Did I messed my knife up?

[LatinoHeat]

Ok, I know heat treatment makes a blade what it is (in a way). I also was told many moons ago not to heat up a blade with a lighter to, say, remove a splinter, because it would damage the integrity of the metal. Well, my Red Cadet has been hell to sharpen. I have not been able to get a decent edge on it AT ALL, and I've only had it for a few weeks. I have sharpened it so much that much of the belly is gone, and it looks like a much older knife. Thinking back on it, my problems started the day at work when I left it in the pocket of some over alls and it went into the drier. We washed the clothes, and dried them, all the while my Cadet was in the pocket. By the time I remembered and got it out, it was just about done drying, and the knife was VERY hot to the touch for quite a while. It felt like the heat had penetrated deep into the metal. Anyway, my question is, did I ruin the integrity of the metal? I mean, if the small flame of a lighter can ruin a blade, is it possible the intense heat of a drier might have messed up the treatment and made it impossible to sharpen my knife? It's just been acting all strange. I get a sharp edge on it, but one use and it is dull again. I've never had this happen before, and my older silver Cadet, and my wife's Green Cadet don't have this problem. I sharpen those and they last about as long as any SAK would, depending on the use. Is this a lost cause?

[Mike]

I'm not positive, but I believe it would take more heat than a clothes drier to ruin the heat treatment of your knife. I have washed a few of my knives before and never had a problem. A lighter on the other hand could ruin the heat treatment, at least in that spot. Since you can get a paper clip to discolor (sometimes even red hot) with depending on the lighter, it stands to reason you can ruin your knife with one too. Could just be the angle your putting on the edge. To shallow/thin and it will roll the edge easier.

Mike

[bren10man]

I do not think a clothes dryer at around 180F on the highest setting will ruin the integrity of knife steel.  You have to heat it to red or white hot IOT ruin a knife blade.

[Poncho65]

  Perhaps (dare I say it) it could have been like that since you got it but you didn't start to notice it until the dryer event I would send that back in since you haven't had it long and maybe that will resolve the problem casue it doesn't sound like you have had any good luck with it and I don't believe the dryer would have gotten it hot enough to lose temper becasue at 1 time they said to throw then in the dishwasher(I don't believe they recommend it now) and it would get awfully hot in there  even with the water and all

yeah it sounds like it needs to be sent in to me

[Leatherman123]

Why not return it to Target? You haven't had it that long!

[Poncho65]

Yeah if you got it there I would take it in with the receipt and exchange it

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

Like the other's have said, your tumble dryer wouldn't have done it, they simply don't get hot enough

You could have got a faulty one, but sak's aren't reknowned for there edge holding anyway (there only real flaw imo)

[LatinoHeat]

Like the other's have said, your tumble dryer wouldn't have done it, they simply don't get hot enough

You could have got a faulty one, but sak's aren't reknowned for there edge holding anyway (there only real flaw imo)

Oh, I know about the edge retention ability of a SAK, but this one is just wierd.  Maybe I have just sharpened the edge to thin and it's rilloing.  As for returning it, I just feel bad, since the belly is gone, and it is actually starting to get an inverted belly from all the sharpening I've done to it.  I no longer have the receipt, so I can't return it to Target.  Hmmm.  Maybe I'll play around with it a little bit and see what I can do.  It probably is my fault as far as the sharpening.  I've just never had this problem with my other SAKs.   Thanx guys.

[hawkchucker]

Mick beat me to it. Vics just dont hold an edge for long.

[Benner]

Definitely not the tumble.  Vic used to say that their knives could be cleaned in a dishwasher and they get damn hot without effecting the blade.

[Swiss Man]

I have to agree with everyone else here, I have washed and dried more then one SAK and never had any trouble.
If your dryer is getting hot enough to mess my your heat treat then what chances does your clothes have?

SAK are easy to sharpen but don't have a great edge retention (that is the trade off). 

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

Like the other's have said, your tumble dryer wouldn't have done it, they simply don't get hot enough

You could have got a faulty one, but sak's aren't reknowned for there edge holding anyway (there only real flaw imo)

Oh, I know about the edge retention ability of a SAK, but this one is just wierd.  Maybe I have just sharpened the edge to thin and it's rilloing.  As for returning it, I just feel bad, since the belly is gone, and it is actually starting to get an inverted belly from all the sharpening I've done to it.  I no longer have the receipt, so I can't return it to Target.  Hmmm.  Maybe I'll play around with it a little bit and see what I can do.  It probably is my fault as far as the sharpening.  I've just never had this problem with my other SAKs.   Thanx guys.

well maybe it is your sharpening, but i doubt it, as this isn't your first sak

Sad to say it, but it does sound like its a very rare fault

[Anthony]

I'm not an expert, but I don't think a washing machine or a few seconds exposed to the flame of a match or lighter will effect the molecular structure in a way it owuld mess up the blade.

I've held a flame to the tip of a SAK blade a few times to "sterilize" it before picking at a splinter to no ill effects.

[Ben X]

If you want me to I could send you a new 84mm blade if you wanna swap it out; all you need is a vice, drill, and a ball peen hammer. And the right size brass pin, which I would send but I only have 2.5mm and 2.1ish mm, no 2.25 and I'd hate for you to end up with less snap. But if you can live without it for 6 weeks, as my signature used to say over at SOSAK, Vic never rejects warranty claims. I said it more colorfully with a quote of another member who said we should just take a climber and bend it in a vice, drill holes in it, etc. and see how far they will take it . But I will say all in all you can send them anything with a note and they'll take care of it.

[Black Rose]

but sak's aren't reknowned for there edge holding anyway (there only real flaw imo)

Is there anything that can be done about that, such as changing the edge angle, or is it the metal itself that is the issue.

[Mike]

but sak's aren't reknowned for there edge holding anyway (there only real flaw imo)

Is there anything that can be done about that, such as changing the edge angle, or is it the metal itself that is the issue.

Changing the edge geometry can help a little bit. By not making the edge too thin, that puts more material directly behind the edge. Now, a convex edge will also help as you are essentially doing just that, getting more material directly behind the edge. Again, it is what it is and you can only do so much. But I have never found SAK steel horrible or anything like that anyhow.

Mike

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

but sak's aren't reknowned for there edge holding anyway (there only real flaw imo)

Is there anything that can be done about that, such as changing the edge angle, or is it the metal itself that is the issue.

Changing the edge geometry can help a little bit. By not making the edge too thin, that puts more material directly behind the edge. Now, a convex edge will also help as you are essentially doing just that, getting more material directly behind the edge. Again, it is what it is and you can only do so much. But I have never found SAK steel horrible or anything like that anyhow.

Mike

Convexing works too

[Mike]

Yeah, I said that too. 

Mike

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

Yeah, I said that too. 

Mike

I meant that as me, backing you up

[Mike]

Yeah, I said that too. 

Mike

I meant that as me, backing you up

DOH! Thanks man!

Mike

[duckman1975]

While are at the topic of messing up knives, is it true you will dull the edge of a knife by soaking or wiping it with alcohol or softdrinks (soda)?  And they say you could sterlilize a knife by using softdrink (Soda) is it true?

[jzmtl]

Alcohol no, it won't hurt your knife. Soft drink can if you soak it long enough, since there is acid in it, but I don't see how it can sterilize your blade.

[Poncho65]

Yeah, I said that too. 

Mike

I meant that as me, backing you up

 

[Gareth]

Alcohol no, it won't hurt your knife. Soft drink can if you soak it long enough, since there is acid in it, but I don't see how it can sterilize your blade.

If anything I'd say that the soda would just leave a trace of food stuff for bacteria to live on.  If you need it sterile then stick to the alcohol.

[Mike, Lord of the Spammers!]

Yeah, I said that too. 

Mike

I meant that as me, backing you up

DOH! Thanks man!

Mike

You are forgiven my son

[Benner]

Alcohol no, it won't hurt your knife. Soft drink can if you soak it long enough, since there is acid in it, but I don't see how it can sterilize your blade.

If anything I'd say that the soda would just leave a trace of food stuff for bacteria to live on.  If you need it sterile then stick to the alcohol.

That's what I was thinking.  Soda will just add dirt to it.

[Mike]

To be honest, I do not think rubbing alcohol does much in the way of sterilizing. It works as a disinfectant, but not necessarily for sterilization. So, for cleaning door knobs, kitchen cabinets, telephones it works fine. But for surgical instruments, ear piercings etc, not so much. For instance, it won't kill hepatitis. Another way to think of it is, disinfect your arm with rubbing alcohol before you get a shot with a properly sterilized needle and syringe.

I found this, which says it pretty well:
"Disinfectants are antimicrobial agents that are applied to non-living objects to destroy microorganisms, the process of which is known as disinfection."

"Sterilization (or sterilisation) refers to any process that effectively kills or eliminates transmissible agents (such as fungi, bacteria, viruses, prions and spore forms etc.) from a surface, equipment, foods, medications, or biological culture medium. Sterilization can be achieved through application of heat, chemicals, irradiation, high pressure or filtration."

Mike

[Craig]

I did not know that, very interesting, thanks

[Black Rose]

I have some of that 99% rubbing alcohol that I use to clean the crap off the threads of my flashlights.

Plan on using it to clean the eBay SAKs that I bought (whenever they get here).

[jzmtl]

I have some of that 99% rubbing alcohol that I use to clean the crap off the threads of my flashlights.

Plan on using it to clean the eBay SAKs that I bought (whenever they get here).

Do not use 99% for disinfection. Alcohol works by denaturing the protein of micro organisms, 99% works too fast and only denature the outer layer, and create a shell of sort that actually prevent alcohol from working further. Stick with 70%~75%.