough already and would rather  shut up until I can put up. So for now let's save the hurt feelings about what I might think of the ultimate robustness of victorinox. I'm not looking for that hornets nest, I'm asking about how victorinox will react to a worn or damaged tool service request.

To give you a Leatherman example. I sent in a charge with the tip of one of the pliers broken off, a chunk of the can opener ground off, the knife blades worn round, the gut hook on top of the serrated blade bent enough the knife would not fully fold up, the diamond side of the file worn to steel, the flat blade screwdriver used as a prybar and snapped off, eye glass screw driver just gone, bit exchanger bit gone, scissors no longer had the blades parallel and plenty of rust. Sent it in, a day after they had it I had a tracking number and 4 days later a new to me tool. I'm sure they just gave mine a viking funeral as soon as they opened the box and saw what I sent in.

[cnlson]

52 views and no replies? Has no one ever sent a sak in for warranty?

[nate j]

I haven’t personally ever sent a Vic in for warranty work.  However, I’ve heard from a number of folks that they got tools repaired or replaced with no questions asked, and can’t recall ever hearing anyone say their warranty claim got denied by Vic, so I would say your odds are good.

[SurgeUk]

52 views and no replies? Has no one ever sent a sak in for warranty?

Sorry. I haven't sent one; ever  (or a LM either)

To be fair, living in the UK, things are a bit different for LM 

I've never broken a SAK (knife) and I hope I won't break my SwissTools 

[Farmer X]

I sent a couple of SAKs in for repair last year. One had clearly been abused (broken blade tip). I paid only for shipping both ways.

That said...one did not get its bent corkscrew replaced. I believe that the repair people were reluctant to remove the scales, which have a logo. (The bend wasn't terrible, and I'd have been PO'd if it came back with new scales.) The second one got a new blade and scales...as well as new scissors and a key ring. I didn't think to specify "do not add a key ring."

My best advice is: be as specific as possible with your request. You may awlso wish to mark everything you send in for repair as sentimental (thanks to Cody6268 for that tip).

[ROKMC MSgt John]

I sent a couple of SAKs in for repair last year. One had clearly been abused (broken blade tip). I paid only for shipping both ways.

That said...one did not get its bent corkscrew replaced. I believe that the repair people were reluctant to remove the scales, which have a logo. (The bend wasn't terrible, and I'd have been PO'd if it came back with new scales.) The second one got a new blade and scales...as well as new scissors and a key ring. I didn't think to specify "do not add a key ring."

My best advice is: be as specific as possible with your request. You may awlso wish to mark everything you send in for repair as sentimental (thanks to Cody6268 for that tip).

I think like a farmer
I got my SAK repaired in Korea.
Maybe my photos will help, I don't know. 
One thing is clear, the repair method is different. Leatherman exchanges the repaired tool, but Victorinox repairs the broken tool and returns it to the user.

This picture has obviously been repaired (all functions have been replaced with new ones) but the scale is still as it was.

[cnlson]

ROK Marine? As in the dragons that made the Vietcong fear the jungle? If so much respect 

Leatherman seems to take the path of least work, it the tool can be quickly repaired it will be. I had a surge I sent to them because the rool lock on one handle was broken and they fixed it, sharpened the blade and replaced the bit driver bit. They will replace it if they would have to spend a lot of time and it would be easier to replace than repair.

One thing is clear, the repair method is different. Leatherman exchanges the repaired tool, but Victorinox repairs the broken tool and returns it to the user.

[cnlson]

I think I didn't explain very well. The warranty says defects not wear or abuse, I'm thinking of, for instance, sawing on ironwood until the saw points are round. That kind of wear.

Same with the file, wearing it on some steel until it's, not quite smooth.

I'm pretty confident, given my warranty experience in the past, Leatherman would repair or replace, I'm concerned , based on the language of the victorinox, they'll look at the wear and say 'no' and I wouldn't care if they replaced or repaired.

Once I put the tools head to head and determine what holds up better I'll send it for repairs the I'm likely to put the Swisstool on eBay and get my money back

I sent a couple of SAKs in for repair last year. One had clearly been abused (broken blade tip). I paid only for shipping both ways.

That said...one did not get its bent corkscrew replaced. I believe that the repair people were reluctant to remove the scales, which have a logo. (The bend wasn't terrible, and I'd have been PO'd if it came back with new scales.) The second one got a new blade and scales...as well as new scissors and a key ring. I didn't think to specify "do not add a key ring."

My best advice is: be as specific as possible with your request. You may awlso wish to mark everything you send in for repair as sentimental (thanks to Cody6268 for that tip).

[ROKMC MSgt John]

ROK Marine? As in the dragons that made the Vietcong fear the jungle? If so much respect 

Leatherman seems to take the path of least work, it the tool can be quickly repaired it will be. I had a surge I sent to them because the rool lock on one handle was broken and they fixed it, sharpened the blade and replaced the bit driver bit. They will replace it if they would have to spend a lot of time and it would be easier to replace than repair.

That's right. I'm serving in the Republic of Korea Marine Corps.  The advantages of the warranty method to Leatherman are clear.  However, Victorinox is suitable for user sensibility.  For example, if I can repair the tools my father gave me instead of using other products, those memories will not disappear.

[Fireman]

I can save you the expense and trouble: in normal use I've never worn out a LM or SAK.   

[nate j]

I'm concerned , based on the language of the victorinox, they'll look at the wear and say 'no' and I wouldn't care if they replaced or repaired.

I suppose there is a first time for everything, but I’ve been hanging around SAK forums for probably the better part of two decades, and I can’t recall ever hearing of Victorinox rejecting a warranty claim.

[dimledger]

I think your best bet is to send your questions directly to Victorinox or one of their distributors.

My guess is that Victorinox would accept most warranty claims for damage incurred during good faith usage.

[cnlson]

Well, a good natured YouTube video prompted me to spend 80 something on eBay for a Swisstool so until I put it back on eBay to sell I do have the expense. Plus I'm interested to know. My perception of victorinox comes from my tinker that I got 40 odd years ago. That non locking blade bit me more than once and nearly amputated a former gf's finger (she deserved it)

That blade, compared to a blade on my Leatherman, seems too thin and too quick to dull. Easy to sharpen no doubt, but if I've got a job that needs to be done I'm not wanting to stop in the middle to sharpen. The plier head seems small which makes me think it wouldn't be able to grab a9/16 or 5/8 bolt head with any force (14 -16 mm) plus I'm interested in who's saw holds up cutting hard wood, who's file can groove harder steel. Who's screwdriver bends or breaks first. ECT. Who is the champion? my friend.

I can save you the expense and trouble: in normal use I've never worn out a LM or SAK.

[cnlson]

Much as I'd like to, I doubt their answer is going to be "heck ya, go for it, we got you!" So I'm hoping someone here has done some damage to their tool and had some advice on getting it fixed under warranty

I think your best bet is to send your questions directly to Victorinox or one of their distributors.

My guess is that Victorinox would accept most warranty claims for damage incurred during good faith usage.

[cnlson]

You can request the same with Leatherman for sentimental reasons. I'm just not sentimental about tools.

I do however still have the Leatherman I took to the gulf war and after I got back I sent it to them to get all the sand out and repair the tools, need screwdrivers and such they did and made sure to return the original tool with the repairs.

That's right. I'm serving in the Republic of Korea Marine Corps.  The advantages of the warranty method to Leatherman are clear.  However, Victorinox is suitable for user sensibility.  For example, if I can repair the tools my father gave me instead of using other products, those memories will not disappear.

[ROKMC MSgt John]

Much as I'd like to, I doubt their answer is going to be "heck ya, go for it, we got you!" So I'm hoping someone here has done some damage to their tool and had some advice on getting it fixed under warranty

I don't know if you can take a closer look at this picture, but I broke the tool inside myself (it's a secret of course) and I requested a warranty and I'm currently coming to Korea from Switzerland.

[cnlson]

Looks like the file, why would they need to send to Switzerland for a file? Or is that the usual course?
I guess this is why I have so many LM, I can afford to be without one if I have another.
So, with all the Russia Ukraine, China Taipei rumblings has the fat elf in the north been threatening?
Or is he just trading his soviet gear back for food and fuel?

I don't know if you can take a closer look at this picture, but I broke the tool inside myself (it's a secret of course) and I requested a warranty and I'm currently coming to Korea from Switzerland.

[ROKMC MSgt John]

Looks like the file, why would they need to send to Switzerland for a file? Or is that the usual course?
I guess this is why I have so many LM, I can afford to be without one if I have another.
So, with all the Russia Ukraine, China Taipei rumblings has the fat elf in the north been threatening?
Or is he just trading his soviet gear back for food and fuel?

Swiss tools are joined by rivets (different from Leatherman), so in order to disassemble it, you will need a technician who can disassemble the tool (of course, it is not difficult, but there will be a difference in finish level after repair), but most of these technicians are Swiss resides in  So almost all warranty repairs are sent to Switzerland.

[Gath]

Personally I have only good experiences with the warranty service. The worst damage I've had was on an used Wenger Matterhorn I had where it was completely plain that it was abused, blades were loose because someone used it as a hammer, that level of misuse. One Victorinox I had where someone had twisted the small pliers out of alignment.

A Swiss tool I had with some blade nicks and the blade locks were apparently forced sometime before is got it and neither worked.

All these I got repaired without question, at the same time actually.

So they are pretty lenient but if you're planning on systematic abuse I really wouldn't be completely sure, damage trough ignorance or the necessity of pushing your tool beyond limits in ignorance is quite different from systematically taking advantage of their goodwill.


I also don't quite get your point. Man can unmake anything man can make, is it really relevant if a tool will fail after 15 or 22 lifetimes worth of real world use, especially when it will be replaced if you actually use it in the real world?

[cnlson]

Personally I have only good experiences with the warranty service. The worst damage I've had was on an used Wenger Matterhorn I had where it was completely plain that it was abused, blades were loose because someone used it as a hammer, that level of misuse. One Victorinox I had where someone had twisted the small pliers out of alignment.

A Swiss tool I had with some blade nicks and the blade locks were apparently forced sometime before is got it and neither worked.

All these I got repaired without question, at the same time actually.

So they are pretty lenient but if you're planning on systematic abuse I really wouldn't be completely sure, damage trough ignorance or the necessity of pushing your tool beyond limits in ignorance is quite different from systematically taking advantage of their goodwill.


I also don't quite get your point. Man can unmake anything man can make, is it really relevant if a tool will fail after 15 or 22 lifetimes worth of real world use, especially when it will be replaced if you actually use it in the real world?

Thanks for telling me your experience. I am more confident that if anything happens I won't end up with an orphan tool.

as far as the point. What i'm trying to quantify at least a little is what area's leathermen have advantages and where swisstools have advantages. When i got in the discussion on youtube, i was told that swisstools never rust, they never break and they are better in all ways.  I want to know what parts of that are true and what parts aren't true before i revisit that conversation. That's what the point will be.
to know, one way or the other.

[ROKMC MSgt John]

Thanks for telling me your experience. I am more confident that if anything happens I won't end up with an orphan tool.

as far as the point. What i'm trying to quantify at least a little is what area's leathermen have advantages and where swisstools have advantages. When i got in the discussion on youtube, i was told that swisstools never rust, they never break and they are better in all ways.  I want to know what parts of that are true and what parts aren't true before i revisit that conversation. That's what the point will be.
to know, one way or the other.

Obviously, Leatherman and Swisstool are the same but different.  This means that each is made using stainless steel with different ingredients.  In fact, it was advertised that the material used for Leatherman was relatively cheap and that only the knife steel material was used in models such as TTI, S30V.  From what I personally felt, Leatherman has a clear limit no matter how shiny it is.  This points out a lot of functionality as a tool. In the functional part, pay attention to the extensibility of Leatherman.  It can get a lot of features with just one bitkit.
Swiss Tool obviously used good materials.  So the basic price is relatively high.  But this is not bad news.  This can have a very good effect if polished.  And you know what?  There is no pressure to use it with bare hands.  Sometimes the Leatherman is inconvenient to use with bare hands, but the Swiss Tool doesn't have this problem.  If a TTI knife loses its function, it takes a lot of effort to restore it, but a Swiss tool can achieve a decent effect with a little effort. This makes a huge difference.  I think that just because the material for a knife is unconditionally strong is not a good thing.  However, the Swiss tool is not scalable.  Of course, you can emphasize expandability by purchasing options other than the official product, but it does not fall under the category of official product.  Oh...and with the warranty, Leatherman is very fast and Swisstool is very slow.  However, both of these have their pros and cons.  My conclusion was that the function applied variety and quick warranty, but relatively rough feeling of leatherman, smooth finish and user-friendly material, excellent corrosion resistance, but slow warranty application and lack of scalability Swiss tool.  After all, everyone has different tastes and styles, so it's not appropriate to say which one is the best.  but I like Swiss tools....lol

[cnlson]

After all, everyone has different tastes and styles, so it's not appropriate to say which one is the best.  but I like Swiss tools....lol

Each tool, even of the leathermans I have,  has different good and bad characteristics. which make it better or worse for a specific job. I was talking about testing the pliers against each other in a different thread and someone reminded me that leatherman has a locking plier (i own 2 of them in fact and had forgotten) but that tool doesn't have good tools for other jobs like screwdrivers and knife. I plan on testing certain things and seeing which combination of uses is better served by what tool. I have 3 swisstool right now a swisstool x, rs, and a spirit x, for leatherman I have almost all.

as far as the tools, Leatherman does need to "wear in" where the swisstools seem not to require that. But my edc leatherman charge is as smooth as any of the swisstools. As far as the blade steels, I actually prefer 154cm to s30v in the leatherman. I have several of each. The s30v seems to chip when the blade is abused, where the 154cm just needs a good stropping