Knives illegal in Hawaii?

[Grant Lamontagne]

On January 11th, 2009, Bill 126 was introduced, prohibiting the possession of pocket knives.  I just read about it in the Blade Magazine newsletter:

http://www.blademag.com/article/hawaiibillwouldbanfolders

February 02, 2009
On Jan. 11, 2009, Hawaii Senator Les Ihara, Jr. introduced Bill 126 that would essentially ban folding knives throughout the state. In a letter to the senator, David Kowalski, of the American Knife & Tool Institute, laid out why the bill is bad for law-abiding knife owners.

Currently, Hawaiian law applies only to possession of switchblades, enforceable at the felony level. Bill 126 would expand the scope of knife regulation to include folders. However, the penalty would be a misdemeanor, not a felony.

What follows is Kowalski's letter.

Dear Senator Ihara:
 
The bill you introduced last week (HI S 126) would make de facto criminals of tens of thousands of your law-abiding  citizens and potentially millions more who visit your beautiful state each year. It reads, in part…
 A BILL FOR AN ACT RELATING TO DANGEROUS WEAPONS. BE IT ENACTED BY THE LEGISLATURE OF THE STATE OF HAWAII:
     SECTION 1. Chapter 134, Hawaii Revised Statutes, is amended by adding a new section to part III to be appropriately designated and to read as follows: "Section 134- Pocket knives; sale prohibited; penalty. Any person who knowingly manufactures, sells, transfers, possesses, or transports a pocket knife in the State shall be guilty of a misdemeanor. As used in this section: "Pocket knife" means a knife with a blade that folds into the handle and which is suitable for  carrying in the pocket."

On behalf of the American Knife & Tool Institute (AKTI), which represents the $1 Billion sporting knife industry in the United States, I would ask two things of you.

First, please call me at your earliest convenience to discuss this proposed legislation. I understand you have introduced the bill at the request of a constituent. It would be important to understand your goals and those of your constituent. While passing a knife law might seem a simple issue, there are grave consequences if it is vague, discriminatory, highly discretionary or simply so broad it is unenforceable.
 
AKTI has worked successfully with lawmakers in several states to make sure their knife laws support the goals of law enforcement, mesh with the needs of a diverse and strong economy, preserve the heritage of men and women who hunt, fish, and enjoy a broad variety of outdoor recreation, allow the construction industry to function at a high level, and preserve the rights of ordinary citizens who may have carried a knife their entire life to open letters and do some pruning in the rose garden.
 
Secondly, I would ask you to consider just a few issues that might give you some new insight into the issues that your bill raises.
 
Broadly, AKTI supports rational, equitable knife laws. Simple possession of a knife should not be punished. Knives do no harm unless used by someone who intends to harm. But we do support significant punishment of anyone who uses a knife in the commission of a crime.
 
Every five years, our U.S. Fish & Wildlife Service documents the impact of hunting and fishing in each of the
50 states. Released in the fall of 2007, its 2006 National Survey of Fishing, Hunting, and Wildlife-Associated
Recreation documents that, nationally, hunters and fishers spend more than $76 Billion annually (State statistics page attached).
 
Hawaii benefited from an estimated $163,363,000 spent by hunters and fishers in 2006. Since most hunters and fishers carry knives, we should not subject them to prosecution for knife possession or jeopardize that vital revenue.
 
Your marine and sport fishing industry is heavily dependent on knife usage. To forbid pocket knives on the docks and marinas of Hawaii would be an economic disaster and an enforcement nightmare.
 
Speaking further about economics, AKTI published its own report in 2007 entitled The AKTI State of the Sporting Knife Industry. Projections from the AKTI study peg annual sporting knife revenue at the manufacturer/importer level in Hawaii at $41,686,375.
 
Sales at Hawaii distribution and retail outlets would nearly double that number to some $82 million. That’s a
lot of jobs, taxes and economic vitality. When you run those dollars through all the local economies affected, the total economic impact of the sporting knife industry in Hawaii approaches $492 million annually.
 
The construction trades are heavily dependent on workmen using knives. They carry them from homes to job sites and back again daily … millions of times each day. I am not an expert on the Hawaiian construction trades, but ask yourself how many of these people could keep Hawaii building and growing without all their necessary tools.
 
Carpenters, electricians, plumbers, auto mechanics, farm workers, greenhouse staff, lawn care workers, tree trimmers, nursery and garden center staff all use knives daily. Scientific research is significant in Hawaii where pocket knives are commonly used to procure samples. Then there are thousands of gardeners throughout the islands, many of whom carry a knife on their person. To bust every grandmother in her rose garden for carrying and using a pocket knife would be a social disaster beyond measure.
 
I have been to Hawaii several times. My small folding knife goes into checked baggage when I fly but then I carry it when I go biking or whale watching. Multiply me by millions of visitors who hunt, fish, hike, rock climb, bike, kayak, canoe, deep-sea fish, snorkel or scuba. Do you really want to threaten all those law-abiding visitors with arrest for carrying a small pocket knife? Whether they come from the continental U.S. or the Pacific Rim countries, their tourist dollars are very discretionary dollars and they can take them elsewhere.
 
Knives are man’s oldest tools. We don’t ban automobiles or cameras or computers because they have become more complex in mechanism and materials, more sophisticated in design, more aesthetically rich, and focused on ever-narrower market niches. We don’t ban baseball bats or golf clubs because they can cause physical injury.
 
Ideally, AKTI’s position is that knife possession of any sort should be permitted. AKTI’s ideal law would read, "A knife is illegal only if it is carried with the intent to assault or harm another person." However, I recognize that Hawaii already bans switchblades (and I have attached your current knife statute).
 
AKTI and AKTI members urge you to withdraw your bill since, as it is written, it would be a broad-brush attack on millions of law-abiding Hawaiian citizens and visitors. Its economic impact on several vital industries would be disastrous, especially given our current economic climate.

I couldn't find any info on AKTI's website, but you may want o have a look yourselves:

www.akti.org

While you are at it, might be a good idea to keep an eye on www.Kniferights.org too, just in case.

Def

[David Bowen]

Wow, wonder how that makes Ken Onion feel? Pretty ticked off I am sure!

[Grant Lamontagne]

And Tom Mayo, who lives in Hawaii....

Def

[David Bowen]

Wow, talk about some angry villagers   

[Grant Lamontagne]

Kind of pointless (no pun intended) to outlaw knives in Hawaii- what makes them think Samoans need knives to be dangerous? 



Def

[Zack]

My father in law goes to Hawaii about once or twice a month for business, and he always has his leatherman wave, dive knife, and rescue tool.  Funny how it doesn't say anything about fixed blades, which are used in many more crimes than a folder (think kitchen cutlery).  Of course, he only goes to Kauai, and not the big island.  Just don't do anything to stick out and I doubt you would be bothered, and don't carry a knife with a clip.

[glorn]

I love Kauai, and go there often... but this is a ridiculous law, and it honestly would keep me from going there.

There are too many other beautiful places I can visit and still carry a pocketknife without being a criminal. St. John comes to mind, and that is the spot that most often competes for my tourist dollar with Kauai. For the last.. 3 trips I think.. Kauai has been the winner. If this is true, bye bye Kauai.

Les Ihara, Jr.might be getting an email from me informing him of that very fact soon if I find this to be made law. And while myself and the 10 other family members that travel with me each year might not mean much to Mr. Ihara, I am sure it will mean quite a bit to the owners of the $10,000 a week house we rent for 2 weeks.

Or maybe Mr. Ihara knows his "constituents" much better than I do. Perhaps they will gladly trade $20,000 each year for the comfort of knowing that they no longer need live in fear of my Leatherman.




G.

[glorn]

And another thing...

I am just making a broad assumption here based upon the limited info the web has on this Ihara character, but..

I'll bet that the reason he so easily would ban pocketknives is that he has no idea the value such tools offer to the common working man due to the fact that he has never actually done a single bit of real work in his entire life. Shuffling papers, spending other people's money, glad handing, and toying around with the law does not constitute real work in my world.

Proof once more that politicians make the worst politicians... if you catch my drift.

[Grant Lamontagne]

Hopefully this law will get as far as the ban on multitools in Michigan a few years ago. 

Def

[glorn]

Well, all of my conspiracy theories aside..

There are people who are so removed from the reality of "every day persons" that they develop a fear of those persons and anything related to the lives they lead. They are so sheltered and out of touch that they also tend to see them selves as better and smarter than "those people", which is not much of a stretch for a person that becomes essentially xenophobic in regard to their neighbors. As a consequence, these types seem to also know what is best for everyone else, even though they actually know nothing at all about these people that they fear.

Now the only question I have is.. why do so many of these types become career politicians?

The only answer I can come up with is that politics further alienates them from the "commoners" and gives them the control over their fear that they so desperately crave. And the corruption and kick backs and privilege don't hurt either.


So when they pass laws to take your rights away, know that they have no clue... not the faintest idea... not even a hint... of what the real world is like or how the uninformed "ideas" they make into laws actually affect you. And on top of that, they do not care.

And the next time you vote... consider the history of the candidate. What strange universe contains the magic anti-reality bubble that they grew up in? Do they still reside there?


Politicians... in my world they will be fed to the dogs right along with the rapists, murderers, child molesters, and thieves.




Rant = apologies. 

[Grant Lamontagne]

I like my dogs too much to feed them that crap...

Def

[Zack]

Glorn, if you;ve spent any time in Kuai, then you have probably seen some of my father in laws handiwork.  He runs radar that clears an area so they can shoot drone missiles for the AEGIS missile defense program.  I fyou ever see a grey G3 flying low and pulling high-g turns its him.  I agree the law is stupid, but seems like such a hassel that the local authorities could probably care less unless you look suspiosos.

[Anthony]

I'm sold on the fact that politicians are just that and nothing more, just politicians.  I'm also sold on the fact that there is an unwritten line of actual Americans who WILL NOT cave in to these laws that get more and more intrusive and innane. 

To quote the brainchild patrick kennedy "I have never worked a F%$#^G day of my life." 

[glorn]

I once had a terrible job with a boss who had about nine bosses above her.

It occurred to me after not much time at all that my boss really did nothing in her job that related to me, my fellow workers, our department, or anything that we actually did on a day to day basis. Her job mainly seemed to consist of handing down the edicts to us that came from her boss, sitting in meetings with that boss and the other bosses, and in general, keeping them happy and thus keeping her job.

This would almost be acceptable, except for the fact that each of her nine bosses did exactly the same thing more or less to some other boss.

So while 50 or so of us indians ran amok without much in the way of direct leadership and supervision (unless you count endless boring meetings in which we are told indirectly and second hand how things are going to be thanks to people who actually know nothing at all about what we actually do, who we are, etc.), our boss mostly worked at just pleasing her boss. And her boss's job was to please his boss, and his bosses job was to please his boss, and so on all the way up the ladder.

In the end, there was some vague person (nobody is quite sure who) that makes the rules from some place where the work that gets done is not entirely understood, and it takes fifteen or so people and some sizable salaries to play an elaborate game of "telephone" just to pass this information on to us.

"Your job is to keep your job."


This is also how modern politics work.

[Anthony]

I never trusted a "boss" whether it be mine or a boss in general, who never had done the job of their employees at some point.  And on a larger scale it's politicians being our "boss", while never really being a regular working citizen. 

[zackhugh]

OK, I contacted my local State Senator to voice opposition to SB26.  He just happens to be the chair of the Judiciary committee where the bill was referred, and also represents the district in which I vote (which I pointed out to him).

What a completely moronic bill.  Thanks for the heads-up.

[Splat]

Isn't Chad Los Banos from Hawaii? I guess he wouldn't apply since he's in corrections. Still, that's gotta suck. Taking away the rights from everyone just because of a few bad eggs? Not logical in my book.

[Craig]

Someone ought to point out to this chap that it is criminals that do most crimes and, being criminals, they don't care about obeying laws like this He sounds like the sort of politician that we have a glut of in the UK.

[Benner]

Isn't Chad Los Banos from Hawaii? I guess he wouldn't apply since he's in corrections. Still, that's gotta suck. Taking away the rights from everyone just because of a few bad eggs? Not logical in my book.

I'm sure he is yes.

[zackhugh]

I was informed by the Senator's office that he has no intention of hearing the bill this session so I believe it's dead for now.  I'll check the status later to make sure. 

[Styerman]

This Senator has frequently tried to introduce bills banning handguns , and various other hobbyhorse projects . He is also the only Dem. incumbent in state history to loose a seat . I wish AKTI would link up with the NRA , an outfit that has a good deal of clout ! Witness that the majority of US States have CCW legislation on the books .

I would'nt worry too much about this particular attempt , but the trend is Irksome .

Chris

[jzmtl]

Good news. http://www.khon2.com/news/local/39409572.html

Funny thing, he said if it ever comes to a vote he'd vote against it. Seems he introduce bills at request of other, weird...

[glorn]

Good news. http://www.khon2.com/news/local/39409572.html

Funny thing, he said if it ever comes to a vote he'd vote against it. Seems he introduce bills at request of other, weird...

Hello new sig line!

"The knife is the most valid invention in mankind history -- without we would have instinct a long time ago."

[Styerman]

Good news. http://www.khon2.com/news/local/39409572.html

Funny thing, he said if it ever comes to a vote he'd vote against it. Seems he introduce bills at request of other, weird...

Somehow I don't think he's one of the leading lites in the Statehouse . Chad Los Banos ( a state correctional officer ) says that all the inmates he's run into who stuck someone , used kitchen stuff/paring/steak knives .

Chris

[I'm Still Bison]

Good news. http://www.khon2.com/news/local/39409572.html

Funny thing, he said if it ever comes to a vote he'd vote against it. Seems he introduce bills at request of other, weird...

Somehow I don't think he's one of the leading lites in the Statehouse . Chad Los Banos ( a state correctional officer ) says that all the inmates he's run into who stuck someone , used kitchen stuff/paring/steak knives .

Chris

  In my time in corrections,I found inmates to be great improvisers.But when you've got nothing but time on your hands,weapons can be and are made from anything you could imagine.