Looking for urban high-rise 'survival' light

[comis]

Hi, all!

Just like to post this to see what would be good for an urban high-rise 'survival' scenario.  I am a semi-flahaholic, so I would consider myself familiar with modern 'smart' flashlight scenes, but none of those lights are really meant for 'survival' situation...


Here are my few criteria for the light:

1) The most dangerous high-rise scenario(for me) will be fire/smoke escape, and/or blackout situation where occupants need to evac.

2) Headlamp would probably be my first choice, but I'd already have the right candidates for the job.

3) Prefer very intuitive single mode/few mode, no signal/strobe/programing at all.  Users will be 6- to 80+ years old.

4)  Prefer lights that can use lithium AA/AAA or CR123.

5)  No need for high power light, in fact, I am looking at 60-200 lumens.



A few candidates I am looking at:

--Streamlight 68751 Dualie 3AA (intrinsically safe)

--Streamlight 68602 4AA ProPolymer Lux Div 1

--Nightstick Pro XPP5422 Intrinsically Safe Dual Light

I am slightly leaning towards the Nightstick 5422 (very similar to the Streamlight Dualie) with both buttons are up on top, and less chance to blind yourself in the eye.  Does anyone have any experience with these lights/brand?

[NutSAK]

I haven't owned any of those particular models, but I've owned Streamlight brand and you really can't go wrong with their products.  Whatever meets your criteria in their lineup will likely be a good candidate.

For headlamps, I highly recommend Zebralight.  Their UI is complex at first, but very intuitive once you're used to it, which doesn't take long.  They are very durable, well-made lights.

As for flashlights, the best combination by far for durability and simple UI is Malkoff, specifically the MDx series.  They cannot be matched for durability for the price. Standard UI is single mode, but the mechanical hi/low switch can be added, which provides two levels with a simple twist of the head.  I recommend the hi/lo switch and have them on all of my MDx model lights.

Is there a specific cell type you would like to use?  What about size/form factor?  Is this a light you're going to want to carry with you, or just have available in emergency situations?

EDIT: I re-read and see that you're wanting to stick to AA/CR123a.  Zebralight models are available in either cell, but Malkoff will require multiple (2x/3x) CR123a.

[comis]

I haven't owned any of those particular models, but I've owned Streamlight brand and you really can't go wrong with their products.  Whatever meets your criteria in their lineup will likely be a good candidate.

For headlamps, I highly recommend Zebralight.  Their UI is complex at first, but very intuitive once you're used to it, which doesn't take long.  They are very durable, well-made lights.

As for flashlights, the best combination by far for durability and simple UI is Malkoff, specifically the MDx series.  They cannot be matched for durability for the price. Standard UI is single mode, but the mechanical hi/low switch can be added, which provides two levels with a simple twist of the head.  I recommend the hi/lo switch and have them on all of my MDx model lights.

Is there a specific cell type you would like to use?  What about size/form factor?  Is this a light you're going to want to carry with you, or just have available in emergency situations?

EDIT: I re-read and see that you're wanting to stick to AA/CR123a.  Zebralight models are available in either cell, but Malkoff will require multiple (2x/3x) CR123a.

I don't own any Zebralight but did hear many good things about them, but for this occasion, I probably would stay away from them since I want the simplest UI possible.

Malkoff is an interesting suggestion, I remembered way back when they were making drop-ins for SF and was expanding to make their own.  Since I did look at some of the SF lights(most of them are a little too bright for this use), I probably should look into them as well.

In terms of form factor, I'd prefer something that's a little wider in grip(like all those candidates I have listed, they are all 4AAs), brighter color and be able to survive a waist high drop if possible. 

I do plan to get 4-6 of them, few may stay around the house to familiarize everyone with the light, and most probably will just stay in the emergency go-bag for precaution.

[enki_ck]

Forget about any light with floody beams. A thrower with as tight beam as possible will penetrate smoke best. High carried light will only blind you as the light will reflect from the smoke particles and you won't be able to see anything, one of the reasons why fog lights are mounted low on cars. Also they are yellow, beat would be red, as the red light reflects less, but on cars that's not an option as the tail lights are red. If escaping smoke filled skyscrapers is the scenario, a tight thrower with a red or yellowish beam would probably work best from what I've read .

Hopefully we have a firefighter who can chime in on this.

[nate j]

I haven't owned any of those particular models, but I've owned Streamlight brand and you really can't go wrong with their products.

+1

[Old Boy]

I’m going to go the boring route and suggest Maglites.

[Sos24]

Have you looked at Pelican lights?

They have several that ultilize 3-4 AA or AAA, including safety lights designed specifically for firefighters or people working in hazard environments.  They usually only have a 1-2 modes and very simply.

I bought one for my handicap brother who doesn’t have fine motor skills.  He was able to hold and operate without issue.  He also loved that the one I got him glowed in the dark.

I had one for many years.  It was in my car emergency kit.  I was cleaning out my old car and found it in a flooded trunk with exploded batteries.  Changed the batteries and it still worked.

[comis]

Forget about any light with floody beams. A thrower with as tight beam as possible will penetrate smoke best. High carried light will only blind you as the light will reflect from the smoke particles and you won't be able to see anything, one of the reasons why fog lights are mounted low on cars. Also they are yellow, beat would be red, as the red light reflects less, but on cars that's not an option as the tail lights are red. If escaping smoke filled skyscrapers is the scenario, a tight thrower with a red or yellowish beam would probably work best from what I've read .

Hopefully we have a firefighter who can chime in on this.

I had a chance to look at some of their equipment during a fire escape couple months back, and what strike me to be interesting is few of them have mounted headlight up on their helmet.  But I guess one thing differ them from us is they do have all the equipment to work in that hazard environment, and equipment to fight fire probably maybe different from what we need to escape.  But one observation most of the time during our high-rise fire escape involves walking down endless staircase, and headlamp probably is best, so we could keep our hands free to hold onto rail or support each other.

[comis]

I’m going to go the boring route and suggest Maglites.

I am a total Maglite addict, and in terms of durability, they are definitely one of the leading ones.  I only wish they have something in between 2AA and 2C.

Have you looked at Pelican lights?

They have several that ultilize 3-4 AA or AAA, including safety lights designed specifically for firefighters or people working in hazard environments.  They usually only have a 1-2 modes and very simply.

I bought one for my handicap brother who doesn’t have fine motor skills.  He was able to hold and operate without issue.  He also loved that the one I got him glowed in the dark.

I had one for many years.  It was in my car emergency kit.  I was cleaning out my old car and found it in a flooded trunk with exploded batteries.  Changed the batteries and it still worked.

Good point, I was browsing some on big river site, but forgotten to go onto their website to check them out. 

I remembered long ago we used to convert their 2x123 into led lights, and that thing was so beefy that I felt it could survive a nuclear blast like eating a sunday.

[Sos24]

I had a chance to look at some of their equipment during a fire escape couple months back, and what strike me to be interesting is few of them have mounted headlight up on their helmet.  But I guess one thing differ them from us is they do have all the equipment to work in that hazard environment, and equipment to fight fire probably maybe different from what we need to escape.  But one observation most of the time during our high-rise fire escape involves walking down endless staircase, and headlamp probably is best, so we could keep our hands free to hold onto rail or support each other.

For hands free, maybe a right angle light that could clip to a waistband?

[Farmer X]

My experience with flashlights is limited, but have a look at the Streamlight Stylus Pro. I don't know if it can run lithium batteries, but it seems to mash every other button. The only real downsides to it are a switch that takes a concerted effort to push down and a crappy pouch.

[Sos24]

As far as headlamps, Knog Bandicoot might be an option to look into. 

It is customizable using their ModeMaker app.  You can set it to have just a single mode or multiple, red light is an option, and iirc you can set the max lumen lower if desired.

[Echotech]

As far as headlamps, Knog Bandicoot might be an option to look into. 

It is customizable using their ModeMaker app.  You can set it to have just a single mode or multiple, red light is an option, and iirc you can set the max lumen lower if desired.

+1 I’m a big fan of the bandicoot

I’d completely forgotten about the ModeMaker app so had thought it might be a bit complicated in an emergency, it sure is versatile

[greenbear]

Have you considered a Nitecore LR12?  Although a hand, not head torch it has an integral extending diffuser that allows it to be used as a lantern plus a maximum light beam of 1000 lumens.  Runs on 2 x CR123 or a single rechargeable equivalent.

I've had mine for a couple of years (since Nitecore started making them) and it has behaved faultlessly.

[comis]

For hands free, maybe a right angle light that could clip to a waistband?

I'm not in the military, but I'd imagine right angle light probably best for military/Forrest fire fighting, where helmet space are limited.  Carry them on a shoulder strip will be so much easier than handheld for long matches. 

Besides being able to stand and not roll around like a maglite, is there any advantage I might have missed about them?

My experience with flashlights is limited, but have a look at the Streamlight Stylus Pro. I don't know if it can run lithium batteries, but it seems to mash every other button. The only real downsides to it are a switch that takes a concerted effort to push down and a crappy pouch.

Thank you, that sounds good, I will definitely have a look. 

This might be slightly off topic.  But while I'm shopping for this particular scenario, I did notice the Streamlight protac 1L AA maybe a good candidate for general preparedness.
 1L seems to be able to take 1AA, CR123 or 1AAA, making it a really versatile light.

As far as headlamps, Knog Bandicoot might be an option to look into. 

It is customizable using their ModeMaker app.  You can set it to have just a single mode or multiple, red light is an option, and iirc you can set the max lumen lower if desired.

+1 I’m a big fan of the bandicoot

I’d completely forgotten about the ModeMaker app so had thought it might be a bit complicated in an emergency, it sure is versatile

I think we'd have a thread about this headlight, didn't we?   I haven't followed their product line since then, but if there is a way to dumb down the headlight and it uses lithium primary, I'd be quite interested too.

[comis]

Have you considered a Nitecore LR12?  Although a hand, not head torch it has an integral extending diffuser that allows it to be used as a lantern plus a maximum light beam of 1000 lumens.  Runs on 2 x CR123 or a single rechargeable equivalent.

I've had mine for a couple of years (since Nitecore started making them) and it has behaved faultlessly.

That's a good light too, this would make a great camping light.  This may sound silly, but I am purposely trying to find a light larger in size with bright colour.  Such that there is less chance for family using it as EDC and take it out from the emergency bag.

[Millhouse]

Take a look at the Fenix WF11E ATEX.

AA powered, max 200 lumens using a neutral white LED.

[Sos24]

I'm not in the military, but I'd imagine right angle light probably best for military/Forrest fire fighting, where helmet space are limited.  Carry them on a shoulder strip will be so much easier than handheld for long matches. 

Besides being able to stand and not roll around like a maglite, is there any advantage I might have missed about them?


Thank you, that sounds good, I will definitely have a look. 

This might be slightly off topic.  But while I'm shopping for this particular scenario, I did notice the Streamlight protac 1L AA maybe a good candidate for general preparedness.
 1L seems to be able to take 1AA, CR123 or 1AAA, making it a really versatile light.

I think we'd have a thread about this headlight, didn't we?   I haven't followed their product line since then, but if there is a way to dumb down the headlight and it uses lithium primary, I'd be quite interested too.

The right angle comment was mainly geared towards the comment about having the light low vs high (headlamp).  That being said, I prefer headlamps because they move with your head where you are looking.

As far as the Knog, the ModeMaker app is pretty good for limiting modes/functions.  The batteries are built in lithium rechargeable.  To recharge the light pops out of headband and plugs directly into a USB-A port.

[Echotech]

The original Knog bandicoot 100 is currently 83% off at A$9.99 which has to be a bit of a bargain, 100 lumens may not be enough for your requirements comis but suspect it’s still pretty bright

https://www.knog.com/collections/headlamps/products/bandicoot-100-headlamp


A$17.99 delivered, couldn’t resist at that price so got one on the way

Edit. I just ordered 4 more, they’ll make great gifts

[comis]

Take a look at the Fenix WF11E ATEX.

AA powered, max 200 lumens using a neutral white LED.

Thanks to this, I was curious to check out the certification of this light, and it's interesting to see the conversion between ATEX rating vs UL certification.  I know some of the Streamlight lights do require a firm 'click' to activate the light, but hopefully this clicky is firm enough so it won't accidentally depress and drain out the batteries.

The right angle comment was mainly geared towards the comment about having the light low vs high (headlamp).  That being said, I prefer headlamps because they move with your head where you are looking.

As far as the Knog, the ModeMaker app is pretty good for limiting modes/functions.  The batteries are built in lithium rechargeable.  To recharge the light pops out of headband and plugs directly into a USB-A port.

We are definitely in the same boat in terms of headlamp, but it is cool to think out of the box to explore other possibilities too.  I took a closer look at the Knog light, I probably will prefer to use this as a hiking light since it is rechargeable, but I do wonder whether the charging port will slip out of the silicon headband as it age.

The original Knog bandicoot 100 is currently 83% off at A$9.99 which has to be a bit of a bargain, 100 lumens may not be enough for your requirements comis but suspect it’s still pretty bright

https://www.knog.com/collections/headlamps/products/bandicoot-100-headlamp


A$17.99 delivered, couldn’t resist at that price so got one on the way

Edit. I just ordered 4 more, they’ll make great gifts

I saw the 9.99 deal and thought it might be a typo, good deal!

[Fireman]

Hopefully we have a firefighter who can chime in on this.

Will do.  We all know smoke and heat rise.  In light smoke, you can see and breathe while standing (but may be coughing).  As conditions deteriorate, standing upright and breathing the smoke/heat will be intolerable or fatal.  Below that layer, though, visibility is still OK for a while, and while not ideal, you can breathe.  The worse things get, the lower the smoke/heat.   We had large Streamlights on the trucks (constantly charged), but in the conditions we worked in even they were not that useful. 

For Comis's needs, I would say prepare for power outage first, fire second.  If buildings have emergency lighting as they do here, it works well for any smoke condition you can walk in without an SCBA.  I would also contact the fire department and ask about their SOPs for residents/workers.  They may want people to stay in place initially, or only certain floors/hallways to evacuate. 

My personal favorite lights use rechargeable batteries: Fenix PD35 (the programming switch is not the on/off switch) or Streamlight ProTac 2L-X (programmed for bright only). 

[comis]

Thanks for chiming in!   

The part about smoke and heat is absolutely true, the smoke on the staircase did get progressively worse during our escape, and we really had to lower ourselves if we want any visibility and less smoke in the eyes.  Luckily, we all had wet towel to cover our mouth, otherwise we definitely will be choking badly with all that smoke around. 

One may think a high lumen flashlight could help navigate the staircase, but I remembered it got so smoky at one point, I couldn't even see an opened door just 2-3 feet away from me, and it happened during broad daylight. 

For me, I probably will prioritize fire escape over power outage or water flooding the apartment, since the other two are less fatal to me.  Some different regions around the world may have other concerns (earthquake, tsunami) but luckily it wasn't our priporities. 

Just my personal experience, I gotten mixed feeling about whether staying put or leaving the apartment to escape after my own incident--local FD did advise to stay put with windows open, if evacuating thru the stairs was not possible.  However, I have seen footage with people stuck in a small room just couple floors above the burning apartment, and luckily they kept the windows closed the whole time.  Their room was getting pretty quite smokey, luckily the firemen did arrive on scene really quickly and got to them soon enough before there was great harm.

Either way, one thing I did learn after that day was, for high rise fire escape, local FD did teach us all 3 things we should have with us at all times--wet towel, cell phone and home keys (in case the need to retreat back to apartment).  And I believed those 3 things were exactly what kept me safe that day.